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On November 13 2015 19:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:54 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:47 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 13 2015 19:44 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also going "Hey I have two scumreads, one is slightly stronger than the other."
"Oh it turns out one of them has to be town, let's presume the one that's stronger is scum and not do any work on actually doing more research on it."
Doesn't particularly strike me as a townie mindset. It doesn't make sense to go from "Arta and HTS are both scum" to "wait they can't be both scums unless rayn is scum, so let's assume the scummiest is scum" after the second mission fails ? What does not make sense in that reasonning ? Of course, if you reasonned that way you would have to attack HTS, who is townreading you. I'm pretty sure your read on her would be different if she was scumreading you. The fact that you had two strong scumreads means it makes no sense. If you had strong reasons to suspect both of us, which you kept saying you did, a townie mindset is going "fuck, I must be pretty damn wrong, I should re-evaluate" rather than "well I guess I was wrong on one of them, let's just go with the one I suspect slightly more! #YOLO" No, I townread her because I actually went through the re-evaluation process after confirming that there was scum on that mission and realizing that at least one of shockeyy/hts were town. You're saying nonsense. I have two scumreads; it's proven at least one of them is false; I keep the stronger scumread as scum. This whole mess started because neither of HTS and you consider the other to be very likely scum, which is bullshit. I have a hard time accepting one of you as town being super stupid and doing that; no way you're both town. One of you is riding the other's stupidity. That doesn't make any sense. You had two strong scumreads. One is false. Re-evaluate. Re-evaluating is what town does when it's proven they're clearly on the wrong track. The fact that you don't reveals your alignment. I considered her likely scum until I did just that.
LOL you are saying I'm not re evaluating. Nice try bro (=
No need to discuss further then.
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On November 13 2015 19:58 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:55 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:49 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also, explain to me why it doesn't make sense for you to be scum with one of Kita/Vivax. 'cause I'm town. I don't think there is a good relantionship case that prove I can't be scum with Kita / Vivax. That doesn't even make any sense whatsoever. Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:24 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 07:08 Half the Sky wrote:On November 13 2015 06:56 Vivax wrote:
I can tell you already that I would send or accept HTS/Coag/Artanis/myself.
I can compromise on swapping myself out with either Shockey or Xata (who I think is more likely to be town than SL) if you don't trust me.
If you also TR rayn who in my opinion is a good player but had to be wrong on someone last cycle, that sort of coincides with his reads, with exception of HTS/Shockey. I'm so sure on Xatalos and Rels as spies at this point but if we must compromise and you want SL out, then Shockey in for sure. Also the frustrating thing here is that rayn is town but Coag needs to do his part in getting Shockey out of the tunnel. Goddamnit. Part of the problem there from Shockey's POV is that rayn voted for two failed missions and was in two failed missions but that must mean that who else is scum? But there's a reason that not even scum are trying to bury him for that even. His reads were off this game (Shockey/myself) so that should lend clear to him as to why he voted that way and put the people on his mission that he did. And to be quite frank, if it comes down to you and Xatalos, I would take you over Xatalos by a country mile. Because I really really think he's mafia and if he gets on a team again, this game is over. HTS you need to stop being so tunneled and THINKYou are town => Arta is scum Others have to decide which of you, or if both of you are scum, but you have a big chance: you know your alignement. Two people voted YES on the first team and wasn't on the first team: there is 99% chance one of them if scum. And YOU are one of them. Here you are pushing a me + Vivax or me + kita team, which is extremely unlikely. I know where you are. I was tunneled on you with rayn before, specificaly for that reason: you refuse to admit two people voting NO is next to impossible with such a close vote. Your stubborness modkilled rayn. Don't make it lose the game and think; even if you can't decide I'm town, at least stop townreading Arta, 'cause it doesn't make sense. BTW if you're scum and Arta is town, fucking WP. I mean, it's more Arta failing than you being good in this case, but WP for keeping the effort. If your only reason for it being "extremely unlikely" is that you're town, you would've said impossible. Instead, you said extremely unlikely. There's really no way you're town.
There is no relationship case that prove we are not scum together. The fact that we all vote NO makes it extremely unlikely.
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On November 13 2015 19:59 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 13 2015 19:54 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:47 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 13 2015 19:44 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also going "Hey I have two scumreads, one is slightly stronger than the other."
"Oh it turns out one of them has to be town, let's presume the one that's stronger is scum and not do any work on actually doing more research on it."
Doesn't particularly strike me as a townie mindset. It doesn't make sense to go from "Arta and HTS are both scum" to "wait they can't be both scums unless rayn is scum, so let's assume the scummiest is scum" after the second mission fails ? What does not make sense in that reasonning ? Of course, if you reasonned that way you would have to attack HTS, who is townreading you. I'm pretty sure your read on her would be different if she was scumreading you. The fact that you had two strong scumreads means it makes no sense. If you had strong reasons to suspect both of us, which you kept saying you did, a townie mindset is going "fuck, I must be pretty damn wrong, I should re-evaluate" rather than "well I guess I was wrong on one of them, let's just go with the one I suspect slightly more! #YOLO" No, I townread her because I actually went through the re-evaluation process after confirming that there was scum on that mission and realizing that at least one of shockeyy/hts were town. You're saying nonsense. I have two scumreads; it's proven at least one of them is false; I keep the stronger scumread as scum. This whole mess started because neither of HTS and you consider the other to be very likely scum, which is bullshit. I have a hard time accepting one of you as town being super stupid and doing that; no way you're both town. One of you is riding the other's stupidity. That doesn't make any sense. You had two strong scumreads. One is false. Re-evaluate. Re-evaluating is what town does when it's proven they're clearly on the wrong track. The fact that you don't reveals your alignment. I considered her likely scum until I did just that. LOL you are saying I'm not re evaluating. Nice try bro (= No need to discuss further then.
Yeah, you instantly jumped to the conclusion I was the scum and you have never reconsidered.
Anyway, done talking to scum. Should be obvious to everyone else by now. Back to work.
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On November 13 2015 19:58 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:57 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:55 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 13 2015 19:52 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:46 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 12 2015 02:40 Rels wrote:
I suppose Arta / rayn / Xata makes some sense too. The relations between the three are super weird:
- Xata and Arta hard townreads each other
- Arta and rayn are super buddies that don't re evaluate on each other
- Arta and Xata have very little interaction.
So the plan would be to put two scums in the first team, so one of them exits with the universal townread, can make the second team fail; and now the plan is to put the third scum in the third team. On November 12 2015 20:36 Rels wrote:On November 12 2015 03:15 Fidei86 wrote:After discussion between myself and Tictock in the Host QT, and also consultation with Blazinghand, I have decided to issue a second warning to raynpelikoneet for this post. The effect of a second warning (the first warning being here) is a modkill/auto-replace, which is effective immediately.
I will begin searching for a replacement immediately. Until one is found, raynpelikoneet's slot will be eligible to go on missions, and will deemed to vote YES on all proposed missions. If his slot has the spy alignment, it will be deemed to attempt to sabotage any mission on which it is placed. His slot will be skipped for the purpose of team submission.
The OP for this game makes clear that all players are obliged to be civil and corteous to each other. The hosts recognise that Mafia/Resistance can give rise to strong emotions. However, there is a large and important difference between criticising someone's play or their decision making, and personal attacks designed only to belittle or demean. The former happens all the time, but the second will not be tolerated.
If anyone has any concerns about this action, or any further rules questions arising please contact me immediately, copying Tictock and Blazinghand. Wow rayn is probably mod-confirmed town then. I don't think scum would cross the line after being warned. This chain of events actually makes no sense either. Rayn posted everything he posted already at this point. The fact that he got modkilled doesn't mean anything about his alignment; the risk he took was already there as he was making the posts yet Rels doesn't use it to confirm Rayn until he actually gets modkilled. Unless you're saying that the actual modkill itself is alignment indicative it makes no sense to flip your read on Rayn to 99% sure town just for that because he couldn't know what he was doing would get him modkilled. Yeah the modkill made me realize rayn had crossed a line he probably wouldn't have crossed if he was scum. Curious how you instantly dismiss the idea that Rayn thought what he was posting is acceptable. You should be pretty familiar with his personality by now. Are you saying scum!rayn could have done that, and I am scum slipping and mistakenly explaining my townread by saying only town!rayn would do that ? I'm saying that it's a bad reason to townread him. There's plenty of good reasons to and 180ing on him because of something a mod did is not one.
You are not clear.
1 - I didn't 180. If you weren't distorting the fact, you would remember I was townreading rayn, and only considering him potential scum because of the possibility of the team failing due to vote result + his weird relationship with you.
2 - I townread him because him getting modkilled made me realize he crossed the line. So once again; is this a good reason, or is it not ? I'm not talking about mod actions; I'm talking about his words.
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On November 13 2015 20:01 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:59 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 13 2015 19:54 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:47 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 13 2015 19:44 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 19:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also going "Hey I have two scumreads, one is slightly stronger than the other."
"Oh it turns out one of them has to be town, let's presume the one that's stronger is scum and not do any work on actually doing more research on it."
Doesn't particularly strike me as a townie mindset. It doesn't make sense to go from "Arta and HTS are both scum" to "wait they can't be both scums unless rayn is scum, so let's assume the scummiest is scum" after the second mission fails ? What does not make sense in that reasonning ? Of course, if you reasonned that way you would have to attack HTS, who is townreading you. I'm pretty sure your read on her would be different if she was scumreading you. The fact that you had two strong scumreads means it makes no sense. If you had strong reasons to suspect both of us, which you kept saying you did, a townie mindset is going "fuck, I must be pretty damn wrong, I should re-evaluate" rather than "well I guess I was wrong on one of them, let's just go with the one I suspect slightly more! #YOLO" No, I townread her because I actually went through the re-evaluation process after confirming that there was scum on that mission and realizing that at least one of shockeyy/hts were town. You're saying nonsense. I have two scumreads; it's proven at least one of them is false; I keep the stronger scumread as scum. This whole mess started because neither of HTS and you consider the other to be very likely scum, which is bullshit. I have a hard time accepting one of you as town being super stupid and doing that; no way you're both town. One of you is riding the other's stupidity. That doesn't make any sense. You had two strong scumreads. One is false. Re-evaluate. Re-evaluating is what town does when it's proven they're clearly on the wrong track. The fact that you don't reveals your alignment. I considered her likely scum until I did just that. LOL you are saying I'm not re evaluating. Nice try bro (= No need to discuss further then. Yeah, you instantly jumped to the conclusion I was the scum and you have never reconsidered. Anyway, done talking to scum. Should be obvious to everyone else by now. Back to work.
Ok bro. A shame you can't shoot me in that setup.
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Coag: did you catch up with the thread ?
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And now I'm gone to eat some delicious sushis with a beautiful woman folks. SRY ILL KEEP THEM BOTH TO MYSELF
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On November 13 2015 19:24 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 07:08 Half the Sky wrote:On November 13 2015 06:56 Vivax wrote:
I can tell you already that I would send or accept HTS/Coag/Artanis/myself.
I can compromise on swapping myself out with either Shockey or Xata (who I think is more likely to be town than SL) if you don't trust me.
If you also TR rayn who in my opinion is a good player but had to be wrong on someone last cycle, that sort of coincides with his reads, with exception of HTS/Shockey. I'm so sure on Xatalos and Rels as spies at this point but if we must compromise and you want SL out, then Shockey in for sure. Also the frustrating thing here is that rayn is town but Coag needs to do his part in getting Shockey out of the tunnel. Goddamnit. Part of the problem there from Shockey's POV is that rayn voted for two failed missions and was in two failed missions but that must mean that who else is scum? But there's a reason that not even scum are trying to bury him for that even. His reads were off this game (Shockey/myself) so that should lend clear to him as to why he voted that way and put the people on his mission that he did. And to be quite frank, if it comes down to you and Xatalos, I would take you over Xatalos by a country mile. Because I really really think he's mafia and if he gets on a team again, this game is over. HTS you need to stop being so tunneled and THINKYou are town => Arta is scum Others have to decide which of you, or if both of you are scum, but you have a big chance: you know your alignement. Two people voted YES on the first team and wasn't on the first team: there is 99% chance one of them if scum. And YOU are one of them. Here you are pushing a me + Vivax or me + kita team, which is extremely unlikely. I know where you are. I was tunneled on you with rayn before, specificaly for that reason: you refuse to admit two people voting NO is next to impossible with such a close vote.Your stubborness modkilled rayn. Don't make it lose the game and think; even if you can't decide I'm town, at least stop townreading Arta, 'cause it doesn't make sense.BTW if you're scum and Arta is town, fucking WP. I mean, it's more Arta failing than you being good in this case, but WP for keeping the effort.
HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Rels, I know you're mafia here, but on the bolded, thanks for making me laugh.
rayn lacked self-control, that's why he was modkilled, not because of anyone. Honestly it didn't matter what my reads were at the time or what I was doing, what happened, happened.
And Rels, there's so many things wrong with your filter, it's not funny. Funny that Artanis even highlighted some of them.
Again, Xatalos got on that team, and that's all that needed to happen with where the reads of people were. rayn was scumreading Superbia, you, and myself at the time, and he pushed sicklucker over Artanis because the "scummier" people were voting for the team. If you voted yes, with a mission failure and you couldn't line your stuff up as scum, you'd look bad. And scum are concerned about how they look. Voting no doesn't necessarily vindicate you when there's other things going on.
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Artanis -
I'm going to explain sicklucker's read flip on you, since (sigh) he failed to do it himself. I saw the reasoning in the thread, but I'll walk you through it. I think you should focus on his mindset and Rels' especially, if you think sicklucker in his flip on you is being mafia motivated or if he's falling for the whole "omg only one person could have voted no" and not take anything else into consideration.
Start at the conversation from pages 126-128 (between SL and Rels) and then follow these quotes from page 130 through
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/497443-resistance-v-section-31?page=130#2595
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/497443-resistance-v-section-31?page=131#2609
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/497443-resistance-v-section-31?page=131#2610
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/497443-resistance-v-section-31?page=131#2612
I remember it because I had just touched down into the US and Shockey was trying to pick the teams. But basically he's convinced that only one person voted no. Even then, the interactions should tell you something about Rels.
On November 12 2015 20:55 sicklucker wrote:
Maybe art just wanted more information? Every vote is more info for town its pretty smart to vote no alot as town. Like really smart...
That post indicates that SL wasn't out to get you in that convo. He was thinking it through. Read in that convo up to post 2558 and you can see why Rels is pushing that one line of thinking so hard after sicklucker was taking other things into consideration ("that false world" in post 2558).
That's another thought process from his end that should make him more towny if you can see it.
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On November 13 2015 08:04 Vivax wrote:
Actually I want to take this to a new level kita, cause just as I realized while checking if you posted any teams, I also realized there's little point in calling people mafia if you can't start pushing preferred teams and making compromises with others (which is what you have been lacking).
Mention a team of people you would accept being sent, cause there's little point in me just calling you mafia if what we're discussing isn't a team with you on it.
On November 13 2015 08:08 Vivax wrote:
Cause one particular thing about this game is that mafia has an easier time just creating scum combinations and being "whatevs" if anyone of the spies outside of that team makes it (cause then they will just vote yes with a short term justification whenever one of them makes it into the team).
Which is what you have been doing contrary to other people who actually propose teams of townreads, not scumreads.
These are actually really good posts. (#2714/2715)
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That might be the whole distance thing that Vivax was referring to re: Kitaman. Hmmmmm.
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On November 13 2015 22:05 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:24 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 07:08 Half the Sky wrote:On November 13 2015 06:56 Vivax wrote:
I can tell you already that I would send or accept HTS/Coag/Artanis/myself.
I can compromise on swapping myself out with either Shockey or Xata (who I think is more likely to be town than SL) if you don't trust me.
If you also TR rayn who in my opinion is a good player but had to be wrong on someone last cycle, that sort of coincides with his reads, with exception of HTS/Shockey. I'm so sure on Xatalos and Rels as spies at this point but if we must compromise and you want SL out, then Shockey in for sure. Also the frustrating thing here is that rayn is town but Coag needs to do his part in getting Shockey out of the tunnel. Goddamnit. Part of the problem there from Shockey's POV is that rayn voted for two failed missions and was in two failed missions but that must mean that who else is scum? But there's a reason that not even scum are trying to bury him for that even. His reads were off this game (Shockey/myself) so that should lend clear to him as to why he voted that way and put the people on his mission that he did. And to be quite frank, if it comes down to you and Xatalos, I would take you over Xatalos by a country mile. Because I really really think he's mafia and if he gets on a team again, this game is over. HTS you need to stop being so tunneled and THINKYou are town => Arta is scum Others have to decide which of you, or if both of you are scum, but you have a big chance: you know your alignement. Two people voted YES on the first team and wasn't on the first team: there is 99% chance one of them if scum. And YOU are one of them. Here you are pushing a me + Vivax or me + kita team, which is extremely unlikely. I know where you are. I was tunneled on you with rayn before, specificaly for that reason: you refuse to admit two people voting NO is next to impossible with such a close vote.Your stubborness modkilled rayn. Don't make it lose the game and think; even if you can't decide I'm town, at least stop townreading Arta, 'cause it doesn't make sense.BTW if you're scum and Arta is town, fucking WP. I mean, it's more Arta failing than you being good in this case, but WP for keeping the effort. HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Rels, I know you're mafia here, but on the bolded, thanks for making me laugh. rayn lacked self-control, that's why he was modkilled, not because of anyone. Honestly it didn't matter what my reads were at the time or what I was doing, what happened, happened. And Rels, there's so many things wrong with your filter, it's not funny. Funny that Artanis even highlighted some of them. Again, Xatalos got on that team, and that's all that needed to happen with where the reads of people were. rayn was scumreading Superbia, you, and myself at the time, and he pushed sicklucker over Artanis because the "scummier" people were voting for the team. If you voted yes, with a mission failure and you couldn't line your stuff up as scum, you'd look bad. And scum are concerned about how they look. Voting no doesn't necessarily vindicate you when there's other things going on.
Wait.
If you voted yes, with a mission failure and you couldn't line your stuff up as scum, you'd look bad.
You're saying I couldn't have possibly voted YES without looking bad during the mission 1 without looking bad. Confirm / deny ?
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On November 13 2015 22:05 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2015 19:24 Rels wrote:On November 13 2015 07:08 Half the Sky wrote:On November 13 2015 06:56 Vivax wrote:
I can tell you already that I would send or accept HTS/Coag/Artanis/myself.
I can compromise on swapping myself out with either Shockey or Xata (who I think is more likely to be town than SL) if you don't trust me.
If you also TR rayn who in my opinion is a good player but had to be wrong on someone last cycle, that sort of coincides with his reads, with exception of HTS/Shockey. I'm so sure on Xatalos and Rels as spies at this point but if we must compromise and you want SL out, then Shockey in for sure. Also the frustrating thing here is that rayn is town but Coag needs to do his part in getting Shockey out of the tunnel. Goddamnit. Part of the problem there from Shockey's POV is that rayn voted for two failed missions and was in two failed missions but that must mean that who else is scum? But there's a reason that not even scum are trying to bury him for that even. His reads were off this game (Shockey/myself) so that should lend clear to him as to why he voted that way and put the people on his mission that he did. And to be quite frank, if it comes down to you and Xatalos, I would take you over Xatalos by a country mile. Because I really really think he's mafia and if he gets on a team again, this game is over. HTS you need to stop being so tunneled and THINKYou are town => Arta is scum Others have to decide which of you, or if both of you are scum, but you have a big chance: you know your alignement. Two people voted YES on the first team and wasn't on the first team: there is 99% chance one of them if scum. And YOU are one of them. Here you are pushing a me + Vivax or me + kita team, which is extremely unlikely. I know where you are. I was tunneled on you with rayn before, specificaly for that reason: you refuse to admit two people voting NO is next to impossible with such a close vote.Your stubborness modkilled rayn. Don't make it lose the game and think; even if you can't decide I'm town, at least stop townreading Arta, 'cause it doesn't make sense.BTW if you're scum and Arta is town, fucking WP. I mean, it's more Arta failing than you being good in this case, but WP for keeping the effort. HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Rels, I know you're mafia here, but on the bolded, thanks for making me laugh. rayn lacked self-control, that's why he was modkilled, not because of anyone. Honestly it didn't matter what my reads were at the time or what I was doing, what happened, happened. And Rels, there's so many things wrong with your filter, it's not funny. Funny that Artanis even highlighted some of them.
List them!
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HTS where you have goooone
Why are you never answering meeeee
It looks like you are avoiding meeeee
Do you really think I was forced to vote NO to the first voooooote
Can you confiiiiiirm
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I'm reading again from pages 40- to about 80 or whenever the first mission failed. That was a generic argument, you stated had no reason to townread sicklucker.
Then later on, this quote more or less supports my "let's see where everyone stands" theory.
On November 05 2015 22:10 Rels wrote:rayn and you are town. SL I'm not sure. Nothing scummy, but he's not doing much. Arta tomorrow will probably elect you / rayn / him; my vote will depend on who I think is towniest between SL and Arta at deadline. Waiting on Arta's answers to me + his analysis on me he said he would do.
Page 65 you're voting no, rayn is trying to still push the team though in the argument between him and you, although his pushing we might need another look at. (page 64-65)
In any case, to answer you Rels, a scum Rels would know that Xatalos is obviously going to vote yes on the team he puts through. You're waiting for SL, so that's basically the reason for you to vote no. What I'm trying to say is that you voting no doesn't necessarily vindicate you from being scum. Especially if everyone else's thoughts are making sense. Does this make sense now?
Actually the biggest problem overall is that you are almost overfocusing on the votes alone, and there are other layers to this game (namely the filters when I look at theirs and when I look at yours). Obviously we're "forced" to eliminate one of you and PoE it down to two townies. Duh, of course that's what scum are banking on here.
And there was a really good gem from rayn on Kita that I'll put in another post. It's decent food for discussion.
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An interesting conversation between Rels and Artanis early in the game.
On November 06 2015 02:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Rels, why did you flip your Rayn read based on things that had already happened before you townread him initially? What made you think about him again? Your argument's revolved around things he should know, but no part of your argument was new to when you said he was definitely town.
On November 06 2015 02:18 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Like you went from calling him basically confirmed town to very suspicious in 3 hours without anything seemingly triggering you.
On November 06 2015 06:28 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2015 02:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Rels, why did you flip your Rayn read based on things that had already happened before you townread him initially? What made you think about him again? Your argument's revolved around things he should know, but no part of your argument was new to when you said he was definitely town. I'm on phone so no quote: read my big post. The first line is something like "I thought he was confirmed because he made a very similar post about noobking in newbie XIII". But actually its super suspicious that he uses this game to prove that my case are boring, when my play D1 this game was boring. Now he defends himself saying "But its not THIS kind of boring!", when he clearly said in example of me being town " look how he's always looking for something new on noobking". I get that this is not very clear without quote; read my big post and the reactions after it to understand.
On November 06 2015 06:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2015 06:28 Rels wrote:On November 06 2015 02:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Rels, why did you flip your Rayn read based on things that had already happened before you townread him initially? What made you think about him again? Your argument's revolved around things he should know, but no part of your argument was new to when you said he was definitely town. I'm on phone so no quote: read my big post. The first line is something like "I thought he was confirmed because he made a very similar post about noobking in newbie XIII". But actually its super suspicious that he uses this game to prove that my case are boring, when my play D1 this game was boring. Now he defends himself saying "But its not THIS kind of boring!", when he clearly said in example of me being town " look how he's always looking for something new on noobking". I get that this is not very clear without quote; read my big post and the reactions after it to understand. Yeah but what made you think about this? He hadn't said anything new since your last post.
On November 06 2015 06:40 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2015 06:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 06 2015 06:28 Rels wrote:On November 06 2015 02:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Rels, why did you flip your Rayn read based on things that had already happened before you townread him initially? What made you think about him again? Your argument's revolved around things he should know, but no part of your argument was new to when you said he was definitely town. I'm on phone so no quote: read my big post. The first line is something like "I thought he was confirmed because he made a very similar post about noobking in newbie XIII". But actually its super suspicious that he uses this game to prove that my case are boring, when my play D1 this game was boring. Now he defends himself saying "But its not THIS kind of boring!", when he clearly said in example of me being town " look how he's always looking for something new on noobking". I get that this is not very clear without quote; read my big post and the reactions after it to understand. Yeah but what made you think about this? He hadn't said anything new since your last post. I don't know. I just thought about it and realized it didn't make sense to take as example a push of mine in one game, and forget another one in the same game that was the opposite.
So Rels ends with an "I don't know" which indicates it might not be a natural thought process, and mafia have to make something up here. Which lends this to being scum-indicative. He also fails to answer the question as to whether rayn did anything new or that he did anything new to change that read or not (Artanis' "he hadn't said anything new [for you to think] since your last post").
I think (???) rayn called him on this earlier but in any case this was a bit easier to follow.
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On November 13 2015 23:16 Half the Sky wrote:I'm reading again from pages 40- to about 80 or whenever the first mission failed. That was a generic argument, you stated had no reason to townread sicklucker. Then later on, this quote more or less supports my "let's see where everyone stands" theory. Show nested quote +On November 05 2015 22:10 Rels wrote:On November 05 2015 22:03 Xatalos wrote:
Rels, thoughts on the current team? rayn and you are town. SL I'm not sure. Nothing scummy, but he's not doing much. Arta tomorrow will probably elect you / rayn / him; my vote will depend on who I think is towniest between SL and Arta at deadline. Waiting on Arta's answers to me + his analysis on me he said he would do. Page 65 you're voting no, rayn is trying to still push the team though in the argument between him and you, although his pushing we might need another look at. (page 64-65) In any case, to answer you Rels, a scum Rels would know that Xatalos is obviously going to vote yes on the team he puts through. You're waiting for SL, so that's basically the reason for you to vote no. What I'm trying to say is that you voting no doesn't necessarily vindicate you from being scum. Especially if everyone else's thoughts are making sense. Does this make sense now? Actually the biggest problem overall is that you are almost overfocusing on the votes alone, and there are other layers to this game (namely the filters when I look at theirs and when I look at yours). Obviously we're "forced" to eliminate one of you and PoE it down to two townies. Duh, of course that's what scum are banking on here. And there was a really good gem from rayn on Kita that I'll put in another post. It's decent food for discussion.
So you agree I could have voted YES without looking bad in case I'm scum. Thanks. (=
Of course one scum voted NO, so that doesn't absolve me; but two scums voting NO is extremely unlikely. That's why I was scumreading both you and Arta before mission 2, and now that it's proven at least one of you is town (unless rayn is scum), I don't understand why he is not scumreading the other.
Interested on the gem BTW.
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On November 13 2015 23:22 Half the Sky wrote:An interesting conversation between Rels and Artanis early in the game. Show nested quote +On November 06 2015 02:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Rels, why did you flip your Rayn read based on things that had already happened before you townread him initially? What made you think about him again? Your argument's revolved around things he should know, but no part of your argument was new to when you said he was definitely town. Show nested quote +On November 06 2015 02:18 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Like you went from calling him basically confirmed town to very suspicious in 3 hours without anything seemingly triggering you. Show nested quote +On November 06 2015 06:28 Rels wrote:On November 06 2015 02:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Rels, why did you flip your Rayn read based on things that had already happened before you townread him initially? What made you think about him again? Your argument's revolved around things he should know, but no part of your argument was new to when you said he was definitely town. I'm on phone so no quote: read my big post. The first line is something like "I thought he was confirmed because he made a very similar post about noobking in newbie XIII". But actually its super suspicious that he uses this game to prove that my case are boring, when my play D1 this game was boring. Now he defends himself saying "But its not THIS kind of boring!", when he clearly said in example of me being town " look how he's always looking for something new on noobking". I get that this is not very clear without quote; read my big post and the reactions after it to understand. Show nested quote +On November 06 2015 06:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 06 2015 06:28 Rels wrote:On November 06 2015 02:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Rels, why did you flip your Rayn read based on things that had already happened before you townread him initially? What made you think about him again? Your argument's revolved around things he should know, but no part of your argument was new to when you said he was definitely town. I'm on phone so no quote: read my big post. The first line is something like "I thought he was confirmed because he made a very similar post about noobking in newbie XIII". But actually its super suspicious that he uses this game to prove that my case are boring, when my play D1 this game was boring. Now he defends himself saying "But its not THIS kind of boring!", when he clearly said in example of me being town " look how he's always looking for something new on noobking". I get that this is not very clear without quote; read my big post and the reactions after it to understand. Yeah but what made you think about this? He hadn't said anything new since your last post. Show nested quote +On November 06 2015 06:40 Rels wrote:On November 06 2015 06:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On November 06 2015 06:28 Rels wrote:On November 06 2015 02:17 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Rels, why did you flip your Rayn read based on things that had already happened before you townread him initially? What made you think about him again? Your argument's revolved around things he should know, but no part of your argument was new to when you said he was definitely town. I'm on phone so no quote: read my big post. The first line is something like "I thought he was confirmed because he made a very similar post about noobking in newbie XIII". But actually its super suspicious that he uses this game to prove that my case are boring, when my play D1 this game was boring. Now he defends himself saying "But its not THIS kind of boring!", when he clearly said in example of me being town " look how he's always looking for something new on noobking". I get that this is not very clear without quote; read my big post and the reactions after it to understand. Yeah but what made you think about this? He hadn't said anything new since your last post. I don't know. I just thought about it and realized it didn't make sense to take as example a push of mine in one game, and forget another one in the same game that was the opposite. So Rels ends with an "I don't know" which indicates it might not be a natural thought process, and mafia have to make something up here. Which lends this to being scum-indicative. He also fails to answer the question as to whether rayn did anything new or that he did anything new to change that read or not (Artanis' "he hadn't said anything new [for you to think] since your last post"). I think (???) rayn called him on this earlier but in any case this was a bit easier to follow.
And what is the scum motivation to change my rayn's read without him doing something new ?
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hts you dont have to convince anyone of my alignment. We either lose here or im confirmed town anyway
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EPT
