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Newbie Student Mafia XI - Page 37

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
June 13 2015 18:12 GMT
#721
Maybe rels. I liked Trfel's points on him but I think I had a townread on him early on tone or something. Otherwise meh. I just try and collect townreads. you know that.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
June 13 2015 18:12 GMT
#722
On June 13 2015 16:20 n00bKing wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2015 15:22 Trfel wrote:
There is some scum motivation not to do that, but there's a lot more scum motivation TO do it. A whole lot more than the town motivation, anyway.

Please explain further. What is the scum motivation to do that?
It makes him look active, and makes him look like he's doing stuff. Posts without purpose.
On June 13 2015 16:20 n00bKing wrote:
Rels? Dunno, man. He looks a lot to me like he did in Newbie X, when he was Town. But some of the veterans in this game are seeing stuff from him they don't like. I'm not ready to try and pass judgment on Rels, I'll just have to keep watching him.
Hm, okay, I'll take a look at that game then.


On June 13 2015 18:08 Rels wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
I went through batsnacks past games and I have two things to share with you all.

First thing

On June 13 2015 09:39 batsnacks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2015 09:34 n00bKing wrote:
On June 13 2015 09:03 batsnacks wrote:
On June 13 2015 09:00 Rels wrote:
Last game D1 you didn't do a whole lot either if I remember correctly. In both game you also posted a nonsense post to gauge reactions.

Yeah you're totally wrong and that is points against you. The only time I posted nonsense that game was at night and that's because I was the cop and did not want to get killed.

Definitely not true. I expect he is talking about this steaming pile here, which was posted early in Day 1, and not at night:

batsnacks wrote:
above is THE JOYOUS, LAKE
below is KEEPING STILL, MOUNTAIN

Influence. Success.

When a weak element is above (the lake) and a strong element is below (the mountain), their powers attract each other so that they unite. This brings about success, for all success depends on the effect of mutual attraction

Perseverance furthers.

By keeping still within while experiencing joy without, one can prevent the joy from going to excess and hold it within proper bounds. This is the meaning of, "Perseverance furthers."

To take a maiden to wife brings good fortune

Heaven and earth attract each other and thus all creatures come into being. From the attractions they exert we can learn the nature of all beings in heaven and on earth.

A lake on the mountain:
The image of influence.
Thus the superior man encourages people to approach him
By his readiness to receive them.

A mountain with a lake on its summit is stimulated by the moisture from the lake. It has this advantage because its summit does not jut out as a peak but is sunken. The image counsels that the mind should be kept humble and free, so that it may remain receptive to good advice. People soon give up counseling a man who thinks that he knows everything better than anyone else.

The influence shows itself in the calves of the legs.
Misfortune.
Tarrying brings good fortune.

In movement, the calf of the leg follows the foot; by itself it can neither go forward nor stand still. Since the movement is not self-governed, it bodes ill. One should wait quietly until one is impelled to action by a real influence. Then one remains uninjured.


Your philosophical post about danger in this game looks a bit like a forced attempt to duplicate the same kind of nonsense you kicked off the last game with (since it was very recent, and people will remember you were Town).

Meanwhile, you never answered my question about approximately how many times you've been assigned a scum role in these games.

[...]
Also I only provide iching commentary when I'm town so I thank you for bringing this up.

That's true. I found 3 games where I did something similar, all of them town. Posts in spoiler if you're curious.
+ Show Spoiler +

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/485267-newbie-student-mafia-x?page=7#137
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/484076-assassination-mafia?page=9#174
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/465384-mission-mini-mafia?page=9#166


Second thing

On June 13 2015 08:23 batsnacks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2015 08:18 Trfel wrote:
On June 13 2015 08:14 batsnacks wrote:
On June 13 2015 08:11 Trfel wrote:
First, my computer internet died, so I am on my phone.

Second, Moosy, I do think that ruX could be mafia, but I feel that Rels is more likely.

Though I might actually want to lynch bats instead. His quick agreement with me is unexpected, his play doesnt feel like his town meta.


Your case is the best most compelling thing that has been posted yet??? Also you can't meta me remember what happened last time you tried?
Last time I tried was the Ver game and I was right.

I have learned a thing or two since my first game of mafia ever, thank you very much.


You don't have to believe this is my normal town meta because it's not, but you can't believe my scum meta is to post this much. I am a 1 page per day scum poster not a post more than anyone else scum poster.



That's not as extreme as he's saying, but it is true. In particular, look at the size of the filters of these two games. In both he got lynched D1. Can you guess in which one he was scum ?

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/474082-imperial-mafia?user=batsnacks
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/469267-fantasy-football-mafia-mini-2?user=batsnacks

If you don't wanna play the guessing game: he has two times more post in the first game, where he was town.

Conclusion
By meta I don't think BS is mafia this game.

##Unvote
Your first point is technically correct, but it doesn't mean anything. It's extremely easy for mafia!batsnacks to post this as scum. One good example of this is Onegu, who was known for a long time to only claim VT as town, and never as scum. Well, one game he did it as scum. If someone has a meta that "makes" them town, it's useless unless there's an actual reason why they can't do the same thing as scum.

As for the second point, again, the post quality is important, not just the quantity.

Damdred's post on batsnacks is really interesting, those are things that I didn't check. However, comparing the two games that Rels linked, I don't see batsnacks fitting Damdred's description that much. Notably because while he's always been a leading wagon, it's always been very close. Looking at Imperial Mafia (town!batsnacks), I noticed that batsnacks' filter at End of Day was extremely productive and focused, and I'm not seeing that from batsnacks this game. I'll take a look at batsnacks' scum reads now.

On June 14 2015 03:08 batsnacks wrote:
Here are the final vote counts from the first two days of newbie X, notice how sulfurus is off doing his own thing
Why does this matter? He did something generally considered to be bad, he got lynched for it, and I'd really hope he didn't do the same thing in his next game.

Were his reasons for voting those people original, or sheeping others (even if not in the final vote)?
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
June 13 2015 18:13 GMT
#723
Kinda thinking there may not be a vet mafia.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
June 13 2015 18:16 GMT
#724
On June 12 2015 22:12 batsnacks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 12 2015 21:53 Rels wrote:
Don't care that you think it's forced. Good if you agree that it's scummy. I'll keep it in mind. Vote for him if you don't find anything scummier.


I wasn't implying that your post was forced I was implying that plants post was seemed forced. Or do you not care that I think plants post was forced?
I just saw this post......

I have no idea how I missed this the first time. Batsnacks' read progression on Rels makes a lot more sense now.

Maybe batsnacks really isn't the best lynch today.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
June 13 2015 18:26 GMT
#725
Damdred, looking at the reasons that batsnacks has to scumread people, I generally don't think they are strong. You seem to disagree. Why?
batsnacks
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
United States4466 Posts
June 13 2015 18:28 GMT
#726
On May 24 2015 06:04 Sulfurus wrote:
I admit even I am confused as to why NinjaBunnies is defending me so hard; right now the only vote on her is Tictock (someone who I have had a townread on longer then anyone else) but she is definitely someone who needs to be looked at later.

For me the the person with the most useful reads and my top town is Barakos; he was the one who helped me townread Breshke and scumread Disformation with this post, he has shown a healthy suspicion of NinjaBunnies, and he influenced me to un-vote BM, along with SL, with his coinflip argument (for the record I still think SL is town).

My favorite Barakos post so far is this one right here especially the Batsnacks part which shows how scummy he truly is (Bat's overly defensive reactions in posts 538 & 539 don't help his case either) so while he won't get lynched today I'll definitely be pushing for his death tomorrow.

##Vote: Batsnacks


This is sulfur when he's town.
batsnacks
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
United States4466 Posts
June 13 2015 18:30 GMT
#727
wait BM was town, I messed that one up.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
June 13 2015 18:32 GMT
#728
On June 13 2015 06:41 geript wrote:
Nah. Damdred is 100% town. He's gotten pretty easy to read.
Geript, I understand that you don't want to give away your secret read on Damdred, but I need to understand why you are saying this, at least on some level.
Damdred
Profile Joined July 2014
15669 Posts
June 13 2015 18:33 GMT
#729
On June 14 2015 03:26 Trfel wrote:
Damdred, looking at the reasons that batsnacks has to scumread people, I generally don't think they are strong. You seem to disagree. Why?


I think strength of town/scum reads is dependent on the player in question, if you remember aperture 4 bats reads were much weaker than normal even for his standards.

While some times bats comes out with a super read most of the time,they are in this line of thinkin.
MoosyDoosy
Profile Joined November 2014
United States4519 Posts
June 13 2015 18:34 GMT
#730
Why are you guys still going after batsnacks. Sure he was a shitty player at the start, but he's clearly a town player at this point. Unless you hold a grudge against him for his terrible start, I don't see why you would go after him.
"Just a second too late rsoultin :D" - My 4k Guardian post
Damdred
Profile Joined July 2014
15669 Posts
June 13 2015 18:37 GMT
#731
Who should we lynch today moos
ruXxar
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Norway5669 Posts
June 13 2015 18:46 GMT
#732
On June 14 2015 03:34 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Why are you guys still going after batsnacks. Sure he was a shitty player at the start, but he's clearly a town player at this point. Unless you hold a grudge against him for his terrible start, I don't see why you would go after him.


Who should we lynch instead?
"alright guys im claiming my role im actually politician I can manipulate a persons vote during the day phase, used it on clarity last phase and forced him to vote for HF. full role name donald trump, definitely town sided". - EBH
WaveofShadow
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada31495 Posts
June 13 2015 18:46 GMT
#733
On June 14 2015 03:00 geript wrote:
And wave got added for feels iirc but weekly so. that might have been earlier though

You know it's funny I remember unvoting you for feels and now that I'm back and seeing that you haven't done anything, nor am I seeing hardcore scumhunter geript I'm starting to worry again.

Would not lynch above Sulf though. Nothing redeeming about that guy whatsoever. Might sheep Trfel too. Really liking him this game.

I also remember Damdred and Scott pinging my radar for some reason---something along the lines of not knowing where they stand but I think scott sort of addressed it. Damdred who do YOU want to lynch today aside form 'not batsnacks?'
twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast! ||| Juicy Dad for lyfe ||| 'idk i get a kick out of stupid things' - Jarms Yarng
n00bKing
Profile Joined June 2015
United States1202 Posts
June 13 2015 18:48 GMT
#734
On June 13 2015 17:38 Rels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2015 16:47 n00bKing wrote:
Okay, one last post, then bed, and I'll see everyone in the morning.

What's the prevailing philosophy around here on whether (or when) Carl should roleclaim? Seems to me that if he remains hidden, there is all kinds of potential for disaster, and maybe even moreso in a Newbie game.

So does someone with that type of role usually roleclaim? If not, why not? And if so, is it usually done Day 1, or not until after Night 1 begins?

I can see some distinct advantages of him claiming during Day 1, instead of waiting for Night. If the claim goes uncountered (and comes from anyone that doesn't have a bunch of votes stacked up on them) then we have a largely confirmed Townie. Anyone who had previously voted against that player gets a small strike against them, for barking up the wrong tree. And Carl's vote in the batsnacks/Sulfurus debate takes on extra weight, because although Carl could still be incorrect, at least we could expect that he's not incorrect on purpose.

I feel like this topic should have probably been raised a while ago, but I kept waiting and waiting, to see who would bring it up, so that I could award them some Town Cred just for mentioning it. (Guess I have to give the Town Cred to myself now? w00t?)

Anyway, interested in hearing other opinions on this.

Thinking about it I agree with it. There is no good reason to stay hidden if you're Carl. My reasonning is:
- if you're a someone most people sees at townie, you take the risk of killing the doctor
- if you're someone people are suspicious of, you take the risk of killing the cop or the vigi

It's even worse than that. If Dr. Weird targets Carl, then it looks to me like they would kill each other, just like Frylock and Carl would kill each other. And yes, Carl would also kill Allen and Neil.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
June 13 2015 18:48 GMT
#735
I just looked at Sulfurus's filter from Newbie Student Mafia X.

He was lynched Day 3, with only two pages of filter. When the pressure was on him, me barely responded at all. I just don't feel comfortable reading him. It's not just trying to tell newbie from scum, the complete lack of posts makes it a complete nightmare. I'd rather take a Day 1 lynch that isn't a shot in the dark.

I really would appreciate it if geript answered my question to him here.
MoosyDoosy
Profile Joined November 2014
United States4519 Posts
June 13 2015 18:50 GMT
#736
On June 14 2015 03:37 Damdred wrote:
Who should we lynch today moos

Sulfurus. batsnacks is not Mafia. He's been playing a shitty game as he says and he deserves to die for doing so, but he's a townie no matter how I look at it. I'd prefer to vote for geript as he's acting strange as well, but the priority should be to keep a townie alive.
"Just a second too late rsoultin :D" - My 4k Guardian post
n00bKing
Profile Joined June 2015
United States1202 Posts
June 13 2015 18:50 GMT
#737
On June 13 2015 18:17 ruXxar wrote:
I disagree.

There are 3 Mafia and 2 town roles.
I believe that reducing kill power from 2 to 1 is the single most important factor in us winning the game.
This would buy us so much time that we should have overwhelming odds of winning.
The chance of targeting Carl is very low.

I'm ok with taking the odds of a power role checking Carl if it means we increase our chances of killing mafia.

Does knowing that there is only 1 mafia attack each Night change your position?

Also, where are you getting that there are "2 town roles?" I see absolutely nothing that would indicate there are 8 VTs and 2 non-Vanilla Town roles, if that is what you are saying.
batsnacks
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
United States4466 Posts
June 13 2015 18:53 GMT
#738
On June 14 2015 03:48 Trfel wrote:
I just looked at Sulfurus's filter from Newbie Student Mafia X.

He was lynched Day 3, with only two pages of filter. When the pressure was on him, me barely responded at all. I just don't feel comfortable reading him. It's not just trying to tell newbie from scum, the complete lack of posts makes it a complete nightmare. I'd rather take a Day 1 lynch that isn't a shot in the dark.

I really would appreciate it if geript answered my question to him here.


Look at the content of his posts in that game though. They're actually pretty dense and show signs of critical thinking. There are like 10 reads crammed into the post I quoted and color coded.
WaveofShadow
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada31495 Posts
June 13 2015 18:54 GMT
#739
With ~4h to go, I don't think discussing blue roles is pertinent.
Also I really hope I can be around for deadline shenangians.
twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast! ||| Juicy Dad for lyfe ||| 'idk i get a kick out of stupid things' - Jarms Yarng
MoosyDoosy
Profile Joined November 2014
United States4519 Posts
June 13 2015 18:54 GMT
#740
On June 14 2015 03:50 n00bKing wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2015 18:17 ruXxar wrote:
I disagree.

There are 3 Mafia and 2 town roles.
I believe that reducing kill power from 2 to 1 is the single most important factor in us winning the game.
This would buy us so much time that we should have overwhelming odds of winning.
The chance of targeting Carl is very low.

I'm ok with taking the odds of a power role checking Carl if it means we increase our chances of killing mafia.

Does knowing that there is only 1 mafia attack each Night change your position?

Also, where are you getting that there are "2 town roles?" I see absolutely nothing that would indicate there are 8 VTs and 2 non-Vanilla Town roles, if that is what you are saying.

Sorry for this newbie question which I should have asked earlier but which slipped my mind because I had to do something else. What's a Carl?
"Just a second too late rsoultin :D" - My 4k Guardian post
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