On November 25 2014 08:09 sicklucker wrote: Are meta is small but I mean it is something. The breske I remember is more of a passive town trying to be the middleman not leading the charge. He does scum hunt but he does it through asking people questions mainly not making a "Looks like we found our d1 lynch already" Lets do nothing for the rest of the day posts.
How much weight are you putting on this reaction to first posts? Do you thin it was just trolly/pressure vote on you to do stuff?
On November 25 2014 08:25 sicklucker wrote: I know im town and hes defending me. His reason is also sound. A mafia would unlikely defend me. Key word here slight
Why can't mafia defend you in that situation? And is it a real defense?
Usually votes within the first page are pressure votes especially when you say hey i'm town going to afk. Of course you need to be back in the thread.
But look at the post that you are slightly town reading sky for, hes not defending you at all hes look at motives for bresh slightly without any real pressure. Half of it won't get any answer and then he discredits himself with the last sentence slightly . So not sur ei'm seeing what you are unless you are just looking to give people town reads for no reason
On November 25 2014 08:27 meatpudding wrote: Student mafia, eh.... Did you know? Sperm whales have the largest brain of any animal.
Cool stuff what do you think of the couple things that have been posted so far
I have my eye on sicklucker. Not really sure what he's up to but I expect he's fishing for reads. I would like to see what he comes up with by end of day. Otherwise I'm marking it as suspicious.
I know its not much posted so far but is there anyone else you are looking at or hinking about?
On November 25 2014 08:20 sicklucker wrote: imo day ones are stupid. I never take too much info out of day one but I do try to get some and start the game rolling I try to take charge as town. Im certainly not going to vote breske because of it , this is the kind of thing you look back at when you have more information.
Kind of agree with your day one idea. Not to say that it's stupid, but it takes some time to make a decent read.
On November 25 2014 07:14 sicklucker wrote: boring im town again afk
Looks like we found our d1 lynch already
##Vote: Sicklucker
Are you voting him down because he's serious and just trolling or because you're a baddie trying to lynch a good guy?
Granted this is my first ever TLM game so you probably know this lad more than I do...just saying. I can read that either way.
This is pretty townie. This got me at least one slight town read
Anyone could have said this. It's not uncommon to have a policy lynch on lurkers. I don't know why you would come out and say that it looks town. Unless you're going to say that it's a meta-play and you're trying to judge Breshke on his reaction to you saying he's town, but then you could say that everything is a play and you wouldn't have to be held to anything you said.
Anyway on the topic of policy, I wouldn't necessarily lynch all lurkers on day 1. Only if there was no reasonable candidate scum lynch.
Could you alk more about the bolded and where lurker lynch/policy lynch came from.
On November 25 2014 09:08 Damdred wrote: SL tell me what you think of Half the Sky.
And since you are so good at reading breske give me a preliminary read (especially since you are fond of fast reads)
Like hes the only person in the game ive given a read on yet. Why do you keep asking
Because your read is half ass'd and at one point you say that he defends you when he never does and in almost his very next post he says "Oh nvm i'll vote him and keep my eye on him" basically.
[...] why did he feel the need to say that he was town and then why if he is town is he afking? As town you need to try find out peoples alignments so you want to post more ask questions w/e as scum you have no need for that. I am also seeing if he actually went afk or not.
Alright, fair play. I had thought for some reason he was a vet who was just bored, and then seeing your last post, checked the list and no he's not a vet, so I stand corrected. I guess I'll be keeping a similar eye on him, and based on his reaction will vote accordingly.
Although if he actually is town and trolling, he's not really helping his/our case. I agree, it is an eager time to vote him down now, but if he is town, that's exactly what the baddies want. Easy targets...
So sicklucker, what's the deal?
He is not defending he is in fact throwing suspicion your way. We go aways with me giving you pressure about the town read and half re enters the thread
On November 25 2014 09:01 Half the Sky wrote: Meatpudding, if you could define lurker...when I think lurker I think of people who are theoretically in this game but aren't posting anything.
Regarding my post, I wasn't siding with anybody. Day 1, I feel it is too quick to accuse someone, so I was calling into question Breshke's vote approx 30 mins into Day 1, as it was pretty quick and I had made an incorrect assumption on sicklucker's experience with TLM, to which I thought Breshke's rationale (in his second post) made sense.
Whops he even says that hes not defending or taking sides. I ask again for your read on him with all of the updated information because I wanted to know your opinon for sure before I posted mine and you shoot back
On November 25 2014 09:08 Damdred wrote: SL tell me what you think of Half the Sky.
And since you are so good at reading breske give me a preliminary read (especially since you are fond of fast reads)
Like hes the only person in the game ive given a read on yet. Why do you keep asking
Because your read is half ass'd and at one point you say that he defends you when he never does and in almost his very next post he says "Oh nvm i'll vote him and keep my eye on him" basically.
Thats bullshit Everypost I made in this entire thread was about those two players. Its like your posting to make yourself look good while adding nothing.
So no its not total bullshit, you had misinformation or was looking to townread someone based on nothing and I wanted an updated read and you decided to act a fool.
On November 25 2014 09:06 sicklucker wrote: Breske knows im super active and push the thread. I expect him to give me more time since he should be able to read me better then anyone else in this game since hes played the most with me. I also think ill read him better then most people here so I wont pass judgement.
What if i decide to play completely different to last game? I don't think one games experience is enough to have a good read on someone at least im not going to claim that on you.
I agree some but of all people I dont expect you to insta vote me. We just played for like 2 weeks you know I cant keep my mouth shut for very long. If anything I talk too much as town
So you think you talk to much as town but are suprised that i pushed on you ebcause you said you were going afk which is an excuse to not post as you didnt really go afk.
Anyway damdred what do you have so far?
i have a two town leans, a few nulls and a slight scum lean
On November 25 2014 09:34 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: and damdred dont you think you might just be finding reasons to find sick funny at this point?
Not really, i'm trying to figure out exactly why hes doing what hes doing hes answered me to the fullest of his abilities thres nothin else to gain from the conversation.
What are you doing though? You agree with Sick when he says its looking lik ei'm trying to do stuff just to do it but then you try to pressure him then switch to me. Looks like you are trying to do the same thing I was accused of
I'm glad you said that SL, you now have a town lean for me after all of this. But when i ask you for a comprehensive read on breske that you are sure you can give and youdon't i will instantly vote you
I agree with slight first reaction reads, Palmar had a really good explanation about why gut reads are generally wrong and they are based off of nothing pretty much and lead you to bypass scum which was why I pressured you heavily. You shouldn't town read someone based on one post when their next few posts contradict the point you are trying to make. (That is my opinon of course and the pressure wasn't to make a point but trying to dig a bit).
And well if you claim to read someone really well, you should be able to tell on certain things which was what i picked up on you earlier with how you approached bre to only end in a null read.
Right now it looks more like town ass kush instead of mafia ass kush but could change pretty fast.
LS I have no clue hes not doing much but he didn't do much in the last game he played either, he would be a plynch basically i'll have to reread him soon as i'm done with prep.
Putin, he seems pretty combative and not caring and goes after people I don't think its his mafia meta that i've seen where he is a bit more lurky hes giving his thoughts pretty freely even if they don't make sense all of the time hes probably townn.
There wasn't much to read so I went on and did it and hes still pretty null. He defends people for being new and scum reads someone who is in the new category also and theres not a lot of reasoning present so can't really make it out to well. he just has to post more and give reads.
On November 26 2014 08:02 Trfel wrote: I'm becoming highly suspicious of batsnacks.
Looking at batsnacks' posts this game, it does seem like he hasn't contributed many reads or constructive comments at all. He has pressure voted kushm4sta, and tried to convince other people to vote for kushm4sta, as shown:
On November 25 2014 12:18 Oatsmaster wrote: He has bad posts regarding a read ohf HTS, his policy lynch on kush is really bad and he is using that to avoid playing the game and doing actual useful things.
This isn't a read. None of oats' posts contain reads.
oats is play is like 80% asking questions that have already been answered and 20% badgering the host about issues he could fix himself.
If my plynch on kush is bad give me something better.
I've seen oats play a lot better than he is doing right now.
He just starts attacking Oatsmaster, without actually providing any argument against the accsusations.
It's been nearly 24 hours and I cannot find any critical thinking or logical reads from batsnacks. He has been only minimally probing for information, as well.
Now, examining batsnacks' mafia history, it seems to show similar, non-accusatory play as mafia, but an ability to logically provide arguments against people as town.
In Fantasy Football Mafia Mini 2, his most recent mafia game, batsnacks was a mafia vanilla. His posts generally seem to lack content, for example this:
I only had to swap 2 letters, the A and the I. You have to swap 3, the N, O, and W. Plus you have an extra letter that doesn't even belong there.
Looks like I'm right about you. You're clearly reaching here.
batsnacks did give some analysis in saying that robik seemed to be town in that game, which ended up being correct. But he failed to provide specifics or any real evidence of this:
On October 24 2014 06:50 batsnacks wrote: I think robik looks pretty solid. I like how he's posting; he's focused, not all caps, consolidated, no personal dramas, that stuff is what reminds me of hard to get along with robik. @DrParnassus what about robik this game seem hard to cooperate with? Could you quote an example? You did say -everything about the way he's playing- reminds you of that.
He also defends Liam from an accusation. Up to now, the only two real things he's said are claiming these two people to be town. At this point he is accused of being mafia, and this is his defense:
On October 06 2014 23:26 batsnacks wrote: Oats if you are in fact "contributing" shouldn't you be thanking me? I did enable these "contributions" of yours. I feel like you're annoyed with me for allowing you to contribute.
Or are you annoyed with being in the spotlight this early?
You dont get to claim credit for something that happened accidentally.
What are your reads, mainly holyflare and me?
I agreed with HF a lot last game and he was town. I'm agreeing with him this game already so, tentatively town.
I'm voting you because I think you're scummy.
Also lol at "accidentally"
You claimed on accident now?
batsnacks accuses Oatsmaster of being mafia in this game (which ends up being incorrect). But when he defends someone as being town, he provides some support for this claim, and also shares his views a bit.
On October 07 2014 08:07 batsnacks wrote: Wait a minute, something isn't right. I quoted all of the following from the same post.
On October 07 2014 02:35 Blazinghand wrote: ...there's roughly speaking 13 players, right? If 3 are scum, then that gives us a solid 22% chance of lynching scum purely based on RNG.
No townie in this game knows the ratio of town to mafia, so it is correct here that BH gives us an example ratio of 10/3 or 22% as an example.
But then later in that post he says this:
On October 07 2014 02:35 Blazinghand wrote: ...the fact of the matter is, I'm offering a straight-up 22% chance to lynch someone.
BH how do you KNOW there are exactly 3 mafia? I bolded fact because that's a serious word to throw around when you're supposedly working with estimates.
Here's a critical analysis of a post in that game. It doesn't result in anything, but this post has more logic and scum-searching than his play to this point in the current game, as well as his play in the first game I mentioned, where he was mafia.
On October 08 2014 02:22 Hopeless1der wrote: You had one job batsnacks. + Show Spoiler +
and then HF gave you another one.
Does it make you nervous that I've already figured out you're mafia?
Then he claims Hopeless1der to be mafia, which ends up being correct. I don't see any reasoning listed, though. This post also came after the first 24 hours of the game, unlike all of the other posts quoted here.
I did notice this inconsistency between his post in this game:
On October 07 2014 08:19 Grackaroni wrote: You're implying that at the start of the post BH was careful not to slip that he had knowledge of the setup. (by pointing out that the number of scum is unknown) and then *slipped* that he was 100% sure there were 3 mafia within like 10 seconds of typing which is really unrealistic.
What I see is BH working off the assumption that random lynch provides at least 22% chance of hitting mafia compared to day 1 analysis which varies (and BH thinks is worse for catching mafia)
I think it's feasible that he slipped.
besides
The TL mafia database disagrees that random lynch is better. So by random lynching we 1) have worse odds of lynching mafia and 2) players who agree with the random lynch have zero accountability for their votes.
Why the change? Probably just a change in his playstyle, but another explanation is that he is searching for mafia in that game, and has less incentive to do so in this game.
Looking at batsnacks' play in the game preceding the above game, 2p2 Vanilla Werewolf 13er, batsnacks immediately comes up with a comprehensive look at GlowingBear:
On September 26 2014 08:14 batsnacks wrote: I'm not completely caught up yet but I still think GB is mafiawolf.
On September 25 2014 11:02 GlowingBear wrote: I think Storr is mafia because of this:
This post stinks:
On September 25 2014 09:20 StorrZerg wrote: (1) i'd lynch fecal for the donkey entrance to the game.
the overly troll attitude fecal has with the caps locks, and insta vote on holy is really throwing off scum vibes. Deff would lynch.
On September 25 2014 08:34 Fecalfeast wrote: The fact that nobody was using the voting thread made me think they were joke votes. That's why I didn't use the thread anyway.
Lol I actually like your case holyflare
"yeah right"
Also i don't like the GB entrance to the game
On September 25 2014 08:41 GlowingBear wrote: Oh THANK GOD I'm town again! I hate rolling scum.
Ok, Haru, tell me what you think of holyflower by now
(2)unless im missing a game he just played, last game he was scum. seems odd to lead with a lie.
(1) very has reason to call someone definetely scum. I did that no geript last game. There is nothing alignment indicative in fecal's entrance and that makes storr look bad.
(2) storr was scum with me and I clearly stated on the qt that I wanted to be town. I was mafia for 3 games and I wish I was town on this, which I am. I never lied.
The way he is disliking entrances looks like he is trying to pretend to be an aggressive town.
Also, he gives Haru free town pass for his entrance and also obiwan. None has alignment indicative posts.
On September 25 2014 10:11 StorrZerg wrote: obi probably town too.
I'm on a phone and I'm too lazy to search for the town pass on Haru now.
storr is my strongest scum read the moment
Here's his case on storr. He says storr is pretending to be aggressive town by disliking entrances. That is a weird thing to say. How can GB tell the difference between someone who is pretending to be aggressive town and someone who actually is aggressive town based on so few posts? Imo he can't and is just making stuff up.
He also scum reads storr for saying someone is "definitely" mafia and says he said the exact same thing as scum last game. Well, look at this:
On September 25 2014 11:32 GlowingBear wrote: Naaaah. I'm positive storr is scum. ##Vote: Storr
He did it again this game.
I also think this post is scummy:
On September 25 2014 13:09 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:51 Hopeless1der wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:42 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:28 Hopeless1der wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:22 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:19 Hopeless1der wrote: not much time tonight, but right now severely dislike glowingbear. Very shallow reads imo. HF's case wasnt terrible, it was misplaced. If haru couldnt prove he was actually sad about rolling blue I'd be voting for him right now. Since the case has obviously failed, why would HF stay with it? Thats ridiculous.
Then there's his scumlist...what the hell is that about. players have literally not even posted yet, but GB has solved the game? I dont buy that in the slightest.
I'll probably be gone until this time tomorrow but should be generally more active when I'm around during my evenings. (Just started a new job, dont want to play at work)
Because that's his scum read and if the case didn't go through he should be asking more questions to Haru to get more information?
Lol...
HF's case on Haru was literally based on one post that was demonstrably false using out-of-thread but public information. Again, why try to stick with such a case? Refusing to "overlook" (which is a strange way to phrase it btw) his case would be way more suspicious than dropping it like he already has. The fact that this seems suspicious to you makes YOU look suspicious to me.
Because it's easy, as scum, to pick on a tiny problem to bus a partner then drop the read.
That is so incredibly shallow. Unless I have found surefire scum tomorrow, I'm voting you just based off this interaction.
btw, fecalfeast is behaving pretty similar to last game imo. No reason to hate on him just yet. Palmar seems to have gotten upset that no one uses the voting thread to follow his policy and has taken up a silent protest. Sky is new to TL but not to mafia. I'd like to hear his (her?) thoughts on why d1 claimers usually got lynched on SK. I'm gone for now, see you all later.
It can be shallow, but at least I'm the only one trying to get people talking. Nothing is in the way of updating my reads the more people starts to talk. If you lynch me, you'll be lynching a townie for stupid reasons and you'll soon lose the game as much as you lost our last one
The "at least" in that sentence is really scummy to me. It's a tone thing. It's like he's really saying "I'm mafia but at least I'm the only one trying to get people talking." It's also scummy how he says he's the -only- person getting people talking. GB made a case against HF earlier for dropping his case against HaruRH. I'm not a mind reader but I think HF made that case to get people talking. So GB is scum reading HF for trying to get people talking -- while saying he, GB, is the only contributor in the thread.
I also think this post is scummy:
On September 25 2014 10:18 GlowingBear wrote: Ok
Glowningbear's first scum team guess: Haru, HF, Storr
Gonna have dinner and give reasons
GB is referring to himself in the third person here in order to distance himself from his reads that he doesn't actually believe in. How can he be confident he's caught the whole scum team and solved the game? Later when he's drunk he posts this:
On September 25 2014 17:48 GlowingBear wrote: My dribk senses says JAT is possibly mafia
So now GB has found 4 mafia... HF is mafia for getting people talking with an early case, Haru is mafia for unflipped assosiations, storr is mafia because GB can tell somehow that storr is just pretending to be aggressive town, and JAT is mafia because ??? Speaking of reads, GB is frantic this game about "getting reads." He is addicted to reads and needs an intervention. He wants to convince us so badly that he is trying to get reads that he can not stop saying it:
On September 25 2014 08:46 GlowingBear wrote: It won't help me getting reads if you use day1 just to charge your solar beam.
On September 25 2014 09:46 GlowingBear wrote: Asking about holyflare's case to everyone is my way to get people talking and getting reads from them.
On September 25 2014 11:11 GlowingBear wrote: Why I think Haru is scum:
He doesn't want to talk much, not letting me getting reads:
On September 25 2014 11:11 GlowingBear wrote: Why not talking? He should be helping us with reads day1.
On September 25 2014 11:15 GlowingBear wrote: I'm done with the reads. I'm going to get ready for a party.
On September 25 2014 11:28 GlowingBear wrote: Because I want people talking about people so I can get reads.
On September 25 2014 13:09 GlowingBear wrote: Nothing is in the way of updating my reads the more people starts to talk.
On September 26 2014 00:33 GlowingBear wrote: Sorry, I'm guilty of getting people to talk to get my reads instead of immediately attacking both HF and hope.
On September 26 2014 00:33 GlowingBear wrote: I think that is good to register and to get reads.
On September 26 2014 00:49 GlowingBear wrote: Gut feelings VS actual reads. Actual reads won.
On September 26 2014 00:49 GlowingBear wrote: It could be totally wrong but at least I would get people talking more so I can have more reads
He's clearly thinking and investigating the posts, and trying to find the scum. Then he starts thinking that SkyDragon is scum:
On September 26 2014 08:18 batsnacks wrote: Also this post is really scummy:
On September 26 2014 01:07 SkyDragon wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:51 Hopeless1der wrote:Sky is new to TL but not to mafia. I'd like to hear his (her?) thoughts on why d1 claimers usually got lynched on SK.
"His" is correct. :p
d1 claimers got lynched depending on what they were saying.
- If they claimed to be Town with nothing to back it up, they were seen as suspicious and people would vote to lynch them if their play-style doesn't match. - Throwing out names on the first day was seen as suspicious. - Feigning ignorance of a particular role was suspicious unless he weren't very bright in the first place (As one guy did when he asked the Mod in the thread whether getting no pm means that you're a Villager - We straight away knew that he was trying it, lynched him and he turned out to be Mafia) - Changing votes repeatedly was seen as suspicious. - Normally active players who become quiet were seen as suspicious.
There's no one answer to fit all situations really. There were also power roles so someone may have been saying something considered "weird" because they were the Seer, Doctor, Vigi or some other good role (And the last thing you want to do is get them lynched). There would be some hesitation to vote to lynch anyone on Day 1 but sometimes something is said that just doesn't feel right to several people.
It's a long post filled with info that makes zero conclusions about anything. Perfect mafia post. If I'm not voting GB today I'm voting skydragon.
He continues to press on GlowingBear and SkyDragon. Both end up being town, but batsnacks is showing that he is capable and willing to attempt to find scum and provide logical accusations that other players are scum.
In conclusion, batsnacks seems very suspcious because he has not yet provided any real content, particularly at least one accusation of someone being mafia with an argument behind it. This resembles his play in his last game, where he was mafia, and contrasts with his play in previous games where he was town. What do you guys think?
First good job, overall this is a really good case and took a lot of effort it looks like to put together.
And for lolz I will say When has bats ever really shown logical critical thinking skills! ( I love you bats)
The big thing about bats is that he has taken great strides to change his play between games. The style and tone of his play and if you can remember him is his biggest mafia give away and lurkiness.
I do not think that you are necessarily wrong in what you are saying, we should be very suspicious of batsnacks and if he really stops doing things and is forgettable we lynch him immediately. But i'm not confident enough as it seems he is trying to push something when talking to people he does ask for reads from people.
On November 26 2014 11:50 Damdred wrote: Actually the way bats went after kush was really towny, Kush is the most lurky beligerent and breaking promises mafia person i've ever played with.
Town kush is just so different, which he is different here.
Explain this is great detail. How is policy lynching someone inherently townie? Are you even reading this game?
Your last question is inherently stupid oats, i'm not saying at all that policy lynching someone is towny infact it is null townies can use policy lynching and mafia can as well.
I don't see as much what Bats was doing as much as it was pressure voting to get kush to do things or lurk more as mafia. Bats is aware of Kush meta and tried tos ee what he could get, I think the way bats went about it was towny and soon as kush showed up to do things and did them bats stopped on him.
On November 26 2014 11:50 Damdred wrote: Actually the way bats went after kush was really towny, Kush is the most lurky beligerent and breaking promises mafia person i've ever played with.
Town kush is just so different, which he is different here.
Explain this is great detail. How is policy lynching someone inherently townie? Are you even reading this game?
Your last question is inherently stupid oats, i'm not saying at all that policy lynching someone is towny infact it is null townies can use policy lynching and mafia can as well.
I don't see as much what Bats was doing as much as it was pressure voting to get kush to do things or lurk more as mafia. Bats is aware of Kush meta and tried tos ee what he could get, I think the way bats went about it was towny and soon as kush showed up to do things and did them bats stopped on him.
How else do you go about a policy lynch?
you vote them and you explain your policy. THATS NOT TOWNIE. THATS NULL.
The problem is that bat's policy was absurdly specific and based on more revenge than anything else.
I just said that policy Is null in my post.
Kush has a specific meta, an easily faked one perhaps but still soon as kush did things bats went on to do other things. So yea I think what bats did was pressure more than policy but that's just imo
All you are doing is splitting hairs and nitpicking oats. To me its more of a pressure vote rather than policy but its the same thing. Bats did something good for the thread got kush to participate.
SL I ask questions to others as well just some dodged me
On November 25 2014 02:10 sicklucker wrote: Im a horrible day 1 player might just coast.
So I set this up pre game to get info. Breske had a really weird reaction. The breske I know does note vote someone five minutes into the first day.
"they called me out better push the blame on Breske"
Basically he starts out the game instead of inquiring what SL means and what information he has gathered about the Breske, he immediately colors i as scum and infers something that just isn't true at this point. Hes not gathering information and throwing crap on people.
On November 25 2014 09:28 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 25 2014 09:08 Damdred wrote: SL tell me what you think of Half the Sky.
And since you are so good at reading breske give me a preliminary read (especially since you are fond of fast reads)
Like hes the only person in the game ive given a read on yet. Why do you keep asking
Because your read is half ass'd and at one point you say that he defends you when he never does and in almost his very next post he says "Oh nvm i'll vote him and keep my eye on him" basically.
Thats bullshit Everypost I made in this entire thread was about those two players. Its like your posting to make yourself look good while adding nothing.
i kinda agree with this.
Cool you agree with SL about my line of questioning thats actually OK at this point until,
On November 25 2014 09:33 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: sicklucker: why are all your posts about your actions revolving around your town meta? it's easy for mafia to act like their town persona and FOS people who aren't mafia.
On November 25 2014 09:34 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: and damdred dont you think you might just be finding reasons to find sick funny at this point?
He seems to be siding with SL at first against my barrage of questions hat i'm throwing at SL in pressure, but instead of pressuring me and my motives he shifts his pressure back to SL and finally back to me without actually inquiring about my read of SL is. He stays in the middle and never commits to the read and he never follows up his quesion in fact he dodges the questions posed to him at this point
On November 25 2014 09:34 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: and damdred dont you think you might just be finding reasons to find sick funny at this point?
Not really, i'm trying to figure out exactly why hes doing what hes doing hes answered me to the fullest of his abilities thres nothin else to gain from the conversation.
What are you doing though? You agree with Sick when he says its looking lik ei'm trying to do stuff just to do it but then you try to pressure him then switch to me. Looks like you are trying to do the same thing I was accused of
He never revisits this point and never follows up any of his questions early on just leaves them fluttering in the air, it looks like he is doing things but not really doing things at all.
On November 26 2014 07:05 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: i'm dropping in to say i won't be able to catch up today i have a shit ton of work to do. i'lll be in tonight hopefullys
Makes excuses and his reads are laregly unsubstantiated
On November 26 2014 12:32 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: Before I read more does anyone who's played with trfle know if he always posts insanely long posts? So far reading in im looking at him for something he said in page 13 where he directly contradicts himself that I can't quote but I have much to read
Easy to back out of read with oh i jus made a mistake, and he can't quote but he wants to say that he just thinks its bad basically.
On November 26 2014 12:48 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: My mistake. It was page 10 when you first called HTS town but a couple posts later put him up as your scumread. SL wrant from null to scum as well. Though reading through bats filter I can see that of everyone he's made and effort to not post reads or reasoning for votes so for today my vote stand on him ## vote bats
Doesn't read the thread but has time to directly read bats filter? What is this? He scumreads Sl, he doesn't even call bats scum he just votes him? 10 minutes ago hes barely read any of the thread and hes had time to filter dive someone call someone else scum but doesn't vote the scummy person? Wha?
On November 26 2014 12:51 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: Concerning the rest, I have confusion on HTS, The whole game agrees he's town but he's had an oddly low post count for that, what gives? I'm still suspicious of trfel for the aforementioned post, I'll look into this but for now I say tentative null. Everyone else I really have no reads on except I can say damdred looks Towny , wish I had a meta to go off of
pretty wishy washy post
On November 26 2014 21:33 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 26 2014 20:51 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 26 2014 20:19 Breshke wrote: Yeah man deadlines are rough for us. I will probably be around if you find anything you want to talk about.
I think you are being paranoid about damdred but it could be a world just not one i think we should consider today.
What do you think of bats taking his vote off of Oats to vote dicksmash?
He didn't even bother to explain why. HES STILL NOT GIVING READS.
What's your reads other than bats?
Honestly mostly town. Not sure how I feel about SLnhis posts feel slippery but that's not alignment indicative. Kush reads town honestly I don't see why everyone says otherwise. Not sure why everyone's written HTS off he's onlyngot a one page filter so that's still up in the air bag t I read him town
Goes back on his SL is scum read to just say he feels slippery at this point which is odd
On November 27 2014 03:14 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 27 2014 01:50 batsnacks wrote: ##unvote ##vote Trfel
Look, I changed my vote again. It's really easy.
here's every vote post he's made, no explanation of thought process in any of them except "oats isnt like this as scum". so tell me bats why vote me if oats is playing scummy?
also, spoiler alert, bats isnt going to switch his vote back to me so when i flip town he can conveniently forget he hopped on the wagon on me and start pointing fingers at my voters.
Then theres this post, not sure what you are doing here but trying to say voting lots is scummy?
Overall I think dicksmash is scum. His reads are pretty flimsy and easy to back out of, he has little to no follow up with the questions he asked and dodged several peoples questions. He has only became active now since he is up for lynch today, he throws dirt on people to see what can stick and his scum read on SL went into the ether and he voted on someone he never called scum till later instead of his scum read at that second.
On November 26 2014 08:02 Trfel wrote: I'm becoming highly suspicious of batsnacks.
Looking at batsnacks' posts this game, it does seem like he hasn't contributed many reads or constructive comments at all. He has pressure voted kushm4sta, and tried to convince other people to vote for kushm4sta, as shown:
On November 25 2014 10:27 batsnacks wrote: I think you should all start voting kush since that's the most logical vote right now.
Then Oatsmaster starts hinting that he might be mafia, and he responds as follows:
On November 25 2014 12:25 batsnacks wrote:
On November 25 2014 12:18 Oatsmaster wrote: He has bad posts regarding a read ohf HTS, his policy lynch on kush is really bad and he is using that to avoid playing the game and doing actual useful things.
This isn't a read. None of oats' posts contain reads.
oats is play is like 80% asking questions that have already been answered and 20% badgering the host about issues he could fix himself.
If my plynch on kush is bad give me something better.
I've seen oats play a lot better than he is doing right now.
He just starts attacking Oatsmaster, without actually providing any argument against the accsusations.
It's been nearly 24 hours and I cannot find any critical thinking or logical reads from batsnacks. He has been only minimally probing for information, as well.
Now, examining batsnacks' mafia history, it seems to show similar, non-accusatory play as mafia, but an ability to logically provide arguments against people as town.
In Fantasy Football Mafia Mini 2, his most recent mafia game, batsnacks was a mafia vanilla. His posts generally seem to lack content, for example this:
I only had to swap 2 letters, the A and the I. You have to swap 3, the N, O, and W. Plus you have an extra letter that doesn't even belong there.
Looks like I'm right about you. You're clearly reaching here.
batsnacks did give some analysis in saying that robik seemed to be town in that game, which ended up being correct. But he failed to provide specifics or any real evidence of this:
On October 24 2014 06:50 batsnacks wrote: I think robik looks pretty solid. I like how he's posting; he's focused, not all caps, consolidated, no personal dramas, that stuff is what reminds me of hard to get along with robik. @DrParnassus what about robik this game seem hard to cooperate with? Could you quote an example? You did say -everything about the way he's playing- reminds you of that.
He also defends Liam from an accusation. Up to now, the only two real things he's said are claiming these two people to be town. At this point he is accused of being mafia, and this is his defense:
On October 24 2014 21:41 batsnacks wrote: I think I'm not a good lynch right now. For obvious reasons.
He continues to not provide any true defense or explanation for his actions, and ends up being lynched on the first day.
On October 06 2014 23:26 batsnacks wrote: Oats if you are in fact "contributing" shouldn't you be thanking me? I did enable these "contributions" of yours. I feel like you're annoyed with me for allowing you to contribute.
Or are you annoyed with being in the spotlight this early?
You dont get to claim credit for something that happened accidentally.
What are your reads, mainly holyflare and me?
I agreed with HF a lot last game and he was town. I'm agreeing with him this game already so, tentatively town.
I'm voting you because I think you're scummy.
Also lol at "accidentally"
You claimed on accident now?
batsnacks accuses Oatsmaster of being mafia in this game (which ends up being incorrect). But when he defends someone as being town, he provides some support for this claim, and also shares his views a bit.
On October 07 2014 08:07 batsnacks wrote: Wait a minute, something isn't right. I quoted all of the following from the same post.
On October 07 2014 02:35 Blazinghand wrote: ...there's roughly speaking 13 players, right? If 3 are scum, then that gives us a solid 22% chance of lynching scum purely based on RNG.
No townie in this game knows the ratio of town to mafia, so it is correct here that BH gives us an example ratio of 10/3 or 22% as an example.
But then later in that post he says this:
On October 07 2014 02:35 Blazinghand wrote: ...the fact of the matter is, I'm offering a straight-up 22% chance to lynch someone.
BH how do you KNOW there are exactly 3 mafia? I bolded fact because that's a serious word to throw around when you're supposedly working with estimates.
Here's a critical analysis of a post in that game. It doesn't result in anything, but this post has more logic and scum-searching than his play to this point in the current game, as well as his play in the first game I mentioned, where he was mafia.
On October 08 2014 02:24 batsnacks wrote:
On October 08 2014 02:22 Hopeless1der wrote: You had one job batsnacks. + Show Spoiler +
and then HF gave you another one.
Does it make you nervous that I've already figured out you're mafia?
Then he claims Hopeless1der to be mafia, which ends up being correct. I don't see any reasoning listed, though. This post also came after the first 24 hours of the game, unlike all of the other posts quoted here.
I did notice this inconsistency between his post in this game:
On November 25 2014 10:58 batsnacks wrote:There is no such thing as scum slips, so no, dude didn't scum slip.
and this:
On October 07 2014 08:29 batsnacks wrote:
On October 07 2014 08:19 Grackaroni wrote: You're implying that at the start of the post BH was careful not to slip that he had knowledge of the setup. (by pointing out that the number of scum is unknown) and then *slipped* that he was 100% sure there were 3 mafia within like 10 seconds of typing which is really unrealistic.
What I see is BH working off the assumption that random lynch provides at least 22% chance of hitting mafia compared to day 1 analysis which varies (and BH thinks is worse for catching mafia)
I think it's feasible that he slipped.
besides
The TL mafia database disagrees that random lynch is better. So by random lynching we 1) have worse odds of lynching mafia and 2) players who agree with the random lynch have zero accountability for their votes.
Why the change? Probably just a change in his playstyle, but another explanation is that he is searching for mafia in that game, and has less incentive to do so in this game.
Looking at batsnacks' play in the game preceding the above game, 2p2 Vanilla Werewolf 13er, batsnacks immediately comes up with a comprehensive look at GlowingBear:
On September 26 2014 08:14 batsnacks wrote: I'm not completely caught up yet but I still think GB is mafiawolf.
On September 25 2014 11:02 GlowingBear wrote: I think Storr is mafia because of this:
This post stinks:
On September 25 2014 09:20 StorrZerg wrote: (1) i'd lynch fecal for the donkey entrance to the game.
the overly troll attitude fecal has with the caps locks, and insta vote on holy is really throwing off scum vibes. Deff would lynch.
On September 25 2014 08:34 Fecalfeast wrote: The fact that nobody was using the voting thread made me think they were joke votes. That's why I didn't use the thread anyway.
Lol I actually like your case holyflare
"yeah right"
Also i don't like the GB entrance to the game
On September 25 2014 08:41 GlowingBear wrote: Oh THANK GOD I'm town again! I hate rolling scum.
Ok, Haru, tell me what you think of holyflower by now
(2)unless im missing a game he just played, last game he was scum. seems odd to lead with a lie.
(1) very has reason to call someone definetely scum. I did that no geript last game. There is nothing alignment indicative in fecal's entrance and that makes storr look bad.
(2) storr was scum with me and I clearly stated on the qt that I wanted to be town. I was mafia for 3 games and I wish I was town on this, which I am. I never lied.
The way he is disliking entrances looks like he is trying to pretend to be an aggressive town.
Also, he gives Haru free town pass for his entrance and also obiwan. None has alignment indicative posts.
On September 25 2014 10:11 StorrZerg wrote: obi probably town too.
I'm on a phone and I'm too lazy to search for the town pass on Haru now.
storr is my strongest scum read the moment
Here's his case on storr. He says storr is pretending to be aggressive town by disliking entrances. That is a weird thing to say. How can GB tell the difference between someone who is pretending to be aggressive town and someone who actually is aggressive town based on so few posts? Imo he can't and is just making stuff up.
He also scum reads storr for saying someone is "definitely" mafia and says he said the exact same thing as scum last game. Well, look at this:
On September 25 2014 11:32 GlowingBear wrote: Naaaah. I'm positive storr is scum. ##Vote: Storr
He did it again this game.
I also think this post is scummy:
On September 25 2014 13:09 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:51 Hopeless1der wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:42 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:28 Hopeless1der wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:22 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:19 Hopeless1der wrote: not much time tonight, but right now severely dislike glowingbear. Very shallow reads imo. HF's case wasnt terrible, it was misplaced. If haru couldnt prove he was actually sad about rolling blue I'd be voting for him right now. Since the case has obviously failed, why would HF stay with it? Thats ridiculous.
Then there's his scumlist...what the hell is that about. players have literally not even posted yet, but GB has solved the game? I dont buy that in the slightest.
I'll probably be gone until this time tomorrow but should be generally more active when I'm around during my evenings. (Just started a new job, dont want to play at work)
Because that's his scum read and if the case didn't go through he should be asking more questions to Haru to get more information?
Lol...
HF's case on Haru was literally based on one post that was demonstrably false using out-of-thread but public information. Again, why try to stick with such a case? Refusing to "overlook" (which is a strange way to phrase it btw) his case would be way more suspicious than dropping it like he already has. The fact that this seems suspicious to you makes YOU look suspicious to me.
Because it's easy, as scum, to pick on a tiny problem to bus a partner then drop the read.
That is so incredibly shallow. Unless I have found surefire scum tomorrow, I'm voting you just based off this interaction.
btw, fecalfeast is behaving pretty similar to last game imo. No reason to hate on him just yet. Palmar seems to have gotten upset that no one uses the voting thread to follow his policy and has taken up a silent protest. Sky is new to TL but not to mafia. I'd like to hear his (her?) thoughts on why d1 claimers usually got lynched on SK. I'm gone for now, see you all later.
It can be shallow, but at least I'm the only one trying to get people talking. Nothing is in the way of updating my reads the more people starts to talk. If you lynch me, you'll be lynching a townie for stupid reasons and you'll soon lose the game as much as you lost our last one
The "at least" in that sentence is really scummy to me. It's a tone thing. It's like he's really saying "I'm mafia but at least I'm the only one trying to get people talking." It's also scummy how he says he's the -only- person getting people talking. GB made a case against HF earlier for dropping his case against HaruRH. I'm not a mind reader but I think HF made that case to get people talking. So GB is scum reading HF for trying to get people talking -- while saying he, GB, is the only contributor in the thread.
I also think this post is scummy:
On September 25 2014 10:18 GlowingBear wrote: Ok
Glowningbear's first scum team guess: Haru, HF, Storr
Gonna have dinner and give reasons
GB is referring to himself in the third person here in order to distance himself from his reads that he doesn't actually believe in. How can he be confident he's caught the whole scum team and solved the game? Later when he's drunk he posts this:
On September 25 2014 17:48 GlowingBear wrote: My dribk senses says JAT is possibly mafia
So now GB has found 4 mafia... HF is mafia for getting people talking with an early case, Haru is mafia for unflipped assosiations, storr is mafia because GB can tell somehow that storr is just pretending to be aggressive town, and JAT is mafia because ??? Speaking of reads, GB is frantic this game about "getting reads." He is addicted to reads and needs an intervention. He wants to convince us so badly that he is trying to get reads that he can not stop saying it:
On September 25 2014 08:46 GlowingBear wrote: It won't help me getting reads if you use day1 just to charge your solar beam.
On September 25 2014 09:46 GlowingBear wrote: Asking about holyflare's case to everyone is my way to get people talking and getting reads from them.
On September 25 2014 11:11 GlowingBear wrote: Why I think Haru is scum:
He doesn't want to talk much, not letting me getting reads:
On September 25 2014 11:11 GlowingBear wrote: Why not talking? He should be helping us with reads day1.
On September 25 2014 11:15 GlowingBear wrote: I'm done with the reads. I'm going to get ready for a party.
On September 25 2014 11:28 GlowingBear wrote: Because I want people talking about people so I can get reads.
On September 25 2014 13:09 GlowingBear wrote: Nothing is in the way of updating my reads the more people starts to talk.
On September 26 2014 00:33 GlowingBear wrote: Sorry, I'm guilty of getting people to talk to get my reads instead of immediately attacking both HF and hope.
On September 26 2014 00:33 GlowingBear wrote: I think that is good to register and to get reads.
On September 26 2014 00:49 GlowingBear wrote: Gut feelings VS actual reads. Actual reads won.
On September 26 2014 00:49 GlowingBear wrote: It could be totally wrong but at least I would get people talking more so I can have more reads
He's clearly thinking and investigating the posts, and trying to find the scum. Then he starts thinking that SkyDragon is scum:
On September 26 2014 08:18 batsnacks wrote: Also this post is really scummy:
On September 26 2014 01:07 SkyDragon wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:51 Hopeless1der wrote:Sky is new to TL but not to mafia. I'd like to hear his (her?) thoughts on why d1 claimers usually got lynched on SK.
"His" is correct. :p
d1 claimers got lynched depending on what they were saying.
- If they claimed to be Town with nothing to back it up, they were seen as suspicious and people would vote to lynch them if their play-style doesn't match. - Throwing out names on the first day was seen as suspicious. - Feigning ignorance of a particular role was suspicious unless he weren't very bright in the first place (As one guy did when he asked the Mod in the thread whether getting no pm means that you're a Villager - We straight away knew that he was trying it, lynched him and he turned out to be Mafia) - Changing votes repeatedly was seen as suspicious. - Normally active players who become quiet were seen as suspicious.
There's no one answer to fit all situations really. There were also power roles so someone may have been saying something considered "weird" because they were the Seer, Doctor, Vigi or some other good role (And the last thing you want to do is get them lynched). There would be some hesitation to vote to lynch anyone on Day 1 but sometimes something is said that just doesn't feel right to several people.
It's a long post filled with info that makes zero conclusions about anything. Perfect mafia post. If I'm not voting GB today I'm voting skydragon.
He continues to press on GlowingBear and SkyDragon. Both end up being town, but batsnacks is showing that he is capable and willing to attempt to find scum and provide logical accusations that other players are scum.
In conclusion, batsnacks seems very suspcious because he has not yet provided any real content, particularly at least one accusation of someone being mafia with an argument behind it. This resembles his play in his last game, where he was mafia, and contrasts with his play in previous games where he was town. What do you guys think?
First good job, overall this is a really good case and took a lot of effort it looks like to put together.
And for lolz I will say When has bats ever really shown logical critical thinking skills! ( I love you bats)
The big thing about bats is that he has taken great strides to change his play between games. The style and tone of his play and if you can remember him is his biggest mafia give away and lurkiness.
I do not think that you are necessarily wrong in what you are saying, we should be very suspicious of batsnacks and if he really stops doing things and is forgettable we lynch him immediately. But i'm not confident enough as it seems he is trying to push something when talking to people he does ask for reads from people.
You are now town to me.
Damdred first says this is a good case against batsnacks, and then says that he isn't confident enough, but is very suspicious of batsnacks. Then votes for Dicksmash, with the only explanation being Dicksmash bothers him. And I don't think he mentioned Dicksmash at all until literally one minute before this vote. As I type this up, I noticed that Damdred just added a post of reasoning against Dicksmash. Which is great and all, but I would have liked to see this earlier, or at least some hints that you were getting suspicious of Dicksmash. Ironically, this is exactly the same thing you just accused Dicksmash of.
On November 26 2014 10:18 batsnacks wrote: There's people arguing about whether someone's excuses are legit or not...
Meanwhile Trfel has contributed a massive case, he's followed up and voted, and no one has commented on any of it.
If you're town get your priorities straight. If you're mafia keep talking about IRL excuses and timezones.
Even batsnacks is saying that my case has some validity. If it didn't, he would have torn it apart by now. I haven't seen anyone provide strong arguments against the case on batsnacks yet, other than it is suspicious but not quite strong enough to vote (which I disagree with, but is understandable I suppose). Meanwhile, excluding the most recent Damdred post on Dicksmash, the case feels a bit thin to me.
Meta cases are weird in the fact that they look Amazing, and really shows effort put in by the person who did it but doesn't take into account changing game play and the way the person is choosing to play the game you are in currently. If you compare Bats earlier games Mission Mafia, Storm, Neat and Tidy, Cell, Titanic. You will see A HUGE disparity in the way he plays. I am always suspicious of batsnacks though because we have such a good history together and I think his scum game and his town game can be similar depending on the amount of time he puts in. Thats just the thing about Meta cases though they can be wrong and can be right
This second point isn't right at all, I even quoted myself when I questioned Dicksmash and he never answered me at all. I never said who my scum leans were and Bresh was the only person to inquire which I just now got around to answering part of hat question and of course I can't go extremely in depth like I want on my phone thats just silly reasoning there.
On November 27 2014 04:50 sicklucker wrote: Rsoutn make sure to change your vote if your push has no traction near the deadline I will do the same. I will policy lynch people who cast useless votes thats a mafia trait if Ive ever seen one.
I am not afraid of you continuing to vote for me, SL, for this reason or any other reason that you can come up with. I am not going to be glued to the computer today. Celebrating the holidays with the fam. If I do get on and see the votes leaning a way that I don't think will benefit town, of course I will change my vote to lynch someone I believe is more likely scum...otherwise it doesn't even matter, now does it?
Don't make me add you to my dropkick pile with bats.
Read my case rsoultin and comment on it.
Overall I disagree with SL just becuase you have your vote elsewhere doesn't make it antitown you could be pushing your lynch at the time or trying to do shenanigans or what not, but yea
On November 25 2014 09:43 Damdred wrote: Show nested quote +
Not really, i'm trying to figure out exactly why hes doing what hes doing hes answered me to the fullest of his abilities thres nothin else to gain from the conversation.
What are you doing though? You agree with Sick when he says its looking lik ei'm trying to do stuff just to do it but then you try to pressure him then switch to me. Looks like you are trying to do the same thing I was accused of
This one irght in my case and when you tried to pressure myself and SL
On November 27 2014 05:26 sicklucker wrote: Another thing if damdreds hard defending bats here. Its way too easy for us to get two mafia after this. I dont think thats whats happening.
On November 27 2014 05:32 rsoultin wrote: Okay, here's a question to Damdred and anyone else who cares to weigh in.
Isn't there a mod-kill policy for people who don't vote? So why are we pushing anyone who still hasn't voted?
Read and post on my case
It just depends on replacements and what not, BH could modkill everyone not voting or putting forth effort or could replace them. IMO they could show up last minut and vote as well.
What in the world, why are you goin to let yourself get lynched like that without even claiming to save town, like WTF is that shit you don't even fucking defend yourself oh my god.
On November 27 2014 07:16 rsoultin wrote: Eh, yeah. You'd think town with a role would kick up more of a fuss if he was being bussed. Oh well. Apologies LS...apparently with this group the potential of hitting power roles is way higher than you'd think.
What do you mean? (first bolded part)
Actually mafia lynch % day 1 is like in the 30% range I believe which is really good
On November 27 2014 07:21 sicklucker wrote: So If breskes mafia he has perfect information. He comes on late and knows a towns about to get lynched. Damdred gives a really good case and he even agrees but his vote ends up on bats. A mafia knows its a town getting lynched and wont put on a pointless vote because it makes him look bad. That is all its not gonna bury him but it is something.
In before wiymfo. Who cares hes not an advanced player I would do the same thing. (infact i did the opposite)
I was looking for his post where he did this, and this is a great point you beat me to it haha
On November 27 2014 07:24 Trfel wrote: Ok guys, see what I told you?
I presented a strong case against batsnacks and continually supported it. I expressed doubt over the Dicksmash McIroncock lynch. Yes, he hadn't been playing well, but that doesn't make him mafia. From here, can we PLEASE continue by lynching targets who seem to definitely be mafia, aka batsnacks?
WE were lynching someone who seemed to be mafia, he ha plenty of scummy things going for him...
On November 27 2014 07:48 Half the Sky wrote: Well let's look at the arguments used to defend bats - Day 1 reads being unreliable to awful (justifying his bad reads on people) and DSMI's gameplay being poor, the latter upon which we generally agree.
Damdred if I recall used a meta argument against DSMI.
Uh this is wrong.... do you know what a meta read is?
On November 27 2014 07:42 Half the Sky wrote: That is frustrating, his voting also made no sense. We had no way of figuring he was the doctor, and I was convinced enough by kush. Now I'm having a really bad feeling about this. Who else seemed driven to vote DSMI?
Oats and Damndred. Sorry the late reply for the night post but my fears had happened :|. rsoultin your apology is accepted. My reads had now changed because of this lynching. My scum team are the ones who pushed for DSMI Kush Oatsmaster Damndred. If we got a cop check one of those 3 out. If we got a Tracker go on to anyone since we got possible setups with a doctor revealed and we got no idea which setup is being used except for either Set up A or Set up C :|
What? Oats was on bats what are you on about? Are you reading? Why are the main pushes of DSMI (who didn't even fight his lynch btw) scum?
On November 27 2014 08:03 sicklucker wrote: Your reads are not completely horrible ls, but theirs no way their all right mafia is not so obvious to vote with each other on day 1. So when you say the scum team is the people who voted him out your just wrong. Some towns lead the charge. Some mafia might have joined in. I think its a bit likely one of kush or dand are mafia. Little chance they both are
This is wifom basically, sometimes mafia do vote and use this exxcuse later
Hold up a second here, if you were so sure that Bats is scum and I was wrong. Why did you say "OH HOLY CRAP DAMDRED HAS CONVINCED ME". And now blame me, you could of pushed bats and told dick to get on bats and it would of been 5 5 and you could of pushed bats off a cliff if you really wanted to, so why blame me now and throw dirt on me on a case that YOU said was good.
I'm confused dwhat your talking about in that post i was referring to the meta case on bats which is a meta case while the case i put forward was a case on in game actions.
On November 27 2014 08:44 Breshke wrote: Damdred can i ask for your thoughts on my EoD actions. I only ask this because you seemed to agree with SL in the begining that it was scummy but havnt said anything since.
SL is correct in that its weird that you would agree with one case and then vote in a totally opposite direction. However it is not scummy in of itself
On November 27 2014 06:24 Breshke wrote: I don't know on one hand I like damdreds case on dicksmash it makes sense. But on the other I don't like how easily this bandwagon formed although if i agree with damdreds case then i guess it isn't that weird because then other people obviously would as well.
SL i think its strange that when the vote had 5 people in it you didn't seem to think at least one was mafia and that you are already finding reasons to throw scum on people not for their play but for pre flip reasons on dicksmash. I still don't like SL's early trap as it achieved nothing and he didnt seem to make it try and achieve anything. I also dislike bats, yeah you can change votes as much as you want it isn't a big deal but I don't feel like the reasons you changed votes are justified. I also don't liek that you are wasting your vote to basically prove a point.
##Vote: Batsnacks
The bolded part makes me a little nervous, Hey guys this guy is wasteing his vote which I don't like so i'm going to waste my vote on Bats.
Then you really don't push bats for the rest of the day even though you are here and you could of possibly got people on Batsnacks instead of dick. So no you voting away from a case that you agree with is not scummy, some of your other acions are questionable
Slam just sheeped to sheep its possible it comes from a mafia standpoint but could come from a town point as well. He didn't over explain his vote though
On November 27 2014 08:44 Breshke wrote: Damdred can i ask for your thoughts on my EoD actions. I only ask this because you seemed to agree with SL in the begining that it was scummy but havnt said anything since.
SL is correct in that its weird that you would agree with one case and then vote in a totally opposite direction. However it is not scummy in of itself
On November 27 2014 06:24 Breshke wrote: I don't know on one hand I like damdreds case on dicksmash it makes sense. But on the other I don't like how easily this bandwagon formed although if i agree with damdreds case then i guess it isn't that weird because then other people obviously would as well.
SL i think its strange that when the vote had 5 people in it you didn't seem to think at least one was mafia and that you are already finding reasons to throw scum on people not for their play but for pre flip reasons on dicksmash. I still don't like SL's early trap as it achieved nothing and he didnt seem to make it try and achieve anything. I also dislike bats, yeah you can change votes as much as you want it isn't a big deal but I don't feel like the reasons you changed votes are justified. I also don't liek that you are wasting your vote to basically prove a point.
##Vote: Batsnacks
The bolded part makes me a little nervous, Hey guys this guy is wasteing his vote which I don't like so i'm going to waste my vote on Bats.
Then you really don't push bats for the rest of the day even though you are here and you could of possibly got people on Batsnacks instead of dick. So no you voting away from a case that you agree with is not scummy, some of your other acions are questionable
Yeah i ddin't try and force the vote to go onto bats because yes i did agree with your case i just didnt like how easily the wagon froemd as i said because there was little to no resistance to it and there was hardly even a counter wagon which i thought might mean that Dick was town. I wasn't going to push this thought though because his partners might have just been leaving him out to dry.
Are you telling me you like bats? I didn't like bats and I didn't like Dicksmash, I voted for bats because i liked him less .
What else have i done that is questionable?
Why though? Why wouldn't you want to force what you are feeling or thinking through everyone's thick skulls? EoD is the best time for shenanigans and other things. You say you didn't like Bat and you liked him less than you did dick but you had 0 follow through and that really disturbs me.
I don't like bats nor do I dislike him, hes just bats if I can't remember what hes done at the end of d2 I probably will vote him unless something better comes a long.
All of these associative reads between me and bat are stupid and dumpster worthy.
I didn't think bats was the lynch I pushed who I thought, not sure what else there is. I've never been scumread so much for stupider reasons so far this game, oats has a reasonable reason I think.
On November 27 2014 09:55 Breshke wrote: Because I wasn't going to take the vote off of dicksmash. Yes i thought he could have been town but you had a good case and he hardly even tried after that. Yeah he was the doctor but he didn't even try to defend himself I was happy with that lynch going though but i would have been happier with a bats lynch. Bats has been more involved though so im not going to try and force the lynch onto someone that will give stuff lateer in the day over someone who wasnt even trying.
Why did you specifically say i had other questionable actions yet you cant pinpoint anything else?
I didn't want you to think i was dodging you so I figured i should answer you now.
Your lead up to your vote, vote and then actions around deadline were questionable to someone who thought that they were on the higher percentage lynch candidate.
Besides that you seemed ok today, you didn't go hard at me for no answering you on your read questions though when you probably should of pressured the hell out of me at that point.
Well I was trying to let things develop and some of the scum reads made me laugh pretty hard tbh damdred asked 16-17 questions he's so obvious scum. But the thread was kind of stagnant with no cases so I figured I should push the scummiest person.
On November 27 2014 17:43 Trfel wrote: So I still think that batsnacks is mafia for the reasons I (and several others) have mentioned many times.
I'm also pretty suspicious of Damdred being mafia. Not because he led the mislynch on Dicksmash McIroncock, that doesn't say anything in and of itself. It's the way he did it. I also am noticing several contradictions in his statements, and lots of opinion changes for seemingly little reason.
On November 26 2014 08:02 Trfel wrote: I'm becoming highly suspicious of batsnacks.
Looking at batsnacks' posts this game, it does seem like he hasn't contributed many reads or constructive comments at all. He has pressure voted kushm4sta, and tried to convince other people to vote for kushm4sta, as shown:
On November 25 2014 10:27 batsnacks wrote: I think you should all start voting kush since that's the most logical vote right now.
Then Oatsmaster starts hinting that he might be mafia, and he responds as follows:
On November 25 2014 12:25 batsnacks wrote:
On November 25 2014 12:18 Oatsmaster wrote: He has bad posts regarding a read ohf HTS, his policy lynch on kush is really bad and he is using that to avoid playing the game and doing actual useful things.
This isn't a read. None of oats' posts contain reads.
oats is play is like 80% asking questions that have already been answered and 20% badgering the host about issues he could fix himself.
If my plynch on kush is bad give me something better.
I've seen oats play a lot better than he is doing right now.
He just starts attacking Oatsmaster, without actually providing any argument against the accsusations.
It's been nearly 24 hours and I cannot find any critical thinking or logical reads from batsnacks. He has been only minimally probing for information, as well.
Now, examining batsnacks' mafia history, it seems to show similar, non-accusatory play as mafia, but an ability to logically provide arguments against people as town.
In Fantasy Football Mafia Mini 2, his most recent mafia game, batsnacks was a mafia vanilla. His posts generally seem to lack content, for example this:
I only had to swap 2 letters, the A and the I. You have to swap 3, the N, O, and W. Plus you have an extra letter that doesn't even belong there.
Looks like I'm right about you. You're clearly reaching here.
batsnacks did give some analysis in saying that robik seemed to be town in that game, which ended up being correct. But he failed to provide specifics or any real evidence of this:
On October 24 2014 06:50 batsnacks wrote: I think robik looks pretty solid. I like how he's posting; he's focused, not all caps, consolidated, no personal dramas, that stuff is what reminds me of hard to get along with robik. @DrParnassus what about robik this game seem hard to cooperate with? Could you quote an example? You did say -everything about the way he's playing- reminds you of that.
He also defends Liam from an accusation. Up to now, the only two real things he's said are claiming these two people to be town. At this point he is accused of being mafia, and this is his defense:
On October 24 2014 21:41 batsnacks wrote: I think I'm not a good lynch right now. For obvious reasons.
He continues to not provide any true defense or explanation for his actions, and ends up being lynched on the first day.
On October 06 2014 23:26 batsnacks wrote: Oats if you are in fact "contributing" shouldn't you be thanking me? I did enable these "contributions" of yours. I feel like you're annoyed with me for allowing you to contribute.
Or are you annoyed with being in the spotlight this early?
You dont get to claim credit for something that happened accidentally.
What are your reads, mainly holyflare and me?
I agreed with HF a lot last game and he was town. I'm agreeing with him this game already so, tentatively town.
I'm voting you because I think you're scummy.
Also lol at "accidentally"
You claimed on accident now?
batsnacks accuses Oatsmaster of being mafia in this game (which ends up being incorrect). But when he defends someone as being town, he provides some support for this claim, and also shares his views a bit.
On October 07 2014 08:07 batsnacks wrote: Wait a minute, something isn't right. I quoted all of the following from the same post.
On October 07 2014 02:35 Blazinghand wrote: ...there's roughly speaking 13 players, right? If 3 are scum, then that gives us a solid 22% chance of lynching scum purely based on RNG.
No townie in this game knows the ratio of town to mafia, so it is correct here that BH gives us an example ratio of 10/3 or 22% as an example.
But then later in that post he says this:
On October 07 2014 02:35 Blazinghand wrote: ...the fact of the matter is, I'm offering a straight-up 22% chance to lynch someone.
BH how do you KNOW there are exactly 3 mafia? I bolded fact because that's a serious word to throw around when you're supposedly working with estimates.
Here's a critical analysis of a post in that game. It doesn't result in anything, but this post has more logic and scum-searching than his play to this point in the current game, as well as his play in the first game I mentioned, where he was mafia.
On October 08 2014 02:24 batsnacks wrote:
On October 08 2014 02:22 Hopeless1der wrote: You had one job batsnacks. + Show Spoiler +
and then HF gave you another one.
Does it make you nervous that I've already figured out you're mafia?
Then he claims Hopeless1der to be mafia, which ends up being correct. I don't see any reasoning listed, though. This post also came after the first 24 hours of the game, unlike all of the other posts quoted here.
I did notice this inconsistency between his post in this game:
On November 25 2014 10:58 batsnacks wrote:There is no such thing as scum slips, so no, dude didn't scum slip.
and this:
On October 07 2014 08:29 batsnacks wrote:
On October 07 2014 08:19 Grackaroni wrote: You're implying that at the start of the post BH was careful not to slip that he had knowledge of the setup. (by pointing out that the number of scum is unknown) and then *slipped* that he was 100% sure there were 3 mafia within like 10 seconds of typing which is really unrealistic.
What I see is BH working off the assumption that random lynch provides at least 22% chance of hitting mafia compared to day 1 analysis which varies (and BH thinks is worse for catching mafia)
I think it's feasible that he slipped.
besides
The TL mafia database disagrees that random lynch is better. So by random lynching we 1) have worse odds of lynching mafia and 2) players who agree with the random lynch have zero accountability for their votes.
Why the change? Probably just a change in his playstyle, but another explanation is that he is searching for mafia in that game, and has less incentive to do so in this game.
Looking at batsnacks' play in the game preceding the above game, 2p2 Vanilla Werewolf 13er, batsnacks immediately comes up with a comprehensive look at GlowingBear:
On September 26 2014 08:14 batsnacks wrote: I'm not completely caught up yet but I still think GB is mafiawolf.
On September 25 2014 11:02 GlowingBear wrote: I think Storr is mafia because of this:
This post stinks:
On September 25 2014 09:20 StorrZerg wrote: (1) i'd lynch fecal for the donkey entrance to the game.
the overly troll attitude fecal has with the caps locks, and insta vote on holy is really throwing off scum vibes. Deff would lynch.
On September 25 2014 08:34 Fecalfeast wrote: The fact that nobody was using the voting thread made me think they were joke votes. That's why I didn't use the thread anyway.
Lol I actually like your case holyflare
"yeah right"
Also i don't like the GB entrance to the game
On September 25 2014 08:41 GlowingBear wrote: Oh THANK GOD I'm town again! I hate rolling scum.
Ok, Haru, tell me what you think of holyflower by now
(2)unless im missing a game he just played, last game he was scum. seems odd to lead with a lie.
(1) very has reason to call someone definetely scum. I did that no geript last game. There is nothing alignment indicative in fecal's entrance and that makes storr look bad.
(2) storr was scum with me and I clearly stated on the qt that I wanted to be town. I was mafia for 3 games and I wish I was town on this, which I am. I never lied.
The way he is disliking entrances looks like he is trying to pretend to be an aggressive town.
Also, he gives Haru free town pass for his entrance and also obiwan. None has alignment indicative posts.
On September 25 2014 10:11 StorrZerg wrote: obi probably town too.
I'm on a phone and I'm too lazy to search for the town pass on Haru now.
storr is my strongest scum read the moment
Here's his case on storr. He says storr is pretending to be aggressive town by disliking entrances. That is a weird thing to say. How can GB tell the difference between someone who is pretending to be aggressive town and someone who actually is aggressive town based on so few posts? Imo he can't and is just making stuff up.
He also scum reads storr for saying someone is "definitely" mafia and says he said the exact same thing as scum last game. Well, look at this:
On September 25 2014 11:32 GlowingBear wrote: Naaaah. I'm positive storr is scum. ##Vote: Storr
He did it again this game.
I also think this post is scummy:
On September 25 2014 13:09 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:51 Hopeless1der wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:42 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:28 Hopeless1der wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:22 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:19 Hopeless1der wrote: not much time tonight, but right now severely dislike glowingbear. Very shallow reads imo. HF's case wasnt terrible, it was misplaced. If haru couldnt prove he was actually sad about rolling blue I'd be voting for him right now. Since the case has obviously failed, why would HF stay with it? Thats ridiculous.
Then there's his scumlist...what the hell is that about. players have literally not even posted yet, but GB has solved the game? I dont buy that in the slightest.
I'll probably be gone until this time tomorrow but should be generally more active when I'm around during my evenings. (Just started a new job, dont want to play at work)
Because that's his scum read and if the case didn't go through he should be asking more questions to Haru to get more information?
Lol...
HF's case on Haru was literally based on one post that was demonstrably false using out-of-thread but public information. Again, why try to stick with such a case? Refusing to "overlook" (which is a strange way to phrase it btw) his case would be way more suspicious than dropping it like he already has. The fact that this seems suspicious to you makes YOU look suspicious to me.
Because it's easy, as scum, to pick on a tiny problem to bus a partner then drop the read.
That is so incredibly shallow. Unless I have found surefire scum tomorrow, I'm voting you just based off this interaction.
btw, fecalfeast is behaving pretty similar to last game imo. No reason to hate on him just yet. Palmar seems to have gotten upset that no one uses the voting thread to follow his policy and has taken up a silent protest. Sky is new to TL but not to mafia. I'd like to hear his (her?) thoughts on why d1 claimers usually got lynched on SK. I'm gone for now, see you all later.
It can be shallow, but at least I'm the only one trying to get people talking. Nothing is in the way of updating my reads the more people starts to talk. If you lynch me, you'll be lynching a townie for stupid reasons and you'll soon lose the game as much as you lost our last one
The "at least" in that sentence is really scummy to me. It's a tone thing. It's like he's really saying "I'm mafia but at least I'm the only one trying to get people talking." It's also scummy how he says he's the -only- person getting people talking. GB made a case against HF earlier for dropping his case against HaruRH. I'm not a mind reader but I think HF made that case to get people talking. So GB is scum reading HF for trying to get people talking -- while saying he, GB, is the only contributor in the thread.
I also think this post is scummy:
On September 25 2014 10:18 GlowingBear wrote: Ok
Glowningbear's first scum team guess: Haru, HF, Storr
Gonna have dinner and give reasons
GB is referring to himself in the third person here in order to distance himself from his reads that he doesn't actually believe in. How can he be confident he's caught the whole scum team and solved the game? Later when he's drunk he posts this:
On September 25 2014 17:48 GlowingBear wrote: My dribk senses says JAT is possibly mafia
So now GB has found 4 mafia... HF is mafia for getting people talking with an early case, Haru is mafia for unflipped assosiations, storr is mafia because GB can tell somehow that storr is just pretending to be aggressive town, and JAT is mafia because ??? Speaking of reads, GB is frantic this game about "getting reads." He is addicted to reads and needs an intervention. He wants to convince us so badly that he is trying to get reads that he can not stop saying it:
On September 25 2014 08:46 GlowingBear wrote: It won't help me getting reads if you use day1 just to charge your solar beam.
On September 25 2014 09:46 GlowingBear wrote: Asking about holyflare's case to everyone is my way to get people talking and getting reads from them.
On September 25 2014 11:11 GlowingBear wrote: Why I think Haru is scum:
He doesn't want to talk much, not letting me getting reads:
On September 25 2014 11:11 GlowingBear wrote: Why not talking? He should be helping us with reads day1.
On September 25 2014 11:15 GlowingBear wrote: I'm done with the reads. I'm going to get ready for a party.
On September 25 2014 11:28 GlowingBear wrote: Because I want people talking about people so I can get reads.
On September 25 2014 13:09 GlowingBear wrote: Nothing is in the way of updating my reads the more people starts to talk.
On September 26 2014 00:33 GlowingBear wrote: Sorry, I'm guilty of getting people to talk to get my reads instead of immediately attacking both HF and hope.
On September 26 2014 00:33 GlowingBear wrote: I think that is good to register and to get reads.
On September 26 2014 00:49 GlowingBear wrote: Gut feelings VS actual reads. Actual reads won.
On September 26 2014 00:49 GlowingBear wrote: It could be totally wrong but at least I would get people talking more so I can have more reads
He's clearly thinking and investigating the posts, and trying to find the scum. Then he starts thinking that SkyDragon is scum:
On September 26 2014 08:18 batsnacks wrote: Also this post is really scummy:
On September 26 2014 01:07 SkyDragon wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:51 Hopeless1der wrote:Sky is new to TL but not to mafia. I'd like to hear his (her?) thoughts on why d1 claimers usually got lynched on SK.
"His" is correct. :p
d1 claimers got lynched depending on what they were saying.
- If they claimed to be Town with nothing to back it up, they were seen as suspicious and people would vote to lynch them if their play-style doesn't match. - Throwing out names on the first day was seen as suspicious. - Feigning ignorance of a particular role was suspicious unless he weren't very bright in the first place (As one guy did when he asked the Mod in the thread whether getting no pm means that you're a Villager - We straight away knew that he was trying it, lynched him and he turned out to be Mafia) - Changing votes repeatedly was seen as suspicious. - Normally active players who become quiet were seen as suspicious.
There's no one answer to fit all situations really. There were also power roles so someone may have been saying something considered "weird" because they were the Seer, Doctor, Vigi or some other good role (And the last thing you want to do is get them lynched). There would be some hesitation to vote to lynch anyone on Day 1 but sometimes something is said that just doesn't feel right to several people.
It's a long post filled with info that makes zero conclusions about anything. Perfect mafia post. If I'm not voting GB today I'm voting skydragon.
He continues to press on GlowingBear and SkyDragon. Both end up being town, but batsnacks is showing that he is capable and willing to attempt to find scum and provide logical accusations that other players are scum.
In conclusion, batsnacks seems very suspcious because he has not yet provided any real content, particularly at least one accusation of someone being mafia with an argument behind it. This resembles his play in his last game, where he was mafia, and contrasts with his play in previous games where he was town. What do you guys think?
First good job, overall this is a really good case and took a lot of effort it looks like to put together.
And for lolz I will say When has bats ever really shown logical critical thinking skills! ( I love you bats)
The big thing about bats is that he has taken great strides to change his play between games. The style and tone of his play and if you can remember him is his biggest mafia give away and lurkiness.
I do not think that you are necessarily wrong in what you are saying, we should be very suspicious of batsnacks and if he really stops doing things and is forgettable we lynch him immediately. But i'm not confident enough as it seems he is trying to push something when talking to people he does ask for reads from people.
You are now town to me.
First, Damdred responds to my case on batsnacks by saying that it is overall a really good case and that we should be very suspicious of batsnacks. Then he says that the way batsnacks went about the policy vote on kushm4sta was really towny. Then a few posts later, he posts this:
On November 27 2014 01:35 Damdred wrote: Oats dicksmash both bother me right now I would vote dick i think
He has never mentioned Dicksmash at all before this point. In fact, at this point, only kushm4sta has presented anything against Dicksmash (and not very much, at that). But then he votes Dicksmash literally one minute after this post, with no reference at all to the "really good case" on batsnacks. I don't see how the fact that batsnacks policy voted kushm4sta could be this convincing.
On November 27 2014 04:48 Damdred wrote: Sure this is why i'm picking Dicksmash over everyone else today
On November 25 2014 07:57 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 25 2014 07:55 sicklucker wrote:
On November 25 2014 02:10 sicklucker wrote: Im a horrible day 1 player might just coast.
So I set this up pre game to get info. Breske had a really weird reaction. The breske I know does note vote someone five minutes into the first day.
"they called me out better push the blame on Breske"
Basically he starts out the game instead of inquiring what SL means and what information he has gathered about the Breske, he immediately colors i as scum and infers something that just isn't true at this point. Hes not gathering information and throwing crap on people.
On November 25 2014 09:28 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 25 2014 09:26 sicklucker wrote:
On November 25 2014 09:22 Damdred wrote:
On November 25 2014 09:20 sicklucker wrote:
On November 25 2014 09:08 Damdred wrote: SL tell me what you think of Half the Sky.
And since you are so good at reading breske give me a preliminary read (especially since you are fond of fast reads)
Like hes the only person in the game ive given a read on yet. Why do you keep asking
Because your read is half ass'd and at one point you say that he defends you when he never does and in almost his very next post he says "Oh nvm i'll vote him and keep my eye on him" basically.
Thats bullshit Everypost I made in this entire thread was about those two players. Its like your posting to make yourself look good while adding nothing.
i kinda agree with this.
Cool you agree with SL about my line of questioning thats actually OK at this point until,
On November 25 2014 09:33 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: sicklucker: why are all your posts about your actions revolving around your town meta? it's easy for mafia to act like their town persona and FOS people who aren't mafia.
On November 25 2014 09:34 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: and damdred dont you think you might just be finding reasons to find sick funny at this point?
He seems to be siding with SL at first against my barrage of questions hat i'm throwing at SL in pressure, but instead of pressuring me and my motives he shifts his pressure back to SL and finally back to me without actually inquiring about my read of SL is. He stays in the middle and never commits to the read and he never follows up his quesion in fact he dodges the questions posed to him at this point
On November 25 2014 09:43 Damdred wrote:
On November 25 2014 09:34 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: and damdred dont you think you might just be finding reasons to find sick funny at this point?
Not really, i'm trying to figure out exactly why hes doing what hes doing hes answered me to the fullest of his abilities thres nothin else to gain from the conversation.
What are you doing though? You agree with Sick when he says its looking lik ei'm trying to do stuff just to do it but then you try to pressure him then switch to me. Looks like you are trying to do the same thing I was accused of
He never revisits this point and never follows up any of his questions early on just leaves them fluttering in the air, it looks like he is doing things but not really doing things at all.
On November 26 2014 07:05 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: i'm dropping in to say i won't be able to catch up today i have a shit ton of work to do. i'lll be in tonight hopefullys
Makes excuses and his reads are laregly unsubstantiated
On November 26 2014 12:32 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: Before I read more does anyone who's played with trfle know if he always posts insanely long posts? So far reading in im looking at him for something he said in page 13 where he directly contradicts himself that I can't quote but I have much to read
Easy to back out of read with oh i jus made a mistake, and he can't quote but he wants to say that he just thinks its bad basically.
On November 26 2014 12:48 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: My mistake. It was page 10 when you first called HTS town but a couple posts later put him up as your scumread. SL wrant from null to scum as well. Though reading through bats filter I can see that of everyone he's made and effort to not post reads or reasoning for votes so for today my vote stand on him ## vote bats
Doesn't read the thread but has time to directly read bats filter? What is this? He scumreads Sl, he doesn't even call bats scum he just votes him? 10 minutes ago hes barely read any of the thread and hes had time to filter dive someone call someone else scum but doesn't vote the scummy person? Wha?
On November 26 2014 12:51 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: Concerning the rest, I have confusion on HTS, The whole game agrees he's town but he's had an oddly low post count for that, what gives? I'm still suspicious of trfel for the aforementioned post, I'll look into this but for now I say tentative null. Everyone else I really have no reads on except I can say damdred looks Towny , wish I had a meta to go off of
pretty wishy washy post
On November 26 2014 21:33 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 26 2014 21:14 Breshke wrote:
On November 26 2014 20:51 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 26 2014 20:19 Breshke wrote: Yeah man deadlines are rough for us. I will probably be around if you find anything you want to talk about.
I think you are being paranoid about damdred but it could be a world just not one i think we should consider today.
What do you think of bats taking his vote off of Oats to vote dicksmash?
He didn't even bother to explain why. HES STILL NOT GIVING READS.
What's your reads other than bats?
Honestly mostly town. Not sure how I feel about SLnhis posts feel slippery but that's not alignment indicative. Kush reads town honestly I don't see why everyone says otherwise. Not sure why everyone's written HTS off he's onlyngot a one page filter so that's still up in the air bag t I read him town
Goes back on his SL is scum read to just say he feels slippery at this point which is odd
On November 27 2014 03:14 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 25 2014 13:13 batsnacks wrote: ##unvote ##vote: Oatsmaster
step it up oats
On November 26 2014 12:57 batsnacks wrote: ##unvote ##vote: Dicksmash McIroncock
On November 27 2014 00:34 batsnacks wrote: SL vote isn't happening meat.
##unvote ##vote: Oatsmaster
I don't think oats plays like this as town. That's probably my final vote today.
On November 27 2014 01:39 batsnacks wrote: I'm sheeping kush because he's town and he's right
##unvote ##vote dicksmash
On November 27 2014 01:50 batsnacks wrote: ##unvote ##vote Trfel
Look, I changed my vote again. It's really easy.
here's every vote post he's made, no explanation of thought process in any of them except "oats isnt like this as scum". so tell me bats why vote me if oats is playing scummy?
also, spoiler alert, bats isnt going to switch his vote back to me so when i flip town he can conveniently forget he hopped on the wagon on me and start pointing fingers at my voters.
Then theres this post, not sure what you are doing here but trying to say voting lots is scummy?
Overall I think dicksmash is scum. His reads are pretty flimsy and easy to back out of, he has little to no follow up with the questions he asked and dodged several peoples questions. He has only became active now since he is up for lynch today, he throws dirt on people to see what can stick and his scum read on SL went into the ether and he voted on someone he never called scum till later instead of his scum read at that second.
This guy is pretty scummy
Then Damdred puts together a collection of evidence against Dicksmash. I'm really glad to see this, as it does show effort. But when I examined the quality of this case, I felt that it was a bit lacking, and he should have seen that when he put this together. If you guys can find such holes in either of my cases (against batsnacks and the current one against Damdred), or if you can show why I am wrong about these holes in the Dicksmash case, I will retract this point.
For the first quote, to me that feels like a fine sentence. He never said sicklucker was scum, never colored sicklucker as scum. He's just criticizing sicklucker's behavior. A lot of people have done that this game, and many have said that he is probably town in the very same post. Nothing out of the ordinary here. For the record, batsnacks gave an early townread to Dicksmash for the same post:
On November 26 2014 10:30 batsnacks wrote: I had an early townread on dicksmash because of this post:
On November 25 2014 07:57 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote:
On November 25 2014 07:55 sicklucker wrote:
On November 25 2014 02:10 sicklucker wrote: Im a horrible day 1 player might just coast.
So I set this up pre game to get info. Breske had a really weird reaction. The breske I know does note vote someone five minutes into the first day.
"they called me out better push the blame on Breske"
He was the first to point this out and several other people sheeped it.
Perhaps he doesn't like your questioning and he doesn't like sicklucker's answers? He's already criticized sicklucker's play, there is nothing new about this. I personally don't have a problem with Damdred questioning sicklucker, but it's not unreasonable to think you went a bit too far. Half the Sky stated this earlier.
I don't think it's expected to state what you learned based on the answers to every question asked. Yes, Dicksmash was giving far fewer reads than questions, but batsnacks, Oatsmaster, and even Damdred himself have done this.
Yes, he made a mistake by saying the wrong page number. Look at page 10 though, and he's right, my statements do seem rather contradictory. I already explained that earlier, that's not the point of this. The point is, he's not backing out of his read, he's sticking with it. If Damdred was reading carefully, he should have seen this.
Perhaps his scumread on bats was expedited because some other players had put the evidence together for him? And a filter read doesn't take all that long. There were 16 minutes in between the time where he said he hadn't read the entire thread and the time where he voted on batsnacks. He never said how far he was in the thread, but he had probably have read through at least page 13, since that was where he said I made the contradiction. At worst, he had read through page 10. And he voted for batsnacks on page 20. I think it's reasonable to read 7 pages and a filter in 16 minutes.
Also, Dicksmash never scumreads sicklucker. He criticized sicklucker's play earlier, but that's not a scum read (as I have previously discussed). I'm assuming Damdred says that Dicksmash read sicklucker as scum due to this post:
On November 26 2014 12:48 Dicksmash McIroncock wrote: My mistake. It was page 10 when you first called HTS town but a couple posts later put him up as your scumread. SL wrant from null to scum as well. Though reading through bats filter I can see that of everyone he's made and effort to not post reads or reasoning for votes so for today my vote stand on him ## vote bats
Which actually says that I changed my opinion on sicklucker from null to scum. He doesn't say a thing about his own opinion on sicklucker.
Again, I feel like Damdred would have seen this if he was being careful about what he was doing and if he was focused on providing an accurate read. The case looks pretty good, and I can see why it convinced a lot of people (including myself, for some time). But Damdred was digging up all of the quotes, he should have seen this.
On November 26 2014 08:02 Trfel wrote: I'm becoming highly suspicious of batsnacks.
Looking at batsnacks' posts this game, it does seem like he hasn't contributed many reads or constructive comments at all. He has pressure voted kushm4sta, and tried to convince other people to vote for kushm4sta, as shown:
On November 25 2014 10:27 batsnacks wrote: I think you should all start voting kush since that's the most logical vote right now.
Then Oatsmaster starts hinting that he might be mafia, and he responds as follows:
On November 25 2014 12:25 batsnacks wrote:
On November 25 2014 12:18 Oatsmaster wrote: He has bad posts regarding a read ohf HTS, his policy lynch on kush is really bad and he is using that to avoid playing the game and doing actual useful things.
This isn't a read. None of oats' posts contain reads.
oats is play is like 80% asking questions that have already been answered and 20% badgering the host about issues he could fix himself.
If my plynch on kush is bad give me something better.
I've seen oats play a lot better than he is doing right now.
He just starts attacking Oatsmaster, without actually providing any argument against the accsusations.
It's been nearly 24 hours and I cannot find any critical thinking or logical reads from batsnacks. He has been only minimally probing for information, as well.
Now, examining batsnacks' mafia history, it seems to show similar, non-accusatory play as mafia, but an ability to logically provide arguments against people as town.
In Fantasy Football Mafia Mini 2, his most recent mafia game, batsnacks was a mafia vanilla. His posts generally seem to lack content, for example this:
I only had to swap 2 letters, the A and the I. You have to swap 3, the N, O, and W. Plus you have an extra letter that doesn't even belong there.
Looks like I'm right about you. You're clearly reaching here.
batsnacks did give some analysis in saying that robik seemed to be town in that game, which ended up being correct. But he failed to provide specifics or any real evidence of this:
On October 24 2014 06:50 batsnacks wrote: I think robik looks pretty solid. I like how he's posting; he's focused, not all caps, consolidated, no personal dramas, that stuff is what reminds me of hard to get along with robik. @DrParnassus what about robik this game seem hard to cooperate with? Could you quote an example? You did say -everything about the way he's playing- reminds you of that.
He also defends Liam from an accusation. Up to now, the only two real things he's said are claiming these two people to be town. At this point he is accused of being mafia, and this is his defense:
On October 24 2014 21:41 batsnacks wrote: I think I'm not a good lynch right now. For obvious reasons.
He continues to not provide any true defense or explanation for his actions, and ends up being lynched on the first day.
On October 06 2014 23:26 batsnacks wrote: Oats if you are in fact "contributing" shouldn't you be thanking me? I did enable these "contributions" of yours. I feel like you're annoyed with me for allowing you to contribute.
Or are you annoyed with being in the spotlight this early?
You dont get to claim credit for something that happened accidentally.
What are your reads, mainly holyflare and me?
I agreed with HF a lot last game and he was town. I'm agreeing with him this game already so, tentatively town.
I'm voting you because I think you're scummy.
Also lol at "accidentally"
You claimed on accident now?
batsnacks accuses Oatsmaster of being mafia in this game (which ends up being incorrect). But when he defends someone as being town, he provides some support for this claim, and also shares his views a bit.
On October 07 2014 08:07 batsnacks wrote: Wait a minute, something isn't right. I quoted all of the following from the same post.
On October 07 2014 02:35 Blazinghand wrote: ...there's roughly speaking 13 players, right? If 3 are scum, then that gives us a solid 22% chance of lynching scum purely based on RNG.
No townie in this game knows the ratio of town to mafia, so it is correct here that BH gives us an example ratio of 10/3 or 22% as an example.
But then later in that post he says this:
On October 07 2014 02:35 Blazinghand wrote: ...the fact of the matter is, I'm offering a straight-up 22% chance to lynch someone.
BH how do you KNOW there are exactly 3 mafia? I bolded fact because that's a serious word to throw around when you're supposedly working with estimates.
Here's a critical analysis of a post in that game. It doesn't result in anything, but this post has more logic and scum-searching than his play to this point in the current game, as well as his play in the first game I mentioned, where he was mafia.
On October 08 2014 02:24 batsnacks wrote:
On October 08 2014 02:22 Hopeless1der wrote: You had one job batsnacks. + Show Spoiler +
and then HF gave you another one.
Does it make you nervous that I've already figured out you're mafia?
Then he claims Hopeless1der to be mafia, which ends up being correct. I don't see any reasoning listed, though. This post also came after the first 24 hours of the game, unlike all of the other posts quoted here.
I did notice this inconsistency between his post in this game:
On November 25 2014 10:58 batsnacks wrote:There is no such thing as scum slips, so no, dude didn't scum slip.
and this:
On October 07 2014 08:29 batsnacks wrote:
On October 07 2014 08:19 Grackaroni wrote: You're implying that at the start of the post BH was careful not to slip that he had knowledge of the setup. (by pointing out that the number of scum is unknown) and then *slipped* that he was 100% sure there were 3 mafia within like 10 seconds of typing which is really unrealistic.
What I see is BH working off the assumption that random lynch provides at least 22% chance of hitting mafia compared to day 1 analysis which varies (and BH thinks is worse for catching mafia)
I think it's feasible that he slipped.
besides
The TL mafia database disagrees that random lynch is better. So by random lynching we 1) have worse odds of lynching mafia and 2) players who agree with the random lynch have zero accountability for their votes.
Why the change? Probably just a change in his playstyle, but another explanation is that he is searching for mafia in that game, and has less incentive to do so in this game.
Looking at batsnacks' play in the game preceding the above game, 2p2 Vanilla Werewolf 13er, batsnacks immediately comes up with a comprehensive look at GlowingBear:
On September 26 2014 08:14 batsnacks wrote: I'm not completely caught up yet but I still think GB is mafiawolf.
On September 25 2014 11:02 GlowingBear wrote: I think Storr is mafia because of this:
This post stinks:
On September 25 2014 09:20 StorrZerg wrote: (1) i'd lynch fecal for the donkey entrance to the game.
the overly troll attitude fecal has with the caps locks, and insta vote on holy is really throwing off scum vibes. Deff would lynch.
On September 25 2014 08:34 Fecalfeast wrote: The fact that nobody was using the voting thread made me think they were joke votes. That's why I didn't use the thread anyway.
Lol I actually like your case holyflare
"yeah right"
Also i don't like the GB entrance to the game
On September 25 2014 08:41 GlowingBear wrote: Oh THANK GOD I'm town again! I hate rolling scum.
Ok, Haru, tell me what you think of holyflower by now
(2)unless im missing a game he just played, last game he was scum. seems odd to lead with a lie.
(1) very has reason to call someone definetely scum. I did that no geript last game. There is nothing alignment indicative in fecal's entrance and that makes storr look bad.
(2) storr was scum with me and I clearly stated on the qt that I wanted to be town. I was mafia for 3 games and I wish I was town on this, which I am. I never lied.
The way he is disliking entrances looks like he is trying to pretend to be an aggressive town.
Also, he gives Haru free town pass for his entrance and also obiwan. None has alignment indicative posts.
On September 25 2014 10:11 StorrZerg wrote: obi probably town too.
I'm on a phone and I'm too lazy to search for the town pass on Haru now.
storr is my strongest scum read the moment
Here's his case on storr. He says storr is pretending to be aggressive town by disliking entrances. That is a weird thing to say. How can GB tell the difference between someone who is pretending to be aggressive town and someone who actually is aggressive town based on so few posts? Imo he can't and is just making stuff up.
He also scum reads storr for saying someone is "definitely" mafia and says he said the exact same thing as scum last game. Well, look at this:
On September 25 2014 11:32 GlowingBear wrote: Naaaah. I'm positive storr is scum. ##Vote: Storr
He did it again this game.
I also think this post is scummy:
On September 25 2014 13:09 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:51 Hopeless1der wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:42 GlowingBear wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:28 Hopeless1der wrote: [quote] HF's case on Haru was literally based on one post that was demonstrably false using out-of-thread but public information. Again, why try to stick with such a case? Refusing to "overlook" (which is a strange way to phrase it btw) his case would be way more suspicious than dropping it like he already has. The fact that this seems suspicious to you makes YOU look suspicious to me.
Because it's easy, as scum, to pick on a tiny problem to bus a partner then drop the read.
That is so incredibly shallow. Unless I have found surefire scum tomorrow, I'm voting you just based off this interaction.
btw, fecalfeast is behaving pretty similar to last game imo. No reason to hate on him just yet. Palmar seems to have gotten upset that no one uses the voting thread to follow his policy and has taken up a silent protest. Sky is new to TL but not to mafia. I'd like to hear his (her?) thoughts on why d1 claimers usually got lynched on SK. I'm gone for now, see you all later.
It can be shallow, but at least I'm the only one trying to get people talking. Nothing is in the way of updating my reads the more people starts to talk. If you lynch me, you'll be lynching a townie for stupid reasons and you'll soon lose the game as much as you lost our last one
The "at least" in that sentence is really scummy to me. It's a tone thing. It's like he's really saying "I'm mafia but at least I'm the only one trying to get people talking." It's also scummy how he says he's the -only- person getting people talking. GB made a case against HF earlier for dropping his case against HaruRH. I'm not a mind reader but I think HF made that case to get people talking. So GB is scum reading HF for trying to get people talking -- while saying he, GB, is the only contributor in the thread.
I also think this post is scummy:
On September 25 2014 10:18 GlowingBear wrote: Ok
Glowningbear's first scum team guess: Haru, HF, Storr
Gonna have dinner and give reasons
GB is referring to himself in the third person here in order to distance himself from his reads that he doesn't actually believe in. How can he be confident he's caught the whole scum team and solved the game? Later when he's drunk he posts this:
On September 25 2014 17:48 GlowingBear wrote: My dribk senses says JAT is possibly mafia
So now GB has found 4 mafia... HF is mafia for getting people talking with an early case, Haru is mafia for unflipped assosiations, storr is mafia because GB can tell somehow that storr is just pretending to be aggressive town, and JAT is mafia because ??? Speaking of reads, GB is frantic this game about "getting reads." He is addicted to reads and needs an intervention. He wants to convince us so badly that he is trying to get reads that he can not stop saying it:
On September 25 2014 08:46 GlowingBear wrote: It won't help me getting reads if you use day1 just to charge your solar beam.
On September 25 2014 09:46 GlowingBear wrote: Asking about holyflare's case to everyone is my way to get people talking and getting reads from them.
On September 25 2014 11:11 GlowingBear wrote: Why I think Haru is scum:
He doesn't want to talk much, not letting me getting reads:
On September 25 2014 11:11 GlowingBear wrote: Why not talking? He should be helping us with reads day1.
On September 25 2014 11:15 GlowingBear wrote: I'm done with the reads. I'm going to get ready for a party.
On September 25 2014 11:28 GlowingBear wrote: Because I want people talking about people so I can get reads.
On September 25 2014 13:09 GlowingBear wrote: Nothing is in the way of updating my reads the more people starts to talk.
On September 26 2014 00:33 GlowingBear wrote: Sorry, I'm guilty of getting people to talk to get my reads instead of immediately attacking both HF and hope.
On September 26 2014 00:33 GlowingBear wrote: I think that is good to register and to get reads.
On September 26 2014 00:49 GlowingBear wrote: Gut feelings VS actual reads. Actual reads won.
On September 26 2014 00:49 GlowingBear wrote: It could be totally wrong but at least I would get people talking more so I can have more reads
He's clearly thinking and investigating the posts, and trying to find the scum. Then he starts thinking that SkyDragon is scum:
On September 26 2014 08:18 batsnacks wrote: Also this post is really scummy:
On September 26 2014 01:07 SkyDragon wrote:
On September 25 2014 12:51 Hopeless1der wrote:Sky is new to TL but not to mafia. I'd like to hear his (her?) thoughts on why d1 claimers usually got lynched on SK.
"His" is correct. :p
d1 claimers got lynched depending on what they were saying.
- If they claimed to be Town with nothing to back it up, they were seen as suspicious and people would vote to lynch them if their play-style doesn't match. - Throwing out names on the first day was seen as suspicious. - Feigning ignorance of a particular role was suspicious unless he weren't very bright in the first place (As one guy did when he asked the Mod in the thread whether getting no pm means that you're a Villager - We straight away knew that he was trying it, lynched him and he turned out to be Mafia) - Changing votes repeatedly was seen as suspicious. - Normally active players who become quiet were seen as suspicious.
There's no one answer to fit all situations really. There were also power roles so someone may have been saying something considered "weird" because they were the Seer, Doctor, Vigi or some other good role (And the last thing you want to do is get them lynched). There would be some hesitation to vote to lynch anyone on Day 1 but sometimes something is said that just doesn't feel right to several people.
It's a long post filled with info that makes zero conclusions about anything. Perfect mafia post. If I'm not voting GB today I'm voting skydragon.
He continues to press on GlowingBear and SkyDragon. Both end up being town, but batsnacks is showing that he is capable and willing to attempt to find scum and provide logical accusations that other players are scum.
In conclusion, batsnacks seems very suspcious because he has not yet provided any real content, particularly at least one accusation of someone being mafia with an argument behind it. This resembles his play in his last game, where he was mafia, and contrasts with his play in previous games where he was town. What do you guys think?
First good job, overall this is a really good case and took a lot of effort it looks like to put together.
And for lolz I will say When has bats ever really shown logical critical thinking skills! ( I love you bats)
The big thing about bats is that he has taken great strides to change his play between games. The style and tone of his play and if you can remember him is his biggest mafia give away and lurkiness.
I do not think that you are necessarily wrong in what you are saying, we should be very suspicious of batsnacks and if he really stops doing things and is forgettable we lynch him immediately. But i'm not confident enough as it seems he is trying to push something when talking to people he does ask for reads from people.
You are now town to me.
Damdred first says this is a good case against batsnacks, and then says that he isn't confident enough, but is very suspicious of batsnacks. Then votes for Dicksmash, with the only explanation being Dicksmash bothers him. And I don't think he mentioned Dicksmash at all until literally one minute before this vote. As I type this up, I noticed that Damdred just added a post of reasoning against Dicksmash. Which is great and all, but I would have liked to see this earlier, or at least some hints that you were getting suspicious of Dicksmash. Ironically, this is exactly the same thing you just accused Dicksmash of.
On November 26 2014 10:18 batsnacks wrote: There's people arguing about whether someone's excuses are legit or not...
Meanwhile Trfel has contributed a massive case, he's followed up and voted, and no one has commented on any of it.
If you're town get your priorities straight. If you're mafia keep talking about IRL excuses and timezones.
Even batsnacks is saying that my case has some validity. If it didn't, he would have torn it apart by now. I haven't seen anyone provide strong arguments against the case on batsnacks yet, other than it is suspicious but not quite strong enough to vote (which I disagree with, but is understandable I suppose). Meanwhile, excluding the most recent Damdred post on Dicksmash, the case feels a bit thin to me.
Meta cases are weird in the fact that they look Amazing, and really shows effort put in by the person who did it but doesn't take into account changing game play and the way the person is choosing to play the game you are in currently. If you compare Bats earlier games Mission Mafia, Storm, Neat and Tidy, Cell, Titanic. You will see A HUGE disparity in the way he plays. I am always suspicious of batsnacks though because we have such a good history together and I think his scum game and his town game can be similar depending on the amount of time he puts in. Thats just the thing about Meta cases though they can be wrong and can be right
This second point isn't right at all, I even quoted myself when I questioned Dicksmash and he never answered me at all. I never said who my scum leans were and Bresh was the only person to inquire which I just now got around to answering part of hat question and of course I can't go extremely in depth like I want on my phone thats just silly reasoning there.
I somehow missed this post, for which I'm pretty annoyed about. Anyway, the point of the meta case is that as town, batsnacks attempts to make reads and find scum. Sure, he can change his play as town, but I cannot see how a playstyle that does not do these things is any good. Town always wants to find scum.
On November 27 2014 14:33 Damdred wrote: Well I was trying to let things develop and some of the scum reads made me laugh pretty hard tbh damdred asked 16-17 questions he's so obvious scum. But the thread was kind of stagnant with no cases so I figured I should push the scummiest person.
What do you think of oats bresh
And then he comes up with this explanation for why he pushed on the Dicksmash lynch. There were no cases? He stated that "overall, this is a really good case" in reference to the batsnacks case. Since then, what changed? Yes, the post I presented contained a large amount of reference to batsnacks' previous play. There is also a lot of evidence against batsnacks in this game. And if Damdred is really so skeptical of meta cases that he considers the case on batsnacks to not really count as a case, why didn't he think of this initially when he read my post? Then he wouldn't have said that the case was really good, he would have said it is weak.
Both before and after the Dicksmash lynch, a lot of people have said that batsnacks seems very suspicious, including Damdred himself. Regardless of how he felt about the meta case on batsnacks, he said "we should be very suspicious of batsnacks". Then after the flip, he initially goes after Breshke, and then suggests lynching Half the Sky. No mention of batsnacks whatsoever. This seems to be a very weird change in his suspicions.
Note that this case has little, if any relation to whether or not batsnacks is in fact mafia.
In conclusion, I am suspicious of Damdred because he keeps changing his opinions and seems a somewhat contradictory. I think he is likely to be mafia, but I am not as confident as I am about batsnacks. I suggest voting batsnacks on day 2, as the evidence there seems very strong. Whether or not batsnacks is mafia, Damdred still seems very suspicious. But if batsnacks flips mafia, I feel like the case against Damdred becomes overwhelming.
Overall i'd say i've been pretty straight forward in most of what I have said which is cool I guess.
Yes it was a very good case, you put a lot of obvious effort in and brought a meta case into the world. Does that inherently make it right? The answer to this is no, I made probably the best case on GlowingBear in hearthstone mafia (best case i've made) it was completely made on meta and even GB said "I'm totes scum" thankfully gb died during the night and he was town, so just because a meta case is good does not mean it is right.
You should always be suspicious of batsnacks idk how else to say this. We will have disagreement about policy vs pressure, just the pressure is slightly towny policy is null oats will be yelling at me in a few minutes though about it again.
I've played probably ten games with batsnacks, if I can remember some things hes done at the end of day 1 i'm not going to vote him d1 when their are scummy people who I think are scummy. I did mention dicksmash before hand infact I spoke with him very early in the day and my question was a pressure question because I did not like what he was doing in fact I put that in my case.
First post that is attack is a tone read as shown by my explanation why it is scummy, generally town will try to figure out what someone means by that and not directly attack the person by reworking what they said to make them look like hey are trying to push blame on someone else, and who cares what bats town reads someone for?
This part of your post is completely guess work, he complains on one hand about not having enough time to read and saying He has a lot left to read but then comes in with a vote on bats after filter diving? That makes little to no sense, I stand by this
I'm not really sure what you mean about changing opinion on SL from null to scum? I think the post can be debated whether he is talking about his own opinion or what he gathered from filters, and as Dick didn't try to correct me but obviously read my case as he asked a question about something later in the case afterwards and didn't correct that part.
Not sure why you quoted that next post it still stands and I talked about it earlier, meta cases are good but super flawed.
Just because there was a meta case that honestly i thought was good but disagreed with your conclusion that bats was mafia, hell I have said that a lot over d1 and n1. Even in that very first post I said that no lynch batsnacks today, you should always be suspicious of batsnacks (no offense to bats) hes not going to get killed by mafia very often especially early so we have time to find out his alignment by means other than meta which you should know since you did the meta cases on him.
This next part is just throwing dirt, tunneling on one person is not the way to win a game of mafia its something i'm weak to that i'm correcting but I know you lose if you tunnel. You should always pressure everyone that you do not have a strong read on I think bresh is town now but I wasn't sure before.
And then more associative reads its great.
Overall the post is really wordy and comes to a conclusion if bats flillps scum damdred is scum. To all those concerned this post looks good and is rather lengthy but that does not make it in fact towny in nature, read it very thoroughly and post what you think
On November 27 2014 15:42 batsnacks wrote: Yeah that was weird. It wasn't intentional though. Also, Dicksmash had the overwhelming majority and my vote wouldn't have mattered anyway unless I voted myself. Also if I weren't afk I would have voted dicksmash as either alignment.
Yeah I believe you makes sense.
Do you think anything slam has done this game is alignment indicative?
Not directed at me, I know, but I've been going back through the thread...without the pressure of voting it's making a bit more sense than when I first read the posts. I would not vote Alakaslam anymore. Here's why:
Biggest problem with him is that he poofed. Still, he was responsible about it. Kept the vote to the vote train instead of voting something that would change the course of the game when he hadn't really been in it.
On November 27 2014 06:33 Alakaslam wrote: ##Vote: Alakaslam
I have been very busy and got a voting reminder.
IF SELF VOTING IS NOT OK:
##vote: DSMIC as that is the largest wagon.
I am really ill informed due to being out of thread so long. I should be able to pick it up soon
Alakaslam did not joke vote. All the random names (shop talk is what I'd call it, because those of us new to the game have little hope of understanding it easily) threw me off. But he said he voted Breshke for joke voting, not that he was joke voting.
On November 25 2014 07:14 sicklucker wrote: boring im town again afk
Looks like we found our d1 lynch already
##Vote: Sicklucker
Are you voting him down because he's serious and just trolling or because you're a baddie trying to lynch a good guy?
Granted this is my first ever TLM game so you probably know this lad more than I do...just saying. I can read that either way.
This is pretty townie. This got me at least one slight town read
see what is this?
I agree with SL! hjijole vato wei!
Someone interpret that too hey?
Can't interpret anything unless you give reasons.
You see not with the eyes of chupazi. I will translate.
I want town to tell me why I voted Breshke for what was obviously a joke.
*GASP* That is so dry it probably won't work now!
or maybe it will? I still want y'all to do it! consider it fellow student homework.
Then, as soon as someone mentions that sicklucker laid a "trap" (which, was first called that by Damdred, though I don't think that sicklucker ever actually said that this was what it was?) Alakaslam removes his vote, accompanied by the following post:
On November 25 2014 11:48 Breshke wrote: SL apprently wrote the afk town thing as a trap
ah thank you.
Oh he did this intentionally?
hiiiiiiiiiijole.
Well he is like Kenpachi then; a not so great player...
##Unvote
Anyway here is the teaching moment.
Kenpachi is a dude who graced TLMafia a while back. He used meta as a tool.
The nice thing about newbie/vet games is you have this mix of meta and originality, when someone uses meta as a tool it is more apparent and the newbie is "left out of the loop" but is perhaps more likely to find out what is stupid about that particular meta.
For example, some people like RVS- Random Voting Stage (hello smashboards -_-)
WHY?
Yet me challenging RVS got me instantly disliked over there.
What (crap I forget his name) noticed there was someone doing a random vote.
And he pointed something awesome out: When you cut it to the bone, you can see that stupid crap like RVS can only really help scum by muddling motivations and intentions readability in a particular post.
Sure it keeps town honest too, (how many times have I seen town say "It's just a joke, seriously") (How many times do I joke!?!? lol) but ultimately taking "it was just a joke" away as an easy excuse for a telling post is better than leaving it.
sure, it will always be doable. THat is the nature of wifom. BUt as town to minimize this is awesome, and here by newness we are presented an opportunity to do so.
Seems pretty clear by the above that Alakaslam is trying to say, in a very narrative style, that town is benefitted most by players who are playing straightforward. I.e. not joking, random voting, worrying about meta when in some later game they might be mafia, etc. Seems like a pretty townie take on things to me, but then, I hate moves based on meta, too, so I'm probably biased.
He also probed Batsnacks for a simple read on HTS rather than the ramble that Batsnacks initially gave where he nitpicked something about baddies or whatever as TMI but then said it didn't seem like anything after all.
On November 25 2014 12:05 Alakaslam wrote: ... BATSNACKS!
Now say in one sentence your read on him plz.
Because if you can't condense it does it actually exist?
And didn't immediately dismiss Batsnacks' vote on Kush to try to force him to vote, instead asking for clarification as to what Batsnacks was doing that.
On November 25 2014 12:18 Oatsmaster wrote: He has bad posts regarding a read ohf HTS, his policy lynch on kush is really bad and he is using that to avoid playing the game and doing actual useful things.
It is real, and not actually baseless.
Hmm.
So do you know the context there? I don't.
Bats care to enlighten me or did he leave?
Also, he defended the people who hadn't posted in the thread yet after the game had just started.
On November 25 2014 12:22 Alakaslam wrote: Of course some folks haven't posted; game just started a few hours ago.
Conclusion: I'm seeing nothing scummy here. Alakaslam is in my town pile.
Still reading through the rest of the thread, but some things have caught my eye. I do not understand Damdred's obsession with HTS in the beginning of the game. He initially attributed it to just trying to push sicklucker for why he was reading HTS as slightly town, but got very aggressive about it and declared a scum read that I never saw an explanation for. (Granted I've only finished combing through page 10 at this time.) All I saw was the following comment that possibly maybe half-explained it by saying that HTSs comment wasn't necessarily town and so could be scum:
On November 25 2014 08:35 Damdred wrote: Usually votes within the first page are pressure votes especially when you say hey i'm town going to afk. Of course you need to be back in the thread.
But look at the post that you are slightly town reading sky for, hes not defending you at all hes look at motives for bresh slightly without any real pressure. Half of it won't get any answer and then he discredits himself with the last sentence slightly . So not sur ei'm seeing what you are unless you are just looking to give people town reads for no reason
I don't understand why this would turn into a scum read, so @Damdred...
Where are you getting your scum read from? Why HTS of all people to go after so quickly?
And @Batsnacks...got anything better than the fact HTS actually stated goodies and baddies in his post when asking Breshke why he voted sicklucker right out the gate?
That said, still reading Breshke and sicklucker as town. Both of what you two were doing at the start of game makes sense to me, but got muddied by some of the aggressive playing from other quarters.
I think it was preetty obvious that I went after SL and his unfounded town read at the moment, I generally don't scum read someone for strange posts at the very onset, but unfounded town reads are another story so a little pressure was needed
Either way I love how you say that i'm overjustified on everything but you aren't jumping on other people who are actually justfying themselves or their vote or scum read 10x as much as what you perceive.
Anyway I won't be here until about5-6 tonight really busy day today so not sure before that if i can pop in
On November 25 2014 10:11 Damdred wrote: @bats I missed you and glad you said that. Would you think I'm insane if I told you I'm scum reading half tight now
Damdred, I was not asking why you were questioning sicklucker. Either you've forgotten you mentioned you thought HTS was scum, or you're dodging the question. Considering I could never find your reasoning for this read, that is concerning.
@all...my main reason for my post on slam was that I don't feel he's the better lynch simply because he wasn't in the game yesterday when he didn't do anything inherently scummy in his posts and we've got so many people question two other players. In fact, you probably have more against me than you do him lol.
I guess I misunderstood what you were asking. I do think half is scummy though over explained vote post few things earlier that were non commital and to agreeable I'll have to filter dive when I'm done here.
Back to dinner if I didn't respond to something directed at me I'll answer it just quote it could of missed it
On November 28 2014 04:36 Damdred wrote: I do think half is scummy though over explained vote post few things earlier that were non commital and to agreeable I'll have to filter dive when I'm done here.
Pot...kettle...black?
I think you had the same argument with Oats, but your meta case and counter argument earlier I'm pretty sure was at least as twice as long as mine was. Not that post length should even be relevant, again it comes down to quality, I just find it ironic you're using those points to paint me (or anyone) as scum, when you are even more guilty/traceable to the same thing.
I made a case on someone it wasn't a meta case it wasn't meta at all so don't say that.
I've been committed to what I've said and I've faught with half the thread so not sure what your post means?
On November 28 2014 07:15 sicklucker wrote: Ya that night kill wants me to kill bats. I think if its bats plus obv partner dand they would totally make that kill. I dont totally agree their scum but its the best math play right now. But we got time
On November 28 2014 07:41 sicklucker wrote: I was also saying hypothetically If both bats and dandred are scum they would have to kill one of the guys pushing them hard. Wifmo my ass its the only play. Because you cant lose bats because then dandred would be voted out.
Alot of people agreed with me that a bats damdred scum team makes sense. If they didnt them I sapose im wrong here
On November 28 2014 07:45 sicklucker wrote: My last evidence is more of a reason to get damdred if bat shows up as scum then a reason to vote bats out.
On November 28 2014 07:42 Damdred wrote: Half maybe I need to dive him properly.
Sl is acting really strange with all this nonsensical math stuff.
Oats is weird but I wouldn't lynch today
I have the same feelings about Half
Im fairly sure SL is town, dont look at his weird math stuff. Last game the way rayn and then because of him kind of myself townread SL is that you need to look at the fact that he truly believes what he is saying is right and what he is saying is helping town. Never seen him mafia so could be wrong obviously.
Why is oats weird?
Just isn't playing how I've generally seen him, he came into the game much more aggro than usual he generally isn't as nitpicky.
On November 28 2014 07:41 sicklucker wrote: I was also saying hypothetically If both bats and dandred are scum they would have to kill one of the guys pushing them hard. Wifmo my ass its the only play. Because you cant lose bats because then dandred would be voted out.
Alot of people agreed with me that a bats damdred scum team makes sense. If they didnt them I sapose im wrong here
So you think me and damdred are mafia. You think damdred's plan as mafia is to draw attention to the both of us by defending me. And you think our plan is to kill the people who are pushing us, because that somehow makes us less suspicious?
On November 28 2014 07:42 Damdred wrote: Half maybe I need to dive him properly.
Sl is acting really strange with all this nonsensical math stuff.
Oats is weird but I wouldn't lynch today
I have the same feelings about Half
Im fairly sure SL is town, dont look at his weird math stuff. Last game the way rayn and then because of him kind of myself townread SL is that you need to look at the fact that he truly believes what he is saying is right and what he is saying is helping town. Never seen him mafia so could be wrong obviously.
Why is oats weird?
Just isn't playing how I've generally seen him, he came into the game much more aggro than usual he generally isn't as nitpicky.
Do you think nitpicky helps kill scum, or do you think it is something scum does to make themselves look like they are helping town.
That's a hard question, it could catch scum and scum could use it to discredit and look like they are helping town. Its more null but I don't usually see oats do it if at all
On November 28 2014 07:53 sicklucker wrote: Well for starters damdred is being over defensive here. I understand bats not wanting to get lynched. We have one guy talking about IF WE LYNCH then MAYBE WE LYNCH and damdred is all over it. I would hope a town damdred here would just help find scum.
Because its HORRIBLE practice and not protown at all! We don't lynch someone based on wifom night kills its horrible and bad and you are still talking u associated flips
Bats actually had decent responses to tr before his death happened. And he's right about not being tunneled that's how town loses games.
Thirdly Scumsnacks and damred (teehee) wouldn't put themselves at the forefront of discussion damdred wouldn't lead the lynch and take out the #1 pressure on him that's idiotic I can fight pressure and discredit them. Total wifom but its not what I would do
See you say you want town to win SL but you are dragging the thread through shit just to pit out crazy wrong theories currently and want people to scum hunt but keep throwing stuff at me and bats
Yep, hes done it before like this in cell though so its not like its a remote incident.
Overall i'm more frustrated with the way people are scum hunting this day, even if you disagree with my case oats and say its shit at least its legitimate scum hunting. And not the undefensible wifom and unflipped association things that are going on right now.
On November 28 2014 11:29 Damdred wrote: Yep, hes done it before like this in cell though so its not like its a remote incident.
Overall i'm more frustrated with the way people are scum hunting this day, even if you disagree with my case oats and say its shit at least its legitimate scum hunting. And not the undefensible wifom and unflipped association things that are going on right now.
I'm not a fan of the association reads and wifom either.
I don't even know what case you are talking about now. And I don't care if you think you played well even though it's not possible to play well if you don't lynch scum.
You just said my case was shit not to long ago oats? Either way I didn't lynch scum, he didn't fight it was a mess but it wasn't associative read bs that people are trying to pull now.
On November 28 2014 12:56 LightningStrike wrote: Okay since now that my cousin and his wife and son have left I can finally give you guys my current reads for the time being. Breshke: Town since he displaying the same kind of approach for today as he did in my last game when he was town.
Batsnacks: Null leaning town since he is acting close to the same way he did last game with me when he was a doctor but he been dodging questions from Oatsmaster and Half the Sky.
Damndred: Null leaning town since he was one of the major pushers for the lynching of DSIM without much of a good reason and been defending Batsnacks actions but at the same time he been giving losts of questions although DSIM didn't respond well to the questions.
Half the Sky: Town since he been giving good reasonings for his reads throughout the game although I don't like his case for Batsnacks being scum based on my own experience playing with Batsnacks in my last game.
sicklucker: Town because his posting style had pretty much stayed the same from the last game I played with him although he did looked very scummy in that game but he was just a Vanilla town and since our power roles had been lynched/killed I having a safe bet that sicklucker is town.
meatpudding: Null leaning town he had some decent questions after being gone for a while and now he claiming to have no power at his house it could be a scum move because one of the scums in my last game tried to pull that move but failed so perhaps meatpudding could scum.
alakaslam: null leaning scum since he not posted much of his reads but he also admitted to notread much of the thread during the time of us lynching DSIM but I need to see more posts of his though since he said he had to go earlier in the thread to confirm my suspicions.
Oatsmasters: Town since he been asking lots of questions to everyone and been trying to lead the discussion when he can which isn't a trait a scum member would do.
kushm4sta: Null leaning scum since he not been contributing a lot like his last scum game which was my last although he did give a couple questions to people he also didn't post much so I need to wait for him to post more so I can get a better read on him
rsoultin: Null leaning town since he trying to ask some questions and responding to questions he been asked by others although he did convence me to lynch DSIM that is haunting me because of my last game experience :|
You can' honestly believe the bolded portion can you?
On November 28 2014 13:04 LightningStrike wrote: I don't know to tell you the truth because I way to inexperience to tell apart what is really scummy posts and what's not but if I had to guess it could be meatpudding and rsoultin.
So your scum is Meatpudding, rsoultin, Kush and Slam?
On November 28 2014 13:09 Breshke wrote: People trying to blame damdred saying he pushed dicksmash for no reason yet they still voted on dicksmash don't make sense.
Damdred why do you think bats ignored my question to give a read on you and to explain the "we cant be scum together". Is it frustrating because they are dumb questions or something? I think it is relevant and could easily be answered if he had stuff to back up the shit he says.
I'm not going to pretend to be able to answer for bats. But it seems that he is frustrated with how the thread is going, and thats null from either perspective.
However its not a dumb question, (no offense to SL) the way he went about it is probably the least helpful that could of happened to be sure. Myself and Bats are not newb scum players in the least, bats is typically a scummy town player in most peoples eyes. So as scum you bus the hell out of bats if you get the chance to get the cred you don't hard defend your scum partner d1 and lead the mislynch into oblivion it is quite literally one of the worst moves you can do in this situation, and hen to top it off kill the person who is hard pushing BOTH of you.
It is quite literally wifom but the worst play you can make as mafia, it is just stupid in general
I probably have at some point but can't remember which game if not all. Maybe its more that it makes me sullen and bitter people think I'm bad enough to pick the worst possible nk right then. Anyway
@Oats, meh we can talk more about it post game but I would of killed Oats or kush depending if they were on team. But pointless to keep on this track.
@bresh I've answered this fifty times. Bats is doing some things, he's not super lurky and I can remember what he's doing.
People who are saying I'm defending bats like my life depends on it you are being dumb, a lot of people are using bad methods to try to lynch batsnacks. Others have town reads that are strange but aren't getting that pressure in getting over it so gj being tunneled.
Look at these games and tell me why Kush is town in them?
This is not giving an excuse not to lynch kush but when Kush is busy he actually really does afk, look at what hes posted and see if it looks towny or looks scummy. Thats how you really tell, is kush super combative or trying to figure the game out when hes present and participating thats how you really tell.
We have roughly 6 hours to figure out the best lynch and i'm not sold on a kush lynch based on this misinterpretation of his meta that some people are putting out their.
Look guys at his filter. He spends most of his time discrediting people for the push yesterday, spends a great amount of time on me but then never talks about me at all once he votes bat and doesn't even put me in his top scum list. I'm not even sure exactly why hes off of bats and unto kush besides that its the vote gaining the most traction.
Trfel has never played with bats, there are some merits to that case still. But there are other factors that play into bats alignment for me that he did not cover that go into my general read of him every game that are correct generally.
And why are you asking about my read of bats when you bandwagon'd on kush just like you did on dick? So you can blame the main pushers and discredit them some more?
On November 30 2014 01:26 rsoultin wrote: So from one quarter (Oats) over-explaining the vote change, and from another quarter (Damdred) a reason can't be found.
Damdred, I've still got a bone to pick with you. Your initial argument with SL, you scum-read HTS practically right out the gate without an explanation. Care to enlighten me?
I think i've said before that I did not like how SL was giving htl a free town pass for something he didn't do. Basically a town read for nothing when htl was playing the middle ground to well and being wishy washy.
On November 30 2014 01:39 Half the Sky wrote: Damdred: Because your rationale (or use of meta) is inconsistent. My rationale for going after both was not without checking each of their reasons for voting the way they did. My methods weren't flawless but they have been consistent.
If I posted with no explanation, then you have a case.
Oats: It is equally probable that Kush is staying low to make you think he's not scum.
How is my use of meta inconsistent, I have a good meta read on bats overall and his play this game looks decently in line with his usual town play.
On November 30 2014 02:04 Half the Sky wrote: Damdred: What I'm trying to say is that you can't say someone cannot use meta and then use it yourself. If you want to agree to disagree that is fine. Meta arguments either way hold nothing to me personally but that is besides the point.
I think i've made it abundantly clear that i disagree with his meta case....if they hold nothing for you w hy are you making a big deal about it
On November 30 2014 01:36 rsoultin wrote: That I'd buy if SL had actually said that. It took him three (plus) times of saying it was just a slight initial read leaning toward town for you to pay attention and accept that he wasn't crawling into bed with HTS (and dude, first time he mentioned it that's exactly what he said slight). Just seems very weird there Damdred for you to pick that bone to worry at, and finally accept it after he said the same thing he'd been saying.
Is wishy-washy unusual right out the starting gate?
Is SL reading scum to you for any reason but that?
Is HTS for that matter?
Otherwise, the circular reasoning is staggering. HTS is scum because SL is scum because HTS is scum? Lol. Dangerous way to look at things, that.
There comes a point in every fight where you just won't get anything else, at the end especially with the bresh i was hoping SL would just make up a read instead of repeating what he was saying as it is a general trap he could fall into. But he didn't, and i didn't think someone as spammy as him d1 should of been the lynch so town pile for the first day wasn't the worst move.
Whats their generally to be wishy washy right out of the gate? Most early votes are jokes or pressure votes, and to try to stay so much in the middle is still strange to me.
SL is just crazy, i think he might honestly be more insane then bats with all his "math" and weird associative reads. I could see him being scum but i wouldn't say i'm sold on that tinfoil hat yet even if i just said it for post game cred.
HTS is scum for readons including that and besides that.
I'm not going to declare that associate read till one of them flips mafia
On November 30 2014 02:29 rsoultin wrote: What's your case on meat, ls?
That Oats likes meat for it? Cause to me that is about as weak as it gets, if that's all you've got.
Damdred you're ignoring me. You shouldn't be ignoring me. Makes me cry. More to the point, ignoring me and not others to argue around in circles rather than answering a new question...This is not the first time you've dodged questions from me.
no I don't think your scum for town reading SL right now, barb away.
1) Kush point about someone claiming RB isn't actually a bad one especially with only one power role out their its not that hard to think that they would hold it claim for a free town pass for a bit probably. Though why k ush brings up town rb idk.
No no no, you misunderstand what i'm trying to say. I'm scum reading HTS, for all of the bandwagon votes, he puts people down as scummy and says he will filter dive them discredits them and moves on to whatever vote is gaining the most traction, dicksmash, bats, kush. I'm not putting any associative read into this right now, if HTS flips scum i'll consider more if SL is brave enough to give his scum mate a pass.
On November 30 2014 04:47 rsoultin wrote: Not HTS, lol.
I'm not going to consolidate just for the sake of consolidating right now. Some haven't been online. Kush and Hope are supposedly still reading. We have over 24 hours before EoD. If people want to make their case for why they're voting for who, I'm down for that.
On November 30 2014 05:28 rsoultin wrote: Just feels too easy. The case against him is minimal. Everyone is way too willing to jump on it. HTS isn't a huge town read for me, if at all, but at the same time it seems weird that so many people would be eager to push him based off so little. And eh, bugger, you're right about the time. I was reading the time the mod said was left but it obviously wasn't updated.
I really, truly believe lightningstrike is the best lynch here, but if I have to go with one of the two pushes we have moving now (kush or hts) I'm going for kush.
Does it have to be hard to catch scum? What is wrong about the case exactly?
Theres currently three people on it with kush still being lynched not sure if this part is true.
On November 30 2014 05:46 Hopeless1der wrote: kush almost literally doesnt play as scum. He also busses like a mofo. He has done neither of these things this game.
Hopeless, question, operative words in bold.
I think Kush has played some here prior to the middle of D2, but others are calling him out that he's not playing enough. Define what you mean as "almost literally doesn't play as scum". As in just AFK to the point of being a policy lynch?
Kush literally does nothing, if you call him out all he does is come in make promsies and is antagonistic towards everyone does not try to push lynches except on his scum mates and never tries to solve the game OR give reads he never does any of that as scum
Look at the games i posted where hes town, he afks in those to! but that doesn't make him scum just because people are propegating what they think his scum meta is doesn't mean thats what it is.
hes been actively trying to figure something out when hes here, he shoudln't be lynched rsoul has been scummy at eod lets go
On November 30 2014 05:20 Damdred wrote: Explain to me why?
Let's talk criteria. Here we go. I want to make sure you understand where I'm coming from here.
1 Gaps in posting/support
- First we have the vote on DSMI. When he first listed his reads, he was on his phone, so he was brief, fine. But I'm surprised to not see further extended support/followup for his reads. He called out the following - LS, Rasputin, Oats, and you. There was no followup for LS and Rasputin, and none regarding you, even though Oats, questioned it (see #2)
- Because there was no followup, it appeared a massive gap between how we went from voting you to voting DSMI on what appeared to be weaker evidence from him - namely nitpicking.
- If Kush used "nitpicking" to vote DSMI, why not vote Oats, who was also guilty of nitpicking?
- His defence of Bats was that reads on d1 are poor (or fluid as he said), and that other people haven't been giving reads. Then he admits that "others have been worse" but somehow, before, he had a "stronger read" on you about your shit pushes. To me something doesn't add up.
- Why did I buy into Kush's post? Because of 1) urgency on DSMI's part posting and 2) filtering DSMI's comments relative to others. I didn't take Kush at face value. I checked before I changed votes.
- Kush pushed the vote before you did on DSMI.
- To extend on the D1 argument, it also doesn't make sense to me that he would say D1 is fluid and then expect us to say that D1 proves him innocent. As in we are good enough to read him as town from D1 actions. If that was a troll comment, see #5.
- Conclusion - There are enough gaps and contradictions here, and I revisited Kush's post because he sold me an argument that proved wrong. Urgency was wrong - he flipped town. So I looked closer at the other points I was sold.
2 Dodging questions
- He dodged Oats asking him about the Damdred read. I think he might have dodged one more in there, but I stopped at page 27 when I was double checking that.
3 AFK issue
- He admitted this. Bad as alakaslam, no but taking it at face value, it appeared a huge cop-out, particularly with the D1 argument. We're past Thanksgiving.
4 Forgettable
- As I said before, I recall Bats' filter more than his, although Bats' filter was 2x as much, so there's that.
5 Spam/trolling
- This is applicable more to Bats than Kush, although Kush had a few of these as well. But I find spam/trolling/etc a problem because it just makes it more difficult for the town. There's more to weed through. Scum would want to make it difficult for the town. I won't speak for others but it's not always easy to tell who is trolling/serious/not serious etc when I'm reading this stuff.
- Again as I said before, meta holds nothing to me. If you think I'm taking someone too seriously, call me on it. I took Breskhe too seriously early on, and I stood corrected.
Kush, if you want to answer these, I'm all ears.
DSMI was decently scummy i'm not going to hold this against kush, the content of his case even though it was smaller than my case was just as good. It might not of been as convincing to some but DSMI was a huge question mark that was acting scummy so I can't fault him here, kush always has a hard on for me to he generally can tone read me etc preetty well and he always thinks i'm scummy early so I usually don't hold thata against him and then the jump off me.
Plenty of people dodge questions though, its not necessarily a scummy trait it can be scummy but doesn't have to be.
The other stuff i'm not sure, i can remember kush push and some other things hes done but nothing that looks overtly scummy from memory.
I disagree slightly with spamming to be scummy i'd rather everyone be spammy gives us more content to work with but meh.
On November 30 2014 06:34 rsoultin wrote: -shrugs- I have.
I still would lynch lightningstrike for playing the frightened rabbit I don't want to get lynched as a vanilla town so I'm not going to participate card, I still don't like how easy it was for Damdred to convince all the currently present players to flip on HTS and then claims it wasn't by citing the absent players still on kush as an example.
I could keep pointing fingers or repeating myself, but I've made my opinions/reads pretty clear throughout the game. SL and breshke are still my strongest town reads. Why would I have a read on you already? lol Slam was completely null other than the AFK, which apparently was for personal reasons. Anyone trying to push you right now would be odd to me.
Oats was on hts before I was, I voted, then bats voted as he didn't want a kush lynch.
Where are these imaginary people Damdred convinced to jump on hts?
On November 30 2014 06:33 Half the Sky wrote: Hopeless, you are defending Kush's play. What do you make of his reasoning for voting DSMI after voting Damdred?
Batsnacks, you can answer this also.
I am claiming gaps in Kush's reasoning from Damdred to DSMI. Counterclaim or help me fill in the gaps please.
Damdred, I've read part of your first case...also continuing...
I dont consider kush's voting damdred in reading him. Kush came back again and again to say we should vote DSMI, gave reasons on why it was a good idea, why lynching others was a bad idea. And I mean actually gave reasons instead of "lol u bad hes town".
Hopeless if you are scum trying to gain cred after the flip i will vig you in every game we play together
On November 30 2014 06:45 Half the Sky wrote: Damdred, I have one more question regarding inconsistency. This is regarding the D1 argument.
- As I said in my explanation, Kush used the D1 argument to defend bats. - Yet he concluded (read) DSMI's D1 nitpicking as scummy enough, or more scummy than you, as you have just stated. - Then when he says he's going afk, he says D1 is enough to save him. As if we are sharp enough that we should deem him town from D1, which who knows.
How does this even make sense? You cannot have it both ways.
At the very least, are you beginning to see how I'm getting to a conclusion where I'm convinced Kush is scum? You do not have to agree with everything I am saying, that is not what I am asking.
I don't agree with the conclussion but I do understand what you are saying and in a vacuum and no prior experience with kush I would vote him with you.
Guys, stop talking until night post is out seriously. This stuff can be talked about after post half probably isn't out of game since the last votes came after deadline.
EPT
