Golden Sun: The Lost Age Mafia Djinn Edition

On May 17 2014 02:33 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I would /in, but Koshi told me to and I'm a rebel at heart so I'm not going to.

On May 17 2014 02:36 thrawn2112 wrote:
i've already pledged myself to cell mini

On May 17 2014 06:07 raynpelikoneet wrote:
btw guys watch out for bkqyrld.

On May 18 2014 22:34 Hapahauli wrote:
/in

Been a while, and I've been meaning to try a larger game again. I can't promise my customary of activity (I'll be periodically travelling for the next few weeks), but it should be enough to read/play the game.

On May 21 2014 06:26 geript wrote:

Suck it. I rolled vig. Want to make sure I don't shoot you today?

On May 21 2014 07:03 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:

So sexy

Now do you have any other ideas other than that?

On May 21 2014 07:04 Steveling wrote:
Person who comes in 2 hours after start of the game with a "logical reason" is scummy in my book.
HF are you scum again?

On May 21 2014 07:07 27ninjabunnies wrote:


So me pointing out that there are probably a few mafia that are present, makes me mafia?

Cause I would so point out something that indicates myself as mafia.

On May 21 2014 07:24 Steveling wrote:


I don't like that personal attack.
Keep your thoughts about what's mafia play and what not to yourself.

On May 21 2014 07:36 marvellosity wrote:
Xatalos, I really have no idea, nor do I care, because I don't particularly strive to be consistent from game to game. Honestly the fact that you're beating away at this makes you look kinda better though, so maybe I'll unvote you if I'm feeling nice


You do realise, though, that Steve's semi-ridiculous behaviour makes it less likely he's mafia though, yes? (or traditional mafia. I'm just gonna say town for town and mafia for all the other factions until something tells me otherwise)

On May 21 2014 07:20 Holyflare wrote:
if you're gonna play like last game i will actually policy lynch you and i honestly don't care

On May 21 2014 07:45 Steveling wrote:


Yes you literally only won because of my bad play as town right?
Not because NO ONE, LITERALLY NO ONE VOTED FOR A SCUM IN ALL 3 DAYS.

Oh wait, except me.

On May 21 2014 07:49 Steveling wrote:


And yeah I was about to post that, this is retarded by HF.

On May 21 2014 07:56 Steveling wrote:
And btw, I didn't call you a retard HF and I have nothing against you.
I call your scum pleasing method retarded and you are the one who calls other people names.

On May 21 2014 08:06 Hapahauli wrote:
Can we stop troll voting and talk about someone that's actually scummy?

On May 21 2014 07:50 Valenius wrote:


From OP: "Town-Wincondition: Eliminate all Factions, which endanger town!"

Not necessarily all scum aligned?

On May 21 2014 08:13 Hapahauli wrote:


Are you trolling me or are you serious? Pulling publicly-available information from the OP does not make someone town.

Also, why do you have your vote on the most obvious townie in the thread?

On May 21 2014 08:29 Hapahauli wrote:


I don't think so at all. For example, it would make perfect sense in this game for a scum-aligned faction member to know that information in the OP, since they too are aware of the other factions in this game.

In general, I don't think speculating on what factions know what sort of information is wise in a closed-themed setup.

On May 21 2014 08:57 Tehpoofter wrote:


HF haha at least stop giving Steve more fuel to his HF/BH scum fire.

So who should we move onto HF?

I want to know what happened to that BKQ he came in with this post: + Show Spoiler + Marv responded actually pretty quickly: + Show Spoiler + but he never addressed him or anyone else again. Like to me seems like "going to run in throw in some scum reads ask a question appear to be analyzing the thread then peace out" Have you played with him before? (this is to everyone) What is he like?

On May 21 2014 09:03 Tehpoofter wrote:


Fair enough it is just one post but I felt that if he really cared about his answers he would have stuck around at least 2-3 minutes.

Who do you think is scummy since BH gets the crazy person yelling pass from you.

So about this whole RNG thing, aren't scum players more likely to vote for OdinofPergo if he isn't in their faction since they don't even need a reason to vote him? They can just claim they're doing it for RNG and get a lynch on someone who isn't aligned with them?

On May 21 2014 09:09 Yell0w wrote:



Well I do think my method is better, I'm new to this though and didn't realize at the time that people would be so against a RNG lynch, because obviously my method doesn't work if everyone doesn't do it.

On May 21 2014 09:08 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
My reads so far:

Jampidampi - Mafia.
Bunnies - Town.
Yellow - Town.
Koshi - Town.
BH - Town, but I don't like his RNG thingy.
Holyflare - Mafia.


I will explain if asked to explain, there's so many people, I'm too lazy to write everything up.

On May 21 2014 09:09 geript wrote:
I'm just going to go ahead and say it. Bkq.... Is probably like Vivax. I can't quit place the "confusion comment" line but like 100% that guy's a smurf.

So about this whole RNG thing, aren't scum players more likely to vote for OdinofPergo if he isn't in their faction since they don't even need a reason to vote him? They can just claim they're doing it for RNG and get a lynch on someone who isn't aligned with them?

Okay so I'm behind an RNG lynch, I understand my idea wouldn't work since people don't want to random their vote and if most don't do it it'll never work, so I'll just vote Odin. I was willing to wait for people to say why they were against it, but nobody gave a good reason not to do it, in my opinion.

##Vote: OdinofPergo

This is only true to an extent, scum still act differently due to the asymmetrical nature of information in the game and as is especially pertinent in the case of sk;s and other 1 player factions having differing win-cons.

Last I recall, saving you've gone through conversion therapy recently, you happen to like pricks.

On May 21 2014 11:27 Hapahauli wrote:


I do think you're town, but Steveling is more obvious. Ranking townies is a kinda silly game to play this early in the game though - what's important is that I'd lynch neither of you.



What's strange about it? He wants to policy lynch my top town read, and someone he should know is obviously town.

On May 21 2014 11:31 Hapahauli wrote:


It's also batshit retarded.

Who do you actually think is mafia?

On May 21 2014 11:38 Hapahauli wrote:


Ok that's better.

So why aren't you voting // writing cases on them?

On May 21 2014 11:40 Hapahauli wrote:


Yeah, but like... why...

I'd love to think you're town, but holy shit you're a better player than trying to lynch/flame-bait a player that you should know is town.

Her response is quite interesting. She does correctly analyze on scenario, that is, if I didn't have a proper read and wanted to gain more information on her. There are many others she does not think about however. What I'm most interested in, is this crucial miss: She does not at all consider a possibility where I am scum. Ding ding, alarm bells anyone?

On May 21 2014 11:48 Steveling wrote:


What should I do then?
How to be good towny?

On May 21 2014 11:55 Cephiro wrote:


How is not considering the possibility of someone voting on you being scum completely wild? She literally ignores the possibility of me being scum voting on her, as proved by her own thought process. They were my first posts in the game and I instantly pressured/attacked her. And she didn't even think of the possibility of me being scum. Like literally, all her responses screamed that I was town to her. There is no way she could be that sure I am town by just exchanging a post or two with her by that stage.

Care to elaborate on your reasoning why it's a completely wild assumption and debunks the whole case?

If I didn't consider you as mafia, why would I be voting for you?

On May 21 2014 12:08 thrawn2112 wrote:
holyflare I need you to clear something up for me

On May 21 2014 12:09 thrawn2112 wrote:


are you town?

On May 21 2014 12:14 thrawn2112 wrote:
Why do you think it's obvious that you're town?

The question you quote is intended to make her think about different possibilities. It's not me wanting her to answer in a certain why. It's clearly a question meant to make her think out of the box. Why would I vote on someone I think is town? Do you really just say "for information", and that's all? Like really.

On May 21 2014 12:18 thrawn2112 wrote:


You scum read Cav for accurately meta reading you last game, but you expect people to be correctly meta reading you right now?

On May 21 2014 12:26 mtamburini wrote:


He does deserve much more pressure youll get a better read of him, but he did do this shit last game and I tunneled on him hard to find him towny in 2 days

On May 21 2014 12:27 Cavalinho wrote:


I'll tell you on one condition:

You tell me how to link posts. Deal?

I kinda of liked the initial response to BH. Wasn't "RNG dum", but was like..."okay, so you have this idea, but why not do another thing instead?" It's not the laziest response, it's not calling him scum, it's not really doing anything other than what seems like trying to figure something out. Bueno.

On May 21 2014 12:40 27ninjabunnies wrote:
@TehPoofter: So I've read through yell0w's filter, and as I stated before, I like yellow's post here. I feel as if he was mafia, he wouldn't even bring this up, as he could follow exactly what he had spelled out.

[red]In our previous game, yell0w contradicted himself, much like he did this game, and I called him out for it. I pushed on him, which is how I got my read on him.[red] Yell0w seems to be joking a bit towards the beginning, such as his preferring a "alive cat to a dead cat" and pretty relaxed. I haven't played a game with him as mafia, but it seems like a town play to me.

I do agree that his switching to go with BH on the odin lynch is a bit weird, especially since he disagreed with it earlier, but it may just be him reassessing the game there.

He also hasn't posted much for me to get more of a read, but I'm leaning more town here.

On May 21 2014 12:45 austinmcc wrote:
Hf, do YOU think the 180 actually matters? And is there any pro-scum reason?

On May 21 2014 12:58 mtamburini wrote:


From the way many people have told me to read HF, hes prob town he seems disappointed and not having fun. I hear he enjoys being mafia 100x more than he is town.

On May 21 2014 13:05 Cephiro wrote:


I definitely agree that she is not scum for that reason alone. It's because of this combined with many other factors I pointed out. Like, what do you think of her claim of providing reasoning for her reads when she really hadn't?

On May 21 2014 07:23 27ninjabunnies wrote:
So here's where I am at.

I don't necessarily like thrawn. Not talking isn't productive for town. Whether he's stubborn town or straight up mafia, I'd lynch him in a heartbeat.

I also want to hear more from Jamp. He seems to be focussing on the 'reads' that I said I had within the first couple of pages, and then questions someone else on what they think about my reads, yet he hasn't really said anything about what he thinks. Also, why is he focussing on my reads? Not saying mine are bad, but im a new player, one he hasn't played with. So why does it matter necessarily what I think?

Tehpoofter, steve, and WOS were the ones that I were considering first out of the ones that have talked the first couple of pages, but my reads, as I'm sure you have seen since I talked about you and thrawn, have changed since then.

On May 21 2014 13:06 WaveofShadow wrote:

Why do you think me/you/marv are the forbidden ones?

On May 21 2014 13:13 Cephiro wrote:
I'm not even mad, I'm just amazed at how you think that is "reasoning for a read".

Not providing reason for her reads because they have changed = Providing reads and reasons for them.

.... Can someone teach the me the maths necessary to make the above statement true?

Like seriously Holy, are you joking?

On May 21 2014 13:21 WaveofShadow wrote:

But see obviously you have some idea because you wouldn't have had a reason for hapa to be on there over me, right?

Also, what geript?

On May 21 2014 13:33 WaveofShadow wrote:

I'm kind of interested as to how he plans to get on with this 'thing' anyway. I'm holding just short of calling it a cop-out especially since surely he know he'd be pinged by about 2000 requests, most of which he will not be able to address. I'm just a little surprised at this approach to the game because Foolishness isn't usually the kind of person who needs direction, he finds his own and rolls with it, every time.

In the end, yeah, let him get on with it etc.

HF is my vote on you for srs?

On May 21 2014 13:34 WaveofShadow wrote:

I never fully trust marv.
Ask him. I've played games with him since.

Paranoia is my 'thing,' rite?

On May 21 2014 13:34 Cephiro wrote:
General question to the players in the game:

1) Is my play more likely to come from town or scum?
2) Reasoning for the above.

Answer these if you'd like to help me get a read on you.

Top town: Meapak
Top scum: waveofshadow

On May 21 2014 12:22 thrawn2112 wrote:
cav we're lynching you d1, fucking serious

On May 21 2014 13:53 WaveofShadow wrote:
What are people's thoughts on this bunnies character?
I'm too lazy to go back and read the million posts/opinions stated thus far but first instincts tell me that anyone this excruciatingly tryhard is probably town. Cephiro had some wall on her I think...what was the TL;DR?

On May 21 2014 14:04 Tehpoofter wrote:


Why is this yellow train (or any train) so hard to get started? No one has had more than 3 votes I don't think all game. I'm going to do a ghetto vote count in a second cause there hasn't been one in awhile.

On May 21 2014 14:07 Steveling wrote:


Ask me anything.

On May 21 2014 14:19 Steveling wrote:
I don't like he bkqyads - vivax association.
What you are doing is scummy.

On May 21 2014 14:20 thrawn2112 wrote:
whatever i'm just going to afk until there's something worth talking about

On May 21 2014 14:21 Steveling wrote:


Because you have no way to know?

On May 21 2014 14:24 thrawn2112 wrote:


it's not how I like to play D1. u can call me scum or complaign about it but this is just how it's going to be. like blue said, if I don't step up during the last half of D1 then yeah I deserve whatever I get. but that's not gonna happen so there won't be any problem.

On May 21 2014 14:27 Steveling wrote:


Oh so IF it's vivax it's scummy, I see.
And how will you know if it's him?

On May 22 2014 00:37 kushm4sta wrote:
can someone write a summary or link to one?

On May 22 2014 00:44 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
Okay, here's my new reads/changed reads:

I'm not sure of the tambo push, I originally read tambo as town, but I'm not sure right now.
BKQ I don't like.
Marv I like.
Xat is my top town atm.
Steve I like.
Cav I don't like.

As always, ask me to explain if needed.

On May 21 2014 09:08 sqrtofneg1 wrote:
My reads so far:

Jampidampi - Mafia.
Bunnies - Town.
Yellow - Town.
Koshi - Town.
BH - Town, but I don't like his RNG thingy.
Holyflare - Mafia.


I will explain if asked to explain, there's so many people, I'm too lazy to write everything up.

On May 22 2014 00:50 sqrtofneg1 wrote:

???
I don't get it?

On May 22 2014 01:03 marvellosity wrote:

Should be the other way round imo, all you're describing with Wave is bad or lazy play, which a Wavemafia would probably try harder to avoid.

On May 22 2014 01:53 geript wrote:

Because I want you to make my peepee hard. Like you haven't made me want to sheep you on any of your reads. It feels like you're half assing it at best. Like I'm only half tempted to shoot you for realz; the rest of the time I just want you to be super town you so I can get a good shot. I get that you think I'm being droll, but the sound of my sonorous voice should make you interested enough.

On May 22 2014 02:13 Onegu wrote:
Ive requested to be replaced out, first game off the banlist not a good start. But with the miltary haveing declared martial law and now protesters gathering close to my home and I am afraid fighting will start my anxiety is through the roof and Im unable to concentrate.


Anyway sorry.

On May 22 2014 02:27 Steveling wrote:
HF can you provide reads pls.
I'm interested on BH and burini.

On May 22 2014 04:07 Koshi wrote:

What Kush is saying:

First you said: Everyone who said this is town
Geript replies: No, usually they are scum
Then you reply: Yes, usually but not this time.

Which is a contradiction.

On May 22 2014 04:14 Koshi wrote:

ah you probably meant the second hapa to be a sqrt

On May 22 2014 01:37 Holyflare wrote:
would lynch/need to pressure more list, some people might be added pending later activity there are a few i'm leaning on adding based on next post they make and yes 2 of them are like modkill pplz

10. MysterMeat1 - modkillable
11. Alakaslam - too serious, defensive, and not trolly enough
19. Steveling - literally doing 0 things, honestly don't care how many pages of 0 things he has because it's still 0 (probs town but /care)
25. austinmcc - "off", asking bh questions of rng, superficially reading people when asked and that's about it
26. Onegu - modkillable - wait and see from replacement
29. bkqyrldp - hydra, one head trying to account for reads of other head, attacking weird people (think it's toad+someone)
31. layabout - not much said, defends and thinks bunnies is suspicious in same post, weird faction talk -scum points for UK


people contemplating adding:

4. kushm4sta - nothing really said...... lazy kush or scum kush?
5. Blazinghand - rng........ feel like voting for inevitable role claim standard bh -.- claimed blue can't lynch/won't lynch
13. Valenius - awaiting non-literal shit posting his big post just now shows that he's actually participating and looking at scummy people
14. thrawn2112 - activity indicator in later posts
18. kitaman27 - done nothing really, still done nothing
23. mtamburini - only one post of substance that ended in no substance, kind of agree with foolishness post but want to know more before adding

On May 22 2014 04:29 sqrtofneg1 wrote:

A bit of a meta read. I hosted Yuma, and the tone of your posts are different. Here, it's a bit more.... carefree... or something. I sensed that something was a bit off. Gut read, I guess.
Plus taking 3 minutes to say ya was interesting too.

On May 22 2014 04:38 sqrtofneg1 wrote:

I disagreed with your read on steveling.
Plus this:

You haven't really proven yourself town when you said that.

On May 22 2014 04:40 Steveling wrote:


You said multiple times that I'm town.

On May 22 2014 04:42 sqrtofneg1 wrote:

Near the beginning of the game, no, you were saying that steveling was mafia.

On May 22 2014 04:51 bkqyrldp wrote:
I don't think BH's claim makes him town, but lynching him today would still be bad play. Having said that, his only mafia reads both look town to me; Odin for his first post, tone and the confidence when he states he has done more in 5 posts than BH in 3 filter pages. BH's reasons for thinking Geript are particularly laughable and look opportunistic. It doesn't look like he actually bothered to read Geript's filter. Anyway, not a priority today.

Jampi still looks bad for the reasons the other head mentioned, as does Austin for fluffy and underwhelming content, in contrast with what I've seen from him as town recently. Essentially all of his reads so far have been in response to someone specifically asking him for them rather him being proactive.

On May 22 2014 05:01 Steveling wrote:
HF you really think foolishness play is towny?

On May 22 2014 05:08 marvellosity wrote:

I went to work out my sexy bum and abs. These things don't maintain themselves you know.

On May 22 2014 05:46 bkqyrldp wrote:
Austin needs to stop enabling this stupid RNG discussion. And HF needs to stop pestering sqrt who is likely towny.

People on top of my lynch list currently are jampi ritoky and austin. I'd like marv HF and fool to comment on those 3 for me. And austin in case you are town you can start doing something useful and comment on the other 2.

On May 21 2014 12:33 layabout wrote:

Her posts are logically consistent and represent a reasonable approach to the game particularly for a new player - not wanting to call people scum before you are confident or have had enough time to make an argument that is worth consideration by others. Her tone is generally good and her posting is on the productive side as far as the thread goes.

However Your point that she does not consider that you are scum voting for her is significant. She immediately talks to you as if she thinks you are town which is not the typical reaction to being voted for. The interpreting your vote as a mafia read could just be how ninja uses language but it also suggests guilt.

And that is my opinion on you case.

Pls shoot people that post like austin's hula stuff, it's tempting to go with gut scum reads but town kp is our only way to effectively deal with that crap and in large games the tone of the thread and proportion of inactives and shitposters has a ridiculous impact.

On May 22 2014 05:46 bkqyrldp wrote:
Austin needs to stop enabling this stupid RNG discussion. And HF needs to stop pestering sqrt who is likely towny.

People on top of my lynch list currently are jampi ritoky and austin. I'd like marv HF and fool to comment on those 3 for me. And austin in case you are town you can start doing something useful and comment on the other 2.

On May 22 2014 06:04 bkqyrldp wrote:
HF, take a look at jampi's 3 other games as town. The way he enters the thread as townie is much more inquisitive. This game the aggression and suspicion throwing he uses is way over the top and unwarranted. It looks fake. Unfortunatelly I can't find a mafia game of his to back this up more.

On May 22 2014 06:07 Alakaslam wrote:

Where did this happen?

On May 22 2014 07:48 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
@BH: it's only supposed to be for D1, the point is since you're such a mafia god it shouldn't be too hard to get your primary only scum read lynched, especially now that you've claimed and are clearly, totally innocent.


People I think could definitely be red:
Layabout
Val

People I don't have good feelings about:
Slam
Bunnies

One of these three is probably red but I don't feel like figuring it out atm:
Steve
HF
Hapa

Look at these people wave, that should give you something at least.

On May 22 2014 08:03 Hapahauli wrote:


Steveling would be a terrible lynch. I get that you don't like his play, and his play is very spammy, but it's also very clearly town. Just because his spam is "contentless" doesn't mean it isn't genuine. Look at some of his other games - he plays like that all the time.

On May 22 2014 08:06 Holyflare wrote:


where are you gettin this info from? The database only has 2 of his games in it and they are both scum,

Surprisingly Normal Mini Mafia VII Mafia Framer Survived
Cell Mini Mafia Mafia Vanilla Survived Day 3

The only game he's played town in is in yuma where he was just spammy because he thought he caught someone and was being stubborn. I get that he looks towny this game but why are you implying this is "obvious town meta"?

On May 22 2014 07:12 Alakaslam wrote:

But we claimed not roles, but names. So here is te thing; it is WIFOM for scum. Who do they shoot? Me? BH? Why? What if we are doc saves? What if we are docs- therefore the perfect shot?

See what happened here is we claimed "blue". But what does that let out to scum that can't be nullified by other blues in a game this size? Now if BH was not BH but rather some newb and said "folks I b doc" now that is sstupid.

Because then scum is like "o g thanks"

But as it is scum is like "YES WE HAVE TWO POWER ROLES CLAIMED LETS SHOOT" and then the other guy says "no stfu you idiot they could be veterans, we need stack shots" and other guy says "u fill of shut they are fakeclaiming" and another guy says "someone actually dying is more important. BH is a strong player so you know doc saves will be on him, but we don't want Alakaslam dead too early because we need our lylo lynch, so shoot outside those two"

And the qt gets hard to read XD

On May 22 2014 08:28 Hapahauli wrote:


Wait dafuq? Where did I ever say he had an "obvious town meta?" My read is more objective than anything else.

Anyway, the town game I did look at from him is...
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/449650-glory-seeker-mini-mafia

The TL Database isn't always complete or up to date. When I look at the difference between his mafia and town games, he's just so much more carefree/hyper/reckless in his town games. His mafia games are certainly active, but surprizingly placid.

On May 22 2014 08:27 Valenius wrote:


looked through his filter.. can't see anything before the post you just quoted.

there's just a lot about princess peach, beets, hula hoops and i think he went into yoda mode halfway through.

On May 22 2014 08:34 27ninjabunnies wrote:
Can someone tell me what's with Geript and the Scumeling thing?

I suppose he is referring to Steveling here?

On May 22 2014 08:39 layabout wrote:
This is a surprise to me but i am actually angry.

I am not sure if i can be bothered to deal with being under pressure for so long because marv can't read me and people listen to him. Is it worth explaining why you are all wrong? Should i ignore it and try to get someone lynched even though i have just about read the thread? Do i commit intellectual self harm and continue watching heroes after the first season?

On May 22 2014 08:42 geript wrote:

He's not scum but he's not town. I'm pretty sure he's like 3rd party.

On May 22 2014 09:02 layabout wrote:

I have limited access i was around at the start when most of the thread was shit. I tried to respond to the relevant bits but i was not reading the thread particularly closely because there isn't much of value around. I get back and a bullshit wagon that only started because i wasn't around when the thread started to get better and because entering a thread that is stacked against you is not all that fun because no one listens to you and very few people will look at what you say the way they should once they start to think you are scummy even if their suspicious were originally quite shaky.

marv is right in that i was avoiding taking a stance but that was mostly because i try to be careful at the super early stages and don't like taking stances when i haven't made my mind up, which if you have been reading (unlikely i know) is actually really ironic. cephiros case was the only thing in the thread that i thought was important he asked for opinions and i offered one. But because i didn't end with i" think ninja bunny is ___ so we should(n't) lynch her" i get this.

On May 22 2014 08:02 Holyflare wrote:


can you explain this crazy unexplained thing?

On May 22 2014 09:21 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:

Simple, ya'll have been pretty aggressively shitting up the thread (or at least it seems that way to me) and I figure one of you is probably scum. Time will sort it out so I'm not going lynch hunting in that clusterfuck right now.

On May 22 2014 09:25 27ninjabunnies wrote:
So I'm stepping away from the thread to be all girly and fawn over Jensen Ackles and Jared Padelecki from supernatural. I'll be checking thread periodically, so if you need me, yell

On May 22 2014 09:27 WaveofShadow wrote:

I actually don't mind it.
Y u so scum holy

On May 22 2014 09:50 geript wrote:
So why is everyone defending Scumeling saying he's produced content. He hasn't. There is not a single redeeming post in his filter. There is not an original thought in his filter. He has done nothing... Lots of nothing. Same for BH. BH has done nothing. Lots of nothing. They're both according to themselves great players capable of single handedly wrecking a scum team. Valenius' shit posting (in the literal not figurative sense) has produced more than both those players combined. Yet people aren't interested in lynching either BH or Scumeling. I don't get it.