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On December 27 2013 14:06 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Because you job as a leader is to send 3 townies on a mission. You knowing your alignment why would you not send yourself?
Because it gives me the opportunity to share my reads and have people discuss them. I can say all I want about people being townie but it never becomes concrete until I send them on a mission.
If I send myself, we only get to talk about the alignment of 3 people.
If I don't send myself, we get to talk about the alignment of 4 people. Myself + the 3 others I sent.
Of course the drawback is that we aren't able to discern the leader's alignment as accurately after the mission fails/succeeds, but I think both approaches are valid ways of picking teams.
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Why would we talk only about those people's alignment who are sent in the mission?
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On December 27 2013 14:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Why would we talk only about those people's alignment who are sent in the mission?
Because when I say, "I'm thinking of sending A/B/C", that means we are supposed to talk about A, B, and C when we decide to accept/reject the team.
There are other times where we discuss everyone's alignment (such as after a mission), but for accepting/rejecting teams, I don't understand why we would publicly evaluate anyone else besides the town status of the people that the leader chose and the town status of the leader himself.
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Oh god, i hope you drop that line of thinking if you are town. We are supposed to discuss everyone's alignment regardless of what the team leader is going to send. Strongest townreads should go, on D1 that means you should send yourself, because you are your strongest townread, and there is no concrete information of anyone's scumminess/towniness (i mean voting patterns & mission results to analyze).
Even if you have a weak townread on someone who is being put on the mission that does not mean you should automatically pass that without discussion, you need to suggest your strongest townreads. After D1 that somewhat changes but the first mission.. There is no reason to not nominate yourself if you are town, absolutely none.
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On December 27 2013 14:25 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Oh god, i hope you drop that line of thinking if you are town. We are supposed to discuss everyone's alignment regardless of what the team leader is going to send. Strongest townreads should go, on D1 that means you should send yourself, because you are your strongest townread, and there is no concrete information of anyone's scumminess/towniness (i mean voting patterns & mission results to analyze).
Even if you have a weak townread on someone who is being put on the mission that does not mean you should automatically pass that without discussion, you need to suggest your strongest townreads. After D1 that somewhat changes but the first mission.. There is no reason to not nominate yourself if you are town, absolutely none.
So you are saying my line of reasoning is only invalid for D1?
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Basically yes.
After D1 that somewhat changes.
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On December 27 2013 13:19 raynpelikoneet wrote:So everybody is basically saying the same thing over and over again. There are 6 townies. If you exclude yourself there are 5 townies. Even the last missions require only max 5 people. You can select an all town team even if you exclude yourself. Therefore, in case you are considered not necessarily town and your team would be refused if you are in it, it's better to select other people. If you select a team which gets 8 nay votes, it tells us nothing. Voting patterns are the most important thing (obviously besides mission results) in this game because there are no flips. Anyone who refuses to cooperate in mission selection as a leader and pushes through a selection that is doomed to get a fuckton of nay votes should not go a mission. That's what i think. Show nested quote +On December 27 2013 12:08 Chairman Ray wrote:
There are definitely situations where the leader would not put himself in. It would probably be best to analyse this case by case when these kinds of situations arise, because I always find that people suggesting sub-optimal teams, getting rejected, and letting the next good team pass gives more information than people doing the right play in the first place. We get information for why they chose the team, who approved the team, and who rejected it.
Anyways, other than Koshi who wants to be in, are there any other suggestions on who should be sent on the first mission? Since it's the first one, I'm alright with any team that goes in. I think you are scum because of this. In 5 pl setup this works because it's actually better to pass the first mission as scum, in 9 pl setup this is different and not necessarily true. Seems to me like an attempt to stop the conversation before it even started. CR - Does Koshi seem town to you? Why?
Why does not asserting for myself or a specific person to go on the first mission mean I'm scum? Is the logic that since scum will want to fail the first mission, then if I am town, I need to get into the mission to reduce the chances that there will be scum in there?
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On December 27 2013 14:41 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Basically yes.
After D1 that somewhat changes.
Ok, I can compromise with you there. Of course I'm not picking first so I don't know what you mean by "I hope you stop thinking like this if you are town". No need to attack me for hypotheticals
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On December 27 2013 14:48 Corazon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2013 14:41 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Basically yes.
After D1 that somewhat changes. Ok, I can compromise with you there. Of course I'm not picking first so I don't know what you mean by "I hope you stop thinking like this if you are town". No need to attack me for hypotheticals
I don't know if you have played Resistance before. What i do know is you are (were?) working on wrong mindset. I don't care if you continue that if you're scum, i do care if you continue doing that if you are town because it makes you scummy to me.
Make your own decisions and have your own opinions, disagree if you disagree. But if you do so i want you to reason yourself.
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On December 27 2013 14:44 Chairman Ray wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2013 13:19 raynpelikoneet wrote:So everybody is basically saying the same thing over and over again. There are 6 townies. If you exclude yourself there are 5 townies. Even the last missions require only max 5 people. You can select an all town team even if you exclude yourself. Therefore, in case you are considered not necessarily town and your team would be refused if you are in it, it's better to select other people. If you select a team which gets 8 nay votes, it tells us nothing. Voting patterns are the most important thing (obviously besides mission results) in this game because there are no flips. Anyone who refuses to cooperate in mission selection as a leader and pushes through a selection that is doomed to get a fuckton of nay votes should not go a mission. That's what i think. On December 27 2013 12:08 Chairman Ray wrote:
There are definitely situations where the leader would not put himself in. It would probably be best to analyse this case by case when these kinds of situations arise, because I always find that people suggesting sub-optimal teams, getting rejected, and letting the next good team pass gives more information than people doing the right play in the first place. We get information for why they chose the team, who approved the team, and who rejected it.
Anyways, other than Koshi who wants to be in, are there any other suggestions on who should be sent on the first mission? Since it's the first one, I'm alright with any team that goes in. I think you are scum because of this. In 5 pl setup this works because it's actually better to pass the first mission as scum, in 9 pl setup this is different and not necessarily true. Seems to me like an attempt to stop the conversation before it even started. CR - Does Koshi seem town to you? Why? Why does not asserting for myself or a specific person to go on the first mission mean I'm scum? Is the logic that since scum will want to fail the first mission, then if I am town, I need to get into the mission to reduce the chances that there will be scum in there?
You are supposed to suggest an all town team, for every mission.
You don't seem to be giving any shits who goes onto a mission 1 and who doesn't. It's not only results and voting that wins the game, it's the discussion behind picks and people's responses on top of that.
What you said was basically "just pick some people who want to go on a mission and let's get over with it".
That's scummy.
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Adam if you needed to decide the team now who'd you pick?
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On December 27 2013 15:02 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2013 14:44 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 27 2013 13:19 raynpelikoneet wrote:So everybody is basically saying the same thing over and over again. There are 6 townies. If you exclude yourself there are 5 townies. Even the last missions require only max 5 people. You can select an all town team even if you exclude yourself. Therefore, in case you are considered not necessarily town and your team would be refused if you are in it, it's better to select other people. If you select a team which gets 8 nay votes, it tells us nothing. Voting patterns are the most important thing (obviously besides mission results) in this game because there are no flips. Anyone who refuses to cooperate in mission selection as a leader and pushes through a selection that is doomed to get a fuckton of nay votes should not go a mission. That's what i think. On December 27 2013 12:08 Chairman Ray wrote:
There are definitely situations where the leader would not put himself in. It would probably be best to analyse this case by case when these kinds of situations arise, because I always find that people suggesting sub-optimal teams, getting rejected, and letting the next good team pass gives more information than people doing the right play in the first place. We get information for why they chose the team, who approved the team, and who rejected it.
Anyways, other than Koshi who wants to be in, are there any other suggestions on who should be sent on the first mission? Since it's the first one, I'm alright with any team that goes in. I think you are scum because of this. In 5 pl setup this works because it's actually better to pass the first mission as scum, in 9 pl setup this is different and not necessarily true. Seems to me like an attempt to stop the conversation before it even started. CR - Does Koshi seem town to you? Why? Why does not asserting for myself or a specific person to go on the first mission mean I'm scum? Is the logic that since scum will want to fail the first mission, then if I am town, I need to get into the mission to reduce the chances that there will be scum in there? You are supposed to suggest an all town team, for every mission. You don't seem to be giving any shits who goes onto a mission 1 and who doesn't. It's not only results and voting that wins the game, it's the discussion behind picks and people's responses on top of that. What you said was basically "just pick some people who want to go on a mission and let's get over with it". That's scummy.
I don't agree with that, but we can revisit this subject on day 2 if you want.
Anyway, we need to get some picks on the table. If Adam doesn't have any solid picks right now, we can throw some names on the table to discuss, and if Adam agrees, then he can put them up for a vote.
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Exactly what do you not agree with?
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If everyone no vote first team I nominate myself Rayn and Cora for first mission EZPZ.
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Why not Koshi? That guy is totes town.
But ok. I guess rayn is townish and can carry town later. Cora was the first in this game to be critical so I guess that can be townish.
And if VE cora and rayn are all town I really wont have to do anything this game except convince rayn I am town.
So I might vote yes to that team.
Yay town! Which Koshi is a part off.
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On December 27 2013 07:22 FirmTofu wrote:
Day 1: Phase 1
Mission Leader Adam4167 must propose a team of 3 players to head the first mission. He may include himself. The mission will fail if there is at least 1 sabotage.
If the mission leader proposes a team in this thread, it is FINAL. We will immediately move to phase 2 of Day 1.
Ok, let me ask a simple question so the scummers can look like they are contributing.
How does the voting thingie work?
1) Leader proposes team. (Phase 1)
2) All peepz vote yay or nay, majority wins? (Phase 2)
3) if nay we go back to Phase 1 with new leader, if yay we go into nightphase.
Am I correct?
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On December 27 2013 15:04 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Adam if you needed to decide the team now who'd you pick?
If I had to send a team right this second - i'd be sending myself, hopeless and probably yourself.
The way hopeless approached the 'leaders voting putting themselves on teams' showed more conviction and confidence than his entire filter in LXIII. While I might not agree with what he was saying, he explained himself well.
You seem pretty invested in the game so far, not afraid to attack people and make waves. Your thoughts on what has been discussed up until now seem to mirror my own so that bodes well for you being town.
VE, do you intend on doing something other than one-liners this game?
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On December 27 2013 18:48 Koshi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2013 07:22 FirmTofu wrote:
Day 1: Phase 1
Mission Leader Adam4167 must propose a team of 3 players to head the first mission. He may include himself. The mission will fail if there is at least 1 sabotage.
If the mission leader proposes a team in this thread, it is FINAL. We will immediately move to phase 2 of Day 1. Ok, let me ask a simple question so the scummers can look like they are contributing. How does the voting thingie work? 1) Leader proposes team. (Phase 1) 2) All peepz vote yay or nay, majority wins? (Phase 2) 3) if nay we go back to Phase 1 with new leader, if yay we go into nightphase. Am I correct?
I believe that to be the case, yes. Majority wins. If not, we go back to phase 1.
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Oh hi Adam. Why are you not selecting Koshi?
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Frankly, I don't see anything in your filter that gives me the slightest clue to your alignment.
Which in itself is probably a tell.
Do something useful instead of professing your towniness repeatedly.
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EPT
