/in I will not break the rules Bluelightz has set out
A Bluelightz Mafia "The Attack"
Forum Index > TL Mafia |
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/in I will not break the rules Bluelightz has set out | ||
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I'm hoping we can start Day 1 off constructively with lots of discussion and no fluff. Anyone out there yet? | ||
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On July 20 2013 15:19 getmoript wrote: What sort of things do you want to discuss? Are you mafia? | ||
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On July 20 2013 23:00 TanGeng wrote: FiveTouch is Marv/VE? We must lynch this Redville scum and take revenge for the mayor!!! Down with FirmTofu!!!! Up with SilkenTofu!!! Constructively discussing? Are we dreaming about a different type of forum mafia. If we wanted constructive discussion, might as well lop off about 24 hours of time and get closer to the voting deadline. Beginning of games is always fluffy and I like fluffy. Fluff=bad You get scum points, sir. On July 21 2013 03:32 getmoript wrote: You wanna say something alignment indicative for me. Because otherwise I really want to lynch you because both Hydras can't be town. Why can't both hydras be town? You get scum points, sir. On July 21 2013 04:02 getmoript wrote: Are you an idiot Marv or just scum? I told you I can't read you versus shit. I read people far better when I've followed/played in more games with them. Hell I still don't have a read on you in Ver's game. You just mad because I'm more gay ripped than you? Why would you want to glean information from only one half of the hydra? Why are you asking for less information to work with? You get scum points, sir. On July 21 2013 05:39 raynpelikoneet wrote: Yeah WoS, i am scum, what was the point of your question? I don't think there is anything scummy in thread atm. Just stopped working and read the thread. Lemme drink a couple of beers so i can start playing. ^^ Oats why are you so silent? You claimed scum. You get scum points, sir. On July 21 2013 06:36 raynpelikoneet wrote: I think Austin is town. I am so confused. You think Austin is town but you don't explain what makes you think that why. Why say it at all? You get scum points, sir. | ||
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On July 21 2013 07:48 TheAwesomeAll wrote: FirmTofu gets what this game is about, just talk about how good of a townie you are and spam your post count up! Also this new hydra thing is anoying as hell. I have 3 posts in the entire thread. Someone's angry about something. | ||
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On July 21 2013 08:03 getmoript wrote: Tofu what are you trying to do with that post? Trying to decide who to place my vote on. I'm not sure if I should vote you or rayn. Help me decide maybe? | ||
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On July 21 2013 08:04 austinmcc wrote: Are scum points indicators that someone is scum or points that the scum team gives out for posts they like? Dunno, you tell me. Do you think I'm scum? | ||
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On July 21 2013 08:05 getmoript wrote: You're being suspicious of 3 people early without having anything actually scummy from any of them. Just seems like you're trying to push random bullshit suspicion for no reason. Well, to me, it looks like I'm trying to find scum. Care to address my points instead of calling it bullshit suspicion? Thanks, bud. | ||
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On July 21 2013 08:17 TheAwesomeAll wrote: i know this magic trick where i get scum to post when i call them out. wanna see it? Yeah, go for it. On July 21 2013 08:21 austinmcc wrote: Ummm, if they're points that the scum team gives out, then yes. Big ol' scumslip. Scum puntos are points people get when they do scummy things yo. | ||
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On July 21 2013 08:27 getmoript wrote: Explain how they're scummy instead of just early game play. ~g Why would early game play be considered mutually exclusive with scummy play? | ||
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On July 21 2013 11:24 getmoript wrote: If there's a goddamn vigilante in this game and you shoot at all in this game I swear I will rage so fucking hard against you in the post game it's not even going to be goddamn funny. Closed setup. Nothing fucking known. Don't fucking kill town. I don't want another fucking repeat of Nuclear. I fucking hate playing as town because I always fucking lose. Goddamn this shit. You sound angry. Would you be against the vigilante shooting unproductive members of town such as lurkers? Or would you want the vigilante not to shoot at all? | ||
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On July 21 2013 12:10 getmoript wrote: I'd like vigilantes to shoot scum if they do shoot, I don't care if they shoot the lurker scum or the active scum. But if they fucking shoot town then RAQAAAAGASDSDGAGGE How do you expect the vigilante to know whether a lurker is scum or not? Let me ask you a more direct question: Would you want a vigilante to shoot JJ right now? | ||
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On July 21 2013 12:40 getmoript wrote: I'll speak up on this one. I personally would not. JJD is lynchbait in the games in which I've seen him, and though his activity is often subject to his schedule or general lurkiness, he at least attempts to contribute most of the time. It hasn't even been 24h yet so I would not consider it a productive shot. I would, however consider lynching him atm if nothing changes as I personally would rather eliminate a lurker/player I don't want at LYLO than risk mislynching a more active player with no strong scumread to go on (I have no strong scumreads atm). FirmTofu. Who is scum? Well, right now I'm thinking geript is scum and WoS is town. My brain hurts... | ||
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On July 21 2013 09:52 getmoript wrote: Because the early opening/foreplay stage of the game is generally just that. Why are you even thinking think that shit like that even alignment indicative? You just said... Scummy. Nothing else. Not even explain why it makes us scummy. Just trying to throw out pointless accusations without follow with pressure or trying to push a lynch. Why are you playing so passively in comparison to nuclear, Ver's game or the newbies? This is passive to you? I may be less active, but I'm certainly not passive. All I've been doing is attacking people this game. I've already made plenty of enemies, haven't I? I think you're just angry that you're one of the people I'm attacking. On July 21 2013 12:37 getmoript wrote: I expect the vigilante to be able to hunt scum. Shooting town is unacceptable. No save the shot. Lynch him. He's hosting a game, he's might be playing in another on this site. He's in a different (non-mafia game) and he's almost never active on weekends under any situation. On July 21 2013 12:40 getmoript wrote: I'll speak up on this one. I personally would not. JJD is lynchbait in the games in which I've seen him, and though his activity is often subject to his schedule or general lurkiness, he at least attempts to contribute most of the time. It hasn't even been 24h yet so I would not consider it a productive shot. I would, however consider lynching him atm if nothing changes as I personally would rather eliminate a lurker/player I don't want at LYLO than risk mislynching a more active player with no strong scumread to go on (I have no strong scumreads atm). FirmTofu. Who is scum? I don't understand why lynching to you guys is preferable to shooting. A shot would eliminate an unproductive player instantly and allow our Day discussions to continue productively. If we pursue him as a lynch, we'd have to give up the opportunity to discuss something else. The opportunity cost of lynching a lurker is higher than the opportunity cost of shooting a lurker, if you catch my drift. On July 21 2013 12:47 getmoript wrote: Unacceptable. Geript and I clearly agree on the question you asked. How is it you come to different conclusions based on our answers? -Wave It's more that I WoS sounds like he's thinking from a scum perspective whereas geript sounds like he is pursuing some sort of agenda. Part of it is the tone of the post and part of it was the reasoning. I'm still undecided on where I'd place your Hydra's alignment. I don't think I'll be pursuing a lynch on you today. | ||
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On July 21 2013 15:05 JarJarDrinks wrote: Do you care to hear what I've been doing IRL? I doubt it. My name was first mentioned a while ago. If I waited untill people started voting for me, you would have said the same thing. My entry into the thread isn't suspicious dude. I was asking because I wanted to know. I literally had no idea how they worked untill this game. You're really jumping on me for nonsense. stay tuned This post is extremely defensive, unnaturally so. JJD could have just brushed off this accusations lightly, but it seems like he's responding a bit strongly. | ||
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On July 22 2013 05:48 getmoript wrote: I don't think he ever gave any answers. Also, what do you think of Tofu trying to pursue a lynch on me? Can you read the last line of my post, please? Thanks, bud. I know reading comprehension is hard. | ||
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On July 21 2013 20:06 raynpelikoneet wrote: FT, how do these things you pointed out about me make me mafia? They don't necessarily make you mafia. I never said they do. I was pointing out all the places where people did scummy things. Town can obviously do scummy things too, by mistake. Now you will probably ask me, "How are any of the things that you pointed out that I did scummy?" 1) Claiming scum sarcastically is scummy to me. I think it indicates inherent guilt. You probably disagree. 2) When you say someone is town to you, I expect a follow up explaining why. Why would you just throw a town read into the thread as town without explaining why? If a townie is talking about his reads, he should be informative and thorough. There should be very little that you feel you need to hide from us. | ||
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On July 22 2013 05:55 raynpelikoneet wrote: So who do you want to lynch FirmTofu? And you ahvn't still answered me. I'll let you know soon, I'm still deciding. Don't have any strong scum reads like I usually do. There aren't enough posts to implicate someone beyond a reasonable doubt, unfortunately. I'm going to have to pick an educated guess. | ||
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On July 22 2013 05:08 getmoript wrote: Also @whoever's around... What do you think of TAA completely ignoring any sort of points on JJD and barely touching on Tofu? This is a good point. TAA, can you give us your thoughts on me and JJD? Any reason why you're ignoring us? | ||
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Useless People: jrkirby Zephirdd DoctorHelvetica Oatsmaster Semi-Useless People: TanGeng austinmcc Active but Useless: TheAwesomeAll JarJarDinks This is embarrassing. Absolutely disgusting. More than half the town isn't contributing in a meaningful way. I am going to vote for one of these people, probably someone on the useless list. I think I'd be willing to give Zeph the benefit of the doubt because he's about to be replaced. | ||
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##Vote: Oatsmaster | ||
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On July 22 2013 06:25 getmoript wrote: Why does JJD get an "active but useless" title over Dr.H? Why is TanG semi-useless instead of useless? That post makes no sense to me at all in how you came to put people where you put them. Explain. Ah, you're right JDD doesn't have many posts. You can move him to useless. TanG at least posted thoughts about the thread, making him semi-useless but not completely useless. | ||
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Useless People: jrkirby Zephirdd DoctorHelvetica Oatsmaster TanGeng JarJarDinks Semi-Useless People: austinmcc TheAwesomeAll | ||
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On July 22 2013 06:42 getmoript wrote: LOL. So you want to continue to post random lists w/o any actual thought put behind who's where. ~g How are they random? It's pretty obvious that all of the people on my list are lurking/useless. | ||
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On July 22 2013 06:45 raynpelikoneet wrote: Hey let's just lynch FirmTofu. He has no scumreads, he is calling out scummy behaviour but apparently that does not make people scum!?!?!?!? He makes useless lists that are also wrong in the first place (lol). How can you honestl justify a lynch on me when there are people who haven't even started playing the game? Seriously? I'm trying to find scum and some people are just goofing off not doing anything and you think I'm the mafia? | ||
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On July 22 2013 06:53 getmoript wrote: Because anyone could've made those lists from any alignment. There's no real thought put into reading who's where and why. Some of those I have leans on in different directions but you can't even seem to find a favor as to which you want to lynch other than Oats for weird random reasons which don't differentiate him from the other lurkers. Of course anyone could have made those lists from any alignment! That's not the point at all. People asked for who I'd like to lynch and this is my answer. I have already justified why, so now it is your job to convince me otherwise. I picked Oats pretty much randomly. I could have easily picked any of the other lurkers. Do you want to lynch any of the other people on the list? If so, who and why? Convince me. | ||
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Active players are more likely to continue being active and have more chances to slip up. Considering the high percentage of lurkers, we should be focusing on that group of people first. I wouldn't be surprised if the entire scum team is hiding there, laughing at us while we accuse one another. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler [TanG's Timeline] + On July 22 2013 09:08 TanGeng wrote: Hey all, got back and looking through the thread as the deadline starts to get closer. Let's go look over the who might look like a surer lynch among the actives. If no clear candidate, let's go with an inactive. TanGeng is stating how he prioritizes his actions. Actives first, inactives second. We need to remember this. On July 22 2013 09:27 TanGeng wrote: I'm not even the most inactive in this game Fuck! This is going to be bad for town. At this point I'm looking at the most active filter: getmoript. All this stuff looks townie for me right now. He's established a town read on getmoript. I would assume he would move on to the next active person to look at based on his previous post explaining that he wants to look at actives before inactives. On July 22 2013 09:45 TanGeng wrote: I'm going to vote for JJD at this point, an initial pressure/suspicion vote. Getript suggests that we should be lynching him. A bit later, he shows up for a short little post about Tofu and then promptly goes to sleep. As getript suggests "convenient." Also 5T, what are you doing leaving me off your lists!!! You too Tofu!!! I am useless. Totally useless. What? This is so off. Why is he suddenly on JJD? I thought he was filter diving active players? Why does he want to pressure someone when there are so few hours left in the day? We need to be voting our scummiest reads at this point, not pressure voting people. On July 22 2013 10:46 TanGeng wrote: Really austinmc. What do I say about 5T's omission of my name or what ever else TAA said!? Interesting, you left me off your lists? Interesting? What would be so interesting about it? From my point of view, as vanilla town, it's just stupid and I called out both 5T and Tofu for it. Why is it stupid to YOU if we leave out you on our list of lurkers? If you know you are town, then you should know that we are leaving out a townie. Why would should that arouse suspicion to you specifically? It should only be suspicious to a third party because they don't know our alignments and could suspect that 5T and I are leaving you out because we are your scumbuddies. Also, why are you claiming? Sounds like a cheap trick to get people off your ass. VT's shouldn't be claiming Vt right now. They need to be looking as pro-town as possible to try and take a hit from the mafia. Blues shouldn't be claiming VT either because that would just confuse town more than it would help. So basically, claiming VT as town is a bad decision no matter what your role actually is. | ||
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On July 22 2013 12:18 austinmcc wrote: Do you have an ETA on the reads? I'm super interested in sleep, but would really like to see your thoughts here and then I will give some minor thoughts and then maybe we can lynch scum and i can go to sleep. I'm not sure if you're talking to me here, but TanGeng is definitely my top scum read now. There's plenty of people I don't like for lurking, but if I had to pick someone to be mafia, TG would be my guy. This is evidenced by my recent vote on him. | ||
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On July 22 2013 12:26 austinmcc wrote: Was talking to getmoript there. Apparently there's a post a-brewin'. But since you responded, I feel bad. I will give you my fourth child. *hands over a box of condoms* | ||
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At least we can rest easy that all the assholes who haven't voted yet are going to be warned about their behavior at the very least. I hate inactive games >< | ||
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On July 22 2013 14:32 getmoript wrote: Because of uber lurkage can we get the voting changed to plurality? 5 players are even voting and its really unfair to everyone to try and force every voting player to vote for the same person to just get a lynch? Alternatively could you just insta-mod kill the lurkers so that we can actually play a game? Changing the rules on whim defeats the integrity of the game. I support insta-mod kill, though. | ||
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On July 22 2013 14:35 JarJarDrinks wrote: I actually didn't realize the whole majority vote thing. No I wont throw my vote away. If the wagons are TG and oats I'd rather go w/ TG. I hate the fact that both my scumreads are pushing this but it's better then no-lynch. changing to TG Sleeping now. see y'all tomorrow Thanks for not being a douchebag, yo. | ||
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On July 22 2013 14:51 getmoript wrote: I wouldn't mind a game restart or something, allow a little more time for signups and maybe we can get some people who actually give a flying fuck. I second this. | ||
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On July 22 2013 14:56 FiveTouch wrote: wat I thought self-voting is allowed. I read the rulez. It specifically says it isn't, now that I read it. 4. You may not vote for yourself. You may not vote for anyone dead or outside the game. | ||
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AHHHHHH | ||
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It's obviously DrH, TG, and jrkirby. | ||
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First things first: lynch TanGeng. Push reads. Probably still lynch DrH. Push Reads. Decide whether Oats/jrkirby/TAA/someone else is the last mafia. | ||
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On July 22 2013 15:19 Oatsmaster wrote: i dont want to super lurk, circumstances have forced me into this position. Oh, the circumstances being that you rolled mafia this game? | ||
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Vigi him if you have to. Stop wasting time talking to him. For the lynch tomorrow, TG is the only viable choice. He's been scummy all game long and needs to be exterminated. His death would also provide us invaluable information about jrk and DrH, maybe even Oats. As for where discussion should go..., I think we should be talking about people like TAA and JJD, maybe rayn as well. There are people who are currently sitting in the null-scum territory for me and are likely to scumslip when pressured. I'm going to go through their filters and see if I can find some dirt on them. | ||
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Onegu claiming vig doesn't make sense from a scum perspective. Why would scum ever claim? Their whole goal is to lie low. Onegu looks like town who made a newb mistake. I highly doubt he orchestrated this whole claim just for town cred. | ||
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Are people told whether they are naive/paranoid/sane/insane when they receive their roles? How useful is a cop's accusation when we cannot trust their sanity? I don't think lynching TAA based solely on getmoript's claim is the best course of action. If we think TAA is scummy AND we have getmoript's claim to back it up, I don't mind lynching him. Back to scumhunting. I'm going to ignore the cop claims for now because in NW, I tried to setup speculate and that fucked me over. I don't want to simply assume that two cops can't exist. My scumreads are TG, jrkirby, and TAA. TG claimed he was roleblocked. This is not alignment indicative. He was scummy yesterday and nothing has changed to sway my opinion in the other direction. I will talk more about jrkirby and TAA in a few additional posts. | ||
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On July 22 2013 11:22 jrkirby wrote: Ok, I'm on a train back and it has internet. I've got 2 hours of power left, so lets see how much scumhunting I can do in that time. I've read the thread, and I got slight scumreads on rayn and TAA. I'm gonna dive their filters now and see if I was just imagining it. If you want me to look at something in particular, let me know. I kinda skimmed the thread, so I might've missed a bit. Really, sorry, this was a hectic and awesome trip, but I'll be back to normal activity on monday. His first scum reads are rayn and TAA. This is important to keep in mind going forward. On July 22 2013 11:52 jrkirby wrote: Well, I read rayn, TAA, and jarjar. Unfortunately, none of them seem extremely scummy on second look. I'm gonna check firmtofu's filter and see if rayn has anything there. God, I'm so bad at seeing scum until the votes come in. He returns 30 minutes later with this post that basically says he has no scumreads now. He also is making excuses for his bad play by downplaying his "mistakes" as newb town. Why does he have such an apologetic tone to all his posts? So far, he has contributed nothing to the thread. On July 22 2013 12:03 jrkirby wrote: Oh, wow, firmtofu looks to have it right on oatsmaster. oats is not saying anything useful: And then he says: . This is just terrible, no reasoning behind his rayn vote. I could be wrong, but I think firmtofu had his vote on rayn then, which makes it double scummy. Anyway, till oats explains himself, my vote is on him. ##Vote: Oatsmaster He then buddies me to push a lynch on Oats. Seems convenient. On July 23 2013 02:01 jrkirby wrote: Oh shit, the train ended and I was stuck without internet on a bus for the next 8 hours, then I slept a bit, and I didn't get to look over TG's case. But I am now back home and can start looking at the thread. At this moment I am not caught up with the thread. He says he will look into TG and will look at the thread. He NEVER fulfills this promise, making it extremely likely that TG and kirby are on a scumteam together and kirby faked AFKness in order to avoid voting him. On July 23 2013 04:11 jrkirby wrote: Ok, I read the thread, and I still think oats is scum. But shit... I kinda caused a no lynch to happen. Really sorry guys. If only I had read tangeng's filter faster. I still haven't read it, but I guess I got plenty of time to do that now. I have even more scumread on oats than I did before. I'm not sure about DrH, I'd prefer to see how he plays tonight and tomorrow before I come to a conclusion on him. Another apologetic post. He again pushes for an Oats lynch, but still hasn't made a post justifying why. On July 23 2013 06:47 jrkirby wrote: What do you mean? I still think Oats is scum, and I still haven't gotten to tangengs filter. I can't spend too much time on this at work, cause I kinda also gotta get work done ANOTHER post apologizing that he hasn't even looked at TG. This is getting repetitive... I think kirby made the decision to kill rayn specifically to implicate Oats as evidenced by this post right after Night 1 ended. On July 23 2013 15:19 jrkirby wrote: So the guy oatsmaster wanted dead is dead, hmmm. If oatsmaster were really taking this seriously, I might think this a sign that he's not scum. But he's not, so I still think that he's scum. This post solidifies my scumread of jrkirby. | ||
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On July 24 2013 07:22 getmoript wrote: Ok I'm with you... What in the actual fuck? Sorry, I meant CDG not TAA. These acronyms are confusing the fuck out of me. | ||
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His conversation with Oats made me think he was scummy because of how irrational his approach was. I still don't understand why you would check yourself for sanity when it barely tells you anything. You should be checking others, not yourself. You can figure out whether you're sane based on their flips and you get a plethora of useful information. While I think getmoript may be lying about his claim, I think he is more likely to be a VT pushing a strong scum read in TAA. I cannot think of a single good reason why cDg would claim as town given a getmoript claim unless he started to speculate upon roles. That being said, I would much prefer to lynch jrkirby or TG today. I think we should hold of on lynching potential blues unless we are certain that one of them is scum. | ||
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I think it's possible that you are VT claiming cop in order to push your strongest scumread. Am I right? | ||
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On July 24 2013 07:59 austinmcc wrote: Given TAA's reaction post, you think it's more likely that: (1) getmoript is not actually a cop, fakeclaiming a red check on a scumread of his, who responded in that manner but is town AND TG or jrkirby is scum (which I still agree with on TG) than (2) getmoript either is or isn't a cop, nobody cares, and TAA is scum ? No, I don't think it is likely that getmoript is not actually a cop. I'm saying it is a definite possibility considering how adamant he has been about his read of TAA. TAA could definitely be scum but considering that I have nothing to go off of except a cop role claim that may or may not be sane, I'm not willing to blindly follow the train on TAA just yet. If you can convince me of his alignment either way, I will definitely be willing to vote him. | ||
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I don't think that you are 100% VT and your claim is 100% false. I'm saying its a possibility. In a game of probability such as mafia, we need to be on top of all possible outcomes and this is a possible outcome I think most people have overlooked. | ||
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On July 24 2013 06:21 TheAwesomeAll wrote: claiming detective instead of making a case is cheating I will address this post directly because everyone seems to think I am scum for not addressing it. This post does not reflect well upon TAA, I totally agree. However, I don't think it makes him 100% scum either. He could be newb town that doesn't feel like defending himself in a situation where it's his word against getmoript's. I've been placed in a sort of similar situation in Sicilian and I know how it feels. Ace fakeclaimed and called me mafia, which was a lie. I didn't even feel like defending myself because there was really nothing I could say. It was my word against his. Anyway, like I said, I'm not against lynching TAA. He's still a null-scum read to me, especially after this post. I will look into his filter, give me a few minutes. | ||
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On July 24 2013 08:16 getmoript wrote: @5T. Tofu isn't this obtuse. Tofu is actually a pretty decent player. I can't understand how he comes to his conclusions. He still hasn't answered why he would think I would fakeclaim. I mean what's the point. You would fakeclaim because it's convenient. It's an easy way to push your reads when you don't feel like making a solid case against someone. Your posts prior to your claim are somewhat indicative of this sentiment. You seemed a bit frustrated that no one was agreeing with you about TAA. By fakeclaiming as VT, you could get town on your side relatively easily and lynch someone that you thought was very likely to slip scum. It's a move I would certainly consider if I were in your position as a VT and I genuinely thought TAA was scum. Of course, this is all dependent on the idea that you are very confident in your scum read of TAA. Regardless, I never said you fakeclaiming is the most likely scenario. You probably didn't fake claim, but I'd put the probability around 25% that you did. I think you are probably not lying about your claim and you are probably a cop who got red on TAA. I don't want to bandwagon TAA just yet because of reasons I have stated previously. Your sanity is not entirely clear. We have a "counter" cop claim. I still have yet to see a solid case against TAA. Going to go back to reading TAA's filter now. | ||
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On July 24 2013 08:20 getmoript wrote: And how did you react in Sicilian? Was you're initial reaction like, "Awww man, claiming is cheetor hax" or were you all like, "WTF. I'm Town. Maybe I could be miller. Here's my claim. Herpaderp." Dude puts no effort in this game, looks scummy as hell. You admit he's looks scummy for stuff. You completely disbelieve the most active, thread driving, attention whoring, asshole, douchebag in the thread is town AND question his roleclaim because random bs reason. This is inexplicable if you're town. I think you are confused about where I stand. I have you down as solid town and your claim hasn't changed my read at all. Please read my posts again. Just because I think you lying is a possibility doesn't mean I think you lied as scum. | ||
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When I said it is possible that you fakeclaimed, it was because I was skeptical of how rational your play would be. You have raged plenty of times in the thread and you seem somewhat reliant on your emotions. If I thought you were rational, I wouldn't have said you fakeclaimed. You are wasting your time. I'm town and I'm pretty sure you're town. Start convincing me that TAA is scum instead of asking me stupid questions. | ||
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On July 24 2013 08:44 getmoript wrote: He fucking claimed scum. He's been totally inactive. The 'shots' he's taken have been completely opportunistic. Have you even read his filter? Yes, I have read his filter. Inactivity is not necessarily alignment indicative. Can you make a sophisticated case against him please? I would like these posts specifically to be addressed. On July 23 2013 20:09 TheAwesomeAll wrote: rayns post mortem. Main thing rayne was concerned with day 1 was fighting with firmtofu, calling each other scum. Austincc thought rayn was town whereas oats was convinced rayn was scum. Tangeng joined the the rayn is scum train of thought later, but wasnt half as convinced as rayn was. Speculation: id guess oats is town because it would be really stupid to tunnel some townie and then shoot him super speculation: oats might be vigi and shot rayne but i dont know where the mafia killpower went then. Alternatively firmtofu might have been scum who didnt like the pressure. Happy wifom everyone On July 23 2013 22:07 TheAwesomeAll wrote: onegu i didnt respond to your case because its a very weak one. The first post you quoted i called firmtofu out for pretending to be very productive(or willing to be very productive) while not doing anything. That isnt a scum tell? in my book it is. The latter post i tried to show what a facade getmoript was pulling, going full bad cop-good cop on us this game. His fake emotions and empty posts seemed scummy to me, really reminiscent of how iGrok played in a newbie mafia game. Player with a ton of experience making fluffy posts and talking a ton. He has kinda stopped making the flufposts so it mightve been just part of his day1 play. Still thinking about this one though. On July 24 2013 06:20 TheAwesomeAll wrote: Also i disagree with the whole "TG claimed RB so hes not scum" train. I think if you thought he was scum D1 you should still think thats the case, since claiming RB obviously implies youre some kind of blue role (yes even despite VT roleclaims on D1) which is exactly what a desperate scum will do to make it another day. I think claiming RB is very much a null tell, it shouldnt change your position on TG too much. Thanks, getmoript. | ||
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On July 24 2013 10:25 getmoript wrote: I don't see how scum can't make any of those posts tofu. I've defended town as scum before. As a matter of fact it's hella common. How do those posts make him town? I never said those posts make him town. I wanted you to convince me that he was scum while considering those posts specifically. Doesn't matter, he claimed blue. He's done himself in. | ||
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On July 24 2013 12:54 JarJarDrinks wrote: Actually, that's exactly what it seems like.That last line. Explain what you meant by potential blues? Considering TAA had yet to claim @ that point. Is there some reason you knew that TAA was potentially blue? No, I didn't know TAA was potentially blue. TAA was null-scum at that time, but not in my top 3 scumreads(Close, but not quite there). When he claimed blue, specifically roleblocker, I knew he had to be axed. | ||
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On July 24 2013 13:01 austinmcc wrote: If you were looking at some of the recent posts that you've made from the outside, they would look really odd and difficult to explain. They really look like you're trying to avoid lynching someone who was redchecked while not calling that person town/not distrusting the cop claim. You may be town and Lieutenant Angrypants may be wrong in calling you scum, but your whole mindset on things since getmoript's claim has been funky. Everyone else isn't going one way because they're overlooking some likely scenario, imo. Like, again, It's not just about whether TAA is scum or not (and seriously, that reaction was super duper scummy). You're going to vote someone, you're going to have a scumread SOMEWHERE. So it's not solely a question of whether TAA is town or scum. It's a question of whether you trust a different read of yours SO MUCH that you think it's more likely that read of yours is scum than TAA. All of TAA's posts don't HAVE to be scummy, there may be some things that are difficult to explain. But that's true of everyone (probably), and you're going to have that problem with any lynch candidate, TAA or whoever you would prefer. You're almost hesitating about TAA because he may or may not be scum (before this claim stuff that you jumped on). But that's true of most anyone, and the combination of the possible check + definite reaction is, imo, a much larger indicator of scumdiddlyumptiousness than anything you can point out in another person's filter. Note that his reaction wasn't that getmoript was LYING, wasn't that he's town and doesn't want to bother putting up a fight, but was that getmoript was cheating because he didn't even make a case. He didn't just get called scum and choose not to fight it (initially), he got called scum and responded by saying it was lame and getmoript should have made a case. The problem a townie has with a redcheck on them is "I'm not red." The problem a mafia member has with a redcheck on them is "Boooooooo." Bolded relevant. At the time, I trusted my reads of jrkirby and TanGeng to enough to offset the likelihood that all of the following were true regarding getmoript: 1) Telling the truth about his claim 2) Target was not framed 3) Is a sane cop(implying not paranoid/insane) The probability of all of these events occurring simultaneously was not particularly high in my mind, so I thought that it was be best to trust my own scumreads before jumping on getmoript's wagon. You make good points about TAA, all of which I have considered and are part of the reason why I'm currently voting for him. | ||
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Here is the quote in question. On July 24 2013 06:21 TheAwesomeAll wrote: claiming detective instead of making a case is cheating The correct rational town response is to consider whether: 1) Town would do this when accused. 2) Scum would do this when accused. 1-> This is bad town play. Town probably wouldn't do this when accused. The correct town play would be to post a defense of themselves and counter-attack their accuser. 2-> Scum wouldn't do this when accused either. This is terrible scum play. Why would they bring about unwarranted suspicion upon themselves? Thus, we can conclude that TAA's post is bad, but not 100% alignment indicative. It's bad play, sure, but I don't think you can say that it implicates him beyond reasonable doubt. As time went on, I started to grow on the TAA lynch. TAA didn't defend himself for a long time, making me more suspicious of him. The nail in the coffin came when he claimed blue. It was far too convenient. TG had just claimed rb'd and it looks like TAA is using the claim as an opportunity to exonerate himself. Add to this that a bunch of other blues have already claimed that look less scummy than he does and I no longer could justify not lynching him. | ||
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On July 24 2013 13:35 getmoript wrote: No dude, you're wrong. There are lots of times when it's correct to claim scum when caught. You'd be amazed how much you can fuck up and derail a thread after you claim scum. I am unfamiliar with the meta on this site. Do scum actually do this? On July 24 2013 13:36 Oatsmaster wrote: So what would scum do FT? Good scum would try to mimic the correct town response as closely as possible to make their response and a town's response in their situation virtually indistinguishable. On July 24 2013 13:37 austinmcc wrote: Scum inherently knows they're scum. You get called out when you're scum, especially if you aren't used to it, and your mindset is "Oh crap, I got caught." It's terrible scum play, yes, but it's a product of you KNOWING you're scum, KNOWING a check is real. Just because it isn't good scum play doesn't mean it's not human nature. It's FAR more likely to come from scum because of mindset. This is a fair point. I hadn't considered that. | ||
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You said "we should hold of on lynching potential blues" when trying to talk people out of voting TAA even though we had no reason to think he was blue @ the time. Tell me how this isn't a slip. I was never trying to talk people out of lynching TAA. That's where you go wrong. I said hold off on lynching potential blues because I didn't want anyone voting getmoript, Onegu, or cDg. Remember, TAA hadn't claimed yet, so I didn't know he was blue. | ||
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I would endorse a shot on either one. I don't think you can justifiably shoot anyone else. cDg is the only person I'm still wavering on, but by process of elimination, I'm pretty sure we found the entire scumteam if TAA flips scum. | ||
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On July 24 2013 07:43 FirmTofu wrote: + Show Spoiler [kirby's timeline] + On July 22 2013 11:22 jrkirby wrote: Ok, I'm on a train back and it has internet. I've got 2 hours of power left, so lets see how much scumhunting I can do in that time. I've read the thread, and I got slight scumreads on rayn and TAA. I'm gonna dive their filters now and see if I was just imagining it. If you want me to look at something in particular, let me know. I kinda skimmed the thread, so I might've missed a bit. Really, sorry, this was a hectic and awesome trip, but I'll be back to normal activity on monday. His first scum reads are rayn and TAA. This is important to keep in mind going forward. On July 22 2013 11:52 jrkirby wrote: Well, I read rayn, TAA, and jarjar. Unfortunately, none of them seem extremely scummy on second look. I'm gonna check firmtofu's filter and see if rayn has anything there. God, I'm so bad at seeing scum until the votes come in. He returns 30 minutes later with this post that basically says he has no scumreads now. He also is making excuses for his bad play by downplaying his "mistakes" as newb town. Why does he have such an apologetic tone to all his posts? So far, he has contributed nothing to the thread. On July 22 2013 12:03 jrkirby wrote: Oh, wow, firmtofu looks to have it right on oatsmaster. oats is not saying anything useful: And then he says: . This is just terrible, no reasoning behind his rayn vote. I could be wrong, but I think firmtofu had his vote on rayn then, which makes it double scummy. Anyway, till oats explains himself, my vote is on him. ##Vote: Oatsmaster He then buddies me to push a lynch on Oats. Seems convenient. On July 23 2013 02:01 jrkirby wrote: Oh shit, the train ended and I was stuck without internet on a bus for the next 8 hours, then I slept a bit, and I didn't get to look over TG's case. But I am now back home and can start looking at the thread. At this moment I am not caught up with the thread. He says he will look into TG and will look at the thread. He NEVER fulfills this promise, making it extremely likely that TG and kirby are on a scumteam together and kirby faked AFKness in order to avoid voting him. On July 23 2013 04:11 jrkirby wrote: Ok, I read the thread, and I still think oats is scum. But shit... I kinda caused a no lynch to happen. Really sorry guys. If only I had read tangeng's filter faster. I still haven't read it, but I guess I got plenty of time to do that now. I have even more scumread on oats than I did before. I'm not sure about DrH, I'd prefer to see how he plays tonight and tomorrow before I come to a conclusion on him. Another apologetic post. He again pushes for an Oats lynch, but still hasn't made a post justifying why. On July 23 2013 06:47 jrkirby wrote: What do you mean? I still think Oats is scum, and I still haven't gotten to tangengs filter. I can't spend too much time on this at work, cause I kinda also gotta get work done ANOTHER post apologizing that he hasn't even looked at TG. This is getting repetitive... I think kirby made the decision to kill rayn specifically to implicate Oats as evidenced by this post right after Night 1 ended. This post solidifies my scumread of jrkirby. | ||
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On July 21 2013 07:48 TheAwesomeAll wrote: Hey guys look at my townie townieness im talking about being a good townie so i must be a good townie right? FirmTofu gets what this game is about, just talk about how good of a townie you are and spam your post count up! Also this new hydra thing is anoying as hell. On July 23 2013 22:07 TheAwesomeAll wrote: onegu i didnt respond to your case because its a very weak one. The first post you quoted i called firmtofu out for pretending to be very productive(or willing to be very productive) while not doing anything. That isnt a scum tell? in my book it is. The latter post i tried to show what a facade getmoript was pulling, going full bad cop-good cop on us this game. His fake emotions and empty posts seemed scummy to me, really reminiscent of how iGrok played in a newbie mafia game. Player with a ton of experience making fluffy posts and talking a ton. He has kinda stopped making the flufposts so it mightve been just part of his day1 play. Still thinking about this one though. On July 23 2013 20:09 TheAwesomeAll wrote: rayns post mortem. Main thing rayne was concerned with day 1 was fighting with firmtofu, calling each other scum. Austincc thought rayn was town whereas oats was convinced rayn was scum. Tangeng joined the the rayn is scum train of thought later, but wasnt half as convinced as rayn was. Speculation: id guess oats is town because it would be really stupid to tunnel some townie and then shoot him super speculation: oats might be vigi and shot rayne but i dont know where the mafia killpower went then. Alternatively firmtofu might have been scum who didnt like the pressure. Happy wifom everyone Bolded relevant. Who you should shoot: Tier 1(High Priority): jrkirby, TanGeng Tier 2(Low Priority): JJD, cDg cDg claimed cop. It will be useful to see what he says about his check tomorrow. JJD seems a bit too aggressive to be mafia. He's also tunneling me heavily which seems stupid if you are scum. I think everyone else is town. | ||
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On July 26 2013 01:08 FiveTouch wrote: Whoever wanted to shoot THIS guy needs....to be shot? You mean Onegu the vigilante? lol. | ||
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On July 26 2013 01:28 cDgCorazon wrote: I'm checking JJD tonight. He's someone I'm not so sure on, so I'd like to get some more info. Why don't you check whichever of the two (jrkirby/TanGeng) that Onegu does not shoot? | ||
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On July 26 2013 01:35 cDgCorazon wrote: Well if I don't know who Onega is going to shoot, how can I figure out which one to check? He'll tell us, duh. | ||
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I'm just going to ignore his posts for the time being until Night 2 ends. I'll probably be able to ascertain his alignment soon. | ||
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Look through TAA's filter. He has wanted me dead the entire game. | ||
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Cora? The cop who says you are town? jjd? The guy who has been trying to lynch me since forever? Or jrkirby? The guy ive been trying to lynch since forever? | ||
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I also subscribe to the belief that 5T is town. Austin, I'm not entirely sure about... but that's only because I'm terrible at reading him and ive never played a game where he was scum. I'm leaning town. That leaves Onegu, jjd, and jrkirby. I'm really feeling Kirby and I think that jjd is the most likely teammate. Onegu is a toss-up. Its hard to tell. | ||
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This leaves the following people. 1) cDg 2) jrkirby 3) FiveTouch 6) TanGeng 8) Onegu 9) austinmcc There are a few things that bug me. Why would scum rb TG if TG claimed VT? Why did cDg claim cop and check himself for sanity instead of pursuing a read? A few relationships I'd like to point out Austin is basically incompatible with TG being his teammate. He's been attacking TG since the beginning of the game. TanGeng and jrkirby both think the other is town. They have been buddying each other since TAA was lynched. Onegu never liked TAA and even made a case against him iirc. Rereading the thread, TAA seemed almost eager to get TG lynched. Additionally, he said the following before getmoript accused him. On July 24 2013 06:20 TheAwesomeAll wrote: I think claiming RB is very much a null tell, it shouldnt change your position on TG too much. This indicates that he wanted people to stay on the TG wagon. I can only see this happening if TG is town. Based on these relationships, I think I can remove a few people from the list of scum. Here is the updated list. 1) cDg 2) jrkirby 3) FiveTouch 9) austinmcc Now, to me 5T has been playing extremely pro-town. I know this is not necessarily alignment indicative, but I highly doubt he is mafia at this point. There are a few things in particular that make me think he is town. As I said before, I'm a little unsure about Austin. He could be mafia, but he is playing similar to his town games and I echo much of his sentiment on TG. I'm inclined to think he's town as well. This leaves me with cDg and jrkirby as the mafia team. My Theory: cDg claimed cop to save TAA. He thought it would throw some doubt on getmoript's claim and get people to distrust getmoript. After some point, he realized it wasn't going to work and jumped on the TAA wagon. It was a impulsive move. kirby is scum for his voting patterns and the case I outlined previously. | ||
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"Why would scum rb TG if TG claimed VT?" and the fact that cDg says he received town from his check on TG. Therefore, I think cDg is our best lynch today. ##Vote: cDg | ||
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On July 27 2013 04:25 FiveTouch wrote: Have you ever seen a mafia counterclaim impulsively within a minute, Firm? In my personal experience of playing mafia on other sites, yes. On TL, no. But let's just put yourself in a scum cDg's position for a minute, shall we? Your teammate has just been accused by a cop claim and you want to save him. What is the best possible way to do this? Claim cop, right? If you claim cop, the real cop's claim should be called into question! After all, what is the likelihood of having 2 cops on the same team? I think this is also part of the reason why TAA didn't show up in the thread until a long time after his scumslip. As he was discussing with his teammate cDg about the best way to save his ass, cDg probably told him to lay low while he tested the waters with his cop claim. If cDg's cop claim worked, then TAA wouldn't need to claim. If the cop claim didn't work, TAA would need to claim. | ||
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Why would I accuse you if I were scum? That would be really bad scum play, too. cDg, what do you think the most likely scumteam is? Who is your #1 lynch target? | ||
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On July 27 2013 05:42 cDgCorazon wrote: My #1 lynch target is swinging between jrkirby and you. I'm still mulling it over. Okay, but what pairings? Obviously, you probably don't think kirby is on my team, so who DO you think is on my team? Also, if kirby is scum, who do you think his teammate is? | ||
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On July 27 2013 05:55 cDgCorazon wrote: I'm still thinking about it. We have a long time for a lynch so I will continue to think about it. I will be holding you accountable for this. Count on it. | ||
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On July 27 2013 05:51 TanGeng wrote: Personally, I love the Corazon, TAA, and me scum team scenario. Wouldn't that have been hilarious? Saving this for endgame for when everyone finds out I'm right. | ||
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On July 27 2013 08:53 Bluelightz wrote: Austinmcc has had a family event come up so that he has been tied up recently. I will attempt to find a replacement for him (if possible). Replacement found! He will enter at Night 3! Does this mean that Austin can't vote? How does this affect the votes needed to lynch? | ||
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On July 27 2013 10:22 Onegu wrote: Going over firmtofus filter now, am I the only person who thinks he is town at this point? Only TanGeng, Kirby, and cDg think I'm scum at this point. So basically all the scummy people think I'm scum. The choice is yours. I really want to lynch cDg today. | ||
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On July 27 2013 11:32 Onegu wrote: JJD has you as scum and 5t has switched to you as null. I am going to post all my reads now and my thought process behind them. Oh yeah, I forgot about JJD. I don't think 5T is serious, though. | ||
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Could he bussing? Yeah, sure. I'm inclined to think he's not though. One vote could change everything at this point. | ||
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I am the Detective! I have the exact same role pm as getmoript. Night 1, I checked TAA. Result: Town Night 2, I checked Cora. Result: Town This should answer a few questions for you. Why did I defend TAA with "weirdness" for so long? Because I got a town check on him. If you have any additional questions, please ask. I'm either a naive cop or a defective cop that gets everything wrong. I'm leaning toward defective. I want to lynch Cora. 3 cops in this town? Highly unlikely. | ||
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On July 28 2013 04:17 FiveTouch wrote: So annoying doing this via phone at a party. I believe this claim because we are also a detective, we have red checks on getmo and Cora. If I were to speculate, I'd say we had 4 cops with a different sanity each. The combination of our and firm's checks means Cora is probably town though Marv Oh damn. Okay hold on, I'm going to have to think about this for a bit. | ||
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I am either naive or defective. If I am naive, Cora is town/scum. If I am defective, Cora is scum. If 5T is paranoid, Cora is town/scum. If 5T is defective, Cora is town. Am I correct in this reasoning? | ||
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On July 28 2013 04:17 FiveTouch wrote: So annoying doing this via phone at a party. I believe this claim because we are also a detective, we have red checks on getmo and Cora. If I were to speculate, I'd say we had 4 cops with a different sanity each. The combination of our and firm's checks means Cora is probably town though Marv The problem with this theory is that Cora didn't claim detective. He claimed investigator. I'm like 100% sure Cora is scum at this point. | ||
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On July 28 2013 04:30 TanGeng wrote: what was your checks? He already said getmoript red and cora red. | ||
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cDg claimed investigator, not detective. He said he was unsure about whether he was a rolecop or an alignment cop. It reeks of fakeclaim. I think he's the mafia investigator. I think TG is defending him by trying to discredit my claim. I think the mafia team didn't block anyone on night one so they could clear TanGeng by allowing him to claim blocked. | ||
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On July 28 2013 04:47 TanGeng wrote: And if Cora is scum: Marv is paranoid Tofu is defective Cora is naive (Getmo was sane) Also if Cora is scum, then he's not a cop, he's mafia so he can't be naive. | ||
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On July 28 2013 04:50 TanGeng wrote: isn't that what marv was saying as scenario speculation Yeah, and I'm saying it's a silly assumption to make. It's completely arbitrary as well. | ||
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As far as I'm concerned, 5T is confirmed town. Kirby is probably town. jjd and onegu and austin/vivax are possible mafia, but unlikely. That leaves cDg and TG as scum. | ||
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On July 28 2013 06:01 FiveTouch wrote: 3 seems more reasonable than 4 to me..but I honestly can't separate confirmation bias from my perspective so take that for what it's worth. If Cora is scum, that would make Marv and I paranoid, with a naive FT and a sane Getmo. I can see that as likely, and taken with Cora's claim of being an Investigator rather than Detective.... But if Cora is scum and jrk his partner, why not claim a check on him that could keep him from being the lynch today? :/ I still like jrk for scum. Have you considered that Cora and TG are scum? This is what I think the scumteam is. | ||
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On July 28 2013 06:06 FiveTouch wrote: TG is player of the team if that's the case, but it's absolutely within the realm of possible to ME. Marv may disagree, but my townread on TG is heavily tied into his more recent play.... Though now that I'm sitting here thinking about it, most of what I dismissed as townie on D1 was based on the assumption that he just doesn't know what he's doing. He's displaying a completely different kind of mindset and capability recently. :/ Well, scum is currently voting for me. It all comes down to whether JJD or kirby will vote me or them. We need a majority on either one to win this game and that means you need to vote one of them as well. I will not be voting kirby today. | ||
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On July 28 2013 06:13 cDgCorazon wrote: BTW, is it weird that FirmTofu's claim only comes after jrkirby gets 2 votes in quick succession? That's pretty convenient... Are you implying that kirby and I are on a team? Kirby, the guy I have been pushing for the majority of this game. Okay. You roll with that. | ||
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On July 28 2013 06:30 JarJarDrinks wrote: I wish this all would have happened yesterday so there'd be more time to reread stuff to see if I really believe these claims. I'm leaning towards legit because it'd be so outlandish for scum to do something like this, If u 2 guys are telling truths. then there's a fullproof way to see if cora is legit. Submit your own name tonight. According to cora u wont get town or scum, it'll say investigator or whatever it was he said. Instead of all of us wasting our checks... why don't we lynch Cora and see what our cop sanity is based on his flip? that way we'll know whether the two cops can find scum the following night. It's a win-win. | ||
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On July 28 2013 06:25 FiveTouch wrote: Hrmmm....why won't you be voting kirby FT? Just read my filter. I don't think Cora would be bussing his teammate at this point. I think if one of the 2 remaining scum falls, scum have no hope of winning this game. Therefore, scum would not be voting scum right now. The votes are too close together. | ||
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On July 28 2013 06:35 cDgCorazon wrote: Why don't we lynch the fake-claiming scum member? The fact that you only want to lynch me for info is pretty scummy, man. You still haven't explained why you think I'm fake-claiming. I mean, to you, I should be just as likely a fake-claimer as 5T. The only difference being that people might actually vote me. | ||
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So your whole case against me rests on the timing. Holy hypocrisy. You think the timing of your claim isn't scummy when it brought getmoript's claim and accusation of TAA into question, but when I claim as kirby is gaining votes, I'm suddenly scum? | ||
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On July 28 2013 12:27 TanGeng wrote: Ok dead fakeclaim by FirmTofu. Here's Tofu's first post when entering TAA fray. Unless he was misrepresenting himself, he should know the answer to the bolded question, already. That was a bait. If someone had answered yes, I probably would have pursued them as a lynch. | ||
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This is what happens when you phone post, kids. | ||
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On July 28 2013 13:05 TanGeng wrote: @Onegu From the conversation flow, I'm just not getting a DT with DT check on TAA feel from Tofu. Either cDg or TAA should have been high priorities for discussion. He still tunnels jrkirky and I and then floats getmoript being VT. Actually doesn't talk all that much about cDg at all. @Tofu What were you trying to do when tunneling kirby and I? Pursuing my scumreads? What else would you think I was doing? I had a town read on TAA so there was nothing to pursue in that department. I wasn't tunnelling you and Kirby either. I thought you two were the best lynch targets from the process of elimination. | ||
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On July 28 2013 13:11 FirmTofu wrote: Pursuing my scumreads? What else would you think I was doing? I had a town read on TAA so there was nothing to pursue in that department. I wasn't tunnelling you and Kirby either. I thought you two were the best lynch targets from the process of elimination. Ebwop: town check* | ||
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However, for scum, a no lynch is actually preferable to a mislynch because a mislynch would giventown invaluable information. That's why you're pushing me instead of Kirby. You want this no lynch. You aren't even looking for scum at this point. | ||
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On July 28 2013 13:24 jrkirby wrote: Ok, either firmtofu or cora is scum, and firm was defending TAA. I think its pretty obvious who's scum. Are you serious right now? I was pushing my TOWN CHECK. | ||
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On July 28 2013 13:24 Onegu wrote: Really a mislynch gets us to mylo. Dont you think scum want that? Yeah, but with no lynch town learns nothing new. They'll kill 5T and then manipulate the town against me the following day. | ||
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This sucks. We cannot reach majority... | ||
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Well if Kirby doesn't switch his vote, then the only viable lynch is me. I'm going to post allmy reads. Town can decide whether its worth killing me for information. | ||
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if one person on the Kirby wagon switches to me, we lose a townie and dt putting us in lylo If the game stagnates, then no lynch. Remember, vivax is out of commission. | ||
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On July 28 2013 13:40 jrkirby wrote: Tonight? Corazon. maybe. I've gotta do some catching up Please please please catch up asap. Cora is scum and I'm sure of it. Ive been defending you. If you're town, why would I do that as scum? It would have been easy for me to call you scum and lynch you wouldn't it? | ||
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On July 28 2013 13:45 jrkirby wrote: Wait, did fivetouch claim cop too? What is this about 4 different types of cops? YES 5T IS A COP. IM A COP. CORA IS A MAFIA INVESTIGATOR. PLEASE READ THE THREAD THROUGHLY KIRBY. | ||
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But seriously, cDg is scum. | ||
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On July 28 2013 13:52 TanGeng wrote: Why not the other way around. Lynch you today and Cora tomorrow. Because a lynch on Cora wouldn't be as guarunteed as a lynch on me. There aren't as many people convinced that Cora is scum. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:00 TanGeng wrote: getmoript also had a strong read against TAA on Day 1. It's more of the avoiding even looking at TAA. Tofu tackles like 5 other issues before even looking at TAA. How is that scummy though? You would expect me to tackle TAA. Why is the timing so important or even alignment indicative? The whole point was to pursue my scumreads in you and kirby to make myself look like VT while I waited for people's reactions to the getmoript accusation. Reactions are key to determining alignments. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:03 jrkirby wrote: With 9 players and 2 scum, we have 2 mislynches left, right? 8 players. 2 scum. Assuming we lynch wrongly today... Night: 7 players. 2 scum. Day: 6 players. 2 scum. Assuming another mislynch... Night: 5 players. 2 scum. Day: 4 players. 2 scum. This is 2-2. We only have one mislynch left. We CANNOT mislynch twice in a row. If we mislynch today, we are at lylo the following day. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:05 jrkirby wrote: FT, what changed your read on me to town? I got a town check on cDg. I know I probably get town checks on scum, so this implicates cDg. cDg voted you. So basically, my biggest scumread was bussing you. That didn't make any sense because scum couldn't afford to lose a member at this stage of the game. That would basically be gg. Bussing was not an option. Therefore, you had to be town. Also, TG makes a lot more sense as scum considering Day 1 and how heavily he's pushing me today. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:08 jrkirby wrote: The main thing I'm confused on is the 5T claim. Can someone link that for me? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=420356¤tpage=102#2027 | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:11 jrkirby wrote: Firmtofu, why did you not counter getmoripts claim when you had a town result on TAA? Countering the claim would have served no purpose. I didn't know if I was sane. I knew that if he was town, he wouldn't know if he was sane. Also, scum don't make plays like that out of the blue. As soon as getmoript claimed, I had him pegged as town. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:14 jrkirby wrote: Did you ever ask getmoript if he knew he was sane? I didn't see that, so why didn't you? I questioned his sanity, but I never asked him directly. I'll look up the post for you, give me a second. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:15 FirmTofu wrote: I questioned his sanity, but I never asked him directly. I'll look up the post for you, give me a second. On July 24 2013 07:16 FirmTofu wrote: Wait, so let me get this straight. getmoript and Corazon are both claiming cop? Are people told whether they are naive/paranoid/sane/insane when they receive their roles? How useful is a cop's accusation when we cannot trust their sanity? I don't think lynching TAA based solely on getmoript's claim is the best course of action. If we think TAA is scummy AND we have getmoript's claim to back it up, I don't mind lynching him. Back to scumhunting. I'm going to ignore the cop claims for now because in NW, I tried to setup speculate and that fucked me over. I don't want to simply assume that two cops can't exist. My scumreads are TG, jrkirby, and TAA. TG claimed he was roleblocked. This is not alignment indicative. He was scummy yesterday and nothing has changed to sway my opinion in the other direction. I will talk more about jrkirby and TAA in a few additional posts. Here is the post. TG kindly bolded the relevant information for me. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:21 cDgCorazon wrote: I'm literally posting this one thing and then going to sleep. This is a 100% scum answer. If FirmTofu was town, he would be ok with being lynched in order to prove his point. It's already been figured out that we have room for mislynches. He only says this because he wants to survive. Guess who only cares about surviving? Scum. It also says something that TG has poked a billion holes in FirmTofu's argument and FirmTofu refuses to address them in any way whatsoever. That's the last of me. I'm going to bed. Make the right decision. Why don't you play the game instead of forcing your scumbuddy to defend you? Seriously bro? Why can't we have a civil conversation about why you're scum and I'm not? | ||
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If town agrees to that, I'll vote myself. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:25 jrkirby wrote: Ok, I really want a lynch tonight, is vote count now: 2 jrkirby (me) 3 FirmTofu 3 Corazon ? Yeah, you choose who dies. I have you as a town read. I've been pressuring you all game. You know you're town. Why would I suddenly switch you to a town read if I was scum? I think that alone should convince you I'm town. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:27 TanGeng wrote: If you flip town, I'll shut up for 2 day cycles and let you run the lynch wagon over Corazon and I. Fair enough. I'll vote for myself if kirby chooses me. If Kirby chooses you, I'm voting for you. Kirby's choice. | ||
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Oh wow, you're right... | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:30 Onegu wrote: Awesome my #1 scum choice gets to choose who is lynched. Actually, if I can't vote for myself, you and kirby choose who is lynched. You guys have to pick the same person though. That's kind of awkward. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:30 TanGeng wrote: How sure are you of your read, Tofu? Tell everyone else to vote you then. Who's getting desperate now? | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:33 jrkirby wrote: Onegu, I know you're town. I'll vote for whoever you do. This is good. This way, Onegu picks the lynch and can be more confident in his choice considering he has you as a scum read. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:34 TanGeng wrote: Look you have 3 votes on your candidate. Corazon = 3 jrkirby = 2 Tofu = 2 I'll take the exchange though. If corazon flips town, you'll lead the lynch against yourself tomorrow? Just be sure to bring Vivax with you. Well, I'll lead the lynch on Vivax if corazon flips town. I can promise that. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:36 TanGeng wrote: I expect I won't be around because you'll have shot me. Cops only have bullets in real life. This is mafia, bro. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:37 jrkirby wrote: How can anyone expect anyone but Onegu is getting shot? I'll play devil's advocate here. Theoretically, if Cora flipped town(which he's not going to), then that would make TG look good because he's been defending him this entire time. Onegu isn't confirmed because mafia could have a dayvig. | ||
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yeah, I meant nightvig, sorry. Does scum have night vigs on TL? I haven't seen it yet. Anyway, I highly doubt Onegu is scum. | ||
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If you are 50/50 split, then I think the pendulum swings his way for not even bothering to play the game at this point. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:46 TanGeng wrote: cDg raged at Vivax your replacement scumbuddy. cDg will certainly be back. Stop flinging the mud. It's ridiculous. Raging is unacceptable no matter who the target is. I'm not flinging mud, I'm pointing out a distasteful play that should not be tolerated. | ||
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On July 28 2013 14:46 jrkirby wrote: Did 5T say he was coming back? I don't remember. I hope he does. | ||
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1) I got a town check on him and TAA. TAA flipped scum. 2) He had some feeble accusations on TG, but never pursued them at length. He dropped his case on TG as soon as possible. 3) Why would scum block TG after TG was almost lynched? The only possible explanation for this behavior is that scum chose to not block anyone and so that TG could claim blocked, effectively clearing himself. | ||
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On July 28 2013 15:06 TanGeng wrote: You're a slimy snake. You're lucky these townies are so lurky and new because you scumslip so much. Your entire team would have been dead at end of N2. Why do you sound so sure he's going to flip town? | ||
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Onegu - Town 5T - Probably Town Vivax - Probably Scum jrkirby - Null(I have to reread) JJD - Null(I have to reread) | ||
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On July 28 2013 15:16 TanGeng wrote: LOL are you really going to tell me you're not scum? I'm going to tell you the truth and that's that I'm town. I will say that my reads have been worthless this game and you probably shouldn't listen to me. | ||
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On July 28 2013 15:21 TanGeng wrote: Tofu: Well if you want to know how I caught you: Here's your links: The "scripted conversation" sequence was the key. You didn't catch me. Explain to me why I would push for cDg's lynch if I was scum. This would only push your proposed scumteam of me and Vivax to the spotlight. If I was scum, I would have silently wagoned the kirby lynch so that neither of us would be suspected. | ||
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Just my 2cents. I know they don't matter much anymore. Looks like I'm a naive cop and 5T is paranoid. That's a bit odd. | ||
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On July 29 2013 14:48 Onegu wrote: Firm can you give me your thoughts on TG, JJD, and JrKirby TG is town based on the flip. He and cDg are inexorably linked. If one flipped mafia, the other was sure to be mafia as well. When one flips town, the other probably town as well. JJD Onegu JrKirby Vivax 5T ...are the remaining options. Onegu was the one who chose the lynch. I'm feeling town on him. He took the brunt of the blame for the mislynch. Doesn't feel like something scum would do. Remember, jrkirby took NONE of the blame for the lynch. He just buddied Onegu so no one would blame him for the town flip. JJD is probably town. He's been pushing me from Day 1, but drops me when I claim. Scum would keep pushing me because it's convenient. I was being pushed heavily and he could just wagon me to oblivion. 5T is still basically confirmed town for me. He had no reason to claim after I did if he was scum. Vivax is probably scum based on the flip. I have to reread his filter to be sure. For now, I think the scumteam is probably Vivax/jrkirby. | ||
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##Vote: jrkirby | ||
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Voting jrkirby is going to tell us who the last scum is. I have determined that Onegu and JJD are very unlikely to flip mafia. By the process of elimination, our choices are Vivax/jrkirby/TG. If all of town votes kirby, we can find out which of Vivax and TG is scum. Assuming kirby is scum, we should be stuck at 3 votes. Town TG will be hesitant to lynch because he thinks the scumteam is Vivax/me. Town Vivax should be perfectly okay with the lynch. Scum Vivax, however, would be hesitant to lynch his teammate. Thus, if Vivax votes kirby, Vivax is probably town. If Vivax doesn't vote kirby, Vivax is probably scum. Unfortunately, I just typed all this and posted it so he's probably going to read this and WIFOM it. I'm betting that he doesn't. After all, I typed this to anticipate the WIFOM play and force it. | ||
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Who's out there right now? | ||
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It looks like Vivax is trying to switch off kirby and onto TG. Let's assume that Vivax is scum and kirby is scum. Both scum. Vivax obviously wouldn't want to lynch Kirby. Who is the best possible target for vivax that he might be able to convince people to vote for? TanGeng. Obviously, he doesn't want to push too hard or it would seem too obvious that he's Kirby's scumbuddy. Now let's say Vivax is town and kirby is scum. Vivax might want to lynch TG, but ultimately he should be relatively ambivalent between the two. He has stated in the past that Kirby is scummy, so he should defer to that lynch,especially considering that town agrees with the lynch with a slight majority. Is there any situation when Kirby is town that Vivax would NOT want to lynch him? No. This is so, so, so, soooo important. I can't emphasize this enough. A town Kirby should be wholeheartedly endorsed by Vivax whether he is scum or town. Scum Vivax would want to WIN. This is LYLO so all his cards are on the table. Town Vivax may be a little unsure, but ultimately defer to the lynch. Let's lynch Vivax. | ||
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Sorry for being ambiguous lol. | ||
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On July 31 2013 12:52 Onegu wrote: Well vivax was going alot off of DrH makeing a no lynch than my filter. Just saying. Also 5T was starting to think I was scum before he died but I think I debunked the case. I AM BATMAN!!! That you are! | ||
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I'm sorry if you're town, but you are the most likely person to be mafia at this point. Nothing can change that. | ||
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On July 31 2013 14:09 Onegu wrote: He is saying you look more scum than him. And if vivax is scum he shoild win because he looks less scum. This. | ||
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*crosses fingers* | ||
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I was in danger of being lynched. In my eyes, JJD and Onegu were town. I knew that if I claimed, I had a shot at making myself look more town and therefore avoid being lynched. Town loses practically nothing from my claim, it gains everything. I do not regret it one bit. | ||
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I wanted Cora lynched. Obviously, the claim only furthers that goal. Hindsight is 20/20. In order to evaluate my actions fairly, you have to put yourself in my shoes. | ||
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On July 31 2013 15:32 geript wrote: What you're saying is that you were completely confirmation biased. I didn't care about claiming because I was going to get shot soon regardless and it would allow us to pressure someone who I actually thought was scum. You didn't even want to lynch TAA after his flat out scum claim. There's no amount of confirmation bias that I would've fallen to had TAA come back and responded multiple times in a towny sense. De-tunneling is honestly one of the hardest things to do in the game. But you have to spend time to actively detunnel and take a fresh look at things. Sure, Cora looked scummy; but you looked scummy as hell too. Town can look scummy. It happens. You were in a completely different situation than me and you are still looking through it in your own little world where you are DT and you got a red check on TAA. In my world, I don't know if you're lying about the claim. I don't know if you're sane, insane, random, naive, or paranoid. I don't know jack shit. I'm basing my read of TAA based on his actions. He said "something something checking me is cheating" but no one post is going to guarantee scum. I had to step back, look at the aggregation of all his posts and decide for myself whether he was worth lynching. Based on his roleclaim, I decided he'd be a solid choice. You realize that if you were in the game, you would have tunneled me to oblivion and we'd have the same situation? Luckily for you, Cora would've actually been sane cop, but there's no way to know that in your position. In OBS QT after you died, you say that I'm probably scum, remember? | ||
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United States1956 Posts
Yes, bluelightz/phagga were a little ambiguous on the role pms. Yes, bluelightz/phagga made a scum favored setup. Yes, bluelightz/phagga made a questionable decision by leading on cDg with his check on himself by giving him his role. That doesn't invalidate that fact that we, collectively, as town were unable to even lynch someone on Day 1. That is truly disgraceful. We didn't deserve to win and Onegu and JJD should be credited for their play. | ||
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1) Setup was improperly balanced. You can't give scum 2 power roles, one being a mafia-vig, and not give town some sort of power role with guaranteed scumhunting power. There should have been a DT that at least knew he was sane. That way, we could evaluate the others based on his checks. We need some sort of grounding. We can never be sure that someone's checks are correct, the roles are worthless. As far as I'm concerned, town had no power roles. 2) Replacements You can't replace DrH in that kind of situation. It gives scum an unfair advantage. We can't hold DrH accountable for his actions not voting for TanGeng and thus cannot effectively play the game. He should have been modkilled. 3) Giving an alignment cop a role check when he checks himself You can't lead him on and imply that his check on himself would have value. That's simply unfair. If he's going to check himself, you should at least have the decency to tell him that it'll be worthless. If you can't do that, please, for the love of god, don't give him a role instead of an alignment. It's just common courtesy. | ||
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On July 31 2013 16:12 phagga wrote: Finally regarding the game: People relied to much on the blues' abilities. Also, people STILL don't read the posts of dead townies. 5T had DrH as scum N1 and was later suspicious of Onegu, and getmoript had TAA and JJD as scum. Just going back and reading those (who were the strongest town players in this game) could have helped town to pin down the remaining scum. Also, the way the teams turned out hugely favored town. 5T is a very strong town hydra, so is getmoript. Austin, cora, Oats are all able of strong town play, to mention some. But with inactivity, strange plays and fake claims town also managed to successfully destroy themselves. Just because they had the some of the right reads doesn't mean they had the right reasons. You can't really blame us for not following dead town's reads. Getmoript also found me scummy. Why should I believe his reads if he doesn't even get me right? Everyone had DrH as scum N1. I don't know why you're singling 5T out. Of all the town, Austin played the best game by far. His reads may not have been the best but based on what he knew at the time, he was playing well. There were far too many variables in the setup to find scum with a high degree of probability so "reads" don't dictate who played well at all. | ||
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