EPT[T] MTG Mini Mafia II
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Stutters695
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On January 05 2013 12:45 iGrok wrote: Decks with themes are fun (bad tribes like bears or squids, etc) Making bad cards work is fun (chalice of life, praetor's council, etc). Doing weird shit is fun (Watch as i lightning bolt My Own Zombie!, etc) Basically anything that cant stand up to Modern decks - so no jund, affinity, etc. Fun is anything that is decent or worse, nothing really great- nd that will generate some laughs. Like a chickens deck. At first i put together a legacy deck for this but now i think this will be more fun! If that's the case I'd need someone to create a deck for me. I can play standard and I'm pretty good about picking up and piloting a deck by seeing the cards but I know nowhere near enough cards to make a gimmick more than just a topdeck race lol. | ||
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Arco if you can't find anyone I've got like 4 or 5 ideas I want to playtest just to get a feel for them if you wanted to come up with a couple decks that you wouldn't use but are playable we could test like 3 each without giving it away completely. When I played standard I was usually like 8-12/24-30 in FNM so I'm by no means good though. Otherwise parroting Arcos request, but only after he finds someone. | ||
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Agreed on scumhunting being way more important than MtG speculation. Especially without a stack its pointless until later. I'lltry to be active about what I'm doing with the game in addition to scumhunting but d1 I don't expect to do much in regards to cards. | ||
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1) I think CHs entrance was definitely safe, but it was worth saying due to the new players to this theme like me. His points name sense. Not much to say on that intro. 2) Its stupid, but I'd have to check iGroks previous games to see if he usually trolls. Since its so early I could see it being used to generate discussion. If he keeps it up I'll have much larger issues with it. 3) Drawing a shitload of cards early seems very pro-town, but I'll need to see some scumhunting since he'd do that as mafia anyway cause it seems like that's his deck style. Regarding the 0/X his response makes sense, but I need to look up the cards. I don't see it particularly worrisome this early with his responses though. 4)RH does concern me. The fact he entered to defend 0/X without any specifics worries me. Especially how he says to suit his purposes, not the town's. Brb work | ||
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On January 29 2013 10:25 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: We could do this: Have the "scummiest" players use their mana for Mind Glow, maybe after 24 hours have passed. The other "townier" players cast creatures/spells/etc. With that, people should get 3-4 cards from Mind Glow, likely enough to fill their hands again, and at worst discard 1-2 useless cards (not discard 10 :/ ) Of course determining who uses the mana and who plays cards can be changed. Maybe someone has nothing to cast today and can use his mana for it. I like the idea here. I can't drop any creatures today so I could fill mana but I'd much rather try to force scum to do it (in case I manage to draw something I can drop and be open to the mafia creature. Really wish I would have thought of mulliganing before I dropped my land. | ||
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On January 29 2013 11:00 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Okay so here's the thing: We are running Zombie Infestation. (this badboy right here:+ Show Spoiler + For that reason, we would have prefered Minds aglow next turn (and given all 3 mana, too!), but it seems like like it would be more beneficial to town in general this turn, than delaying until next turn  So if it's going to be today, we would REALLY like to cast zombie infestation this turn (instead of contributing mana). And of course still ask everyone else to use as much mana as humanly possible! Not just the lurkers/scum! Everyone! Think of it as a group project! I promise we're not crazy (or scum) ~dandel (with acro's consent) Haven't we established that using as much mana as possible isn't entirely helpful? Drawing is great but if we mill ourselves were ditching a lot of potentially powerful cards when we discard to seven since we won't have mana. Since you haven't mentioned it, what are your thoughts on forcing the scummiest players into contributing their mana for it? | ||
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On January 29 2013 12:02 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: of course it helps mafia, but hand size is one of the most powerful resources in magic. By forcing two players to contribute their mana if we hit townies the mafia benefits slightly better, but town gains 35 cards to their 10 (assuming 5 each) with 5 players developing their boards to mafia's two. If we hit one or both mafia the benefit to town is even greater, but even with the worst case scenario town comes out way ahead. you'll have to excuse me if i'm talking nonsense right now (magic noob  ), but this post is what resonates with what i've been saying. Clockwork provided a framework for mafia to contribute in a sense they would find townie, and in a way (presumably) that could even be beneficial for mafia. I don't understand the townie motivation behind this | ||
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On January 30 2013 07:42 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Also Stutters: This is kind of interesting, since every single post of yours since this one (except the one where I basically force you stuff out of you), has been about MtG speculation. What gives? I think I saw you post in LIX, so you shouldn't have much trouble posting here soon. I should have phrased that better. Theory crafting isn't good on its own but it is helpful early d1. It provides something to discuss. As the game goes on I expect less theory crafting except to what directly applies to actions that day. That said regarding mind aglow I'm neutral to today or tomorrow. Since the mafia creature is unlockable and we want yo attack whenever possible anyway as long as I don't get attacked for 11 from monsters that are dropped I'll live til tomorrow. It's definitely better for me today since I might pull something I can drop but in the grand scheme whatever gives us the most attack damage is what I'm backing. Regarding revealing deck arch types I agree with revealing. I've got a green ramp with bears and its probably one of the weaker decks due to my lack of vintage knowledge and picking cards. That said it does pack some power of it gets rolling but nowhere near as fearsome as zombies or something like that. I saw someone has lavamancers which means the more they mill through mind aglow means they can burn more, but I don't know the other decks well enough. Now regarding who I think is scum, I agree I think at least 1 hydra is scum. I know I'm not and currently nova feels town to me. Crossfire I'm somewhat suspicious of. He might not know MtG that well but of all of his posts nothing is an original thought except gonzaw is scummy for a post that once he explained it he agreed with (although less extreme). What concerns me about that is that he's advocating defending attacks as long as they're offensive also which is beneficial to scum much more than town from my view. I need to read over the hydras filters to get a feel for who is most likely scum out of them, but holistically I'd lean towards aperture currently. | ||
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On January 30 2013 08:37 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Please don't say this kind of stuff. Stutters: you are not getting a freebie from me. I don't give a shit about your meta. Start scumhunting or get zombied. Agreed with this actually. Why would you give me a free pass for a day? From your position I wouldn't consider me town yet. Why would you give me a free pass instead of questioning me to force more out of me. | ||
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On January 30 2013 09:18 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Check the "i.e". If I had to attack someone today it'd be Cross, not you. I don't think I said I'd give you a "free pass", rather that I'd "forgive" your lack of participation/shit as not being scummy enough to kill you. Thus I wanted more focus on Cross, who I do want to kill, or rather (to not be that extreme just yet), who I think is likely scum, at least ahead of your/Nova /G Yeah, I got that. Makes sense but why not question me to try and force more out of me? Seems like you're content to kill Xfire then me rather than be proactive about it. That concerns me. | ||
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On January 30 2013 09:48 Aperture Science wrote: I will attack BinOnFire with everything, every turn. Now you no longer have to worry about me in your attempts to plan out what everyone will play. Or you could attack someone for being scum and play to win? | ||
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On January 31 2013 05:23 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Damn S&B, I don't know what to think of you Marv gives me slight town feels with his attitude (attitude alone though, not his play, i.e lack of scumhunting and taking a strong position in town), but you gave me so many "bad" feelings dude. Like you going against Nova up there, and having that "I don't give a fuck" attitude. Let's start somewhere: Skim Nova's filter from the previous game. Do you still find him scummy? Do you agree with what I've said a few posts back? /G So do you think that Marv is town based on that or do you think despite the attitude he is more scummy than town? | ||
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Checking what I pulled. I'll see if I have anything I can drop to help the town's monsters. | ||
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On January 31 2013 08:25 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Why didn't you cast anything last cycle? Because I had literally nothing that was a 2 drop or less except verdant catacombs and cultivate. I now have a howling mine (if it's untapped each player draws an extra card during draw step) I can play from minds aglow. I finally pulled a monster drop but it won't be able to be played today so unless I get attacked today I'd focus on the mine tomorrow. Not having a second main phase really fucks me with my initial hand. | ||
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On January 29 2013 10:41 Stutters695 wrote: I like the idea here. I can't drop any creatures today so I could fill mana but I'd much rather try to force scum to do it (in case I manage to draw something I can drop and be open to the mafia creature. Really wish I would have thought of mulliganing before I dropped my land. I said it right here. The only issue is I didn't realize minds aglow resolved at the end of the main phase, not during until it was actually played. | ||
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First and foremost RH entrance feels town. He was pretty fierce about defending his 0/X creatures and seeing that they're artifacts I can see some synergies that make sense with that(memories of that artifact deck in DotP mostly). I'm not seeing the connections to a Ninja deck from that but I'm sure it'll become apparent. If he just chumps then then disregard this, but it felt town. I really don't like his filter after that though. They're barely out posting me as a hydra, and their only hint of scumhunting is calling me out for lurking, defending XFs newbie to mtg post and a list that they don't say anyone is more than town to null in. Then to defend not looking at hydras when mathematically it is way more likely for a hydra is svummy as duck to me. | ||
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Even post return hopeless hasn't taken a stance on anything. It's been over 50 hours and he's said almost nothing. I'd have to double check his metar but I don't remember hopeless bring so non committal | ||
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On January 31 2013 15:48 RockHydra wrote: Good morning all I guess I was afraid of this. I don't have any good reads on anyone, "so that means we're scum". It's BS of course. The game is only 1 day long, there isn't much to go on yet. It's not my style to accuse people based on trivialities. /zebezt so what about your partner? you have no reads and your partner who.was much more aggressive in previous games has nothing? anyway goodnight. I'll post between class tomorrow. | ||
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On January 31 2013 17:43 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Hmm, I guess he could have kept it as scum (just in case, for later), and not discard it. But he'd have 1 less zombie I think. Anyways, going to bed. Prome, check the QT when you get back, I have something "Interesting" to tell you, hehehe I'd really like some thoughts on Cross's behaviour, both at the end of the main phase (casting something right at the last minute), and after (going apeshit against me, then cooling down and apologizing). /G I think I saw someone ask my thoughts on Cross in general so I'll talk about that and what you're asking. As someone who didn't play MtG Mini I, I felt similar to X in wanting a summary, however I didn't voice it (I figured if I said something really dumb, people would point it out). I don't find that nearly as scummy as a few others have because rereading an entire game is a daunting task, especially when you're not looking for something in particular. Lazy, yes. Scum, I'm not so sure. The post about ThePosters plan is where I started getting suspicious. At first I wasnt too suspicious because if he doesn't understand MtG, he might have misunderstood the mechanics but at least he was scumhunting and found something suspicious. Until it got explained and we're back to zero contribution towards finding scummers. Going to skip his defending himself since what he said makes sense, but it'd be what he would say if he was town or scum. What he says in regards to scumhunting in that post actually was a decent post that I agreed with a lot of. What really concerned me about it (I can definitely relate to the low amount of time to play) is that despite seeming convinced of COn's guilt he never attacks CH again or discusses anything with the town to prove his innocence/work with us, despite the higher emphasis on teamwork in this. When I am on a tight schedule, I have two focuses. If I have a read I'm confident about it is getting them lynched, if I don't it is doing whatever I can to work with the town to convince them off my innocence. X doesn't do either of these. Instead of discussing what to do with his mana. Because he's posted so little it's hard to quantify, but it appears he's in it for himself and is hiding something. The emotional part I'm not so sure of how scummy that is, but to not discuss anything in the thread into dropping his mana on two creatures worries me. I need to check his past games, but when I replaced into whose line he was calm and although he didn't post a lot, he gave reasons and was transparent with his actions. This feels incredibly different. | ||
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It wasn't that I'm worried people aren't attacking me, it's that I'm worried people were using my early game as a way to "scumhunt" without actually doing anything to find scum except saying I don't post enough. Like I said about minds aglow previously during d1 I think discussing plays and overarching town strats is good because the re is less to talk about. Especially in my position where I didn't have a lot of free time to compose a good case through filters. I'm assuming you're talking about when I asked if you thought Marv was town. I was asking that because that entire post was just fluff where you didn't say much of anything. I wanted to hear how you were leaving instead of justI'm not sure. Did that answer what you wanted? | ||
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On February 01 2013 03:59 RockHydra wrote: Hey all. I'm around again. I must say this is a pretty active group. I'm gonna be making a case on xfire now... although most things have kinda been said on that, but maybe I'll find something new. I'll get back with that in a sec. Then hopefully I also have time to read up on all the stuff going on with SuckMyTopdeck /zebezt So you disagree with Hopeless read that XF shouldn't be attacked I take it. Do you have any thoughts on anyone other than the person who is believed to be scum by most the thread? | ||
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On February 01 2013 03:05 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Stutters, imho, is one of the towniest players in the game. That is, imho a lot more valuable than SnB's half-arsed read of Nova based on almost exclusively bad tells. /Acro CH I'm a bit curious about this. In eight minutes I go from being used as an insult (I'm doing more than he is, which is bad) to you seeing me as one of the towniest players. Why such a sudden switch? | ||
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The other is that we still haven't seen grey and earlier you guys made it sound like iGrok trolls early. I'd have to check his meta for that but I don't have the time at the moment. I'll look into it, but I think cross is so obviously scum he must die first. | ||
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On February 01 2013 06:29 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: I forgot that if you block a creature that creature dies  Fucking MTG rules lol Anyways, I think Crossfire should not block your zombies, if not it'll give town less KP tomorrow. If he ninja-blocks again in the thread right before the deadline I'll take it as a scum claim again, because that'd be getting ridiculous /G Not quite (unless this is changed and I don't remember it from the rules for the mafia gain. 2/2 attacks 0/3 0/3 turns to 0/1 until turn end and the zombie stays at 2/2 | ||
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On February 01 2013 08:12 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: I am not sure if this global card would benefit us that much. Only Rock has "useless permanents" we can use to destroy shit as far as I know /G I was hoping for a colorless mana or something lol. | ||
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On February 01 2013 10:01 Clockwork Hydra wrote: @Stutters: don't you have any giant growth (or one of the billions of giant growth clones) you can cast on one of the creatures attacking Xfire? Or some enchantment? @Rock: do you have mana for a ninja and equipping the shuriken on it? I have a instant that's +1/+1 trample infect for all creatures I control, nothing that just blanket affects the board though. | ||
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On February 02 2013 00:58 RockHydra wrote: I'm assuming Triumph of the Hordes, in which case you don't have 4 mana anyways. I really do not understand your deck at all. ~Hopeless err sorry, wrong one. I've got a gaeas anthem too. I fucked up by not mulliganing and I thought we had time between the attack phase and when we had to discard. I was going to drop my cultivate and bear cub or howling mine, but since I missed the discard step I lost cultivate via rng. The deck revolves around ramping up to 4 mana then throwing out mass bears to create tokens and using some artifact that's +1 to each bear/bear played after the artifact is down. other cards are mostly enchants that bump their power also. | ||
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On February 02 2013 07:30 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Once again, I disagree with my hydra head. I think Stutters should do what he wants. If he thinks a 2/2 bear helps town, then great. If something else, great too: he's the only one who knows his deck and how it can contribute. Word of caution, though: I'm not sure a howling mine is a good idea, because we have to consider the serious situation where Aperture is scum and will "go off" tomorrow and deck us all, play an infinite number of Eldrazi or do something else fucked up. The presence of Epic Experiment AND Mind's Desire in his GY point towards a pretty funky combo where he just dumps down a giant list of instants and sorceries which ends in 200 damage to everybody else in the game. "I win". Dandel was saying we should blow up his braids. I don't quite see what 2 red mana in his upkeep can do (can only play instants, not sorceries), but it's something to keep under consideration. I WOULD like Aperture to tell us how his deck is supposed to work and what he needs to "go off", so we can estimate the threat he likely poses. /Acro Back, catching up. That's a good point about the mine. Those are the only two things I can do anything with. I'll drop the bear and if we decide his two mana is a threat I can sack the bear since I'm so much less developed and likely to influence the game other than by having you guys know I'm town. Preferably I can keep it in Peru and have it at least as a 3/3 tomorrow. | ||
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On February 02 2013 05:18 Aperture Science wrote: I am not willing to sacrifice braid of fire. It is too key to our deck and we don't have a backup one available yet. Clockwork: me and iGrok are going to pick apart the thread when he gets home from work later tonight and we can talk on skype. That being said I have had time to catch up on the events of the thread, and though I dont have much actual things to go on I have found things that I see are weird. The Primary of this was some of stutters interactions with clockwork especially this post: This post rubs me the wrong way though I cannot say why. The second is that he is obviously noncommittal on everything in the game. Even his "next biggest scumread" (me) is him saying the case on my is good but has problems. Now having null reads is not a scumtell, but he seems to be very noncommittal all game, something that I find is a scumtell. On the magic side of things he also really hasnt had incredibly strong opinions on his development in this game. I am speaking of this post: While it might seem the "townie" thing to do, this information doesn't do us any good. We don't know how much we will hurt his development, what the risks are, what the reward is, or how vulnurable he will be. Only he knows this information for sure. The best thing for him to do in this situation would be to commit to something and say "this is the best option". Once again, this is an example of non committal behavior. Please read his filter and study him. beyond the standard policy discussion for his first few posts stutters has yet to actually take a real stance on anything, especially now with crossfire taking a lot of the attention of the day. Although it looks like no one took this seriously, I'd just like to point out how incredibly selective with my filter he is. I've took a stand on cross since halfway through t1. I pointed out cross was my #1 read before bins case because he wasn't taking any stands, and I'm fairly certain I was the first person to actually drop the point about how blatantly different cross's meta was when we played in WLIIA. His MtG not taking a stance is out of context too considering I was directly asked what I could play to help our collective kp. Hard to see them being anything but the second scum with head 1 not really contributing and head 2 only contributing in one weak ass case that is based on misrepresenting my filter. | ||
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On February 03 2013 00:03 RockHydra wrote: Well by elimination really, I have CH, SMTP, DFTP and duh, myself as town, so that leaves Stutters, Nova and AS. Of those three, I'm most inclined to see stutters as scum. As zeb pointed out, and both GreY and iGrok pointed out in his analysis, the flip-flop on my "entrance post" regarding the 0/X creatures is the epitome of a Lynch-all-liars policy and has obvious scum connotations (forgot what lies he told) with no clear town motivation behind the how or why that read changed. In addition, saying he'll put together reads and then not doing so, (which marv says is right up his meta-alley,) is still freaking scummy. As far as associative cases, the "xfire has been discussed to death" is a good way to sheep without saying a goddamned thing. AS is difficult to read as noted due to his scumhunting methods being "mechanical". While I think stutters is scummier, I am generally fearful of the power of AS's deck, so I'm comfortable sheeping an attack on him if people still feel he's the top candidate. Gonzaw's case is still quite good, but the assumption that random discards fucked up his play and that work is hectic kind of makes me want to stay my hand. I guess that leaves me null of Nova? He hasn't given a whole lot to the thread (though he has a pretty good excuse for that), and I'd expect scum to be kind of forced to bus xfire. However, in his response to the case on AS: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=17688758 he basically ends off with "kill xfire", AS needs more discussion. At the time I don't think xfires fate was sealed by any means, as scum he could have had the opportunity to sheep gonzaw's case, so I consider this to lean him towards a townread. ~Hopeless Let me explain a couple things. First, the flip flop was two days apart. One thing you'll see if you've played with me before is that when I post I always am as transparent as I possibly can be. When I first read his intro they hadn't said much else and it.felt significantly scummier. After reading it again two days later in the context of everything they had said that his defense felt more town after seeing their lack of stances in between on anything else (not that they felt more town in general, just their intro). I'm not afraid of changing my opinions cause I have nothing to hide. Regarding the Xfire thing, he had been discussed, his play was scummy and his lack of any defense felt like it wasn't worth wasting my time typing a post considering I was busy and I could have used that time looking at other people. If you'll notice when Gonzaw asked for me to expand, I expanded, including original thoughts showing how blatantly not like his town meta he was playing. If you consider that sheeping I don't know what to tell you. | ||
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On February 03 2013 0:00 Aperture Science wrote: Link to Stutters Analysis Conclusions: Greater Suspicion of Scumminess. Factors: 1) Multiple Contradictions, often withing just a couple posts. 2x Class B 2) Soft defenses, particularly about Xfire. Class C 3) Deck Lies. There is no way that a Bears deck can't play with 5 mana. Just no way. Class B BBBC is pretty damning. This is my analysis, GreY's isn't quit finished but you can see most of it. Artanis(sp?) did some balancing to the deck but you know pretty much what's in it. He added a mox emerald and a couple other things (I'd have to check my PMs) but where are you getting five mana from? I have three. If I was at five mana I would be rolling, but when my initial pulls were all three mana plus, I haven't had a lot of options. I have played the deck poorly but I've said what's in my hand of value. What possible benefit would I get from being so weak in a scum position? What cards do I possibly have that once XFire dies would let me win 1v8 off of my "deck lies?" How is that point even remotely scummy (if I was lying, which you should know isn't true). | ||
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I haven't had time to read his analysis after coming back (like his second half) yet but so far I've seen a couple good points (they're wrong of course, but him putting it out there feels town). Aside from that his analysis is just a summary. I can go through anyone's filterand find tthings that stand out or contradictions. Doesn't make them scum. What stands out to me is how incredibly non committal the whole thing is. He clearly suspects me of being scum, but after all that analysis I'm barely more likely to be scum than a coinflip? I'll get to your question Gonz, gonna take a bit though until I can get back to my phone after this post. | ||
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On February 03 2013 07:48 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Main Phase ends in 10 minutes, we didn't forget anything to deal damage to Xfire right? Stutters, thoughts on Aperture, Rock and Nova please. I want you to try and figure out who's the remaining scum. Same with Nova who disappeared for some reason. And of course (this should be obvious) Aperture should do like everything we said he should do or some shit, whatever. /G It's coming up. I'm finally off work so I'm going thru stuff now. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + On February 01 2013 00:37 Stutters695 wrote: I think I saw someone ask my thoughts on Cross in general so I'll talk about that and what you're asking. As someone who didn't play MtG Mini I, I felt similar to X in wanting a summary, however I didn't voice it (I figured if I said something really dumb, people would point it out). I don't find that nearly as scummy as a few others have because rereading an entire game is a daunting task, especially when you're not looking for something in particular. Lazy, yes. Scum, I'm not so sure. The post about ThePosters plan is where I started getting suspicious. At first I wasnt too suspicious because if he doesn't understand MtG, he might have misunderstood the mechanics but at least he was scumhunting and found something suspicious. Until it got explained and we're back to zero contribution towards finding scummers. Going to skip his defending himself since what he said makes sense, but it'd be what he would say if he was town or scum. What he says in regards to scumhunting in that post actually was a decent post that I agreed with a lot of. What really concerned me about it (I can definitely relate to the low amount of time to play) is that despite seeming convinced of COn's guilt he never attacks CH again or discusses anything with the town to prove his innocence/work with us, despite the higher emphasis on teamwork in this. When I am on a tight schedule, I have two focuses. If I have a read I'm confident about it is getting them lynched, if I don't it is doing whatever I can to work with the town to convince them off my innocence. X doesn't do either of these. Instead of discussing what to do with his mana. Because he's posted so little it's hard to quantify, but it appears he's in it for himself and is hiding something. The emotional part I'm not so sure of how scummy that is, but to not discuss anything in the thread into dropping his mana on two creatures worries me. I need to check his past games, but when I replaced into whose line he was calm and although he didn't post a lot, he gave reasons and was transparent with his actions. This feels incredibly different. | ||
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Gonzaw I didn't realize they came into play tapped. Im playing the bear. | ||
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Might as well babysit you and show them to you: On February 02 2013 12:27 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: It's right next to your stuff in the spreadsheet, how did you miss it? So Aperture, what about Nova and Rock? Just skim their filter, don't do a super uber detailed analysis. Tell me your "gut feeling" about them, and why your gut on Stutters is stronger than they are. /G On February 02 2013 12:52 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: You say "Blatant Contradiction bla bla bla" +7 Yet on another one you put "Can you please post an opinion once?" +1 Why is exactly the 1st one +7 and the other one +1 ? Why is that contradiction scummier times 7, instead of maybe a change of mind or townie mistake, while not contributing nor scumhunting like in the 2nd one is just +1 ? Etc for the rest of the posts basically, or his play in general /G On February 02 2013 11:30 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Nova should be free to step on the "Who is the 2nd scum?" discussion as well, I haven't seen him in it in like ever /G On February 02 2013 11:26 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: I'd really like to see what Stutters has to say, and see him make a stance and analysis on who he thinks is the 2nd scum He spent most of T1 Attack Phase implying Rock was that scum, and next Suck. Now that Aperture "attacked" him, he OMGUSed, even when he said Aperture was likely town, and he was not even convinced by my case (like....my case was super awesome and persuasive, if he was starting to get suspicious of Aperture it should have been there). So what is it? Is Appy 2nd scum? If so, what do you agree about my case, and what did exactly not convince you, and how did that change if it changed at all? What about Suck and Rock? They are town then? Care to explain why they are town then? Remember, if you think 1 guy is scum then everybody else is town, and that changes some reads drastically at times I want to see how they change yours. /G /G[/QUOTE] Quoting this so it's easy to reference. My aversion to thinking Aperture as scum came from iGroks trolling and not seeing Grey post anything yet. If iGrok wasnt a hydra I would have backed that case (still would have been apprehensive due to the timing, but again that was minor since there is no voting in this game). I agree with your case and I would add the following: His analysis of me: it's almost identical to his analysis of bin. We've both "flip flopped" (although my flips were pretty clearly justified if he had actually taken the time to read the posts in context) and we're derailing the thread, and lying about our decks. Holes in his case on me: Line 17 I'm scummy for being cautious of MA, however I didn't ever say I was cautious of it. I was indifferent to if it was t1 or t2 since it didn't affect my deck. Line 25 They say I'm scummy for talking MtG when it was in response to a question I didn't quote. Again it's only scummy because he's doing post by post instead of in context. Line 30 Again more misrepresentation, however my post wasnt clear so I don't hold this against him. It should have read more likely to be town, not that he is. Lines 31/33 Addressed this in the thread but again it is only scummy because of a lack of context and this was his main point. And so on and so forth(I'll do the rest of requested, but I think it should be pretty obvious how bad this analysis is at this point). The only saving grace for AS is when Grey posts, I feel some sincerity. However since Grey's main stance is on me and entirely based off of misrepresentation he's my choice for the second scum right now. I don't think Suck is scum. Although marv isn't paying like he was in LIX it feels sincere and honest. RH I'm not so sure of but by virtue of thinking AS is scum I'm leaning lazy town on them. I'll be checking his filter but I don't see nearly the scum motivation I do from ASs posts. | ||
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On January 31 2013 23:33 Nova_Terra wrote: I currently think that crossfire is more suspicious. His plying an antitown card 1 minute before deadline without saying anything, and then his getting mad seemed very fake agnflagsbfnsisnfnatbf. Cause around 10 seconds after i made the post i wondered if anyone was gonna ask me about that. This post of his stood out to me. He's as inactive as I am yet calls out XF and myself for the same thing while he hasnt posted anything. Seems like he's trying to get by through doing just enough to skate by as not the lurkiest without saying anything of value. My main concern is if he would lurk while his scumpartner lurks, possibly outing himself. In addition to the odds of a non hydra scumteam existing. Depending on how Aperture/Nova continue this might change as AS analysis may actually be how they play and just don't see the glaring holes due to no context. This is the first time I've really looked through his filter since when I thought he was townier than XF but the lack of doing anything and flying under the radar is concerning. I'd say AS is still my number one read but im a lot more interested in Nova now. I'm with my girl so I' ll be sporadically popping in. Gonna try to read skim of novas old games | ||
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On February 03 2013 18:19 Nova_Terra wrote: Alright so gonzaw, you especially have found me to be more and more scummy, said that i pretty much blew off the case on aperture for XFire, correct? I dont see it that way, but i get the point, but i feel that this isnt scummy whatsoever, particularly with the massive chance of him flipping scum. Wait for his flip first. Stutters, you said that i felt townie to you, and then you posted a post from me where i replied to CH and said something anti- xfire. Could you explain to me what that had to do with what you said? I could be missing something, but it seemed to be irrelevant to what i had posted there I said its hypocritical for you to call out XFire and myself for lurking when you haven't said anything. Even now, you still haven't taken a stance on anything really. Thus I'm concerned that you're trying to appear active without actually doing anything. | ||
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On February 03 2013 18:45 Nova_Terra wrote: Upon checking XFire, there are a grand total of two people in mind: Poster CH If Crossfire indeed flips scum, we need to take a look at these interactions: + Show Spoiler + On January 29 2013 14:20 Crossfire99 wrote: I don't like this post by Gonzaw (?) because he's saying people shouldn't defend themselves. This is like a townie who is getting lynched and not fighting it. You have to fight the lynch to save yourself and help town in the process. In this game, a lynch is like everyone attacking someone, so I think people should play their decks to the best of their ability and when we find scum, we all attack him because I doubt scum can withstand 7v1. I mean if scum can withstand that, how is this game balanced lol? On January 29 2013 14:27 Crossfire99 wrote: Uh, yeah unless I'm not understanding the magic part correctly. Basically, what you seem to be advocating (feel free to correct me if I misunderstood you) is that people shouldn't play cards which can keep them alive longer. This would be the equivalent of someone fighting to survive a mislynch in a regular game. You don't just want to roll over and die. That only helps scum. On January 29 2013 14:38 Crossfire99 wrote: Oh I understand what you mean now. Yeah people should definitely take a stance and attack a scum read if given the chance. I probably won't be as harsh as you in saying that no one should play defensive creatures, but if someone only defends himself and never attacks, that will definitely play an important part in how I view them. On January 31 2013 08:03 Crossfire99 wrote: YOu know what gonzaw: I just got home. I'm sorry that I don't have all the freaking time in the world to play this game. I need to catch up now. Stupid accusations like that...ah...seriously. Idk what to see. I already made my position clear on Join forces earlier On January 31 2013 08:19 Crossfire99 wrote: Seriously, you want me to use mana for Join Forces, when I think Clockwork is the most scummy as of right now. Oh hey what's this post by you to suck: This makes no sense seriously. I'm just...lask;dfjkl;sdjlakj.f...aaaaaarrrrrrgggggggggggggg...why are you attacking me for playing according to my reads...ajdsfljdfiopjdoajfp On January 31 2013 08:25 Crossfire99 wrote: I have a freaking life and it is pretty busy right now. I played at night when the started 2 days when i had time. I played at night last night when i had time. Now i am playing just when i got home. I really really really really really lrajljafl;dsfjal; klaldsfj want to attack you right now just cause of the crap you just said, but I know that is just me not thinking clearly because of what you said, so I'm not going to decide rihgt now. ughguigho On January 31 2013 08:33 Crossfire99 wrote: I'm according to my reads at this time, which happen to be the smae as the big last post because I haven't had time to play since then. Seriously. And thinking about it some more right now. Clockwork's whole be careful about powering invidual people up and then asking everyone to do it to him reminds way too much of strong from WLIIA, except here clockwork had the balls to tell everyone to be careful of just what he was doing this game. Strong in WLIIA at least didn't try to say bewware of the very thing he was doing. On January 31 2013 08:39 Crossfire99 wrote: Your right Gonzaw. Sorry, for getting so angry. There's a lot of crap going on irl causing me to be stressed and i'm getting way too pissed off at people saying where's crossfire. crossfire isn't here. crossfire needs to post more becaues I know i am literally using every free moment to play this game. I hope we can have a clean start from here and i will try not to let me emotions get the best of me. Feel free to call me out again if I get too angry again. I don't want to play like that. On January 31 2013 08:44 Crossfire99 wrote: I chose to cast the monsters I did because they were the only ones I could cast this turn (and I didn't want to give my mana towards minds aglow). You'll have to ask Risen why he put Shaman in the deck, but Shaman can do more than just do 2 damage to everyone. On January 31 2013 08:48 Crossfire99 wrote: Don't worry about it, I understand we're cool. Time to get back to reading so I can answer your questions in an informed manner.And then they're buddies again. I also don't know what to think as very recently this comes up: + Show Spoiler + On February 03 2013 04:06 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Anyways, I'm lazy so I'll post the "interesting" stuff I found about Xfire: 1)Yesterday he didn't attack with his 3 damage, nor defend himself against Clock's zombies. You might say he didn't defend so he'd have his shaman to do shit, but he could have defended with the goblin, specially since it relates to my next point. Also, since he did ninja-cast last day, I assume he was active in the Attack Phase at some point. I don't know if to believe his IRL busy shit or believe he was lurking every now and then. Even so he could have attacked with his 3 KP when he was active (if as scum he knew he wouldn't be active). It's weird how he didn't attack Clock, his "scumread" he was so pushing when he freaked out at me, which would be 3 free damage to a townie by scum. Unless he thought Clock would block with zombie tokens and destroy his Shaman? Dunno 2)As soon as this T2 started, Xfire claimed scum with the Soul Syphon and stuff. This was WAY too sudden if Soul Syphon was the card he drew this T2, you don't plan to out yourself as scum in 10 seconds like that after receiving that card. My point: Xfire and scum planned Xfire outing himself ever since the T1 Attack Phase, already having drawn Soul Syphon and maybe Soul Warden with Minds Aglow This bit may be interesting to see how the other scum would react in T1 AP. If they already planned on outing Xfire as scum, I'd think his scumbuddy would have no problem at all in instantly bussing him with all his might, considering they knew every townie would know he was scum just 1 cycle later. Or maybe not? Dunno, it's what I want to discuss with Prome, and might as well let you guys know to see what you think /G On February 03 2013 04:10 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: I had this funny conspiracy theory about Clock being Xfire's scumbuddy setting himself up to a late-win. Xfire wouldn't attack him T1 since he's his scumbuddy. Xfire would WIFOM about him being scum today to confuse us and then say "lol I was telling the truth you dumb townies!" in post-game. Also maybe Clock didn't actually want to attack Xfire on T1, but when they figured out they could out Xfire as scum he posted the "Oh actually I'm not suspicious of Suck (who I said I wanted to attack this turn), in fact Xfire is like confirmed scum!" case late-T1. Also like half of the people were suspicious of Clock for some reason at some point (some reason I could never figure out), so hey maybe they were all right, right? And maybe I'm a dumb townie who just can't catch scum. It even seems to "fit" too much lol. It's funny if it's true though (if it is then I should be Town MVP for being the first one to figure it out  )/G At any rate, this has in fact made me more suspicious of Poster. Something about the exchange certainly seems weird. The other interaction was the XFire-CH case. + Show Spoiler + On January 30 2013 14:43 Crossfire99 wrote: -snip- Now onto some scum hunting. Let's take a look at Clockwork shall we. Look at the contradiction at how he responds to virtually the same question: + Show Spoiler + On January 30 2013 00:30 Clockwork Hydra wrote: -snipped- But the worst part is the last bit: 1. Can some over-eager townie please do all the hard work for me, by giving me a cliffnotes version of a long and complicated game? PS. All the time you spend summarizing that game for my lazy ass, you're not scumhunting, so doublescore one for me! 2. More MTG discussion, but this time with extra wishy wash! For the record: we focus down people. Why make it easier for the mafia creature to kill people? That is one of the mistakes made in the first game, which you would know if you had read it... like everybody has been telling you to. The entire post is completely useless. It contributes nothing, yet tries to sound as if he is actually contributing, with a "novel" point on the use of Minds Aglow and a pointless question about policy. If this post didn't put you on instant red alert, your scumdar needs fixing. On January 29 2013 08:59 Clockwork Hydra wrote: -snipped- Well, you mentioned quite a bit of it. They/you spent a LOT of time bickering about useless stuff (not just setup, but completely pointless stuff about setup) and town didn't play as a team (mainly due to everybody mistrusting each other for stupid shit). This game is fundamentally different from normal mafia games not just in that we kill with magic, but because we don't actually have a town-controlled KP. It is thus twice as important to be an active townie, because we are a town TEAM. We need to work together, because our strength is in numbers. This turn people may be able to play one creature, which is a bit of a wimp. But if next turn we can all attack one player with wimps, that will be a healthy chunk of damage. If everybody goes off attacking their own favourite target without reasoning it out properly (like happened in the first 3 turns or so of the previous game), then we have lots of players at 16 life and one dead townie due to mafia creature. That is pointless, and last game was in fact harmful, because the mafia creature could one-shot people sooner than should have been possible (although mafia derped too when they missed an attack). Yes, they're more elaborate forms of our own policies, with some stuff we forgot about. /Acro Also, look at this post where they advise caution when powering up a single person + Show Spoiler + On January 29 2013 09:07 Clockwork Hydra wrote: rhetorical questions, already? huh. As for your points, they're fairly straightforward. The thing about #4 (also kinda applies to #5): Sure it's a townies job to establish his townieness - but if everybody did that properly, we wouldn't need any policies in the first place, now. I shall be reluctant to participate in plans when they result in a favorable position of somebody whose alignment I have no clue about. And I advise everybody to use the same caution in regards to this. On the other hand, I won't have any problems cooperating with people whose townieness I am sure of. (or at least if acro is, that's fine too) ~dandel On January 29 2013 11:00 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Okay so here's the thing: We are running Zombie Infestation. (this badboy right here:+ Show Spoiler + For that reason, we would have prefered Minds aglow next turn (and given all 3 mana, too!), but it seems like like it would be more beneficial to town in general this turn, than delaying until next turn So if it's going to be today, we would REALLY like to cast zombie infestation this turn (instead of contributing mana). And of course still ask everyone else to use as much mana as humanly possible! Not just the lurkers/scum! Everyone! Think of it as a group project! I promise we're not crazy (or scum) ~dandel (with acro's consent) Lastly, I already showed before how their attack on me was bad and all of this definitely has me thinking Clockwork is the first scum. On February 02 2013 00:17 Crossfire99 wrote: So here's where we stand, we need to find 2 mafia. It is turn 2. We acomplished nothing on turn 1. From all the reading of thread I came to the conclusion taht clockwork is the most obvious scum. He might have a strong position in the game, but if we really work together and focus him down, we have a chance of turning this game around. On February 02 2013 03:17 Crossfire99 wrote: Not going to even defend yourself against my accusation, scum? I see how it is. On February 02 2013 05:03 Crossfire99 wrote: Sorry, but I can't let scum kill me with his zombies after all. On February 02 2013 05:14 Crossfire99 wrote: Didn't read the op, scum? On February 02 2013 05:22 Crossfire99 wrote: Thanks for that. Totally didn't realize that lol. Everything that crossfire does here seems fake... The thing is that i would have a hard time believing that he is THAT BAD of an actor. Why are you saying if? XFire claimed scum with his life steal. Do you really think there is any chance of a town flip still? When he flips scum, Wich of these to you think is the second scum? | ||
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I'm working the super bowl. Don't know what my activity will be like. | ||
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On February 04 2013 04:28 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Nova doing that is indeed fucking weird. It's also weird how he thinks like one of me/Prome+Clock is scum based on.....something he didn't specify? And he ignores Aperture, Stutters and maybe even you or someone else. Like...he saw the people that attacked Xfire initially and wanted him dead, and thought those were suspicious? Wtf? Can he be this bad as town? I mean, if he actually made some good points about me/Clock, then maybe it'd be okay, but it seems he just posted that for the sake of posting something "new" and maybe not just "say something someone else has already said thus seem you have no new content". I dunno, but he's acting weird as fuck /G Go check his previous games. If he's town he's actively playing against his wincon because he's never this bad as town. To treat him as anything other than confirmed scum is wrong. We should be focusing on scum 2 instead of getting derailed by this. | ||
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On February 04 2013 05:22 Nova_Terra wrote: well im not actively playing against my wincon, and im still town. Trying to deal with RL issues and all, probably my last TL mafia game cause shit hit the fan. so is life, apparently. I misread that post, thought the second part was about XF. Sorry to hear about that though, hold everything works out. For the game though, if you could kill any person other than XF who would you target and why? | ||
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you as in AS. again were getting more skirtingthe questions. | ||
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On February 04 2013 09:42 Aperture Science wrote: How do you feel about Nova and Rockhydra stutters? I'm still not sold on you being town, but if you are town Nova is definitely my next in line. Tomorrow I actually have a break in my hectic schedule for a few hours so I'm going to be doing some detailed analysis. I haven't given rock much of a look the past turn so my view is obsolete, but from what I noticed he has been wishy washy but when they took stands it felt town. Of course reading closer might change that but at current my attack will be going to either you or Nova. | ||
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today: 2(DoD) or 3(gaeas anthem, bear drop) t4: 4 (dod, gaeas, bear drop) or 6 t5: 8 (2 bears, gaeas, DoD) or 6 | ||
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On February 04 2013 11:50 Aperture Science wrote: Yes. GreY and I both think he's scum. I don't really find Rock scummy, but GreY thinks its Stutters or Rock Any response to how your scummiest points against me were all out of contex ? | ||
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On February 04 2013 15:47 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: It won't work if we don't have the necessary KP, so people should get claiming it (I'm missing Rock, Suck, Stutters and Aperture) I said it. It depends if 2kp or 3kp makes a difference. If not, and there is a decent chance of living to turn five my deck develops much better with a door of Destiny drop today (2kp, 4next turn, lethal with infect turn after, then between 8-15 depending on when I get another bear drop). However unless I will make it two turns from this one, the better play is to skip door of destinies and play the bear and Gaeas Anthem (3kp this turn, 6 next at the sacrifice of 1kp/bear permanently). Currently I'm leaning towards the former because we still have a lot of power on the board but that'll drop as the Mafia creature gets more powerful and starts one shotting people we lose power quick. | ||
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On February 04 2013 15:02 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: So yeah, I'm going to sleep soon You guys better state what you want to do with all the leftover KP: Flip 1 guy, flip 2 guys, or let everybody attack whoever they think is scum If you choose "Flip 1 guy", tell us who you want that guy to be, or thoughts about it If you choose "Flip 2 guys", tell us the 2 guys you want dead, why, and which one is likelier to flip scum than the other in your mind, etc. If you choose "Let everybody attack", then tell us why, and why it is better than the previous 2 options. I want to flip 2 guys. I think it has higher chances of winning the game now. If we suck and derp and kill 2 townies, then it would indeed "accelerate" the game, but at least the scum beast would have less impact on it. Basically, this being a double-lynch. A double-lynch misslynch, followed by scum KP, is better than a misslynch followed by scum KP followed by misslynch followed by scum KP. Hint hint: There is 1 less scum KP in there. Prome wants to flip a guy as well, dunno if he wants 2 or 1, I'll discuss it with him. If we flip 2 guys I want Aperture to be one of them. I have a slight feeling he may flip town, thus wanting to flip a 2nd guy. We are having doubts about this 2nd guy, but me and Prome are discussing about it I hope you guys discuss it as well Brought to you by the Promethelax & gonzaw Administration of Scum Hunting Affairs, LTD. I'm going to bed but I'm leaning double lynch. My two would be aperture and nova for reasons previously stated. The only reason I'm not 100% for it yet is the hurting of our own KP. Attacking whoever is out of the question because it would probably put multiple people in 1hit of the scum monster. I don't think town will actually lose that much though from Nova and Aperture currently though so I think a double its better than single. I just need to go over the math to make sure. | ||
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On February 04 2013 23:53 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Possibilities of terrible terrible damage: Clockwork: minimum of 12. Poster: 11 Rock: 7 Stutters: 3 Nova: 4? Suck: 0 AS: 0 Total: 37. This is enough to kill AS and Suck assuming there is no life-gaining and Xfire doesn't fuck us over. Assuming SnB is a douche and uses his enchantress thingy to block, there is a total of 35 damage dealt. This is still enough to kill both. General mtg advice: @Stutters: by playing Gaea's Anthem and a bear now, you not only get +1 damage this turn, but +2 next turn. This game has probably ended by then. Also, you have no land at all in your hand? @Rock: you can attack anybody you like with your Phyrexian thingy, so attack us: we won't block it. Then ninja in your giant beasty to do 5 damage to the target you actually want to kill. @Nova: your creature pumping thing is an instant and can be cast in the attack phase. Phrase it conditionally to pump 2 creatures that are attacking and are not blocked. Negative, got fucked harder than I thought by that d1 rng discard. If I had another mana I could door and bear today (3 today, 8 tomorrow) but I don't have a way to get a colorless/fetch a forest. | ||
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Rock do you honestly think I'm anywhere close to as scummy as Nova? What changed in the past 24 hours that made your list go from Nova, AS, me to AS, Nova=me? CH I'm assuming you are the next town to go due to your board. Does my 3kp difference over two turns affect our killing potential over the next two days? Right now I don't see how it does and being able to be lethal myself forces either the scum to kill me or town has a free lynch when our kp starts to stagger. | ||
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On February 05 2013 02:28 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Honestly, I think the game ends tomorrow (if it doesn't today). T5, if it happens at all (and we fucked up bigtime if it does), will have 2 townies and 1 scum alive. Mafia creature will be 16/16, so forget about a T6 happening. That means you come out 1 damage ahead if we include T5, if you go the Gaea's Anthem path. Moreover, Infect doesn't play nicely with other forms of damage (you need to do the 10 poison counters all by yourself, whereas everybody can chip in on bringing life total down). You're only lethal on your own if you can guarantee 10 damage regardless of blockers (trample obviously helps). However, 6 regular damage is almost certainly going to be more help than anything < 10 poison counters (even 9). /Acro Well the infect thing would be all ten counters from me in one shot from two 5/5s. What I'm asking is mostly irrelevant to that anyway. I don't have to play triumph if my target can chump the damage out and not die. I want to know the town's opinions on if that 3kp over this turn and the next will affect our lynching ability. We're at 7 left, we kill AS and nova were at 5. mafia mob can't kill unless AS or Nova is the scum and does damage, or someone doesn't follow the town plan effectively outing themselves. Thus we don't lose enough kp to not kill tomorrow. Then we kill someone, mafia kills someone (I'd ssume you), and we're at 2-1. Given everyone will probably be sitting at between 10-15 that day having more kp is insanely better for town because if we get to 1-1 town would lose, at best tie (unless the last toothltown has crazy good instants). The door of Destiny route opens a lot more options if I pull a bear tomorrow (3 5/5s in 2-1situation) and I don't see where that KP would be relevant in the meantime. This is all of course worst case scenario but if we don't hit worst case we've won anyway. | ||
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I was thinking about the adding to towns KP thing but I saw it a little differently. A scum AS has nothing to lose.If he doesn't contribute to town kp, he's still dead this turn (the main question was who else should flip). If he does contribute he's still dead unless someone comes along and WIFOMs into thinking he must be town. I could see a suck/AS double kill today, but if you're wrong and we leave AS alive his deck is probably packing some scary combos and that scares me. | ||
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On February 05 2013 07:03 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Anyways I could probably just sheep you Clock, I don't want to think that much >_> When I over-think I tend to fuck town's chances of winning (e.g last MTG game, maybe iGrok's mini, etc) <_< I do have a feeling we will hilariously fail this game....again /G Marv feels more likely to be town than aperture, but this case actually has me kind of concerned about CH. They've really been milking their Xf case hard for cred all game despite multiple people saying the same things, just without quotes. This case also feels incredibly oportunistic. Why wait so late to post this case when we've been discussing a double kill all day. Additionally the discussion with me about door vs anthem. He tells me to make the play that does less for town when town is going to be dropping kp incredibly fast for no reason other than that the game should be over before DoD really gets rolling despite saying in the same post that we have enough kp tokill them both either way. That doesn't sit well with me. I think an AS Suck kill today might be our best bet and if its still going after to look into taking out clock. If he is scum and we hit 2-1 with all his chumps we'd be completely fucked. | ||
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Stutters695
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On February 05 2013 07:58 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Well, I agree with that Stutters. Prome just told me that as well (he's been awake for 28 hours so won't post here just in case) Kill Aperture and Suck today, and tomorrow (if both were town) focus on Nova and Rock. I'd add that if there is a tomorrow (i.e both Aperture and Suck flip town), we just take a clean state and consider everybody as possible candidates, including Clock, just in case. The thing about Clock is that he could have easily keep going against Suck on T1, and could have jumped on my case on Aperture like Suck did, but he just ignored both and decided to 100% kill Xfire Unless they both planned for Xfire to out himself, then that doesn't make sense at all if he's scum. There's also the fact that he's been active as shit, and maybe has scumhunted more than me this game. Also both heads are pretty active doing shit, not just 1 while the other one goes AFK or something (like Toad last game). Also he was the first one that found Xfire and let his fury against him. Those should count in his favor....right? /G Definitely in his favor but everything about this case feels opportunistic as shit. I also don't giveas much credit to staying on XFire because I'm a reasonably bad scumhunter (like I try, but my value until that gets better is more revolving around confirming myself to people) and I had XF pegged as scum. A bus might not have been the original intention but with how obvious XF was he wasn't living past d2 even if aperture was our d1 lynch. I would seriously consider busing there as they gain almost nothing from xf living an extra day but the town cred is huge. The activity is huge though, my concern is more over if we think there is a chance he is scum we don't win 2v1 vs CH. He can just chump and lol while the mafia mob kills us. We need to decide if he's town and keep his kp or flip him tomorrow because if he survives and is scum we're boned. If he was playing a deck like mine I wouldn't be nearly as concerned as we could take him in lylo easy, butthe horde aspect really worries me and is at least worth accounting for. Again not saying he's scum but we need to really take our time and come to a conclusion because it's probably game deciding. | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
On February 05 2013 08:15 Clockwork Hydra wrote: We aren't town because we made a case on Xfire. We know he was acting super scummy and several people realized it. However, if you were to click on our filter and read a few of our posts, you would realize how much nonsense your allegation is. Also, we're not "milking the xfire case". We are trying to kill scum. PS. If you think "milking the xfire case" is scummy, we present scum Marv: And he never even made a case on Xfire, just non-committally "agreed" to it. Taking credit for a scum lynch when you didn't do jack shit for it? Hell yeah, sign scum Marv up (this scumtell was brought to you by Dandel Ion, the best Ion). /Acro I'm 100% for an AS Marv flip. unless people present valid reasons why that shouldn't be the case I'm going to play the rest of the turn as they're town. If that's wrong, we win no harm done, but if they are town we shouldn't stifle discussion. | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
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Stutters695
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On February 05 2013 08:43 Clockwork Hydra wrote: How exactly is two days' time "too late" to post? I mean, sorry for not posting it on day 1? or what you want from us. Tell me what your actual problem is. Why are you even thinking about that? >.< It's not about who you "should" want to lynch. Are your opinions so weak you have trouble remembering them? ~dandel Again I'm not saying you're scum. Just that after we see the flips from today everyone needs to reevaluate because if you have been playing a great scum game, letting you live past the next turn would all but seal our fate. Your focus on this lynch compared to playing long term worries me. The time thing I meant like hours before the attack phase your case on Marv came seemingly out of nowhere. It's probably just paranoia but I felt it worth bringing up. | ||
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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I'm putting my 2 on AS correct? | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
On February 07 2013 00:15 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: Stutters - stick around for a moment. How did you go from to ? I think the case against you is compelling but I can't shake this suspicion that CH is trying to lynch you before developing into an unkillable position. It's irrational and more than likely wrong (still paranoid after losing YANMM lylo). Your flip makes logical sense for two reasons though: 1) Your scum play is highly touted and I've never seen it so I could be completely wrong about my feel and 2) your deck is much more threatening than Novas. Dropping you first makes more sense if the others are convinced. This just feels too easy, but we'll see in a few hours. | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
On February 07 2013 00:39 Aperture Science wrote: Attacking me is a waste of time since I still cannot do anything. I have 6 lands and a brightstone ritual. There is not a single card I could draw that would let me do anything next turn either. Kill off suck and stutters, suck because theres a good case on him, and stutters because I still think he's scum and if he is, next turn he''ll be unkillable. Sorry, how am I unkillable next turn? I've looking at 2 4/4s, one of which can't attack. If I get lucky and pull a creature (like a 40% chance just estimating), we're looking at 3 4/4s, only one of which can attack and I have a life total low enough to die to town even if I were to chump (which I don't plan on doing). | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
On February 07 2013 01:01 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: but the last quote said you think Nova and AS were more likely to be scum. Is that true or not? If it is true, why do you now think that compared to before? This is going to.sound weird but I think Nova has always been a better flip compared to you (Marv specifically) in terms of being scum. However my lack of knowledge of your meta/reading you, snb's complete lack of interest, and the much bigger threat you pose via your deck if you are scum and I've read you wrong means your flip is much safer because Nova is much easier to deal with next turn than yourself. | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
On February 07 2013 01:23 Aperture Science wrote: He contradicts himself multiple times, and (to me at least) it seems like he's always trying to be on whatever bandwagon is rolling (but never on it TOO hard). I read a lot of people say stutters was a town read, but I didn't really think there were convincing arguments for that. I still think he is on the FBI's Most Wanted list Sorry to disappoint, but I change my mind a lot unless I'm sure. Sure it means I push some stuff that will inevitably be wrong but in exchange for that we see how people react. I always explain why I think what I do as transparently as possible. This is easily the most town game I've played, I'd encourage you to check my previous games if you think otherwise. | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
AS were you being honest about your hand or did you have some serious stuff up your sleeve if we didn't kill you? | ||
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Stutters695
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On February 07 2013 03:18 Aperture Science wrote: Oh, so MTG should only cater to people who just want to play big monsters and swing? (Or lots of little ones I guess) No but running a win-con that one you get rolling early wins regardless of your alignment/others actions goes against the whole mafia portion of the game. There are plenty of things you can do short of a loop into auto-win that aren't just swing big creatures but it certainly isn't traditional magic either way with no counters to instants and the like | ||
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Stutters695
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Stutters695
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On February 07 2013 08:01 Promethelax wrote: The thing is, this game is so heavily themed that the balance is already totally whack; look at how scum could have won day four even though both were caught day one. With so many 'power roles' in town the balance depends highly on town making good reads, if you have seven viggis shooting into each other town is in a terrible place. This would be a very interesting PYP/PTP game since we would all try to balance it for ourselves. Crossfire, the hell were you planning to do with that deck had you rolled town? Yeah, I can see this game turning into a shitfest really quick if it wasn't so easy to establish town reads on some of the stronger decks. It kind of forced everyone to treat this more like a traditional game and less like a game of mtg. The mafia monster kind of contributed to that as well. Seems like this is really hard for the mafia unless they play a win-con like AS did and it all falls into place. Was fun though, thanks for hosting Artanis | ||
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