EPTNewbie Mini Mafia XXXIII - Page 3
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OmniEulogy
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OmniEulogy
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OmniEulogy
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##Vote: Spaghetticus ##FoS: cDgCorazon Congrats Corazon. I still think you are scum but I'm going to hunt your buddies for the rest of the day. This post reads to me "I'm playing my game and I don't care what yours is, I'll just sit in the middle of the room so you know I'm here" And I must have missed the part where you were ever happy to vote for somebody instead of defend them without giving us any other leads. For such a big post it doesn't say very much. Please stop coaching and ask one of the real ones for help because if you are town you've just dragged me away from my top scum reads for a moment. Personally I read Mocsta as town and don't mind him trying to lead conversation for the next day and night. If he is scum the amount of talking he'll have to do will eventually make him slip up. I'll also ask you how Corazon is the towniest person here when as soon as he received a few more votes + Show Spoiler + On December 20 2012 13:27 cDgCorazon wrote: Sigh, I thought this was newbie Mafia, and all of you seem to be using strategies that newbie Mafia players shouldn't know. TL Mafia surfs, maybe? and On December 20 2012 13:28 cDgCorazon wrote: GG were the first things he said. Even if he is being sarcastic it's still just another scum tell in my eyes. You don't post a bunch of potentially scummy things, get told people think you are scum for doing it, and then do it even more. If you are town you try to convince other people that it was a mistake and give them feedback and correct your actions. That taken into account I can explain this massive post as "please don't lynch my scummate" and it all sounds pretty reasonable. | ||
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Sylencia has had a pass today and claimed so ahead of time so we have no reads at all on him. Cakepie hasn't said very much. long posts but not many of them. Kickstart has even fewer posts and much less content. makes it hard to judge him as well. And then Fatchunk would be most likely at the moment if you or Corazon flip scum based on people who have been involved in the conversation. I'd say in those 4 we have a 3rd scum if one is present. | ||
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and if by bandwagon you mean make the case and stick with it for 30~ hours while continuing to bring up new material that hasn't been said. Yup total bandwagon. I ignore the original vote on him as a way to gauge how he reacts and gets conversation started. He slips - argues with Threesr and then I make the 3rd vote on him (2nd with evidence) and push for others to also vote and put pressure on him. I don't think I have to play this game at a higher level than simple. It establishes me as town, helps in scum hunts and I give my input about how people are acting and how I feel about them. Why would I try to be more complex than that in my first game? I'd just confuse people and myself. | ||
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OmniEulogy
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 + Show Spoiler + On December 20 2012 23:20 Spaghetticus wrote: Bugger tomorrow IDGAF While I actually liked the last part and even took a note in the satisfactory column, Omni does little here but say a bunch of safe stuff. He came across as a little bold when he proclaimed his disapproval of thoughtless lynching, but in retrospect this is actually a very safe move. ty, ofc. I'm going to play safe in my first game as VT in mafia. + Show Spoiler + (points finger at Threesr and Corazon) Another safe play. These guys were destined to get it. I predicted the shitstorm (though admittedly I named Shz as well), if the info was available to me it was available to Omni. Targeting the weaker town is a move that a scum naturally does whether they are new or not. What would you do if you were scum? I'd play the same way I am right now but wouldn't have switched my vote from Corazon. Draws unneeded attention. As well as advise my team mates not to make any large plays until day 2 and if possible and there are 3 scum discuss throwing one under the bus themselves N2/D3 to establish one or both of the other scum as good townies. imo pretty basic stuff. + Show Spoiler + If he latched onto Corazon because he realized he would be extremely easy to put him under suspicion. (followed by Corazon actually stating he's Mafia) I can't really see Corazon being town but if he is and has just made every mistake he could then my reason behind Theesr being shitty town would disappear and he would become my #1 scum read instead of #1 shitty town See how if Corazon comes up innocent (which I think he will) then Omni has set the stage to move onto the next easiest player. Even if these players were scum they would pose very little threat. This is positioning for an incredibly strong day three for the mafia, leaving 2-3 strong players, a bunch of lurkers, and zero leads. I've already thought about what happens if Corazon comes up innocent and shz and myself had a nice talk about that earlier. The information we get if he is innocent would still help town. I also like how you take a post from early on in the game and apply its rationale to a point after we have more information. + Show Spoiler + Also Chunk is the only one who has tried to defend Corazon but hasn't come completely out and said he thinks he's innocent, just that with ALL the evidence he still can't vote for him? I'm going to stick with Corazon as my #1 scum read but Chunk seems suspicious just based on that to me. More bagging on the lowest players. The big three are common knowledge and a safe sell at the point of writing the above quote. Omni continues to say absolutely nothing at all risky. He is waiting for things to be safe and then stating the obvious. He openly displays all the signs of posing bluster I resent to demonstrate myself. Why be risky when I am town. scumhunt and give my input is all I've been doing so far in D1. You caught me. doing my role as I intended. + Show Spoiler + If anybody can clearly give us a way to gain more information while at the same time getting rid of suspicion of Corazon I am all for it. I don't want to lynch somebody who could be town just because we all tunnel him. Let's try and get some information from other lurkers. What do they think of the current situation ect. See this? This is someone that has the gall to ask for someone to do the very thing I have been doing, then nails me for it (but only after someone else does... can't be too safe). Clear difference in somebody who scumhunts and somebody who has posted fluff all game, gets voted on for it, and for his defense posts more pointless fluff that doesn't answer anything. What information have you given us exactly? have you seen the results of all of your posts? Any information come out of them? nope. + Show Spoiler + This defense of his vote almost seems like he's committing to a lynch, until you realise he was just waiting for a better lynch for scum to present itself. Yes I believe I'm a bigger prize than Corazon's entirely compromised town play, because I have a better position, and because I play more like a blue role would (less aggression). I still believe he's scum. There is no better lynch than scum. Other scum =/= better. + Show Spoiler + I was ready to tunnel Corazon until your horrid defense to Aqua's case. 100% believe he is scum. Doesn't mean I'm not going to look for other scum though. My defense was not horrid. I take offense. You repeat everything that he is attacking you for. it's horrible. If it wasn't I wouldn't need to be typing right now. + Show Spoiler + and if by bandwagon you mean make the case and stick with it for 30~ hours while continuing to bring up new material that hasn't been said. Yup total bandwagon. I ignore the original vote on him as a way to gauge how he reacts and gets conversation started. He slips - argues with Threesr and then I make the 3rd vote on him (2nd with evidence) and push for others to also vote and put pressure on him. On a person which the zeitgeist favours as a bandwagon. I don't care how long you spent blustering at the obvious pickups of non-town behaviour. The guy's level of play was inadequate and the case made itself. Do you really think his door would not have been knocked down without you? He was in for pressure, from you or otherwise. You wasted your time while pretending to contribute. Scummy. pretending to contribute - putting out information nobody has stated yet and clearly YOU missed his slip. .+ Show Spoiler + I don't think I have to play this game at a higher level than simple. It establishes me as town, helps in scum hunts and I give my input about how people are acting and how I feel about them. Why would I try to be more complex than that in my first game? I'd just confuse people and myself. "I don't know if I'm doing the right thing, so I will assume that I am and not try to improve my play, as playing dumb will convince people I'm town." I know I'm playing D1 1st mafia game ever, I also know I have absolutely no feedback on my play so far. I also know I've built a case based on Corazon both being scum and flipping VT for information (again you are more than welcome to see shz's post for that) I said it myself but it wasn't very clear. He made it make a lot more sense. + Show Spoiler + am actually genuinely impressed with your expression here, regardless of your alignment. The problem I have is that you are pushing to lynch me and my two best town reads because of your failure to look deeper. Try harder. When you address me or speak of me in any way, please refrain from throwing emotional garbage about. It makes me like you more if you don't. Tell me what's wrong with what I said, not how wrong it is. Words without reason are meaningless fluff, or peripheral associative priming depending on who the listener is. A townie should have logic behind his claims. Or just not give any input at all and pretend to be helping I guess. Then get called out for it and still post the fluff you hate. I didn't get emotional stop getting so defensive because I called your defense trash. which it was. Horrid really. + Show Spoiler + Rebuke of Mocsta's Early Town Tells: He was potentially misleading town, and setting himself up to take control. I stopped him the same way I did SS, though I did not make a case out of it because there wasn't one. Theory of Town and Scum: I have not stated my thoughts but that does not mean I haven't devoted a lot of time developing them. I'm confirming with a large degree of confidence that neither Threesr nor Corazon are scum. This degree of confidence is a big deal for a meticulous SOAB like me. I've determined that Chromatiacally, Aquinim, Cakepie, and Mocsta will need to be dealt with later rather than now if they happen to be scum. That's narrowed the list of lynchable candidates down to six for me, this is no small analysis! Your assertion that I have not developed any theory is BS. Rather than flaunt every thought that tickles my ol' brain I know my understanding will only get better with time, and voting now is pretentious or whimsical. Asking Kickstart for meta reads: You say this wasn’t useful. Surely you could see the potential of such a move? I am lighting a fire under a lurker, and attempting to mine a new vein of data. As far as post efficiency goes you can’t fault me on this. “So Spag thinks that the best way to get town back to scumhunting is to defend someone under pressure, not make a case himself? Words fail me.” In this particular instance this is exactly what I thought. I don’t have any really solid cases, I am still narrowing down suspects. Any case I would post at that point would likely fall on deaf ears and I really believed I could benefit town by taking pressure off of the obvious targets and spreading the suspicion around. "Spag's whole "I'm defending Corazon but still happy to vote for him" BS is a classic scum move too - keeping his options open for new developments so he doesn't have to contradict himself later. I'm not saying that town would never do this, but it's pretty damn scummy." I am no longer happy to vote for Corazon which I believe I expressed in the same post. Through writing the post I came to the conclusion that he is the towniest person here, and I will stand by that statement. I am sorry I did not go back through and edit for consistency, I was tired after doing a LOT of legwork for this game. You’re welcome. Where in that is anything not just smoke and mirrors? You don't answer a single thing. You still don't take a firm stance on anything other than ignoring other reads, that you have stayed consistent with, and you still don't offer any scum hunting but instead you say you still don't have enough information to even post on who you think might be scum. You were called out, I didn't think much of it, you returned with nothing, I voted. Aqua's case against you was much stronger than your defense of yourself. | ||
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I'm gonna grab a bite to eat and then see what else can be learned from this. I don't think we have been entirely wrong guys. Corazon/FC/Sylencia/Kickstart still under heavy suspicion from me. When Sylencia starts to post more we'll hopefully get a better read if town/scum. Kickstart has been lurking and its very difficult to see what he actually thinks of this lynch but a few of his posts have been ok. | ||
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To put it simply for you. I am VT. I scumhunt. I give my thoughts to the rest of you. If thats all you've got for a case that I claimed VT and then proceeded to play like a townie and continue to contribute to town... you caught me. Spaghetticus tried his hardest to find something in my filter and couldn't even come back with a FoS and I was voting for him. Don't get distracted on me, it will just waste time. Yes I'm being defensive - this is my defense after all. | ||
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Go make your case, I'll prove you wrong again and then you can hunt some actual scum k? | ||
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Reads I'll start off with Corazon. After re-reading everything he's said a few times I believe I owe him an apology. As he defended Spag while the vote was on him I'm willing to say I believe he is town. He stuck with his vote on Theesr the entire time. I am willing to overlook every mistake up to this point in his posting and trust that what ever he says from now on is from the mouth of a townie. I believe strong town reads are Mocsta, Chromatically, and Aquanim. If Aquanim were scum, he didn't need to try to get Spag lynched to save Corazon, as Corazon defended Spag and imo proved his innocence. If Aqua were scum he could have sat back and let us lynch Cora. - same thing happens N1 but his name isn't out there for starting the lynch. For this I believe Aqua is town. FC's actions at the end of D1 still throw me off a little bit. On one hand he's defending him (much too late) and if he were scum and knew Spag would turn up town it would make it easy for him to try and give a last minute case about why he thinks he's innocent. Hard to tell as he makes a few good points as well. He also tried to defend Corazon when nobody else would. Makes it much harder for me to call him scum now. Theesr moves to my #1 scum read as even during the lynch of Spag he really doesn't seem to care. I believe he even says at one point he doesn't care. Again I owe an apology to Corazon as I believe he might be right in thinking Theesr is Scum or possible SK. Shz fits into a middle ground for me. I am neutral about him for the time being. I'll need to look through the filter again. with them gone the people I really have trouble marking come out. Orange, Kick, Cakepie, and Sylencia. I'll enjoy having Sylencia around more often now and it should bring some more insight on him but I find it incredibly hard to read the other three and can't tell if they represent town or scum at all. TL:DR sorry Cora, I believe you are town along with Mocsta, Aqua, Chrom, and maybe shz/fc Aqua I think you should look this over and see if it makes sense to you. Moc/Chrom/shz/cora as well. I believe if we use D1 as any indicator we can assume this to be correct. I admit I was wrong about Corazon after reading through everything again and thinking about it for awhile. Hopefully we can move on and get some of these lurkers out in the open | ||
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He generally feeds off what other people say and starts conversations with them to try and scum hunt without leading a player in a direction which I also think is a pretty big sign of a helpful townie. | ||
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For very similar reasons as you Mocsta I believe Chrom is town. He was the one who originally made the case against Corazon which at that point was the correct move imo. He advanced our conversations and gave us a lot of information, even with this lynch it has still been helpful in clearing some of the confusion I had after I went over all of the posts. He pressures well, he asks good questions. and again there is a lot to go through but I couldn't find any real scum tells. He made his major cases against FC and Cora and they were both very well thought out imo. Very easy to see him as town at this point. and idk if I take offense to that or not Mocsta  but if you see an error in the way I've said I see things please let me know. That goes for anybody. | ||
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You are absolutely right though. I was intending to switch my vote back to Cora after Spag cleared himself because until that point I hadn't actually thought of him as scummy in the least. but I said it a few times, Aqua's case was much stronger than Spag's defense in my eyes. | ||
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Anyway on to Corazon, as I mentioned in the quote you posted his starting game was bad, as I was going to sleep and reading everything over he was already becoming scum in my mind, I woke up and read through 6~ more pages of him making bad posts, excuses and no real answers to anything and then posts that he's mafia. I honestly just had a hard time anybody would be so nervous that even while being careful they would post so many scummy things. as per what he means about the NK from what I take from it and the only thing that makes sense is that scum will avoid targeting me because they know I'm not blue. If that isn't what he meant about the NK then I don't know. | ||
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