Chrono Trigger Mafia - Page 9

On November 21 2012 11:01 Promethelax wrote:
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Based on the fact that Acro had the same though as me and from our last game together I would currently, put him in my team, along with Acro I would add Marv (come on, wouldn't you?) and as third player I would chose Hapa. Hapa is a guy who over many games I have come to like and respect though I once hated him. He is a great town player and a kinda crappy scum player, seems like the right guy to have along for the ride.
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Clarity, i would agree with you if Hapa's reaction to Kier's questions had been what I expect from a town Hapa but it wasn't. My short list is a little bit shorter. Why would you vote anyone you don't have a town read on?

I would expect an explanation from you, Hapa, as to why you mind changed. Not an explanation from someone else while you got mad about being asked. My version of your town meta is where you pressure people until they cry and admit that they are scum or poop themselves in fear of your tunnels even though they are town.

hapa: How many games have you played with Sandro that make you aware of, and able to read, his meta?

Clarity: I see your reasoning and agree with it, I just don't have that town feel from Hapa. (as Hapa knows I never have a town feel from him).

Marv: while Hapa is a cute little hedgehog he is usually a responsive one. Not getting a scum read from his behavior but I am uncomfortable with him not explaining himself and getting defensive instead.

Hapa reads as non-town to me he has not been the assertive, pushy in my face townie I expect and I don't like it.

Hapa, you will not get my vote today. You come to late to change this election and I don't like that you push us away from Sand/Syllo but don't mention Kita except as a 'joke'

My read on Hapa: not assertive enough to meet either of his metas, there were some early posts which rang false to me and I do not trust him. Too early for me to say scum but not to early for me to have you far from my green list.

Hapa: you ignored everything I said in response. I think you know better that my actions follow the way I think about the game which, as should be obvious, is not always the dominant way of thinking. Since you haven't responded to me I don't have more to add except that you are a top scum read for me now. I've never seen you, as town, push that someone is scum but also refuse to engage with them. You are more hands on.
I expect this disengaged sort of attack from Zbo but not from you.

On November 26 2012 11:38 Promethelax wrote:
He didn't even conclude that. When I directly asked him he said that Toad would most likely flip scum. Okay Hapa, I'm buying your case more and more the more he talks.

On November 27 2012 10:59 Promethelax wrote:


he voted and posted, you haven't been reading the thread (also obvious in your mixing up names event). This is not your town play. You are not town. You should not be a member of this party.

On November 27 2012 11:04 Promethelax wrote:


it isn't a case. It is: you are better than this. This is not your town play. You have been in and out, not laying heavy pressure on people, not trying to be the guy who takes control and skating by. These accusations aren't passive your play does not match your town play. It doesn't match your scum play either but after mario I assume you've been working on that.

On November 27 2012 11:13 Promethelax wrote:
your case on Hopeless was good.

I don't know that you are scum.

I know that you are too far from your townie self for me to trust you. It isn't just the misreading/missing that I don't like. You are a guy who gets his reads from putting pressure on people which you have not done this game.

On November 27 2012 11:33 Promethelax wrote:
sorry Hapa maybe that wasn't clear. I don't know that you are scum. I am pretty sure you are not town. Not town =/= scum.

Dien: poll=bad idea no way to old people accountable for their votes/choices

On November 27 2012 11:35 Promethelax wrote:
also a top scum read is different than totally my top scum read this guy 100%. I think you understand what an indefinite article is.

On November 27 2012 11:54 Promethelax wrote:


you were a top scum read. Why would I bother to push my read on you as scummy, you were scummy and I could do nothing about it. Until you started pushing yourself as a leader (again) when I brought that back up because you should not be leader and, were it up to me, you'd also not be in the party.

No one who is new to the party should be the leader. That is fucking dumb. We have guys who have been partially confirmed by the game mechanics and we have to choose someone to receive a reward which helps town, do we set one of the partially confirmed guys up to take it or do we give it to the other guy who really wants to be a leader?

I'm going through your filter now.

On November 27 2012 12:08 Promethelax wrote:
My read didn't matter. You were scummy and I did not use my ability to protect you. Now, when you tried to put yourself in a party I opposed you. Similar to when, in a normal game, we would propose lynch candidates in this game we oppose quest members. I oppose you for quest member.

When we had a chance to lynch I was more confidant in Sand being scum than you being scum.

Your insistence that scum would not want to push themselves onto the party because 1 for 1 is dumb and you know it.

re-reading your filter I don't think I can make a strong case on you Hapa. The thing is I also can't make a strong town case for you. I'm battling my usual Hapa=scum mentality but I can't decide which way I've erred. Either way you are not my top scum read right now. Toad is scum. After Toad there are a few people I would am looking at: you, Syllo, Zbo and the TC/Hope/Acro triangle.

On November 27 2012 12:13 Keirathi wrote:

There was no lynch. I don't particularly see a problem with your whole "He wasn't pushing his scum read" thing when he had no avenue for getting you killed. There are a lot of people that aren't pushing scum reads and you're just singling him out because he said he didn't want you in the party.

FWIW, I have a very slight town read on Prom. Not enough to bet on it or anything, but that's the way I'm leaning right now. And I still wouldn't ever lynch him over toad, and someone out of the whole TC/Acro/Hopeless debacle.

On November 27 2012 12:14 Promethelax wrote:


look, if I was scum I'd cherry pick your filter and build a damn good case. I'm giving you my honest read. Which is: confused.

On November 27 2012 12:24 Promethelax wrote:
I am not building one because the one I made didn't convince me. there are things in your favour and things that point to you being scum. I am not going to make a case that I'm not convinced of (though I tried to in ACME) my gut read on you is anti-town and there are things to back that up. My case comes out null though and therefore I am not going to push you.

Do you really think that I am such a bad scum player that when pressured I would make no case? Go look at XIX, I can make one hell of a convincing case as scum. There is nothing to be gained by not making one if I am scum.

On November 27 2012 12:31 Keirathi wrote:
@Hapa:

I find it strange that rather than asking me to expand on my town read on Prom, you decided it would be a better idea to repeat to me your reasonings that he is scum. Like I wasn't able to read them 15 posts ago.

On November 27 2012 12:32 Promethelax wrote:
watch out Kier, you've been passively accusing him all game. That probably makes you scum and stuff.

On November 27 2012 12:42 Keirathi wrote:
It's mostly meta things that Prom has done as town and scum.

For one, the day 2 "gambit" that secured sandroba's lynch (at least for me). Town Prom loves pulling silly gambits that have the potential to backfire horrendously (just look at his two gambits in ACME; they were terrible and got townies lynched [no offense prom]). The whole "sandroba: why did you target syllo" is definitely something town Prom would do.

And the reason I don't think scum Prom would have done it is because of his scum play in newbie XIX. He played all-or-nothing for the entire game, and by the end was entirely linked with both of his partners. I'm sure he's a better player now than he was then, and sandro could have said "Hey Prom, bus me!" in scum QT, but my gut is still that that isn't the way he would have done it.

On November 27 2012 12:38 Promethelax wrote:


man, definite article and indefinite article mean totally different things. You were one of my top scum reads (ergo: "a top scumread). Looking back through your filter instead of looking at how your play feels I have more of a null read on you. As I mentioned there are good reasons to point to your scumminess and good reasons which point towards your townieness.

On November 27 2012 13:14 Keirathi wrote:

I'm talking about day 2.

Sandro claimed that he was roleblocked, and Prom said "Sandro, why did you target syllogism?" Then Sandro answered that he used Shadow on syllogism. That was a major factor in me voting for Sandro, because at the time, I thought Prom was implying that he was some kind of watcher/tracker, and that Sandro had targetted Syllo even though he claimed to be roleblocked and was therefor lying.

Then, of course, Prom explained his ability the next day, and it was nothing like that, just a gambit/hunch that sandro had targetted syllo.

Now, does that seem like a normal way to bus, if your scum team is telling you to bus in the QT? I don't. It would have been much more natural to either just sheep onto the wagon or make up a case.

On November 27 2012 13:20 Keirathi wrote:
EBWOP: Again, I don't necessarily have a strong read on Prom. Maybe he is scum, maybe he's not. But we have 2 red checks that are our number 1 and 2 priorities, and I doubt we'll get a third lynch cycle, so this discussion is kind of pointless.

On November 27 2012 13:22 Keirathi wrote:
TC has a parity check on Acro and Hopeless. They are different alignments.

On November 27 2012 13:27 Keirathi wrote:

I'm pretty on the fence about which one of the two are scum.

I mean, a case can definitely be made for Hopeless being scum. Hell, they HAVE been made.

But I could make a case that Acro is scum too :o

Not to mention the fact that TC checked Acro vs Hopeless is weird as fuck to begin with.

On November 27 2012 13:34 Keirathi wrote:

Yes, checking Hopeless makes sense. Checking him against someone who's still an "unknown" rather than against one of the near-confirmed town people is what doesn't make sense. Why not check him against, say, Dieno?

And there are just too many weird things about Acro for me to ignore.