META CASE ON KICKSTART
ok
Filter for mario mini, Kickstart is town
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=381440&user=36871
Filter for newbie mafia XXXI, I think he is scum
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=381931&user=36871
The only other game kickstart played was mario mini.
he posted stuff like this
+ Show Spoiler +On November 14 2012 12:33 Kickstart wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 12:25 Hapahauli wrote:On November 14 2012 12:19 Kickstart wrote:
I am down for flipping you and BH at this point. I am not really interesting in arguing with you about it - I find the fact that I was down for voting BH and you, then after him claiming jk just voting for you to be perfectly reasonable. Again I want other people to weigh in though. I don't. Your logic is completely disproportionate. You show every indication of wanting BH dead and are very eager about "flipping" him. You don't trust his claim, don't like his posts, don't like anything about him, then magically twist your vote on me because apparently you don't like a "bandwagon" I started. Yet you sympathize with my logic, yet disagree with it by ignoring all of my emphasized points. It. Makes. No. Sense. And I"m having a very difficult time figuring out if you're just dense about it or you have a mafia motive for all of this. You don't, I do - that is ok with me. Having a scum read on both you and BH and voting you over him is not as big of a leap as you are trying to make it sound. And I have not "magically twisted my vote" on you, I have given my view on you from the beginning, and unlike some - have voted once, and not by way of bandwagon.
He is calm and logical.
Then in this game,
He posts emotional bullshit.
+ Show Spoiler +On November 27 2012 00:09 Kickstart wrote:Ah I get to wake up to a case on me and many questions to answer, have to say I wasn't anticipating that. I am catching crap for "defending cheese". First off I am suspicious of everyone and no one at this point is confirmed town, but if me pointing out that the cases against him are absolute SHIT, then you can claim I am defending him, but saying that a case is founded on bad logic or that I don't agree with the case is hardly scummy. Show nested quote +On November 26 2012 05:35 Kickstart wrote:
In regards to your case on cheesecake SDM, I am personally not a fan of meta cases (they did not go well at all in my last game lol), I am much more interested in a players activity in this game. I have to agree on the point that he has echoed what has already been said in the thread, I just personally think it is a null tell at this point.
Right now I really need to hear more from the people lurking, they've had almost a day at this point to post something of substance and engage in some conversation. Show nested quote +On November 26 2012 06:00 Kickstart wrote:
I just haven't had good experience with meta-cases, plus since this is a noobie mini I wonder if there is really enough of a history on any player for a meta case to actually hold much weight. To be fair though I haven't played with any of the people in this game so I would really have to read up on them to formulate an opinion on meta cases unless people pulled extensive posts from the other games - but that is asking a bit much this early imo. That is basically why I said I am more interested in this game, but of course a solid case is a solid case, so if one can be made using someones performance in past games go for it. Interested in reading Cheese defense though. Show nested quote +On November 26 2012 06:03 Kickstart wrote:
Was ninja's by cheese! But he basically defended as I thought - how can you make a meta case on someone who only has two game, one as each faction ;/. There are all the posts where I "defend" cheese, and all they say is meta cases in a noobie game where the person has only played one game each as town and scum is not worth anything to me. If you disagree then whatever, but me saying this is hardly scum, it is me trying to be a logical town. I am not going to just let shit cases fly on people when I don't think the cases hold any weight. With that being said, I will explain why Aquas case on me is also shit. So he decides to start out by going after my first post as useless, content-less, and just a space filler. Well I take offence to that, especially given the posts of the majority of people in this thread. I think my post: Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 17:20 Kickstart wrote:Hello all, This is my second game, my first game was mario mini mafia where town won! (we lynched mafia first day and shot one first night, hopefully we can do the same here!) you can see the game here if you want to check my filter: Mario Mini MafiaOn the lurker lynch policy, I think scum reads should trump everything because the goal of the game is to find the scum. If someone doesn't post at all then they will likely get modkilled/replaced anyways, and if someone isn't posting much at all then we need to pressure them more. But yeah if someone is hardly posting and we have nothing else to go off of then that person would be a good D1 lynch. On that note we shouldn't get bogged down in policy talk too much because it is easy for mafia to hide in it (everyone can just be like "oh yeah mmhmm lets do that that sounds good" without contributing anything at all or can just keep the policy talk going on for awhile so that no other discussion is being had. And cheesecake all the way. @ OatsmasterIf you really have a scum read on Mr.Cheesecake then you need to make a case on him that tries to persuade us all. Posting "I have a feeling he is scum" is not going to make anyone throw their vote on him. Would you maybe expand a bit on why you think he is suspicious or if you still do? Is much better than almost anyone's first post, and it has substance. I quickly say what needs to be said about policy because focusing on it too much is horrid as town, and I point out some shit play coming out from oatsmaster. Then I get accused of "lurking" because I didn't post for four hours. I am not sure if this is a serious accusation or him grasping at straws to try and make a case. But frankly it is ridiculous, it is the start of the game, I posted a perfectly good introduction post that asked questions of people, and I was waiting for the answer. How you could possibly accuse ME of lurking in this thread is beyond me given the activity that I have had compared to others. But I will write it off as an attempt to bolster your "case" on me. Then the rest of your "case" is just me going after Oatsmaster in an opportunistic way. For one, I am the FIRST person who was telling him to step up his posts in the beginning and I called him out for giving a half-assed vote without ANY explanation. AND HE IS STILL FUCKING DO IT, LOOK AT HIS RECENT POST: Show nested quote +On November 26 2012 16:05 Oatsmaster wrote:
I have a strong feeling that he is scum. I cant prove it due to having less than 10 posts to analyse.
On the fence means that I didnt see anything from him to change my vote.
Really? I pointed out the fact that saying "well there isn't much to go off of" and then saying you feel he is scum is really, really, silly - but Oats just continues to tunnel Cheese. I have just pointed out that Oats is playing horrible and that I am suspicious of it. And my case on Oats is not meaningless as you would like to paint it to be, look at his posting - completely confusing and doesn't drive any discussion at all; he is then asked to please give some real reasons and sound logic for his votes and he refuses while just continuing to post nothing of substance. And it also seems to me that a shitty wagon on Cheese has formed that he is all too keen to sit on. Now again I must say I don't know if Cheese is town or not, but the case against him is crap and not convincing to me at all. Could he still be scum? Yes, but I won't be voting on crap cases, and other than a few horrible cases on him there is nothing; as is the case with this "case" on me.
Look at the difference in effort in making the 2 lists.
Newbie
+ Show Spoiler +On November 27 2012 00:38 Kickstart wrote:
I am going to copy the player list and then give reads on them from what I have gathered so far, if you want a more in depth read on someone ask away but I will try and make them as substantial as I can based on what we have to work with so far.
HeloKnight: I read him as a timid townie so far. Early on he was not posting much and got some flak for making easy points, but afterwards he did step it up and defended himself and then went on to make a case on Munk-E, so I get a slight town read on him (although as with most players in the thread so far, there isn't much to go off of).
Aquanim: Despite his case on me I read him as slightly town. Actually the case on me gives me that read because aqau is activiely trying to scum hunt and bringing pressure onto people that weren't being pressured at all before, so this I like as town play and encourage him to continue doing.
Mr. Cheesecake: null read. I soft-defended him because I felt like the cases were bad and had no weight, which I think can be agreed upon by everyone. Unfortunatly most of his posting doesn't allow me to have a town read on him because he hasn't done much in the way of sticking his neck out on anything. But on the other hand he has been forced to defend himself for most of Day 1 so I give him a null read thus far.
Sonic Death Monkey: SDM is my top town read so far. Again no one is confirmed town at this point but SDM is playing incredibly well and is a benefit to town at this point. He is pressuring people, providing honest and well thought out reads on people and at this point is a huge asset to town.
Oatsmaster: I think at this point everyone knows my views on Oats, so I won't expand on them much here. I think he is slightly scummy.
Jacob Strangelove: Null-read, here is another player who I don't feel I have enough to work with. He has posted a bit but again I don't feel strongly one way or the other just because there isn't much to go off of here.
Munk-E: There isnt much to be said that is new. Two posts - both not giving us much and one is just jumping on Oats with points that have been made. I would say LURKER but if i have to choose between town and scum I would say slight scum read, simply because I feel a town player would want to be more active while a scum player would do as he has - try to hide and maybe jump on some cases if he sees an opportunity.
Kickstart: I read myself as town ! No but seriously, If YOU want a read on me just read my posts in context, I feel like I have been trying to push sound reasoning and logic throughout the game and been nothing but honest about my reads on people.
Yamato77: Too many one liners for my taste, he did provide one large general read post (much like this one) but other then that has not tried to scum hunt at all - just nothing. I have to give yamato a slight-scum read at this point because he has been around, he has posted enough, but it has mostly been one-liners with no substance. Again I feel like a town player would want to make real, substantial posts instead of just coming in with one liners on everything.
Mario Mini
+ Show Spoiler +On November 16 2012 10:21 Kickstart wrote:So anyways I looked back over the D1 lynch to read through it more carefully because it was a huge mess. Here are some of my thoughts on it. Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 11:00 Dandel Ion wrote:Final Votecount:DarthPunk (1): thrawn2112 Z-BosoN (5): Clarity_nl, marvellosity, Crossfire99, strongandbig, Hapahaulidebears (1): Hopeless1derHapahauli (6): Z-BosoN, Blazinghand, debears, iamperfection, Kickstart, DarthPunkHapahauli has been lynched!
Full version (disregarded):+ Show Spoiler +debears (2): Z-Boson, strongandbig, Hapahauli, Hopeless1nder, marvellosity, strongandbig
DarthPunk (7): Hapahauli Hapahauli, Clarity_nl, thrawn2112, Blazinghand, iamperfection, Blazinghand, Blazinghand, Hapahauli, debears, Z-BosoN, Kickstart, debears
Hopeless1der (0): debears, marvellosity, marvellosity, Z-BosoN, Kickstart, debears, debears
Z-BosoN (4): Blazinghand, iamperfection, Blazinghand, marvellosity, Clarity_nl, marvellosity, DarthPunk, Crossfire99
Hapahauli (0): iamperfection, strongandbig. Kickstart, Blazinghand
Blazinghand (0): iamperfection, Z-BosoN, marvellosity, iamperfection, strongandbig, Crossfire99
iamperfection (0): Hapahauli, Bloatinghand
thrawn2112 (0): Hapahauli
strongandbig (0): DarthPunk, Z-BosoN, Clarity_nl, Hapahauli, DarthPunk
Clarity_nl (0): DarthPunk
marvellosity (0): debears
Crossfire99 (0): marvellosity, debears, Blazinghand
Not voting (0): Now the townreads aren't set in stone for everyone I put as town nor are the people I didn't mark green suspicious, this is just based off of the D1 lynch and I would like to make a case for why I think these people are town: Regarding Z-BosoNHere is just an outline of my views on ZB throughout the game so far because my town read on him just builds as time has gone on. + Show Spoiler +On November 14 2012 00:41 Kickstart wrote:
@debears
I have a slight scum read on Hapa at the moment, because of what I outlined in that post and the fact that in general I found his posting to be (trying to find the most polite way to phrase it :D) non-productive.
Hopeless hasn't really stood out to me too much. His posting has been under the radar and not sticking his neck out much, almost his entire filter is the discussion about if crossfire is a smurf or not. So overall I view him as slightly "anti-town" thus far. I would just like to hear more of his thoughts on something/someone not related to cross being a smurf or not.
ZB started the SnB bandwagon which I have already stated I am completely against, so I want to see if he sticks with it. In general his posts have been substantive - out of six posts one is a roleclaim, two he casts a vote on someone and gives some explanation, and then the others he is reacting to/reading people. I see no reason yet to question his miller claim, but again a lot of that could change depending on how he continues with the SnB vote.
With that I am going to go to sleep and won't be back on for awhile. I will try and catch up and post before heading to class but if not I have all night once I get back! So I did not like the whole SnB bandwagon to begin with and therefor was watching how ZB acted around it but off the bat I felt his posts were pro-town and contributing. ZB came under fire for his new posting habits but the above is part of the reason why I didn't like the meta case and why I refused to lynchvote ZB. See this quote for more of the same on why I didn't want to lynchvote ZB (made at the time when a large number of votes were on him): + Show Spoiler +On November 15 2012 09:57 Kickstart wrote:Regarding Z-BosonI am not comfortable with a lynch on ZB. So he is playing differently and posting less, but when I take a look at his filter I see some very lengthy and thought out posts that offer good analysis. I don't think that lynching him due to him posting differently this game is fair, especially when his posts are pretty significant (I said earlier that even though his filter wasn't large, every post contributed something). I take Hapas word that before this game even started he talked with ZB and ZB discussed wanting to change his posting style a bit (though a skype log would be nice!).
Why lynch someone who has changed their posting style when you could be lynching someone who isn't being pro-town at all:Regarding Hopeless1derLook at his filter, there is NO attempt to find scum, the only person he gos after is debears, but only after debears went after him. The first half of his filter is talk about people being afk and/or smurfs - this really doesn't help at all. And his post where he reads debears: + Show Spoiler +On November 14 2012 22:16 Hopeless1der wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 14:54 debears wrote:
For all you who think me being afk is a scumtell, which you guys are retarded if you do
Let me just say this once. Fuck off debears. Nothing personal, but in all seriousness OMGUS. I'm still your scum read because I've done nothing since you laid into me for 'lecturing town'. If you still want to harp on that chord, you're not being a good little townie. I was afk for longer than you were, and you have nothing new to post in the thread. I'll lay this out for you. This is the post I was "lecturing" about: Show nested quote +On November 13 2012 10:49 DarthPunk wrote:On November 13 2012 10:44 marvellosity wrote:
you can't active lurk in a game that's less than 2 hours old, numbnuts.
If anyone's 'active lurking' it's me. Put that in your pipe and smoke it. Don't shut people down who are obviously trying their best to scum hunt and contribute. You are only going to discourage those things. Or is that what you want? I was not lecturing everyone, I was responding to a single post and listing multiple examples of less than stellar reasons to vote for someone. I was told to drop it with you so you could focus on the rest of the game instead, because I was distracting you from being useful. Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 00:17 marvellosity wrote:
Hopeless, I think you're making too much of that. The bit you bold says "was" - past tense, that was his stance previously (when he'd missed my Crossfire post).
Like debears said just now there's not a lot to say about Crossfire otherwise, you can't really have a stance on someone who hasn't posted yet.
The whole issue is overblown and should be dropped. If only because it's a big distraction to debears, who has to keep talking about it, and it's not helping anyone And yet I'm still your top scum read and iamperfection is still the only other player you'll really talk about. You haven't commented on anything significant (neither have I yet, but fuck it, you're already voting me) I dont give a shit what your IRL issues are, same as you probably dont care why I was gone. I care that you claim that there are no better cases than the one on me when you have no new information and are just stuck on the fact that I'm afk and therefore avoiding you. What's more, you aren't even pushing me as your scum read. Yes this is an OMGUS vote. ##Vote: debearsAm I going to need to pull a BH and shoot my load earl--I mean sift through my own meta to find examples of me being a jackass? Btw debears, why in the hell were you unable/unwilling to comment on BH's claim? On November 15 2012 06:27 Hopeless1der wrote:
In response to Z-Bo's case on me:
- No comment on BH should still hold merit as an attack against debears, especially if used as a contributing factor to my own scumminess.
Meta read - Earlier you said my meta this game was comparable to LVII. You've 180'd that read. I have no conclusion here, I'm just pointing it out.
Other points from meta: Me referring back to previous cases. I had an actual case to refer back to, and I was also much more convinced by that case. This game, we have me being inactive, Cross being modkillable the first 24 hours or so, thrawn afk, DP afk, BH trolling. Lots of things that just sucked bag. In LVII, we have Matt claim scum super early and the ensuing discussions were getting excessively redundant until Palmar came in and confirmed Matt was fakeclaiming. Before that, I was trying to focus the thread a little. This game is no where near as out of control as that situation was and also (IRL bullshit that no one cares about)
Since BH has claimed, I find debears to be incredibly scummy, and Marv made a point of articulating already. I felt he was scummy before from the way he attacked me for lecturing and it being anti-town. I also felt his meta/smurf's are unreadable comments were contradictory and he was twisting words to make a case on me based on very little information. However, I was explicitly told to drop my suspicions because they were a) poorly thought out and b) distracting debears from helping town.
He hasn't helped town. Hapa's case on debears is spot on (in my heavily biased opinion) and I don't want to lynch anyone else right now. His only reason for voting debears is that debears made a read on him and voted him. And then there is this: Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 09:21 Hopeless1der wrote:
@Marv's case on Z-Boson - Quite frankly, if it saves me, I'll vote Z-boson, otherwise my vote stays parked on debears. I still think Z-Bo is town though, I just happen to know I'm town. I don't like this at all. Hopeless clearly states that he views ZB is town, earlier in the game ZB makes a small meta case and hopeless doesn't vote him (rightfully so) - but now he will throw his vote on ZB??? You don't scum hunt at all, say you view ZB as town but are willing to vote for him, and keep your vote parked on debears all game solely because debears made a read on you and threw his vote your way. This is not town oriented play in my opinion. Then there is the day 1 voting. ZB was one of the potential lynch candidates and at a point it seemed he was goign to be the lynch (with 8 votes on his head no less!): Note that this is right before the wild swing of votes to Hapa, so had that note happened it was ZB getting lynched. + Show Spoiler +On November 15 2012 10:55 Dandel Ion wrote:votecount:DarthPunk (2): thrawn2112, KickstartZ-BosoN (8): Clarity_nl, marvellosity, DarthPunk, Crossfire99, Blazinghand, strongandbig, iamperfection, Hapahaulidebears (1): Hopeless1derHopeless (2): Z-BosoN, debearsCurrently, Z-BosoN is set to be lynched!
Full version (disregarded):+ Show Spoiler +debears (2): Z-Boson, strongandbig, Hapahauli, Hopeless1nder, marvellosity, strongandbig
DarthPunk (7): Hapahauli Hapahauli, Clarity_nl, thrawn2112, Blazinghand, iamperfection, Blazinghand, Blazinghand, Hapahauli, debears, Z-BosoN, Kickstart, debears
Hopeless1der (0): debears, marvellosity, marvellosity, Z-BosoN, Kickstart, debears, debears
Z-BosoN (4): Blazinghand, iamperfection, Blazinghand, marvellosity, Clarity_nl, marvellosity, DarthPunk, Crossfire99
Hapahauli (0): iamperfection, strongandbig. Kickstart, Blazinghand
Blazinghand (0): iamperfection, Z-BosoN, marvellosity, iamperfection, strongandbig, Crossfire99
iamperfection (0): Hapahauli, Bloatinghand
thrawn2112 (0): Hapahauli
strongandbig (0): DarthPunk, Z-BosoN, Clarity_nl, Hapahauli, DarthPunk
Clarity_nl (0): DarthPunk
marvellosity (0): debears
Crossfire99 (0): marvellosity, debears, Blazinghand
Not voting (0): Looked bad for our pal ZB so this is "dying post": + Show Spoiler +On November 15 2012 10:55 Z-BosoN wrote:
LYNCH HAPAHAULI.
LYNCH BLAZINGHAND. when he is alive day 3.
marv, hope you learn you are not the fucking god of mafia, and see that meta reads are only worth it if it isn't fucking obvious stylistic proven logical and pre-claimed reasons. Turns out he was right (halfway at least but I suspect 100% right ^^). So in summation I've always felt pretty good about ZB and then the D1 lynch just solidified it. Regarding DarthPunkBasically I agree with and echo the idea that when DP was set to be lynched, he did an extremely good job of showing that he was town. And an interesting note is that like ZB, when DP thought he was the lynch, he names Hapa and BH aswell : + Show Spoiler +On November 15 2012 10:43 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 10:37 iamperfection wrote:On November 15 2012 10:35 DarthPunk wrote:On November 15 2012 10:34 iamperfection wrote:
DP DO NOT RUN AWAY IF YOUR TOWN. Give reads on the people voting on you. I just did. more How about this. I was probably not going to be lynched until two of the best town players I know who are very rarely wrong about scum reads lead the most retarded wagon in the world on me which is wrong. So either they are worse than I thought. Can't read me at all or are scum. Hapa is not playing the same as GSL he is playing worse. Hi scum game is townie though so be wary of that. But he is not giving the confident and often correct reads taht he usually gives as town. He is starting up a stupid fucking wagon that he is usually wary of as town. Hapa is like the fucking divine presence of level headedness usually but this band wagon is not it. BH I have never played with before. But he is reading scum into things that should not be read as scummy. SO he might just be worse than I thought. Marv is actually fucking right although rightly confused but seems townie from genuinely wanting to figure shit out rather than leap onto a retarded wagon. Also. How much fucking conviction does BH have in his reads when I am so scummy but then he insta votes for a fucking Coin toss. BH is scum. Because he doesn't give a fuck about the lynch as long as he lynches a townie. So those are my two strong town reads out of the lynch. Again the others I showed as green or did not is only an indication of how I viewed the lynch (some of the people I left unmarked I feel are very likely town for example). As for the people I had marked as SCUM: Well, Hapa doesn't need much explaining :D (GJ town!). Regarding Hopeless1derBefore the lynch I posted my read of him, and so far it all remains relevant: + Show Spoiler +On November 15 2012 09:57 Kickstart wrote:Regarding Z-BosonI am not comfortable with a lynch on ZB. So he is playing differently and posting less, but when I take a look at his filter I see some very lengthy and thought out posts that offer good analysis. I don't think that lynching him due to him posting differently this game is fair, especially when his posts are pretty significant (I said earlier that even though his filter wasn't large, every post contributed something). I take Hapas word that before this game even started he talked with ZB and ZB discussed wanting to change his posting style a bit (though a skype log would be nice!). Why lynch someone who has changed their posting style when you could be lynching someone who isn't being pro-town at all: Regarding Hopeless1derLook at his filter, there is NO attempt to find scum, the only person he gos after is debears, but only after debears went after him. The first half of his filter is talk about people being afk and/or smurfs - this really doesn't help at all. And his post where he reads debears: + Show Spoiler +On November 14 2012 22:16 Hopeless1der wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 14:54 debears wrote:
For all you who think me being afk is a scumtell, which you guys are retarded if you do
Let me just say this once. Fuck off debears. Nothing personal, but in all seriousness OMGUS. I'm still your scum read because I've done nothing since you laid into me for 'lecturing town'. If you still want to harp on that chord, you're not being a good little townie. I was afk for longer than you were, and you have nothing new to post in the thread. I'll lay this out for you. This is the post I was "lecturing" about: Show nested quote +On November 13 2012 10:49 DarthPunk wrote:On November 13 2012 10:44 marvellosity wrote:
you can't active lurk in a game that's less than 2 hours old, numbnuts.
If anyone's 'active lurking' it's me. Put that in your pipe and smoke it. Don't shut people down who are obviously trying their best to scum hunt and contribute. You are only going to discourage those things. Or is that what you want? I was not lecturing everyone, I was responding to a single post and listing multiple examples of less than stellar reasons to vote for someone. I was told to drop it with you so you could focus on the rest of the game instead, because I was distracting you from being useful. Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 00:17 marvellosity wrote:
Hopeless, I think you're making too much of that. The bit you bold says "was" - past tense, that was his stance previously (when he'd missed my Crossfire post).
Like debears said just now there's not a lot to say about Crossfire otherwise, you can't really have a stance on someone who hasn't posted yet.
The whole issue is overblown and should be dropped. If only because it's a big distraction to debears, who has to keep talking about it, and it's not helping anyone And yet I'm still your top scum read and iamperfection is still the only other player you'll really talk about. You haven't commented on anything significant (neither have I yet, but fuck it, you're already voting me) I dont give a shit what your IRL issues are, same as you probably dont care why I was gone. I care that you claim that there are no better cases than the one on me when you have no new information and are just stuck on the fact that I'm afk and therefore avoiding you. What's more, you aren't even pushing me as your scum read. Yes this is an OMGUS vote. ##Vote: debearsAm I going to need to pull a BH and shoot my load earl--I mean sift through my own meta to find examples of me being a jackass? Btw debears, why in the hell were you unable/unwilling to comment on BH's claim? On November 15 2012 06:27 Hopeless1der wrote:
In response to Z-Bo's case on me:
- No comment on BH should still hold merit as an attack against debears, especially if used as a contributing factor to my own scumminess.
Meta read - Earlier you said my meta this game was comparable to LVII. You've 180'd that read. I have no conclusion here, I'm just pointing it out.
Other points from meta: Me referring back to previous cases. I had an actual case to refer back to, and I was also much more convinced by that case. This game, we have me being inactive, Cross being modkillable the first 24 hours or so, thrawn afk, DP afk, BH trolling. Lots of things that just sucked bag. In LVII, we have Matt claim scum super early and the ensuing discussions were getting excessively redundant until Palmar came in and confirmed Matt was fakeclaiming. Before that, I was trying to focus the thread a little. This game is no where near as out of control as that situation was and also (IRL bullshit that no one cares about)
Since BH has claimed, I find debears to be incredibly scummy, and Marv made a point of articulating already. I felt he was scummy before from the way he attacked me for lecturing and it being anti-town. I also felt his meta/smurf's are unreadable comments were contradictory and he was twisting words to make a case on me based on very little information. However, I was explicitly told to drop my suspicions because they were a) poorly thought out and b) distracting debears from helping town.
He hasn't helped town. Hapa's case on debears is spot on (in my heavily biased opinion) and I don't want to lynch anyone else right now. His only reason for voting debears is that debears made a read on him and voted him. And then there is this: Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 09:21 Hopeless1der wrote:
@Marv's case on Z-Boson - Quite frankly, if it saves me, I'll vote Z-boson, otherwise my vote stays parked on debears. I still think Z-Bo is town though, I just happen to know I'm town. I don't like this at all. Hopeless clearly states that he views ZB is town, earlier in the game ZB makes a small meta case and hopeless doesn't vote him (rightfully so) - but now he will throw his vote on ZB??? You don't scum hunt at all, say you view ZB as town but are willing to vote for him, and keep your vote parked on debears all game solely because debears made a read on you and threw his vote your way. This is not town oriented play in my opinion. I just feel that his anti-town tone has continued on through the lynch and after. As for the lynch itself hopeless NEVER stuck his neck out, he constantly stayed on debears the entire time (not that hapa temporarily switch over to debears apparantlytrying to start a wagon on him?): + Show Spoiler +On November 15 2012 10:50 Hapahauli wrote:##UnvoteYeah marv's right here - DP's being pretty townie going down. Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 10:46 debears wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote Hopeless
Plz for the love of god vote hopeless ppl Can we please lynch this guy? Please? ##Vote Debears The only thing that gives me a bit of reservation is that hopeless could have saved hapa had he switched his vote off of debears and put it on ZB at any time. But then I don't really think anyone was expecting hapa to get lynched. Regarding strongandbigJust take a look at this guys filter and then couple that with his votes and tell me it isn't suspicious as hell. SnB, like hopeless, never sticks his neck out on any reads and just agrees or disagrees with other peoples points. Couple that with his votes (ignore the hapa vote, it was at the VERY start of the game and it was a complete joke vote; he only votes for debears, blazinghand, and ZB). He was also oddly quiet during the pile onto hapa - while being there to laugh the most and mkae jokes afterwards?? Some reservations I have about snb is that he has gone after both hapa and hopeless postings (hapa who we know is scum and hopeless who I have the strongest read on at the moment), but scum dissing on scum isn't unheard of. Another reservation is that he has gone after BH hardcore, who I would be just as willing to lunch at this point as snb (though I would still rather go after my top read atm - hopeless). Anyways there you have it, hopefully night actions reveal some more stuffs.
Scum motivation you say?
Scum are lazy, they want to look like they are putting in effort.
Town actually are invested in finding scum.
LOOK AT THE CONTRIDICTION
On November 29 2012 23:46 Kickstart wrote:
##unvote
I really hate you right now. This doesn't mean you are off the hook but now I have to reevaluate because lynching claimed blues is fucking stupid at this point - almost as dumb as claiming blue without trying to argue your way out of it with 12+ hours to go.
On November 30 2012 03:00 Kickstart wrote:
Makes sense. Yeah, a counterclaim would do no good - it would confirm/deny Oats' claim but also out the blue claiming.
##vote: Oatsmaster
Keep in mind in mario mini, BH claimed blue too, and he was telling the truth. So I assume kickstart knows that claiming blue doesnt happen willy-nilly, AND HE STILL TRYS TO LYNCH ME.
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EPT
