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Mario Mini Mafia

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 00:27 GMT
#4
/in <3
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 01:42 GMT
#18
you give us too much credit, sir.

Please join us clarity :d
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 02:28 GMT
#30
no no, DP. You don't get to play that card any more ^^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 12:00 GMT
#71
I'd prefer deadline to be made an hour earlier if possible. Not the end of the world if not, though.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 12:51 GMT
#81
Yeah, I need ma flips.

DP, NMM3 was an all-vanilla game basically. Actually scum had rber/framer, but all townies were VTs, so those roles were pointless.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 13:12 GMT
#86
On November 12 2012 21:59 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 12 2012 21:51 marvellosity wrote:
Yeah, I need ma flips.

DP, NMM3 was an all-vanilla game basically. Actually scum had rber/framer, but all townies were VTs, so those roles were pointless.


yeah? How did It go? Giving scum useless roles is... Mean. Poor things panicking about being checked by a DT that doesn't exist. LOL



Well, as the scum choosing night actions, yeah I put far more thought into it than I had to xD

Game was just normal, except without the blue pontificating because there were never any actions to discuss. No-one really noticed the absence of blues. Just a good normal game of mafia I suppose.

I think scum were given roles to disguise the fact that town did not have roles.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 14:09 GMT
#90
alright, i can manage with it where it is then, just might not be present at deadline all the time
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 14:41 GMT
#97
On November 12 2012 23:19 strongandbig wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 12 2012 16:27 Djodref wrote:
Guys, y u no join cold war africa mafia ?

/replacement

I'll be following this game for sure but I'm not taking the obs QT just in case I get a chance to replace ^^


I am also /in for cold war mafia and if it starts before this one finishes I am totally up to playing two at once

but i needs mah mafia fix

also minis with marv who can resist?


On November 12 2012 23:20 strongandbig wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 12 2012 21:17 syllogism wrote:
/replacement


this is why wbg's "not-first-come-first-served" system is better
i would like to play in a mini with syllogism


<3

But then there would be a player I'd have to genuflect to, and that would be no good for my ego ^^;;
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 15:56 GMT
#99
phew, dodged a bullet
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 16:12 GMT
#101
wouldn't say it to someone if i genuinely thought it :p
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 16:16 GMT
#104
On November 13 2012 00:56 marvellosity wrote:
phew, dodged a bullet


like that
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 12 2012 16:21 GMT
#106
Clarity knows what's going on. Maybe you'll transcend someday.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:02 GMT
#129
hi all ^_^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:07 GMT
#133
first things first, any millers should claim.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:10 GMT
#138
try reading things Hapa.

Don't need everyone to say they're not a miller, just for the miller to say he is :/
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:16 GMT
#143
On November 13 2012 09:13 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 09:10 marvellosity wrote:
try reading things Hapa.

Don't need everyone to say they're not a miller, just for the miller to say he is :/

I'd prefer everyone says yea or nay to it ASAP, or else argue why claiming is a bad idea. Prevents anyone saying 'oh i didn't see whoops, im a miller' as they're going to be lynched.


people can disagree all they like, but they'll be wrong, and any miller claims past day 1 should be auto-lynched.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:37 GMT
#164
On November 13 2012 09:35 debears wrote:
and he isn't here for game start= obviously doesn't care about the game


it's worrying that you've failed to read the thread already
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:37 GMT
#169
On November 13 2012 09:37 Hapahauli wrote:
@iamp

The "random vote" gambit has been far overused. I'm not a fan.

I'd comment on your post, but I'm not even sure what you're talking about there.


random vote gambit is overused, yet pointless vote on DarthPunk is so much better, why?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:38 GMT
#171
debears, I know very well that your main goal, above winning as either alignment, is to outpost me.

It's ok, I can pass the mantle on.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:40 GMT
#176
no, it means i know you can spew more shit than i can ^_^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:44 GMT
#182
no, I said you can outpost me. There's a difference.

Ok, Z-bo claimed miller. For some reason I like the miller mechanic, it's kinda fun.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:46 GMT
#188
Seems a relatively sheepfree lineup though, which is nice.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 00:48 GMT
#194
ah, no Crossfire is just Crossfire.

He played in Whose Line (town) and Aperture mini (third party type scum thing) recently
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 01:02 GMT
#211
On November 13 2012 10:01 strongandbig wrote:
if zb was scum he would have made a much longer post

##vote: hapahauli

im down with that iamperfection thinkamajig


voice of experience right there
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 01:44 GMT
#257
you can't active lurk in a game that's less than 2 hours old, numbnuts.

If anyone's 'active lurking' it's me. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 01:53 GMT
#276
On November 13 2012 10:49 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:44 marvellosity wrote:
you can't active lurk in a game that's less than 2 hours old, numbnuts.

If anyone's 'active lurking' it's me. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.


Don't shut people down who are obviously trying their best to scum hunt and contribute. You are only going to discourage those things. Or is that what you want?



I happily discourage stupidity, so yeah.

strongandbig, answer yourself please.

iamp's on the ball for calling out Blazing for *actually* popping into the thread, saying nothing, and leaving.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 01:53 GMT
#278
ninjad by s&b
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 01:56 GMT
#287
On November 13 2012 10:55 Hapahauli wrote:
Oh goddamnit I got sniped by the "kenpachi rule" apparently, but my post still stands since he had his vote on me at the time of the post I reference.


this makes no sense. the post was stupid, and that's irrelevant of your alignment.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 01:58 GMT
#289
kenpachi rule is the first to put doubt on a VT claim is scum
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:00 GMT
#293
On November 13 2012 10:59 Hapahauli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:56 marvellosity wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:55 Hapahauli wrote:
Oh goddamnit I got sniped by the "kenpachi rule" apparently, but my post still stands since he had his vote on me at the time of the post I reference.


this makes no sense. the post was stupid, and that's irrelevant of your alignment.


Why doesn't it make sense? I'm just saying that SnB changed his vote to someone else before I made my vote on him (in which I reference his vote on me). Perhaps an unnecessary clarification, but it should make sense.


so what if he had his vote on you? the post he commented on was stupid, what does him having his vote on you have anything to do with that?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:03 GMT
#300
On November 13 2012 11:00 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Marv

Let us into your mind a little bit - any thoughts/suspicions thusfar?


not a lot worth sharing. I think the s&b wagon is a bit silly, but s&b's last two posts are a little too... try-hard for my liking.

"look how casual i am guise!!!!"
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:05 GMT
#305
On November 13 2012 11:04 debears wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:01 Hopeless1der wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:55 debears wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:53 Hopeless1der wrote:
What good did that question do for town?


I'm trying to figure out wtf you are doing coming in out of nowhere and lecturing someone early d1. In fact, lecturing everyone for their scumhunting.

What have you done?

##Unvote
##Vote Hopeless1der

DP calls out marv because multiple people were actively lurking and you singling out clarity was unfair. I was also lurking, and DP implies you were "trying your hardest", whereas you have said:

On November 13 2012 10:48 debears wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:46 Hopeless1der wrote:
I think debears is just mucking up the thread hard, but that's apparently just what he does? pretty much what marv said again for myself on the active lurking.


Eh. It's early d1. Give me about 10 more hours before the good stuff comes out.

And yeah guys didn't realize it's only 2 hours at this point....

And yeah marv that's why my vote is still on u!

Did we catch the scums yet? Did 10 hours pass when I wasnt looking?


^^^^^Can someone tell me if this is how hopeless is?


aren't you the same dude who told hapa it didn't matter who crossfire was from before because all we need is behavioural analysis?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:07 GMT
#308
we can tell, because i told you who he was
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:10 GMT
#313
On November 13 2012 11:08 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:03 marvellosity wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:00 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Marv

Let us into your mind a little bit - any thoughts/suspicions thusfar?


not a lot worth sharing. I think the s&b wagon is a bit silly, but s&b's last two posts are a little too... try-hard for my liking.

"look how casual i am guise!!!!"

what is it that you would rather see from SnB before deciding whether to vote him?


who knows, his alignment is up in the air right now, i'll see how he posts tomorrow. don't really wanna direct what i think he should be doing
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:12 GMT
#318
On November 13 2012 11:10 strongandbig wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:03 marvellosity wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:00 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Marv

Let us into your mind a little bit - any thoughts/suspicions thusfar?


not a lot worth sharing. I think the s&b wagon is a bit silly, but s&b's last two posts are a little too... try-hard for my liking.

"look how casual i am guise!!!!"

lol marv

it's all because you said on irc that i'm more composed when i'm scum

i'm upping my game son









+ Show Spoiler +
wifomwifomwifomwifomwifom


yes, this could well be true. sleep well and know i'm watching you, newbie 6 brother.

Hesitate over every word.

what will marv think of this sentence?

is it too constructed?

is this too over the top?!

clam up in fear.

Or carry on as normal and trust your alignment will win out, that's good too.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:17 GMT
#323
yes, hopeless isn't a proven enough town player to be lecturing people, really.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:21 GMT
#327
On November 13 2012 11:18 Hopeless1der wrote:
that doesn't mean i don't do it anways, proven or not


actually, reading the first couple of pages of your filter in Whose Line, you were pretty constructive, and you are not at all here.

What gives?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:28 GMT
#332
On November 13 2012 11:26 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:21 marvellosity wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:18 Hopeless1der wrote:
that doesn't mean i don't do it anways, proven or not


actually, reading the first couple of pages of your filter in Whose Line, you were pretty constructive, and you are not at all here.

What gives?

Themed game mostly I guess..it usually takes me longer to get constructive.


alright, i know it's pot kettle black, but try not to snipe too much (i'm an awesome common sense police)

the reason i didn't chuck a vote on you is because you seemed constructive in acme and you were scum there, so *shrug*
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:29 GMT
#334
On November 13 2012 11:20 Z-BosoN wrote:
DP, that's the second time you've voted for him without saying why.
This won't do.


also, this.

If this is your gameplan, DP, stop it immediately, because it's fucking awful. And if you're town, I do not wish you to be fucking awful.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:29 GMT
#335
and no, "my vote should be obvious" is not a legitimate reason.

give good reasons at the time for your vote or it makes your vote meaningless.

are we clear?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:34 GMT
#341
On November 13 2012 11:33 DarthPunk wrote:
Lol marv scolding me is super cute.


i don't do so for my own amusement.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:37 GMT
#344
just... play properly.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:38 GMT
#346
On November 13 2012 11:37 iamperfection wrote:
Whats everybody think of bh he is like a very good player when he is town from what i saw and here he really hasent done anything despite being here tell me what you guys think.


I agree wholeheartedly, in Rock Band he came out all guns blazing (no pun intended) whereas the opposite is true here. I expect great things from him when he comes back to the thread, that's for sure.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:40 GMT
#348
actually, I didn't, I typed it and then realised. So there
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 02:42 GMT
#352
On November 13 2012 11:40 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:37 iamperfection wrote:
Whats everybody think of bh he is like a very good player when he is town from what i saw and here he really hasent done anything despite being here tell me what you guys think.


Give him a chance. He is one of those guys I would 100% never lynch day one because the benefits of him being town vastly out weigh the risks of him being scum.

From what I have heard around the grapevine however he is fairly easy to read as scum so we should be fine to take a look at him later on in the game.


you kidding? I'd lynch him day 1 in a heartbeat if I thought he was scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 11:39 GMT
#409
On November 13 2012 17:16 Blazinghand wrote:
K I think S&B is town and you guys voting him are voting him for carless, free posting that isn't at all how he played as scum a few days ago in Whose Line Mafia when he was posting shit like this on the first day + Show Spoiler +
On November 02 2012 00:32 strongandbig wrote:
Blazinghand, I am not saying you are violating the "mafia rules" or being "immoral" as the mafia community would see it. Churlish is a better adjective to describe your behavior than "cheating" would be. Dastardly, you're not being. Essentially, I think that "we joined this game to have fun with minigames in a mafia context, and just ignoring them isn't in the spirit of the game." For sure, you're well within your rights and the game rules to do what you've been doing, but I think the game would be more fun all around if we were all trying to follow the minigame rules and I hope the incentives to do so are stronger next time around.

Going on to Adam. His posts this game "sound weirder" or "sound less genuine" to me than anyone else's except perhaps crossfire, who's playing the mad poet or something like that. It's hard to say whether that's because he's having a hard time posting naturally within the context of the minigame, or if it's because he is uncomfortable being scum or because he's not "being genuine" (I think that's how Sandroba described his scumhunting in some recent game I was following, reading people's posts and looking for people not being genuine etc).


Just read through his filter a couple of times, it's not very long.

K, here's one thing - he starts off with his "meta argument" on BKE, but then drops the read for no reason when he moves on to mementoss. Later, he says "BKE isn't scum to him," I would very much like to know what in BKE's filter gave him that impression because (as I outlined in my previous post) BKE's filter looks pretty terrible to me, and the worst parts are the parts that came after Adam's "meta read".

Mementoss case, I find pretty unpersuasive, I think that comparing pre-game and in-game enthusiasm levels is a valid tactic. "Not posting much of value" or "not having strong opinions" can be a decent case to make if it's clear and pronounced but it's hardly unique to Mementoss at the moment, I would contend that BKE, Djagulingu, maybe hopeless also fall into that category.

Oh, something else - he promises very early on to be like super active, but he is far less active than many other people.

Putting the shoe on the other foot, however, his claims about the meta component to your case are pretty compelling. Qualifying that - I know your case is not mainly based on meta anymore. Really, however, unless you disagree with him that his more recent games are different from your claim about his meta, it should be recognized that that element of the case on him is weak.

Something else you argue - he did originally take a position against BKE and later backtrack on it. Though I've said above that I don't understand why he backtracked, and though I really want to hear his reasoning, and though I think it's scummy to backtrack from one position and jump on another one without explaining yourself, I do think that at least taking a position is better than not taking a position, even if there is scummy backtracking.

Ultimately, here's where I stand. Voting for BKE because I think he's scummier - his positions are less both in number and firmness, and there's also the factor of him doing what I believe is "smokescreening" by talking so much about "how important it is for people to vote in both threads" and then about "how people didn't understand what he meant when he was talking about how important it is for people to vote in both threads", neither of which matter very much. With that said, however, I think a lot of what you say about Adam makes sense, and I wouldn't strenuously object to voting him if that's necessary to get a majority.



so yeah looks town to me


have you not read what strongandbig has written?

I spoke to strongandbig during/after Whose Line and told him his scum play was much more composed and constructed than his town play, and we've both alluded to that here. So in fact he's aware of it, and if he's scum would be actively trying to change it.

What then makes you so sure he's town, scumski?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 12:56 GMT
#410
On November 13 2012 15:39 Blazinghand wrote:
Z-BosoN should be aware it's on him as a non-DT-checkable player to distinguish himself as town, and what he's posted so far is all bullshit. ZB wanted a wagon to hop on with minimal discussion, so he puked some posts out into the thread and slapped down some poop vote. He voted debears, but unvoted him basically immediately. His reason for voting debears is also crap since debears doesn't see a need to worry about ZB right away.

ZB says this:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote:
For someone who is analytical enough to attempt to judge marv's early game reactions, he's sure not being analytical about my claim. This smells scummy to me.


and that's basically wrong. The fact that debears essentially ignores ZB's claim (which is the right move-- it's clearly a null tell) is COMPLETELY normal. And look at this sentence from ZB-- 1.it's a meta case about debears comparing meta from PREVIOUSLY IN THE THREAD. That's not meta. That's bullshitting.

Z-B iquickly moves over to another shitcase before peacing out of the thread:

Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:13 Z-BosoN wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:02 strongandbig wrote:
also fuck you zboson i wanted to fakeclaim miller as vt since then people couldn't say "oh he's fakeclaiming miller must mean he's scum" when i fakeclaim miller as scum

but now if i did that people would be like "two millers what are the odds" and then probably lynch you so no good on that one


Glad I beat you to it.
Interesting way to claim VT though. Actually I find that suspicious as fuck.

##Unvote
##Vote strongandbig

Debears, I hope your posting improves throughout this game. Also, what do you mean by "that argument again?".


S&B's "accidental" "vt claim" (both of those are in question) could be suspicious. But Z-B doesn't explain why. He doesn't set up a scum motive. He just slaps down a vote and bails. This is a chance to look like a townie wagon-started without doing analysis or writing the kind of long posts that could reveal his own scum motives. When Hapa rightly calls him on it:

Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:14 Z-BosoN wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:09 Hapahauli wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:07 debears wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:02 strongandbig wrote:
also fuck you zboson i wanted to fakeclaim miller as vt since then people couldn't say "oh he's fakeclaiming miller must mean he's scum" when i fakeclaim miller as scum

but now if i did that people would be like "two millers what are the odds" and then probably lynch you so no good on that one


^^^^^^claim


The VT claim is significant why exactly?


Scum just love implying they are town.


2.First off, a crap explanation. Everyone wants to appear as town cause getting lynched hurts your side no matter whether you're town or scum. A more correct explanation would talk about how VTs wouldn't claim VT because it narrows down potential blue snipes, and how he believes S&B was serious and not joking in that post. A town player would lay out his own thought process right away so that others understand what he's thinking. He'd respond to s&B and push the wagon, not just slap down a vote and a bad explanation.

ZB is setting up to look good as a wagon starter (since scum don't like to stick their necks out) and appear to contribute to town, but if you read his astonishingly short filter, it's clear he's not actually helping. He's flinging shit at the wall and hoping it sticks.

Let's splatter this guy.

##vote: Z-Boson


I think this whole case is pretty bad actually.

1. You're introducing the word meta for no reason, and in a horrible way. While Z-Bo's point may be bad, comparing stuff and attitudes to things within game is perfectly valid and calling it bullshit meta is just total nonsense.

2. It's just you not reading. Z-Bo said "implying", not "appearing" or "saying". He's right, scum do like to *imply* they are town, and I understand the perspective of "oh, s&b "accidentally" claimed VT, of course he did, har har har". I don't see why your more correct explanation has to be more correct at all.

Also, why are you attacking Z-Bo for the manner in which he's voted when there's a raft of players who have done similar things? (debears, s&b, hapa, DARTHPUNK (voted twice with no explanation), and probably a couple others too)
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 13:00 GMT
#413
On November 13 2012 17:42 Clarity_nl wrote:
Hapa, this still bothers me.
I asked you what you thought about SnB's claim and if you thought it was bad for town, and you answered:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:12 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Clarity

Well in a theoretical sense yes, but you remember how well that worked with Cheesecake in Newbie XXX right? It's really not that significant IMO.


You compared this to Cheese's claim from NMM XXX even though the situations are completely different.
The only reason Cheese claimed was because he thought only VT's knew the VT flavor. So he was trying to claim without alerting scum. SnB just outright claimed VT.

After I explain why it's different, you basically give me the same answer:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:25 Hapahauli wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:14 Clarity_nl wrote:
It's not like he flavor claimed, thinking others didn't know the flavor. How are those situations alike?
You don't think it's a weird move for a VT to claim VT day 1?


No I don't find it weird. I think it's just a pointless comment that can be made by either alignment. Again, see Mr. Cheesecake's "odd" VT claim time in the Newbie game.

Him trusting Z-Bo's claim so up-front is a bit strange, but again, I don't know if it's just bad logic or scum knowing who's who.

I haven't seen anything alignment indicative from him yet.


The other thing I don't really like is the use of "theoretically yes" and "IMO"
Whenever I've seen you post you tend to be direct and with conviction, but not this time.


I agree with you Clarity, this is weird.

Two things:

1. I don't inherently find a VT claim particularly suspicious. It's just meh. I think the bluesnipe argument is basically wrong because a blue can claim VT just the same.

2. The comparison, like you say, between this claim and Mr. Cheesecake's is totally misplaced. The one here was basically a throwaway and Mr. Cheesecake was (trying to) secretly signal other townies. The two are not the same in any way, and I'm curious that Hapa is equating them.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 13:02 GMT
#414
s&b, I'm going to want something else than you pushing the Kenpachi rule, using that as an excuse going forward for not building a case (even if it is on debears) is unacceptable.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 13:19 GMT
#417
when Palmar is playing well as town, he explains pretty clearly and at reasonable length why his chosen candidate is scum

he only starts calling people bad if they don't vote with him
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 13:20 GMT
#419
On November 13 2012 22:18 strongandbig wrote:
but tbh marv the kenpachi rule has plenty of substance behind it and you know it

i just don't like explaining it because once you explain it it stops working.... T_T


the thing is, s&b, when you first mentioned it I went and re-read over that portion of the game, and honestly debears didn't even really attack you for it particularly, he only really mentioned it, and indeed subsequent posts he was replying to other things.

So this would be an extremely weak instance of it at best in any case.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 13:21 GMT
#420
On November 13 2012 22:20 strongandbig wrote:
yeah but no one expects him to do stuff like that day 1, he just gets to dick around


incorrect, read NMM3
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 13:40 GMT
#422
it looked like a vt claim to me too
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 13:43 GMT
#423
also bear in mind it came after Z-Bo's miller claim, so it's not like a claims mindset came out of the blue
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 13:48 GMT
#425
care to expand on your thoughts on hapa?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 14:16 GMT
#427
On November 13 2012 23:10 Clarity_nl wrote:
Marv if you're still around, who would you lynch if you had to pick someone right now?


I am very much around. Currently I'd be lynching into a total lurker (thrawn or crossfire). My most significant progress so far has been removing a few players from the people I'd be willing to lynch today.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 14:28 GMT
#429
He did, but I've come to expect more than a solitary post from thrawn.

Hopeless, could you clarify this

On November 13 2012 11:31 Hopeless1der wrote:
Is the way debears confused 'small amount of games' with 'unreadable' scummy? He did it AFTER he was supposedly aware that cross has played before. or would you consider them the same thing?


I'm not sure what you're getting at? As far as I can see, debears missed my Crossfire explanation post and therefore continued prattling on about smurfs or whatever. It's apparent that debears is guilty of not reading the thread properly, but I'm not entirely sure what you're asking here.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 14:33 GMT
#431
I look forward to entertaining your suspicions then, my dear.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 14:53 GMT
#433
where did he say that? I missed it going through his filter earlier
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 15:17 GMT
#443
Hopeless, I think you're making too much of that. The bit you bold says "was" - past tense, that was his stance previously (when he'd missed my Crossfire post).

Like debears said just now there's not a lot to say about Crossfire otherwise, you can't really have a stance on someone who hasn't posted yet.

The whole issue is overblown and should be dropped. If only because it's a big distraction to debears, who has to keep talking about it, and it's not helping anyone
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 15:36 GMT
#448
what do you make of Clarity's posting since, debears?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 15:54 GMT
#458
On November 14 2012 00:53 Blazinghand wrote:
so what's the delal with hopeless


what's the deal with you posting like scum?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 15:58 GMT
#464
no, making some case on Z-Boson doesn't make him town.

On November 14 2012 00:42 Blazinghand wrote:
lil iamperfection im gonna talk down @ u till u get on my level cause else how u gonna hear me from down there lol


On November 14 2012 00:43 Blazinghand wrote:
no disrespect though cuZ ur voting well


On November 14 2012 00:53 Blazinghand wrote:
so what's the delal with hopeless


this is not the town BH play I am familiar with. It's pointless.

BH is capable of making lighthearted posts as town and indeed does so, but he does so while clearly pursuing his agenda and making his feelings clear.

Town BH doesn't ask "so what's the deal with Hopeless'", he wades in with a strong opinion. Scummy.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:00 GMT
#467
Rock Band or Whose Line are recent town games of his.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:11 GMT
#476
On November 14 2012 01:09 Blazinghand wrote:
When I get home I'll address that travesty againsf the human language that ZB thinks is a case but is in fact and OMGUS


best do so, I'm down with it right now.

##Vote: BlazingHand
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:15 GMT
#478
indeed, I am not
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:15 GMT
#479
implied in that is - that's why you should be taking this seriously.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:33 GMT
#485
On November 14 2012 01:31 Blazinghand wrote:
Really its just demeaning to English to have something so incorrect wrote with it


No, this kinda nonsense is demeaning to english:

On November 14 2012 01:17 Blazinghand wrote:
nah this sis a marv pressure vote. if you thought I was scum youd have voted me before ZB omgused. alt theory: you sndor imh are scum


Stop pouring scorn on the case until you've properly answered it.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:35 GMT
#487
I am indeed the mafia-slaying hedgehog.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:36 GMT
#490
On November 14 2012 01:35 Blazinghand wrote:
iamp bad but not scum this is just how he plays


and how does Z-Boson play, sir?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:38 GMT
#495
On November 14 2012 01:38 Blazinghand wrote:
right now hes playing like scum


no, how does he play normally? In other games?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:48 GMT
#499
On November 14 2012 01:40 Blazinghand wrote:
dunno if you want to make a meta defense go ahead but this game XB is scum

* ZB


answer my god-damn question!
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:48 GMT
#500
or was the "dunno" the answer?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:49 GMT
#501
On November 14 2012 01:45 Clarity_nl wrote:
Blazing for the love of god use spellcheck or autocorrect or something and please stop posting one liners and address the case made against you.

Hi guys, I'm back.

Marv I'm not suspicious of you, I was just curious about debears' response. I phrased the question in a way that would make him seem inconsistent if he found you town, but he found you town anyway. Gives me a town read on debears. Scum hate to be inconsistent.


oh, interesting, I'd misread where you were going with it. Carry on then ^_^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:51 GMT
#503
Guys, guys!!!

I think I may have an awesome quiz for you a little later in the evening. It may even be as good as my Palmar quiz in Rock Band.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 16:59 GMT
#507
On November 14 2012 01:54 Blazinghand wrote:
so marv you think ZB is both coherent and town?


unsure of Z-Bo's alignment, but his case seemed pretty reasonable, ya.

Clarity, you'll have to wait and see!
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:09 GMT
#509
On November 14 2012 02:06 Blazinghand wrote:
including the part where he says mu case on him is bad huh


i said myself i thought your case on him was bad, before z-bo did
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:13 GMT
#511
I didn't have anything convincing down on paper to do so
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:20 GMT
#513
well enough I suppose?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:36 GMT
#517
the case on iamp makes zero sense to me, his jumping on Z-bo draws attention to himself massively, for reasons you mention, and I see no reason whatsoever to do that as scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:42 GMT
#522
On November 14 2012 02:42 Clarity_nl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 02:41 iamperfection wrote:
I changed my mind deal with it bro. When I get home I might do it again. does that make me scum? If so continue if not don't waste my time


What made you change your mind?


that would be the case he wrote
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:43 GMT
#525
On November 14 2012 02:42 Hapahauli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 02:36 marvellosity wrote:
the case on iamp makes zero sense to me, his jumping on Z-bo draws attention to himself massively, for reasons you mention, and I see no reason whatsoever to do that as scum.


Well duh it draws attention to himself if I call him out for it, but look at his line of thinking here - he basically completely sheeps BH and only adds the "iamperfection rule." Sheeping someone =/= drawing attention to yourself. It's the exact opposite in fact.


don't be stupid.

1) iamp says miller claim is town
2) iamp votes for miller claim

of course it's massively drawing attention to himself.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:49 GMT
#528
What's the scum motive in blatantly making yourself look bad by contradicting yourself?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:53 GMT
#530
I don't understand why it's scum play.

1. Believes miller claim
2. Later decides he's scummy

The scum motivation is what? He wanted a case to jump on? Is that it?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:55 GMT
#532
it isn't "convenient" at all.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:55 GMT
#534
i wonder if iamp thinks i'm scum now, given i'm basically hard defending him ^_^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:55 GMT
#535
On November 14 2012 02:55 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Marv

I've seen you super critical of virtually every case brought forth so far with little to offer on your own. What's your top scumread atm?


Read my filter and it will all become clear
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:56 GMT
#537
On November 14 2012 02:55 Hapahauli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 02:55 marvellosity wrote:
it isn't "convenient" at all.


The hell? BH makes a case, and once it gains traction, iamperfection jumps on it. That's the fucking definition of "convenient"


what traction? iamp was 2nd on it.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:57 GMT
#539
how is being the only other one on the wagon "gaining traction" you fucktard
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 17:59 GMT
#542
On November 14 2012 02:56 debears wrote:
Its kinda weird that iamp went out of his way to point out the contradiction.

Guilty conscience? I don't feel why he would need to bring it up as town unless someone asked him


why wouldn't you mention something which is a blatant volte face?

+ Show Spoiler +

On September 21 2012 21:55 marvellosity wrote:
I haven't got more to say on Ange right now, so I'd like to talk about HiroPro a bit. Earlier I've been leaning town because I was impressed with his diligence and his arguments based on going back and finding meta from previous games, which seemed 'townie for effort'. I'm pretty much reversing that read now.

Actually Hiro as town is more categorised by laziness. His last scum game was a while ago (magic mini normal), but looking through his filter there I found this:

+ Show Spoiler +
On May 27 2012 07:00 HiroPro wrote:
Katina:

Katina has hardly been posting in this game and when she does, she's maintained a singular focus on N_T and Matt.

Show nested quote +
On May 22 2012 07:25 Katina wrote:
On May 22 2012 05:52 froggynoddy wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On May 22 2012 05:29 Tunkeg wrote:
Reads d1 of Day1

Acrofalis/Marvellosity:
Leaning town based on Acrofalis aggression while he was in game. He tried to get this game going, and tried to apply some pressure.

EchelonTee:
Leaning town. He went into a fight with Acrofalis from the get go, and haven't been afraid to stick his head out.

Zealos
Get some scumvibes off him. He started the game by voting VE as number two, without a good reason. He claims it to be a joke later (which it might be). He then proceeds to vote Acrofales based on ET's case, and because of meta, basicly sheeping ET. The rest of his filter seems very empty, even though he got more post than most in this game. Some townpoints for actually bother to answer questions.

Mattchew
He might be one of those I called out for not posting earlier, that is a scum. I don't know what he is trying to do, but if his postingstyle continues this way he will be disruptive townie at best, and sabotaging scum at worst. Leaning scum for now.

Nova_Terra
Leaning scum. He was active at the start, but unlike Acrofalis his attempts at pushing seems more forced, and with no real weight behind it. His whole postingstyle seems very non-commital and gives me scumvibes.

Also Navillus need to get in the thread and do some more. His vote on WBG is the only thing he have done. And it was done without much reasoning, and in my opinion strange reasoning.


PS: I know you guys don't like list. But I want to do lists so bare with me.

PS 2: This is not an analysis post. It is a read post. When I am ready to put my vote down on someone I will try to make a good case/analysis on them. Exception is if there is a great case on them that I agree with, then I will be open about sheeping it, and probably just add some of my own reasoning to it.



This list... serves no purpose other than making you look active. Town reads are worse than useless day 1 as 1. they are even weaker than day 1 scumreads and 2. points to scum who to kill to cause confusion.

EDIT: There was more but WBG and Navillus covered it whilst I was writing

+ Show Spoiler +
On May 22 2012 05:37 Navillus wrote:
Okaaay so my WBG vote was a joke, I do not actually think it's a good idea to lynch one of our 2 vets on that basis alone and I am not really of the opinion that advice is an automatic scum-tell, it'd be nice to have a little benefit of the doubt on me not being an idiot.

Next ##Unvote
##Vote: Mattchew


As far as I can tell he's just posting with flavor text from mtg cards, if that continues I don't really care if he's scum or town it makes him impossible to read, doesn't let him contribute, and makes for a really shitty atmosphere. Mattchew stop it.

On N_T yes VE and WBG I'd say he's using pretty bad method of scumhunting/analysis and his vote is for a dumb reason, but that doesn't make him scum and aside from clear-cut examples of someone being useless or disruptive (such as restricting their posts to text from a card game) it's a bad idea to lynch someone for bad play, in my experience it's rarely a scumtell and depending on how they're playing badly it can be more of a town tell.

Tunkeg you asked a bunch of questions earlier, most of them were ignored, was there any point to them? Why don't you care that people didn't answer you/why aren't you following up? Also why post that list, if you have scum reads why aren't you just pressuring them instead of telling them, and how does telling everyone your town-reads do anything but let scum know who you think is townie and so light them up as targets?

Holy spam batman! NT scum or town please stop with multiple one or two line posts in a row, it's distracting and makes the thread harder to read through, consolidate.


How is voting for Mattchew due to his posting style (which you consider to be *Bad*) different to voting N_T based on bad play?

I don't necessarily disagree with you I just think you're being a little inconsistent. Shoot I forgot to unvote as promised:

##Unvote
##Vote Katina


Inactive players kill town. Katina, my vote stays on you until you make an appearance.


I made an apperance earlier today. Do you not read over the thread my dear?

On May 22 2012 03:27 Nova_Terra wrote:
On May 22 2012 02:58 VisceraEyes wrote:
On May 21 2012 21:17 Nova_Terra wrote:
Hey VE since you seem to want to ignore my challenge who do you wanna kill


Hey Nova, since you seem to want to ignore my question to you (something that's actually USEFUL to this game, unlike your "challenge"), how about you actually answer it instead of trying to distract town with meaningless drivel? I'll even repost it for your convenience.

On May 21 2012 08:56 VisceraEyes wrote:
On May 21 2012 05:59 Nova_Terra wrote:
On May 21 2012 05:27 wherebugsgo wrote:
Whether or not advice is good has nothing to do with the alignment of a player, just the same as making a plan, regardless of how good it is, is generally not indicative of alignment.

If the advice makes sense, follow it. If not, don't. The question of "is this guy scum" has nothing to do with that.

I never said that it has anything to do with indicacating the alignment of the player,i said that general advice seems to be contributing but isnt really. and that its just as likely mister helpful is scum, etc.


Your style has so far been laced with an air of giving advice to the other players - in what way is Bugs' post giving advice any different from, say, you warning that "players trying to give advice could be scum"?

ooh i forgot about that
Its different because its not all i've done
and because i know im town
and its not really different itself, but i was aware of the hypocrisy before i made teh post


I would to bring attention to this lovely post. N_T might be the BM version 2! I say this because of his spam, oneliners, and the fact he seems to be refreshing the thread every 5 minutes. When BM is mafia he always over emphasizes that he is confirmed town.

Such things are silly to say and provide no help to the town I will be setting my vote.

##Vote Nove_Terra

Based on his fliter, he seems to more interesting in proving his innocence then trying to find the Mafia.


Show nested quote +


Look at this link where N_T was mafia. Notice that he spams here.... and what is he doing this game?
...
...
Spam!


JubJub 2:

Show nested quote +
On March 23 2012 14:04 Katina wrote:
DoctorHelvetica is mafia

This is because throughout the game he has been inconsistent in his posting.He doesn't seem to have a focus at all. DrH has done a massive amount of finger pointing. His posts consist of spamming and calling people retards.

DrH is inconsistent and pointing fingers a lot. Take a look at this post:
On March 12 2012 07:09 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Caller is trolling, mafia shouldn't be that scared of me to push me day 1 for no reason because I often back off my correct reads if I get distracted.

It's up to an individuals discretion whether or not they share who they are PMing with, policy lynching someone for not doing it is stupid. Also, town circles could be set up so that somebody can claim DT to someone they confirm and then use that person to broadcast their reads, or a tracker/watcher/etc. That can be useful. In that case the last thing you want is everyone saying who they are with.

Jackal58 is being a bit silly with what Wiggles and people like that are saying. His point is that scum know who town is and because of that they can cut down any circles that arise that they aren't directly involved in themselves. Especially it would be dangerous for someone to say "i'm pming with A B C and D" and then later come out and say "I'm PMing the DT and..." when say, B and C are dead or something. It's up to an individual to share their PM targets or not.

Gumshoe is posting a lot and very focused on town circles and such. For that reason, I'm voting for him. He has 2 pages of filter all completely disconnected from finding scum. The way you're probing Caller looks as though it would be helpful, but doesn't actually lead to anything. It's wishy washy, I feel like it's the kind of thing that scum would feel they can't ignore but don't want to commit to Caller if he's town. That'll satisfy me for now, it's pretty likely I'll come up with something better or that Gumshoe will just make himself look worse

The last paragraph is important here. He says gumshow is suspicious and is going to vote for him. Yet 8 hours later he makes this post:
On March 12 2012 15:12 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
On March 12 2012 15:03 Bill Murray wrote:
@doctorh, what are the reasons you like from curu? I'm catching up, and I value your opinion. That is also why I am sort of sheeping you. You saw what I saw out of gumshoe, switched when that wagon wasn't going anywhere for some reason, and probably found a good one here.

I remember Caller's posting earlier on in the day being suspect. He came in like a bull, china flying everywhere, and the broken glass and debris are making it easy to see a case on him being valid.

tl;dr: catching up, asking questions, can see caller being scum


Caller came in trolling then made his case when there was light pressure and it seems forced. I'm not totally sold on him at the moment because I feel like this is pretty much in line with the way he always acts but Curu does make a better case. I still think Caller is a better lynch than Jackal but I'm not confident enough to push it.

Caller's case is based on, from what I can tell, misunderstanding of jackals post and then overstating the significance of it. Curu has a meta read that is at least accurate. Jaybrundage is one of those players who seems to me to be participating only in the surface discussion and making little effort to figure out what peoples motives are or hunt scum. His last few posts speak for themselves really. His confidence is a little bit out of place for a newer scum player though.

I'm torn between Caller and jaybrundage right now. I'd be on prplhz in an instant if his logic wasn't equally terrible last time I played with him.

I'm waiting for Pandain to come into play, he's awful so I'll know right away if he's scum or not.

And now his focused has shifted to Caller and jaybrundage. And this is where his focused stayed for all of another 12 hours until he posts this:
On March 13 2012 05:28 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
How does Caller thinking a scum would defend another scum make him scum? Maybe I'm not following your logic.

Jackal, roleclaiming was unnecessary. If there is no claim to the contrary I'll believe you. Dreamflower is a pretty specific role and I doubt there is more than one in this game as opposed to something like medic or veteran.

We need to reconsider the business surrounding prplhz. His play is poor but it's not particularly scummy and the attempt to pin someone as scum for making a similar case around the same timeframe is ridiculous and comes off to me as a hamfisted attempt by scum to start a bandwagon. The fact that it took makes me even more sure it's scum originated or backed.

Wiggles is the first to jump on it, doing nothing in the game besides talk about mechanics/town strategy (at great length) until this point I'm surprised his first attempt at hunting scum is so forced and illogical. The fact that prplhz made a case near the same time period is inconclusive, might perhaps implicate that he is town talking to curu or caller in PM but hardly mafiaesque.

Jitsu is the only one who voted for him and he's already been in the hotseat. This is the most alarming event in this thread to me. The Caller vs VE deal is really coming off to me like an ensuing tragedy of townie vs townie.

And now he's dealing with Jackal and Wiggles and Jitsu.

What is interesting is how quickly DrH jumps from one case to the next. He accuses and votes for gumshoe, yet never brings up the case again except where he says he's changing his vote. He moves his vote to Caller at one point before finalizing on Jitsu.

Part of the problem here is that he never follows up on his reads. From here on out all he has are one liners and random posts, there is nothing more about his reads until he makes the following post:
On March 14 2012 09:03 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Node is suspicious. I'm leaning toward Node or Caller on day 2. I know Caller is a ballsy player but he comes off as way too phony. He makes a fake case on me then ditches it for a bad case on Jackal then goes back to attacking me? He's just playing disruptively.

Node's vote switch to Sheth is a joke. Not only was Jackal not gonna get lynched but I refuse to believe by the way he was posting that he put so little thought into the game as to waste a vote on somebody completely random (the only one that actually had excusable inactivity) like Sheth.


This post came near the end of night 1 as well. Suddenly there is no more attention on Jitsu. He moves away from it just like he did with gumshoe. He makes the occasional one liner about him being mafia, but never pushes his case ever again.

And on Day 2 he makes this post
On March 15 2012 08:58 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Kurumi is indefenseable at this point.

jaybrundage, you play like scummy shit all game then start demanding role claims from everyone. Stop doing that. If you're town, it's stupid and unhelpful.

With Kurumi gone, we need to shoot prplhz tonight or lynch him tomorrow. He's been on Jackal and didn't react to Jackal's claim but despite this obvious fakery from Kurumi, he chooses to ignore it then go after me. He is aggressive then immediately backs off and acts like he was just messin around. What a joke.

Curu straight up lies about things I say, he at least has the good sense to vote for Kurumi.

I'm not pushing Caller anymore, his claim seems to be legit and like I said I lost some confidence in him as the day went on and moved toward Jitsu (who is also misrepresenting me). It isn't scummy for a player to change their mind and it isn't my priority to tell the town about every change of thought or thing I think, otherwise I'd end up spamming the thread. If you're that interested in my thought process, just PM me, I'm not going to clutter the thread with that shit.

kurumi, prplhz, curu that's my best guess. Abenson, rgTheSchworz, Sentinel, probably scum or traitor between those 3. Dunno about Palmar. His play seems pro-town but I know he's good. If he's town this game is probably in the bag, if it's scum it's over since it seems a town circle has been built around him.

Nobody has PM'd me in this game yet, which surprises me a little.

and Jitsu isn't even on his mafia list. Furthermore he only lists Curu as scum because Curu was being a JubJub. DrH should know better than most that idiocy =/= Mafia. Yet he puts Curu on his mafia list, but removes him later on the account that Curu started making more sense.

DrH is known to second guess himself more than anyone else. He even admits to it. The problem is is that he is not second guessing himself. He makes a case against someone, then immediately drops it and never returns to it. He simply has no focus. His agenda is in correspondence with a mafia. He accuses lots of people to insinuate the doubt. He tries to make everyone look bad so nobody is in the clear. Then when a mafia gets lynched he can immediately defend himself by saying he was onto them.

Someone said that DrH pushed for the Kurumi lynch so therefore he is in the clear. However if you observe the day 2 votes you will notice that it's very likely the mafia team was on Kurumi the whole time. Bill Murray has gotten a town check, the only remaining players not on Kurumi are myself and EchelonTee. So he is not immediately in the clear because of the Kurumi lynch. In fact the majority of his posts about Kurumi entail things like this post:

On March 16 2012 04:48 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
This thread is in fucking chaos and if this keeps up we will continue having no lynches for the rest of the game. Is everyone this terrible? I can't believe Kurumi is actually going to get away with straight up faking his role and doing nothing but trolling and trying to find the traitor all game.

I also can't believe that Curu making shit up to try to get Jackal killed and him and his scumbuddy prplhz trying to get a town suicide vig to shoot at night (benefits scum) ONLY seems odd to me. This is far and away the most embarrassing town performance I've ever seen.

You're an idiot if you don't vote for Kurumi. Caller is saying to vote for me because I flip flop and "only talk about the set-up". That's a bald faced lie, the majority of my posts are about scum or pressure and I'm WELL KNOWN to flip-flop and second guess myself constantly as town such as in AC where I changed my vote like ten times in the first day. In fact, if anything, the fact that I haven't changed my vote a million times makes me look bad. I don't even know what Katina is doing but she has no sense of meta and seems to be completely missing the obvious.

Caller is the dayvig, he confirmed it as far as I can tell so unless he somehow faked shooting Node, why would anyone vote for him? Scum have their powers in that KP cost thing it says so in the setup ...

So what Kurumi did is too scummy to be scummy? Congratulations, you've failed the most basic fucking trap of bad townie logic now never sign up for another game again you retarded jubjubs

His posts about Kurumi are much like this one: "vote Kurumi or else you retard!" His only reason for voting Kurumi is that Kurumi scum slipped. No analysis or anything. Vote Kurumi or you're retarded. If this is what scumhunting is than Palmar should be the reigning champion.

Even more proof of his inconsistency can be found if you click his filter and search for my name. Multiple times he lists me as mafia yet he has never hard pushed for me or giving reasons why I need to be lynched. In one post he says, "katina has called me out for stupid reasons but I'm not saying she looks like shit for "tunneling a townie" because my alignment isn't confirmed." This is interesting because when I first accused him he agreed with the arguments that I was making. He even acknowledged that he was jumping all over the place on his reads. As I said before, he's not second guessing himself. He is mafia and is casting doubt upon all the players. He has done a fabulous job of accusing everyone so when someone flips mafia he can say that he was suspicious of said person. Even if he was on Caller and Kurumi, he hasn't done anything recently besides cast more doubt on the remaining players. He has pushed for Jay to get lynched, but the majority of his accusations can be summarized with "Jay is retarded, let's kill him".

This leads into the obvious fact that DrH is acting nothing like he does when he is town. This is evident from his past games. Look at one of his posts from Storm Mafia:
On February 23 2012 09:08 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
I didn't sheep anybody. I made my case on BC well before I even read syllogisms original post. You're connecting points I'm making in specific reference to other peoples posts to unrelated ideas. I was trying to illustrate that the wagon forming quickly doesn't mean much. The scum don't need to defend redFF if they can get somebody else lynched.

I don't think my posts are wishy washy. I wasn't yelling in the thread for one person to get lynched over any other, but that can't really be defined as wishy washiness. I wasn't planning on rebutting the case on redFF because I never ever thought it needed to be rebutted. I voted for redFF in the end. I moved my vote to BC to put pressure on him and make sure he stays active in the thread, his responses satisfied me enough that I wanted to stick with my original convictions and give BC Day 2 to prove himself. Needless to say I'll be keeping a close eye on him.

Calling BC the alternative lynch is a non-point since his flip, or lack thereof, was inconclusive. You don't know whether or not he is scum, unless you are scum, so implying that it is a defensive alternative makes no sense as town especially considering redFF is the person I voted for.

I never called RedFF not scum. I never called him 100% scum. I said very clearly RedFF is likely scum or terrible town but his claim is poorly done and seems defensive. I was more than okay with the RedFF lynch, which seemed so likely to go through at the time I switched to BC to pressure another player I was suspicious of. Seeing as RedFF has been AWOL during this entire period, I feel I made the right choice. If I didn't think RedFF was very suspect, I would have been far more vocal in trying to get people to join a BC bandwagon but you will notice I did no such thing as far as I can recall anyway. That's as much as I'll say in the interest of defending myself.


This redFF "flip", or whatever it is, is inconclusive and I don't feel it necessary to comment on it further. I'll read filters when I have the time.

Notice how he is very direct in explaining his actions about where his vote and suspicion lies. There isn't a single post he's made in this game that can be mirrored with a typical post from that game. He hasn't done any explaining this game. He only focuses on the present and fails to address his past behavior. And the few times people have brought up this fact his response has been "well I always second guess myself trolol" Put simply, he is not taking responsibility for his actions.

It's also interesting to note how calm and collected he has been in the past when he is town. The above post is typical in showing is behavior when analyzing and addressing issues. Of course we know him to have a temper from time to time, as we all do whenever we are in a game with VE. However this game he has done nothing but call people retarded over and over again. This attitude is a bit reminiscent of wherebugsgo when he is mafia. I can understand being frustrated with the game (considering I have Jay riding my ass constantly), but the level of his insults coming from DrH is not only out of character, but completely unnatural.

I would also like to mention that this game DrH has an absurd amount of one liners and small posts. A quick glance through Storm Mafia and Arkham City show that his posting length this game is also not in sync with his normal town play. When DrH is town, he is not afraid to write paragraphs upon paragraphs detailing his thoughts. This game we have one liners about how small our IQ is.


Summary
DrH has been playing completely out of character from his typical town play. He hasn't been focused, anormous finger pointing, one liners and insults. His posts have been inconsistent and bringing confusion into the thread. He has not been responsible this game and he needs to be held accountable for it.
DrH is mafia

##Vote DoctorHelvetica




In this game, when going after N_T Katina displays a very odd use of meta - very different from the way she used in the past (LII: Jubjub Mafia where Katina fingers DocH based on meta with a clear difference between his town and mafia styles (when DocH is town his posting is much longer and doesn't attack other people)). Compare that to this game, where Katina uses meta against Nova_Terra (Nova_Terra is scum because he spams as mafia. Yet he does this both as town and mafia...) That's not a logical argument at all. Also everyone should look at the cases that Katina makes in that game and compare that to this game; there's a clear level of depth that's missing from anything she has posted here.

This Game:

Show nested quote +
On May 27 2012 02:34 Katina wrote:
Okay first of all, I'm really tired of people (WBG) assuming I'm mafia because of my Meta I have said myself I have been busy. Stuff kept coming up this week, that's what happens when you have a "Life". I am sorry I couldn't be more active.

Secondly the two people I have been gunning for (N_T and Mattchew) are doing nothing but constantly bashing me. N_T is so focused on getting me lynched he is completely distracting himself from the forum. Mattchew is butt hurt because I got him to crack and stop using his quotes.

Third, I realize that Zealos claimed. I was fine lynching him as I stated in one of my posts before that. So me voting for someone I thought was scummy is considered Mafia? I love the logic behind that.

I apologize for not spewing out random votes and cluttering up the thread like a lot of you do. Everyone is so focused on me for stupid reasons when there are so many scummier people.


Liar Game:

Show nested quote +
On May 16 2012 07:26 Katina wrote:
On May 16 2012 03:04 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
On May 16 2012 00:10 Katina wrote:
On May 15 2012 07:35 slOosh wrote:
Katina are you calling Meapak scum? Or misguided? How about prplhz?

Not really. His reasons for thinking Palmar is innocent are silly. I don't actually think he's mafia but then again I have no idea who could be on Palmar's team other than Wiggles.

Katina I'm sick of you half assing this game. Put in some goddamn effort and give us some ACTUAL reasons. I don't know, maybe write an analysis, maybe have more of a thread presence, maybe PM people and at least pretend like you're interested.

After the cephiro flip I blew up all my reads and started over again and let me say this katina, it's foolishness's insistence that you're town which is preventing me right now from putting you in the majority and lynching you this cycle. Play the game.

I have been sir.

I do not mean to overstep your pride here. Let me say again that your reasons for thinking Palmar is innocent are silly. I don't say this in an accusatory way; it's the truth. I don't think you are mafia, but as I said I don't know who the last member on Palmar's team is (I think Wiggles is one of them).

You said that Palmar is innocent because he has had the same reads as you from the start. That does not indicate anything about alignment. Palmar has wanted to kill sandroba and Cephiro (these are the two you listed). But everyone wants to kill those two. Also it makes the most sense that sandroba is the last member of BC's team. So Palmar isn't bussing one of his teammates.

The most incriminating piece of evidence is that Palmar was virtually derping when syllogism was alive. That's cause syllogism was hard core pushing his innocence especially in PMs. I know Foolishness and wherebugsgo were both suspicious of Palmar but syllogism made it hard for them to push that read. That and there were more important targets at the time. If you look through Palmar's post history you will see he was most active day 1 and then in the previous days since syllogism's death. Palmar was using syllogism as an excuse to not do anything. With syllogism constantly pushing his innocence he did not have to try at all, either in the thread or PM. He has only stepped up his posting since syllogism died, whether he's stepped up in PM land or not I don't know.

Even if you want to start pointing guns at me, you still need to explain why Palmar deserves a free pass. Cause this isn't about me, it's about Palmar. And like I said at least one person out of you, me, and Palmar has to be mafia. Unless you're going to claim mafia I'm not stopping until Palmar is dead.



When attacked in previous games (for example Liar Game) Katina typically brings forth new thoughts and reads (She's very eager to elaborate her reads on Palmar and address the issues that other people bring up). In this game though, Katina just says that she was busy and repeats the same arguments that she's been giving the entire game without analyzing anything new.

With such a big difference between her town play and her play this game and a general lack of good posting and reads, I think Katina is almost definitely scum.


A fairly long well thought through post, making valid points based on meta across several games and applying them to the current game. Except it's scum Hiro making this post.

Looking through his town games, they are more categorised by shorter posts, where ultimately Hiro is more involved in what's going on than he is here.

I believe HiroPro is scum



when i changed my read on hiro in Rockband, I made mention of the fact. Why wouldn't you?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:00 GMT
#544
I think iamp is town.

If we lynch him today for what he's done so far, I quit mafia.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:01 GMT
#546
On November 14 2012 03:00 debears wrote:
Eh. I don't really see a need for it as town. Who cares if u change your read if you have good reasons?


who cares whether you think there's a need? I'm just showing it's a natural thing for a townie to do.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:02 GMT
#548
On November 14 2012 03:01 Hapahauli wrote:
Well I beg to differ marv. My mind is blown that you think that his actions so far are townie. MAYBE null. But town? Good lord.


yeah my mind was blown when you found Ben Richards town and we know who ended up right there.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:03 GMT
#550
I am quite well known for being right, however.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:05 GMT
#553
Blazing, it was merely meant as a demonstration of how bad I think the lynch would be.

god i'm gonna look dumb later/post-game if he's scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:08 GMT
#555
On November 14 2012 00:12 Dandel Ion wrote:
Votecount:

strongandbig (2): Z-BosoN, Hapahauli
Z-BosoN (2): Blazinghand, iamperfection
debears (1): strongandbig
Hopeless1der (1): debears

Not voting (7): marvellosity, thrawn2112, Hopeless1der, Kickstart, Crossfire99, DarthPunk, Clarity_nl


Currently, strongandbig is set to be lynched! A bit less than 35 hours remaining in Day 1.

Full version:

+ Show Spoiler +
strongandbig (2): DarthPunk, Z-BosoN, Clarity_nl, Hapahauli, DarthPunk
Z-BosoN (2): Blazinghand, iamperfection
debears (1): Z-Boson, strongandbig
Hopeless1der (1): debears
Blazinghand (0): iamperfection
Clarity_nl (0): DarthPunk
Darthpunk (0): Hapahauli Hapahauli
Hapahauli (0): iamperfection, strongandbig
marvellosity (0): debears


Not voting (7): marvellosity, thrawn2112, Hopeless1der, Kickstart, Crossfire99, DarthPunk, Clarity_nl



There are 4 people with votes, 5 if you include iamp's previous vote on Blazing.

And iamp chooses to directly contradict his early town read to go on to Z-Bo? Why not debears, hopeless, staying on blazing, s&b, ANYONE that isn't z-bo? I just don't see it.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:14 GMT
#558
On November 14 2012 03:11 Hapahauli wrote:
Again marv, I don't care what he could have done. We're not in his mind - we don't know what he's thinking. Therefore we have to look at what he did, and the contradiction makes no damn sense from a townie perspective. How the hell do you go from "insta-convinced claim = town" to "I agree with BH case, "iamperfeciton rule", Z-Bo is scum" if you're town. No way. NOOOOO way.


why the fuck not? it makes a lot more sense to me as town than it does as scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:22 GMT
#560
i'm waiting for him to answer the case, at the moment.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 18:26 GMT
#562
it seemed ok. in line with what i might expect from him.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 19:15 GMT
#573
so who's your top suspect atm, Clarity?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 20:44 GMT
#595
On November 14 2012 05:31 Clarity_nl wrote:
Anyone willing to give their read on DarthPunk while everyone anxiously awaits Blazinghand's defense and case?


hi. i don't think he's scum at the moment.

i think BH is increasingly looking like scum, however.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 20:46 GMT
#598
On November 14 2012 05:45 Clarity_nl wrote:
@ Marv

If he's not scum in your eyes, that means he's terrible town, or do you disagree?


I think perhaps he hasn't been playing as seriously as he could/should have been.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 21:02 GMT
#607
On November 14 2012 03:11 Hapahauli wrote:
Again marv, I don't care what he could have done. We're not in his mind - we don't know what he's thinking. Therefore we have to look at what he did, and the contradiction makes no damn sense from a townie perspective. How the hell do you go from "insta-convinced claim = town" to "I agree with BH case, "iamperfeciton rule", Z-Bo is scum" if you're town. No way. NOOOOO way.


This has been bugging me all afternoon. Sure, we're not in his mind, but the job of a good townie is to PUT yourself in someone else's shoes and try to best work out how/what/why they're doing or have done things.

And Hapa knows this too.

GSL 3:

On October 22 2012 07:49 Hapahauli wrote:
Tbh, I can't see scum Kei playing this carelessly. I hate to use this read again, but it seems accurate in the games I've played so far - he has this "I don't give a fuck" attitude towards suspicion against him.

Paired with how much effort I know he put into GSL I, I think he's town.



Puts himself in the shoes of a player who was outwardly playing scummily (lurking, not giving reads, etc.). And his read there is that he doesn't see scum Kei doing whatever he was doing.

In this game though:

On November 14 2012 03:11 Hapahauli wrote:
Again marv, I don't care what he could have done. We're not in his mind - we don't know what he's thinking.


He's not willing to put the same thinking process into iamperfection, and this reeks, especially as my main argument in defence of iamperfection is why the fuck would he vote for Z-Bo of all people after his earlier town read on him.

You have to think about what he could/should/would do and what iamp did there does not line up with how I see him playing scum, and for some reason Hapa does not address this. He gives some bad 'scum motive' but at the same time doesn't address anything at all with how iamp in particular was thinking at the time.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 21:03 GMT
#608
On November 14 2012 06:00 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 05:58 Clarity_nl wrote:
Rather odd to be cracking jokes and saying you have null reads when you don't have the time to post, unless you're trying to seem active.


spoken like a guy who doesn't know how to crack jokes

way easier to crack jokes than to contribute, dont see why it's odd


stop spamming up the thread.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 21:07 GMT
#614
On November 14 2012 06:07 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 06:04 Clarity_nl wrote:
@ Blazing

Well I'm working under the assumption that it's a time issue, being in two active mafia games.
Cracking jokes is something you do on the side. You play mafia to play mafia, socializing is nice but it's not why I play mafia at least, guess I can't speak for others.
If all you're doing is cracking jokes then that's anti-town, you don't agree? If you're going to be around to post 3 pages of filter without content, why not post 1 page of content instead, if you're town.



Absolutely, but cracking jokes isn't a scum tell any more than being inactive in general is. Town players play anti-town all the time. Someone who's posting but with zero content is "active lurking" which is functionally equivalent to lurking-- just as scummy, no more, no less.


why don't you do something useful like answer the case against you?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 21:08 GMT
#616
ninjad xD
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:12 GMT
#637
Clarity, I've put the quiz on ice, it wasn't as awesome as I'd hoped.

On November 14 2012 07:06 Blazinghand wrote:
Scumslips don't exist. Townies "scumslip" as much as scum do. There are scum mindsets and scum ways of doing things, but revealing "extra info" or telling someone you're scum inadvertently happens equally to scum or town. It's self-serving of me to mention this, but it's also true.


townies don't HAVE extra info, so they can't reveal it. duh.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:19 GMT
#645
On November 14 2012 07:17 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 07:12 marvellosity wrote:
Clarity, I've put the quiz on ice, it wasn't as awesome as I'd hoped.

On November 14 2012 07:06 Blazinghand wrote:
Scumslips don't exist. Townies "scumslip" as much as scum do. There are scum mindsets and scum ways of doing things, but revealing "extra info" or telling someone you're scum inadvertently happens equally to scum or town. It's self-serving of me to mention this, but it's also true.


townies don't HAVE extra info, so they can't reveal it. duh.


Townies make statements that appear to be scumslips. You know this as well as I do, and regularly fight against bad cases based on so-called scumslips all the time. Don't play dumb.


not with extra information stuff, no.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:21 GMT
#647
no Hapa, the point is you're not putting yourself in scum iamp shoes, not town iamp shoes.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:23 GMT
#651
On November 14 2012 07:22 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 07:19 marvellosity wrote:
On November 14 2012 07:17 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 14 2012 07:12 marvellosity wrote:
Clarity, I've put the quiz on ice, it wasn't as awesome as I'd hoped.

On November 14 2012 07:06 Blazinghand wrote:
Scumslips don't exist. Townies "scumslip" as much as scum do. There are scum mindsets and scum ways of doing things, but revealing "extra info" or telling someone you're scum inadvertently happens equally to scum or town. It's self-serving of me to mention this, but it's also true.


townies don't HAVE extra info, so they can't reveal it. duh.


Townies make statements that appear to be scumslips. You know this as well as I do, and regularly fight against bad cases based on so-called scumslips all the time. Don't play dumb.


not with extra information stuff, no.


Yes, they do. All the time.


that's a logical fallacy, because they don't have extra information to slip.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:29 GMT
#657
Blazing, you still haven't answered why you're attacking Z-Bo so heavily for his s&b vote when there's a slew of other people who made very similar votes.

And stop calling his case OMGUS, it's tedious.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:34 GMT
#663
On November 14 2012 07:31 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 07:29 marvellosity wrote:
Blazing, you still haven't answered why you're attacking Z-Bo so heavily for his s&b vote when there's a slew of other people who made very similar votes.

And stop calling his case OMGUS, it's tedious.


Z&B was hopping around and trying to start wagons until one stuck, then he did, and it stuck. He is the scummiest, and I will lynch him. Other people might also be scummy, but that's not my main concern: I've caught scum. It's a waste of my time and attention to think about these other, worse candidates beyond the normal examination of their posts and the cases against him.


he uses his vote as a way to pressure people and he's "hopping around trying to start wagons"? Like one or two hours into the game?

What drugs are you on?

Attacking your attacker isn't just OMGUS, his case is clearly more than just OMGUS. My vote on Palmar in Rock Band at the start was OMGUS.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:54 GMT
#668
Claiming with 3 votes on you with 27 hours remaining in the day as jailkeeper is the most fucking stupid thing you've ever done if you're town.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:55 GMT
#669
for fuck's sake, blazing.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:57 GMT
#673
I am absurdly angry at you if you are town, BH.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 22:58 GMT
#674
On November 14 2012 07:56 Hapahauli wrote:
Well thanks for breaking the ice there marv. I'm a bit speechless myself.

My first impression is that this is the most needlessly reckless play ever for scum to do. Ever. On the other hand, the claim itself is such an overreaction to the suspicion on him. The former explanation seems more likely to me... but like damn dude...


oh pish, prplhz claimed cop with 3 votes on him in NMM2 day 1 and he was scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 23:05 GMT
#680
seems a terrible fakeclaim for scum to make.

there is almost certainly a scum roleblocker and so basically scum are giving up all their roleblocks for this claim, because BH would have to soak up the scum roleblock every night. Further he's a sitting duck later on.

As town it's also fucking retarded though. Fuck.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 23:06 GMT
#682
On November 14 2012 08:04 Blazinghand wrote:
Im here via phone now. I've claimed because this discussion on lynching me is a waste of time. I wont make the same mistake twice and after chewing out BKEXE last game I dont wan to look like an idiot

youre welcome to be mad at me but at least let me soak up a bullet/rb tonight and potentially stop the scum NK


you don't fucking stop anything, scum roleblocks you and kills me, or scum roleblocks you and kills you.

you fucking idiot.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 23:07 GMT
#685
but you're a fucking idiot and i am so mad right now.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 23:08 GMT
#688
scum always want to kill me.

and woop de do for our other blues. you've basically just removed our (probably only) protective role for the sake of 3 god damn votes.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 23:08 GMT
#690
i don't care, suck it
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 23:09 GMT
#692
alright i'm gonna do something else for a while.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 13 2012 23:09 GMT
#694
no, i will not.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 00:19 GMT
#715
On November 14 2012 08:39 Hapahauli wrote:
@iamp

##Unvote

From your reactions so far, you're probably town. The "I don't give a fuck" thing has been on full display for the last few hours, and that meta read hasn't been wrong on you yet.

I also do like the post on Z-Bo, but I give him less townie points than you do. Z-Bo can push a read as either allignment, but I do agree he's being open so far.




i return, less heatedly
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 00:20 GMT
#716
i agree with much of what you say, z-bo
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 00:43 GMT
#721
top choice right now hapa?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 00:47 GMT
#724
i'm starting to ponder debears also
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 01:29 GMT
#731
that's not productive, s&b.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 01:29 GMT
#732
##unvote
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:12 GMT
#743
we are not better off for it.

i'm not going to shout at you any more, but i will if you say stuff like that.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:13 GMT
#744
On November 14 2012 11:10 Blazinghand wrote:
He's pretty unhelpful and posting lots of oneliners without a lot of content, but that's just literally how the man plays. Clarity or Marv can back me up on this. Not sure what to make about the vote vs attacks thing. He's not on my lynch radar for today presently.


who is, then? your two main reads have basically become town or null reads.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:18 GMT
#747
no you're claim is shit and you're wrong.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:22 GMT
#751
my rage is perfectly coherent.

what's even more infuriating is that you don't understand why you are bad.

any sensible townie would argue his way out of his lynch (3 votes, cmon) and only if necessary, a few hours from deadline, claim if he could absolutely not avoid getting lynched.

Jailkeeper is a very strong role and now you've made it so it cannot protect anybody, plus a confirmed bluesnipe on you, if you are town. Which I'm not even convinced of yet, I just can't bring myself to lynch the claim day 1.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:24 GMT
#753
i'm not agreeing to anything with you. the fact you disagree is mindboggling to me and i find it scummy.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:26 GMT
#755
i find the fact you maintain your claim was a good play scummy, yes.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:28 GMT
#759
the fact you claimed is mindboggling to me also, i believe that was implied.

if this game was purely marv-world i'd flip you right now out of spite.

In essence, your claim does not in any way match up to the esteem I generally hold your town play in.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:33 GMT
#761
i agree not to carry on being mad at you if you promise not to say again a single time that your claim was a good idea.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:35 GMT
#762
thrawn dear, where indeed have you been?

The problem is, thrawn, is that my meta read on DarthPunk is the diametric opposite to yours.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:41 GMT
#767
On November 14 2012 11:39 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 11:33 marvellosity wrote:
i agree not to carry on being mad at you if you promise not to say again a single time that your claim was a good idea.


If someone asks me, I will answer truthfully, but I won't volunteer information if I don't see a need to.

Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 11:35 marvellosity wrote:
thrawn dear, where indeed have you been?

The problem is, thrawn, is that my meta read on DarthPunk is the diametric opposite to yours.


from a meta perspective, yes, this is what town DP does, but the fact that he hasn't taken any stances that currently he's maintaining / is accountable for is scummy. I find him worthwhile even if Thrawn's meta case is crap.

I think Thrawn comes out of this looking worse though, because he brought up a meta case that is basically false. I'd like to see more out of DP though, and so they're my two lynch targets right now. Plus you kinda for being such a drama queen.


I disagree thrawn looks worse, as I know he genuinely believes in that meta read. It's not specific to this game.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:42 GMT
#768
On November 14 2012 11:40 thrawn2112 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 11:35 marvellosity wrote:
thrawn dear, where indeed have you been?

The problem is, thrawn, is that my meta read on DarthPunk is the diametric opposite to yours.


you do not remember my first newbie and how stubborn and argumentative he was being with me about my vig claim? he didn't end up voting me in the but he was definitely the most aggravating to deal with. and there was that game where kush scum claimed and dp tunneled and caused mislynches on townies afterwards because he was being stubborn with his reads.


sure he can be stubborn with his reads as town.

But overall I find him more cooperative as town and more lighthearted. As scum he is similarly argumentative and strident in his views, and is more "angry", without any of the lightheartedness.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:54 GMT
#778
On November 14 2012 11:50 thrawn2112 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 11:21 thrawn2112 wrote:
His last voting action was an unvote, and the next 8 posts contain mainly fluff and jokes, not much information that's pertinent to the thread.



The fact that he hasn't taken a position is worrying-- but the joking and fluff are characteristic of his play. See NMMXXVIII

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=370487&currentpage=17#322



That game is one of the specific ones I'm thinking of in regards to dp's town play. He stays on his targets till he gets a flip, he is sorta.. aggressive.. with his language, especially when people are disagreeing with him. This game he's made extremely questionable votes while not pushing his reads. Town dp reads as the most convicted guy ever and that's not what i'm seeing this game.[/QUOTE]

scum DP is equally if not more aggressive with his language.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 02:58 GMT
#782
On November 14 2012 11:50 Blazinghand wrote:
Also I'm not voting debears


this is not the same debears who in his last newbie game was abnormally excited about reaching a 30 page filter length, and was very very much the centre of attention.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 13:12 GMT
#840
It's got to about the stage where I need to be telling people where I am and what I'm thinking.

DarthPunk - earlier in the day he was on my "do not lynch" list as I'd metad him townie. I no longer feel this way. The constant excuses (in relatively long posts too) are wearing me down. He knew how much time he was spending on mafia in the other game when he signed up to this one. If he spent any of the time he spent making excuses doing something productive then we'd be a lot better off. The problem with DP is that as scum I don't see him being quite that useless either, so meh. "Null" is a dull finish, but it's the kinda null where I'm being pulled both ways and I can't make up my mind either way.

debears - I wanted to be more suspicious of debears than I am, but I can't quite make myself again. There's just something about the way he's gone about his ideas, like... the manner he's questioned people on them, that make me think he could be townie. I think he's probably a wily enough operator to fool me like that though, so I'm gonna continue to be wary, but I don't want to lynch him right now.

thrawn - bleh.

Blazing - IF you are town, you need to not be telling Kickstart he is "bad or scum" .... "he can be ignored" ... "he is irrelevant to our discourse." Kickstart has done nothing which I deem to be bad play and wanting to ignore a (however new) player like that is just horrible. Yuck.

Crossfire - I was hoping for something a little more substantive than that after your re-read. The fact you failed to provide it makes me suspicious.

s&b - If you're town, please do something.

Hopeless - My current lynch choice. The only thing he has given to town is his musings on debears' inability to read the thread. At the time I did like that he dropped it when I asked him to, however he hasn't offered town anything at all since. I literally cannot find an opinion from Hopeless on anyone.

On November 14 2012 05:22 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 04:38 debears wrote:
Iamp's switch on Z-Bo is alarming to me. Let me explain why

Town read on Z-Bo
+ Show Spoiler +

On November 13 2012 09:50 iamperfection wrote:
zbos explained it in his post would have been very risky in my view.


On November 13 2012 09:55 iamperfection wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 09:52 Hapahauli wrote:
On November 13 2012 09:45 iamperfection wrote:
i guess theirs no reason not to believe zbos right? has to be to risky to do if he was scum right.


Woah woah hold-up. I'm not liking how you're trusting this claim right away.

Claiming miller is a pretty much a riskless play here. We don't know how many millers are in the setup, and as far as I'm concerned, the claim is null until Z-Bo proves otherwise.

its what i think so whatever. Zbos scum is gone put himself out there like that i dont think so.


Alright, these two posts seem pretty strong saying that Z-Bo is townie. Note the word use "very risky for scum" and "scum wouldn't put themselves out there like that"

On November 13 2012 10:33 iamperfection wrote:
guys a town zbos could lie if he was blue

He could be scum

he could be vt.

I'm inclined looking at the comment that he was just writing what he thought and that it was probably true. He just had a slip of the tongue so i'm actually inclined to think it was actually the truth. It didn't look like to me as a scum making a post in order to put a claim together. Boom i got two town reads already which you gonna do mafia??????????


Here he states outright that he has a town read on Z-Bo

Note that his town read is a null tell to me.

Suspicions of BH ----> Agreeing with BH

Next, iamp becomes suspicious of BH

+ Show Spoiler +
On November 13 2012 11:31 iamperfection wrote:
so uh this guys is like not helping right now and i expect better from him since i hold him in high regards. i say we force his hand.

## Vote Blazinghand

Especially since he made it obvious that he was here with his "lol"


Note the timestamp. 30 minutes later, this comes out

On November 14 2012 00:04 iamperfection wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 15:38 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:52 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:47 Kickstart wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:44 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:42 marvellosity wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:40 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:37 iamperfection wrote:
Whats everybody think of bh he is like a very good player when he is town from what i saw and here he really hasent done anything despite being here tell me what you guys think.


Give him a chance. He is one of those guys I would 100% never lynch day one because the benefits of him being town vastly out weigh the risks of him being scum.

From what I have heard around the grapevine however he is fairly easy to read as scum so we should be fine to take a look at him later on in the game.


you kidding? I'd lynch him day 1 in a heartbeat if I thought he was scum.


Well. That is fine. But I am not going to lynch him day one when he is a very good town player and the only case against him so far is that he is lurking.


The night (or day in terms of our game i guess!) is young, I wouldn't call anyone a lurker just yet. But I agree with marv that people who give off scum vibes should get the vote and find it odd that you are basically stating that you wouldn't vote for him no matter what ;o.


Yep. I would not. I would not vote day one for Hapa or marv either. Unless there was something super obvious I would not vote for them. But I do not think that would happen because they are all good players and that is why I respect them I suppose.



Honestly I think it's bad to tie yourself down with ideas like that. If someone's playing scummy, they're playing scummy. My scum play isn't amazing, but due to my extreme sex appeal and enormous intelligence and penis, I can assure you that it's improved a great deal. Mostly it's due to my large penis-- it is quite a monstrosity. It works as a pad, even.

Back on topic, don't feel like you can't vote or push people because of possible contributions. This kind of play is lazy and puts preconceived notions of what certain players are worth ahead of behavioral analysis. Someone voting for me because they legitimately think I'm scum and they have the cojones to do it is infinitely more helpful to town than someone not voting me because I'm a sexy baller.

That being said, iamperfection's vote is pretty typical iamperfection throwing his vote around trying to pressure people but not doing it effectively. He needs to realize that you should vote people when you want to lynch them, or else you won't be taken seriously.

LOL dont you dare talk down to me you little punk. You criticize me when YOU were the one being all terrible with your first couple of posts. Being all herp derp i don't have to contribute even though interesting things were happening at the time. Give me a break

But that being said ## Unvote

Your case on zbos reminds me more of your play from rockband more then the way you were being early on.

Lokking at what zbos has posted especially this crap which bh pointed out
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote:
Loving the activity so far.
What I'm not loving is the excess of activity coming from debears.
He's being very chit-chatty this game and here's what I find very interesting.
He has commented on every single little thing on this game and is posting a ton (which by itself is anti-town, as it clogs up the thread and makes it difficult to read), but when dealing with the only significant thing that has yet happened in this thread, he simply shrugs it off as:

On November 13 2012 09:46 debears wrote:
On November 13 2012 09:45 iamperfection wrote:
i guess theirs no reason not to believe zbos right? has to be to risky to do if he was scum right.


Eh. If it's down to lylo we'll need to take a strong look at it if he's alive. Other than that, nothing much to talk about with the claim


For someone who is analytical enough to attempt to judge marv's early game reactions, he's sure not being analytical about my claim. This smells scummy to me.

##vote debears


If you look closely debears never said anything about being able to tell if marv is town or not from an anyltical standpoint he made it pretty clear that it was not the case and that he had said he was simply going to vote for him no matter what.

Zbos totally misrepresents what is being said here and if he has the courage to throw a vote out for it you would have thought he would have read clearly what he was in fact voting for.
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:05 Z-BosoN wrote:
@Hapa: To be honest, I've had an opposite reaction from iamp's trusting of me. I think scum would think twice before openly accepting any townie claim. In his last scum game, iirc, he was much pickier on his town reads. May be wrong here.

@debears

On November 13 2012 10:16 debears wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:13 Z-BosoN wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:02 strongandbig wrote:
also fuck you zboson i wanted to fakeclaim miller as vt since then people couldn't say "oh he's fakeclaiming miller must mean he's scum" when i fakeclaim miller as scum

but now if i did that people would be like "two millers what are the odds" and then probably lynch you so no good on that one


Glad I beat you to it.
Interesting way to claim VT though. Actually I find that suspicious as fuck.

##Unvote
##Vote strongandbig

Debears, I hope your posting improves throughout this game. Also, what do you mean by "that argument again?".


z-bo, I face an onslaught of fluff accusations d1 last game. And, in the end, was night killed d1 after having 2/3 of my top reads being the two scum :D


Great, grats. So you suffer an onslaught of fluff accusations day one, and yet you still plague the thread with fluff? Do you find nothing wrong with that?

@marv
So you say that you fit best the description of actively lurking, and pretty much continue to do that? Tell me more.


This post here is also another pile of crap and its the iamperfection rule of whoever defends me is probably scum. If he cared at all to check in gsl III where i was scum which he played in lollololol i thrw around 2 strong town reads early on he should know this and the fact that he isnt willing to do any legwork in order to find out is more evidence not in his favor. This post is also extremly wishy washy on everything he said.

I know i said early on that i thought the miller claim was more of a town tell but well i think zbos actions speak louder.

so ## Vote zboson


Note the two changes here

1) BH is suddenly town because of one case 30 minutes after iamp's original suspicion
2) Z-Bo is suddenly scum because of BH's case

Note his poor reasoning. His first point is BH's reasoning. His second point is the "imperfection rule"...Really??????? Also, remember that it was and is the first half of d1 at this point. Why is he jumping on Z-Bo for two fucking posts? Why is he jumping on a case from a person whom he thought was suspicious 30 minutes prior?

See how poor that reasoning is? When you switch from a town read to a scum read, you're reasoning should be pretty good.


An apparent guilty conscience

I know i said early on that i thought the miller claim was more of a town tell but well i think zbos actions speak louder.


Ok. What does this line from his vote post on Z-Bo tell us about iamp?

1) He cares about how the town is viewing him
2) He doesn't believe his reasoning is that great for his vote
-note the "well I think his actions speak louder". It's a weak statement. Not a strong one, (a strong one) which should be warranted when you change your read from town to scum in literally no time

Point 1 is a null tell. Point 2 doesn't make any sense from a townie perspective.

What are your guy's thoughts???

The only thing I really disagree with is the 'guilty conscience' as I would probably do the same thing. However, he not only flipflopped his town read, he sheeped his former scumread, with poorly explained reasoning as noted. I need to review his meta looking for posts like this:


Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 10:35 iamperfection wrote:
also ## Unvote Hapa

I liked his thinking in this post
On November 13 2012 10:25 Hapahauli wrote:
On November 13 2012 10:14 Clarity_nl wrote:
It's not like he flavor claimed, thinking others didn't know the flavor. How are those situations alike?
You don't think it's a weird move for a VT to claim VT day 1?


No I don't find it weird. I think it's just a pointless comment that can be made by either alignment. Again, see Mr. Cheesecake's "odd" VT claim time in the Newbie game.

Him trusting Z-Bo's claim so up-front is a bit strange, but again, I don't know if it's just bad logic or scum knowing who's who.

I haven't seen anything alignment indicative from him yet.


For now...


This post is so trivial...the explanation is like asking "Why?" and getting the answer "Because."


This post. It looks like he might be saying something but actually he isn't. It's just summing up the post he's responding to, and summarising. He needs to review iamp's meta but has not, despite making a post half an hour after this one indicating he was still around with the capability to do so.

##Vote: Hopeless1der
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 13:19 GMT
#842
Hopeless, what do you think of iamp right now?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 13:31 GMT
#844
On November 14 2012 22:30 Hopeless1der wrote:
I think hes null. I found the phrase "tell me" (more/please/what you know) alot in his filter and thought I could use that against his meta somehow, but he says it as either alignment best I can tell.
Liquid City he barely explains his reasoning, he was blue.
GSL II, similar traits, but scum.

I'd rather lynch BH over iamperfection today if that puts anything in perspective. That is not me saying I want to lynch BH, he's just higher on the list than perfection.


So you no longer find how iamp flipflopped on Z-Boson particularly scummy?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 13:32 GMT
#845
I hadn't really looked at debears in the manner of how many people he'd talked about. I'll have to look into that :x
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 13:40 GMT
#849
just as i'd decided to vote you, now i don't want to anymore. this is annoying.

##unvote
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 13:49 GMT
#853
On November 14 2012 22:48 strongandbig wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 11:35 marvellosity wrote:
thrawn dear, where indeed have you been?

The problem is, thrawn, is that my meta read on DarthPunk is the diametric opposite to yours.


hmm apparently both marv and bh disagree with me for agreeing that dp is usually more aggressive and in-your-face and not-wishy-washy than he is in this game. I'm pretty sure that at least one of marv and bh is town, if they were both scum BH wouldn't have claimed like that. I'll have to think a little bit or reread some darthpunk history if I really want to vote for him I guess.


Please do.

What you need to look at, s&b, is his scum games. It's no use saying "he's not this wishy washy as town" - because I completely agree with this, he isn't.

He's not as scum either, though.

To the bold: quite.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 13:54 GMT
#858
iamp, who do you wanna lynch buddy
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 13:58 GMT
#863
touché, sir.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 14:11 GMT
#871
On November 14 2012 23:08 strongandbig wrote:
oh forgot to unvote debears (I think that's who I was voting?)
still think he's scum and would possibly be willing to consolidate on him if we need to consolidate but bh is just shouting "hey i'm scummy" at me

##unvote
##vote: blazinghand


While I agree with you that he's scummy, I just don't think the best "technical solution" or what have you is to lynch him today.

Do you have any reasons for calling debears scummy other than the Kenpachi rule?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 14:14 GMT
#875
On November 14 2012 23:06 Clarity_nl wrote:
Marv, how did Hopeless convince you to unvote him?

I think we're getting to the point where we have to consolidate a bit, narrow our focus.
As much as I want to lynch BH, I don't think lynching a blue claim day 1 is smart. If he's scum that's great, he definitely might be, but if he flips JK or VT we're fucked. There won't be any useful information for us.

@ everyone
Is it safe to say that not idiotic lynch candidates are: Thrawn, Darthpunk, Hopeless, Crossfire and MAYBE debears?

I've been having a hard time reading hapa, but the cases against him haven't convinced me whatsoever, and looking at his filter myself.... I haven't found anything I would consider scummy, but I definitely don't get a town vibe.


He did actually seem to have looked at a couple of iamp's games, at least what he said seems true (iamp does say things like "tell me more" a lot).

Clarity, you have first hand experience of debears from last game.

Tell me about him. How is he like to play with this game compared to last? What has he given you that you were expecting, or what are you missing? Your insight is particularly valuable here.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 14:15 GMT
#877
On November 14 2012 23:12 iamperfection wrote:
just trying the dear on marv want to see how it feels


that'll be $10
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 14:17 GMT
#878
debears, tell me how you feel about Hapa.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 16:10 GMT
#901
On November 15 2012 00:48 Blazinghand wrote:
here via phone. anyo e votibg me needs to explain how my play this game is diferent than Storm Mafja or similar to any of the scum games ive played especially since a nontrivial component of the case is meat. no getting off voting me on meta wkfbojt at least doing your HW and staking out a position you can be held to. Ill be back in a few hours prk ably to vote one of these guys trying to opt out of the discussion by voti g me or more likely to call tbem Bad and develep DP case or talk Bout hopeless 1 meat


Take more time on your phone, man.

Anyway, I'll bite.

First things first: you are a clever dude. You are also aware of your scum meta, and we've talked about it before too. As such you're capable of making changes to your meta, or trying to. In other words, being more aggressive and what have you.

Things that have struck me this game with that:

- You called iamp "bad" at least a couple of times. Just outright calling him a bad player. This is in contrast to say Rock Band where you railed at him for poor play and you kept pushing him to play better. Here you call him bad and that's different.

- You called Kickstart "scum or bad", he should be "ignored", he should be "removed from our discourse" (or whatever the direct quote was). The townie BH I know does not completely belittle players like this. This boils down to pretty much outright bullying of a brand new player, and that is not the townie BH I know.

- we've also talked about this before again, but one reason you're pretty good as town is that you make yourself look positively townie with your play. I don't give a shit if you got mislynched once, that's how you normally play town. Here your play is marked by put downs, sarcastic remarks, and very little positive input.

- your case on Z-Boson. This was going to be part of my 'quiz', but if we take a look at your two most recent town-games, Rock Band and Whose Line, your first cases are marked by extensive use of meta. X is scummy because of Y, and look at how he played in this game and this game and this game to try to prove your argument. In this game you made no effort to research Z-Boson's meta, and that's not what I expect of a town BH. In contrast, your first major case as SK in Emergency Mafia also failed to utilise any meta as a supporting argument. Same with Bureaucracy.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 16:13 GMT
#904
On November 15 2012 01:12 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 01:10 iamperfection wrote:
On November 15 2012 01:01 DarthPunk wrote:
SO it seems as if he case against me boils down to meta almost completely and yet my play this game conforms to neither my town nor my scum meta.

Let me tell you what I was doing today. I know people hate this kind of shit. But honestly FU all.

I am house sitting for my sister whilst she goes to Vietnam and Thailand for a month. She leaves tomorrow. So I had to pick up the keys and go over the care of her cats and dog.

Then my friend who I haven't seen for three years was here so I grabbed lunch with him. I had 4 hours in which I had time to not only post in two games, but do various chores before my friend and several others went out for dinner and drinks. I stayed out till now when it is almost 3am and then I get back completely wasted to post in this damn mafia thread with a bunch of idiots who want to mislynch me.

Yes you are idiots. The case is a meta case in which I am deviating from both my scum and my town meta. If I didn't care about being correct I could shit out some cases right now and most likely not get lynched.

I can make fucking excuses because they are true and I didn;t have the time to day to do the amount of reading I like to do in both games. So I prioritised the other game. Holy Shit. you know I need to read 4 end game filters in that game right?? And this game is progressing at a million miles an hour.


Literally I take 5 minutes to write my defence posts but it would take me hours to read enough to be comfortable pushing a lynch.

Because I give a fuck about being right in my reads. Holy shit. that is a town tell if I ever saw one.

I am drunk as fuck writing this post at 3 am when I should rightly be in bed because the best thing I can contribute right now.] is to try and prevent my mislynch.

Honestly. The meta case against me is complete bullshit because it is a shift of meta for both alignments.

Give me one more day to prove my self and to let me shape up. If I don;t you can lynch me.

Holy shit this is some bullshit.





Dont be cry baby about it prove your town by scum hunting. no one really gives a shit about your irl stuff. You are not scumhunting either do so or die at this point.

I want to win this game and if your town your not helping me win


That is so fucking fallacious. Lynching bad townies does not further your win condition. If you think it does you are fucking terrible.


stop replying to things and look at a filter or two, please.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 16:20 GMT
#906
On November 15 2012 01:16 Clarity_nl wrote:
Marv you're gonna have to tell me what this quiz thing was, or maybe refer me to where you did it in another game? I'm intrigued.

@ Darth
You're not getting lynched today, if you had read the thread you would know this.


I was planning on pulling up BH's cases in Rock Band, Whose Line, Emergency, possibly Bureaucracy, and here.

And playing "spot the difference" and "guess the alignment" with each post. Like I said above there, the two previous town games had lots of meta as supporting evidence. Here nothing - if you recall, I specifically asked BH earlier in the thread whether he had looked into Z-Bo's meta at all, and he had not.

I previously did a 'quiz' in Rock Band where I pulled up a bunch of Palmar posts from previous games as well as that game and asked people to guess the alignment. I put two list posts from scum games, as well as a really detailed thought out post from a town game, next to his list post from that game.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 16:21 GMT
#908
why are Hapa and debears town reads, DP?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 16:50 GMT
#914
I had a dig through filters because I was interested in gauging some reactions to BH's claim.

thrawn - doesn't mention it. He makes me uncomfortable with his absence, but... meh.

debears - also doesn't mention it. At all. I find this *extremely* odd, given that he commented on s&b's "claim" and also referenced Z-Bo's. It seems unlike him not to comment on it at all. The only time he's really mentioned it is screaming in all caps that we're not lynching a claimed blue Day 1.

Hopeless - also doesn't mention it. Which is extremely odd for this reason:

On November 14 2012 22:16 Hopeless1der wrote:

-snip-

Am I going to need to pull a BH and shoot my load earl--I mean sift through my own meta to find examples of me being a jackass?
Btw debears, why in the hell were you unable/unwilling to comment on BH's claim?


Attacks debears for not commenting on BH's claim but hasn't done so himself.

I cannot explain why very clearly, but I just don't think we should be lynching DarthPunk today.

I think the lynch should be between Hopeless and debears, and I'd like people to talk about that, a lot. At the moment this makes me lean on Hopeless (and yes, I'm aware I'm flipflopping on him like mad).

##Vote: Hopeless1der
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 16:56 GMT
#916
On November 15 2012 01:54 strongandbig wrote:
posting briefly from work -
marv do you honestly believe bh was really being that dumb? Like, do you think he is telling the truth about why and how he claimed?


It doesn't matter right now. It can be assessed much better tomorrow after night actions. wifomwifomwifom.

If I had to choose I'd say BH was scum, but I'm nowhere near certain enough on it to lynch into a claimed blue without any further flip information.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:09 GMT
#922
I really think DP is a bad lynch. Hopeless or debears.

DP does not play uselessly as scum either.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:10 GMT
#923
On November 15 2012 02:09 iamperfection wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 23:10 debears wrote:
On November 14 2012 23:06 strongandbig wrote:
On November 14 2012 12:39 Blazinghand wrote:
anyone who would lynch a claimed blue D1 has serious issues


that sir is what's called "pushing your luck"

On November 14 2012 13:31 Blazinghand wrote:
Thrawn is more right than he's wrong. More stalling, excuses, and mentioning other games in progress from DP.

##unvote
##vote: Darthpunk


BH posted this after reading exactly the same explanation from DP that I read, and exactly the same comments on DP's meta from marv as I read, and doing exactly the same amount of work looking into DP's actual scum/town meta as I did (none) - and yet he comes up with a vote? Without at all addressing the points from Marv and from himself about DP's meta? And without addressing the other game in progress issue - which isn't an "unverifiable irl excuse," we can go look at the thread - and yet he comes up with a vote?

guys what we have out of BH is not just a scummy and needless claim - we have a scummy and needless claim from a player who isn't playing up to his usual town standard in several ways
- bad cases
- trolling/fluff while taking the easy opportunity to gain points by attacking other people for fluff
and most importantly
- the huge mismatch in thread presence, thread control, and town organization between BH's last town game (whose line) and this game

And then we have
On November 14 2012 12:39 Blazinghand wrote:
anyone who would lynch a claimed blue D1 has serious issues

BH psychology: he just saw me do well - not win, except for self-declaring victory, but do much better than I should have given how the game started out - he saw me do well by fakeclaiming blue and then really pushing that fakeclaim hard. He also just had what I assume must be a trollgasm from evoking ridiculous reactions from Keirathi in that same game. Now he's claimed blue for no good reason, and it's a blue role that he can "verify" easily by withholding KP, or that he can make unverifiable by claiming to be roleblocked.

There's no way a town BH decides "there are 3 or 4 votes on me, like 30 hours before the lynch - time to claim!"

I just don't believe that thought process is real.

##vote: blazinghand


that's not commenting on the claim, that's commenting much later on strongandbig wanting to lynch BH>

There's a massive difference


ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING??? THERE ARE NO COUNTERCLAIMS FROM A JK/RB, AND YOU WANT TO LYNCH A JK CLAIM DAY 1???

debars did comment on it with caps lock no less

[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:10 GMT
#924
oops

On November 15 2012 02:09 iamperfection wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 23:10 debears wrote:
On November 14 2012 23:06 strongandbig wrote:
On November 14 2012 12:39 Blazinghand wrote:
anyone who would lynch a claimed blue D1 has serious issues


that sir is what's called "pushing your luck"

On November 14 2012 13:31 Blazinghand wrote:
Thrawn is more right than he's wrong. More stalling, excuses, and mentioning other games in progress from DP.

##unvote
##vote: Darthpunk


BH posted this after reading exactly the same explanation from DP that I read, and exactly the same comments on DP's meta from marv as I read, and doing exactly the same amount of work looking into DP's actual scum/town meta as I did (none) - and yet he comes up with a vote? Without at all addressing the points from Marv and from himself about DP's meta? And without addressing the other game in progress issue - which isn't an "unverifiable irl excuse," we can go look at the thread - and yet he comes up with a vote?

guys what we have out of BH is not just a scummy and needless claim - we have a scummy and needless claim from a player who isn't playing up to his usual town standard in several ways
- bad cases
- trolling/fluff while taking the easy opportunity to gain points by attacking other people for fluff
and most importantly
- the huge mismatch in thread presence, thread control, and town organization between BH's last town game (whose line) and this game

And then we have
On November 14 2012 12:39 Blazinghand wrote:
anyone who would lynch a claimed blue D1 has serious issues

BH psychology: he just saw me do well - not win, except for self-declaring victory, but do much better than I should have given how the game started out - he saw me do well by fakeclaiming blue and then really pushing that fakeclaim hard. He also just had what I assume must be a trollgasm from evoking ridiculous reactions from Keirathi in that same game. Now he's claimed blue for no good reason, and it's a blue role that he can "verify" easily by withholding KP, or that he can make unverifiable by claiming to be roleblocked.

There's no way a town BH decides "there are 3 or 4 votes on me, like 30 hours before the lynch - time to claim!"

I just don't believe that thought process is real.

##vote: blazinghand



ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING??? THERE ARE NO COUNTERCLAIMS FROM A JK/RB, AND YOU WANT TO LYNCH A JK CLAIM DAY 1???

debars did comment on it with caps lock no less


that's not commenting on the claim, that's commenting much later on strongandbig wanting to lynch BH>

There's a massive difference
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:12 GMT
#926
On November 15 2012 02:11 iamperfection wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 02:09 marvellosity wrote:
I really think DP is a bad lynch. Hopeless or debears.

DP does not play uselessly as scum either.

DP was not useless as town either in gsl III


you're missing the fucking point.

DP does not play uselessly AS EITHER ALIGNMENT.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:14 GMT
#928
On November 15 2012 02:13 iamperfection wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 02:12 marvellosity wrote:
On November 15 2012 02:11 iamperfection wrote:
On November 15 2012 02:09 marvellosity wrote:
I really think DP is a bad lynch. Hopeless or debears.

DP does not play uselessly as scum either.

DP was not useless as town either in gsl III


you're missing the fucking point.

DP does not play uselessly AS EITHER ALIGNMENT.

SO THAT MAKES HIM FUCKING TOWN??!!!?!?!


it makes him neither, for fuck's sake.

If he is not useless as either A or B, then when he IS useless you can't say that he's necessarily A or B.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:16 GMT
#930
just... do me a favour and look into debears and Hopeless, please.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:24 GMT
#934
thrawn, what do you think about other players? Hopeless, debears? What do you think of BH's claim?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:31 GMT
#939
On November 15 2012 02:29 thrawn2112 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 02:24 marvellosity wrote:
thrawn, what do you think about other players? Hopeless, debears? What do you think of BH's claim?

i think his claim's probably true... there's been no counter claim and it'd be difficult to fakeclaim this early on and hold your story straight the rest of the game. also, he came to similar conclusions as I did about the snb voting so i'm leaning town


and the rest?

we have very little to hang our hat on with you, dear.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:44 GMT
#941
I'm down with debears. Hopeless is slightly mindfucky to me because he keeps answering my concerns in what seems to be a legit way.

And the debears screaming about not lynching claimed JK thing is increasingly getting on my nerves, given that's the first time he mentioned it. If he's really so convinced by it why hadn't he said anything about it previously? Especially as I mentioned he hasn't minded talking about other, less relevant, claims.

On November 13 2012 10:04 debears wrote:
so now we have 2 claims d1....great


so he's tutting about claims... but doesn't mention BH's at all? Like, the really really important one?

##unvote
##vote: debears
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 17:51 GMT
#943
On November 15 2012 02:49 debears wrote:
Hey I'm the main lynch candidate now. Yahoo!!!!!!

Will address hapa in a secs. Lolololol

How long is lynch from now?


host said exactly how long half an hour ago. work it out.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 18:03 GMT
#953
On November 15 2012 03:02 debears wrote:
Lol BH *high five*

You my dawg


why didn't you comment on BH's claim?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 18:06 GMT
#958
oh yeah, missed that.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 18:16 GMT
#970
On November 15 2012 03:04 strongandbig wrote:
AT: "this is a dumb town claim but a dumber scum claim"

I have yet to see why this is true.

I addressed in this post why BH specifically would make this fakeclaim as scum right now. To summarize, it's a combination of reasons: he really enjoys trolling, and he knows how good of an idea making an unverifiable fakeclaim is as scum under pressure in the current TL meta.

your argument "if he's alive in a few days" is terrible. if, in theory, he was town, there would be no reason for scum to kill him above anyone else; they could just roleblock him forever now that he's claimed, and he's taking enough heat that town doesn't get any kind of "confirmed townie" advantage from having him alive.




all that said, debears is still my second lynch choice. I guess I should say more about him than "kenpachi rule", but I won't right now because I don't have time.


There are some reasons not to lynch BH today. In any setup with 3+ blues, scum will have a roleblocker. If BH is lying, scum will have to withold all of their roleblocks. This makes the claim inherently a poor scum play.

There may yet be another Jailkeeper (or perhaps, the only jailkeeper) who doesn't want to claim, but can 'prove' their existence when a roleblock appears tonight (hopefully on me, yo ). Or 2 jailkeepers is possible (although it would require JJJ which is pretty unlikely).

I've seen a fucking appalling day 1 jailkeeper claim before on a day 1. VE did it in... er... LIII? The claim made no sense, and it was fucking stupid. We lynched him. He flipped jailkeeper. So... ugh.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 18:17 GMT
#972
On November 15 2012 03:08 Blazinghand wrote:
marv although i didnt use meta in my case on ZB i dont think thats a legit meta read of me cause the usage or none usage of one tool which i only started using in the past month it is only one part of a tool box


and the rest of it?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 18:25 GMT
#977
you don't have to make a meta case to show someone is scum, debears, that's silly
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 18:31 GMT
#979
On November 15 2012 03:30 Blazinghand wrote:
oh yeah i mean ive played like poop im just saying im playing to my town meta not my scum meta


stop making pointless one-liner posts from your phone, i don't want them. there was a whole bunch of stuff i said and you said you don't always use meta. this is not helpful. Address the rest of it too when you're home.

Stop saying which meta you're playing to.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 19:07 GMT
#983
On November 15 2012 03:51 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 03:31 marvellosity wrote:
On November 15 2012 03:30 Blazinghand wrote:
oh yeah i mean ive played like poop im just saying im playing to my town meta not my scum meta


stop making pointless one-liner posts from your phone, i don't want them. there was a whole bunch of stuff i said and you said you don't always use meta. this is not helpful. Address the rest of it too when you're home.

Stop saying which meta you're playing to.


ill stop defending meta claims when people stop using it against me. dealing with specific meta claims is easy to do from the phone because i am intimately familiar with my own meta so might as well do it sooner rather than later right also if there's relevant meta in my defense im gonna talk about it and if you dont like the truth then too bad


you didn't give me the truth, you answered one fucking tiny part of my post.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 21:06 GMT
#993
On November 15 2012 05:16 Z-BosoN wrote:

Why not DarthPunk?
He hasn't posted much. I find him a good lynch, nevertheless. He is referring himself as a mislynch, YET AGAIN. And I've already told him he loves doing that as scum. I have no idea why he's doing it, but I'm not going to use that as a tell. I don't like how bitchy he is being, focusing most of his time in crying and whining instead of scumhunting. I'm interested to see how he goes in day two though.



i hate this. what's your read on him and why?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 21:06 GMT
#995
On November 15 2012 05:58 Clarity_nl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2012 14:17 DarthPunk wrote:
You know I could make some half arse case and tunnel some bad townie really easily and then probably not get lynched right?

Now why am I not doing that? Because, as I have said. I have not had the time required to get reads that I am convinced are valuable to the thread.

I don;t want to just fake shit to keep myself alive.

Is that scummy or townie.


I never answered this, so I will now, it's scummy. You don't want to keep yourself alive as town?


Stupid. I retort:

"You don't want to keep yourself alive as scum?"
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 21:12 GMT
#998
Blazing, when you home? I wanna talk to you, and not in the "I want to shout at you for being a douche" way, but a "I want to talk to you about some things" way.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 21:14 GMT
#1000
On November 15 2012 06:13 Z-BosoN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 06:06 marvellosity wrote:
On November 15 2012 05:16 Z-BosoN wrote:

Why not DarthPunk?
He hasn't posted much. I find him a good lynch, nevertheless. He is referring himself as a mislynch, YET AGAIN. And I've already told him he loves doing that as scum. I have no idea why he's doing it, but I'm not going to use that as a tell. I don't like how bitchy he is being, focusing most of his time in crying and whining instead of scumhunting. I'm interested to see how he goes in day two though.



i hate this. what's your read on him and why?


He can definitely be scum. The reasoning is above. I'd rather lynch Hopeless. Perhaps instead of "Why not DP?" just read "DP" and interpret that as a secondary assessment.
I'd rather lynch Hopeless though, my post says it all.
I find it interesting how you hated my bit on DP, instead of my bit on debears, your main lynch candidate. Is there anything else you want to add while you are at it? Do you agree with what I said?


I'm finding you kinda scummy all of a sudden actually.

"He can definitely be scum" is not a read, by the way. Anyone can definitely be scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 21:18 GMT
#1002
Thanks, Hopeless. You've convinced me.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 21:18 GMT
#1003
I need me some Blazing, Hapa, Kickstart, and Crossfire.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 21:20 GMT
#1007
alright, just tell me when you are home so I can talk to you. I don't want to talk to phone you, I need your attention and ability to post fully.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 23:04 GMT
#1047
##unvote

I wanna lynch someone else. Case incoming once I get the pieces all together.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 23:07 GMT
#1051
3 hours is plenty.

And I'm motherfucking marvellosity, baby.

/hubris
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 23:18 GMT
#1059
debears is right, by the way.

Some of Hapa's pushing on him is fucking nonsense.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 23:27 GMT
#1071
Hi BH. I really just wanted to talk about your claim a little bit.

Given the legit concerns I raised earlier about the downsides of claiming Jailkeeper, plus the fact you're a good enough player to avert your lynch if you're town, I just wanted to know your thought process when you decided to claim.

I'd quite like to make a read on you because it will help with my Z-Boson read.

At the moment I think he is scum. Although I am struggling to make an excellent case out of it because so much of it comes down to tone.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 23:31 GMT
#1077
On November 15 2012 08:30 Blazinghand wrote:
I mean, I personally don't think ZB is scum right now. Earlier I did for the way he was trying to set up town cred with his voting pattern, but iamp correctly noted that ZB straightened up after his initial OMGUS on me. This could be due to scum thread coaching, I'll admit, but the aggression he displayed, however wrong-headed, is town to me.


wasn't what i asked dear
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 23:36 GMT
#1087
On November 15 2012 08:33 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 08:31 marvellosity wrote:
On November 15 2012 08:30 Blazinghand wrote:
I mean, I personally don't think ZB is scum right now. Earlier I did for the way he was trying to set up town cred with his voting pattern, but iamp correctly noted that ZB straightened up after his initial OMGUS on me. This could be due to scum thread coaching, I'll admit, but the aggression he displayed, however wrong-headed, is town to me.


wasn't what i asked dear

You're not lynching me today and I'm town. I'm helping you with your ZB read.


NO. I asked you about your claim thought process. I want to get a read on YOU. Please answer me.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 23:36 GMT
#1089
ninjad. bleh
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 14 2012 23:58 GMT
#1116
Z-Boson

Metarelated stuff. Let's a gogo. First of all, here's a sample post from him playing scum in Newbie XXIV. You'll have to excuse the length, but the point is it's length and effort.

On August 22 2012 02:38 Z-BosoN wrote:
@goodkarma

Well that was quick. Let me see if I understand. Now, in day 3, in a MYLO situation, you propose to.

Show nested quote +
On August 21 2012 09:16 goodkarma wrote:
Okay then. We need to be active today, and I'm wasting no time in getting started:


@Golbat:

You have a lot of explaining to do for your lurking, so please start there. Also, if you would kindly explain this quote:


On August 18 2012 15:59 Golbat wrote:
On August 18 2012 15:50 DarthPunk wrote:
On August 18 2012 15:32 Golbat wrote:
On August 18 2012 15:19 DarthPunk wrote:
On August 18 2012 15:10 Golbat wrote:
On August 18 2012 12:55 goodkarma wrote:
@YourHarry:

Any suggestions as to who this someone else is that we should lynch?


My first thoughts are either Orchrow or you.


You seem to be very interested in keeping thrawn alive as long as possible... I suggest you start making some meaningful suggestions as to who you feel looks scummier. And it would also be helpful if you commented on people's most recent cases against thrawn, Orchrow, and yourself instead of continuing to strive to keep Thrawn alive.


There are situations here where the vigi still shouldn't claim. Like what if there is an sk, but the vigi hasn't used his shot yet? A vigi counter claim here would be terrible, as he could wind up rb'ed by scum and NK'ed before he can do anything.

And if we wait, who's to say town doesn't get a successful medic save or rb? Or that scum or the sk (if he exists) doesn't just sit back and do nothing for one night? There's a few different ways that there could be an sk but fewer than two night kills.

Waiting achieves nothing. My read, and the read of several of us here, is that thrawn is scum. It's time for him to go. Read through the case points against him, and show us why you feel he might be town. It's more productive than your WIFOM defense of thrawn you're presenting now.


I am in agreement that we should just lynch thrawn here. We seem to have caught a scum or even two, I think if thrawn flips scum then YH is almost certainly scum.


You are lurking pretty hard buddy. I would also like to ask Ochrow, solarsail Z-Boson and Stutters to increase their contributions.


I agree i'm lurking, but I feel that I have at least contributed well for my sparse filter. I made my case on thrawn, and cast my vote. When I see something worth discussing I mention it. I may not be living in the thread as hard as you, harry or thrawn, but at least I've contributed. What do you suggest I do to be less "lurky"? Make a shit case on someone in a misguided attempt to look active? Last game it got me lynched and cost town a vigi shot.

I'll go over the thread again and see if anything catches my eye, but I don't really see a case I can make that hasn't already been made ATM. At the very least i'll prod some people in my next couple posts.


Why so defensive? I understand that you got lynched for being over eager in XXII but your posting is markedly different than what I experienced there (although you were only alive for 24 hours so not much of a meta to read ) my post was not a personal attack but rather a call to all lurkers to contribute something.


Apologies. I didn't mean to come off as defensive, just that I'm not intentionally lurking, just not posting uselessly. in my last game I died before I could make a big contribution, and I just want to help catch a scum before I die this game. Now is the time to step it up I guess.


I've already explained what I felt was scummy about this, but in case you need a reminder:

You seem more interested in staying alive right now than in actually scumhunting. "Not posting uselessly" is not an excuse for not posting at all. Even one one-line post explaining your absence would have been useful at this point, and you wouldn't even contribute that.

You argue to not be lurking intentionally, but I would argue that yes, lurking for 48 hours is rather intentional. There's no way that you haven't thought up anything worthwhile in that time unless if between then and now you have forgotten altogether about this thread. And why would you do that if you want to "make a big contribution" that leads to the lynch of a scum?

One more question: Why did you tunnel Thrawn so hard?


##Vote: Golbat


Wait a minute. This is do or die for the town. You plan to consolidate your vote on someone who barely has any information on him and has been a hardcore lurker since day one? Because he tunneled thrawn, as if you didn't? Oh wait, that's right, you had a very sudden change of heart. But then, you go on and say that:

Show nested quote +
(...)And finally there's the final vote count for day 2. I currently believe the Thrawn mislynch had heavy scum support. One reason scum would have for getting behind a candidate would be if one of their own also had strong support. If you look at the votes, and see where those who have established themselves as town have voted, I'm sure you'll agree the YourHarry lynch had some reputable town support behind it. And all of the current scum suspects are on the Thrawn mislynch.:


Well that's a very convenient argument, to go along with your name not being on that list. Drop in the bomb, wait for people to sheep you, then escape, no compromises.
It's also ironic you didn't think of it before, when everybody wanted Shady Sands dead, who was the top poster at the moment. I'll go ahead and post the day one votes.

Show nested quote +
ShadySands (5): SolarSail, thrawn2112, SolarSail, mkfuba07, Jhuyt, YourHarry, YourHarry
SolarSail (0): YourHarry
thrawn2112 (4): YourHarry ShadySands, Archrun, DarthPunk, Golbat
goodkarma (0): YourHarry
Jhuyt (2): goodkarma, Z-Boson
Archrun (2): Ochrow, Stutters695. Ochrow, YourHarry


Same argument you used. Look at that, everyone on ShadySands list must be quite the suspects of being scum. Because, "One reason scum would have for getting behind a candidate would be if one of their own also had strong support."

Except that he wasn't scum was he? This is because this argument is very weak. It only becomes suspicious when one target has a LOT of scumminess on him and a LOT of posts against him while the other looks so innocent and barely has anything substatial on him. This is not the case, because thrawn had a huge wall of text against him, not only the one you posted, but also the one that I did as well. DP also thought he was scum, and I will agree that the case against thrawn was fairly powerful.

DAY ONE should have been the time we should have lynched lurkers. DAY TWO, maybe. Not day 3, with a do or die scenario, against someone who, as Obvious pointed out, is clearly not giving a rat's ass about this game. This day will be the target with the greatest case against him.
I really don't like how quick it was for you to vote on golbat, and how quick some people seemed to sheep you.




Regarding YourHarry, you went from him possibly being your third suspect to him being your main suspect with this post:


Show nested quote +
On August 21 2012 17:59 goodkarma wrote:
Regarding YourHarry:

Sometimes the most obvious scum is the hardest to spot. YourHarry has a "meta" for sporadic and unpredictable play. But however strange, or different, or unpredictable his play is, if you were to look at the motivation behind his play, you can determine his alignment. With YourHarry, actions speak louder than words:

-First, YourHarry is fond of withholding information from us. YourHarry starts the game by making a weak WIFOM case on me, claiming if I'm not a mason I'm scum. He withholds his read on me for a long time until pressured to provide it, and while here maybe you could argue he had some justification, this is a recurring theme. Over and over again he's done this. With this "mason case," with vote swapping history, with providing reads on certain people (most recently, Golbat). This behavior is clearly anti-town. Obviously withholding information would be advantageous for scum as it could make it harder for others to get a good read on him. Could a townie also do this? Maybe, but this is just the tip of the iceberg.

-YourHarry is a fan of last-minute vote swapping. He has now twice last minute switched his vote to secure the mislynch of the top candidate. This behavior simply can't be ignored anymore. There is clear scum motivation here.

-The use of WIFOM first, actual use of reasoning when pressured later. He already did that today with Golbat. He started today with soft defending him, and then decides he will actually "read his filter." I'll say that again: only after defending Golbat with WIFOM does he decide it's a good idea to read his filter. Then, finally, he decides to actually present a case which is in fact against Golbat. In other words, he's demonstrated a lack of interest in actually contributing meaningfully to scumhunting.

-On top of this, today he has focused a large degree of effort on getting people to role claim. If my theory on scum's motive for the night kills is to be believed, YourHarry is trying to draw important town roles out of hiding as easy scum targets.

There's loads of scum motivation to be seen behind YourHarry's actions, and there are several cases that have already been made against him. Yet somehow he seems to have avoided getting lynched. My biggest issue with lynching him, and why he hasn't been higher on my "scum reads," has been that his play is consistently bad, and it would be easy to mislynch a town YourHarry. But if you look at his actions, they fit a scum agenda.

And finally there's the final vote count for day 2. I currently believe the Thrawn mislynch had heavy scum support. One reason scum would have for getting behind a candidate would be if one of their own also had strong support. If you look at the votes, and see where those who have established themselves as town have voted, I'm sure you'll agree the YourHarry lynch had some reputable town support behind it. And all of the current scum suspects are on the Thrawn mislynch.:

Directly from the official end of day 2 post (minus the blue text):
thrawn2112, as VisceraEyes, vigilante, was lynched!

[spoiler=Final Vote Count]
Final Vote Count:

Thrawn2112 (5): DarthPunk, Golbat, Solarsail, goodkarma, YourHarry, Z-BosoN, Obvious.660, Solarsail, YourHarry
Obvious.660 (1): goodkarma, thrawn2112, Solarsail
YourHarry (3): DarthPunk, Jhuyt, Stutters695
goodkarma (0): Obvious.660
Jhuyt (1): thrawn2112, YourHarry


YourHarry, right now you're my top scum read.


##Unvote

##Vote: YourHarry

I encourage everyone to put together their reads, as there's still time for you to express your viewpoints before we consolidate our vote in the last 24 hours of the day. And obviously supporting or dissenting case points towards this case would be much appreciated.


Your arguments are nothing new, it's what has been stated on YourHarry since the beggining of time. The only thing new that you add is that he is suspiciously wanting everyone to roleclaim. But why do you focus on him, and blatantly ignore DarthPunk's same remark:

Show nested quote +
On August 21 2012 13:49 DarthPunk wrote:
On August 21 2012 13:24 YourHarry wrote:
Good point on scums not having time to respond to your latest post. But there were common suspicions between Golbat and Jhyut that were posted hours before deadline:

Z-boson's suspect list went: me, Jhyut, Golbat
Darth's suspect list: Golbat, Jhyut, Solar
GK's suspect list: Golbat, Jhyut, Obvious

Maybe WIFOM. But to me, I still can't get my head around scum Golbat lynching town Jhyut, who seemed to be scum Golbat's only way out.

Regards to no lynching, the only caveat for choosing to lynch today rather than tomorrow is the medic save. But if we decide to go ahead with our lynch today, I think claiming today is a good idea. We NEED a scum lynch today. And everyone claiming would make that much easier.


Sorry I am kind of busy and am not following the thread right now. but I agree with a mass claim. we are at the stage of the game where we need as much info as possible because we cannot afford a mistake. I feel really out of my depth here, scum are either afk winning or playing really well.


The same guy in which you solemnly confided your trust in your "will":

Show nested quote +
(...)I have played with DarthPunk before, and I’ve seen his scum play. He has been 10 times more proactive than he was in that game about sharing scum reads and I am convinced he is legitimately searching for scum this time around. Add to that that he’s come independently to similar reads as myself, and I feel he is my strongest town read right now. So all of you get behind him as your leader and consolidate your vote under him. There is a small (note: slim) chance that he’s scum, but you’re going to have to live with that. To have a chance of winning town needs to consolidate its vote and this is the best way to do this. Come the next night, I leave it to Darthpunk to leave his successor in a will similar to this one should he also get NK’ed.


Also, you say these incredibly serious accusations:

Show nested quote +
(...)There's loads of scum motivation to be seen behind YourHarry's actions, and there are several cases that have already been made against him. Yet somehow he seems to have avoided getting lynched. My biggest issue with lynching him, and why he hasn't been higher on my "scum reads," has been that his play is consistently bad, and it would be easy to mislynch a town YourHarry. But if you look at his actions, they fit a scum agenda.


And you don't bother explaining what you mean. You just sheep around with the main case that has already been made, add something meaningless (if you want to give it meaning, please go ahead and attack DarthPunk as well), then hint at the most serious accusations you can possibly make and don't go ahead and explain what you mean.

I agree wholeheartedly that YourHarry is scum, you can go ahead and check that in my filter , but the way you write this and the arguments you use make me feel very suspicious that you may be scum as well. Now I see that the only reason I had lifted my suspicions of you were mainly WIFOM, but your latest actions have definitely raised my eyebrows. Right now is the easiest time for a scum to slip, because any small mistake now will not slip by so easily.

One more thing, you say that the night kills were not discussed in detail. Read my filter, if you will. Actually this night's night kills is what is giving me additional ammo on YH. That soon to come.

##FoS goodkarma


Also, here is Z-Boson's filter from that game: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=359489&user=28495

Notice there are a large number of big posts. Big posts with certain conclusions. All the time. Much as here.

What's missing in Z-Boson's play this game?

On October 21 2012 22:46 Z-BosoN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 21 2012 13:13 DarthPunk wrote:
Also his defense each time is oh you must be scum and trying to trick me. Nothing townie about it. And your 'meta' read is bleh.

Haha, you don't say, eh DP?



On October 22 2012 01:03 Z-BosoN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 22 2012 00:52 DarthPunk wrote:
Also ZB. Postgame I would like to go through how you make such accurate reads on me all the time. It get's frustrating as scum. (and also hilarious)

Oh-oh. This obviously-I'm-town post comes mostly from scum DP. Don't get so confident, I'm not dead sure on you yet!



On October 22 2012 01:08 Z-BosoN wrote:
Sniped by austin. There we are, finally. Now waiting for the two days of unforgiving tunneling from him
Hello Keirathi! How goes your scum life?
Any thoughts you would like to trouble us with?


On October 22 2012 03:53 Z-BosoN wrote:
k
k
Well, you really think he is scum and should insta-die before he's even had a chance to defend himself? I'm uncomfortable sending him to his grave like this...
I'd like to know if you are scum. Think about it. It's the pro-town thing to do. If you are scum, it's pro-town because town will lynch a scum. If you are town, then it's pro-town that we don't have to kill you. Tell us


On September 30 2012 13:32 Z-BosoN wrote:
Oh god.
Is there anyways I can mega-vote him?


On September 30 2012 13:52 Z-BosoN wrote:
I think someone has some real issues.
Does liquid city have a psych ward?


On October 02 2012 11:04 Z-BosoN wrote:
Omfg austin really loves me.
I'm just going to ignore you this time, I make an oath that your bad arguments will bother me no more.
You also seem a lot more scummy this game. At least on LVII your arguments made sense, from an ape's perspective.
Right now you just seem desperate.
I, Z-BosoN, solemnly swear, to never defend myself from austin's scrutiny ever again.


On October 22 2012 05:24 Z-BosoN wrote:
Austin, holy shit.
For the first time ever, I've successfully agreed with every single thing in your post, every single thing.
/applauds

Due to recent events though, Hapa is coming off pretty suspicious to me.


This is a selection of quotes from GSL3 and Liquid City. I paste them all here to demonstrate Z-Boson's ability, and indeed propensity, to throw in light-hearted comments. He's not all serious all the time.

Look at his filter here. Can you find that? At all? No, not really. It's completely absent. Arguably, this is it:

On November 13 2012 09:41 Z-BosoN wrote:

Regarding DarthPunk, don't worry, if he's scum, I'll figure it out


Right at the beginning. I find his attitude towards DP... not townie. There's a lack of interaction from Z-Bo towards DarthPunk that I wouldn't expect from townie Z-Bo.

On November 13 2012 11:20 Z-BosoN wrote:
DP, that's the second time you've voted for him without saying why.
This won't do.


It goes from the above, to:

On November 15 2012 05:16 Z-BosoN wrote:
Why not DarthPunk?
He hasn't posted much. I find him a good lynch, nevertheless. He is referring himself as a mislynch, YET AGAIN. And I've already told him he loves doing that as scum. I have no idea why he's doing it, but I'm not going to use that as a tell. I don't like how bitchy he is being, focusing most of his time in crying and whining instead of scumhunting. I'm interested to see how he goes in day two though.



He finds him a 'good lynch', but he makes it clear that he's not using the referring to self as mislynch thing as scum. Is it that he's bitchy? Is that a scumtell? Who knows. He's "interested" to see how he goes in Day 2 though. The wording is just... ick.

On November 15 2012 08:21 Z-BosoN wrote:
Had some internet problems.. Luckily it was on control C. In reply to marvs other post:




Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 06:14 marvellosity wrote:
On November 15 2012 06:13 Z-BosoN wrote:
On November 15 2012 06:06 marvellosity wrote:
On November 15 2012 05:16 Z-BosoN wrote:

Why not DarthPunk?
He hasn't posted much. I find him a good lynch, nevertheless. He is referring himself as a mislynch, YET AGAIN. And I've already told him he loves doing that as scum. I have no idea why he's doing it, but I'm not going to use that as a tell. I don't like how bitchy he is being, focusing most of his time in crying and whining instead of scumhunting. I'm interested to see how he goes in day two though.



i hate this. what's your read on him and why?


He can definitely be scum. The reasoning is above. I'd rather lynch Hopeless. Perhaps instead of "Why not DP?" just read "DP" and interpret that as a secondary assessment.
I'd rather lynch Hopeless though, my post says it all.
I find it interesting how you hated my bit on DP, instead of my bit on debears, your main lynch candidate. Is there anything else you want to add while you are at it? Do you agree with what I said?


I'm finding you kinda scummy all of a sudden actually.

"He can definitely be scum" is not a read, by the way. Anyone can definitely be scum.


Isn't it fucking obvious that I mean that to me he has a good chance of being scum, especially given what I've written on him?
10x better than your "I'm finding you kinda scummy" which adds shit to the thread.
If Hopeless is a 10, DP is a 7, go with that.
Try answering the question now? I phrased it very clearly and I find it important enough that I insist.




Anyways, Hopeless´s meta explanation makes sense, and that was my main issue with him. Right now I´d rather lynch DarthPunk. Gonna let marv finish to see if he will/will not change my mind.

##Unvote


There's weird things going on in this post. "If hopeless is a 10" to "his meta explanation makes sense".

Generally, given Z-Bo's intimate familiarity with DP's play and his meta, there seems to be no discernable effort to make any read on him on that basis. Z-Boson is calling DarthPunk scum right now, but there's no supporting evidence of games previously played. I don't buy it.

Also I bolded that other line where he says I should answer just because I find the wording completely unnatural. "I find it important enough that I insist".



None of this play looks like Z-Boson's town play.

When he is townie, he is very indecisive about who he wants to lynch. Just look at his filter in GSL3 or Liquid city. Liquid City his vote jumped around more times than I can count and with great uncertainty, and even his final vote he still seemed clueless. And in GSL3 he agonised for days on everyone before finally voting for someone.

Here there is no... communication with town, trying to figure things out properly. It's BAM, BlazingHand is scum. He pursues BlazingHand - and make no mistake, he can pursue very well as scum, check the filter I gave you. Then when BH is off the table, he comes back today with BAM, Hopeless is scum.

As quoted there's the absence of Z-bo interacting in a lighthearted manner with town that I am familiar with. His filter is short, with long posts, rather than longer, with lots of short posts figuring things out.

##Vote: Z-Boson
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:13 GMT
#1132
On November 15 2012 09:09 debears wrote:
@Marv

While it does fit meta, and I did say long posts make it easier for scum to think things out, I'm not willing to lynch Z-Bo today.

Why not HopelesS?


why not?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:16 GMT
#1134
On November 15 2012 09:13 thrawn2112 wrote:
marv do you have any problems with boson that aren't meta related?


Generally speaking Z-Boson has not been involved with town at all, and while that directly contradicts his meta, it is scummy in its own right.

An almost identical reference to this is HiroPro in Rock Band, who I found scum for meta reasons, and one of those reasons was that he was not invested in the thread. And his DP stuff I don't like, and just the general wording of some of his stuff I don't like (this is all in my case if I read it).

And to preempt "I'm trying to change my style" defence. You can try to change your style to post more concisely, but the underlying player is still the same. Z-Boson would not suddenly become way more confident in his reads; however posts are presented it's not like he miraculously becomes 100% more certain on his reads as town.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:19 GMT
#1136
i find hopeless less scummy. i'm not talking about him atm.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:30 GMT
#1141
On November 15 2012 09:20 Hapahauli wrote:
@ BH

Why the hell do you still have your vote on me? It's shit and you know it.



Regarding Z-Boson

It's interesting, and I'm interested in hearing what Z-Bo has to say about it. That being said, I still find debears much more scummy.

1) Z-Boson is matching his Newbie XXV scum-meta. I'm reallllly hesitant about using meta from that long-ago. It was his first game, and he's changed as a player a lot since then. There is a resemblance, but nothing lynchable.

2) Z-Boson is not making enough "non-serious" remarks. Again, this isn't a deviation that I consider significant enough from his town meta to be lynchable.


3) Z-Boson is more decisive. This point I like quite a bit. However, I've had some conversations with Z-Bo after recent newbie game where he mentioned he wanted to make a stylistic change to his game. He talked to me a lot about wanting to post less and what not. I think it's consistent. I'll see if I can find the skype logs.



On August 26 2010 13:07 Ver wrote:
The strongest proof is actually in the summary: the abrupt change in demeanor (a great catch, changes in psychology aren't easy to spot but are really compelling) ]

[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:31 GMT
#1143
On November 15 2012 09:30 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 09:20 Hapahauli wrote:
@ BH

Why the hell do you still have your vote on me? It's shit and you know it.



Regarding Z-Boson

It's interesting, and I'm interested in hearing what Z-Bo has to say about it. That being said, I still find debears much more scummy.

1) Z-Boson is matching his Newbie XXV scum-meta. I'm reallllly hesitant about using meta from that long-ago. It was his first game, and he's changed as a player a lot since then. There is a resemblance, but nothing lynchable.

2) Z-Boson is not making enough "non-serious" remarks. Again, this isn't a deviation that I consider significant enough from his town meta to be lynchable.


3) Z-Boson is more decisive. This point I like quite a bit. However, I've had some conversations with Z-Bo after recent newbie game where he mentioned he wanted to make a stylistic change to his game. He talked to me a lot about wanting to post less and what not. I think it's consistent. I'll see if I can find the skype logs.



Show nested quote +
On August 26 2010 13:07 Ver wrote:
The strongest proof is actually in the summary: the abrupt change in demeanor (a great catch, changes in psychology aren't easy to spot but are really compelling) ]



EBWOP: this was Ver commenting on Rastaban's case where rastaban said:

"As I went through his posts this game, they lacked a lot of his characteristic humor that he used last game. This seems like a minor thing, but they all point to a change in his playing method. Why, I believe it is because he is mafia this time around."

[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:34 GMT
#1144
thrawn, stop fucking whining about why I don't want to lynch you, and do something useful for once.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:44 GMT
#1152
Z-Boson, how come you're so certain about things this game?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:46 GMT
#1154
BlazingHand is simply absent with his vote on Hapa about an hour before lynch.

Crossfire never came back.

I dislike both these things immensely.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:47 GMT
#1156
well, we're definitely not lynching Clarity today.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:51 GMT
#1164
I could consolidate on to Crossfire, I guess.

I don't think DP is scum. I don't think DP would make a case on Clarity if he's scum. There are enough outlying candidates for him to make a case on and vote on.

I think it's more likely DP is being bad. I often find DP's reads as town somewhat ridiculous.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 00:57 GMT
#1176
There's posting less, and then there's posting with way more, unwarranted, certainty and devoid of any humour.

The change is too great.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:00 GMT
#1182
DP said he'd come back before lynch
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:05 GMT
#1188
On November 15 2012 10:01 Clarity_nl wrote:
Marv I realize you're not at risk of getting lynched but it's not a difficult question to answer, why would you be willing to consolidate on cross?


basically to lynch a lurker
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:08 GMT
#1197
##unvote
##vote: crossfire99
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:10 GMT
#1206
why is he making that post instead of bothering to read the thread, where BH is clearly not a possibility?

It's just nonsense.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:11 GMT
#1209
On November 15 2012 10:10 Crossfire99 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 10:08 marvellosity wrote:
##unvote
##vote: crossfire99

What do you want me to do about my internet? I can't help it. That is what I was working on when my internet crapped out, so I'm posting it now.


1 post a day isn't enough.

Do not sign up for mafia games if that is all you can post.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:12 GMT
#1213
Clarity is such a hard taskmaster
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:13 GMT
#1219
fine. Z-bo is still scummy to me.

sorry for the shenannies everyone.

##unvote
##vote: z-boson
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:13 GMT
#1222
On November 15 2012 10:13 debears wrote:
Vote Hopeless guys.

Seriously HE ISN'T HERE AND HE HASN'T CONTRIBUTED ALL DAY

HE DOESN'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT TOWN


he said he was going home from work, dude
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:15 GMT
#1227
naw, Clarity is right, bad shenannies.

I made a big case I believe in and got pissed off and voted a fucktard.

silly silly.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:15 GMT
#1230
i think hopeless is town though
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:17 GMT
#1237
why don't we go back to the tried and true method of sheeping marv?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:22 GMT
#1248
oh, iamp <3
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:27 GMT
#1258
yeah, that whole case on Clarity was odd, not because it was on Clarity, because it's a weird time to make it.

I feel stronger about z-bo, tho.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:34 GMT
#1284
On November 15 2012 10:33 Clarity_nl wrote:
Marv you've been super quiet. Thoughts?

Where the hell is thrawn?


yeah i'm kinda in disarray atm. i felt quite strongly DP was town but making a random case like that is so fucking weird, i don't understand it.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:39 GMT
#1303
they said that about my cases on Palmar and Hiro too
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:39 GMT
#1307
he's back you buffoon
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:45 GMT
#1320
yeah this is gonna be a mislynch
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 01:59 GMT
#1421
On November 15 2012 08:30 Blazinghand wrote:
I mean, I personally don't think ZB is scum right now. Earlier I did for the way he was trying to set up town cred with his voting pattern, but iamp correctly noted that ZB straightened up after his initial OMGUS on me. This could be due to scum thread coaching, I'll admit, but the aggression he displayed, however wrong-headed, is town to me.



On November 15 2012 10:46 Blazinghand wrote:
._. curse you DP for casting doubt into my heart. I'll just shoot you tonight with all my vigi bullets then

##unvote
##vote ZB



On November 15 2012 10:48 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 10:47 iamperfection wrote:
On November 15 2012 10:47 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 15 2012 10:46 iamperfection wrote:
On November 15 2012 10:46 Blazinghand wrote:
._. curse you DP for casting doubt into my heart. I'll just shoot you tonight with all my vigi bullets then

##unvote
##vote ZB

...........................................wat


it'll all make sense after the flip!

no explain fucking now


ZB... will flip scum.


cool story bro
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 02:00 GMT
#1428
On November 15 2012 11:00 Blazinghand wrote:
Please, marv, that was so 12 minutes ago


you will have to answer for it tomorrow.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 11:05 GMT
#1543
On November 15 2012 11:30 Clarity_nl wrote:
Marv where are you. Even if you are flabbergasted please at least comment.


Given this has come up a couple of times, I'll address it. It's awfully dull, though.

So, before the game I said 2am deadlines were a bit dodgy for me, sometimes I'd be able to make it, sometimes I wouldn't. That's because my other half stays at my place on Wednesdays, Fridays, and Saturdays.

On days that aren't these days, deadline is fine and I'm often up till 3am or whatever. On days that ARE these days, we usually go to bed at 1am or so. So I was already pushing my luck being up towards the lynch.

So anyway, 15 mins before the lynch I finally had to start getting ready for bed to appease the other side of the bed, and I went for my smoke/brush my teeth/bathroom etc, where I was musing on BH calling Z-Boson town and then scum, which I dug up and went to bed shortly after, having just about had the time to digest the 5 new pages while I was away.

Amazing last minute shenannies in the end, I didn't think town would want to lynch Hapa Day 1, but having done so I expected him to flip scum. So much to re-read and plenty of people who should come out looking good from this, which is nice ^^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 11:07 GMT
#1544
On November 15 2012 11:39 Blazinghand wrote:
Of course, my mitigating circumstances are infinitely better because I wasn't even on the lynch block, Hapa never pushed me, I am a claimed blue, and I've generally been good.


no, you have been the absolute worst player in the game. By a stretch.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 11:12 GMT
#1545
and I've just got to the part where you fakeclaimed. Jesus christ. Make that stretch infinitely longer.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 11:15 GMT
#1546
my feeling is that debears should be town now given how shittily Hapa was pushing him.

If it were a bus the reasoning would have been better, but so much of the reasoning was completely atrocious. Just awful.

Pending re-read, possibly Z-Bo town too.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 11:26 GMT
#1548
I'm not so sure. He shouldn't have preached at me though, like I'm not allowed to get reads wrong? Dunno. He's up in the air until that like 10 pages around lynch time get re-read laters.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 12:49 GMT
#1551
On November 15 2012 21:47 Clarity_nl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 10:52 Blazinghand wrote:
I still don't like Hapa at all. He seems way too straight-laced for his normal town play. Anyone want to lynch him?

Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 10:53 Blazinghand wrote:
I'm like not really serious about lynching hapa, btw, we shouldn't be switching this close to the deadline

Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 10:53 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 15 2012 10:53 debears wrote:
Save Hapa for d2 BH


yeah basically this

Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 10:55 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 15 2012 10:54 iamperfection wrote:
On November 15 2012 10:53 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 15 2012 10:53 debears wrote:
Save Hapa for d2 BH


yeah basically this

well i actually wouldnt mind doing it now this is not town hapa. going herp derp scumslip scumslip


##FoS: Hapa


Let's get a count of who's in. FOS him if you are willing to vote him.

Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 10:56 Blazinghand wrote:
You know what, fuck it, let's vote him. I'll go back to ZB if need be.

##unvote

##vote: Hapa


I just don't get this series of events. I agree that the "scumslip" thing was suspicious but we were waaaayy too close to deadline.


This is, as well, on top of BH calling Z-Bo town, then voting him and calling him scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 12:57 GMT
#1553
because he's scum or actually JK trying to avoid being hit or roleblocked or something. Still doesn't make much sense, though.

Obviously somewhere between the posts he came to the decision to recant on his JK claim.

In the first quote he still had the intent of keeping up the 'charade'.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 13:09 GMT
#1555
Clarity, stick around for a few minutes, i'm digging something up
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 13:17 GMT
#1557
Below spoilered are BH's crumb and his claim. If we're to assume he's telling the truth, then, as Vanilla Townie, he breadcrumbed Jailkeeper Tuesday night so that he could fakeclaim Jailkeeper Wednesday afternoon. My mind absolutely boggles.

+ Show Spoiler +
On November 13 2012 15:38 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 13 2012 11:52 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:47 Kickstart wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:44 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:42 marvellosity wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:40 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 13 2012 11:37 iamperfection wrote:
Whats everybody think of bh he is like a very good player when he is town from what i saw and here he really hasent done anything despite being here tell me what you guys think.


Give him a chance. He is one of those guys I would 100% never lynch day one because the benefits of him being town vastly out weigh the risks of him being scum.

From what I have heard around the grapevine however he is fairly easy to read as scum so we should be fine to take a look at him later on in the game.


you kidding? I'd lynch him day 1 in a heartbeat if I thought he was scum.


Well. That is fine. But I am not going to lynch him day one when he is a very good town player and the only case against him so far is that he is lurking.


The night (or day in terms of our game i guess!) is young, I wouldn't call anyone a lurker just yet. But I agree with marv that people who give off scum vibes should get the vote and find it odd that you are basically stating that you wouldn't vote for him no matter what ;o.


Yep. I would not. I would not vote day one for Hapa or marv either. Unless there was something super obvious I would not vote for them. But I do not think that would happen because they are all good players and that is why I respect them I suppose.



Honestly I think it's bad to tie yourself down with ideas like that. If someone's playing scummy, they're playing scummy. My scum play isn't amazing, but due to my extreme sex appeal and enormous intelligence and penis, I can assure you that it's improved a great deal. Mostly it's due to my large penis-- it is quite a monstrosity. It works as a pad, even.

Back on topic, don't feel like you can't vote or push people because of possible contributions. This kind of play is lazy and puts preconceived notions of what certain players are worth ahead of behavioral analysis. Someone voting for me because they legitimately think I'm scum and they have the cojones to do it is infinitely more helpful to town than someone not voting me because I'm a sexy baller.

That being said, iamperfection's vote is pretty typical iamperfection throwing his vote around trying to pressure people but not doing it effectively. He needs to realize that you should vote people when you want to lynch them, or else you won't be taken seriously.


On November 14 2012 07:44 Blazinghand wrote:
Well, I was hoping it wouldn't come to this, but if wishes were wings, etc.

Man, there's few things I hate like arguing about my own meta, but several people have talked about it, at least in passing, so I'm dispelling the meta myth right now. I would have liked someone else to do it, but you all are too lazy to actually back up your meta statements so I have to do it myself. It'd be really nice if one of you could verify it for yourself because a dude talking about his own meta doesn't usually go well.

Here are my scum games. There might be one or two I'm missing, but these are the ones I remember:

Cop Idiot Mafia: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=328827&user=133498
Bureaucracy Mafia: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=349678&user=133498
Resistance II: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=311315&user=133498
Emergency Mini Mafia (3rd party): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=311315&user=133498

If you take a look at all these games, even Emergency Mini Mafia, what people are attributing to my "bad scum meta" this game are not present at all. As scum I try to play like town-- posting big cases and interacting with people a lot. Where I fail is that as scum, I'm typically overly diplomatic and temperamentally less aggressive. This game is nothing like any of my scum games.

Now let's look at the one time I've been mislynched, in Storm Mafia:
Storm Mafia: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=313426&user=133498

Yeah it's rather old but the point is I don't always play perfectly. Sometimes, yes, I'm making smaller posts and my cases aren't perfect. I've been mislynched for playing to my "scum meta" when in fact I just sometimes play differently as town. I'm not making the same mistake I made in Storm Mafia-- not defending myself zealously and claiming at the appropriate time.

I'm the Jailkeeper. My crumb is in the post where I talk about my large penis and how it could work as a "pad" (link)-- for pad-lock, lock, locked up, jail, jailkeeper. Admittedly, role crumbs aren't much supporting evidence, but lynching a claimed blue D1 is amazingly bad play. It's possible there's no scum roleblocker which means my power can still be of use to us.

You all have plenty of time to unvote me and vote Z-B before the day ends.


Oh, and by the way, this is BH on VTs fakeclaiming:

On June 17 2012 15:52 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 17 2012 14:01 wherebugsgo wrote:
So when I was coaching I actually talked to Lazer specifically regarding the claims and the possibilities. It was the most straightforward for a DT in that situation.

I don't at all agree with grush's play in this game, and from a results-oriented perspective it looks good. However, it is INCREDIBLY dangerous in any normal game for a VT to claim DT. Imagine grush fake claimed and he was wrong about his target. That's an instant town loss. Imagine the mafia don't counterclaim and the real DT does; the DT is outted and the mafia can kill both players with ease (one with lynch and the other with a shot) If the DT is lynched, the fakeclaimer almost certainly gets lynched the next day.

With that said, grush got incredibly lucky. Scum panicked a bit (if I were in scum's position I would've simply denied the claim and tried to get grush lynched. I only really consider claiming at lylo). Blues get lynched all the time without counterclaims, and fake blues are even easier to lynch because their claims are flimsy. Someone who pushed and pressured grush to explain his claim could probably have ended up exposing him and getting an easy lynch. This takes confidence, though, and is much easier said than done.



I'd like to second what WBG mentioned here about VT fakeclaims. Typically gambitting with a fakeclaim, especially in a semi-open mini like this, is a great way to get mislynched. The fact that scum freaked out and counterclaimed doesn't mean the gambit was good, it just meaned it worked.

If, for example, the real Cop counterclaimed (since a 1-1 trade isn't so bad if they both get lynched, he thinks), it's entirely possible town could have killed the Cop, THEN KILLED THE VT. Could you imagine trying to say "oh, no, it was a fakeclaim you guys" after the Cop claimed, or after he got lynched for his counterclaim and flipped cop? Nobody would buy it. Scum would say "nice try, scum", and so would town.

I guess the best analogy here is that Grush walked into a casino, went up to a roulette table, put it all on 0, and won 20 grand. Yeah, he won 20 grand. It doesn't mean the strat was good, though. All it means is he got lucky.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 13:21 GMT
#1559
Basically BH is either JK or scum, as I see it.

He needs to answer for his voting on Z-Bo and Hapa, though. Especially, for me, how we went from Z-Bo looking town to voting him and calling him scum shortly thereafter.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 13:22 GMT
#1560
On November 15 2012 22:20 Clarity_nl wrote:
Can you find a scum angle on backing out of your claim during N1? It's major WIFOM at best. Which actually makes me think it would be a good move for scum, since trying to keep your story straight as scum JK is hard.

We have quite a bit of time, I'll mull it over.


I can think of angles both ways. He's townie trying to stupidly protect the role he stupidly outed.

Or he's scum who wants to be able to use his roleblock to actually roleblock people.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 13:26 GMT
#1563
On November 15 2012 22:25 Clarity_nl wrote:
Keep in mind he keeps insisting he is playing well.


yes, I know, and I want to hit him in the face for it.

But I kinda believe townie BH is capable of self delusion like that :/
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 13:47 GMT
#1570
no, he's not Serial Killer.

He's JK or scum. Pretty sure of this.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 13:49 GMT
#1571
On November 15 2012 11:24 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 11:22 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 15 2012 11:18 iamperfection wrote:
On November 15 2012 11:17 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 15 2012 11:13 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 15 2012 11:00 marvellosity wrote:
On November 15 2012 11:00 Blazinghand wrote:
Please, marv, that was so 12 minutes ago


you will have to answer for it tomorrow.


I *saved* Z-B from the lynch. I have nothing to answer for but my own excellent D1 scumhunting and overall good play.


Trying to get as much town cred as possible from your bus hey.


you actually tthink that was a bus come on dude it happened in like 2 min and me and bh started and pushed for it give me a break



So it was very unlikely to succeed and then if either of them flipped they would have been at a comfortable distace. But It worked. And they had to do something because the way which they bandwagoned me was super fucking suspicious and would have damned them both when I flipped town


I'm tired of listening to the garbage you call logic. You're dead tomorrow.

http://tinyurl.com/66wbb8t <3


Why did BH say this??
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 13:53 GMT
#1572
fuck me, I just read that link in that post and it might be the cutest thing I ever saw.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 14:17 GMT
#1574
Would it be along the lines of "never listen to IRL excuses?"
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 14:22 GMT
#1576
go on, tell us what he told you
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 14:26 GMT
#1578
I just wanted the gist of it, not an exact transcript, dear.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 14:39 GMT
#1582
you're just lazy to type
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 14:42 GMT
#1588
naw, your quiz is boring, bro.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 14:42 GMT
#1590
On November 15 2012 23:41 debears wrote:
oh btw, Iooked thru Hapa's filter for scum games. The only one I found was RB I believe and all Hapa did was troll that game after replacing in :/


He replaced in to Liquid City as scum, and got caught by a night mechanic.

His first (2nd?) game as a newbie he was scum also. Like, Newbie 21 or something around there.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 14:43 GMT
#1591
On November 15 2012 23:42 debears wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 15 2012 23:42 marvellosity wrote:
naw, your quiz is boring, bro.


What if I come up with a better one?


sure i'm game, i love quizzes. gotta be good ones though.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 14:56 GMT
#1599
Gotta be very careful drawing associations with Hapa. He may not have played excellently this game, but he is a very clever player, and so associations are tricksy.

On the surface it makes Hopeless look worse. Not even because he was pushing debears so hard, though. I kinda expect that anyway.

But because he didn't really address the wagon on Hopeless very much. Hapa was always like

"yeah well, Hopeless lurks as both alignments yo" and never said much more about it. This is what I find potentially dodgy. I think/thought (not sure atm) Hopeless is townie, but I'm not so sure atm.

Hopeless - what are your scum games other than Acme?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 15:21 GMT
#1602
On November 16 2012 00:20 Clarity_nl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 00:19 debears wrote:
And was Hapa ever at threat for lynch before the swing? No way in hell. He wouldn't have to cover his tracks that early


Pretty sure he's not that naive.


Correct. Liquid City is a perfect comparison here - I was playing a pretty nice game as scum, and then totally unexpectedly I was outed night 1 by a blue mechanic.

I went down, and then town fucked themselves in the asses for days looking at connections I had with people.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 15:22 GMT
#1604
see above
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 15:38 GMT
#1608
oh yeah, I remember that. Ho hum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 15:38 GMT
#1609
Do you have any thoughts on players/events now, Hopeless?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 15:47 GMT
#1611
how about debears?

who do you think comes out of this looking bad/worse? (anyone other than BH)
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 15:54 GMT
#1613
yeah, I know you look bad, sweetie, but anyone else?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 16:33 GMT
#1626
I think Crossfire has a decent chance of flipping scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 16:40 GMT
#1629
I do, it demonstrates that he basically hadn't been reading the thread, and that was going to be his predetermined contribution to the thread.

He popped his vote on Z-Bo 25 minutes before the deadline, and then as the night post came up, popped up to say "good job town".

There was no emotional investment in the lynch at all, nor do I see any signs of him being invested in the game. I just looked at his filter from Whose Line and he seemed waaaaaaay more invested in the game. Real life internet excuses or no.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 17:30 GMT
#1635
debears, you're so cute
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 17:51 GMT
#1639
Hey Bo-man.

Really unsure on Hopeless atm. My note against him says

"Could be either. ick. useless lurky. feels town. now not so sure. torn."

I've also uncoloured you orange for now.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 18:07 GMT
#1643
On November 16 2012 03:06 debears wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 02:51 marvellosity wrote:
Hey Bo-man.

Really unsure on Hopeless atm. My note against him says

"Could be either. ick. useless lurky. feels town. now not so sure. torn."

I've also uncoloured you orange for now.


Do you use a coloring book for your reads?


I use the google spreadsheet colour-in-cell function

i'm sure that's the technical name.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 18:11 GMT
#1645
I would use my excellent memory.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 19:10 GMT
#1653
Z-Bo, you're adorable if you haven't read me as clearly town by now.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 19:19 GMT
#1655
why? I agree with him, I think Crossfire is an excellent lynch for tomorrow.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:07 GMT
#1666
On November 16 2012 05:33 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 05:23 Clarity_nl wrote:
Hopeless do you plan on posting a detailed read on me while giving me time to respond tonight? I'll be around before the NK.

Yes, I plan to have it in the hour before deadline.


why so late? now is better than later.

some of us would like to have more time to talk about it than half an hour or something.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:12 GMT
#1667
Hey Vigilante!

If you exist, put a bullet in BH's head please.

He's either scum or a liability, and we're better off with him dead.

Ta.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:18 GMT
#1672
On November 16 2012 06:14 Clarity_nl wrote:
You don't think cross would be a better vig target?


No, I think Crossfire is a good lynch target.

BH just needs to die.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:19 GMT
#1674
On November 16 2012 06:19 debears wrote:
We can get a read on bh as time goes by.

How can we get a solid read off people who barely contribute?


yes.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:19 GMT
#1675
oh, i thought you said 'can we'
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:20 GMT
#1676
BH is basically trolling town a lot for whatever reason.

His nonsense claim.

He calls Z-Bo town then votes him and calls him scum.

He said DP is town, but also says "you can die tomorrow, fuck your bad logic"

It's all just ridiculous and town is better off without him, right now.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:22 GMT
#1679
On November 16 2012 06:21 Clarity_nl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 06:19 debears wrote:
We can get a read on bh as time goes by.

How can we get a solid read off people who barely contribute?


I agree with this.


you can agree, but you're wrong.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:23 GMT
#1682
s&b is not way trollier, get a grip.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:25 GMT
#1687
It is quite possible to get a read on all the people who haven't posted much.

You don't have to post a lot to look at whether they're genuine, sincere, honest, contrived, fake.

You also don't have to post a lot to look at whether it looks like they're pushing an agenda or not.

BH on the other hand is just all over the place. JK claim recanted, voting for people he called town, having a really long, pointless, 13 page filter. If you want to lynch BH you'll be sitting there guessing yourself because his whole play is just total and utter nonsense.

BH should be shot by a vigi tonight, and then we/town can work on getting a read on everyone else.

It's very simple.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:25 GMT
#1688
BH is giving us jack shit information, Clarity.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:27 GMT
#1692
On November 16 2012 06:27 debears wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 06:25 marvellosity wrote:
BH is giving us jack shit information, Clarity.



We pretty much know he's either jk or scum. That's a big chunk of info


funnily enough, I was musing that he could be SK after all.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:28 GMT
#1694
and no, being town or scum is not a huge chunk of info.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:29 GMT
#1698
On November 16 2012 06:28 debears wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 06:27 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 06:27 debears wrote:
On November 16 2012 06:25 marvellosity wrote:
BH is giving us jack shit information, Clarity.



We pretty much know he's either jk or scum. That's a big chunk of info


funnily enough, I was musing that he could be SK after all.


Isn't sk helpful to us until scum is gone?


not necessarily, because if we're lynching scum, SK is shooting at town.

It is in SK's interest to balance the game out according to lynches. Atm town has advantage, SK is shooting at town.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:30 GMT
#1700
On November 16 2012 06:30 Clarity_nl wrote:
How does an SK expect to win when he claims JK day 1? Even if scum decide to just roleblock him a ton, eventually SK will need to kill someone and scum will figure it out.


because he recanted on his claim

that's what made me think it's possible he is SK
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:35 GMT
#1704
On November 16 2012 06:31 Clarity_nl wrote:
That is the most roundabout way of going about things if you're SK. Your vigi shot suggestion makes sense, wouldn't an SK BH consider this as well? If you fuck with everyones heads, someone is gonna want you dead before the end.


BH claimed vigilante last time he was SK and got lynched day 2 for making such a retarded play. Expecting optimal play is a mistake.

The possible motive as SK is easy enough - you make yourself a terrible target for a scum shot.

If I do say so myself, in this game I am the highest priority target, and behind me there's a couple of players, one of which is BlazingHand. Making himself useless avoids being shot by scum. He may hope he can avoid the lynch long enough as well to manage to pull off the win somehow.

I don't know. There might not be an SK, he probably isn't even SK

He could be scum, he could be anything, we don't know because his play is retarded.

That's why a vigi should be shooting at him.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:36 GMT
#1706
also note for all BH's filter he hasn't been here at all today.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:37 GMT
#1709
On November 16 2012 06:36 debears wrote:
And if bh is sk its a wasted shot if he's nk immune


not necessarily.

because if he's jailkeeper, scum would be roleblocking him to try to prevent him saving their scumshot. And scum would only know he's not-scum.

And if he doesn't die, then town knows 100% that he is SK. That would be extremely valuable.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:43 GMT
#1713
On November 16 2012 06:37 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 06:36 debears wrote:
And if bh is sk its a wasted shot if he's nk immune


not necessarily.

because if he's jailkeeper, scum would be roleblocking him to try to prevent him saving their scumshot. And scum would only know he's not-scum.

And if he doesn't die, then town knows 100% that he is SK. That would be extremely valuable.


EBWOP: to clarify a little, roleblocking removes one-shot immunity.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:44 GMT
#1714
On November 16 2012 06:43 Kickstart wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 06:36 Clarity_nl wrote:
On November 16 2012 06:34 Kickstart wrote:
And this shit about me lurking is getting annoying, I have posts all throughout the thread, I have given my views on people and been completely genuine. Just because I'm not spamming up the thread with useless one-liner shit posts like half the people here doesn't mean I'm lurking.


You get all the information from posts that other people have enticed. If everyone was playing like you no one would be making cases because there would be no information.

Ok fair enough - I haven't helped pull any information. But I have given thoughts on several people (hapa, bh, hopeless, my thoughts on ZB) without just quoting what someone else has said. I really don't want to use the fact that this is my first game as an excuse for myself, but it is true and is why I'm posting the way I am. But in my defense, at least I am trying to contribute - there are plenty of people who may be posting tons but aren't contributing anything or even trying to.


who would you say those people are, dear?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:47 GMT
#1719
On November 16 2012 06:46 Dandel Ion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 06:43 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 06:37 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 06:36 debears wrote:
And if bh is sk its a wasted shot if he's nk immune


not necessarily.

because if he's jailkeeper, scum would be roleblocking him to try to prevent him saving their scumshot. And scum would only know he's not-scum.

And if he doesn't die, then town knows 100% that he is SK. That would be extremely valuable.


EBWOP: to clarify a little, roleblocking removes one-shot immunity.

No, in this game it doesn't.


Are there any other rules that are non-standard that I should know about?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:50 GMT
#1723
who gives a fuck if he's fucking jailkeeper?

if he's jailkeeper he'll not be able to pull off his saves because he'll be roleblocked.

Don't shoot a lurker, because, maybe you're not good enough to, but others are good enough to get reads on them.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 21:54 GMT
#1728
On November 16 2012 06:52 strongandbig wrote:
maaaarv say something about hopeless's list post so i can move on to something else


what do you want to know? I don't think anything of it in particular. I can see either alignment posting it.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:23 GMT
#1733
On November 16 2012 07:02 debears wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 06:50 marvellosity wrote:
who gives a fuck if he's fucking jailkeeper?

if he's jailkeeper he'll not be able to pull off his saves because he'll be roleblocked.

Don't shoot a lurker, because, maybe you're not good enough to, but others are good enough to get reads on them.


Cool marv. Flaming cuz I disagree with you. That's real pro town there

You're making a huge deal out of this. Just lynch him if u feel he's that detrimental. Don't make a vig waste a shot (cuz 2/3 things he could be are wasted shots)


I'm making a big deal out of this because I'm telling the vigi what's optimal, and you're saying it's not.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:23 GMT
#1735
On November 16 2012 07:22 iamperfection wrote:
marv you dont think bh is just playing wifom mind games with the mafia in being a jk?


BH could be doing fucking anything.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:26 GMT
#1738
Kickstart has 30+ posts and we are still in the first cycle.

That is not lurking.

Just because he's not activity fiends like the rest of us doesn't make him a lurker. 30+ posts in a cycle is quite adequate actually.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:31 GMT
#1741
His content seems reasonable. I think he's probably town.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:35 GMT
#1743
On November 16 2012 07:31 marvellosity wrote:
His content seems reasonable. I think he's probably town.


Also, although he's not a mass poster, he seems actively interested in the game. He was around for the lynch, kinda panicking like the rest of town were, and he was one of the ones who voted hapa (of course one might say, given his earlier posts). Given it's his first game and he's often absent, he could easily have just not voted for hapa and pretended to be gone or whatever.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:36 GMT
#1744
On November 16 2012 07:34 debears wrote:
Ok noted.

Now what about thrawn, dp, crossfire?


I'll flesh out more opinions in the resolution time
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:37 GMT
#1746
yeah, kickstart is coloured in my townie colour atm ;p
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:53 GMT
#1754
it is, iamp. that's the point of the period :p
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:56 GMT
#1757
yes dear
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 22:58 GMT
#1760
pretty terrible reason.

you said you had a scumread on clairty so you're not giving anyone new information, and 100% you're not being shot, so it's just weird.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 23:25 GMT
#1771
what does the case do for your read on hopeless, clar?

Not sure what i make of the case itself, whether it's genuine or not. Some of it is silly like mixing names up. Why does that have to be scummy?

The quote where it says "my scumreads aren't important"

Clarity in that quote was saying that he would address DarthPunk's case ON Clarity, as Clarity wasn't getting lynched day 1, which isn't the same thing at all.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 23:28 GMT
#1774
On November 15 2012 11:14 Clarity_nl wrote:
Is it bad of me that I still feel that was fucking dumb as shit?


this is the only thing that gives me pause about Clarity really. Maybe it's just a different type of personality but if you're lynching scum day 1, i don't give a shit how it went down, i'm just really happy it happened.

like... it all kinda was a bit dumb as shit, but i'd expect it to be said in a more joking manner.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 15 2012 23:29 GMT
#1775
basically it seems to be weird to be complaining when scum just got lynched day 1.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:07 GMT
#1812
On November 16 2012 10:06 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:05 Clarity_nl wrote:
If marv is scum he is playing amazing. He's so pro-town, and every time I get this nagging feeling about him I look at his filter and think "nah, there's no way"


Marv is an amazing scum player in general-- he's never lost as scum and he plays a pro-town game as either. I wouldn't lynch him D2 though just because he seems "too pro-town". DT would do well to check him.


I lost as scum in the last game you hosted dear.

Checking me is a fucking ridiculous use of a check.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:09 GMT
#1815
On November 16 2012 09:48 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 09:46 iamperfection wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:44 Blazinghand wrote:
Hopeless' case is utterly unreasonable

marv wants the vig to shoot you. are you aware?


Not a good use of a vigi shot given that we have lurkers. Marv is smart enough to know this, but he's (pretending to be?) mad at me so he wants to shoot me anyways.


we don't have lurkers, really. we have Crossfire who is lynchable, not simply for lurking. And thrawn. and that's it.

Explain why you called Z-Boson town, then voted him and called him scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:10 GMT
#1820
oh my god BH is a complete idiot if he saved DP.

fucking god save me.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:10 GMT
#1822
On November 16 2012 10:10 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:09 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:48 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:46 iamperfection wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:44 Blazinghand wrote:
Hopeless' case is utterly unreasonable

marv wants the vig to shoot you. are you aware?


Not a good use of a vigi shot given that we have lurkers. Marv is smart enough to know this, but he's (pretending to be?) mad at me so he wants to shoot me anyways.


we don't have lurkers, really. we have Crossfire who is lynchable, not simply for lurking. And thrawn. and that's it.

Explain why you called Z-Boson town, then voted him and called him scum.


Cause I changed my mind on DP


no, that's nothing to do with your read on Z-Boson.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:11 GMT
#1824
you're not super town, you're the biggest liability this town has.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:12 GMT
#1826
On November 16 2012 10:10 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:10 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:09 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:48 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:46 iamperfection wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:44 Blazinghand wrote:
Hopeless' case is utterly unreasonable

marv wants the vig to shoot you. are you aware?


Not a good use of a vigi shot given that we have lurkers. Marv is smart enough to know this, but he's (pretending to be?) mad at me so he wants to shoot me anyways.


we don't have lurkers, really. we have Crossfire who is lynchable, not simply for lurking. And thrawn. and that's it.

Explain why you called Z-Boson town, then voted him and called him scum.


Cause I changed my mind on DP


no, that's nothing to do with your read on Z-Boson.


answer this.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:12 GMT
#1830
BH is seriously the worst player in this game by a stretch. It's quite embarrassing.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:13 GMT
#1833
no-one was lynching you because of your claim, idiot.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:14 GMT
#1835
On November 16 2012 10:12 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:12 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:10 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:10 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:09 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:48 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:46 iamperfection wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:44 Blazinghand wrote:
Hopeless' case is utterly unreasonable

marv wants the vig to shoot you. are you aware?


Not a good use of a vigi shot given that we have lurkers. Marv is smart enough to know this, but he's (pretending to be?) mad at me so he wants to shoot me anyways.


we don't have lurkers, really. we have Crossfire who is lynchable, not simply for lurking. And thrawn. and that's it.

Explain why you called Z-Boson town, then voted him and called him scum.


Cause I changed my mind on DP


no, that's nothing to do with your read on Z-Boson.


answer this.


There were only two wagons at the time dude, both of those guys were less scummy than hapa but it wasn't happening so I unvoted hapa


There's a difference between "there are two wagons" and "this guys is town. no wait, he's scum"

that's bs.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:15 GMT
#1838
On November 16 2012 10:12 iamperfection wrote:
anybody want to comment on my will back there?


sorry buddy, i'll get to it. i agree with much but not all of what you say.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:15 GMT
#1839
On November 16 2012 10:15 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:14 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:12 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:12 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:10 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:10 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:09 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:48 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:46 iamperfection wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:44 Blazinghand wrote:
Hopeless' case is utterly unreasonable

marv wants the vig to shoot you. are you aware?


Not a good use of a vigi shot given that we have lurkers. Marv is smart enough to know this, but he's (pretending to be?) mad at me so he wants to shoot me anyways.


we don't have lurkers, really. we have Crossfire who is lynchable, not simply for lurking. And thrawn. and that's it.

Explain why you called Z-Boson town, then voted him and called him scum.


Cause I changed my mind on DP


no, that's nothing to do with your read on Z-Boson.


answer this.


There were only two wagons at the time dude, both of those guys were less scummy than hapa but it wasn't happening so I unvoted hapa


There's a difference between "there are two wagons" and "this guys is town. no wait, he's scum"

that's bs.


Well, I sure aint gonna call the guy I'm voting town am I


you already had and gave NO REASON WHY HE WAS NOW SUDDENLY SCUM
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:16 GMT
#1843
sure there is. plenty of reasonable ways.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:16 GMT
#1845
On November 16 2012 10:16 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:15 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:15 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:14 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:12 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:12 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:10 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:10 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:09 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 09:48 Blazinghand wrote:
[quote]

Not a good use of a vigi shot given that we have lurkers. Marv is smart enough to know this, but he's (pretending to be?) mad at me so he wants to shoot me anyways.


we don't have lurkers, really. we have Crossfire who is lynchable, not simply for lurking. And thrawn. and that's it.

Explain why you called Z-Boson town, then voted him and called him scum.


Cause I changed my mind on DP


no, that's nothing to do with your read on Z-Boson.


answer this.


There were only two wagons at the time dude, both of those guys were less scummy than hapa but it wasn't happening so I unvoted hapa


There's a difference between "there are two wagons" and "this guys is town. no wait, he's scum"

that's bs.


Well, I sure aint gonna call the guy I'm voting town am I


you already had and gave NO REASON WHY HE WAS NOW SUDDENLY SCUM


right, but not when I'm voting him derp


so you were voting someone you thought was town and called him scum to what, keep up appearances?

what the fuck?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:17 GMT
#1848
On November 16 2012 10:16 Blazinghand wrote:
reasonable ways that involve claiming jk D1 then lynching hapa at the last minute by 1 vote?


yes, you could have fakeclaimed.

I led a wagon on scum Day 1 in Liquid City and I was scum

You can be scum.

I desperately want you to be scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:18 GMT
#1852
On November 16 2012 10:18 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:16 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:16 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:15 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:15 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:14 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:12 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:12 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:10 marvellosity wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:10 Blazinghand wrote:
[quote]

Cause I changed my mind on DP


no, that's nothing to do with your read on Z-Boson.


answer this.


There were only two wagons at the time dude, both of those guys were less scummy than hapa but it wasn't happening so I unvoted hapa


There's a difference between "there are two wagons" and "this guys is town. no wait, he's scum"

that's bs.


Well, I sure aint gonna call the guy I'm voting town am I


you already had and gave NO REASON WHY HE WAS NOW SUDDENLY SCUM


right, but not when I'm voting him derp


so you were voting someone you thought was town and called him scum to what, keep up appearances?

what the fuck?


What, no. I thought ZB was a better lynch than DP given DP's reactions so I voted him and called him scum

are you just willfully misinterpreting me here?



this is you


I'm not misrepresenting shit.

I went back and looked at your filter when I was asking you about Z-Boson. YOU SAID YOU THOUGHT HE WAS TOWN.

Then you didn't want to lynch DP and suddenly Z-Bo becomes scum?

HOW DOES THAT MAKE ANY SENSE
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:20 GMT
#1854
I'm going to fucking die tonight and it will be all your fucking fault.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:21 GMT
#1858
On November 16 2012 10:20 Blazinghand wrote:
IT makes perfect sense you just refuse to understand for some reason. look

0) want to lynch hapa, DP and ZB are not great lynches, but have to unvote hapa cause it's not hapaning. (huk huk huk)
1) want to lynch DP, vote him, think ZB is towner
2) DP becomes towner
3) vote for ZB and call him scum

I don't get where you don't understand


one player being townier than another doesn't make the other one scum...

HOW DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND THIS
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:22 GMT
#1861
if you think player A is town. and you are voting for player B. and then you think player B is town.

Player A did not magically become scum in that scenario.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:23 GMT
#1863
If you're town, most of all I'm mad at myself for evaluating you totally incorrectly as a player.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:25 GMT
#1867
because when I'm town, which I am excruciatingly so this game, scumteams shoot me.

In case, ya know, i catch everyone when i'm left alive for a couple of days. as has happened reasonably regularly my last few town games.

and you said you saved DP, not ZB.

jesus christ.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:26 GMT
#1872
anyway i'm gonna have a smoke and tell everyone my reads. back shortly.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:32 GMT
#1879
On November 16 2012 10:29 Blazinghand wrote:
Well, even off hand, all of you could be blues, and DP is not a blue. Also i have a strong town-read on DP, even if he's less useful to town than all of you.


you protect your biggest assets as JK, it's really easy.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:32 GMT
#1882
I am clearly town and a bigger asset (sorry DP)
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:44 GMT
#1892
My reads:

iamperfection - totes town. he just is. not saying any more, he's town.

darthpunk - town, didn't think he was scum all day and then came out really good around lynch time.

clarity - town, for some reason i don't feel as strongly about this as i did, but still feel it pretty strongly. way more involved n shit than when he played scum.

debears - town. would have been null but i find it impossible to believe the way day 1 went down that he's scum. gotta be town.

Kickstart - I think he's town. I said why earlier in the night phase. I quite like his posting, and he was really involved and invested around lynch time, and he voted hapa. should be town.

Now there's a more greyish area:

strongandbig - meta suggests that he's town. but... at the end of the last game i told him specifically what made him look like scum, and I think he's a good enough player to be able to change it up. I'd be more solidly town on him except he's been more useless than i expected. and usually s&b is useful as town. So I dunno. If I was nudged I'd say town, but i'm not uber convinced.

Z-Boson - argggg. his meta is SO FAR OFF, even with his explanation. he DOES buy points though in that he basically preempted my case. Plus, he claimed miller. Now that's not a definite tell in itself, but he did it before everyone had posted and it's really risky, because if a real miller existed, then statistically it's enormously unlikely there are two millers. It just seems unnecessary. If pushed, again I would say town.

thrawn - it's getting trickier here. so fucking lurky. There are a couple of things I consider here. Look at Acme that just finished. Like, everyone is ssaying "i expect more from thrawn as town". But thrawn definitely looked in that game like he'd lost a lot of his va-va-voom. he looked really flat. just like he's playing in this game. In addition to this, his case on DP read as genuine. I know that he totally believes in the meta read that he set forth in his case, which made it sincere. He was using a sincere townie meta argument in his argument on DP, which I liked. I think for whatever reason thrawn is bored or unmotivated, but I think he's town.

Hopeless - i'm all-a flipfloppy on hopeless. I don't like at all how Hapa basically brushed off talking about Hopeless, even though he was quite clearly a major contender for a large portion of the 2nd half of the day. "he lurks as either alignment" is all hapa had to say about it. really weak, tellingly weak even. On the other hand, at some points I've kinda gotten a townie feel from his play. But it isn't a strong gut feeling at all. in other parts he's been fairly non-contributory. If I had to choose, I'd say scum.

Crossfire - lurky AND scummy. Clarity - it's a big mistake too many players make going "oh, he's a lurker, it's so coinflippy". That's a weak viewpoint to take. I talked earlier in the phase why I thought he was scum. He's lurking which is bad in itself, but also he's totally uninvested in the game. I haven't seen a single post of his that shows he gives a shit. I looked at his play in Whose Line where he was town, and he gave many shits. He was involved, he posted quite a lot, he was down with what town was doing, he was mucking in. Even if he is having internet issues or whatever, his posts while he are here do not show any of that mentality. absolutely the strongest lynch in my opinion.

BH - fskfsdkfjsdklfjdklsfjsdklfjklsdfjsdkljfdklsjfdklsjfsdvdfvnxkvsnsdfnsdkjfhdjsvnjksdnvjknksdbnvjksdnvjksdnvksdnvsdkvnsdjkvnjksdnvklzsnvxsknvzkjvnksdvgiojfglkjgdjknbkdjfnbdklsfngkdjngjkdgnjkdfngkljdfngkdnfgkljdngjkdfngkjndgjkldnfjkgndklgndfjkgndjkfgndksjfngkdfjlgndfjkngkdfjngkdnsfgkdfjlnsgkljsdngdjnfgnldfkjgsdn.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:47 GMT
#1897
On November 16 2012 10:45 Blazinghand wrote:
Marv is it ok if we interpret that string of characters next to my name as "I hate to say it, but logically BH is town."


no, and stop antagonising me you dick
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:47 GMT
#1899
On November 16 2012 10:39 debears wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:36 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 16 2012 10:32 marvellosity wrote:
I am clearly town and a bigger asset (sorry DP)


Not offended at all it is true. But you are not clearly town so stop putting that Idea into peoples heads right now.

Also. Blazing hand would be fucking insane to fake claim JK day 1 as scum or as fucking SK. he is JK. So Marv as much as you would like to believe he is scum he is not and you are going to have to deal with that and use your 'assets' elsewhere.



DP haven't u been saying BH is scum all day?


I'd really like this answered actually.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:48 GMT
#1900
On November 16 2012 10:47 Clarity_nl wrote:
@ Marv

Yes he's a good lynch D2, but your shenannies D1 lynchtime to go for cross would have been bad. I don't think he's a coinflipanymore, but D1 he totally was.


yes, but you made a comment earlier today along the lines of "ugh he's just a lurker" which he isn't.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:50 GMT
#1902
if anyone wants to ask me anything about my reads, now is a pretty good time
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:51 GMT
#1904
wow, that DP saying BH is scum and saying he can only be JK is really bugging me now.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:52 GMT
#1909
you don't know what ninjad means.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:53 GMT
#1912
On November 16 2012 10:52 debears wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 16 2012 10:51 marvellosity wrote:
wow, that DP saying BH is scum and saying he can only be JK is really bugging me now.


Yep marv. And he accused like 5 ppl this night of being scum, including me


i'm tempted to retract my read on that alone. jesus.

and if hopeless is vigi... hum. maybe there's scum in my grey area where i fell town but are actually scum.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:54 GMT
#1915
i petulantly refuse to have one
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:56 GMT
#1922
mostly my list was in order of certainty.

perhaps some of my conclusions were wrong.

If crossfire is town, all of my conclusions were wrong
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:57 GMT
#1928
fuck off, BH.

if crossfire flips scum. then...

s&b/Z-bo/thrawn in that order

I literally don't know where to put DP right now. He might have just majorly fucked up with the BH thing and he's disappeared. Fuck.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:58 GMT
#1934
On November 16 2012 10:58 Blazinghand wrote:
Actually waht would be cool is if DP was somehow the other scum, and delivering the scum KP, and I just blocked him


that would be epically hilarious. and i would forgive you.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:59 GMT
#1936
oh yeah, DP has a point there.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 01:59 GMT
#1940
On November 16 2012 10:59 debears wrote:
LOL. That is not making any sense.

"Oh his breadcrumbs make sense now"

That's cool


no, it's the fact that BH had recanted when DP called him scum.

now BH is saying he is JK with a crumb to say so.

the two ARE different.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 16 2012 02:00 GMT
#1950
oh I died

gg, gl town. Bring it home!
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-22 12:22:02
November 22 2012 12:21 GMT
#3730
On November 22 2012 18:55 Kickstart wrote:
Yeah I was pleased that everyone read me as town basically all game, not so pleased that everyone was like "stupid townie" or "noobie townie", even if it is true since this was my first -_-.


You are a noobie townie, that's not an insult. But I thought you played very well. Made a case + vote on scum day 1 and were extremely clearly town by the flip too. This is a huge success for *any* townie. In fact you outplayed many of the not so noobie townies

Djo - nice try, coming in from so behind. Respect.

s&b - I have no idea how you think "lololol i dicked around day 1, it was fun" matches with "my philosophy is that townies should try to avoid being mislynched". Does not compute.

BH - still one of the worst claims I've ever seen.

DP - great catch on Djo at the end. Your setup spec/lack of scumhunting was bang on.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 13:52 GMT
#3734
On November 22 2012 22:47 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2012 13:59 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 21 2012 13:56 iamperfection wrote:
On November 21 2012 13:50 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 21 2012 13:42 iamperfection wrote:
i think djo is town

and im gonna say s&b and dp in that order is the way to go.


Why me exactly?

process of elimination and i said S&B first. Why does this bother you?


Cause I think S&B is probably town and I am town so if both those things are true lynching like this loses the game for town.


I <3 Imperfection.


that would have meant iamp would have lynched TWO players off my "town" list. tsk, iamp, tsk.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 16:18 GMT
#3738
There's no analysis, town got lucky as well as played well to lynch hapa day 1, vig shot the obvscum, then town derped a bit and tried to throw it away but had such a lead they couldn't.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 16:19 GMT
#3739
oh yeah, thanks to hosts. Theme was cool ^_^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 16:20 GMT
#3741
On November 23 2012 01:19 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 01:18 marvellosity wrote:
There's no analysis, town got lucky as well as played well to lynch hapa day 1, vig shot the obvscum, then town derped a bit and tried to throw it away but had such a lead they couldn't.

I should have shot BH like you said I should, then we'd have had a real game to analyze, right?


town would've lynched crossfire day 2, what's the difference
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 16:24 GMT
#3743
lost JK role that didn't do anything = VT. What shenanigans? Djo wouldn't be claiming JK, that's nonsense.

I'd still have shot BH out of spite, even looking back, simply because the day 2 lynch was clear.

The game was pretty much solved night 1 either way.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 17:43 GMT
#3749
On November 23 2012 02:42 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 02:32 Keirathi wrote:
On November 23 2012 01:37 Mementoss wrote:
loool 188 page mini wat

It was ~100 pages by the end of night one.

Yeah but how much of it was BH and marv ripping each other new ones?


I like to think it was rather onesided
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 23:13 GMT
#3805
On November 23 2012 08:13 Blazinghand wrote:
But.. town WAS already doing great. Like, that's a fact. You're welcome to dispute that fact, but it was true. In any case, Aside from me not buying your defense, what other lazy things did I do that I should avoid in the future?


we're talking post 1st cycle, right? ^_^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 23:16 GMT
#3811
On November 23 2012 08:14 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 08:13 marvellosity wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:13 Blazinghand wrote:
But.. town WAS already doing great. Like, that's a fact. You're welcome to dispute that fact, but it was true. In any case, Aside from me not buying your defense, what other lazy things did I do that I should avoid in the future?


we're talking post 1st cycle, right? ^_^


Yeah read my comments on the last page or two. My gf's grandmother died etc


ah. sorry to hear it.

I'm most curious how you went from protecting DP over me night 1 to not being sure he was town later.

Like, nothing significant had changed. DP pretty much had to be town because of the first cycle.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 23:21 GMT
#3816
On November 23 2012 08:17 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 08:16 marvellosity wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:14 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:13 marvellosity wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:13 Blazinghand wrote:
But.. town WAS already doing great. Like, that's a fact. You're welcome to dispute that fact, but it was true. In any case, Aside from me not buying your defense, what other lazy things did I do that I should avoid in the future?


we're talking post 1st cycle, right? ^_^


Yeah read my comments on the last page or two. My gf's grandmother died etc


ah. sorry to hear it.

I'm most curious how you went from protecting DP over me night 1 to not being sure he was town later.

Like, nothing significant had changed. DP pretty much had to be town because of the first cycle.


DP wasn't reading the thread-- I had him as my least townie town read for that.


your death reads post was dangerously indecisive. It was sooooo unlikely, like monumentally so, that DP was scum after the day 1 shenannies.

"I like DP less, but I think Djo is scummier" was not as strong as I'd hoped, especially as you'd cottoned on to the fact that Djodref's setup speculation basically took days and confirmed players who would end up being confirmed eventually and weren't getting lynched.

Like, there were REALLY REALLY GOOD REASONS why DP should be town, and none of these reasons existed for Djo.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 23:22 GMT
#3820
"cottoned on" is like grasped/realised. maybe it's a britishism.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 23:23 GMT
#3822
yes I know and you were right, but like I said its lack of firmness was worrying. it didn't even say "lynch djodref after s&b"

all's well that ends well, thankfully.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 23:26 GMT
#3828
On November 23 2012 08:24 DarthPunk wrote:

That being said. I think I should be banned or something. It is clearly against the rules to win by making others not want to play. And I'm pretty sure that is what happened here.



No, no, this is simply not a correct reflection of events.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 23:36 GMT
#3843
On November 23 2012 08:34 Z-BosoN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 08:32 Blazinghand wrote:
But definitely not because you were aggressive, aggressive DP is town dP


He's aggressive as both alignments. But his play as town is very different as town and as scum in some way I'll leave marv to explain


And give away my secrets?!

There was one other thing - although debears got bizarrely sniped, he wasn't checking Djodref that night, when he should have been. Check the replacement almost always, especially if he's replacing some lurker who's on the confirmed, flipped town's "lynch list"
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 22 2012 23:58 GMT
#3865
On November 23 2012 08:52 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 08:51 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:49 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:44 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:40 Z-BosoN wrote:
I disagree heavily with not lynching replacements. If the guy he was replacing was hella scummy, and in 48 hours you manage to act scummily and provide zero to none reads, that's more information than you have on whoever you lynched on day one.


Yes, Djodref played scummy during D2, but you can't hold a guy accountable for the actions of the guy he replaced in for. I gave him 72 hours, then called him scum.


This is a liberal interpretation of events. You called him scummier than me. and didn't really help me get a lynch on him as you should have if you were certain like I was.


SnB was the scummiest, he was priority 1


I disagree. But fair enough.

Now marv just needs to tell me my meta tell so I can change it.


you will roll town most of the time (yes, i know you've been a bit unlucky with scum rolls) so having someone recognise you as town is pretty useful.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 23 2012 00:19 GMT
#3868
On November 23 2012 09:01 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 08:58 marvellosity wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:52 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:51 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:49 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:44 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:40 Z-BosoN wrote:
I disagree heavily with not lynching replacements. If the guy he was replacing was hella scummy, and in 48 hours you manage to act scummily and provide zero to none reads, that's more information than you have on whoever you lynched on day one.


Yes, Djodref played scummy during D2, but you can't hold a guy accountable for the actions of the guy he replaced in for. I gave him 72 hours, then called him scum.


This is a liberal interpretation of events. You called him scummier than me. and didn't really help me get a lynch on him as you should have if you were certain like I was.


SnB was the scummiest, he was priority 1


I disagree. But fair enough.

Now marv just needs to tell me my meta tell so I can change it.


you will roll town most of the time (yes, i know you've been a bit unlucky with scum rolls) so having someone recognise you as town is pretty useful.


Yes but if I can emulate it I can do it as both alignments and then everyone will know I am town regardless of alignment. Right?


how does this benefit me?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 23 2012 00:28 GMT
#3871
On November 23 2012 09:27 Clarity_nl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 09:19 marvellosity wrote:
On November 23 2012 09:01 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:58 marvellosity wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:52 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:51 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:49 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:44 Blazinghand wrote:
On November 23 2012 08:40 Z-BosoN wrote:
I disagree heavily with not lynching replacements. If the guy he was replacing was hella scummy, and in 48 hours you manage to act scummily and provide zero to none reads, that's more information than you have on whoever you lynched on day one.


Yes, Djodref played scummy during D2, but you can't hold a guy accountable for the actions of the guy he replaced in for. I gave him 72 hours, then called him scum.


This is a liberal interpretation of events. You called him scummier than me. and didn't really help me get a lynch on him as you should have if you were certain like I was.


SnB was the scummiest, he was priority 1


I disagree. But fair enough.

Now marv just needs to tell me my meta tell so I can change it.


you will roll town most of the time (yes, i know you've been a bit unlucky with scum rolls) so having someone recognise you as town is pretty useful.


Yes but if I can emulate it I can do it as both alignments and then everyone will know I am town regardless of alignment. Right?


how does this benefit me?


You get to improve the play of others and therefore have a richer experience when you play with them


but it won't improve his town play, only his scumplay, and the chances of rolling scum with someone are quite small. I'd rather his scumplay was catchable :D
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 23 2012 00:35 GMT
#3874
quiet you :D
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 23 2012 00:35 GMT
#3875
naw, I'll just teach him then, BH.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-23 01:09:06
November 23 2012 01:08 GMT
#3881
On November 23 2012 10:03 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 09:33 Keirathi wrote:
Don't you remember what you said to me after LC when I said "meh, for all the good it did, I should have just kept my meta read [of you, proving kush was town] to myself?"

You said you were glad I shared because you wanted the opportunity to improve your own game. You should extend the same courtesy to DP, IMO!


This.


it's quite hard to describe, really. just little behavioural and tonal tells. Kei knows how to read you too, ask him, ask him!
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 23 2012 13:17 GMT
#3899
On November 23 2012 18:56 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2012 18:52 Clarity_nl wrote:
On November 23 2012 13:44 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 23 2012 13:34 Keirathi wrote:
On November 23 2012 13:31 DarthPunk wrote:
On November 23 2012 12:47 Keirathi wrote:
I believe I've explained how I nailed you as scum in both of your last two scum games, didn't I?

In both games, you had a well thought out opinion that set you apart from the crowd, then backed off that opinion to push an easy target when it was convenient.

In LC, you were the first person to pressure me at all. You had a super strong, well reasoned case about why I was scum that 100% could have gotten me lynched if you stuck to it. Instead of fighting for it, though, you backed off to push kush once he started getting pressured because it was "easier".

ACME was basically the same. You gave a well-reasoned town read on kush, then when no one paid attention to it and started talking about lynching kush, you were all too happy to join in the wagon on him, despite the fact that he was still acting the same way you called him town for.

However, I can't actually say how that's different from your town play, because I'm pretty unfamiliar with reading you and deciding that you're town. I think I would need to obs a game where you're town to notice if you actually do any of those things and see if my read is right. This game doesn't count, since I already knew your alignment beforehand.


yeah thanks kei I'll work on that. Or just do it a bunch as town.

Doing it a bunch as town is a terrible strategy


Yeah but it serves the purpose of obfuscating my meta.


It also serves the purpose of not being good for town. When you're town: Play to your win con, not your meta.
Your town play should affect your scum play, not the other way around.


ZZZ I wasn't being serious.


Don't jest, some players like Drazerk genuinely believe that's a good thing. He plays terribly on purpose so people can't "meta" him. Don't ask.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 23 2012 14:14 GMT
#3901
On November 23 2012 22:58 Blazinghand wrote:
Can I change my story from "played this bad while trying" to "played this bad but was actually trying to play bad for weird meta reasons"


it'd make me feel better <3

actually apart from the first cycle I don't really think you played badly, maybe like you admitted a little lazily.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 23 2012 17:49 GMT
#3904
On November 24 2012 02:40 debears wrote:
I think the best strategy in terms of meta is to just post a shit ton
1) It makes you get nked early as town
2) It makes you look scummy day 1 no matter what, but you will never be lynched unless you just completely mess up
3) It allows you as scum to be active with thread presence while still being considered scummy

The only downside, as to what Hapa and Marv experience, is that you don't make it past d2/d3 as scum
:D

But maybe you can bullshit your way out of it


i don't really agree with any of this

especially as most of my scum games i've been alive to take the win at lylo

you get nked early if you're strong and constructive, not because you post a lot
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 23 2012 18:17 GMT
#3907
On November 24 2012 03:07 Dandel Ion wrote:
That'd be the so-called "Oh-god-shut-the-fuck-up bullet"


that's where the "wtf" shot on Shady Sands came from in Death Note.

He was a clear mislynch target for me as scum but I killed him to stop him posting. No-one in the thread or the obsQT understood the shot at all, and gamewise it was completely suboptimal.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 26 2012 01:29 GMT
#3929
On November 26 2012 10:24 Blazinghand wrote:
I'm gonna be real here it was a picture of a dick


why don't i believe you
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 26 2012 01:49 GMT
#3941
rofl. actually having a good chuckle right now.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 28 2012 02:12 GMT
#3949
On November 28 2012 11:06 Blazinghand wrote:
It's certainly not against the rules, but it's playing a game that's not mafia. Mentioning out-of-game things in game as excuses for activity is unsportsmanlike. I don't want to play a game that's about seeing if someone's excuse is real or not by trying to figure out if it's photo-shopped or it makes sense. That game isn't mafia, and it isn't what mafia should be about.


I only partially agree. If I've been away for some reason or I know I'll be away, I'll say so so that the thread knows. People can take it or leave it. I'd rather just say "I'm travelling today, so I won't be around until tomorrow" than ppl go "omg marv so quiet for so long i wonder wft is up with that shizzle to the nizzle"
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 28 2012 02:21 GMT
#3953
On November 28 2012 11:16 Blazinghand wrote:
I don't think saying "I'm gonna be gone for a day" is great but at least it's something that can be analyzed and fit into a read with someone's actions. I personally ignore such statements because they are as easily made by town as by scum-- it's null. It doesn't offend me, it's just not helpful.

I think once people start photographing plane tickets and taking screenshots of dota games, though, they've crossed the line. It may not be against the rules but I find it very distasteful.


yeah, i just don't agree with this. like, it's supposed to be null, i'm just making a statement of fact. Obviously you can take inactivity/excuses into a larger read, but overall I much prefer warning the thread of my absences. I've never lied about my absences as either alignment and I never will.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 29 2012 13:23 GMT
#3957
I don't treat talis' excuses as legitimate

:p
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 29 2012 22:10 GMT
#3960
On November 30 2012 07:05 Blazinghand wrote:

I'm infinitely more honest about mafia than you are because I don't mention out-of-game stuff, I don't take photos and screenshots of things to "prove" why I was AFK and I don't derail the thread with it. I'll never be put in a situation where i have to choose between "honor" and my win-con because my philosophy, which is to ignore and treat as null (not scummy or townie) anyone's excuses prevents the out-of-game from interacting with the in-game.



That doesn't make you more honest. s&b is 100% honest about what he's done.

The viewpoint you hold I wager is in the minority. As you're saying to the rest of us, you're free to hold it; but however much you want it to be it isn't more intellectually honest or superior.

The fact you take such a stance is your own peculiarity, and you should recognise it as such...
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
November 29 2012 22:15 GMT
#3962
In your opinion, yea.

Not a lot else to say about it as no-one else agrees with you.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
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