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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Edit: Assuming that no prior knowledge of DF is needed /in, and I will not be modkilled, nor banned, nor burned at the stake, nor sexually harrased, nor shot, nor stabbed, nor force-fed Scottish food in punishment during the first game that the good Bluelightz is hosting. I reserve the right to take the listed punishments during Bluelightz' second hosted game until further notice. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On August 06 2012 23:27 Custos Luna wrote: Back in MY day that didn't HAVE newbie mafia. Had to walk uphill both ways 7 miles in the snow barefoot! Wait, but this is your first game on TL, right????? How can you have played a game of mafia with single digit post count??? I'm sooo confused ............... ^^ | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Edit: Unless you're name is referring to the group that protects the moon, in which case I would think it should be Custodes Lunae. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
+ Show Spoiler [Translation] + For his abuse of the genitive I am calling out Custo Luna, and he must either change his name or I will vote for him.+ Show Spoiler + Not really, this was just a fun may to make my 4 years of latin worthwhile, and for anyone who's taken latin: Come on, Luna is a first declension noun. Easiest one to learn, and CL has it wrong in his name (Unless his name is just supposed to be two unrelated nouns, like JingleHell, VisceraEyes, and if you allow one word to be an adjective, BlazingHand, BloodyCobbler, etc, etc, etc.). This is therefore a joke. Funnily enough, the first person I'd like to ask a question is Mr. CL himself. In a way, Sciberbia's post telling people not to claim VT doesn't make any sense, especially when he comes out and says that he's a dwarf. On the other hand though, I don't see why you called out that illogical passage. Are you implying that bad logic is scummy? Or are you just poking fun at him? | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Wow, Forumite's accusation came much earlier than I expected. All Shiao had done was come out as anti-policy, and then when pressed came out against lying and lurking. What in that is scummy, I have no idea. I think its clear that Forumite has some type of plan hatching, but until we find out what the plan is, his early accusation is sort of weightless. It could be an attempt to draw scum out or to force townie mistakes in order to mislynch. Or it could be something completely different, or even some amazing, irrefutable meta-read that paints Shiao as scum already. I don't see how that could be possible, but without further information, it's sort of a null read on Forumite for now. I think Forumite does deserve some extra attention, as I'm always kind of wary of people who are scheming. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
I'll do some defense first, because it takes less time, and in a while I'll come back with my reads so far. First things first: + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 16:00 slOosh wrote: Hey guys, didn't anticipate the early deadline so yea ... Anyways, any of the blue roles can be used to the "innocent child" effect. Scum are extremely limited in their ability to fakeclaim because it is a blue-wise open setup (we might not know the 2nd blue identity but we can still cc any blue claim instantly). I recommend whoever is blue to consider this and not hastily throw away a potential advantage here by claiming early (mainly tracker but same thing extends to watcher/cop). No go on double lynch. Too exploitable / volatile in a game this small. Hey Mordanis, could you explain this contradiction? If this was an attempt to draw scum out, you have now just alerted them all with the second post, which goes against what you said in the first post. You said you are currently null on Forumite yet it seems like you are leaning a certain direction in your read of him. Moving on, there's ShiaoPi's case on me + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 19:00 ShiaoPi wrote: I just read sciberbia's case on Forumite, while it has merit, I am unsure of him being scum. I can also see the early scumread on me simply as an early attempt to get some discussion/pressure going, he succeeded in that regard for sure. Regarding the logical inconsistencies they are a concern, but for now I would just like to keep an eye on him. @Custos I would really like you to contribute more. All you have done until now is pointing out a rather silly (read almost nonexistent) contradiction in one of sciberbia's posts and voicing some concern regarding me and prphlz. Mind elaborating why? Currently I am having an issue with Mordanis: Take a look at his opening post: + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 03:34 Mordanis wrote: I actually disagree that talking policy early on is bad. It is only bad when the policy talk tells scum how to get off free. "We will only lynch active players" tells scum that they can get one or two players to the late-game with as little content to hold against them as possible. On a similar note, it's probably not a good idea to discuss your heuristics for finding scum until you find examples of them in people's play. If you start talking about them right now, unless you list 173 of them, scum probably will actively avoid fitting your heuristic, thus ruining your chance of finding scum. Discussing when/how to use novel mechanics is simply a rational thing to do early in the game, though. Personally, I haven't had too much time to think about when/how to use the double lynch mechanic, but I can say that in my experience it happens fairly often that neither candidate up for lynching D1 is scum, and going from 9 town 3 scum D1 to 6 town 3 scum D2 would be pretty brutal. In short, I am strongly against D1 multi-lynching unless something very convincing happens to change my mind. Aside from that, the only other bit of policy I have to offer is that we should probably wait until night to discuss power roles, NKs, etc. During the day, all that really matters (in the absence of Day-vigis) is town/mafia. Daytime is for hunting scum, not deciding power role strategy. Enough with the policy now, I'm off to find scum. He is against cutting policy talk short and proceeds to do a good amount of it. The next sentence marks Mord as anti-lurker, but then he says that policy-talk should not be done, since it gives scum a pattern to avoid. But then he goes back to say that policytalk is useful based on the ground that there is nothing else to be done. This entire paragraph is extremely redundant and makes me think of him trying to boost the look of his filter by seemingly contributing in a circular logic pattern. His next two posts are hitting Custos, he questions why he quotes that part of scib. + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 04:26 Mordanis wrote: -snip- Funnily enough, the first person I'd like to ask a question is Mr. CL himself. In a way, Sciberbia's post telling people not to claim VT doesn't make any sense, especially when he comes out and says that he's a dwarf. On the other hand though, I don't see why you called out that illogical passage. Are you implying that bad logic is scummy? Or are you just poking fun at him? He is again extremely wishy-washy. Just look at it, first he critisizes scib for claiming alignment (which is pretty much a nulltell in my opinion), but then he also "does not see" how that could be called out. When Hiro says that it is a nulltell and differentiates between alignment claim and VT claim Mord responds like this: + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 04:35 Mordanis wrote: He is still implying that he's VT though, or else just asking for scum to kill him. When someone claims town, they are trying to make other people perceive them as VT. Why else would you claim town? Now he suddenly is much more concerned about claiming alignment (which he again links to VT). Flip-flopping at its best. Also on his latest post: + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 05:23 Mordanis wrote: Right, and so saying that you shouldn't claim VT when you make a statement that's only purpose is to make yourself be perceived as VT seems illogical to me. Enough on that subject though ^^ Wow, Forumite's accusation came much earlier than I expected. All Shiao had done was come out as anti-policy, and then when pressed came out against lying and lurking. What in that is scummy, I have no idea. I think its clear that Forumite has some type of plan hatching, but until we find out what the plan is, his early accusation is sort of weightless. It could be an attempt to draw scum out or to force townie mistakes in order to mislynch. Or it could be something completely different, or even some amazing, irrefutable meta-read that paints Shiao as scum already. I don't see how that could be possible, but without further information, it's sort of a null read on Forumite for now. I think Forumite does deserve some extra attention, as I'm always kind of wary of people who are scheming. Keep in mind that Forumite had already accused me much earlier than Mord posted. He only gives his opinion on it when Hiro asked him specifialy to do so. Mord sees no reason to suspect me, but hadn't he said that he also dislikes cutting policy short? Shouldn't he agree with Forumite's accusation based on that? Furthermore examine the rest of the post after the part I bolded. It is actually pure fluff. I feel that Mord has a higher chance of flipping scum than Forumite does, so ##vote: Mordanis About my questions to CL, I honestly don't see any wishy-washiness. I said that it didn't make sense to claim town and tell VTs not to claim VT in the same post, but that it doesn't seem particularly scummy. I don't really see any reason for scum to do this. Later I said that if you are claiming town you are really claiming VT because it makes sense. If you claim town, you are saying that you're either green or blue. If you claim a blue role at this point, you're either really bad or scum. It makes much more sense to interpret someone claiming town as claiming VT. This does not contradict what I said earlier. Going further, there is no analysis of why potential wishy-washiness would be alignment indicative. Finally, Shiao mentions that he thinks that I should have voted for him because I didn't agree with him that policy talking is unnecessary or unimportant or even scummy. I don't see how Shiao can criticize my logic when a large part of his reason for voting for me is based on how I did not vote arbitrarily for someone because I didn't agree with them. BRB, I'm going to go get some lunch, and then I'll do some scum-hunting. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
@ CL: Just because townies aren't capable of planning as scum doesn't make them incapable of planning as townies. As a specific example, in NMM 14 Release (town) went fishing for a kp by tunelling one player all night cycle. When he wasn't killed, he assumed that the player he had tunneled wasn't scum, and thought of that person as confirmed town. He was wrong. He made a plan to find a scum, and it backfired and would have lost the game had it not ended earlier due to a hardcore lurker. This is a large part of why plans scare me~ they backfire as often as not if hatched by a townie, and they're really susceptible to WIFOM, which is a great thing for scum to hide behind. Moving to the pertinent bits, I think the scummiest player so far has been ShiaoPi. + Show Spoiler + Before anyone claims OMGUS, please read through. I am not accusing Shiao because I'm pissed, but because his play seems aligned with scum goals He starts the game off with a really bad post. + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 00:08 ShiaoPi wrote: Well well, let's get started! Skip policytalking, we all know lurkers suck, you should not lie etc. etc. LiquidTomb's fallen demand justice, so let's go hammer some goblins. + Show Spoiler + As a digression, literally less than an hour after yelling that policy is bad, Shiao is discussing the multi-lynch mechanic. In fact, Shiao makes 8 posts centered on policy after coming out as anti-policy. And he calls my play wishy-washy ^^ His next non-policy non-probing post is his accusation of me. + Show Spoiler [for your convenience] + On August 08 2012 19:00 ShiaoPi wrote: I just read sciberbia's case on Forumite, while it has merit, I am unsure of him being scum. I can also see the early scumread on me simply as an early attempt to get some discussion/pressure going, he succeeded in that regard for sure. Regarding the logical inconsistencies they are a concern, but for now I would just like to keep an eye on him. @Custos I would really like you to contribute more. All you have done until now is pointing out a rather silly (read almost nonexistent) contradiction in one of sciberbia's posts and voicing some concern regarding me and prphlz. Mind elaborating why? Currently I am having an issue with Mordanis: Take a look at his opening post: + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 03:34 Mordanis wrote: I actually disagree that talking policy early on is bad. It is only bad when the policy talk tells scum how to get off free. "We will only lynch active players" tells scum that they can get one or two players to the late-game with as little content to hold against them as possible. On a similar note, it's probably not a good idea to discuss your heuristics for finding scum until you find examples of them in people's play. If you start talking about them right now, unless you list 173 of them, scum probably will actively avoid fitting your heuristic, thus ruining your chance of finding scum. Discussing when/how to use novel mechanics is simply a rational thing to do early in the game, though. Personally, I haven't had too much time to think about when/how to use the double lynch mechanic, but I can say that in my experience it happens fairly often that neither candidate up for lynching D1 is scum, and going from 9 town 3 scum D1 to 6 town 3 scum D2 would be pretty brutal. In short, I am strongly against D1 multi-lynching unless something very convincing happens to change my mind. Aside from that, the only other bit of policy I have to offer is that we should probably wait until night to discuss power roles, NKs, etc. During the day, all that really matters (in the absence of Day-vigis) is town/mafia. Daytime is for hunting scum, not deciding power role strategy. Enough with the policy now, I'm off to find scum. He is against cutting policy talk short and proceeds to do a good amount of it. The next sentence marks Mord as anti-lurker, but then he says that policy-talk should not be done, since it gives scum a pattern to avoid. But then he goes back to say that policytalk is useful based on the ground that there is nothing else to be done. This entire paragraph is extremely redundant and makes me think of him trying to boost the look of his filter by seemingly contributing in a circular logic pattern. His next two posts are hitting Custos, he questions why he quotes that part of scib. + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 04:26 Mordanis wrote: -snip- Funnily enough, the first person I'd like to ask a question is Mr. CL himself. In a way, Sciberbia's post telling people not to claim VT doesn't make any sense, especially when he comes out and says that he's a dwarf. On the other hand though, I don't see why you called out that illogical passage. Are you implying that bad logic is scummy? Or are you just poking fun at him? He is again extremely wishy-washy. Just look at it, first he critisizes scib for claiming alignment (which is pretty much a nulltell in my opinion), but then he also "does not see" how that could be called out. When Hiro says that it is a nulltell and differentiates between alignment claim and VT claim Mord responds like this: + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 04:35 Mordanis wrote: He is still implying that he's VT though, or else just asking for scum to kill him. When someone claims town, they are trying to make other people perceive them as VT. Why else would you claim town? Now he suddenly is much more concerned about claiming alignment (which he again links to VT). Flip-flopping at its best. Also on his latest post: + Show Spoiler + On August 08 2012 05:23 Mordanis wrote: Right, and so saying that you shouldn't claim VT when you make a statement that's only purpose is to make yourself be perceived as VT seems illogical to me. Enough on that subject though ^^ Wow, Forumite's accusation came much earlier than I expected. All Shiao had done was come out as anti-policy, and then when pressed came out against lying and lurking. What in that is scummy, I have no idea. I think its clear that Forumite has some type of plan hatching, but until we find out what the plan is, his early accusation is sort of weightless. It could be an attempt to draw scum out or to force townie mistakes in order to mislynch. Or it could be something completely different, or even some amazing, irrefutable meta-read that paints Shiao as scum already. I don't see how that could be possible, but without further information, it's sort of a null read on Forumite for now. I think Forumite does deserve some extra attention, as I'm always kind of wary of people who are scheming. Keep in mind that Forumite had already accused me much earlier than Mord posted. He only gives his opinion on it when Hiro asked him specifialy to do so. Mord sees no reason to suspect me, but hadn't he said that he also dislikes cutting policy short? Shouldn't he agree with Forumite's accusation based on that? Furthermore examine the rest of the post after the part I bolded. It is actually pure fluff. I feel that Mord has a higher chance of flipping scum than Forumite does, so ##vote: Mordanis Even further, this is the first true case of the game, unless you count Forumite's claim that Shiao is scum. Again, posting the first case of the game is generally a good way to gain town trust in my experience. So far Shiao has seemed pretty desperate to gain a place of trust within the town. The reason I have been focusing on this is because of a post by Marv in the obs QT for NMM 22, in which Shiao has been fairly active, where he says + Show Spoiler [names edited out for active game prote…] + yes, that was (Player A)'s big mistake. Miscalculation of the consequences of doing so and of(Player B)'s town-standing (which was very high; perhaps (Player A) got misled that (Player C)'s attacks on (Player B) = not high standing? but that wasn't the case) Effectively you should not pick fights with townies who have a higher town-standing than you. (Player A) had a decent town-standing at the time but not as high as (Player B). Further to this point, it goes to show the very high value of being super townie as scum (i.e. how i play). Because then if someone decides to take you on, town sides with you. The higher your town-standing, the more town are willing to passively accept your arguments without too much criticism. Lylo in LIV was a really good example of this - I used pure WIFOM to explain away the fact I didn't die the night before and town just lapped it up because I was so established. But if you haven't got high town credit you can't get away with that kinda stuff at all. @ Forumite, I hope this is clear enough for you: ##FoS ShiaoPi For now, I need to go back and do some more analyzing and see SP's response before voting. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Marv: I'm assuming that you're referring to my analysis of his first post as well. The reason I believe that his first post is an attempt to buy town cred is because it is generically pro-town without offering any details or actually helping town. Needing to seem pro-town but not contributing to discussion is patently scummy, as it is supposed to give him all the benefits of a high level of trust while stalling D1 discussion. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
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Anyways, my case on Shiao was kind of shitty (especially in the fact department. I'm actually really ashamed to have forgotten about the case on Forumite.), so I'll brb with new thoughts. One final question: Sciberbia, are you basing your estimation of my scumhunting on NMM XIV? I really don't think its fair to label me as a mediocre or worse scumhunter based on a game where I was in fact on the mafia side. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Marv: Anyways, I don't really trust Marv's motives so far. His reason for voting for CL: + Show Spoiler [Reasoning] + On August 09 2012 00:31 marvellosity wrote: Final post for now. People who don't care about town: prplhz. For your convenience, his posts so far: Posting to say he isn't reading, and casting doubt with seemingly no purpose. This is seriously pants. I'd be happier to vote for him if I hadn't seen him do similar as town before. Custos Moony This dude is worse. DoYouHas talked about him a little yesterday, and I agree with what he said. To expand: This goes back to part of Shiao's case on Mordanis, where Mordanis tied himself up in knots a bit about it. However, I see the root cause of that particular problem as Luna's post here (of course sciberbia was the originator, but Luna is the one to highlight it). The problem I have with this post is that it's highlighting something without providing your own commentary on it. As DYH said, it's highlighting a contradiction that wasn't even really a contradiction. What it *is* doing is planting an idea into town, an idea that can't be fruitful, and then letting town shit itself up with it. I see strong scum motive in this. Again as DYH points out, everyone wasn't talking about a D1 double lynch at all. It was mentioned offhandedly as a bad idea a couple of times, but never seriously proposed in any way. In an empty filter, it's empty filler devoid of content for the sake of saying something. Further to note - he's at work and reading where he can, and just "poking". Excuse for not being substantial. Just pointless. If it was sandwiched between content, fine, but it isn't. The fact of the matter is that Custos was around the thread at at least three points yesterday (just check the timestamps of what I quoted) but when he's around he contributes nothing or even causes thread disruption. Second excuse for doing nothing. In short, Custos Luna doesn't give a shit about town. His original quote-post of scib's was unexplained with his own opinion and served to disrupt the thread by making people talk about an irrelevant non-contradiction. He excuses himself for scumhunting. He is currently my favourite lynch target. ##Vote: Custos Luna Mufaa/Skware in NMM 14, where one player was replaced because he didn't post at all in a cycle or two, and his replacement posted a total of like 4 times in 4 cycles, and 3 of them were in the first cycle he replaced into. He literally didn't post for at least 2 cycles and missed at least 2 votes, and he was town. Marv later posts + Show Spoiler [Similar Reasoning] + On August 09 2012 05:24 marvellosity wrote: ##Unvote Custos is actually getting involved in town affairs ##Vote: prplhz prplhz very much is not. I'm going to look more into the Forumite situation. Need to mull over what slOosh said to me and also see if I can make anything out of what seems to be a lot of 'meh' from people about it. Before I begin my next point, I want to point out again that Marv has either played in or cohosted every game I've played. Assumably this means that he has read every post of mine, and known my alignment for most of them the entire time. Marv must know my habits, foibles, tells, and what to do to get me lynched at this point. This is rather important. Here I'd like to point out these posts + Show Spoiler + On August 09 2012 08:28 marvellosity wrote: scib, I meant all the questions/explanations/possible contradictions in the explanations for Forumite's play. Most likely to be scum? ick. to be continued. For when you return - please talk about Mordanis' case on shiaopi. On August 09 2012 08:02 marvellosity wrote: ugh this Forumite stuff is soooo dense. can't tell if mordanis is scum or just made a really atrocious case. as you're here, what did you make of mordanis' case on ShiaoPi, prplhz? In short, marv is either extremely light on sharing his opinions, or is trying to find scum in a really bad way. Also, he seems to be afraid to take responsibility, which seems very scummy. ##Vote marvellosity Also, I'm going to be up for like 15 minutes, and then I'll sleep for like 4 hours, be awake for the deadline, and then probably crash 5 minutes later. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On August 09 2012 22:47 Forumite wrote: Mord change your vote to me or prplhz, there's no point in voting for marv, he's not going to be lynched today. Consolidate to one of the leading lynches, otherwise you are helping scum. How so? unless we go to a double-lynch or no-lynch situation, whether I'm one of the ones to pile on a bad case or not seems irrelevant. I notice that CL is still voting me, so why am I the one you're mentioning? | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
+ Show Spoiler [This] + On August 09 2012 00:14 Forumite wrote: Clarification about my opinion of Mordanis Big posts but very few, talking about me, possible VT-claim and policy, with a lot of fluff. Overall lots of text but next to no content, which looks bad. His post about "funnily enough" asking CL feels off somehow. Mordanis needs to shape up, or at least post more. I'm anxiosly awaiting the time when CL gets back. On August 09 2012 04:34 Forumite wrote: @mordanis You still fill your posts with fluff. It makes you look bad and makes it harder to understand what you mean. I don't want you to defend yourself about this, it's done, but if your scumhunting looks like the last post then I'm going to vote to have you lynched. to + Show Spoiler [that] + On August 09 2012 21:27 Forumite wrote: @scrib -I've allready answered why I kept saying I thought ShaioPi was scum even when I got unsure. -I got suspicious of prplhz earlier, but didn't trust my read at first, because I thought it might have been anger at him voting for me. Then he came back and didn't change my opinion after three posts, so I went with my earlier read, that he's scum. About mord I don't think he's scum. I don't like his long posts, but he's actually my strongest townread right now. I'm not sure if I'll be around anymore before the deadline. The main thing though is that it seems like he is just trying to muck up the thread once he dies. I don't understand why a townie close to being lynched would share town reads instead of trying to throw in some final analysis on who's scummy. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
## Unvote ## Vote Forumite | ||
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On August 11 2012 02:14 Custos Luna wrote: This is possible. However, I believe that the scum team is trying to incriminate me. They want to set me up for a lynch. They are using the fact that marvel placed a vote on me and they want town to think that marvel was killed because of it. If you notice in Hiro's last post (before day post), he posts claiming I'm scum: He and his scumbuddies have created a situation in which they can try to get me killed. Sweet WIFOM. I'll tell you what, I'll play along too. CL is scum and engineered the kill to make it look like people were out to get him so he'd have a couple of easy mislynches. Or perhaps CL knew that he'd be called out for WIFOM so he made himself seem paranoid in a good paranoid-townie way, and he's trying to buy town cred. Or perhaps WIFOM isn't a good way to play. | ||
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Mordanis
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Mordanis
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In short, it makes a lot of sense to me to say "Don't lynch me because in one situation I'd be trying to get rid of marv because he voted for me", but it makes none to then say "now lynch these other dudes because in one situation they're trying to set me up". By calling out 3 players and calling them a scumteam and then saying that the scumteam is trying to screw you over with their KP you are arguing for lynching all 3 of the players you called out. You can't argue (well) that the best course of action is to lynch 3 people in a row based on a logical jump (that prplhz is scum) plus connection play based on that leap. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
##Vote Custos Luna | ||
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On August 11 2012 08:07 DoYouHas wrote: CL, I don't like that you have brought out a connection case this early in the game. My experiences with connection cases is that they are rarely accurate when presented on day3 and you posted this at the end of N1. I also don't like your WIFOM. You, risk, and scib have all posted possible reasons marv was hit, and they are all equally possible. Speculating on night hits is pointless without corroborating evidence. However, I do agree some of your points and who you are suspicious of. The fact that it took vote switching instead of a clear majority to lynch Forumite increases the chance that prplhz is scum and that his scumbuddies manipulated the vote. That would make Hiro, Shiao, and Mord the suspicious parties day1. This is convienent as those are the people I have been most suspicious of after prplhz already. I'm going to withold my vote for now. I need to do some more filter digging and put together an actual case before I commit to pushing someone. CL also changed his vote to Forumite. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On August 09 2012 23:27 Custos Luna wrote: EBWOP: DYH, looking back, that does appear to be fairly accurate. I had thought more people unvoted off prplhz and onto Forumite. If it is necessary, I will switch my vote from Mord to Forumite to avoid the double lynch depending on what is said in the next half hour. However, Mord, you need to decide. Forumite or prplhz. Make your choice. Do so before I am required to or the wrath of the moon will fall upon you. EBWOP: I think this makes it clear that CL wouldn't have voted for prplhz, so by DYH's logic CL should also be under scrutiny. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
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Your first post indicating that the people who switched their votes were suspicious was based on prplhz being scum. Your accusation of CL assumes that prplhz is town. So how are you leaning right now? | ||
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Mordanis
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On August 11 2012 19:29 risk.nuke wrote: DoYouHas pulling out some big guns. I like that. ##unvote: prplhz ##vote: Custos Luna Mind sharing your opinions? | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Also, somehow Shiao has somehow escaped being labeled a lurker despite not having posted at all this cycle. | ||
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Mordanis
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It would be completely worthless to switch my vote to anyone other than prpl at this point, but I still feel that I need to comment on him. I feel it is highly likely at least one of the scum are lurking pretty hard, simply because the setup strongly encourages it. 3 mislynches plus 3 night kills yields victory to the scum. While lurkers by their nature don't really contribute, prpl really hasn't done anything at all the entire game. He voted for his counter-wagon, defended himself, and added more to the counterwagon. Take those away and he has zero content. He obviously cares at least a little to save his own ass but doesn't seem to give a shit about finding scum or even contributing to discussion in any way. I do find that scummy. ## Unvote ## Vote prplhz Luna diem integram novumque tibi donaverit. Aut nox donaverit. Teneas gratior et leta gobbae. The moon has given you a new and fresh day. Or she has given you a night.You may choose whichever pleases you more and you must kill scum. | ||
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United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On August 11 2012 08:09 Mordanis wrote: Actually, in my mind, the scummiest thing in the entire game so far has been your argument to lynch 3 players in a row based on the assumption that one of the players is scum, and then connection-based logic on Hiro. ##Vote Custos Luna On August 11 2012 11:31 DoYouHas wrote: Thank you thank you thank you Mordanis. Your point about me not including CL was absolutley right, and I was pondering my answer in the shower when I had a bit of a revelation. CL's voteswitch was unique from the others in a very specific way. He let you pick for him Mord. He implies multiple times that voting Forumite is what he wants to do, so why not actually do it? His reason is that he fears that Mord will force the double lynch if he votes first. But is this a rational fear? no. If Mord is town then he would realize that everyone does not want a double lynch day1 and would not cause one. He probably would have sat on marv and been content that CL took the decision out of his hands. If Mord is scum then he would realize that the town is going to lynch him day2 if he forces a last minute double lynch and that a 2 for 1 trade isn't bad for town day1. Neither alignment would have forced that double lynch in Mord's position. So why would CL put Mord (someone he is supposed to believe is scum, drastically increasing the chance of a mislynch) firmly in the driver's seat of yesterday's lynch? I can think of only one answer: CL knew that either choice would end in a townie flip and did not want to be tied to the blame for it. The language he uses leading up to the lynch only strengthens my belief that this is the case. + Show Spoiler + On August 09 2012 23:27 Custos Luna wrote: Firm stance on wanting to switch to Forum, immediately hands reins over to Mord to choose Forum or prplhz.EBWOP: DYH, looking back, that does appear to be fairly accurate. I had thought more people unvoted off prplhz and onto Forumite. If it is necessary, I will switch my vote from Mord to Forumite to avoid the double lynch depending on what is said in the next half hour. However, Mord, you need to decide. Forumite or prplhz. Make your choice. Do so before I am required to or the wrath of the moon will fall upon you. + Show Spoiler + On August 09 2012 23:36 Custos Luna wrote: Begins to distance himself from a Forumite lynch and even entertains double lynching.If one of prpl and Forumite are scum, the double lynch benefits us. However, I'm still not entirely convinced and I'm trying to figure out how to give us the best chance into this lynch. + Show Spoiler [Important One] + On August 09 2012 23:54 Custos Luna wrote: This is a very important post tone-wise. It starts with a mischievous tone with the bantering line of "I would never!". This bantering statement tells me that CL just relaxed a bit, or even is feeling a bit victorious. This is immediately is followed by an even bigger distancing statement, "Still unsure on Forumite. But I'm less sure on prpl". Then his 'moon' closing is even a bit off of the normal. Up until this point the moon comments by CL have been either normal signoffs or threats. This one is different, it reads to me like a self satisfied dig at Mord, which seems out of place until I fit it to my theory.I would never! Still unsure on Forumite. But I'm less sure on prpl, and I want to pad some security against a last minute swap/double lynch. Therefore: ##unvote Mordanis ##vote Forumite The moon is shocked that Mord has actually committed to something. Custos Luna is SCUM ##Vote: Custos Luna It goes further though. He says that there is no reason to be confused about the bandwagon switching to prpl. This is the reason that D2 seemed so weird to me. prpl wasn't a candidate for the lynch so much as the one candidate was sort of exonerated, and he seemed like the backup lynch. Shiao is expecting me to believe someone based purely on their meta-reads. I apologize if I don't have the brain of a sheep. If you ignore prpl's meta, it becomes a lurker lynch. Why everyone was piling on one of the lurkers instead of the several others is confusing. Finally you literally cut the bits of my quote that explain your concerns about my switch. Here is what you snipped: + Show Spoiler + On August 12 2012 17:15 Mordanis wrote: ....... CL is obviously a bit rusty, and so if he were scum I'd expect to be able to find lots of little scum-tells along with the major mistakes. I just didn't find any, and not for lack of effort. In short, it simply doesn't make any sense to me to assume that someone is good enough to have a filter basically free from little scum-tells but bad enough to make massive mistakes unless there isn't anything for that player to hide. It would be completely worthless to switch my vote to anyone other than prpl at this point, but I still feel that I need to comment on him. I feel it is highly likely at least one of the scum are lurking pretty hard, simply because the setup strongly encourages it. 3 mislynches plus 3 night kills yields victory to the scum. While lurkers by their nature don't really contribute, prpl really hasn't done anything at all the entire game. He voted for his counter-wagon, defended himself, and added more to the counterwagon. Take those away and he has zero content. He obviously cares at least a little to save his own ass but doesn't seem to give a shit about finding scum or even contributing to discussion in any way. I do find that scummy. ## Unvote ## Vote prplhz Luna diem integram novumque tibi donaverit. Aut nox donaverit. Teneas gratior et leta gobbae. The moon has given you a new and fresh day. Or she has given you a night.You may choose whichever pleases you more and you must kill scum. Shiao: you better have a really fucking good reason for lying and manipulating what I wrote to make your case against me stronger. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Okey Dokey, I had some time to think about SP's post. First off, I think it is important to recognize that SP manipulated, bordering on barefaced lying, my posts to make his case seem stronger. There is zero possible explanation for good townies to make that case. + Show Spoiler [Wordy Logic] + If SP had been a DT and found scum last night, making a case like his would make sense. Unfortunately, the setup allows only 1 power role besides medic, so SP cannot be a DT, or either of the other power roles. It is therefore clear that SP made a really bad post. At least as bad as CL's mistakes. The problem is, I can't accept that heuristic (big mistakes without small mistakes = town) for defense anymore. Clever scum who were playing well could make one big mistake to gain a town read as long as their filter was clean of scum-tells. This means that scum would be playing well (instead of really well and simultaneously really bad), so that heuristic can't be used for defense for quite a while. It can however still be used for hunting scum. If there is a mistake worth investigation, and the player in question has a filter full of minor "slips", they've been playing pretty bad scum. Also, I get the feeling from this post that it is a contrivance. The contradictions to his play (which Sloosh pointed out) within the post plus all of the innacuracies make it seem as though he either had some sort of gut read and didn't Another player whom I believe is worthy of more suspicion than he's seen is Risk. Virtually no contribution save one post relatively recently. This is partially in answer to SP's question about whom I'm suspicios of. I'm about to pass out though, so I'll do some more reading in the morning. See you all then. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
##Vote risk.nuke | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Anyways, I'm pretty sure SP is scum. Remember his D3 accusation of me? I've thought it seemed way too bad to be something he honestly believed was a viable case that would lead to lynching scum. The factual errors that supported his views more than the truth combined with the way he accused me of something and snipped my explanation from the post he quoted simply didn't add up. But I didn't see any reason for any townie or scum to make a post that bad on purpose. Now I do. SP had been the subject of little debate, but from what I can tell most people had a town read on him. As scum, he won't be dying tonight or during any night. How does he explain that when someone brings it up? He manufactures a case that is so bad that people will become wary of him and it will make sense when he doesn't die. How can we tell that he purposely made the case to be bad instead of convincing? See both my and Sloosh's posts about his case. He changes his views he's held the entire game, misrepresents reality, cuts parts of posts that don't fit with his case, and complete lack of follow-through are proof that he didn't really think his case would ever convince people that I'm scum. There's also the subject of his case. CL has been trying to get me lynched since D1, so SP knows that at least one person will side with him no matter what. Long story short: SP is not going to die and he is almost certainly scum. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
I'll almost certainly be back because an easy lynch like me in LYLO is pretty nice for scum. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
As I wrote earlier, I'm pretty sure SP is scum, and his lack of scum hunting while under suspicion pretty much seals my vote. There is no reason for a townie in LYLO to only defend himself. His only goal this cycle seems to have been to keep himself from being lynched, which seems much more of a scum goal at this point. As scum, it can't hurt and you also can't slip and give away your scumbuddy. ##Vote: ShiaoPi | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
gg guys | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
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