TL Mafia LIV

On May 03 2012 08:39 Katina wrote:
Mr. Blazinghand I say this once and once only. I'm not mafia. Point your Blazinghand at someone who actually deserves it.

On May 06 2012 03:48 marvellosity wrote:
Sup l10f.



Let's kinda point some fingers... but not call someone scummy at the same time. Let's discuss things, yay!



Fluffy apology. Summary summary summary. Fingerpointing followed by some nice unprovable speculation about the BM lynch.

Anything concrete to say?

On May 05 2012 05:10 layabout wrote:
Katina has made posts indicative of intelligence.

I do not think we should lynch katina.

Do other people think that this is BS?

On May 05 2012 05:43 layabout wrote:
Katina few posts have been critical of the disruptive play at the beginning, and acted to stamp out the bad.


Katina Implies that the "blub scumslip affair" is stupid (it was) by implying that the accusations are rather hastily made (which further implies that they are poorly thought out)


katina points out that BH is being a big drama queen.


Katina points out that the game is hours old and that there has not been time to contribute in response to BH's vote on her for not contributing.


Criticises grush for sheeping a baseless vote.

Points out how destructive the "lets all vote for no real reason" is and tells the perpetrators to stop.

If Katrina does anything suspicious it is the way in which she puts attention on BM. She tells us that he tend to lurk when he is mafia that he posted earlier and is now lurking. He isn't lurking at the moment. Lurking is playing passively, posting infrequently or posting with consistently low content. BM is inactive in this game since these are his only posts:

+ Show Spoiler +
Both of which of from the very beginning of the game

On May 05 2012 05:49 layabout wrote:
Look how few votes the candidate have

Look how weak the cases are

Look how easily the 5 player scumteam could swing the vote

See how unlikely we are to hit mafia

Lynch a player that will be anti town either way.
Vote BillMurray

On May 07 2012 02:18 ghost_403 wrote:
I have a confession: I can't actually read.

On May 07 2012 04:23 Eiii wrote:
l10f just jumps on the layabout train and posts a bunch of stuff that're basically exact copies of cases others have made before him (specifically Sinensis). Memetoss hasn't really changed much in my book-- it's worth noting that he copies sinensis' layabout case as well, though that seems less like a pretending-to-contribute thing and more like a jumping-on-the-bandwagon thing since his posts otherwise seem significant enough. For now, I don't want to lynch him anymore because yesterday's flips made some people look really bad (aka layabout).

On david vs panda: I dunno. Both have been pretty inconsequential this game from my perspective, so they'd be better to shoot if anything.


So anyway, I'm going to vote for layabout. All the other accusations are good, but one thing most people are missing is that if we had lynched BM and the modkills hadn't happened, we'd be completely lost right now. Lynching a lurker who had done almost literally nothing because he 'might hurt town' gives us zero information. We'd all still be running around in the chaos of day one on day two if kat/206 hadn't fucked up. Between that and the kat defense, I'm throwing my vote on him. If lay flips red then marvel is worth looking at just because of being so associated with both layabout and kat day one.

On May 07 2012 06:13 PaqMan wrote:
I'm taking my vote off NT for now.

+ Show Spoiler [I10f] +

On May 07 2012 10:06 johnnywup wrote:
Like I said, I've been super addicted to this 999 game and I'll be putting a LOT more time into this game. I've been alt tabbing and reading what's going on, to keep up (I guess you can call that lurking but I've just been wanting to get all 6 endings to this game asap, but i'll town it down and be more active in thread now that I see it's an issue). If you don't believe me, fine. I don't care. It's the truth. And so, I'll be posting more now, since people are thinking I'm scummy and lurky :u

On May 08 2012 06:32 Mementoss wrote:
Also cheers to I10f, Nova_Terra, and Paqman for wasting there votes!

Aka, voting someone who has no chance of getting lynched and not trying to actively push that player, or convince anyone else why they are scum/to vote them. I guess having your vote have no influence on the outcome at all is good for keeping away from a WIFOM vote analysis paper trail. >_>

On May 09 2012 07:05 Blazinghand wrote:


Ah, that's interesting, May 9th Nova_Terra! However, I have another player here who disagrees with you.

His name is May 7th Nova_Terra! You should argue with him:

On May 08 2012 11:56 PaqMan wrote:
I'm confident that layabout is scum and I want him lynched tomorrow.

On May 09 2012 20:27 marvellosity wrote:


Also here you completely forgo mentioning layabout. Apparently you have nothing to say on one of the main lynch candidates.

On May 10 2012 04:52 layabout wrote:
froggynoddy you are now confirmed town
so my scumteam is in here:
grush57
l10f
Eiii
papapanda

On May 10 2012 01:17 Eiii wrote:


But you voted for me on day 2

On May 11 2012 13:01 Sinensis wrote:
l10f is suspicious too to me but it's more subtle than papapanda. Plus it was layabout's dying wish that some kind of investigation be had of l10f... I just can't think of anything solid right now.

More on this later.

On May 11 2012 22:27 Mementoss wrote:
I10f has't even talked about half the people on his list in the whole game. The way that list was contstructed is pretty much a secret other than Eiii being top with grush and Marv. But there is barely any cases about grush and Marv from I10f's filter of 1 page.

Since how did froggy become super townie all of a sudden. What the hell has he even done?

Please read his filter BH. There is so many ridiculous statements. I'll point out a few.



I know this isn't much. But for a "townie" being completely free and apparently reading the thread. His filter is 1 pages and lackluster.



There is no way for him to know this. He is distancing himself from the townie lynch here. Never explains why he doesn't find N_T or blubb scummy. I think he has been distancing himself from townie lynches all game actually.

No vote day 1.
Eiii Day 2.
Grush day 3.



Doesn't ever explain why N_T is not scum. And this tone just seems like he pulled out a random name. Then writes a 2 line reason why.



Hes been so easy to push that he has been second in line for lynch every day. But never dies. So easy eh?



I dont post cases cuz im bad. (using the newb card) I read cases and pick the case that is on a townie. If that is to obvious I just vote for someone random and be the only person voting him.

Again WHY do you not think nova is scum.

Gut feeling is for scum. It's used when you have no fucking explanation for your actions and are to scared to say scummy shit and get caught.



This is a bit late from early game to be saying "Im town" for no reason. Hes not even suspected here. But I think its the third time in the thread where he throws in a "Im town" for good measures. Or a face to make people like him -_______________________-

Also the second part is so so so scummy. I haven't done anything to make anyone think im scum. What. So your purposely not doing anything and being safe so you don't look scummy? At least you have done that? You haven't done anything.

And again how do you know your right, that scum is in Eiii/marv/grush good thing you gave three options, for an out when one of them flips town.

I already explained why the list is scummy. Also BH made some good points on why the list is awful. If I10f is scum, he strategically placed people that are most likely to die tonight (mementoss, BH) and strategically placed his scum buddy around 4-7 after a couple mislynches so town would lose in the MLYL.

N_T I10f scum team.

On May 11 2012 21:50 Mementoss wrote:


Wait,wait,wait,wait what?!

Does anyone else not see this.

1 is most likely scum and 11 is most likely town.

So he thinks Me, BH, and froggy are more town then HIMSELF. WHEN HE KNOWS HIS OWN ROLE. WTF? If he was actually town he would be 100% confirmed town on his own list.

This is a scum slip.

If I10F is scum, scum most likely lies between number 4 and number 7.

On May 11 2012 18:48 Blazinghand wrote:


Right now we're 9-2, right? 8-2 after scum shoots. If we mislynch and scum shoots again, we're 6-2, then if we mislynch and scum shoots again, we're at 4-2, which is MYLO.

Assuming there aren't any more vigis (which I believe is fair; any vigis would have shot N1 or N2), and we don't get any medic saves, we have 2 mislynches before MYLO.

Also, assuming scum start by shooting the towniest players (though they'll probably spare me in hopes of hitting a medic or DT, or because they're worried I'm Medicced) and not making things easy on us, here's what your list says:

"I think we should lynch Eiii, Marv, then Grush. If none of those guys are scum, we lose"

well, let's say one of those 3 is scum. then you're saying

"I think we should lynch Eiii, marv, Grush, then Panda. If only one or if none of those gus are scum, we lose. I'm not even gonna consider the scumminess of N_T"

As a final note, you have definitely pointed out several players you think are townier than yourself, tipping your hand to the scumteam. Why not just mention your 3-4 biggest scumreads? like "hey guys I know we're all up on grush but there weren't significant wagons on Eiii or marv and I think those guys are scum"

Like, this was possibly the worst way to share your reads with the town.

On May 12 2012 01:48 Blazinghand wrote:
Since, you know, he's suddenly started acting like scum.

On May 12 2012 02:02 Eiii wrote:

Didn't you read his 100% objective list?! He's like, 8th.
list doesn't lie bro

On May 12 2012 05:43 marvellosity wrote:
Ok, regarding Nova_Terra. He's not really posted anything, except for being even more scummy.



Lends his support to a terrible plan based on lynching people with no cases made. Lest we forget, Nova's main read is apparently on papapanda. Which seemingly leads to this afterthought:



Realises he forgets to mention his main 'scumread'. Just all kinds of bad because he's lending tacit support to lynching Eiii first, for absolutely no discernable reason.

On grush: I can't get over where he posted that he saw no reason to post until someone made a case on him. The anti-town sentiment there is just astonishing. So he lurks, doesn't scumhunt (because he doesn't feel the need? seriously, wtf), and only comes out the woodwork to defend himself. The irony is that he doesn't defend himself at all, he just posts crap. I think this guy is pretty scummy.

At the moment his case, though, is superceded by l10f's. What distinguishes l10f and grush is that l10f actually seems pretty capable of logical thought - his posts are arrogant and dismissive, as opposed to grush's headless chicken/ostrich approach. Mementoss, your whole case on him is pretty sound. The list is just all kinds of bad, pushed at us like it's '100% objective' and not his opinion. The fact that he's basically claiming the list is truth when he never makes any attempt to back anything up is really scummy. I also go back to the contradiction I pointed out in my last post. He has Eiii and me as #1 and #2 for lynching, but also explains 'scum have led the mislynches we've had so far'. This statement and his list can't both be accurate, so he's been caught in his own lie.

On May 12 2012 01:38 Blazinghand wrote:


Dude, it's been like 2 nights so far. Chances are the DT or Tracker has like 2 results both of which are "not scum" and maybe 1 or more of which is someone who got modkilled. Like, if I were a DT I know that N2 I would have checked Kenpachi. Just because we haven't heard a DT or Medic roleclaim doesn't mean they're not out there trying to do good work.

Don't go fishing for claims.

And your list is dumb. Just talk about your top scumreads. If your list legitimately doesn't work if the top 2 aren't at least one scum, why ar eyou even posting the list... just talk about those two

.). <--- unicorn head

On May 13 2012 18:51 Eiii wrote:
obviously I feel l10f is pretty scummy at this point, since he's been attacking me for actions I've done that I can't really see as scummy.

Between his overnight shift into pushing me as #1 scum as hard as possible, providing arbitrary lists and calling them 100% objective, then manipulating those lists to try to get people to accept them... I dunno, it feels like he's trying to disrupt and take control of town as much as possible which is pretty sketchy when we're so close to lylo.

On May 14 2012 07:22 papapanda wrote:
Sinensis:
I am not too sure what you mean by "textbook mafia," but I'll let give part1 to you.
However, the other parts I will try again,
Part3: Oh, its not ok for grush to just ##vote name, so I'll just do the exact same thing!
Part4: I think you mistook the bulk of my post here. I made an error so I was against voting BM -> I was corrected and agreed BM looked scummy -> I voted BM, he ended up being town.
Part5: The point I was trying to make is by using N_T's own lynch-logic, N_T himself can be a great candidate.

Marvellosity:
Using information from the alignment-flip after death should only be used when the flip is red IMO. When layabout flipped green, we know that layabout does not actually HAVE information. But using Kenpachi, we know he HAS information because he is red, so obviously his suspicions can have extra meaning behind it.
When Sinensis said because layabout says so, it sounded scummy to me as layabout had no facts; Sinensis was just trying to abuse the fact that layabout is town.


My thoughts on l10f:
l10f lacks strong explanation for the people who he calls out. Looking at his list he doesn't make explanations either. He claims he is bad at scumhunting, but is good at weighing in factors made by other people(He called correctly on N_T). This allowed him to excuse himself from actively scum-hunt and avoid making mistake if he is scum.
You mentioned his inconsistency, but it looks like he really wants to lynch Eiii. His reason for calling you out is from various times when you defended people who flipped scum, and I am not sure what to make on that.
A reason I am sitting at my computer with a raised eyebrow right now is stuff like this:

Sounds like he knew he was flipping blue.

I'll keep an eye open for him(like sinensis), but I think Grush is my vote for the next day.

On May 14 2012 09:47 marvellosity wrote:
l10f, the amount of shit you're full of is remarkable.

On May 14 2012 13:41 Eiii wrote:


My gut reaction is that he's scummy because he's calling out a lot of actions of mine as scummy. I have a hard time agreeing with him, so it feels more to me like he's trying to quickly shift attention onto me using whatever means he has available than him actually scumhunting. My feelings are probably wrong. Sorry, I thought the 'obviously' I threw in at the beginning of that sentence was enough to make it clear what I was trying to convey. I wouldn't have said anything about him if you hadn't asked :s

In my defense, though, it was kind of 3am.

On May 15 2012 09:02 marvellosity wrote:
l10f - then make a consolidated case on him

On May 06 2012 03:21 Eiii wrote:


Hi there! I don't really like posting or having big discussions at night, but it seems like the rest of town doesn't feel the same way.

Well, this gets my one-post-per-cycle requirement out of the way, at least. See you in a few hours!

On May 07 2012 04:55 Eiii wrote:


zzzzz

We should *kill* the lurkers by some means. We have ways of killing that isn't a lynch! Ideally we'd shoot all the lurkers and lynch people who took scummy positions. Maximum information (which is a good thing, no matter how you spin it)! That's not always possible, though-- but to lynch a lurker day one when we had a handful of lynch candidates actually puts the town behind. Really, ask yourself. If BM had been the only death day one, where would we be right now?



What? No, I don't think you should be lynched for information at all. You should be lynched for pushing BM day one, which accomplished nothing, together with your questionable defense of kat when it wasn't clear that he'd be modkilled, like several other people have pointed out before me. The part about marvel isn't an accusation, just an observation that'll come into play if you flip red.

Since you're so interested in what my plan is if you flip green: I'll probably say 'darn' and apologize for voting for the wrong person. And you'll be dead. I'm willing to take that chance, though!

On May 08 2012 05:59 Eiii wrote:
In my experience, when people blow up under pressure like this, they're usually scum :s

On May 13 2012 18:51 Eiii wrote:


man this whole situation kind of sucks. It's impossible for me to tell if NT is just playing really really badly (suggesting lynching for information when it's been EXPLICITLY mentioned in this game that that's a horrible idea) on purpose to try to solidify his newb town claim or if he actually just has no clue what he's doing. wifom wifom wifom. weird black-and-white statements like this

are pretty retarded too, but it's the same deal there.

obviously I feel l10f is pretty scummy at this point, since he's been attacking me for actions I've done that I can't really see as scummy. Between his overnight shift into pushing me as #1 scum as hard as possible, providing arbitrary lists and calling them 100% objective, then manipulating those lists to try to get people to accept them... I dunno, it feels like he's trying to disrupt and take control of town as much as possible which is pretty sketchy when we're so close to lylo.

My late-night snap decision on the subject is that we really, really can't let plays like N_T's stand. If we still had vigs then he should outright be shot instead of lynched, but it looks like we're out of those. voting for NT.

On May 15 2012 19:01 Eiii wrote:


Sin doesn't seem to have an agenda. l10f, on the other hand, has suddenly appeared in the last two days and is trying to get people to vote his way mostly by beating people into submission with his posts-- presenting an 'objective' list and backing it up with posts like this:





Seems to me like he's trying really hard to be influential without producing a lot of solid content.