EPTNewbie Mini Mafia VI - Page 37
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omnomMuffins
United States255 Posts
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Kohbee
United States155 Posts
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
you obviously know better than literally everyone else. grats | ||
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Kohbee
United States155 Posts
On April 11 2012 11:55 omnomMuffins wrote: Okay me being totally new again... WIFOM? Wine in front of me. Someone else has to take this. Also, I would recommend making sure you have enough time in your schedule before signing up for another game. On top of that maybe reading some guides would help cause you seemed to play more on emotion than logic TBH | ||
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Solohan50
37 Posts
On April 11 2012 11:55 omnomMuffins wrote: Okay me being totally new again... WIFOM? As Kohbee said, it stands for Wine In Front of Me. It's based on the scene between Wesley and Vizzini in The Princess Bride: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=WIFOM | ||
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omnomMuffins
United States255 Posts
As I said I learned that this time, as well as the time required being much higher than I thought it would be, and while I realize you are pissed for me not realizing this beforehand, it is a newbie game made for learning. You came off as a massive dick the whole game with the attitude which makes people react in a certain way, making it impossible to actually get a neutral read, which leads to pure logic instead of being able to just get reads. When someone is a dick in a real life game, you kill them. I was just using the same rules between the two games, when they are completely different, which again, I already admitted. Notice how you made me get all defensive agin, even though the game is over. It is impossible to get a read off of anyone who has to triple read instead of just gut post since they over analyze it or get overly defensive. | ||
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omnomMuffins
United States255 Posts
On April 11 2012 12:02 Solohan50 wrote: As Kohbee said, it stands for Wine In Front of Me. It's based on the scene between Wesley and Vizzini in The Princess Bride: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=WIFOM Ty. Well clearly I just need to build up my resistance to Iocane powder. | ||
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Kohbee
United States155 Posts
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
Kohbee, I appreciate your input. | ||
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omnomMuffins
United States255 Posts
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Therapist.
United States207 Posts
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Solohan50
37 Posts
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jaj22
United Kingdom1376 Posts
On April 11 2012 11:38 omnomMuffins wrote: Out of curiosity how often do town win these? Rarely. Without meta or veteran scumhunting abilities, I think the balance is strongly against town, and scum need to screw up badly to lose. What's notable about this victory is that it had no positive blue influence. The only other newbie town victories I recall are Student Mafia (really good town play + Palmar smurf) and Newbie Mini Mafia III (blue victory). | ||
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jaj22
United Kingdom1376 Posts
On April 11 2012 10:57 KharadBanar wrote: I think this is the first time I hear anyone positively impressed by FourFace's play =P My initial thought upon seeing the kill of Night 2 in the daypost was "oh thank God they shot FourFace out of all the townies in this game". I can't tell you how hard it is to concentrate on anything productive at town if you are constantly facing that disruptive voice you can't possibly predict. It's hard to estimate how much town productivity was shot down the drain that day simply because of that fact. For what it's worth I hated his play in his previous game  This probably isn't a popular view, but I think FourFace is right that towns can suffer from being too polite, careful and reasonable. The converse is also true, but in newbie games towns tend to err on the side of caution, which make it tough to spot the (naturally cautious) scum. Unfortunately newbie towns also tend to mislynch aggressive players (eg Kohbee). | ||
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omnomMuffins
United States255 Posts
 There needs to be a balance of being aggressive, but not using obnoxious language that sets everyone on edge. Sure, town can have problems from being too polite, but the level of aggression put forward on day 1 and until Kohbee was lynched by the two of them (and myself when I got pissy at them) was so high that it was daunting to even think about posting because of their language and so on. | ||
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FourFace
701 Posts
On April 11 2012 14:51 omnomMuffins wrote: The problem IMO of being obnoxiously aggressive is that it puts everyone on the complete defensive, and makes it hard to make reads off of cadence and sentence structure because of that. Again, I have no place to talk because the only read I had about town/mafia was KB and S&B. I couldn't pick mafia out of a candy bag if they were the only kit kat There needs to be a balance of being aggressive, but not using obnoxious language that sets everyone on edge. Sure, town can have problems from being too polite, but the level of aggression put forward on day 1 and until Kohbee was lynched by the two of them (and myself when I got pissy at them) was so high that it was daunting to even think about posting because of their language and so on. man up, woman :trollface I need to read this whole thing and try to learn something from it. By the time I do the discussion will have dried out. To give me a heads up, which night-time post are you referring to when you're saying you gave yourself away, Solohan. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On April 11 2012 12:16 strongandbig wrote: I'm just not going to talk to kohbee about this game anymore. It's clear that he just wants to show how right he is, but that he's not willing to listen. GG town, really happy we won. gg man, still can't believe you came over to the lightside with less than a minute less. f5f5f5f5f5f5 syndrome... On April 11 2012 13:43 jaj22 wrote: Rarely. Without meta or veteran scumhunting abilities, I think the balance is strongly against town, and scum need to screw up badly to lose. What's notable about this victory is that it had no positive blue influence. The only other newbie town victories I recall are Student Mafia (really good town play + Palmar smurf) and Newbie Mini Mafia III (blue victory). Feels good I tell ya, with no blue actions being taken/having impact the whole game. On April 11 2012 14:31 jaj22 wrote: For what it's worth I hated his play in his previous game This probably isn't a popular view, but I think FourFace is right that towns can suffer from being too polite, careful and reasonable. The converse is also true, but in newbie games towns tend to err on the side of caution, which make it tough to spot the (naturally cautious) scum. Unfortunately newbie towns also tend to mislynch aggressive players (eg Kohbee). Yeah, we were one of those 'newbie towns' :p I didn't like Fourface's play (took it too far) but I absolutely see where you're coming from - I've replaced into Mafia LI and everyone is generally far more flippant and less reserved. | ||
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Solohan50
37 Posts
On April 03 2012 01:33 Solohan50 wrote: I find it amusing that Kohbee is sitting here telling the entire thread who is scum, based off of who voted to lynch him. I would be more worried about some of the last-minute switches than I would about the people who thought you were scum from the start. A last minute vote-switch to the Therapist bandwagon would be the perfect place for scum to hide. It gives them all the credibility in the world, even if they have to miss out on the supposed "Cop". What better way to pretend you're not scum than to say "But I saved the Cop at the end?". It makes even more sense if you think the roleclaim is false and that Kohbee is actually scum. If he is indeed scum, I'm willing to bet that his scum buddy switched vote at the last minute when he realized that the lynch vote was going to take Kohbee out first day. On top of that, Kohbee spent the whole day trying to lynch a townie. When that failed, he roleclaimed and bandwagoned a townie right at the end of the day. On top of that, the townie he lynched was one of the most vocal anti-Kohbee players in the thread short of FourFace. This seems like too big of a string of coincidences for me, which is why my vote stayed where it was, and which is why we ended up lynching a fellow townie instead of the real scum. FourFace, this is the post that I feel was the first big nail in my coffin. I jumped the gun on this in a couple of ways; I should've posted this on Day 2, after you showed up dead. My whole intention was to frame Kohbee for your murder, so posting anything super accusatory before my plan was completely was foolish (turns out the plan sucked anyway, but that's besides the point). Secondly, I should've put more thought into that post. I typed and sent it off without much review, hence the strange wording and haziness of the main argument. | ||
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Kohbee
United States155 Posts
Day 1 Day 1 started with Fourface's trolling plan. Nothing of game value was posted so anyone wanting to do scum hunting had to read solely into the tone of everyone's posting and not on the agenda behind it. I picked up on Hiropro here because his attempts to troll seemed forced and really well thought out. When I brought this discovery to light in the thread and voted for Hiropro's lynch. Therapist, not seeing things the same way I did, responded immediately, 2 posts after, that I was wrong and voted me. Because of this, Hiropro was never forced to respond for himself, and this pissed me off. This kind of soft defense in my mind spoke to two different options. The first is that therapist is defending his scum buddy and the second is that scum therapist knows hiropro is town and thinks he will gain town cred saving him. Other than this I cannot think of a good reason why a townie would defend someone over 1 vote early on day 1. Basically this is me not following my own advice of not expecting people to act the "right" way. This is why I called him scum and didn't want to talk to him. Hiropro seeing that Therapist, Strongandbig, and even KB (to a lesser extent) defending him was able to answer my pressure calmly and sensibly. Fourface sums it up nicely *here* and is extremely logical about the entire situation. Wait what, yes, yes I did just call Fourface posting logical. As the day progressed I saw that my voting of hiropro was going no where. If I had pushed it any harder people would have jumped on me harder and the last thing I wanted to do was get lynched as a cop. Hiropro also started sheeping me. This was another reason why I had to call him town so that I could continue getting him to vote with me. Then, towards the end of day 1 fourface and strongandbig are back voting for me again. Omnom's vote is based on fourface being an "asshole" and hiro and KB are with me on therapist. Seeing that there are 2 hours left, and I am a blue, I do what I believe is the only thing I have left, which is claim my role. All of a sudden the thread explodes, Marvel votes therapist, fourface switches to marvel, and I am saved. In all honesty when Therapist flipped town I wanted to post "and nothing of value was lost" but that would got me insta-lynched day 2 for being "aggressive". Night 1 During the night I knew I wasn't going to be able to check anyone. You can see I tried to check hiropro, solohan and omnom LOL. I posted all my reads knowing I was going to be on the chopping block the next day. Marvel made a really really really good (yes I'm saying good things about you Marvel) post *here*. Then a bunch of nonsense was posted (i did like my post *here*) Then, at the top of page 22, hiropro posted that my reads were getting way worse. This is actually what opened my eyes to what was really going on. This was the best exchange for me in the whole thread and even though he was scum, this was extremely helpful. Then, Omnom and me started. To be honest I have no idea what I did to piss Omnom off so terribly, however Omnom's huge post began with a completely emotion based attack on me and fourface. Calling my actions unjustified (when I explained every one of them) and calling me albert (aka stupid IDC how you explain it, this is the truth). When you slander me and call me stupid, I am not going to react politely to you. I also was misguided by the emotion of the moment to the point I did actually think you were scum. This is an internet forum in a game of lying. To expect people to believe that you were gone all that time without question is bullshit. You were a lurker, like it or not, and did not put in the same effort as others into this game. You made it next to impossible to get a read on you which is inherently anti-town and you voted based off emotion which was anti-town as well. I understand now that you really didn't have the time for this, and that is completely fine, but to tell me and fourface to shut up, because we were 1000x more active then you was not smart and not logical for forum mafia. Remember, you didn't believe I was cop, why should i have to believe you were actually not able to post? Day 2 Fourface dies. He probably would have done really well this game so thats sad. I started off continuing my emotional stupidity voting omnom (see I call myself stupid too). Then we argue a little more and Omnom *townslips* and I stubbornly ignore it at that exact moment. Then Strongandbig and Marvel post cases on me (I broke down why they were bad *here*). To be completely honest in retrospect I should have been tipped off by this effort to scumhunt. However, at the time I was blinded by how not great the cases were, yet they were gaining traction. I played extremely poorly at the beginning of day 2. I posted petty meaningless shit just to prove people wrong or hypocritical. I was completely blinded by my disgust with the faulty logic being used against me. This all changed *here*. KB ninja'd the shit outta me with his awesome post but for me, this was when I started thinking logically. The worst thing was that I had a massive post on why hiropro was scum (I detailed it out in the obs qt) but I knew that calling him scum when he was voting with me on someone I had as 100% scum was probably not the best way to get mafia lynched lol. From this point forward I tried to convince people to vote with me on solohan. Unfortunately people were pretty tied to their "first mafia reads". I tried to argue why I was a bad lynch logically, and why solohan was scum logically. Both failed pretty hard. In all honesty Omnom was right in one respect in that I didn't have anyone's trust, which for a person like me who tries to take a lot of the emotion out of this game means very little. In retrospect, idk if I woulda changed much but I may have kept it in mind when trying to argue day 2. I knew I was about to get lynched. In this time I was completely torn between Marvel and Hiropro to be solohan's scum buddy. Marvel was the one I decided on more outta rage then outta logic. Once again I did something stupid cause of emotions. I get lynched. I lol @ the bad. I sad @ KB cause I know he's gon die. Nigh 2/Day 3/Night 3 I group these together cause nothing really happened. KB got shot which meant Solohan HAD to be lynched. He flipped scum (shock!) Then night 3 hiropro killed omnom. To be honest I think he shoulda no-killed or killed marvel. Day 4 The entire day rested on Strongandbig deciding which argument to side with. The day looked like the cliche example of 2 people fighting over ownership of a dog by calling its name. I have said a bunch of times, I think strongandbig basically flipped a coin with who he was voting for because both sides brought such weak arguments to the table from his prospective. To be honest I would have liked strong to take a stance using his own argument and case, instead of just choosing between the 2. I don't mean this disrespectfully but Strong seemed to take the lazy way out (just choosing to follow 1 persons lead instead of coming to the decision on his own). In the end Strong made the right decision to win the game. hurray! Individual Breakdowns Therapist - You were looking for the wrong qualities in mafia. Ironically you ended up defending one to the point that it got you lynched. Early votes provoke discussion and pressure people into talking, which is always a good thing. The early vote on hiropro should not have cleared me as town, but it did not deserve the response you and others gave. Grade - D Fourface - You actually played very well this game. You made yourself clearly town, and occasionally posted logically sound shit. If you would drop the crazy side to you and just play straight up I think you could become a very very very good player. Grade - B+ Kohbee - I learned a lot from this game. First and foremost I need to calm down when being accused regardless of how terrible I think the argument against me is. There are so many unnecessary posts from me in this game. However me, KB and at the very end Marvel are why town won this game. Grade - A- KharadBanar - At first I thought you were stupid townie. Then you came through with amazing logic and reads. Town's MVP for sure and by far the best player in this game IMO. Grade - A+ Solohan50 - Meh. You needed to get involved more. You only focused on basically nothing, and would almost always de-lurk immediately when called out. Grade - D Omnommufins - You played this game like it was IRL mafia. This was your first and biggest mistake. While I have never played IRL mafia, I would be willing to beat its a lot less competitive and a lot more about the good time playing. I don't know how to grade your play because I don't think that you had the time or the right mindset for forum mafia. I don't know how to suggest improvement other than to point you to guides about forum mafia and suggesting that next time you play you make sure your schedule allows it and that you basically forget everything you know about IRL mafia. Grade - I (incomplete) HiroPro - Up until the last day you played flawlessly. However you never really came out of your shell to try and show your towniness. Even up until the last minute you kinda had a nonchalant "im right" attitude which carried you to a last day lylo. If you had came at marvel with a fury on the last day I fully believe you would have won. You also realized early on that you need to separate yourself form Solohan, which I believe you did very well. Grade - A- marvellosity - In retrospect, you did not play nearly as bad as I had remembered. You had a number of good posts, but you also lived and died by WIFOM logic. I would suggest you to stop predicting mafia action, and especially to stop using it as your argument to the rest of town. I know that you figured out hiropro at then end, but I hope that you understand you did not do an exceptional job of either proving you were town (so that SB could see your logic) or proving that Hiropro was scum. Grade - A- strongandbig - I honestly didn't see too much of value to take away from this game. You basically saw me as aggressive, and equated that to scum (big no-no). After this you got stubborn, refused to listen to me, and saw all of my actions and posts through clouded lenses. I don't know how exactly you came to your final decision, but congrats it was a good one, and for that I can't grade you too low. Grade - C | ||
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