EPTcan i be a replacement?
Student Mafia (New/Newish players welcome)
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
can i be a replacement? | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
I will post some detailed thoughts in the morning good job so far though | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
xtfftc: has made some glaring contradictions and that he owes and explanation Grackaroni highlighted this in an earlier post and i think you (xtfftc) need to expalin: I've posted more on Jay, look at Day 1 but it's mostly one off remarks (such as pointing out how Jay justified not voting for a lurker by saying that we shouldn't lynch a lurker because a lurker isn't around to defend himself) and I don't see how the last quote was me suggesting that he is probably town. It was me pointing out the scumminess of EY's reasoning, and at that moment it was to be expected that mafia would jump on the Jay bandwagon. At the moment I think that Jay is more likely to be scum because if he's not, we have EY, xsk, and Adam left, and I consider Adam to be the worst lynch out of the players I am suspicious of (Adam, Jay, EY, xsk, BKE) you explicity state that you think Jay is the most likely to be scum and grack makes this point On December 09 2011 10:16 Grackaroni wrote: Show nested quote + Here he even admits that Jay is more likely to be scum but his vote still remains on Ey215. . . I stated my reasons for keeping my vote on EY. Your reasoning is pure WIFOM in this case. Jay was obviously going to be lynched hours before I posted the bit you quoted, so what could a townie do in this situation? Vote for Jay and be accused of sheeping after BH and bandwagonning (remember Tunkeg and his analysis of the Bbyte lynch?) Or vote for someone else and be accused of not voting for the obvious mafia. you call his "reasoning" (i see a simple statement of fact) "pure WIFOM" well where is the pure wifom in this? On December 08 2011 06:45 xtfftc wrote: You lynch your best read. You don't start looking for excuses for when the player you're voting for flips town. You didn't want to get into the "pissing match" with BH, you were forced to by his aggressiveness. And using lurking as a proof that you haven't been staying under the radar is a pretty solid point if you're building a case against yourself. You were out of the picture when every good mafia wants to be: during the last ~12 hours before the deadline, so you did a great job. I answered to him after he mentioned me and I don't see how his death changes anything. What is there to be said about EB? His play was arrogant and trollish. He was obviously a veteran smurfing, who thought it would be fun to frustrate the townies (refusing to vote just when he was asked to the most active player in the game just because he felt like irritating us) and then giving us a great demonstration of how a town player has to prove his innocence when attacked. He posted a great case that lacked obvious flaws - and then he was happy to go inactive again. He came back to announce that he's found the whole mafia team - but didn't bother providing any analysis on two of the players he accused. And he also made sure to notify us that the Bbyte lynch was pushed easily... Before the game started (and also in the Looking For Coaches thread) some veterans suggested that there should be some experienced players in this game to help teach the newbies how to play properly. Instead we get a cocky smurf. There was no way to make a good guess about his intentions, which is the reason why I'm not all over Hassy at the moment. EB was good enough to make us do anything he wanted to as long as he was interested in putting a serious effort in the game, and I have no reason to believe that his intentions were pro-town, even after his flip. Ask veterans such as Sandroba and Palmar and they will tell you that the first thing a townie should do is to establish his/her innocence. The first thing EB did was to frustrate town and lose us half a day. So what good would it do to town to focus on him again instead of doing our own analysis? All you're achieving with this is disruping the discussion. you have stated that you should only vote for mafia and that you should lynch your best read and yet in the above quote you do not do that here earlier you didn't On December 06 2011 06:20 xtfftc wrote: Pretty much all I have on Adam is based on two of his posts that push pro-mafia agenda. Now that I think about it, I have a much stronger case on ey215, even though I decided to leave him for day 2. I don't have enough to convince Adam on my own and it seems that most of the others are happy to lurk or to vote for lynching Bbyte. Here's what I wrote on Adam earlier in case you're lazy and can't be bothered to check it out: + Show Spoiler + I'll check the thread again before going to bed. you have a strong case on a player but you would rather not post it and you would rather vote for someone other than your best read? seriously? so you vote for BByte On December 06 2011 07:26 xtfftc wrote: I'm going to bed, so I'm voting for Bbyte. It's not ideal but it's better than some unpleasant last minute surprise. ##Unvote: xsksc ##Vote: BByte why? "its better than a last minute suprise" you just jump on a bandwagon On December 09 2011 05:24 xtfftc wrote: Yes, albeit a short one that doesn't cover some bits. I feel uneasy about the way no one objects on lynching Jay. It feels like Day 1 all over again, which makes me wonder whether Jay might actually be town - even though mafia are probably just bussing him at this point. So my vote stays on EY to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team and not just one member of it. another contradiction it also doesn't make sense that "to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team" could be a reason for a vote i also think your case against eye is weak i shall soon explain why. | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 11 2011 02:29 BroodKingEXE wrote: I do not have anymore time to defend myself as I need to study for finals. I urge everyone to come up with a plan when I do not turn up mafia. I say do not blame the players that created the case against me, but blame the people who used their cases and did not check for errors. I need to develop my skills about gathering evidence in the game and was not active enough in the scum hunt. I know that the case against me was pretty solid though, as I was not good in double checking my evidence. Well,GG BroodKingEXE we still have time do not martyr yourself now if you are town try to contribute and then the things you have said can be considered if you flip town or try to contribute and find us a scum or two to lynch instead there is also enough time for you to write a reasonable defence | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 09 2011 02:06 Tunkeg wrote: Probability lynch I think probability should be discussed more before going into a day 2 lynch. Some of you may call this WIFOM and just ignore it, and probably it is somewhat WIFOM, because it involves alot of speculating. we would be right in calling it wifom because it is, speculating isn't helpful is is only marginally better than RNGing votes by pointing out that it may be wifom and not useful he has provided an excuse in case he is called out on using poor logic.If you are trying to help town then why would you make a post full of logic that you think can and possibly should be ignored. A townie cannot help town if people ignore them they also cannot be lynched. Being ignored does not help people scumhunt The first thing I will speculate about is number of scum involved in the lynch on BByte. As I've mentioned before I belive the probability that 2 scums joined in on the lynch is the biggest: so what? we still don't know,there are either 0 scum 1 scum or 2 scum and we have no way of knowing with any certainty which is the correct number so this assumption very unreliable if you allowed to speculate: well yes you are but it is not helpful! you make the assumption that scum were trying to secure the lynch on Bbyte but it is also possible that the lynch was entirely down to town and you then decide that in your opinion 0 scum would be unlikely. This is complete guessworkand it is not helpful to speculate about mafia's actions in such a fashion.It is pure wifom and such not be taken seriously As I belive BH and Velinath is the most green out of these (as of now) I will leave them out. And I will also leave myself out. This leads me to believe that there is 2 scum out of xsksc, gracken, ey215 and xtfftc. Seeing that ey215 and xtfftc is attacking eachother, and the way they are attacking eachother I don't see it as likely that they both are scum. Seeing that Grackorini is somewhat joining in on xtfftc's analyses: based on nothing but the unreliable thought that 2 scum voted for bbyte you then decide that because you think it is likely (which it isnt) you then omit your two best town reads (which have not been comprehensively justified and who could still be scum) and omit yourself (which is not consistant if you are looking at probabilities but is understandable) and decide that we should lynch from the 4 others who lynched bbyte. because you think that 2/3 scum would vote for the lynched townie on day1 you are assuming that bbytes alignment and flip makes the player that voted for him more likely to be scum but it just doesn't. And therefor I don't think both of them are scum. he assumes that the above statement means that they both can't be scum, this s somewhere between bad logic and wifom xtfftc have been voting on xsksc and had him as one of those he suspects as scum throughout the game. I don't think both of them are scum. for almost the same bad reason he assumes that xtfftc and xsksc(me) cannot both be scum So this leads me to think that the most probable scum pairings of those in on the BByte lynch is: xsksc(Starshard)/Grackorini xsksc (Starshard)/ey215 Grackorini/xtfftc the unreasonable ruling out of two scum pairings doesn't even have any relevance to his point. I say we should lynch anyone of these four, it would give us a high probability for actually killing a scum player. this last part is amusing because the chance of scum is either 0% 25% or 50% and i dont like those chances especially when they are based upon unreasonable and not useful speculation. You recommendation is more likely to lynch a townie and that would benefit mafia. I do not see how what you are recommending benefits town in anyway it would only serve to further a mafia agenda. the points i have added have been italicised (for clarity) and underlined (for my ego)+ Show Spoiler + actually it was also for clarity + Show Spoiler + this joke was for my ego i really think that the shoddy reasoning in this yourcould be an attempt at trying to hurt town/ help mafia. i think that tunkeg could be a good lynch candidate unless he can explain himself. if you have a town read on him then why do you think that he would behave this way? i strongly recommend you review your stance | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
BKEXE if you are town please help!! because lynching a town today would really hurt our chances and people have so confidently voted for you they have barely been posting there has been very little discussion so far and so a mislynch would make today a huge waste of time that could have been spent scumhunting | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
it was stupid | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
replace stupid with unreasonable | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
my take the bbyte lynch: it was not a great lynch because the reasons given for voting for him were weak and his behaviour did not make him seem likely to be scum. but it was a day1 lynch and he was lurking and i do not think it is reasonable to expect to lynch mafia on day1, he was lurking and there weren't strong cases for alternate candidates. so i accept that you all lynched him do i believe that 0,1,2,3, scum voting for him was equally probable? no. do i believe a specific circumstance say 1 scum is more likely? no because we do not know who the mafia are and we do not know how they think or what their plan for the game is. the only things we know are that they are in the thread they win when they are equal or greater in number to town. the rest of our information comes from the thread from what we read in the thread. any thoughts or suspicions about what the mafia will do are of very limited usefullness because speculation about how mafia will leads to "circular reasoning that results from trying to determine the choices of an opponent who acted with full knowledge that their behavior would be subject to scrutiny."(from mafiawiki) this is why your guess is unreasonable mafia know that people may look at voting patterns and so they can try to act unlike what you expect or like what you expect because they expect you to expect them to act unlike how you would expect them to. trying to follow through such reasoning is unhelpful as it leads nowhere and as such reasoning dependent on the expected behaviour of the mafia has no value + all of the stuff about poker is useless fluff + calling my post desperate do not address the point i made instead you are asking me to explain myself but you have not justified your actions which were anti-town and supported by poor assumptions | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
if they were your town reads they should be included but you could argue that because you think that their behaviour is town-like and that they would be the worst lynch choices on the list you should not exempt them becuase that defeatd the point of lynching players who voted for a town because for some (bad) reason you think 2 of the total players voting for that town should be mafia because that is what you expect mafia to do. by eliminating players from the total you eliminate potential mafia and further reduce your chance of hitting scum. (which was 50% in the optimal situation) | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
so i decided to see why, you made a post in which you began by saying people would ignore you and then went on to make worthless speculation and unjustified assumptions i feel that i have highlighted why this is this case very clearly i cannot believe that you have not adressed any of my arguements but have instead tried to attack my possible motivation and you have mostly just provided fluff It was based on assumptions, poor is your words. But the entire game is based on assumptions. justify them then!don't just say i made assumptions we need to in this game that is an entirely worthless statement as was your poker "analogy" you just make general statement about making reads and how reads are more valuable the more time passes. This has nothing to do with what you had written if you make an argument based on reasoning then you better have solid reasoning because otherwise your post holds no weight it is not helpful to town (unless it reveals that you are scum) because your entire argument relies on reason that does not withstand scrutiny i think we are past the point of this being a useful exchange because you clearly don't understand or are ignoring the point that i have made explain yourself and then try to help town by analysing behaviour | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
. I believed that lynch went as it did because scum players jumped on the bandwagon, /facepalm | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
First of, nice to see you being active. Secondly - the answer to your question is in the very post you have quoted. It is pure WIFOM because the logic behind the vote I am accused for can apply to both mafia and town: why are you trying to add wifom logic? if jay was your best read which you said he was then you should have voted for him, you even said so the fact that you didn't and the fact that you had already said that players in general should lynch their best read is highly contradictory. how does that involve wifom? And anyway, jumping on a bandwagon is another thing that 3/4 of the town is much guiltier than I am of, yet you only attack me for this. Why would you do such a thing? I was pretty much the only one to try to push for a lynch that was based on analysis, yet you target me for "jumping" on a bandwagon? i attack you because you were happy to be on a day1 bandwagon but on day two when their was a much stronger case for a player being mafia and when you openly stated that you that that player was probably scum and yet you decided to vote for somebody else. and one of the reasons you gave was to "avoid sheeping". yet you had already been on a andwagon. I did post it hours before posting the bit you quoted. Seriously. the bit i quoted was dated for me as "On December 06 2011 06:20 xtfftc wrote:" before then this is everthing you had to say on eye215: + Show Spoiler + 100% agree, this was pretty much my point anyway. And there's a lot of similar views expressed later in the thread by others, so can we say that we've reached consensus? If we don't get a good case, we lynch a lurker. Dude, no need to be so defensive. Blazinghand is trying hard to organise the town. I don't agree with some of his ideas but they are stuff to be discussed. There is absolutely no need for a townie to react like you did. Blazing's play so far is great. On December 04 2011 21:23 xtfftc wrote: ......what? So we all agree that lurking is bad for town. No one denies that. We need all townies to post, so that mafia are pressured into we're able to distinguish town from mafia. And then you express your concerns that if we somehow manage to get all townies to post, we would have trouble figuring out "the scum lurkers over the town lurkers"... If they don't lurk, we are going to have reads on them and figure out their alignment. No townie would suggest that this is a bad thing. It works but I think it's better if you have ¤tpage=All at the end of each link ey215 I'm still not happy with and it wasn't just his defense that made me suspicious. But perhaps I am tunneling him a bit too much indeed. Unless he proves me wrong, he's going to be my main target on Day 2. if this was the case against eye215 before that you are refering to. i just didn't veiw it as a case because it just isn't. However, how come you quoted just half of my explanation? This is the full one: your argument is that you could as a player who could be town or mafia vote the best lynch candidate (like the majority of players) and be accused of sheeping, or vote for someone who isn't obviuos mafia but because you have the same options as town or mafia then you could take the second and anti-town option because you could have done so with either alignment? as town you should take the pro-town (and non-contradictory) option because that is pro town play. you acted i an anti-town fashion and your justification is just a statement of options, which isn't a justification. even though mafia are probably just bussing him at this point. So my vote stays on EY to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team and not just one member of it. Of course it does make sense. We had the whole town sheeping for Day 1 and Day 2, so it is necessary to have proper discussions from now on.And what it is that I am guilty of exactly? Are you suggesting that I was trying to somehow save Jay by refusing to vote for him, even though there were like 10 votes for him a few hours before the deadline? so now your reason was for discussion? you don't leave your vote for discussion you vote for mafia! you know this but you didn't do it your behaviour is totally contradictory and you are just trying to hide it by bringing up wifom and discussion which are inexcusable reasons for placing a vote jay had 7 votes and refusing to vote for him given the opinions that you had expressed does not make sense from a town-based standpoint. scumhunting for the next day's vote is one thing but to intentionally waste your vote or try to make people vote for someone other that the best candidate is scummy.were you trying to save jay?i can't say, but you definitely were not trying to lynch him. even though mafia are probably just bussing him at this point. So my vote stays on EY to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team and not just one member of it. does anybody in this game think that that makes any sense and is a reasonable thing for town to do??? | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
I never said that Jay was my best read. I said I consider a mafia team consisting of Jay, BKE, and EY or xsk more likely than the alternative. And I already explained the WIFOM perspective to you 've posted more on Jay, look at Day 1 but it's mostly one off remarks (such as pointing out how Jay justified not voting for a lurker by saying that we shouldn't lynch a lurker because a lurker isn't around to defend himself) and I don't see how the last quote was me suggesting that he is probably town. It was me pointing out the scumminess of EY's reasoning, and at that moment it was to be expected that mafia would jump on the Jay bandwagon. At the moment I think that Jay is more likely to be scum because if he's not, we have EY, xsk, and Adam left, and I consider Adam to be the worst lynch out of the players I am suspicious of (Adam, Jay, EY, xsk, BKE) liar liar liar you say you are uneasy about the lynch being easily decided but feeling uneasy when facing uncertainty is not a reason to not follow the obvious course of action. If you had genuine reservations about what was happening you should have tried to come up with a better alternative and you should not have tried to pursue a worse course of action because doing so is anti-town. additionaly i have already explained that the wifom perspective is not relevant so an explanation of it is similarly worthless posting that looks like a contribution (which in itself is scum like). This isn't enough for early Day 1 it isn't a case!!!you have not shown why his actions would be anti town and why they would make him likey to be scum. You are a liar. I wasn't happy to be on the Day 1 bandwagon and it is obvious from all the effort I put in my attempts to prevent it. And where is my motive for not voting for Jay? Seriously? If I'm mafia, what is my motive? Are you saying that I knew that someone was mafia and outright refused to vote for him in order to look more suspicious after the red flip? Did I try to save Jay by not voting? Anyone with half a brain would know that he was dead a few hours into Day 2 - and yet I decided not to switch to him for ~36 hours in order to gain absolutely nothing out of it? i fail to see how i have "lied" im not suggesting a motive i suggesting that your actions are anti town, trying to come up with a motive in this circumstance is unreliable and unhelpful + Show Spoiler + On December 06 2011 07:26 xtfftc wrote: I'm going to bed, so I'm voting for Bbyte. It's not ideal but it's better than some unpleasant last minute surprise. ##Unvote: xsksc ##Vote: BByte As for the rest of your post, it's a gameplay opinion that I disagree with. But even though I think that you are wrong, I can see your point. All I have to add on the subject is that I explained my vote at the time and no one had an issue with it, so I think that the problem is in you - or you're trying to turn it into a problem because of your red alignment. the game play opinion is that you should act in the best interest of town and that you should vote for the player you th ink most likely to flip scum. my point is that YOU also said that this is how you SHOULD vote and yet YOU HAVE NOT done.so | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
best try to get someone else lynched rather than do that. SCUM | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
but right now i think that 1 player is not making sense and that their behaviour is scummy therefore ##Vote: xtfftc | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 12 2011 03:58 Tunkeg wrote: lol @ layabout. You are quite a piece of work, you come out guns blazing, with purely one dimensional cases against me and then on xtfftc. Me you want to lynch based on my probability lynch, xtfftc you want to lynch based on his reasoning behind why he didn't vote jay. Sure both me and xtfftc should be looked into for beeing on the wrong side of both the lynches that have taken place. But really your stuff is just weak. The most funny though is that after you first started the case on xtfftc: + Show Spoiler + On December 11 2011 02:21 layabout wrote: i need to take some time to try to understand Broodking 's post in the meantime i think that xtfftc: has made some glaring contradictions and that he owes and explanation Grackaroni highlighted this in an earlier post and i think you (xtfftc) need to expalin: you explicity state that you think Jay is the most likely to be scum and grack makes this point you call his "reasoning" (i see a simple statement of fact) "pure WIFOM" well where is the pure wifom in this? you have stated that you should only vote for mafia and that you should lynch your best read and yet in the above quote you do not do that here earlier you didn't you have a strong case on a player but you would rather not post it and you would rather vote for someone other than your best read? seriously? so you vote for BByte why? "its better than a last minute suprise" you just jump on a bandwagon another contradiction it also doesn't make sense that "to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team" could be a reason for a vote i also think your case against eye is weak i shall soon explain why. You proceed to post this on BKE: And then you continue your case on xtfftc without adding anything to it, and then vote for him. Basically doing the same thing as he did on the jay case. Are you fucking kidding me??? I think you are trying your best to derail the BKE lynch. Your moves are truly desperate. i want you to look at this post and explain to me the errors you have made then apologise and lets move on | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 12 2011 05:11 ey215 wrote: Ok, no fancy quotes no fancy analysis but I do have some opinions to share about the last 24 hours of posts. layabout I disagree with both of your cases vehemently. Remember, Xt has spent most of the last two days trying to get me lynched, but I think his vote patterns make sense. Day one, he's right he begrudgingly voted for BByte. Day two he made a case on me and placed his vote there. While I do agree it's best for the town if his vote goes on Jaybrundage I think at least his reasoning of keeping a vote on me when it was obvious Jay was getting lynched is good reasoning. I do however have an issue with him being worried about looking like he was jumping on a bandwagon. Don't worry about what it looks like when you vote, just try to make sure the vote makes sense and is highly likely to kill scum. If anyone looks bad from yesterday's vote it's Tunkeg, however you're "case" against him is really not particularly good. Maybe it's just a misunderstanding of what he was saying, but really his poker analogy is relevant (not filler like you called it) and an approach you can take to a game of limited information. It is folly to not use all information you get when coming to an educated decision on who you are going to vote for. I do agree he was wrong in listing only certain potential duo's of scum, but not wanting to put your own name on a list like that is probably pretty understandable. I think the townies that have played best so far are those that are not playing not to get lynched, but are playing to win and I imagine (not sure) it's a common new town mistake to play the other way around so they therefore appear scummier than they really are. You could be right, one or both of those guys could be scum but those cases aren't nearly convincing enough. to clarify: i am not saying that tunkeg is scum i am not making a caes against him i was just pressuring him based of actions which i believe could only be anti-town + the analogy isn't relevant because it does not deal with the questions i asked!!! it is general garbage about mindset not an answer, that is why i deem it not relevant, a summary of his defense and actions "mafia is a guessing game im using probability, they use probability in poker and im using that similarity to compensate for the fact that my assumptions were unreasonable and i proposed we should lynch randomly into 1 of the 4 players that voted for the lynch target because i dont think the others are scum but i cant prove that and because i think that 2 scum voted for the lynch but we really have no idea how many voted for the lynch" my main problem is what he proposed and how he got there. i was not satisfied with his answer. but i think that xtfftc is very likely to be scum and that we should lynch him. bolded part: how on earth do you not see how his behaviour is contradictory? his attitudes towards the day1 and day2 lynchings are completely incompatible and not justifiable. | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
1st spoiler + explanation so if i post an entire quote and try to place it into context then "im being hard to read and scummy" and if i cut out parts not relevant to my point then im misrepresenting your post and being scummy? ...wow... I deliberately cut off the bit of wifom logic because it was totally fucking useless and was not relevant to the point i was making. On December 09 2011 05:24 xtfftc wrote: Yes, albeit a short one that doesn't cover some bits. I feel uneasy about the way no one objects on lynching Jay. It feels like Day 1 all over again, which makes me wonder whether Jay might actually be town - even though mafia are probably just bussing him at this point. So my vote stays on EY to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team and not just one member of it. your explanation for leaving your vote on eye215 makes no sense. feel free to ask your coaches if you don't believe me sencond spoiler the above quote was in this post the above quote refered to this On December 09 2011 10:16 Grackaroni wrote: Show nested quote + Here he even admits that Jay is more likely to be scum but his vote still remains on Ey215. . . I stated my reasons for keeping my vote on EY. Your reasoning is pure WIFOM in this case. Jay was obviously going to be lynched hours before I posted the bit you quoted, so what could a townie do in this situation? Vote for Jay and be accused of sheeping after BH and bandwagonning (remember Tunkeg and his analysis of the Bbyte lynch?) Or vote for someone else and be accused of not voting for the obvious mafia. i point out that grackaroni pointed out that you left your vote on eye and admitted that you thought jay was more likely to be scum than him (this have nothing to do with wifom logic) i then refer to a long post of yours in which you wrote "You lynch your best read." AND "Town votes to lynch mafia." showing that you have acted in one way yet vocally opposed it in the thread and et you have not acknowledged or explained this 3 spoiler you wrote layabout posted "you have a strong case on a player but you would rather not post it and you would rather vote for someone other than your best read? seriously?" Yet I never voted for Adam and the post layabout quoted was me saying that I don't hjave a good case on Adam. cough its bolded and underlined that you have a stronger case on eye215 cough cough its blantantly obvious that that is what i was refering too cough [QUOTE]On December 11 2011 02:21 layabout wrote: [quote] On December 06 2011 06:20 xtfftc wrote: Pretty much all I have on Adam is based on two of his posts that push pro-mafia agenda. Now that I think about it, I have a much stronger case on ey215, even though I decided to leave him for day 2. I don't have enough to convince Adam on my own and it seems that most of the others are happy to lurk or to vote for lynching Bbyte. Here's what I wrote on Adam earlier in case you're lazy and can't be bothered to check it out: + Show Spoiler + I'll check the thread again before going to bed.[/quote] + you said "i never said jay was my best read" now im fairly sure that the player you think is more like to bbe scum than all your other scum reads is your best scum read + Show Spoiler + On December 11 2011 22:56 xtfftc wrote: I never said that Jay was my best read. I said I consider a mafia team consisting of Jay, BKE, and EY or xsk more likely than the alternative. And I already explained the WIFOM perspective to you. You are a liar. I wasn't happy to be on the Day 1 bandwagon and it is obvious from all the effort I put in my attempts to prevent it. And where is my motive for not voting for Jay? Seriously? If I'm mafia, what is my motive? Are you saying that I knew that someone was mafia and outright refused to vote for him in order to look more suspicious after the red flip? Did I try to save Jay by not voting? Anyone with half a brain would know that he was dead a few hours into Day 2 - and yet I decided not to switch to him for ~36 hours in order to gain absolutely nothing out of it? "Everything"? This isn't enough for early Day 1? I got called out for tunneling EY too much and you're acting like it was nothing. I had more on EY than other players had on all of us combined. As for the rest of your post, it's a gameplay opinion that I disagree with. But even though I think that you are wrong, I can see your point. All I have to add on the subject is that I explained my vote at the time and no one had an issue with it, so I think that the problem is in you - or you're trying to turn it into a problem because of your red alignment. + Show Spoiler + On December 09 2011 04:53 xtfftc wrote: I've posted more on Jay, look at Day 1 but it's mostly one off remarks (such as pointing out how Jay justified not voting for a lurker by saying that we shouldn't lynch a lurker because a lurker isn't around to defend himself) and I don't see how the last quote was me suggesting that he is probably town. It was me pointing out the scumminess of EY's reasoning, and at that moment it was to be expected that mafia would jump on the Jay bandwagon. At the moment I think that Jay is more likely to be scum because if he's not, we have EY, xsk, and Adam left, and I consider Adam to be the worst lynch out of the players I am suspicious of (Adam, Jay, EY, xsk, BKE) regarding LAL and you accusing me of lying i have shown that you have lied and additionally you have not directly explained yourself, you have evaded the points i have made you have been misleading and you have posted fluff but you are instead trying to OMGUS me, your reason? that i said "you were happily on a bandwagon" well guess what, you were on a bandwagon and if you were unhappy about it or you felt that there was a better other option you should not have been on it, regardless of what you say you were on itand you did lynch a town. +your case on eye215 is mostly day 1 stuff and the whole i made 5 posts in a short space of time...tunneling... how can you say i did have a case? - is pure nonsense the first time you put together a case was " December 08 2011 07:30." (near the bottom of page 3 of your filter. | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
strenghts of the case against him: he lurked quite a bit early on, apparantly he was busy but lurking doesn't help town he has referred to the fact that he is new repeatedly, this only serves to lower our expectations of him (and perhaps ignore him( or to forgive scummy or anti-town moves because he is new and made a mistake. a new town player should not keep calling themselves bad or new it provides an excuse for Mafia as new players you (we) should try to contribute not remind people that we might fuck up (the game is also exclusively made up of new players so being new does give you free license to be bad). he has made a lot of mistakes with formatting and his post are very hard to read. this makes him appear to be contributing whilst actually just clogging up the thread it also reinforces that he is new and might make mistakes "buddying with jay" by this point you had all voted for and condemned him it is also worth noting this post On December 11 2011 02:29 BroodKingEXE wrote: I do not have anymore time to defend myself as I need to study for finals. I urge everyone to come up with a plan when I do not turn up mafia. I say do not blame the players that created the case against me, but blame the people who used their cases and did not check for errors. I need to develop my skills about gathering evidence in the game and was not active enough in the scum hunt. I know that the case against me was pretty solid though, as I was not good in double checking my evidence. Well,GG BroodKingEXE this is incredibly anti town, it doesn't help in any way and a post like this is almost volunteering to be the lynch. he has had 1 vote since then he later posted that he had the dealine wrong. /doh Weaknesses in his case being inept is independent of alignment - he is definately new he is making mistakes adam made a post showing how BKEXE and jaydunbridge were defending each other [+ Show Spoiler + QUOTE]On December 08 2011 13:37 Adam4167 wrote: On December 08 2011 12:01 Velinath wrote: And of course RIGHT after I post that, BKEXE comes back with some decent reasoning and also steps up and votes. Guhhhhhhhhhhh I don't see what you see at all. I see BKEXE quote BH's book that he wrote on jay, ramble on about policy (a bit late in the piece for this really..), then dump his vote on jay after calling him an idiot. Oh and don't forget declaring how new he is... again. Your case on BKEXE was exactly where I was heading with the next day (assuming I survive the night.). It was well done and did a good job of highlighting exactly how BKEXE has been playing thus far, however I am going to highlight something you missed: BKEXE and jay have been defending each other this entire game: Here BKEXE Here jay Here jay Here jay Here jay BKEXE's more recent posts aimed at jay are nothing more than distancing because we have shifted focus onto them. It is just a smokescreen, do not buy into this nonsense. notice a pattern, bk was the 1st to "defend" jay and from then on jay was "defending" BKEXE we cannot know for sure and it may be that after 10 mins looking i could find the post that contradicts this BUT it is entirely possible that jay purposely created a connection between himself and BK knowing that when he flipped red the pitchforks would be hunting BK. we cannot be certain of how they act and this can be WIFOM'ed to death but it is important to remeber that jay's flip does not tell us a lot about BK's alignment. his posts in the last 24 hours may be him trying to help or simply him trying to seem town and change the vote but i feel that lynching him is a very reasonable move because his behaviour has been plain anti-town and there is an okay chance of him flipping scum. personally i think he is bad town + Show Spoiler + I still think we should lynch xtfftc | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
if you look carefully BK you will see that is is a formatiing error (im ashamed that you of all people have pointed this out) but that the reference to adam was in a quote i quoted and the spoiler was from xtfftc but its contents were not the part of the post i was refering to im using gracks "info" (a quote that he quoted) because the he highlighted a contradiction and because it is such a major contradiction when looked at in the context of his actions as a whole that he needs to explain it. xtfftc has said "he thinks x is most likey to be mafia and then voted for y" and the reason he gave "to remind everyone that we have to catch 2 scum so im leaving my vote on eye215"(loosely i must have quoted it 2 times already) make absolutely no sense for someone whose priority is to catch mafia. when you combine this with the way he has evaded the actual points made against him but still posted a ton of stuff (so it looks like he is trying to help) he is very likely to be scum. rather than not so subtly calling me mafia how about you post proper usable analysis to help town when you flip (if your town) or just dont post (if you are scum) | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
i think at this stage it is reasonable to state that blues (cop and tracker) may have some information and that there is a considerable chance that you might get shot tonight (2blues out of 6 town) i hope that you realise that if you die sitting on information then town does not benefit from it. i think that it is worth thinking about claiming immediately before the nightpost (please use common sense) | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
have a look at tree huggers contradiction and vers analysis of it it is almost perfect match for what xtfftc wrote (i have linked it enough times already) +the thread is worth reading if you have time i think he fits lots of the behaviours outlined by Ver as mafia motivated (i don't know which blues are in the game i just think they need to consider that they could die soon) | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
oh wait... | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
everthing i am summarising can be found in his filter or the past few pages in quotes or things he himself has said on day 1 xtfftc indicated that he had a strong case on eye215 (very early in the game he has said he finds eye215 scummy, i would argue that he thought this too early and that if his case was genuine and strong then eye215 should be dead) on day 1 he vocally oppossed lynching Bbyte on day 1 he joined the "bandwagon" on Bbyte + Show Spoiler + he claimed to have a strong case (early in day1) on eye215 making him his best read, he later switched to xcksc possibly making him his best read, and he also said that adam may have been a good lynch. but he didn't vote for any of them???the reasoning of voting to prevent a voteswitch is almost acceptable but he later takes a very different stance at a point day 2 he did say that jay was his strongest read he tried to move discussion away from jay + Show Spoiler + he did not do it because he was proposing a better case or to find scum for the next day lynch but acted in a way that potentially could have saved jay he proposed a case on eye215 (based primarily on analysis of day1 he justified voting for him because he didn't wish to be accused of bandwagoning he left his vote on eye215 to remind people that we have to lynch the whole mafia team (which makes no sense whatsoever) he did not vote for jay + Show Spoiler + at the start of day 2 there was a strong case on a member of the mafia team (town didn't know he was mafia) xtfftc has previously called jay suspicious but he then decided that voting for a player he thought was scum could lead to him being accused of bandwagoning and that the risk of being accused of bandwagoning was not worth commiting to voting for jay.only scum fear being accused, and bandwagoning is something that by definition you do with other people so it simply isn't a good reason for at lynch at all, he may get increased attention which a town player should use to support their innocence. He also stated that he would switch his vote back if it looked like a voteswitch could happen, which contradicts the only reasonable explanation for his day1 actions. he voted in a way that could have lead to a voteswitch off of a player he thought was probably scum this makes a lot more sense if he is mafia himself on day 3 he voted for BK i asked him to justify his previous behaviour + Show Spoiler + what happened to his case on eye215 i wonder? he has not explained these actions satisfactorily see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explanation he has evaded explaining how these mafia are reasonable town actions he has attempted to twist the things i had previously said + Show Spoiler + he criticised me for quoting (in a spoiler) an entire post and highlighting the key bit, he also accused me of cherry picking when i left out irrelevant information that had nothing to do with my point and did not put his statements into better context he denied saying that jay was his best read (a lie) + Show Spoiler + he propsed a LAL against his accuser (me) because i said he was happy to be on the Bbyte lynch, and yet he was on it. he has OMGUS'd against me by calling me scum without properly justifying his doing so he has forced wifom logic into situations in which it should not be applied to confuse and defsnd himself he has linked a lot to previous posts but he has not explained himself, posting so much without answering what you claim you are answering has cluttered the thread and is not helpful to town (if he is town, which he is not) he has also stated that as town you have lynch to kill mafia, and that you have to lynch your strongest scum read (this pops up in vers XXX analysis in which a player (tree hugger)does almost exactly what he has done) he words and his actions do not match the only players that would have motivation to act the way he has are Mafia ##Vote: xtfftc | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
if a town was roleblocked they should share the information (town can benefit from information) and if mafia is stupid then by claiming roleblock they could be counter claimed and town could trade 1 for 1 if mafia claims to have been roleblocked to ensure they cannot be counter claimed they must not roleblock a town. no matter who claims the only outcomes benefit town | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
And layabout has provided yet another post with lots of statement and no evidence while waiting for Veli to vote first. hahahahahahaha the evidence is all over the thread that was a clear summary to avoid confusion and a formatting hell for myself almost everything in there has been raised as an issue before and that your next post ignores my arguements and does not answer the issue. yet again you have made a big post and given precisely fuck all to the thread. "waits for veli to vote first?" the nightend/daystart post was at 3am for me, i got up at 8:am and went to study at 8:30, i got back home at 4pm and i was tutoring someone from 4pm - 5:30 pm besides not being the 1st to vote for you is a no tell that has next to no bearing on my alignment, it is a piece of information with monumental uselessness. Scum would be more likely to make a point like than than town would (because town saying as such should realise that it holds no value whilst mafia just want to deflect attention/scumhunting from themselves onto others). It is desperate. | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
@Zona is Bluelights getting modkilled/replaced for inactivity? his filter in the last 5 days he has posted at these times December 09 2011 08:55. a line of text December 10 2011 10:45. line + vote December 12 2011 01:23 2 lines worth of text + quotes December 12 2011 01:34 1 liner December 12 2011 01:34 comment on typos December 12 2011 02:14 2 lines of text my timestamp for velinaths last post December 14 2011 06:34 | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 14 2011 06:52 ey215 wrote: I'm frankly not sure what has been brought up/not brought up re:xtfftc at this point but I do have a question about this vote. Wouldn't a last minute surprise be a good thing for the town in many cases? A last minute switch screams mafia. Just wondering on your logic. fix this and give you thoughts please | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 14 2011 07:31 Tunkeg wrote: I'll speak for myself here. I think the entire thread have taken a bad turn after layabout came into play. All he have done is make shitty cases and OMGUS'ing anyone arguing with him. I think he himself is playing an utterly crappy game (if he is town), he is purposly misinterpreting what other writes, twisting and turning every word that is written and his dickish behaviour wants me to straight up punch him in the face. He acts like he is so fucking great at this game, and keep referencing other games and how this game should be played. At the moment I get pissed off just by opening the thread and reading anything he writes, and therefor I find it hard to contribute anything usefull. I'll give him this though, if he is scum he is doing a good job, creating a crappy townenvironment and distracting the town with his shit. I know this is an increadible OMGUS post, and I know it will probably make me look bad, but I don't care, I can't coexist with layabout anyways. So please feel free to jump on me, cause atm I am the third best lynch town can make (green townie who is having a hard time contributing). I will give layabout the benefit of the doubt, I think he is scum and not a crappy asshole of a town... ##Vote: layabout your case is just so good! (/sarcasm) you have really proved through analysis that all of my behaviour suggests that i am mafia (/more sarcasm) your also insulting... which is of course the best way to present a legitimate argument (/immature and slightly hypocritical rebuttal) please come up with something to support your vote pssst i referenced ver because i felt it was relevant and that his analysis really puts the behaviours i have drawn attention to into context, reading through and understanding the guides/analysis on tl that can help new players to improve. | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
by pure chance any player you pick is likely to be town, if you are town that makes 2 town by my impression of the game so far (aboutyou)/(my) rolepm i believe that we are both town lynching a townie would almost certainly force lylo right now (1 from lynch + nightkill puts us a 3town-2mafia) even worse should one of us flip town if we had forced the thread to chose, forcing the situation itself is scummy behaviour and killing a townie makes it much likelier that the survivor would get lynched, and if the survivor is town that would be game. you also say your case isnt great don't vote for someone if your case is weak. + Show Spoiler + i think its okay to say that right? i also found the image of me going "total ass-hole" quite amusing | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
maybe today there will be an enitire page made in my absence + Show Spoiler + i have thought this every day, every time i login i am awash with disappointment | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 12 2011 04:35 layabout wrote: i want you to look at this post and explain to me the errors you have made then apologise and lets move on sadly tunkeg never did respond to this post, so i will do it for him. this also adressed the point bluelightz made against me Sure both me and xtfftc should be looked into for beeing on the wrong side of both the lynches that have taken place he identifies bbyte flipping town and jay flipping scum and them voting bbyte/not voting jay as the thing that i am saying makes them scummy. I did NOT say that, i posted about how the things they said and didsuggests that they are mafia.he misrepresents my points and then labels them weak. the act of doing so is anti town.additionally he calls my case against xtfftc "one dimensional" "weak" and "desperate". Now if you are a town player and you think that a case is weak this is not the way to convince people that it is weak, by addressing the actual case itself and criticising it you can eliminate a bad case by showing that it is bad, discrediting a player or their posts in this way can be between null and scummy play.doing this in a post that is entirely to discredit a player is inexcusable because if you were sucessful a case would be dropped and a player would be ignored due to misrepresented and out of context information, and insults about my posts that are not related to their content. The most funny though is that after you first started the case on xtfftc: + Show Spoiler + On December 11 2011 02:21 layabout wrote: i need to take some time to try to understand Broodking 's post in the meantime i think that xtfftc: has made some glaring contradictions and that he owes and explanation Grackaroni highlighted this in an earlier post and i think you (xtfftc) need to expalin: you explicity state that you think Jay is the most likely to be scum and grack makes this point you call his "reasoning" (i see a simple statement of fact) "pure WIFOM" well where is the pure wifom in this? you have stated that you should only vote for mafia and that you should lynch your best read and yet in the above quote you do not do that here earlier you didn't you have a strong case on a player but you would rather not post it and you would rather vote for someone other than your best read? seriously? so you vote for BByte why? "its better than a last minute suprise" you just jump on a bandwagon another contradiction it also doesn't make sense that "to remind people that we have to catch the whole mafia team" could be a reason for a vote i also think your case against eye is weak i shall soon explain why. You proceed to post this on BKE: On December 11 2011 06:43 layabout wrote: i would like to post analysis before i vote and i still have plenty of time to do so but as it stands i don't feel like i can justify a vote for anybody over broodkingexe BKEXE if you are town please help!! because lynching a town today would really hurt our chances and people have so confidently voted for you they have barely been posting there has been very little discussion so far and so a mislynch would make today a huge waste of time that could have been spent scumhunting allow me to add context which you have left out. In the first post you quote i presented some things xtfftc had done that i felt he should explain and asked him to explain them. I then posted something similar regaurding your probability lynch post and why it was scummy. i continued to pressure you until i felt that very little to no more useful information could be obtained. the second post was part of the last real post (there was also a one liner from me) i made reaguarding you xtfftc then responded by not actually answering my questions, by trying to confuse and, i feel my posting strongly reflects that i found his responses extremely scummy. i tried again to get him to answer me he still didn't xtfftc then posted this: This might work with somebody else but not with me. I have addressed your questions but it's obvious that you want to waste my time now and to distract me the best you can. I am committed to providing more analysis and if you are so scared that you decide to shoot me or manage to somehow manipulate the town into lynching me, they will have a lot of information to work with after I flip green. As long as I continue contributing, my death wouldn't be that much of a problem for town, so I am not afraid of dying. But now that I refuse to play your game, you try to scare me into doing nothing else but defending myself. If you were town, you would have been happy to let me finish the BKE analysis because it is very important for us. Instead, you chose to be obtrusive, even though I already paid a lot of attention to you. It's not like I said I'm not going to answer you at all. I could have simply pretended I'm not checking the thread but only mafia are scared of some extra attention. he had not adressed my actual questions - he soft claims vanilla townie an action that has no value whatsoever to town because all players try to appear town aligned and claims of vanilla town cannot be proven until your dead (or possibly in this set-up an announced cop check and cop + other blue flipped) -he accuses me of trying to manipulate town and of trying to scare him into doing nothing but defending himself so in his eyes pressuring a player and asking them to EXPLAIN themselves is a scare tactic that hurts town, pressuring is good, mafia can seriously benefit from an environment without people pressuring or justifying how they act, (it makes it easier to hide). -saying he isn't afraid of dying in part is claiming vanilla town and is entirely unhelpful. -he also stresses the value of his contribution and mentions that he could have simply ignored my posts is he was mafia this implies that the act of responding makes he more town-like (in fact it doesn't). basically what he is saying boils down to "hey guys im town, this person asking me questions is mafia, did i mention that im town?" after seeing how he responded and without addressing any of the concerns i had raised about how he was likely mafia, i decided to vote for him. from this time onwards xtfftc has been my strongest scumread and the more he posts and trashes the thread the more convinced i am that he is scum and so i have tried to make my case as clear as possible. i then voted for him. Me you want to lynch based on my probability lynch he seems to think i wanted to lynch him based on his probability lynch, i asked him questions, i criticised his answers, i stopped posting about him and then i posted about and pushed someone else. i didn't even present a case on him. i never said that we should lynch him based on that post. this is another example of him misrepresenting me. I think you are trying your best to derail the BKE lynch i feel that my reasons for xtfftc being scum over BK are a lot more comprehensive than your reasons for eye215 being scum over jay. I also feel that my posts reflect that i had reasons for thinking the BK lynch was sensible, but also that i was no convinced by them and that i felt i had a better case and that we should lynch xtfftc over BK. I feel that my actions are much better than voting for BK at the start of the day, not adding anything and then scrathcing my head 48 hours later when BK flipped town + Show Spoiler + you all know who you are and I'm watching you do you really think trying to lynch xtfftc over BK and keep people posting makes me likely to be mafia? | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
well, I cant say anything else but, things to consider He & Velinath has been agreeing alot. He's been tunneling xtf preety much since he was in the mafia @ bluelights agreeing with somebody is a null tell tunneling and pushing a case are different things why have you suddenly started posting? coughcough | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 15 2011 03:41 xtfftc wrote: It depends. On Day 2 we had just one case and very limited discussion, so a switch that leads to a townie lynch would have been blatantly obvious. On Day 1 we had a few cases, so a switch could have been masked much better. As for bigger games, last minute switches almost always benefit mafia because there's more people voting and it's hard to distinguish between the lurking mafia and newbie townies. so did day 1 or day 2 have better cases? | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 15 2011 04:19 xtfftc wrote: Day 2 had better cases but Day 1 had better discussion. Who is your third mafia read in case I'm red? And if I flip green, who would be the second one? scum team: jay xtfftc tunkeg/bluelightz - they are about even, i feel that what their behaviour indicates can vary grealy based upon different veiwpoints and subsequent interpretations and i am not comfortable voting for either at this time. blue is probably scummier of the two. oh, and by answering a question that was of basically no-consequence you have shown that you are perfectly able to answer a question straight up but that you have previously chosen not to. (why is very scummy) On December 15 2011 04:31 xtfftc wrote: You never did, this was the point of my criticism when I wrote "you did not bother to disagree with what layabout said". -why are you trying to make such a big deal out of "velinath not disagreeing with one comment that layabout made" don't you see that that really isn't important but that you are focusing attention on it and trying to create discussion about a peripheral issue? Some more urgent things that you should think on and post about: -What is scummy behaviour and how am i(in this case you) scumhunting? -Why are you focusing on this "best read" issue when there are 2 votes for tunkeg and 2 votes for bluelightz 2 votes on you and two votes on me? -Why aren't you concerned that there aren't comprehensive cases on tunkeg, bluelightz and myself? -Why do you think it is okay to OMGUS me? could you please address this post?? | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 15 2011 04:41 xtfftc wrote: I'm almost done for tonight. All I'd like to say before I go offline is that the vote tonight is the most important part of the whole game, so you should make your decisions carefully. stay the crap here and explain yourself | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + btw that is the case on me, i see no real credible analysis against me | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
so is this it then? i have to go sleep now , its a shame there isn't anything more to respond to | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
gg | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On December 15 2011 19:20 Palmar wrote: To those who didn't already know, I was playing in this game as the smurf "ElectricBlack". This was of course done with the approval of the hosts: + Show Spoiler + I would like to know how the new players in this game felt about the presence of a veteran in the game. I used this article: http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Being_a_good_IC as a guideline on how to handle my play this game, I tried to be less aggressive than I usually am, without cutting off that edge that makes me successful as mafia. Unfortunately the game started on a night I was out with the wife for several hours so I only got plenty of posting in later in the day. The reason for using a smurf was because I did not want the game to become about me. With all the coaches knowing me and my play, I feel an unreasonable amount of weight would've been put into my posting. I tried to call out incorrect play wherever I could, and lead by example with the case on HassyBaby. I don't think I did a magnificent job, but I think I did alright. I would very much like feedback from the players of this game, both town and scum, on how and if we should continue introducing veteran players in newbie games to help create a more useful town atmosphere. For what it's worth, the townies of this game should really be commended for creating the most awesome scumhunting atmosphere I have ever seen in a TL mafia game. Seriously, this town was better at looking town than almost any other town I've played with. Mad props to you all. Some of you may have noticed I did finger all three mafia on day 1: This is not because I'm some kinda awesome scumhunter, or because they all fucked up. What really happened this game is that the town played such a transparent, useful and good game, that simply through process of elimination I could find all the mafia. Veteran towns can learn a lot from you guys, I am thoroughly impressed with your play. When all townies look town, it's much, much easier to pick the mafia out from the rest. Can you guys please answer these questions: Did you like having a veteran in the newbie game? Would you prefer the veteran did not smurf? Would you prefer giving both factions a veteran? The bottom line from this game is that you guys, as complete newbies, managed to create the most healthy town discussion I have ever seen on day one. I can't overstate how impressed I am with it. Good Job. i like it, i think that we are aware of it then it could add another dimension to gameplay, because you would be aware that at least one player in the game has a lot of experience/is likely playing very well you may or may not try to figure out who it is but identifying players who are playing well and players who aren't is something that i at least need to work at. I think that knowing who the veteran was would drastically change behaviour, while the player is alive their will be an expectation for them to lead and almost win for town, this could only have negative consequences as people could become lazy, they may become reliant on the work of others and it would be very hard to push a case when a veteran is pushing another player. In order for both factions to have a veteran (who i am assuming would be smurfs) 1 town vet and 1 mafia vet would likely favour mafia, although a host may wish for this to be part of the game balance (which would have risks associated with it), the other option would then be to give town mutiple vets, if they are smurfs there would then be a strong chence of them surving later into the game. I am not sure how large the skill gap between "vet" and "newbie" is but i am fairly sure that a vet would have quite good reads even a few in-game days in and that it is unlikely that they would not push some of them. basically for vets on both factions it would require a larger game and having mutiple vets could completely defeat the newbie game's goal. Alternately you could have a vet smurf in the first few days that could and then they could be modkilled, so that newbies have to rely on themselves when it comes down to lategame | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
did i ruin the atmosphere when i joined the game? will you forgive me tunkeg? <3 | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
what are peoples thoughts about the day1 "list of all of my reads of everybody"-syndrome? | ||
| ||
