TL Mafia XLVII - Page 105

On November 28 2011 04:29 xtfftc wrote:

What disadvantages? Examples, please.

Things said during the night are not leading to a lynch but instead towards night targets.

How exactly? If mafia can figure out who to hit because of what we say during the night (which somehow differs from what we would say during the day), then medics can use the same information when choosing who to protect.

On November 27 2011 03:52 tnkted wrote:


This is optimal town play for all of the roles. Other people can correct me if they think I'm wrong.

1. Detectives should check whoever they find scummy. On the first day they should check people who are very polarized and likely to die if they aren't mafia (ie, palmar if he isn't elected, bc, etc). This can be vets or newer players who are making a lot of sense. They check people who are likely to die at first because they want to know their alignment. Acceptable choices also include people who are likely to get lynched the next day, After they've confirmed their alignment, they can start making real checks. Dts SHOULD NOT reveal who they are. They should crumb all their checks in their posts somewhere (breadcrumb = saying things like "I think jackal is scummy" and then writing up some sort of analysis, or dropping subtle clues). That way, when the DT dies, (because blues are usually detected by mafia at some point) there will be all of the information town needs, cleverly hidden in the filter. Just don't be obvious about your crumbs, and make sure you are careful how you record sanity. Rather than use words like 'paranoid' or 'naive' which mafia are looking for, just record every check and let town figure it out for themselves.

2. Veterans should be trying to PULL BULLETS. We want ALL of the veterans to get shot once. Why? Because mafia has limited KP and every bullet that a veteran soaks up is one less that can be used on a detective or medic. This means that veterans have, perhaps, one of the most difficult townie jobs in the game: they have to appear to be not only town (so they dont get lynched), but also BLUE, and trying to hide what their role is. They have to act like they are in the shadows so that they can get hit. The other alternative is for them to post a fuckload because they feel safe being a major town analyist because they know they have two lives. Either way is good. Does it make sense now why Siani's plan, if he really is vet, is stupid? We needed him to soak up a bullet. Now mafia isn't going to bother shooting him at all if they had been thinking he was a dt or something; they dont want to waste two shots on one townie.

On the other hand it kind of guarrentees he'll be around for awhile, because town isn't going to want to waste a lynch on him either. So go figure.

3. Medics nobody has talked about yet. Personally, I am a big believer in 'wifom coordinating' by which I mean, town provides a small list of targets for medics to protect, and then the medics decide for themselves whether to protect on that list or not. Mafia doesn't want to shoot into the list because they don't know who is protected, and are forced to shoot elsewhere, and the medics have a strong possibilty of having decided to ignore the list and therefore are able to save elsewhere.

But thats just me. Generally speaking, medics should try to save high-piority targets. Medics should not be crumbing their roles; IIRC the medic and their target are both informed if a safe is successful. Therefore it is up to the saved target to post that they were saved. Medics should just breathe a sigh of relief with the rest of town, safe in their anonymity. Just try to avoid attracting too much unwanted attention, but WHATEVER YOU DO: DO NOT GET SHOT BY A LURKER BULLET.

4. Vigilantes are pretty simple: Kill whoever you think is scum. Go ahead and claim afterwards so we don't waste time tracking down your clue. But be VERY careful, and don't claim or breadcrumb until after you end a life. For newer players, Vig can be a very scary role, but don't worry: Town probably won't lynch you for killing the detective if you own up to it and explain your reasons truthfully.

5, Lurker Banes are a new role for me! And nobodys discussed them yet. So lets do some theorycrafting.

LBs seem to be designed to wittle off inactive players. But as I read closer, I think I'm starting to realize that LB are actually an asset to mafia late game. Why? Its a role thats only purpose is to kill off useless players. Early game, thats fine: people that don't post a lot in the beginning are probably either shy, away from their computer alot, or scummy lurkey mafia. But in the later game, the entire mafia is actively participating in the thread, and town is left with a smaller pool of people to shoot. Since mafia, late game, are more likely to shoot into the active playerbase, and lurker bane is likely to shoot into the inactive playerbase, this essentially adds an extra KP into the mix that is unlikely to hit mafia.

Therefore I propose, for this new mechanic, the following rule: SHOOT EARLY, NOT LATE. Do not shoot when we are less than, say, 25 players. Let mafia use all their KP, and save it for yourself. I think also at that point its probably safe to claim, since you won't be shooting anymore and it will help town to have those clues explained. Claiming is up for debate, however, I'd like to hear what other people think about it.

6. Mad Hatters is a tricky role. If you're new to mafia, go look up dreamflower. She is well known for having precision scumsense and remarkable mad hatter skills. She has, in previous games, put her two bombs onto two mafia, posted very detailed, AND CORRECT analysis, gotten killed by mafia, and taken two of them down with her. She has preformed some of the best mafia play I've ever seen; in one game I played with her in which I was mafia, she absolutely nailed Ace, the mafia godfather, on day 2 with a very detailed and spot on analysis. I was very impressed, although it caused a lot of worry amoung my team (Kurumi, IIRC, was with me in that game).

The reason I bring dreamflower up is because I believe that she exemplifies the mad hatter role to perfection. Mad hatters should be town analysts. Why? Simple: as mad hatter, you need to KNOW who is scum. Then you need to put a bomb on that person. Then you need to start posting analysis. Its a win-win for town: town gets the benefit of your analysis, and when you get shot by mafia you take two of them down with you.

The trick is that you need to be very good, and very careful at who you think scum is. A lot of this really comes down to experience; not only in your targets meta, but more importantly in how scum behaves in general, what sort of thoughts they have to suppress while in thread, stuff like that. But newer players aren't completely shut out. Just pick someone you have a gut feeling is scummy, read ALL of their posts, meticulously analyze them, post your results in thread, get some feedback, and place a bomb. If someone you analyzed is likely to get lynched, place that bomb somewhere else so you don't lose it. And for the love of all things holy: Don't claim. Just act like a competent town analyst.

7. Rolecops are generally speaking, a role that works better for more experienced players. I'm not entirely sure how to play one, to be honest, I've never gotten this role before, nor played in many games in which one was present. I imagine that rolecop's true purpose is for checking whether people's claims are true or not. Again, like the detective above, crumb your posts, but don't be obvious about it and don't claim. If anyone has any ideas about how to play this particular role, please post them.

8. Town Roleblockers should be pretty obvious: Block shit! Try to block people who you think are scummy. Even if they don't have roles, if they are scum they will be unable to shoot anyone, which is what you want. Roleblockers should be very careful when they read the thread to look for mafia; they should be blocking the high-priority scumtargets and participating in town discussions. DO NOT LURK WITH ROLEBLOCKER.

Thoughts?

If I have a large post about that I am wanting to make it will not help at all in any way more so than if I posted that same post after the day started. They both contribute to the next lynch. The only you 'gain' by posting during night over day is to influence night actions. Thats the heart of my point.

I am done with trying to explain this to you.... Hope that the newbies didn't actually believe you that discussing things during the night is somehow bad for town.

8. Town Roleblockers should be pretty obvious: Block shit! Try to block people who you think are scummy. Even if they don't have roles, if they are scum they will be unable to shoot anyone, which is what you want. Roleblockers should be very careful when they read the thread to look for mafia; they should be blocking the high-priority scumtargets and participating in town discussions. DO NOT LURK WITH ROLEBLOCKER.

Thoughts?

On November 28 2011 05:54 xtfftc wrote:

I'm curious about that last bit. It sounds as if for some reason it is not okay to lurk if you're a roleblocker, which means that it's okay to lurk if you are some other role? What makes RBs special in that aspect?

On November 27 2011 23:37 Jackal58 wrote:

Bullshit.

+ Show Spoiler +
You say it's an alternative that defeats the purpose of your list.

On November 28 2011 05:49 syllogism wrote:
I don't really care who gets protected other than the obvious townie sandroba, who might even get double stacked depending on who is on the scum team.

Palmar since you are basically untouchable until day 5, I'm just going to ignore all the little issues I've with your play so far. Of course, it's very unlikely I will be around by that point, but just letting you know.

On November 28 2011 05:40 vaderseven wrote:
Lurker bane doesnt just help the mafia late game, Ive played on forums before where lurking as scum was a dominate strat that won games.

It basically means that BOTH sides must be active as part of their strat or risk being killed by someone that only cares to kill lurkers. I am fine with that and will be stealing that role to take to other forums.

Rolecops most certainly help to catch people in lies as you say.

I 100% disagree with your ideas about medic and wifom coordinating. WIFOM becomes stronger and more real the better every one knows each other and so many players no 0 about everyone in this game. I think meds should, in the early stages of the game, protect those that they feel will be targeted or might be power roles and in the later stages should protect those that either become 'confirmed town' or seem the likely target of scum. The best thing for a med to do is to protect a cop or what not but that can't be done as a sure thing.

On November 28 2011 06:02 Hassybaby wrote:
In all honestly, I don't understand the point of the instructions in total. Anyone who gave a damn about this game are either vets who know what the abilities do, or newbies who read up a fair bit. The only ones who would need such info are newbies who didn't bother reading up before

On November 28 2011 06:02 Hassybaby wrote:
In all honestly, I don't understand the point of the instructions in total. Anyone who gave a damn about this game are either vets who know what the abilities do, or newbies who read up a fair bit. The only ones who would need such info are newbies who didn't bother reading up before