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On July 21 2011 02:32 Kurumi wrote:
Wait, You really believe scum would out itself as scum? VE could either get Mafia OR DIE. But we saved him BECAUSE HE IS TOWN.
1:1 trade for scum is BAD.
You're right in that he could either get mafia or die. That is not why he was spared. It was still a close vote, and he is definitely not confirmed town. Some people felt that it's better to hit him at night than to lynch him, that's all. If he were II he could either get Mafia OR DIE as well.
@Curu: Why CB/VE and not Kav?
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i don't even care which one of the 3 gets hit, as long as we don't have to talk about more of this shit in the day when we're going to have a fuckton of stuff to discuss (there's going to be at least what, 5+ KP) and this thing is just going to go in circles unless ONE OF THEM DIES
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On July 21 2011 02:39 Lucidity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 02:32 Kurumi wrote:
Wait, You really believe scum would out itself as scum? VE could either get Mafia OR DIE. But we saved him BECAUSE HE IS TOWN.
1:1 trade for scum is BAD. You're right in that he could either get mafia or die. That is not why he was spared. It was still a close vote, and he is definitely not confirmed town. Some people felt that it's better to hit him at night than to lynch him, that's all. If he were II he could either get Mafia OR DIE as well. @Curu: Why CB/VE and not Kav?
Because they have a history of Traitor-ish looking posts, they started this whole II business, one of them modified PMs, etc. In my opinion CB is the more likely actual Insane Inmate but VE would give the most information. I'm happy with either dying, just as long as one of them does.
Kav at least has bumatlarge to vouch for him so he has something going that neither of them do.
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People are talking about shooting VE, and that's something I can speak on:
Look at the facts: Player A is an accused II.
Player A posts a PM from Player B, where B claims he is a II.
Player A then posts a IM from Player C, where Player C claims II.
Player B denys the PM, Player C confirms the IM.
Who are the likely liars?
It is very unlikely that Player A would forge a PM, unless he is actually an II.
If Player A is an II he would not turn in another player claiming II. (Even if he didn't believe that the person was an II, a real II would just keep quiet about it, and not risk hurting his team any further. )
Given that we have a confirmed "turn in" of player C, we now KNOW that player C is actually turning in people who claim II. This is not what an II would do.
Now for Player C: If he is an II, then he just follows suit, and denys the IM. With player B and player C denying the claim, they will at least get Player A killed before the game is up.
If player C is town, then he tells the truth about the whole thing, and does NOT deny the contact.
Conclusion:
Player A (VE) is not lying about any contact, and is not an II.
Player B (CB) is lying about not PM'ing the claim, and IS an II. (Who the hell sends pm's with an example claim, to someone who just claimed II?)
Player C (Kav) is not an II.
The only other posibility is that VE and I are collaborating to kill CB, but that would be a horrible trade for mafia, and I told someone of my intentions before I did this, so again, if notasmurf and I were in league with the mafia, we would be making a horrible trade. (1-2!)
Don't just take my word for it, just look at the logical conclusion that is drawn from the facts that are publically known in the thread. If ANYONE is shot tonight, it should be CB. Am I missing fail logic somewhere, or is this as obvious as it seems.
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On July 21 2011 00:41 Lucidity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 00:22 Nisani201 wrote:
gj everyone, there was less than one page of activity over the night. Barely anything to add through the node graph.
I think we have the vigi hits planned out pretty well. Kav is off the hook so we shouldn't vigi him. VE needs to die, and CB. I'd recommend a DT check on Pyo, RoL, or anyone else that was under suspicion for lynch yesterday. What is a node graph? Why is Kav off the hook? notasmurf confirming that Kav mentioned his plan doesn't really say anything does it? You can do the same thing as II and townie and it's equally effective as both. For both sides the best case scenario is being accepted into the scum team. For both sides the worst case is being outed in the thread. So mentioning the strat to a 3rd party makes no difference. (Other than potentially tipping off scum as to your plan. So imo actually mentioning to a 3rd party is terrible.) I guess the only certainty tonight is that Batman (Mr Wiggles) dies? 
Lucidity, what is your fascination with trying to get me killed? The easiest way to get someone killed in this game without wasting scum KP is to keep mentioning that they're third party, in the hopes that an actual third party kills them for you. What gives?
As for the VE/CB/Kav scenario, I think the best thing to do tonight is to shoot CB, and maybe DT check VE. I think between CB and VE, CB seems more likely to be II (and the one who faked his PMs) just based on his posting. However, that doesn't really let VE off the hook completely, and I'll probably just be ignoring what he says until he flips, or a DT eventually clears him (if a vig doesn't decide to shoot him first anyways).
One thing people didn't really discuss so far is medics. For protection tonight with reasons I'm calling for protection, or why mafia might shoot them, I'd say:
Curu- Active and contributing to scumhunting
Mr. Wiggles- Got potential town-cred from the VE incident, also wants to live to solve clues
YM- Playing very openly and naturally, scumhunting
Jackal58- Just got a town vibe off him, not sure how likely scum are to hit him though
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yay Kavdragon out of the hat
kill CB
aquire two confirmed townies
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CB's flip confirms absolutely nothing about the other two and jesus christ stop suggesting DT checks on people who have 0% chance of being actual scum rather than traitors
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On July 21 2011 02:52 Kurumi wrote:
yay Kavdragon out of the hat
kill CB
aquire two confirmed townies
How does that work exactly?
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On July 21 2011 03:24 deconduo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 02:52 Kurumi wrote:
yay Kavdragon out of the hat
kill CB
aquire two confirmed townies How does that work exactly?
MAGIC!
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On July 21 2011 02:49 Kavdragon wrote:
People are talking about shooting VE, and that's something I can speak on:
Look at the facts: Player A is an accused II.
Player A posts a PM from Player B, where B claims he is a II.
Player A then posts a IM from Player C, where Player C claims II.
Player B denys the PM, Player C confirms the IM.
Who are the likely liars?
It is very unlikely that Player A would forge a PM, unless he is actually an II.
If Player A is an II he would not turn in another player claiming II. (Even if he didn't believe that the person was an II, a real II would just keep quiet about it, and not risk hurting his team any further. )
Given that we have a confirmed "turn in" of player C, we now KNOW that player C is actually turning in people who claim II. This is not what an II would do.
Now for Player C: If he is an II, then he just follows suit, and denys the IM. With player B and player C denying the claim, they will at least get Player A killed before the game is up.
If player C is town, then he tells the truth about the whole thing, and does NOT deny the contact.
Conclusion:
Player A (VE) is not lying about any contact, and is not an II.
Player B (CB) is lying about not PM'ing the claim, and IS an II. (Who the hell sends pm's with an example claim, to someone who just claimed II?)
Player C (Kav) is not an II.
The only other posibility is that VE and I are collaborating to kill CB, but that would be a horrible trade for mafia, and I told someone of my intentions before I did this, so again, if notasmurf and I were in league with the mafia, we would be making a horrible trade. (1-2!)
Don't just take my word for it, just look at the logical conclusion that is drawn from the facts that are publically known in the thread. If ANYONE is shot tonight, it should be CB. Am I missing fail logic somewhere, or is this as obvious as it seems.
You're missing something.
Player A can turn in player B even if he's an II because it'll cause a ton of havoc for the town. Look at what happened! We went from scum hunting to Traitor hunting, WIFOM, and speculation. Have we gone anywhere really since it started? Not really. We've gone backwards from having 1 near-confirmed II to debates about IIs again and again. I hope we move on by day time.
Speaking of atmosphere, props to Curu for trying to get town back on track again.
Btw, does Wiggles die if he's medic protected and Joker/Ra'as hit him? Cuz idk how a medic is supposed to stop a smiting of the bats. :p
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On July 21 2011 03:53 ghrur wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 02:49 Kavdragon wrote:
People are talking about shooting VE, and that's something I can speak on:
Look at the facts: Player A is an accused II.
Player A posts a PM from Player B, where B claims he is a II.
Player A then posts a IM from Player C, where Player C claims II.
Player B denys the PM, Player C confirms the IM.
Who are the likely liars?
It is very unlikely that Player A would forge a PM, unless he is actually an II.
If Player A is an II he would not turn in another player claiming II. (Even if he didn't believe that the person was an II, a real II would just keep quiet about it, and not risk hurting his team any further. )
Given that we have a confirmed "turn in" of player C, we now KNOW that player C is actually turning in people who claim II. This is not what an II would do.
Now for Player C: If he is an II, then he just follows suit, and denys the IM. With player B and player C denying the claim, they will at least get Player A killed before the game is up.
If player C is town, then he tells the truth about the whole thing, and does NOT deny the contact.
Conclusion:
Player A (VE) is not lying about any contact, and is not an II.
Player B (CB) is lying about not PM'ing the claim, and IS an II. (Who the hell sends pm's with an example claim, to someone who just claimed II?)
Player C (Kav) is not an II.
The only other posibility is that VE and I are collaborating to kill CB, but that would be a horrible trade for mafia, and I told someone of my intentions before I did this, so again, if notasmurf and I were in league with the mafia, we would be making a horrible trade. (1-2!)
Don't just take my word for it, just look at the logical conclusion that is drawn from the facts that are publically known in the thread. If ANYONE is shot tonight, it should be CB. Am I missing fail logic somewhere, or is this as obvious as it seems. You're missing something. Player A can turn in player B even if he's an II because it'll cause a ton of havoc for the town. Look at what happened! We went from scum hunting to Traitor hunting, WIFOM, and speculation. Have we gone anywhere really since it started? Not really. We've gone backwards from having 1 near-confirmed II to debates about IIs again and again. I hope we move on by day time. Speaking of atmosphere, props to Curu for trying to get town back on track again. Btw, does Wiggles die if he's medic protected and Joker/Ra'as hit him? Cuz idk how a medic is supposed to stop a smiting of the bats. :p
Only batman's hits go through protection, if you read the OP. Also, batman can only actually be hit by Ra'as, and nothing else.
Any of the three would be pretty dumb to hit me anyways, because it would be a waste. A minority is calling me third party because I actually talked about them, and was the only person who talked about the set-up. To put it nicely, that's the dumbest argument I've ever heard. By that logic, the people who are scum-hunting the most are the mafia, and Lucidity is another third-party. See how stupid it is?
It's reckless to ignore all the third-parties in this game, and just pretend they don't exist. There's two ways to do this, we can either just pretend they don't exist and wait for them to kill each other off, probably taking about 6 townies with them, or we can hunt them down like the scum they are. Does that make sense to you?
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On July 21 2011 03:50 Coagulation wrote:
*Goes back to lurking*
Shoot him...
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On July 21 2011 04:14 Mr. Wiggles wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 03:53 ghrur wrote:On July 21 2011 02:49 Kavdragon wrote:
People are talking about shooting VE, and that's something I can speak on:
Look at the facts: Player A is an accused II.
Player A posts a PM from Player B, where B claims he is a II.
Player A then posts a IM from Player C, where Player C claims II.
Player B denys the PM, Player C confirms the IM.
Who are the likely liars?
It is very unlikely that Player A would forge a PM, unless he is actually an II.
If Player A is an II he would not turn in another player claiming II. (Even if he didn't believe that the person was an II, a real II would just keep quiet about it, and not risk hurting his team any further. )
Given that we have a confirmed "turn in" of player C, we now KNOW that player C is actually turning in people who claim II. This is not what an II would do.
Now for Player C: If he is an II, then he just follows suit, and denys the IM. With player B and player C denying the claim, they will at least get Player A killed before the game is up.
If player C is town, then he tells the truth about the whole thing, and does NOT deny the contact.
Conclusion:
Player A (VE) is not lying about any contact, and is not an II.
Player B (CB) is lying about not PM'ing the claim, and IS an II. (Who the hell sends pm's with an example claim, to someone who just claimed II?)
Player C (Kav) is not an II.
The only other posibility is that VE and I are collaborating to kill CB, but that would be a horrible trade for mafia, and I told someone of my intentions before I did this, so again, if notasmurf and I were in league with the mafia, we would be making a horrible trade. (1-2!)
Don't just take my word for it, just look at the logical conclusion that is drawn from the facts that are publically known in the thread. If ANYONE is shot tonight, it should be CB. Am I missing fail logic somewhere, or is this as obvious as it seems. You're missing something. Player A can turn in player B even if he's an II because it'll cause a ton of havoc for the town. Look at what happened! We went from scum hunting to Traitor hunting, WIFOM, and speculation. Have we gone anywhere really since it started? Not really. We've gone backwards from having 1 near-confirmed II to debates about IIs again and again. I hope we move on by day time. Speaking of atmosphere, props to Curu for trying to get town back on track again. Btw, does Wiggles die if he's medic protected and Joker/Ra'as hit him? Cuz idk how a medic is supposed to stop a smiting of the bats. :p Only batman's hits go through protection, if you read the OP. Also, batman can only actually be hit by Ra'as, and nothing else. Any of the three would be pretty dumb to hit me anyways, because it would be a waste. A minority is calling me third party because I actually talked about them, and was the only person who talked about the set-up. To put it nicely, that's the dumbest argument I've ever heard. By that logic, the people who are scum-hunting the most are the mafia, and Lucidity is another third-party. See how stupid it is? It's reckless to ignore all the third-parties in this game, and just pretend they don't exist. There's two ways to do this, we can either just pretend they don't exist and wait for them to kill each other off, probably taking about 6 townies with them, or we can hunt them down like the scum they are. Does that make sense to you?
But can't 3rd party just as easily take mafia out too? All of this traitor baiting is silly - why would mafia ever believe any traitor claim? It feels like people are out thinking themselves and allowing them to get distracted by everything.
Also, do insane inmates count toward mafia KP? If they don't town might be better off leaving them alone... for potential targets for mafia/3rd party people to randomly hit, no?
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On July 21 2011 04:14 Mr. Wiggles wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 03:53 ghrur wrote:On July 21 2011 02:49 Kavdragon wrote:
People are talking about shooting VE, and that's something I can speak on:
Look at the facts: Player A is an accused II.
Player A posts a PM from Player B, where B claims he is a II.
Player A then posts a IM from Player C, where Player C claims II.
Player B denys the PM, Player C confirms the IM.
Who are the likely liars?
It is very unlikely that Player A would forge a PM, unless he is actually an II.
If Player A is an II he would not turn in another player claiming II. (Even if he didn't believe that the person was an II, a real II would just keep quiet about it, and not risk hurting his team any further. )
Given that we have a confirmed "turn in" of player C, we now KNOW that player C is actually turning in people who claim II. This is not what an II would do.
Now for Player C: If he is an II, then he just follows suit, and denys the IM. With player B and player C denying the claim, they will at least get Player A killed before the game is up.
If player C is town, then he tells the truth about the whole thing, and does NOT deny the contact.
Conclusion:
Player A (VE) is not lying about any contact, and is not an II.
Player B (CB) is lying about not PM'ing the claim, and IS an II. (Who the hell sends pm's with an example claim, to someone who just claimed II?)
Player C (Kav) is not an II.
The only other posibility is that VE and I are collaborating to kill CB, but that would be a horrible trade for mafia, and I told someone of my intentions before I did this, so again, if notasmurf and I were in league with the mafia, we would be making a horrible trade. (1-2!)
Don't just take my word for it, just look at the logical conclusion that is drawn from the facts that are publically known in the thread. If ANYONE is shot tonight, it should be CB. Am I missing fail logic somewhere, or is this as obvious as it seems. You're missing something. Player A can turn in player B even if he's an II because it'll cause a ton of havoc for the town. Look at what happened! We went from scum hunting to Traitor hunting, WIFOM, and speculation. Have we gone anywhere really since it started? Not really. We've gone backwards from having 1 near-confirmed II to debates about IIs again and again. I hope we move on by day time. Speaking of atmosphere, props to Curu for trying to get town back on track again. Btw, does Wiggles die if he's medic protected and Joker/Ra'as hit him? Cuz idk how a medic is supposed to stop a smiting of the bats. :p Only batman's hits go through protection, if you read the OP. Also, batman can only actually be hit by Ra'as, and nothing else. Any of the three would be pretty dumb to hit me anyways, because it would be a waste. A minority is calling me third party because I actually talked about them, and was the only person who talked about the set-up. To put it nicely, that's the dumbest argument I've ever heard. By that logic, the people who are scum-hunting the most are the mafia, and Lucidity is another third-party. See how stupid it is? It's reckless to ignore all the third-parties in this game, and just pretend they don't exist. There's two ways to do this, we can either just pretend they don't exist and wait for them to kill each other off, probably taking about 6 townies with them, or we can hunt them down like the scum they are. Does that make sense to you?
Oh please, no need to insult. I understood that the batman's hits go through protection, and I also read the OP. I can comprehend English you know, despite your connotations. Also, it's unclear if Batman dies to Joker or not. It never says Joker can kill batman, but it also never says Joker CAN'T kill batman. It says only Bane and Croc survive against joker.
By the way, that wasn't the logic used. First of all, you weren't the only person who talked about set up. That's a lie right there. I talked about set up, CB talked about set-up, Zona talked about set-up, ketomai talked about set-up, deconduo talked about set up. Etc, etc. In fact, Deconduo even discussed third parties with you. To put it nicely, you just tried to make yourself sound like a victim by telling a lie.
Then, you're also twisting the logic here. See, the logic here isn't that those who scum hunt are scum. It's that those who consistently think like scum are scum. Those who consistently think like blues are blues. It's the same logic used when scum are hunting blues - who's talking about how to organize them the most. We call you third party because of your obsession with them. Your early posts all talked about third parties, and your posts still do. We understand that you can't ignore them. In fact, I'm quite sure we realized that after your discussion with Decond. So why do you feel the need to consistently repeat what you've already said? Why do you consistently need to talk about the behavior of third parties?
And please stop putting words into my mouth. When have I ever stated we should ignore third parties? Did I not push for your lynch (and I still do) precisely because I think you're a third party and therefore am hunting you? I realize they're dangerous. I want their KPs gone. That's why I want you gone. Now, allow me to belittle you in turn. Does that make sense to you?
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On July 21 2011 04:40 Shraft wrote:Shoot him a pm and ask him to quit lurking...
FIXED
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On July 21 2011 04:46 Coagulation wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 04:40 Shraft wrote:On July 21 2011 03:50 Coagulation wrote:
*Goes back to lurking* Shoot him a pm and ask him to quit lurking... FIXED
Are you asking to be lynched?
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Oh and Wiggles, where is your scum hunting? All I've seen you do is post a PM from VE that doesn't confirm anything to us, caused us to get off track, and then randomly voted redFF without reason. You only stated once, ONCE, that you think he's scum. You haven't done any analysis, and you haven't pushed anyone's lynch. Honestly, this play makes total sense as SK.
Oh, and Also, nice, red lynch day 1!
Yeah, I said something to that extent in Salem Mafia, day 1. I was scum.
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Mr. Wiggles (Btw, there shouldn't be a fullstop there :D?), the issue isn't that you've considered the SKs, but that it seems to be your main focus.
You've even considered them individually, crafted a pecking order and their likely behaviour. There is absolutely no point to that pecking order. We'd be lucky to catch an SK at all, nevermind knowing exactly which SK it is. When someone considered your pecking order and replied that we should just be killing ALL SKs your first response was, "Hmmm...ummm....welll....I guess soo..." almost as if this wasn't what you wanted.
You suggested that Batman would be acting like a townie with his scum hunting and that he'd likely be firing into players he saw as scum... Basically you were implying that we couldn't/shouldn't hunt Batman... Because we'd have to hunt for someone who appears pro-town. (And I don't think that behavioural analysis holds any merit)
I'm sure the other SK picked up on this and I guess we'll find out what happened on the morrow.
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On July 21 2011 04:44 ghrur wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 04:14 Mr. Wiggles wrote:On July 21 2011 03:53 ghrur wrote:On July 21 2011 02:49 Kavdragon wrote:
People are talking about shooting VE, and that's something I can speak on:
Look at the facts: Player A is an accused II.
Player A posts a PM from Player B, where B claims he is a II.
Player A then posts a IM from Player C, where Player C claims II.
Player B denys the PM, Player C confirms the IM.
Who are the likely liars?
It is very unlikely that Player A would forge a PM, unless he is actually an II.
If Player A is an II he would not turn in another player claiming II. (Even if he didn't believe that the person was an II, a real II would just keep quiet about it, and not risk hurting his team any further. )
Given that we have a confirmed "turn in" of player C, we now KNOW that player C is actually turning in people who claim II. This is not what an II would do.
Now for Player C: If he is an II, then he just follows suit, and denys the IM. With player B and player C denying the claim, they will at least get Player A killed before the game is up.
If player C is town, then he tells the truth about the whole thing, and does NOT deny the contact.
Conclusion:
Player A (VE) is not lying about any contact, and is not an II.
Player B (CB) is lying about not PM'ing the claim, and IS an II. (Who the hell sends pm's with an example claim, to someone who just claimed II?)
Player C (Kav) is not an II.
The only other posibility is that VE and I are collaborating to kill CB, but that would be a horrible trade for mafia, and I told someone of my intentions before I did this, so again, if notasmurf and I were in league with the mafia, we would be making a horrible trade. (1-2!)
Don't just take my word for it, just look at the logical conclusion that is drawn from the facts that are publically known in the thread. If ANYONE is shot tonight, it should be CB. Am I missing fail logic somewhere, or is this as obvious as it seems. You're missing something. Player A can turn in player B even if he's an II because it'll cause a ton of havoc for the town. Look at what happened! We went from scum hunting to Traitor hunting, WIFOM, and speculation. Have we gone anywhere really since it started? Not really. We've gone backwards from having 1 near-confirmed II to debates about IIs again and again. I hope we move on by day time. Speaking of atmosphere, props to Curu for trying to get town back on track again. Btw, does Wiggles die if he's medic protected and Joker/Ra'as hit him? Cuz idk how a medic is supposed to stop a smiting of the bats. :p Only batman's hits go through protection, if you read the OP. Also, batman can only actually be hit by Ra'as, and nothing else. Any of the three would be pretty dumb to hit me anyways, because it would be a waste. A minority is calling me third party because I actually talked about them, and was the only person who talked about the set-up. To put it nicely, that's the dumbest argument I've ever heard. By that logic, the people who are scum-hunting the most are the mafia, and Lucidity is another third-party. See how stupid it is? It's reckless to ignore all the third-parties in this game, and just pretend they don't exist. There's two ways to do this, we can either just pretend they don't exist and wait for them to kill each other off, probably taking about 6 townies with them, or we can hunt them down like the scum they are. Does that make sense to you? Oh please, no need to insult. I understood that the batman's hits go through protection, and I also read the OP. I can comprehend English you know, despite your connotations. Also, it's unclear if Batman dies to Joker or not. It never says Joker can kill batman, but it also never says Joker CAN'T kill batman. It says only Bane and Croc survive against joker.
It says batman is immune to ALL night hits. The only exception, is where it says that Ra'al's hit kill batman.
Do Joker's hits kill batman?
Also, if you read the OP, then why ask if Ra'as/Joker's hits go through protection? It's pretty obvious it says nothing about that, so why ask, and especially when it's directed at the thread and not the mods? It's non-contributory.
By the way, that wasn't the logic used. First of all, you weren't the only person who talked about set up. That's a lie right there. I talked about set up, CB talked about set-up, Zona talked about set-up, ketomai talked about set-up, deconduo talked about set up. Etc, etc. In fact, Deconduo even discussed third parties with you. To put it nicely, you just tried to make yourself sound like a victim by telling a lie.
Then, you're also twisting the logic here. See, the logic here isn't that those who scum hunt are scum. It's that those who consistently think like scum are scum. Those who consistently think like blues are blues. It's the same logic used when scum are hunting blues - who's talking about how to organize them the most. We call you third party because of your obsession with them. Your early posts all talked about third parties, and your posts still do. We understand that you can't ignore them. In fact, I'm quite sure we realized that after your discussion with Decond. So why do you feel the need to consistently repeat what you've already said? Why do you consistently need to talk about the behavior of third parties?
So you're saying I think like a third-party? You never actually stated it. If yes, then of course I think like a third party, when I'm trying to hunt them. Same way I try to think like scum to hunt scum. You're using the logic, that those who talk about the third-parties are third party. I pointed out that it's wrong, because then those who talk about scum i.e. scumhunt, are scum, by that same logic. Also, blues that think like blues are bad, same with scum who think like scum. Scum want to think like greens, blues want to think like greens, and third-parties want to think like greens. The only difference between them is how good they are at it.
I'm repeating what I said, for a couple reasons. First, when I'm accused of being a third party, simply for bringing them up, I'm somewhat forced to talk about third parties, aren't I? In the same way that someone accused of being scum must talk about scum and their behaviour. Next, I'm bringing them up, because no one seems to be worried about them at all besides me. They are a threat to town, just the same as scum are. Do you want them to stick around? No? Then why do you try to quash any discussion about them?
And please stop putting words into my mouth. When have I ever stated we should ignore third parties? Did I not push for your lynch (and I still do) precisely because I think you're a third party and therefore am hunting you? I realize they're dangerous. I want their KPs gone. That's why I want you gone. Now, allow me to belittle you in turn. Does that make sense to you?
Hmmm? Check the bolded parts. You ask why I need to talk about them, implying that I shouldn't, then say you never inferred we should ignore third parties. What is not discussing third parties at all, besides ignoring them? You haven't stated it explicitly, but you can see it in the actions and posts of certain individuals. Those who are nervous about addressing third parties, those who want to stop discussion about them, or try to attack the credibility of those who do talk about them.
On July 21 2011 04:56 ghrur wrote:Oh and Wiggles, where is your scum hunting? All I've seen you do is post a PM from VE that doesn't confirm anything to us, caused us to get off track, and then randomly voted redFF without reason. You only stated once, ONCE, that you think he's scum. You haven't done any analysis, and you haven't pushed anyone's lynch. Honestly, this play makes total sense as SK. Oh, and Yeah, I said something to that extent in Salem Mafia, day 1. I was scum.
Why do you ask for scum hunting? Did I ever promise you any? I don't think so. Don't worry though, I'm doing it. The point is it's just in private, and not the thread right now, until I can form a strong case against someone. Why throw out pointless accusations if I can't realistically get that person lynched yet?
Also, it's very hypocritical of you to call me out for lack of scum-hunting in the thread, when the only analysis you've done yourself is calling me scum, which is incorrect. So, you haven't been able to finger a single scum yet, in other words, and only have an analysis calling a townie scum.
Also, are you saying that posting the PM from VE was anti-town? That's incredibly silly. What do you suggest I should have done? Held onto it and let a possible traitor accuse me of being mafia later because it wasn't revealed? By posting that, we've netted ourselves at least one traitor, which is a gain.
On July 21 2011 05:12 Lucidity wrote:
Mr. Wiggles (Btw, there shouldn't be a fullstop there :D?), the issue isn't that you've considered the SKs, but that it seems to be your main focus.
You've even considered them individually, crafted a pecking order and their likely behaviour. There is absolutely no point to that pecking order. We'd be lucky to catch an SK at all, nevermind knowing exactly which SK it is. When someone considered your pecking order and replied that we should just be killing ALL SKs your first response was, "Hmmm...ummm....welll....I guess soo..." almost as if this wasn't what you wanted.
You suggested that Batman would be acting like a townie with his scum hunting and that he'd likely be firing into players he saw as scum... Basically you were implying that we couldn't/shouldn't hunt Batman... Because we'd have to hunt for someone who appears pro-town. (And I don't think that behavioural analysis holds any merit)
I'm sure the other SK picked up on this and I guess we'll find out what happened on the morrow.
SK's are in no way my main focus, but they share my focus with mafia, because at the end of the day, they're all scum.
I made a pecking order, because Joker will be easiest to catch of all the SKs, and killing him will remove all third parties. Objectively, he's the best one to kill, if we can find him. Of course we should kill all SKs, when we find them, but in my opinion the only one we have a realistic chance of finding is the Joker.
I suggested Batman will try to appear pro-town. I never said he was pro-town. Try to think of this, with me.
The Joker is a serial killer. He wants to live until the end. He also wants to avoid mafia shots, because he will be forced to claim, bringing scrutiny to him, or he will be outed by mafia. To accomplish this, he will play a very bland, safe, style. This style is scummy because it contributes nothing to town, and just lets him skirt along until the end. It's also the style of lurkers as well as some mafia. So, shooting for the Joker, Batman will be shooting into "scummy" people. Batman wins by killing a serial-killer, who is by definition anti-town, so he isn't trying to accomplish an anti-town objective, which will help him in his mindset for posting. If he's smart, he will try to use the lynch to his advantage, by actively scum-hunting FOR THE JOKER, and trying to get him lynched as well. By actively scum-hunting, he will appear pro-town, and if someone solves the clues about him, he will just look like a vigilante, thus making it hard to find and kill him to remove Ra'as. I have no clue what Ra'as will do. He'll probably just try to avoid detection while firing into scum-hunters, where batman will most likely be.
So, the joker is the easiest third party to find, because he will act the most anti-town out of all of them. He's also the best one to lynch, because it will remove all of the third-parties.
At this point, and the way you keep trying to call me the batman and ask for a hit on me, I'm beginning to believe that you are the Joker yourself. You can't kill batman, so you're continuously pointing out the person you believe to be Batman, in the hopes that Ra'as believes you and hits him, removing himself and Batman from the game, thus removing the threat to you, and reducing the focus on the third-parties.
Also, nice slip with the bolded part. So you're an SK, right? And Ra'as is the "other"?
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