Surprisingly Normal Mini Mafia II

1 Mafia Role Blocker, 2 Mafia Goons, 9 Town

On May 16 2011 12:52 Mataza wrote:
lynch and night kill. It means two people die between days.
First day we are 12, and on day 4 we will be 6. If we never catch a maf, we lose then, because to vote we need to be more than 50% Townies.

I think I overestimated my town

Captain obvious also says:
flamewheel91 is the Town Coach.
Caller is the Mafia Coach.
Qatol is the Neutral Coach.

Asking the very basic questions is spam that doesn´t get us any information, which is anti town behaviour.
I bet you 5 dollar that at least 1 mafia guy will pretend to not understand how the game works, if we keep asking dumb questions. We have Coaches for questions.

On May 17 2011 21:48 prplhz wrote:
Yo people

I see that people have started voting now, around 16 hours before deadline. This is not good people. Unvoting is very suspucious and there is still plenty of time for people to provide material to analyze. Of course some claim to do it for the sake of discussion but I still think that this is very bad. In addition to this I do not think that any of these votes are currently well founded, they are wild accusations at best.

First of all, in my opinion, having perfect conviction and unerring foresight are NOT prerequisites to being a good townie. In fact, if people have it in their minds that unvoting is suspicious, they won't vote until someone tells them it's the right thing to do. People should make up their own minds and vote according to what they think is right for the town. And if that changes, that's totally fine. Unvoting isn't suspicious...what's suspicious is the TIMING of unvoting.

I also think that it is bad that people have removed focus from Mataza. While he might not be scum this town has him very much under control. He is very active and has agreed to answer every question directed at him. These are very useful qualities for town to find in a player, no matter if he is scum or townie. We should have tried to use these qualities to hunt scum.

So wait...is it bad or is it good that people have removed focus? You appear to have nothing against Mataza from this passage, aside from the fact that people aren't focusing on him anymore.

I would love to have waited with this post until GiygaS next post but lets just go ahead and do some analysis.

I do not think that Mataza is harmful for this town just yet. He is under control so far, I would like him to be more harmful for the Mafia though. So I ask this:

@Mataza : With the information available to you now, who would you lynch if you should lynch the player you think is most likely to be Scum?

Further evidence that you're okay with Mataza...asking his advice as you feel he has qualities you can use to hunt scum.

So I'm going to go ahead and do something that VisceraEyes has done several time. Point fingers at some random person for the sake of discussion. And this random person is going to be VisceraEyes himself. Some reasons (so it's not entirely random who I am pointing fingers at) for this:

1. He was the first person who point fingers at others. While he might have done this for the sake of discussion, I think that mostly scum would do this early on in the game. Townies would consider how the other person might be a townie and how unfounded accusations might harm the town, even if you made it clear that they are unfounded.

While this is a game of finger pointing, and we can't all do it simultaneously...being the FIRST to point fingers shouldn't really be a scum-tell...SOMEONE is going to be first, and there's no reason to believe that it will be scum.

2. He is often analyzing his own actions. This is something I think you would (should) mainly do when you are scum. There is nothing to fear as a townie, only thing you have to consider is how the town can benefit the most from your actions. While we would all like to survive this game I think this is done best by being honest and only analytical of the actions of potential scum.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'analyzing my own actions', but I've been nothing but honest and forthright with everyone from the beginning. Obviously there's no way to prove that, but I've also given you no reason to doubt me.

3. He has just something I would deem crazy to do if you were a townie. He suddenly said "this guy I have been bashing all game long, maybe he's not scum so I'm just gonna vote for someone and provide very limited rationale for this". This is not only very scum-like in my eyes, it is also harmful to the town.

Okay, speaking to this...I had a scummy feeling about Mataza from the beginning, and I FoS'd him. I didn't 'bash' anyone 'all game long'. Not only that, but I shifted my focus OFF of someone you've spent a lot of this post BUILDING UP as someone useful for town. I fail to see how me NO LONGER SUSPECTING someone you feel is trustworthy would indicate scumminess.

@VisceraEyes : Do you think that it is beneficial for the town that you suddenly make a 180 in letting Mataza off the hook and go full force against stefftastiq?

Off the hook? But...you....you said you....but...Guy, these contradictions are getting palpable.

Another player who has struck me as harmful to the town is Palmar. He has recently used some very questionable rhetorics to defend Mataza, and while it might be good that Mataza is not lynched, questionable rhetorics are always harmful to town. But on the other hand he also appears to be a very strong player who the town can make good use of later on, so maybe it is just a question of getting him under control

@Palmar : Why do you think Mataza is "innocent as a newborn baby"? Gutfeeling is not an acceptable answer


Think that was it for now. I will try to vote around 4 hours before deadline. Finals notes on what I think all townies should currently be aware of:

Lurking townies make it possible for scum to play lurker style too. I think everybody should get up and post some analysis, if you are a townie this is absolutely the best thing you can do. We still missing a couple of you but this is making the game very much harder for town!

I would consider any of the prospective modkills (Skrammen, Wunder) showing up in the nick of time to cast crucial votes for the lynching VERY suspicious. Even if they decide to show up now I think they will be very harmful to town if they don't post a lot in a very short amount of time.

It is very good to have people under control; the more they post the more we can ask questions and the more we can make ourselves sure that someone is scum/townie. We will probably have two modkills but maybe it will be beneficial to town to lynch one of the least active players, to set an example, to make the game more fun, to maybe hit a lurking scum!

Oh yeah and GiygaS; my nick is "purple haze" without any vowels or spaces

On May 18 2011 12:26 Palmar wrote:
Alright, turns out he was indeed a terrible mafia!

This definitely isn't a bad start. I still worry about the amount of information we have, but I guess that can be remedied in the coming days.

First thing to do is try not to overthink the situation. There is a chance the mafia might have voted for Giyg as soon as they saw him as a potential target, but the obvious and much more accessible solution is to approach the problem from the point of view that mafia didn't vote for mafia.

So unless any major clues get revealed, the first thing to do is to analyse and understand everyone that got on the wrong side of the vote, and try to find out who was genuinely wrong and who had malicious intent.

Karshe
Hiro Protagonist
Wunder
Nard
Palmar

It's more than likely that both the remaining mafia can be found in this list.

I will break down everyone's posts in this list, except of course myself, that's a job for someone else, and provide analysis in the coming day.

On May 16 2011 18:49 nard wrote:
hio everyone, obligatory 1st post here.

@current discussion:

Mataza seems to be more experienced than the average newcomers here so i don't suspect him just because he made the first posts with some actual content today.. i rather find it interesting that VisceraEyes is jumping to conclusions / trying to badmouth someone that quick. :p

im really curious how were gonna settle for our 1st lynch given that no special roles are in the game!

On May 17 2011 02:25 nard wrote:
dont forget we have an 48hour day cycle, so there is still plenty of time for everybody to post.
i can imagine there are still some people thinking about what they could include in their first post which is not completely trivial - took me a while as well :p

On May 17 2011 10:35 nard wrote:
nice to see a 2nd poster with a lot of content besides mataza - thanks prplhz

onto your note:


i realized when i made that post that it in itself is suspicious as well and thats kinda supporting the argument i posted - everything you post except a trivial "hello" might be endangering your life and i guess most if not all townies want not only the town to win, but also to survive until the end.

as requested here are my opinions on the 3 most active posters. this is no deep analysis just some gut feelings after having read the last 2 thread pages. i might post a reasoning with quotes and all that jazz in a few hours when i have a break.

Mataza - before prplhz posted his argument about him trying to set up a leadership he was pretty unsuspicious to me. currently undeciced, still tending to townie though.
Viscera - so far the most suspicious. locking in on only Mataza, a lot of posts with lacking content.
Giygas - less suspicious then Viscera. kind of in an odd place to make a decision as his posts are way less agressive / suspicious than viscera, but they keep appearing as a double tag team which makes it harder to form a seperate opinion on both.

hoping for the 2 inactives to show up soon :>

On May 18 2011 10:08 nard wrote:
oh my, waking up and checking mafia thread as the 1st thing was a good choice :D
by skimming the last 4 new pages quick i find hiro's lynch logic the most appelling.
as im lacking a big analysis right now, ill jump the bandwagon for the inactives - skrammen slightly more suspicious as after his 1st post there will still 8 hours to go and he didnt post again, even after being asked to.

##vote Skrammen

modkill avoided, suspicion raised - see you on day2 :3