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This is a PM conversation I have had with d3_cresentia, read from the bottom up, first message is his to me
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From: d3_crescentia [ 1353 posts | Profile | Buddy ]
Subject: Re: are you green?
Date: 4/28/10 11:25
I asked if you were green. You said you wouldn't say your role but that you're pro-town. This lead me to believe you were blue, not green - which is why I brought up the curious case of Shockeyy and Ace. Now you say you don't actually have a night action?
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Original Message:
I never said I had a night action, where are you getting this from?
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Original Message:
who did you use your night action on?
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Original Message:
lol is it really that curious that I would say that, what were you expecting "no actually I am mafia!"
On brownbear, to me there just simply seems too little info to go on, he has posted sparcely but done nothing overtly mafialike to me and I am far more concerned with others, RoL for one thing as he has had no input whatsoever so far this game. Whats your plan to get more info on Johnny or is it one your keeping close to the chest?
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Original Message:
Curious that you'd say that. It reminds of the one time when Shockeyy roleclaimed to Ace in PM and then Ace got lynched him for it. I think I now understand why Ace did that, even though Shockeyy flipped blue.
Did Radfield say anything interesting last night? Sort of curious.
I don't have a strong opinion on Johnny yet, but I think I know a way about how to get more information. What about BrownBear?
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Original Message:
You are correct sir! Won't say my actual role but yeah I am pro-town.
What are your thoughts on Johnny? im wavering between him actually being suspicious or me just thinking he is because he jumped on an opportunity to cast suspicion on me and tbh i always tend to think people who accuse me are red when I am a town role. Korynne seems somewhat consistent with his posting style in the other mafia game and on a purely statistical basis he is more likely to be green in that one so good sign possibly.
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Original Message:
I think you are green
Quite frankly I think it is exceptionally scumlike, he is essentially trying to guage whether or not I am a blue role (or possibly double bluffing trying to see if I am red will no doubt be his argument) but this is most certainly not something that a pro-town player would do, everything about it reeks of scumlike behaviour tbh and currently my Vote is on: d3_cresentia
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RoL, hobbes, brown, get involved. There should be no mafia games where people are allowed to get away with inactivity so please start contributing so we can actually try to analyse people, otherwise we are going to be forced to vote out inactives. This is pretty well known but games where people are allowed to get away with inactivity are only good for mafia.
And editing posts is not allowed I'm afraid Kor so your a guy for now!
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For anyone else who is thinking of voting cresentia because they agree with the reasons I layed out for why I consider him likely mafia, please hold off on doing so. I impatiently rushed my first day vote on Abenson as their was little to discuss or talk about and i always consider the first vote a crapshoot. Now however, we have a wealth of things to discuss and players I'd like to see contribute, RoL and Hobbes, and like to hear Johnny's take on things now and assuming d3's vote is actually allowed it is only 1 more vote to lynch.
Cresentia you are acting most strangely this game compared to how you usually are in mafia games, your defence seams weak and illogical, you voted for yourself...? now you are still posting clear mistakes//lies in Xelin's the one that's actually claimed that said he doesn't have a night action
No, I, Did, Not.
However, I agree with you that browns analysis does seem really lacking, but from what I know of you, you would highlight this, explain how how he is wrong in his reasoning and possibly place FoS because of it. Not jump to "Oh i had better lynch BrownBear now".. you really are acting unusually to me and it's making my thoughts that you are mafia all the stronger.
I'm going to have to go over the other thread to try to get more of an idea on brown though.
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Johnny I am not making a big deal, I have given no information whatsoever as to my role and cresentia still is labouring under the delusion that I have and it is irritating, especially since it is unlike 'her?'
On your second point I did read the post, I am simply saying that this reaction:
On April 28 2010 13:54 d3_crescentia wrote:
Oh BrownBear,
Thank you so much. Let's get this out of the way, first.
Vote: BrownBear
Seemed off, and is not consistent with how I have seen cresentia play in the past.
And once again you have posted something fundamentally meaningless yet suspicion casting "I wouldn't be suprised if both xelin and brownbear are both scum, all their posts reek of scum. can we lynch these two already?"
How useful of you to cast suspicion and say my, well our, posting reeks of scum without explaining what you mean at all or providing any form of argument as to why you say that. You have now numerous times this game tried to cast suspiscion without actually providing much if any form of reasoned analysis to my knowledge you have not provided one coherent argument against me that I have not explained, and sure I could be lying but you have just let it drop and are not continuing to analyse. If you think I am scum, address my explanation and reasoning, outline why the way I am posting is suspicious to you, compare styles with past games. Casting suspision without substance is exactly the type of thing that is beneficial to the mafia if they can get away with it, if you are actually town stop doing so and clearly outline your reasons when you try to label people and if your mafia, well don't expect to get away with it.
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I [red] Remove: Vote [red] for now, going to be busy for a while next 10ish hours so may not be able to post and I'll save my vote till later.
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I PM quite abit in games that allow it, you put out you find me suspicious and I wanted to know why, but seeing you've written a big post im going to read it now.
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ok your points seem weak to me, but then again I know I'm town and that the one single thing that I have done that could be linked to a mafia type action is the vote for Abenson, although I fully explained that. Anyway...
Firstly I have outlined the reasons why I find d3 suspicious, you claim I haven't but please go back and reread, secondly his "big plan" you mention, if you read the actual PM's between us I sepcifically ask him, "what is your plan for johnny or are you going to keep it close to your chest" he doesn't even respond which led me to believe his "big plan" was a "big fail". If he legitimately had a plan but didn't want to reveal to me he would have just said "I'm not saying now, you'll find out later on e.t.c" but he didnt even address it, also I felt the suspicious nature of his PM's was more worthwhile to share with the town than the slight chance he actually had a plan(on retrospect I could have simply edited out the big about it but either way imo your overstressing something unimportant and I doubt he had a plan anyway)
You say Instead of doing something I can control (removiing my vote from d3 to not risk someone getting lynched before everyone has had a chance to contribute//show they are active) I instead keep it and simply ask others not to bandwagon too soon. I removed my vote, admittedly the red tagging didn't work but it was still bolded plain as day, just as you have failed to read my reasons for voting d3 and jumped to the conclusion that I didn't//don't have any so you have failed to read that I changed my vote.
So as far in terms of substantial reasons for considering me mafia, you are relying on my voting Abenson. I have explained this as best I can and outlined my reasoning//mindset behind it. If you think that is bullshit then fine I can do no more, but I would ask you to reread my posts talking about that as the only point you brought up about my defence of the vote on Abenson, was that I considerend Abenson to not be very useful and you said you disagree with voting for someone based on their usefulness.
Put more effort into your analysis, if i am mafia then it is in your interest to address my specific points of defence, analyse my posting, not simply rely on your opinion of actions and generalisations.
And RoL can you hurry up and post...
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The last bit in the post above was to eveyone, not specific to you Kor, you haven't generalised much but there seems to be quite alot of "seems scummy as hell to me" type comments flying around without much backup.
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Hobbes your are not the only one, I was suspicious and still am of johnny for the same reason, I disagree on voting brownbear, if this was the first day lynch I would be fine with it because the reasons against him seem similar to the reasons raised against Abenson but we have far more information to go on now and quite frankly far better candidates. Brown does not seem mafia although I'll have to go over the other game because if he shows clarity, strong argument and reasoning e.t.c then the fact it is missing from this game would be telling.
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Ok I have decided I'm going to be voting: Johnnyspazz
My vote on Cresentia was a reactionary response to the mafia like PM's and also that he seems to be playing so differently this game than the others I have been with him in, given that to my knowledge he has been town in all of those something seemed off however, he has explained somewhat the PM interactions and there was alot of room for misinterpretation so I shouldn't overstate that, his different manner is still worrying to me but not enough for a vote as of now.
Johnny on the other hand has continuously, almost from the moment the first lynch was decided, attempted to cast suspicion far and wide and without much credible analysis. His posts seem so scumlike to me as this is EXACTLY the type of thing that benefits mafia yet does not benefit town and so I'm voting him.
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And Kor, I removed my vote and said I was going to be away for some time, but think through this, clearly it means I do not want anyone to be lynched in the time that I am away, whilst not explicitly stating "i removed my vote to avoid a quick lynch" that was the intent, there doesn't seem another explanation although I haven't tried to think up a possible one.
As to the PM's I see a little more clearly now. I thought you were opposed to it as you believed I wanted to stop you posting analysis on me to everyone and just keep it private so people don't get to see. This baffled me a little as I've tried to make it clear I want people to analyse as long as it is justified and I will always respond to it. But you said it's because you suspected I might do so in order to get tips on how to come across less mafialike (this assuming I am mafia) and in that case it does make sense although I would say it's a little far-fetched but certainly plausible.
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Also I should mention i would change my vote if it would mean lynching RoL, unless he posts ofc, but even then there needs some serious explanation as to why he has done absolutely nothing this game. I would think he is close to being modkilled currently, especially given how small this game is.
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Bill will RoL be lynched if he does note vote//post before the next night?
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Also we cannot let this day go by without someone getting lynched, simply someone has to a no lynch is advantageous to the mafia.
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BrownBear doesn't seem mafia and im suprised so many of you think so, but looks like he's getting the chop...
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This last minute jump is worrying me slightly, assuming the mafia would not vote for one of their own in order to establish trust, and assuming that johnny is actually red, that leaves either brownbear or RoL as the other mafia. This is possible and would be great although something seems slightly amiss.
tbh Johnny has played in such a scummy fashion that I really shouldn't be second guessing at this point, but when last minute jumps are made it's worrysome.
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Ok, I Remove Vote i believe you johnny take the vote off yourself plz, was having misgivings and you wouldn't post like that, as well as edit, on your final post if you were mafia.
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I'm not even sure self voting counts, it never has in any other games.
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The majority of votes has not been reached, if Kor's vote counts at 3 and I took mine off at the same time then it is only 3 people voting for you, all that matters is whether you are allowed to vote for yourself (in which case yeah your fucked) but that has never been allowed in any other games and it seems unlikely to be allowed now, especially when taking into account the only reason you voted for yourself was that you were sure majority had already been reached which it had not.
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She changed her vote before 3pm KST so how can that count? If she was not allowed to do the thing Qatol outlined then surely you should have told her it was against the rules or something, seems unfair to just decide now that your going to adopt that approach without mentioning it at all at the time the post was written.
If brownbear is mafia disregard all of this but lets face it he isn't...
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EPT
