EPTMini Mafia 2 - Page 4
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
Then went back out at 11AM this morning. :'( | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 14:30 L wrote: Yo, bro, you gotta be more active if you're mafia. Your zero content made it obv you were mafs. Shoulda jumped on the 'rape mikey' train. I wasnt here, was working :/ | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 15:37 Scamp wrote: Screw that Malongo. Killing you led to town cruising for the win.  Malongo is the town's MVP | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 15:39 L wrote: Ace, I gave you the opportunity to wagon the medic. Don't say I don't love you. why would I kill RoL who amazingly was the only other person to call Judge's BS? Anyone claiming Day 1 should be scrutinized because...we've been through this like 5 games already. Especially MEDIC of all roles. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 15:42 Malongo wrote: Imo this was a little underbalanced against mafia. Well they didnt play that good either. we played fine. We just had some weird bad luck moments, and a few good ones. You not killing Judge actually saved the town from a serious situation. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 15:53 L wrote: Because it was pretty obvious that the only people who would be willing to go so far as to campaign to kill the guy would either: 1) Know he IS lying. or 2) Be fearful mafia. Scrutinizing is fine; I pretty much vomited the fact that he wasn't the medic into the open during day 1. Killing the guy, however, prior to him taking a single anti-town action is way off into crazyland. There's no incentive for a green townie to rail for his lynch unless you were heavily trying to metagame, which wasn't an explanation anyone brought up. People simply talked about prior metagaming regarding early claims. nemY also hung himself this way. Judge and I talked about you either being a vanilla townie trying to trap people with your push against judge, or being a mafia. When you were unrepentant, you kinda sealed your own fate. I'll be honest though, between you and RoL, I was certain one was mafia. I wasn't 100% certain of which, though, which I remarked to Zato when he asked me for comments regarding hitting you. In the end, I think I made a rather large error in my analysis by ignoring the reaction of the legit medic to judge's claim, but it all worked out because chez and zato fucking raped this shit. I guess I'll have to show you why I thought this was just a bad play by the town overall that just worked out very lucky. The minute Judge claimed Medic I was expecting a town lynch. It was actually the perfect reaction no matter what role I had : any Day 1 claims especially something that can't be proven should be looked at as a Mafia ploy. We've been through this like almost every game but it's impossible to know when the town is thinking straight. I immediately told Incognito to make me a Medic and I started accusing Judge. Even with Judge's bad play I was hoping I'd get DT checked. Amazingly I didn't, nor did Judge. This was my alibi for calling Judge out - I knew he was lying not only because it was a dumb move but because I was the real medic. Next I had the Malongo situation because Zato came out of no where and blew Malongo up. This was a HUGE turning point of the game for a lot of reasons: Zato looked like he was saving Judge. In all fairness in any reasonable game Judge looked like Mafia for his move. L you yourself were batting for Judge blindly. There was no plan that could be implemented based on RCs when there's a GF in the game. None. I knew this and a few other people did too. Thats why when Judge was screaming about it I was thinking tough shit - no one cares. Especially when you say "wait and see" - that should have been the prime lynching point for Judge. With all that we had a prime situation: 2 of you looked like Mafia and Zato at the least looked fishy. He called Malongo out literally based on nothing. My whole play was me acting like a Medic all game knowing that Judge was lying. When the lynch came we also got another break. Chezinu said he was PMing around with Scamp. Scamp then last minute votes while Chez is playing around and taunting Malongo and Judge. Then Chez flip flops. I was actually sitting here thinking to myself how is possible no one would lynch Chez at this point? Everything up to this point was great for us. No Mafia were in the crosshairs except myself, which was great. Several townies were looking really bad, and for some weird reason L wanted to go for RoL who honestly played like a perfect townie. He did nothing wrong yet. Then the play that ended the game came. Malongo didn't off Judge. This was the major play of the game that saved the town. None of the Mafia had any incentive to switch off of Judge because it made 0 sense - Judge looked guilty. If he died and flipped whatever he was (I knew he wasn't a Medic) Zato was going to be fucked royally (well, probably not with the way the town was playing). L still had a decent alibi saying he wanted to see what the plan was. Malongo was surely going to live no matter what, and we would have went into the next night sailing smooth with some good targets to hit. Chezinu role claims the next day, and then Zato does right after. This was SWEET for us because no matter what Chez said it wasn't going to stick. I went to bed knowing it was highly possible for chez to die. Then I had to go to work and didn't come back for about 36 hours up to this point. In this time span MM as rallied on, and I didn't even have a chance to put in any posts because I was away. Zato also brings forth a mega post based on the last time I was Mafia (another game in which I missed the beginning of everything) and trumps me. If I was here I could have used my Medic defense and shown why I played the way I did. But Zato crucially pointed out that instead of trying to bury Judge I blamed people. This was a break in my defense because if I claimed Medic I should have kept hammering on Judge. He was the only person in the game to pick up on it while everyone else kept saying "ace is suspicious" which everyone says any game I play in. So all in all I think we did well considering the town had 0 clue what was going on, and it was Malongo's play and Chez's Ids that got the game sealed away. The town was making mistake after mistake and before this time frame no one was doing anything. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
GG. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 17:00 L wrote: Exactly. It isn't enough that you think judge is lying. You need to think he's mafia and stands to gain something from lying. Additionally, how could I have been batting blind if my switch from criticism to support was admittedly when judge told me the content of his plan during day 1. What godfather would volunteer himself for a CONFIRMATION lynch and call a huge amount of town attention to himself? If judge was mafia, he asked for a DT check and would be killed according to his plan. If he was godfather, my slight modification to his plan would have removed his trade for our DT and left him essentially self-raped for no benefit. If he was town, we got a confirmed townie pool to claim to. So why would I want to have him killed day 1? He gains the fact that the town believes he's a legit Medic. It doesn't matter if I believe he has nothing else to gain from it. He's lying. This is fundamental action of the game: a person lying blatantly is anti-town. There is no extra layer of what ifs and whys. It also doesn't matter that he asked for a confirmation lynch via DT check: How do you know once he's checked whatever he flips doesn't call for the DT to talk up? You don't. That's the entire point of Lynch All Liars play. You don't know as much information as he does so you can't know what his benefits are. Hence, you just lynch anyone lying to stop any Mafia from bullshit claims on Day 1. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 17:08 vx70GTOJudgexv wrote: You're an idiot. I stand by my statement that you're an incompetent mafia player, now I'm adding in you're just plain incompetent. I'll ask again. If I'm such a bad player, and I'm such a hinderance for the town. Why the NIGHT KILL jackass? Usually mafia only nightkill those who they feel are a threat to them in the town. But funny, according to you, I seem to be useless and the reason town almost lost. Hmmmm.... flawed logic much? So again. GG. I DIDNT KILL YOU I WASNT HERE. How many times do I have to tell you that? Durrrr? | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 18:15 Vivi57 wrote: No it's right. We know he's lying. Its no longer even a question of "oh gee why would Mafia do that?!". You don't know what the Mafia knows. You don't know if someone slipped up some info in PMs. It comes down to is this guy lying or not? And townies that lie aren't going to get you very far. This very game showed you that because for all the praise of Judge's plan it didn't even come through. Wrong again. You have NO idea about anything relating to Judge. Nothing. There was no one connected to Judge in any way. All you know is this: Judge claimed Medic on Day 1. Stop trying to make it sound like there was some hidden condition by which Judge had to be innocent. There isn't one. You also didn't know I was GF. This is the same logic that was used last game I was Mafia and look what happened then. What is this bs? Can you list all the possible scenarios? The only claimer I wanted to kill was Judge. He lied, he had a plan, and it was on a role that couldn't be verified. Whether I'm town or Mafia why in the hell would I want him in a leadership role? Amazing, because the best players this game were 2, possibly even a 3rd person no one would have expected. Don't even try to post drivel like this and make it sound like there was some major mind game going on here. There was no major comprehension that was missing at all this game - everyone was playing screwy and letting things that normally would lead to death, like lying, just go. The site Judge even plays on his this in plain sight. Then again you can just ask other Mafia players on this forum that didn't play but watched this game what they think. Either way I had fun this game but in no way should anyone think Medic claims on Day 1 is some brilliant strategy that only Einstein could come up with - especially when it didn't even help you win. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
We hit HoE because he was posting quality stuff, and we didn't even need to touch the main townies. All of them were playing suspicious enough that leaving them alive was beneficial. I think nemy or MM also had Scamp as a possible target. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
and for all those who think I'm in the wrong here's another take on the situation: Lynch All Liars | ||
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Ace
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MM and nemy weren't even starting fights so I don't know where you got that from. | ||
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Ace
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nemy played it solid. It made no sense to not push to lynch the claimer because it was the most pro-town play at the moment. Either way you never saw any of us going around agreeing with each other on everything all game. Remember from the outside looking in we all came off as pro-town so it doesn't even matter if you get a feeling we agreed. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 12 2010 05:52 L wrote: Wrong. I don't even see how you can say this with a straight face. If Chez was a DT: free kill. If Chez was mafia, we vig hit him the same night. The only reason you'd hit chez first is because you want to kill the DT as mafia. I mean, this was pretty transperant, check the vote list. The reason we've used 'lynch the claimer' in the past was because we had large underground confirmed townie groups in certain games and we wanted to dissuade mafia from faking DT. That simply doesn't apply here; mafia can't trade 1 for 1 starting on day 2 and hope to succeed. I thought we were talking about Judge here? We use lynch the claimer all the time when the claimer can't be confirmed (almost always on Day 1) because it dissuades Mafia from claiming on Day 1. It's a general metagame strategy that you'll find everywhere. No, you didn't look pro town. Why do you think you three were chain killed? Magic? Clairvoyance? We did look Pro-town. If we didn't how come none of you pinned us on Day 2 with the exception of Chez and Zato? Oh right, all those "this game is weird, the town seems lost, wtf is going on" references clearly made it obvious we were easily spotted. Right. Amazing how after the game everyone seems to say they were right all along but during the game barely any of you could get anything going. How about you just give Chez, Zato and Malongo the credit for winning the game? If we were so easily Mafia looking you should have had us Vigi'd on Night 1 but instead you sitting there asking for RoL to be lynched. You were just as lost as the rest of the town. | ||
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United States16096 Posts
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Ace
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On January 13 2010 01:10 L wrote: Lynches aren't for killing people you don't like. They're for killing mafia. Unless you thought judge was mafia, there was no reason to hit him, much like there was no reason to hit chez prior to mikey. You guys are using a shorthand solution from arguments we've had in other formats to justify a very poor move. Lynching Judge had nothing to do with not liking him, stop making that up. We know he was lying because Day 1 medic claims are almost always a lie or at the very least bad. From a town perspective it made sense to get rid of him. It's that simple. *nods @ Qatol's analysis: I tried to play a laid back, nonforceful role because people bitch and moan when I yell at them. Looking at this game they still bitch and moan though. Guess I just have that effect on people ^_^ *nods @ Dreamflower: yea I forgot to include HoE. I don't think anyone would have believed his post (yay I guessed right) partially because the tone it was posted with wasn't a confirmation but more of a hunch. | ||
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