[NA LCS] Spring 2015 Playoffs - Page 201

On April 14 2015 02:05 LimpingGoat wrote:


I've been saying this shit since S4 Worlds where I thought they were going to lose in the finals, everyone thought that was a joke. I said SK was overhyped when everyone thought they were the best Western team going into IEM, guess what, they were overhyped. I said GE Tigers was going to get upset before IEM even started, they got upset.

Before this split started, people thought Santorin was going to be a downgrade from Amazing, I hyped him up, and so many thought teams like C9 and TL were going to be better, I'm not even that proud of this one because it was pretty ridiculous to predict any team besides TSM as number 1 in NA, but I called it.

Now, I'm not too confident that TSM is for sure the best team in the World, and going to win MSI, but I would only give EDG, SKT a chance at beating them in a Bo5, and even then, I'd still give TSM the edge.

Oh and remember those couple days when people actually thought TiP was going to beat TSM because Impact/Rush > Dyrus/Santorin? Good times.

On April 14 2015 02:39 ticklishmusic wrote:
Actually, I'm going to make a crazy statement and say SEA is low key becoming a powerhouse region (or at least capable of hanging with Korea and China). We definitely see that the talent is there (plz ignore Worlds from last season). There's a pretty deep pool of good players, all the region needs is some roster stability to allow team members to make the transition from good to great. Not having much inter-regional import/ export probably helps as well.

Worst case I'm wrong, best case I'm a prophet and quote myself in a few weeks.

On April 14 2015 02:16 MajorityofOne wrote:
GE vs TSM I disagree. Getting your top ahead isn't as bad a trade relative to getting your mid ahead nowadays, a top centric play style can work. Bjergson can play very well on non-assassins so I don't think Monte was right saying its a weak patch for him, yeah he's not gunna be able to spam Zed but we've seen him have great games on mages, but against GE its kind a situation where he needs to get really rolling ala Xiye to make up for GE's stronger teamfighting, and that at least IS harder for mids to do this patch. Also, if TSM is good at laneswaps, GE is at least equally good. Smeb is going to have more game impact than Dyrus if everything is even. I know in NA whenever teams try to camp top it always ends up with them killing Dyrus and bunch then losing because map pressure is being applied elsewhere by Santorin and Lustboy. But its because that map pressure always succeeds against NA teams, especially in laneswap scenarios, and there's no guarantee it does against GE. The end result could just be a dumpstered Dyrus without a tangible gain for TSM.

TSM doesn't have to pressure mid all the time to win, but the fact that Bjergson never gets pushed in lets them focus WT bot if they want. Or they can have Lustboy Santorin cave mid in with Bjergson and that opens up the map. And if youre the enemy team and you just leave Bjergson alone, you might get owned because of it, so that restricts your choices. The options exist for TSM because of Bjergson's strength. So I'm inclined to agree on SKT and EDG, as TSM would be in the reverse situation that they normally are vs Faker or PawN.

LGD's jungle weakness is just enormous. I think any other top team should be able to beat them despite them having great laners just on how weak they are at that position. But they could also potentially upset people because of Imp or Weiless just going off. In theory this meta should play into Flame's strengths but they might not even use him.

I don't even want to try with Snake and OMG, those teams are still mindfucks to me. Maybe Krystal and Uzi just wreck everyone and one of them ends up world champion. I don't think either is obviously better or obviously worse than TSM and trying to sort out how their styles match up is difficult when 1) we have no clue if Snake can do anything except the 1 thing they always do and 2) we have no clue if OMG has just been lawling the entire split so far

EDIT: And yeah, theres no POINT to all this speculating, but it is fun to do.

On April 14 2015 02:47 wei2coolman wrote:

SEA's best team can maybe hang in midtier for korea, and china, but "powerhouse" it's not. Probably a step below NA, around EU level is more accurate/

On April 14 2015 03:35 oo_Wonderful_oo wrote:


It's not like EU as region is step below NA, rofl.
NA/EU/SEA are on same level outside of TSM/yoe, who're stronger than other pack and could be top-6 in LPL probably/top-4 OGN.

If Fnatic can take down TSM at MSI it might be good sign though for EU.

On April 14 2015 01:49 LimpingGoat wrote:


EDG might not even be better than TSM, why assume Snake is.

On April 14 2015 04:35 Ansibled wrote:
I've lost the ability to know what is serious in this thread.

Are people seriously rating TSM above SKT/GE/EDG etc?

On April 13 2015 13:53 Buonomo wrote:
Turtle's been trending upwards since Worlds.

On April 14 2015 02:13 Azarkon wrote:


In that case, what basis is there for stating that TSM won't ever beat EDG and SKT, after all they haven't met each other, have they? Theorycrafting is theorycrafting regardless of whether it's team vs. team / player vs. player. Observers are bound to theorycraft because it's entertaining to do, not because it's objective fact.

Having said that, such theorycrafting is not completely useless. 1v1 match ups are a lot easier to "eyeball test" than team vs. team just as mechanical differences were easy to spot in Starcraft. EU mids have shown parity with all but the very best Korean mids for years now; Bjergsen losing to PoE is surely an upset but also not completely out of the left field. Froggen and Xpeke both matched Korean mids at Worlds last year - Ggoong and Dade, respectively - and this year, Bjerg did the same at IEM vs. Coco, and I reckon so is Febiven when given the opportunity.