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oo_Wonderful_oo
The land of freedom23126 Posts
Even though, 2-0 isn't something unreachable, especially if Seraph grew more shinergy. Against C9 they just have to run standard lanes and not mess up those laneswaps, with Dignitas there is possibility that either we're going to see slaughterhouse or just messy game. | ||
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KissBlade
United States5718 Posts
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Disengaged
United States6994 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On June 07 2014 16:57 IMoperator wrote: people overhype clg so much lol, they look pretty mediocre each game, just the other team does some really stupid decision and they win 5 minutes after cause of that. They're the 2nd strongest early game team (2nd highest avg gold before 10minutes.) They're hardly mediocre. If c9 doesn't step it up. Very likely clg ends up top 2 Source if you think I'm spewing shit. http://www.ongamers.com/articles/na-lcs-stats-assessing-early-game-proficiency/1100-1648/ | ||
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orzeu
Poland5205 Posts
On June 08 2014 01:36 Disengaged wrote: TSM gonna get wrecked with the way they are playing recently. They always played like that, difference is that Bjergsen can't snowball and bot is weaker. CLG is good but they are making a lot of mistakes right now. Winning pre 30 min doesn't mean a lot when opponents are retarded. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On June 08 2014 01:52 orzeu wrote: They always played like that, difference is that Bjergsen can't snowball and bot is weaker. CLG is good but they are making a lot of mistakes right now. Winning pre 30 min doesn't mean a lot when opponents are retarded. TSM looks so bad. C9 is still impressive to me. They manage to win a lot of games despite how mediocre their early game is. | ||
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Sleight
2471 Posts
On June 08 2014 01:56 wei2coolman wrote: TSM looks so bad. C9 is still impressive to me. They manage to win a lot of games despite how mediocre their early game is. Hai was so good last split, heartbreaking to see how far he fell after his lung attacked him. | ||
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Fusilero
United Kingdom50293 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On June 08 2014 02:07 Sleight wrote: Hai was so good last split, heartbreaking to see how far he fell after his lung attacked him. I'll get a lot of flack for this, but I've never thought hai was that good tbh. He's essential to how c9 works as a team, and a reason why they're so successful as a team, but his individual ability has always been fairly mediocre imo. If you were to trade him at his prime, for any midlaner in any LCS team right now, it would not be a net positive for the team, except for maybe Curse. Riot casters always talk about his mediocre stats because he's always "helping his team", I don't buy it. He's got mediocre stats, because he's a mediocre player. | ||
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orzeu
Poland5205 Posts
On June 08 2014 02:25 wei2coolman wrote: I'll get a lot of flack for this, but I've never thought hai was that good tbh. He's essential to how c9 works as a team, and a reason why they're so successful as a team, but his individual ability has always been fairly mediocre imo. If you were to trade him at his prime, for any midlaner in any LCS team right now, it would not be a net positive for the team, except for maybe Curse. Riot casters always talk about his mediocre stats because he's always "helping his team", I don't buy it. He's got mediocre stats, because he's a mediocre player. Ye, I agree. His champion pool was always small and his laning phase is not good. I still can't believe how he gets away with random lvl 2 ignites and stupid roams. | ||
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Sleight
2471 Posts
On June 08 2014 02:40 orzeu wrote: Ye, I agree. His champion pool was always small and his laning phase is not good. I still can't believe how he gets away with random lvl 2 ignites and stupid roams. This is simply not true. His laning phase was great last split. He 1v1d fucking Bjergsen. You can't talk about how insane Bjergsen's laning phase is, and then the guy who beats him is trash despite having only lost lane to him TWICE ever in their 5 meetings. His champion pool was sufficient because Yasuo, Raka, Lulu, Leblanc, KZ were rarely all banned out. Now he gets banned/picked out easy because his TF is too weak and KZ isn't viable unless its a good matchup. Don't know why he didn't go back to Yasuo vs LMQ actually. Hai outperformed every mid except Bjergsen last split. This split he is now a clear 4th but he is recovering. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On June 08 2014 02:48 Sleight wrote: This is simply not true. His laning phase was great last split. He 1v1d fucking Bjergsen. You can't talk about how insane Bjergsen's laning phase is, and then the guy who beats him is trash despite having only lost lane to him TWICE ever in their 5 meetings. His champion pool was sufficient because Yasuo, Raka, Lulu, Leblanc, KZ were rarely all banned out. Now he gets banned/picked out easy because his TF is too weak and KZ isn't viable unless its a good matchup. Don't know why he didn't go back to Yasuo vs LMQ actually. Hai outperformed every mid except Bjergsen last split. This split he is now a clear 4th but he is recovering. Except the stats don't prove it. He didn't get a significant advantage over any midlaner in individual goal out of individual play. Not to mention he has the best jungler in LCS, best top laner in LCS, along with one of the stronger bot lanes, all drawing pressure away from him. Meanwhile, players like Shiphtur, and Pobelter have to deal with fucking mentally braindead junglers who don't bring jackshit to their teams, and have a botlane that finds a way to feed 5 kills by the 10 minute mark. Despite all this hai barely manages to look alright? Just look at international experience from c9, where is it that they always seem to fall short immediately? It's the midlaner, they get crushed midlane, and they get snowballed on. It's the first pillar to fall for c9 before they get shat on by everyone else. | ||
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orzeu
Poland5205 Posts
On June 08 2014 02:48 Sleight wrote: This is simply not true. His laning phase was great last split. He 1v1d fucking Bjergsen. You can't talk about how insane Bjergsen's laning phase is, and then the guy who beats him is trash despite having only lost lane to him TWICE ever in their 5 meetings. His champion pool was sufficient because Yasuo, Raka, Lulu, Leblanc, KZ were rarely all banned out. Now he gets banned/picked out easy because his TF is too weak and KZ isn't viable unless its a good matchup. Don't know why he didn't go back to Yasuo vs LMQ actually. Hai outperformed every mid except Bjergsen last split. This split he is now a clear 4th but he is recovering. He killed him 1vs1 when he had 2 kills and assist, when Bjergsen was 0-1-0. | ||
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Sleight
2471 Posts
On June 08 2014 02:56 wei2coolman wrote: Except the stats don't prove it. He didn't get a significant advantage over any midlaner in individual goal out of individual play. Good thing individual performance in individual play isn't the only that determines how good someone is in a team game then. Teamfighting, shotcolling, helping your other players are all metrics that are relevant to evaluating skill. So... Yeah. Saying, "Well he'd lose a 1v1 fight at Baron" is pointless. That doesn't exist. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On June 08 2014 03:20 Sleight wrote: Good thing individual performance in individual play isn't the only that determines how good someone is in a team game then. Teamfighting, shotcolling, helping your other players are all metrics that are relevant to evaluating skill. So... Yeah. Saying, "Well he'd lose a 1v1 fight at Baron" is pointless. That doesn't exist. lol. except it does play a massive fucking role in early game, as mid lane is the only lane that regularly gets the 1v1. Not to mention, we're strictly talking about the midlane role here, how is he in anyway better than his counterparts? Cuz he has a jungler, top lane, and bot lane that draws pressure away from him? Best team in NA for 2 splits? Still barely making avg cs at 10 min mark in comparison to other midlaners? like wut. Look, I'm not saying Hai is a bad player by any means, or that c9 needs to replace him. He brings important shotcalling skills and non-tangibles to c9, and could not be replaced. But, his actual ability to play out the midlane during laning phase has always been fairly mediocre. You can only compensate for your early game so much with shotcalling and rotations, before it starts to be putting the cart before the horse. | ||
AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
Or talk to me about curating the LRs personally if you're interested! | ||
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MeteorRise
Canada611 Posts
On June 08 2014 03:30 wei2coolman wrote: lol. except it does play a massive fucking role in early game, as mid lane is the only lane that regularly gets the 1v1. Not to mention, we're strictly talking about the midlane role here, how is he in anyway better than his counterparts? Cuz he has a jungler, top lane, and bot lane that draws pressure away from him? Best team in NA for 2 splits? Still barely making avg cs at 10 min mark in comparison to other midlaners? like wut. Look, I'm not saying Hai is a bad player by any means, or that c9 needs to replace him. He brings important shotcalling skills and non-tangibles to c9, and could not be replaced. But, his actual ability to play out the midlane during laning phase has always been fairly mediocre. You can only compensate for your early game so much with shotcalling and rotations, before it starts to be putting the cart before the horse. I agree. Even in his prime Hai was pretty good, but never really felt like a particularly fearsome laner. He did preform fairly well but he wasn't a player that you were scared of in lane. Hai is a good player because he is really good at shot calling and leading the team, while his lane presence is one of his weaker skills. | ||
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GhandiEAGLE
United States20754 Posts
TSM TSM TSM TSM TSM | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
LMQ C9 DIG CRS | ||
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Amethyst21
Canada7032 Posts
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