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On August 23 2014 00:32 Ketara wrote:
Show me the masteries you're using, if you could.
Personally I use mana regen glyphs vs. ADs. I think mana regen gives you more pressure than AP, especially in the early game where runes matter the most.
There are a couple lanes where I like AP/level blues still. Mostly vs. APs where you can bully them but they can't bully you back or have difficulty doing so, such as say Mordekaiser or Swain. I might go for flat APs over AP/level these days though, since with the buff Lux's level 2 is really really strong now.
Also honestly, don't be so afraid of the jungler. In that Zed game when he went on you at level 2, if Amumu was there as well he also would have been level 2 and you likely could have doublekilled them.
Lux level 1-3 is a strong lane bully, it's 4+ where her power starts to slow down. You want to be dominating the lane 1-3 in the vast majority of matchups. The only things that outbully you at that stage are like, Pantheon/Annie/Syndra/etc. Even Ziggs pretty much goes equal with you now.
The mastery page I use is #15 diamond smurf my ass
http://na.op.gg/summoner/mastery/userName=nobodywonder
For the runes, I only have ap scaling blues and mr blues.  ( Someday I'll get and try out some other blues.
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You are missing out on a lot of regen by not taking Strength of Spirit and Feast, broseph.
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I almost always use scaling ap, can you even oneshot caster minions once you got large rod if you run anything else?
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Depends on when you get it.
The one shot caster minions at level 9 timing for Lux is really sketchy. It depends heavily on how well you're farming and how fast you can buy AP, and it's unfortunately very possible to be put in a position where your E gets casters down to less than 5 HP.
I am pretty interested in scaling AP in a lot of lanes these days since the buff. But against ADs I'll always take Mp5 runes now, because the build I use (2 dorans into armguard into morello) requires it.
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Here is some math on item openers.
Dring vs. Cloth Armor
Basically what I'm interested in is what's better in an early all in situation. I'm assuming 21/9 masteries here, and level 2 since most all in fights happen at at least level 2.
Lux lvl2 with Dring: 616.97 HP, 29.45 armor, 135 barrier, 37.78 AP, 186.466 shield
Lux lvl2 with Cloth: 555.17 HP, 45.2 armor, 135 barrier, 22.78 AP, 175.946 shield
So, for EHP
Lvl2 with Dring: 1408 with shield, 1167 without shield
Lvl2 with Cloth: 1474 with shield, 1219 without shield
So basically, assuming that your opponents damage is all physical, Cloth Armor is better against an early all in than a Dorans Ring, but not by too much, and since it requires more early game potions, it's more efficient to open Dring.
Personally, I'm going to start opening Dring in AD matchups unless it's something where I feel like an early dive is really likely (lets say we've got an enemy Xin Zhao mid and Shaco jungle)
Dring vs. Flask
This one is going to be harder to figure out just with math. Basically what I want to see here is how long you have to be in the lane before a Dring out-regens a flask. I'm assuming 21/0/9 or 24/0/6 masteries with this.
This one got long and boring as fuck, so I'm gonna spoiler the details and TL;DR it.
+ Show Spoiler +A flask+3 start gives you 726 HP and 308 mana.
Assuming 10CS/minute, dring+2 start gives you 390 HP and 1.432 mana per second. I'm assuming 10 CS/minute because that's a good goal to have, basically. It means you miss about 1 CS per wave.
What I want to look at is mana regen, so first we need to get the HP values even. Assuming that the difference in HP between the two is worth about 2 shields, I'm going to add 100 to the effective amount of mana flask+3 gives you, so 408 mana. I actually think this is a little unfair in favor of Dring because it assumes you get 100% use out of both shields. More on that in a bit.
This means it takes about 285 seconds of laning for Dring to go even in regen. So, you break even at about 6:45 game time.
The next big question here, if we want to figure out which opener is better, is how much is each point of mana worth? This is where shit gets kinda theoretical.
Looking at your E, which is your most often used spell, it costs an average of 85 mana during this time (70+85+100/3). Your AP ratio on it is effectively 0.8, so the 15 extra AP from Dring gives you 0.14 more damage per point of mana spent.
So basically, with a Dring, every 7 points of mana you spend is worth about 8 points of mana with a flask. This is assuming you never miss spells, but it's also discounting your Q and W which are both more mana efficient than E, so for the sake of keeping things simple I'm going to assume these two things cancel each other out.
(Note that before the buff it was more like every 10 points of mana you spent with Dring was worth 11 with Flask)
So, just counting the Dring/Flask regen, this adjusted number means it takes 250 seconds for Dring to give more regen (1.432 * 1.14 = 1.632, 408/1.632 = 250). Pre buff this number would have been 259 seconds.
So, now I want to figure out what these seconds values mean. At what point do I hit each level? So lets go into a custom game and figure that out.
You hit levels at these timings:
Level 2 - First minion of the second wave (2:30 approx)
Level 3 - Third minion of the third wave (3:15 approx)
Level 4 - Last minion of the fourth wave (4:00 approx)
Level 5 - Fifth minion of the sixth wave (5:00 approx)
Level 6 - Third minion of the ninth wave (6:15 approx)
The next question is how much does my base mana influence this. At the moment Dring is out-regenning Flask just before you hit level 6, so I'm going to assume 5 levels worth of base mana and base regen here.
Your base mana pool up to level 5 is 500. Effectively 570 with Dring (550 before the buff).
Now our break even point is about 207 seconds (5:27). You're still at level 5 at this point.
But, how much does base mana regen fuck with this? You've got 9 base mana regen, plus 0.6 per level. Your 9 base mana regen gives you another 48 "effective mana" by the time you hit level 5, by our reasoning. The 0.6 per level gives you about another 10 "effective mana" by level 5.
Now it's only taking 171 seconds for Dring to outscale Flask. This is actually just before you hit level 5.
TL;DR
So, BASICALLY, Dring outscales flask at about level 4 now, and before the buff didn't until you were into level 5. Basically. This math is nowhere near exact because I'm assuming a lot of variables (not the least of which is how good your CS is which will vary on the player and the game).
However, the raw stats on Dring makes it stronger at levels 1-2 for sure, and likely level 3 as well. Flask doesnt' become stronger until you've used up its charges, basically.
So before the buff Dring would have been stronger in the level 1-2 area and Flask would have been stronger in the level 4-5 area. Now it's likely that Dring is stronger all the time as long as you're CSing well and hitting your spells. Dring is also a more efficient buy since you have to spend less on potions.
Personally, at this point I will always be opening Dring over Flask, unless I expect to be 1v2ing. If I expect to be 1v2ing I will still open Flask. This is because in a 1v2 I'll expect to be levelling slower, CSing less, and attacking the enemy duo less. I'll also probably take Teleport for a 1v2, so I'll be able to back and tele to my tower at level 3 or so and pick up more flask charges.
An interesting final note about this is that since the efficiency of Dring essentially depends on how well you're playing (how good your CS is and what percentage of your spells hit), the lower the level of play, the better Flask openers will be.
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I ran through your masteries a bit, and see they differentiate quite a bit from mine. I'm going to list some different choices I made and the reasoning behind them, and would like to compare it with your reasoning.
* masteries
Offensive -
24-0-6 vs 21-0-9
I don't get exposed weakness & the weaving duo. Instead I get 3 points meditation, 1 point random(cus fuckit), 3 points insight, 1 point strength of spirit & runic affinity. Other masteries are the same.
Why: while the added damage is nice, lux needs blue buff for sustained sieges / pokewars. 20% longer before your push/poke drastically decreases in potency is invaluable.
Summoner's insight is all about the cd wars in 1v1. I'm the kind of bitch that checks if the other person has it, and if he has ignite I try to force a summoner spell trade early, and look for an allin when barrier gets off cd. That's a 21 second window you have to abuse!
Defensive masteries - I'm too cocky with lux to take defensive masteries
* runes
I was going to do runes too, but then decided to play a game of lux. Will be back later for that!
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How often do you all go for 40% CDR on Lux and how do you like to attain that 40%?
I personally max it out every game with either Athene's/Morellos, 5% mastery and scaling CDR quints.
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Imo 40% CDR isn't really that useful from just runes, Athene's/Morello and masteries. It means that late game, things like blue pot and blue buff give you wasted stats. The 4% from masteries are fine, that plus 20% from Athene's (which I still buy every game, it's still way too good on Lux) is more than enough to survive and do well. I'd rather have a late game with scaling AP or MR blues, or survive lane phase because of MR blues, than reach a quicker 40% with scaling CDR that I'd probably have anyways but from other sources.
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Okay so, a couple notes here.
For CDR, you're getting 20% CDR from your regen item, and minimum 2.5% from masteries because it's required.
If you get more than 7.5-10% from runes or other itemization, you're wasting efficiency on blue elixirs, which are strong on Lux and you should be buying them religiously if the game goes into 40 minutes or so. So, basically, you don't want to be going much over 7.5% on her.
Since Lux's mana costs are so high, I don't like flat CDR runes. CDR is only helpful if you have the mana to support an increased number of spellcasts. While you have that after finishing Athenes, you don't beforehand. As such, I don't like flat CDR runes, why am I going to take runes I can't make any use of the first 15 minutes of the game? Scaling CDR runes give well over that 7.5%.
So for that last 7.5%, basically in the first part of the game you're getting blue buff. At end game you buy a DFG for your 6th item, and then cede blue buff to your jungler or ADC who at that point can make better use of it than you, and you're at 40% CDR. It's a pretty natural progression and it works well.
As far as masteries go. People have asked me why I take the masteries that I do a few times, so let me go through Schwopzi's points one by one, as well as some other masteries I've been asked about. Mastery math is one of my favorite nerdy things to do in LoL, so trust me that there is a lot of research behind this shit.
Exposed Weakness:
This is literally the second strongest mastery in the offense tree, right behind Havoc at 21 points. You should always take this on every champion who is going at least 5 points in offense, no matter what champion it is. The reason why is because of how this mastery actually works, which is contrary to what the league wiki says but is very easy to go test in a custom.
Exposed Weakness increases your own damage.
So, for 1 point, you get a 1% damage increase. This would be strong even if that was all it was, but it's a 1% damage increase to both you and the rest of your team? That's great.
Exposed Weakness stacks with other champions Exposed Weakness.
Yes, that's correct. If all 5 people on your team have Exposed Weakness and all 5 tag an enemy with a spell, all 5 of you do 5% more damage.
Exposed Weakness affects lane minions, jungle monsters, and baron and dragon.
So it helps you CS to a degree, and if all 5 people on your team have it, your team does Baron and Dragon 5% faster.
Exposed Weakness procs on Lux's passive.
Lux's passive damage is coded as a spell, NOT as an on hit effect (more on this when I talk about Blade/Spell Weaving), which means when you tag somebody with a spell, and then hit them with an auto to proc your passive a second later, it extends the duration of the Expose Weakness debuff.
This mastery is ridiculously strong. You should always be taking it.
Blade and Spell Weaving:
These I think are not quite as clear cut as Expose Weakness. Basically they are stronger in the early game when you are going to be autoattacking a lot than they are in late game teamfights when you are going to be focusing on spells and positioning and not autoing often.
However, they are very strong for Lux in the early laning phase, particularly because of how they interact with her passive.
As I said before, Lux's passive is coded as a spell, not as an on-hit effect.
A Lux passive auto gives her one stack of both Blade and Spell Weaving at the same time.
Not only that, if you do a passive auto on somebody as Lux with the weaving masteries, the auto gives you a stack of blade weaving, which IMMEDIATELY increases the damage of the passive hit for that same attack by 1%.
So lets say at level 2 I hit somebody with a Q and do my Q>auto>E>auto combo.
I get a blade weaving stack for the Q.
Auto #1 is increased by 1% and gives a spell weaving stack. Passive #1 is immediately increased by 1% and gives a second blade weaving stack.
I pop the E, which is increased by 1% and gives a third blade weaving stack.
Auto #2 is increased by 3% and gives a second spell weaving stack. Passive #2 is immediately increased by 2%.
On top of that, that second passive hit refreshes my 3 blade weaving stacks, which gives me 3% bonus damage on all subsequent autos if I want to shield myself and keep trading.
The tooltip says that the weaving effect can't trigger multiple times in the same second, but this is bullshit, the above totally works. I think what it means is the same spell can't trigger it multiple times in the same second, like for Singed poison or whatever.
Basically, the weaving masteries are really strong on Lux in the early lane, which is when she has her highest bully potential. I take them because my strategy on Lux in almost every lane is I am going to bully and get a lead right at level 1, and maintain that lead throughout the game.
Another thing to remember about the offensive masteries is that % damage increases in League are all multiplicative, so the more of them you have the better all of them are. If you have 3% from Havoc, 3% from weaving, 1.5% from double edged sword and 1% from exposed weakness, the total isn't 108.5% damage, it's 108.75%. That's not a giant difference but it is something.
Sorcery
This mastery is not bad, it is just worse than the alternatives. Archmage, Blade/Spell Weaving, Double Edged Sword, Expose Weakness and Feast are all just better.
Feast
If you assume 10 CS per minute, Feast is giving you 2.5 HP/5 and 0.8 MP/5. Even if you say Butcher is worthless (It's not, it does help you CS) and Feast is effectively costing 2 points, that's 1.25 HP/5 and 0.4 MP/5 per point, so it's still 1.65x as efficient as the tier 1 regen masteries in Defense and Utility, both of which are on their own quite strong.
Feast is real strong. Take it in every game.
As for the utility masteries.
Summoners Insight
I feel like this mastery looks strong if you say "10% summoner spell Cooldown Reduction." Which is, in literal on paper terms what it does.
In practice that's not what it does.
Summoner spells have very long cooldowns, and you're typically (at least on Lux) using them in a reactionary way. You're using them as a response to your opponent doing something, rather than just walking into lane and flashing on top of somebody the way an Annie or a Galio might.
So, basically, if your Barrier comes up 21 seconds faster than the other guys, the only time these 3 mastery points matter is if you use that Barrier in that 21 second window. What this means is I don't like to look at it as "10% cooldown reduction", I look at it as creating a window in which these points are VERY strong inside that window, and do absolutely nothing outside of it.
But because Lux bullies by safe harassment and never actually needs to go all in in order to fight, and only goes all in as a response to her opponent, it is difficult to create that magic window where you use Barrier inside that 21 seconds. Sure you can walk up and auto the crap out of the guy and use Barrier, but on Lux you don't actually need to do that. You can harass them safely, and if you're strong enough to kill them with a spell combo, you can do it from outside their range in most cases.
I think Summoners Insight is very strong on champions who can make big plays IF they have flash, such as Annie and Galio. But on Lux I don't really see the point over putting more points in offense, thereby increasing her damage and bullying potential at all stages of the game. It's important to remember that you spent 3 points on this shit, not 1. I'd rather have 5% more AP all the time than that 21 second window.
Runic Affinity
Basically, this mastery is strong if you're getting blue buffs, and if you're not getting blue buffs it's not. Also, since I don't like Summoners Insight, this mastery costs more than one point. Since I only see 6 useful points in Utility for Lux, this mastery costs more like 3 points to take.
On top of that, I'm not going to have a blue buff for the first 7 minutes in the game, and once I'm at 6 items I'm going to be letting the jungler or ADC take blue buffs. So I'm only actually using this mastery for what, maybe 75% of the game. And even in that time, I might have a jungler who is hogging blue buffs, or an enemy jungler who is stealing mine.
So I just don't take it. I'd rather have a mastery point that is guaranteeing me a benefit at all stages of the game, such as another point in the Offense tree. If I was doing ranked 5's, I might take this, but in solo queue I'm not going to.
Alchemist
Alchemist is just really strong, especially early in the game. 10% more regen from your potions is 30 HP in your initial lane potions. It takes 3 points to get that much HP from the defense tree. It loses its strength late in the game, but since you should be buying a Flask in Lux and using it religiously, and don't have item slot concerns and can generally keep that Flask until you start building your 3rd or 4th major item, I feel like this is strong.
It's not as strong as it was when Lux was opening Flask over Dring, but I think it's stronger than anything you'd get in Offense or Defense on a 1 point to 1 point comparison, so I'm going to keep taking it. The only thing I might take instead would be maybe a point in HP regen in the defense tree.
Strength of Spirit
This mastery gives Lux 1 HP/5 at level 1, and 3.75 HP/5 at level 18. It's just a really efficient buy for 1 point. Late in the game it's worth about 200 gold (200 gold for a mastery point is pretty good!), and if you look at initial laning, assuming you're in lane about 4 minutes before your first back, that's about 50 HP regenned from this 1 mastery point, which again took you 3 points in Defense to get. Essentially it is a strong, cost efficient early game mastery that also scales as you level.
Let me know if you have any comments Schwopzi!
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Have you done any math on the breakpoints between Recovery and Strength of Spirit?
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Strength of Spirit (on Lux at least) is always better, because Recovery is 1 HP/5 and Strength of Spirit at level 1 is 1 HP/5 and then scales.
It's slightly different for different champs because they have different base mana pools, but on just about everybody with mana Strength of Spirit becomes better than Recovery by level 2-3.
This is not really surprising. Strength of Spirit is a tier 2 mastery with a prereq, so logically it should be slightly better.
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Recovery is 2 HP/5 at level one, strength of spirit is 1 HP/5 at level one (for Lux). You don't get to 2 HP/5 from SoS until you reach 600 mana which with no mana items or runes isn't until level 7.
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Recovery is 1 HP/5 per point, not 2.
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On August 27 2014 13:43 Ketara wrote:
Recovery is 1 HP/5 per point, not 2.
Oh you are comparing per point. Doesn't matter, because no one goes 1/2 Recovery if investing points into defense.
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It does matter though because you want to look at it in terms of what you would reasonably be building.
Assuming that you want 24 points in offense, and assuming that you want 3 points in mana regen (otherwise you wouldn't put any points in Utility at all), you're left with 3 points.
If I go deeper into Utility, I can put one point in movespeed (Not exactly a bad point, especially against skillshot reliant champs) and then get Strength of Spirit and Alchemist.
Strength of Spirit is strictly better than Recovery. Alchemist is about the same in terms of HP regen but also gives mana regen, until late game where 1 HP regen starts to not mean much.
If I go for Defense, I get 2 points in Recovery and 1 point in Enchanted Armor or whatever the name is.
Basically, if you go 3 points in Utility, it's strictly better to go 24/0/6 than it is to go 24/3/3.
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Ok, what you say makes perfect sense, I was comparing it in a general way (probably not the best idea in the Lux thread) like for example a support who might be going 0/9/21.
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Finally got to play Lux v. Orianna.
She's still not bad, but it's easier now.
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And now I got to play Lux v. Xerath.
That one seems really hard. I didn't realize that his stats are just across the board higher than Lux's, which is kinda depressing.
His base HP, Mana, Mana Regen, AD, Armor and Movespeed are all higher.
His AP ratios are all higher.
His range is 25 lower but that's not enough to matter, and honestly it doesn't even make any sense for him to have a low AA range since he's supposed to be a long range, immobile mage.
It's something that really bugs me about Lux these days, her base stats are just absurdly low.
It's also something that bothers me about Xerath. I really dislike the Xerath rework, I feel like it really gutted what made him special and turned him into this super generic ranged mage with no identity. Sad day.
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Now you understand my Xerath pain, he pretty much does most everything Lux does (minus her shield I guess) except better. I will continue to ban him whenever I play mid, in capable hands he's impossible to even fight against unless I get camped 24/7. /QQ
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On September 01 2014 02:18 InfSunday wrote:
Now you understand my Xerath pain, he pretty much does most everything Lux does (minus her shield I guess) except better. I will continue to ban him whenever I play mid, in capable hands he's impossible to even fight against unless I get camped 24/7. /QQ
When I play the B-string champs I feel this way against a lot of champions. 1v1 with no jungle presence or threat at all, who beats Zed? If he can spam aggressive shadows he will beat Lux every time. Same with Xerath and Syndra if they can play forward and spam you with their superior stats and mana sustain. Same with Fizz if he can troll poll aggressively.
These champs are balanced almost entirely on having no escapes or having to save their utility for escapes. If there is literally no pressure and they realize they can stand at the border of your turret for minutes on end with no risk of a gank then you better roam or outplay super hard.
I guess the good news is that the higher you go the less 0 interaction junglers you will run into. It isn't uncommon for me to get no ganks but it is uncommon for my jungler to not gank at all. At the end of the day I am okay fighting to go a little below even on Lux if my other lanes are getting good pressure. You will lose your 100-0 snipes until you catch up but you will still do competitive damage with a well placed ult.
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EPT
