EPTPre 6 ganks are obv the big drawback, but with a point in e + flash to apply red you can make something happen if you chose right lane to gank. After 6 ganks are super strong obv.
[Champion] Diana - Page 8
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Kenpark
Germany2350 Posts
Pre 6 ganks are obv the big drawback, but with a point in e + flash to apply red you can make something happen if you chose right lane to gank. After 6 ganks are super strong obv. | ||
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Artunit
Philippines399 Posts
On December 18 2013 02:18 Kenpark wrote: I play her a lot in the jungle too lately. Full carry style taking every blue and tax like crazy. With her insane clear + the gold passive you can get really farmed, often surpassing solo laners. Pre 6 ganks are obv the big drawback, but with a point in e + flash to apply red you can make something happen if you chose right lane to gank. After 6 ganks are super strong obv. Nice. Can you share your item build / runes and mastery build? | ||
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Kenpark
Germany2350 Posts
Itemwise I still dont know what to get on her. I rush this ap jungle gold/5 item and sorc boots but after that you have a lot of options. I´ve been experimenting with gunblade followed by a nashor tooth with decent success, but you are really squishy and more of a 1on1 assassin then Best bet is prob get your usual Diana items like hourglass, abbysal etc. | ||
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Artunit
Philippines399 Posts
On December 19 2013 03:30 Kenpark wrote: I´m no jungle main and dont have a specific runepage for her. I just use my Kayle page with armor yellows, ap quints, ap blues and for reds I use a mix of as and hybrid pens. Masteries I use 25/5 taking both ap and ad damage. Just get as much ap/ad as possible. The 3 points in defense tree for reduced damage from monsters + your shield allows you to basicly stay in the jungle as long as you want. Itemwise I still dont know what to get on her. I rush this ap jungle gold/5 item and sorc boots but after that you have a lot of options. I´ve been experimenting with gunblade followed by a nashor tooth with decent success, but you are really squishy and more of a 1on1 assassin then Best bet is prob get your usual Diana items like hourglass, abbysal etc. Thanks for your sharing and I'll give this a shot. However if you are going on full ap items would it be better just to have the standard 21/9 ap favored mastery? | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
Do you pick her into aggressive early-game junglers? What teamcomps is she good with / against? How do you decide between Abyssal, Lich Bane, Nashor's, Zhonya's, Rylai's, Rabadon's, Void Staff, etc., all of which seem to be great items on her? How do you counter Diana jungle? | ||
AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
On March 11 2014 08:35 Diamond wrote: So my presence has been requested to discuss Diana jungle. I shall do so a bit later tonight, in the mean time tell me things you want to know so I can make the post as badass as possible. I'm mostly curious as to simple runes and masteries and item progressions to make her as effective as possible from the jungle. Your goals at various points in the game would be interesting to hear as well. | ||
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GhandiEAGLE
United States20754 Posts
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R04R
United States1631 Posts
Iceborn Gauntlet, Frozen Heart, Sunfire, Banshee, Randuins, Visage and the like What are you favorite champion combos to team up with? | ||
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arb
Noobville17921 Posts
On March 11 2014 08:57 R04R wrote: What are you thoughts on Diana switching to a utility tank with damage rather than an ap assassin with utility? Or... when do you like to deviate from mainly offensive items to defensive. Iceborn Gauntlet, Frozen Heart, Sunfire, Banshee, Randuins, Visage and the like What are you favorite champion combos to team up with? Her E + Yasuo is lols | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
Edit: Btw when I said parts, I meant not all of them tonight. But I will ofc answer questions when I'm wrapped up with this. | ||
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MidnightGladius
China1214 Posts
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
Jungle Diana by Diamond ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/7Arifmk.png) Hello! Some people on here were asking for some help with jungle Diana so here it is as requested for you! For those that aren't familiar with me, I am someone that has been jungling Diana since her initial release. I was gifted an RP card by the awesome Semi Pro Joe and have not stopped playing her since. I am not a good player by any means as a Gold level jungler, but I have always played Diana and feel I know some tips and tricks that may help people. I have approx 700 normal games with her, and since Season 2 (I started ranked one month before Season 2 end) roughly 150 ranked games. I also like to play AD Diana on Dominion, but that's another story.... PART 0: WHY? Above all I find Diana jungle to be very fun and one of the strongest AP junglers regardless of jungle state outside of Elise. While she needs to get items to keep up with the game, there is no single item, rune, or mastery that dictates her ability to jungle. At this point the only things that could change this is a total jungle rework or a Diana rework, neither seeming likely. No matter what changes about jungle items, rune or mastery reworks, she will be able to jungle fine. Most people don't realize but you can jungle Diana efficiently on a Lvl 1 account, and that applied even before Spirit items returned health/mana. You can run all crit dmage runes and 0/0/30 and with a leash on the 1st buff, you will be fine (although you will have to make your 1st back much earlier). What I like the most however about Diana jungle is the ability to make massive plays, and become an 1 shot assassin that comes from no where. She brings the same stopping power as a Kha'Zix most points of the game, while being tanky at the same time. She can start an entire teamfight or just pick someone off in 2 seconds. She brings many aspects to the table while being completely flexible in all areas. Except one. The largest knack against Diana and her legitimate only barrier to being a Tier 1 jungle is her god-awful pre level 6. While she brings more early threat than some champions, most of them are picks like Warwick jungle which are rarely seen. However recently meta changes to the jungle have I believe made her a possible solid pick. Champions like Vi/Wukong are largely seen as "farm till 6" champions and are still viable. While her ult does not read "press r to kill enemy mid laner" like Vi, she brings much more utility to her team at all points, with some amazing objective control. Now onto the stuff you want! PART 1: RUNES/MASTERIES/SKILLS RUNES + Show Spoiler [Normal S4 Rune Setup] + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/A89icx8.png) This page is a rune page I stole from TheOddOne of TSM as his go to for AP junglers. I have really taken a like to it over time, and feel it's very appropriate for Diana jungle. Marks - Only ever run attack speed reds. Only deviation is if you like to run 1 crit % mark, but anything else will not bring you the value of AS red's. You auto attack A LOT as Diana and have a built in 20% AS buff on your passive. With runes/masteries/passive you will have a 40% AS boost at level 1! It's pretty close to a Recurve Bow + Dagger for your early clears. With this setup you will find your AS going up quite high no matter the items you choose to build. Most of your Lvl 1-4 damage is AD, you will want the attack speed Seals - Flat armor yellows because you are out of your mind if you ever run anything else on any champion in the game as is. Glyphs - I now run flat AP Glyph's. You have a very strong early clear without extra AP, the extra 11 from this just makes it that much better. I do take these mainly for their pre-6 vs monster power. However you can run any glyph you want. I will cover a few common ones. Scaling AP - Diana jungle falls behind in AP late game no matter what, and these runes will not change that. I tend to favor the overwhelming early power of Diana as a fighter and value her end game as a utility initiator assassin thing? MR (flat or scaling) - These are fine. Seasons 2 and 3 I ran only these, however now with the Season 4 increased jungle gold you have more money to buy MR items that will give more impact. These are really good as you are learning Diana, as they allow you to make some risky plays a bit less risky. CDR - Don't. CDR is pretty useless on Diana, you don't need it. Armor - Again don't. You will stop taking any real damage from the jungle early on and your W is A LOT of HP at all stages of the game. If this is something you want to do, you would be better off with AP of some sort to just make kills faster. Remember, at the core you are an assassin. Anything not listed here is probably not optimal on jungle Diana, but can be used if you lack the proper Glyphs. Quints - This is the wild west. ANYTHING that you might want on any of the following would be ok. A: Assassin B: Mage C: Tank D: Initiator Diana by design fills four unique roles all by herself, so anything can work. In a period of Season 3 I ran Move Speed quints, I have run hybrid pen, whatever. At the moment same as glyph's I value the early clear power and the extra oomph on the early ganks. Remember also AP gives more shield which is more health. For starting Diana players Flat AP all the way. As you learn more about her matchups and style however, you will find having a move speed quint page will do you well. MASTERIES + Show Spoiler [Normal Season 4 Masteries] + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/dgkDZSF.png) I prefer to run 21/9/0 currently as most junglers do. In a perfect world you would run 21/0/9 however the defense on Diana is very vital in the current jungle/meta. Do not let this deter you from exploring however. I have recently ran 9/0/21 Diana and of course 9/21/0 Diana with no problems. As I mentioned earlier, she is not dependent on a certain rune/mastery setup. I will touch now on a few key masteries. Executioner - You are an assassin, even if you are behind or building utility based you do a lot damage, and this mastery is very nice for finishing people off with. Fury - AS > CDR on Diana, no exceptions. Archmage - This imo is very overrated on Diana. Unless you are hard snowballing (like 10-0 at 10 minutes) you will end most games with 300 or so AP. While this mastery makes sense at that point, a majority of your large AP boost items are bought later in the game. This mastery for a large majority of the game will provide you with 2-4 AP for 3 mastery points. I do not believe this is worth. Devastating Strikes - God bless this mastery. Get it if you are deep in the offensive tree every time. Enhanced Armor - I normally choose to skip this but if you pick Diana jungle into a team comp that is all glass cannons (ex: Teemo, Zed, Ezreal, Nami) it could be wise to take this. Runic Affinity - I really wish there was a more motivating case to run 9 utility, as this mastery is MASSIVE on Diana. However the sacrifices you have to make to get it rarely pay off. SKILLS Passive: Moonsilver Blade - This is the skill that makes Diana have such a strong jungling kit despite being an AP mage. DO NOT underestimate the damage as or vs Diana this puts out, especially at lvl's 1-2. I used to practice my lane Diana vs a friend that was in plat as a top Renekton main. He had to run very specific runes/masteries/items to be able to win a trade lvl's 1-3 vs Diana. This passive makes her destroy champs like Vi and Wukong early. I cannot stress how important keeping track of your autos in early fights is to maximize use of the cleave part of it. NOTE: This passive can proc the same auto as Lich Bane. It's possible with Bane/Death Cap/Nashor's/Zhonya's to have 1k damage autos at times. NOTE 2: This passive WORKS on towers. Combined with the free attack speed, you are one of the best junglers at tearing down towers with or without items. Q: Crescent Strike - This is by far the hardest part of Diana's kit. The arc that her Q fires in takes some time to get used to and nothing but experience with it will fix that. When you learn to use this ability however it has many flexible uses. It is also one of the best skills when chasing someone thru a jungle to hit them and aggro a neutral camp to them at the same time. NOTE: This skill provides vision (but does not reveal invisible units). Use it when chasing or to start a camp you are on your way to. You can also use this vision to check enemy buff camps safely when you are without wards. It can reach over any single direct wall in the game (including Baron/Drag pit). However if you are behind dragon pit vs a dragon that is pulled out it will not reach it. W: Pale Cascade - This is Part 2 of why Diana has a great jungling kit. This ability is a great AOE clearing ability that also gives you two shields vs every camp. It's a great skill with good scaling and utility. Learn to love this spell. NOTE: If low on mana use this as your single skill to clear a camp. Although it's mana costs are higher, the AOE clear + double shield is very strong and will pay off the best. However in the same token, at level 5 this is your single most expensive skill, when you use it, get use from it or you will OOM quickly. NOTE 2: This is one of the best skills in the game for tracking close invisible champions that doesn't directly reveal. The orb's hitbox is not a whole lot larger than the particle for it. If you hit a close invisible enemy with an orb it will tell you their approx location. This is best used vs units with short invisibility like Kha'Zix. I have killed SO many invisible champs because of this skill tipping me off to where exactly they are running to. E: Moonfall - A very underrated skill. While there is no direct damage, a circular AOE slow of up to 55% on a non-ult is very strong. NOTE: This can be used as an escape ability vs enemies not named Lee Sin. If you have the ability to sustain an auto or so of extra damage, the slow you put on them will often be the difference between and escape and dying. NEVER use it in this manner vs Lee however, or you will regret it. NOTE 2: As mentioned by Arb earlier in this thread, Moonfall will count as making the enemies airborne to allow Yasuo to ult to them. If you have a good Yasuo, Diana has an amazing synergy as both ult c/d's are low, and once Diana can ult to you, she can hit her E or force you to flash. Not to mention the 5 man Ult>E>Zhonya>Yasuo Ult teamfight initiation combo. NOTE 3: If you are close range to a unit that recently went invisible immediately pop this, cast W, and cast Q on top of yourself. If you do it fast enough you will not only get the slow to make their escape harder, but you will get a lot of damage down on them. This skill ALWAYS gets the enemy right on top of Diana, you will get 3 W orbs popped and a Q. R: Lunar Rish - Understanding when to use Lunar Rush will separate the good Diana's from the average Diana's. This skill for being so straightforward, is the hardest part of Diana aside for her Q arc. In a perfect world you always lead an ult with a Q, but knowing when to just blow it without is what will make plays happen. DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF R>E>Q combo (ie: no reset)! NOTE: You can cast this while Q is in the air, land before the Q, and still get the reset. See attached video starting at 24s. + Show Spoiler [ Q/Ult Reset trick] + NOTE 2: Previously Diana's ult counted as one stack of her passive. Meaning a Q>Ult>Ult would make the follow up auto a passive charged one. This was ninja-removed several patches ago, and from my understanding was not intentional. While this does not work at the moment, you should be aware of this interaction should it silently return. NOTE 3: Once in awhile Lunar Rush does no damage. Don't know why, but know you can get hung out to dry with it on occasion. Very rare however. NOTE 4: You can go over any amount of walls with this, however the range is too small to jump to Dragon/Baron from over the wall except in ONE particular spot. I have seen Voyboy do this, but I cannot replicate it reliably enough to document the spot. SKILL ORDER As a jungle Diana player, you should be flexible with your skill points. Aside for putting points into your ult at lvl's 6, 11, and 16 and getting W level 1, no other skill point has to be spent in any order. ALWAYS start W lvl 1. No other skill should be needed. Diana with W lvl 1 is one of the very best duelists in the game, and you are a force to be reckoned with. It gives you health to make your 1st buff easier, as well as provides damage. I do like in most games to put a 2nd point into W by level 4, the extra shield is very nice. DO NOT fight against a Diana lvl 1, in most situations she will win if she has W. As for the leveling priority, there is no set order. I change it up every game. Here's the ups and downs of the skill ordering Max Q 1st: This tends to be my go to. The ranged damage increase is very nice, and getting the base cooldown to 6 seconds is pretty nice. However in teams that lack escapes, or just can outright dodge your Q (ie: Fizz) I do not max this 1st. Max W 1st: This is actually a great route to in slow farm heavy games. Your W at level 5 is sufficient to take on camps alone at any point of the game, and most of the time later on will one shot some small creeps. The other reason I do this from time to time is when I am behind and being counter jungled heavily. The extra health will go a long way. Max E 1st: WHAT? E 1st? Yes. It can work. It's very specific to certain enemy comps/junglers, but it happens. The most obvious example is when jungling vs Hecarim. This skill at level 5 screws Hecarim pretty hard, or can really interfere with an enemy rammus' powerball. I think I have done this about a total of 10 times ever, so if you are new to Diana, do not do this. It's a very specific thing vs enemies that are reliant on move speed. One other situation would be if your lanes are getting very ahead early. If ahead, most of the time R>E will be enough for them to secure a skill and is very easy for you to do with no real risk. 2nd skill to max: I actually find myself evenly maxing W and E 2nd. The slow increase + CDR on E is nice, and the lesser mana cost on the W is as well. In skirmish heavy, low farm games you will be very heavily gated by available mana instead of cooldowns. If you have to use your W every 10 seconds you will be relegated to an auto attacker only. Keeping your W costs minimal while still slowly increasing it is good. I officially suggest an even level of W and E with W having priority. If you did not max Q 1st, max Q 2nd. OK I'm done for the night, it's 1am and I have to be up at 7am. Will continue on with it, and sorry if the end is sloppy, I got pretty tired and will touch it up tomorrow. | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
+ Show Spoiler [Diana's Pre-6 On Purple Side] + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/9pn3zWR.png) | ||
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AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
Edit: Just remembered I have to make a section on why the Dark Valk skin sucks, don't use the Dark Valk skin Edit 2: Spoiler on the summoner spells section later + Show Spoiler + Smite/Flash, shocker, I know | ||
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Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
On March 11 2014 14:10 Diamond wrote: Thanks! Added some stuff to the W and E sections about invisible units, she's good at killing them. Edit: Just remembered I have to make a section on why the Dark Valk skin sucks, don't use the Dark Valk skin Edit 2: Spoiler on the summoner spells section later + Show Spoiler + Smite/Flash, shocker, I know pls don't troll. It's Flash/Smite. Looking great mate, love playing jungle Diana myself -- certainly learned something from your guide. Could it be moded into the OP? | ||
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MidnightGladius
China1214 Posts
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
On March 12 2014 06:29 MidnightGladius wrote: Is there a window to E->Flash such that they can't Flash out of the E? I've been trying to, but I'm not sure if it's just my latency, or if I'm executing it incorrectly, or if it's just impossible. I am in Michigan so I have 100 or so ping all the time so I can't speak for lower ping. But at 100~ ping, they can always flash out. I'm always ok with that, 20s~ c/d for 5 minute one. Edit: Big storm tomorrow. If all goes well (ie: snowed in but power is good) going to hammer out a section or two. Played some games today also, might do some commentary on the replays if time allows. Glad you guys like it  ! | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
NOTE: You can cast this while Q is in the air, land before the Q, and still get the reset. See attached video starting at 24s. Wait what? I've watched that video and still don't understand: if you cast ult while Q is in the air, you get the reset regardless of whether you or the Q arrives first? I thought there was a timing where you had to throw Q and then arrive with your ult at the same time the Q hits. | ||
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