EPTPhantom dancer or wit's end would be a thousand times better than either of those. Attack speed procs her E so her autos are basically getting a 40 damage on hit steroid, which then benefits from Q and is aoe if you go dragon.
[Champion] Shyvana - Page 3
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
Phantom dancer or wit's end would be a thousand times better than either of those. Attack speed procs her E so her autos are basically getting a 40 damage on hit steroid, which then benefits from Q and is aoe if you go dragon. | ||
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
Any kind of stun/kiting will make that stat worthless. | ||
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On November 09 2011 05:37 Juicyfruit wrote: Attack speed is pointless if you aren't up in someone's face attacking nonstop. Any kind of stun/kiting will make that stat worthless. not true on kiting. attack speed speeds up your attack animation, which helps while trying to animation cancel and chase someone while they're kiting. | ||
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
On November 09 2011 05:39 Mogwai wrote: not true on kiting. attack speed speeds up your attack animation, which helps while trying to animation cancel and chase someone while they're kiting. Yeah I mispoke there. I meant to say peeling, not kiting :< On November 09 2011 05:39 UniversalSnip wrote: which makes infinity edge a good pick I don't know whether I'd actually but infinity edge, but it's does make you less counterable by stuns and shit compared to AS since instead of hitting like wet noddle but very fast, you do a very strong 3-hit combo with auto + Q and then if you get stunned after that, at least you're stunned while waiting for your cooldowns to come back up y'know. | ||
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rainfable
United States171 Posts
edit: exhaust ftw on her, imo. gives her that little extra push :v | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
On November 09 2011 05:39 Mogwai wrote: not true on kiting. attack speed speeds up your attack animation, which helps while trying to animation cancel and chase someone while they're kiting. She has a pretty good attack animation though, at least in terms of pre-attack. Though to be honest I can't tell during dragon form if it's any different because COLORBLINDATTACK holy fawk. As mentioned though, my biggest issue with ASPD is the amount of repositioning you end up doing, for instance having to overshoot target so that you can turn around and E/Q. In that sense I can see the mspd being useful off PD, but considering that she feels more like an MF ult (wherein you stacked BTs before to maximize the AD scaling of her ult, before she got nerfed to oblivion) it's honestly debatable (uncertain either way) whether trying to aspd weaker Q-procs more often is better than just nuking the ever living shit out of people in one blow. If that explains my mindset regarding IE to Tapi's later post. Especially if you can get a nasty double crit off Q for an AoE explosion. | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
In big team fights Shyvana's team needs someone who can initiate well. Like Galio or something. You dragon dive into the enemy team immediately after someone initiates and deal all of that absurd damage while being naturally tanky (and hopefully you have a Warmogs by the time big team fights break out). Even if you feel like you aren't doing enough damage late game you should be doing enough to pressure their carries out of the fight or to force them to focus you and in either of those situations your teams carries should be able to just clean up unless they're bad. You can definitely carry with Shyvana but I think she's a bit more team dependent than other tanky DPS champions which might make her kind of bad in solo queue. Still, if you have a competent initiator and a competent AD carry I think she's stupidly strong in solo queue. And I have to agree with what was sad on the last page. I think Trinity is pretty garbage on her. Would rather build Phage into Frozen Mallet for more Atmas damage and more HP because of how bad Sheen is on her (you're basically wasting at least 1260 gold worth of stats if you go Trinity). Wit's End is gonna give you more AS and also some MR. Atmas is going to give you more damage and give you armor and even give you more crit chance. On Shyvana at least I feel like Trinity is a great way to piss away 4k gold for less damage and less tankyness. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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overt
United States9006 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:23 Slayer91 wrote: Trinity force is very cost effective to make up for the fact that no champion in the game really wants every stat. Not using the mana or AP is not a reason not to want sheen because lots of champions don't really use either and still get it. I'd rather get Frozen Mallet than Trinity though. I just don't think the 4k gold can justify getting Trinity when in that same time span I can have Wit's End and the start of Warmogs. She doesn't make use of 1/3 of the stats from Trinity and there are better options, which is why I don't think it makes sense to get it on her. On November 09 2011 05:53 Voxae wrote: She has minimal cc, and her ulti (which I would think is her "initiate"), knocks people slightly away from you instead of pulling people towards your team. Good skill for escaping, good skill to fly over walls with. Initiating as a tanky DPS, might want to take another approach. edit: exhaust ftw on her, imo. gives her that little extra push :v I think if she had some initiation she'd be borderline (or even completely) OP. But without any CC she's basically a tanky DPS champion that can't initiate which is why I think a lot of people considered her a bit underwhelming. She's a lot more team reliant than other tanky DPS champions imo. | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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overt
United States9006 Posts
I agree with Southlight. If you can get to level 6 without dying or getting far behind she could probably do well. | ||
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Slomo
Germany7198 Posts
On November 09 2011 02:33 Southlight wrote: Yes, hence the Atmog -> Infinity Edge idea (though that's a lot of money!). I'm not sure that Sheen procs affect both strikes, as I'd imagine it's treated the same as MF's DU and only Sheens the first and not the second. (sorry for the late response, @work). Just tested it. Sheen and Triforce only affect the first hit. Makes me a little bit sad. Cause i think she needs that slow from Phage or stuff. Buying a Frozen Mallet until lategame costs imo too much. I love that champ btw. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On November 09 2011 05:53 Voxae wrote: She has minimal cc, and her ulti (which I would think is her "initiate"), knocks people slightly away from you instead of pulling people towards your team. Good skill for escaping, good skill to fly over walls with. Initiating as a tanky DPS, might want to take another approach. edit: exhaust ftw on her, imo. gives her that little extra push :v You can use Shyvana to initiate, just you need to it smartly. For example, you can ulti from behind the other team toward your team, pulling them towards you. | ||
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:02 Southlight wrote: She has a pretty good attack animation though, at least in terms of pre-attack. Though to be honest I can't tell during dragon form if it's any different because COLORBLINDATTACK holy fawk. As mentioned though, my biggest issue with ASPD is the amount of repositioning you end up doing, for instance having to overshoot target so that you can turn around and E/Q. In that sense I can see the mspd being useful off PD, but considering that she feels more like an MF ult (wherein you stacked BTs before to maximize the AD scaling of her ult, before she got nerfed to oblivion) it's honestly debatable (uncertain either way) whether trying to aspd weaker Q-procs more often is better than just nuking the ever living shit out of people in one blow. If that explains my mindset regarding IE to Tapi's later post. Especially if you can get a nasty double crit off Q for an AoE explosion. Q's got nothing to do with it, she's got an on hit steroid. Like teemo. When was the last time you built infinity edge teemo? | ||
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
Shyvana's E is an on-hit effect, yes, but it's very very weak unless you level it up first, and even if you max it it's still pretty terrible since she's not a ranged hero naturally designed around kiting. Moreover, unlike teemo, it's not perpetual on-hit damage since you need to hit someone with E and then wack them within 4 seconds. Bad comparison. | ||
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rainfable
United States171 Posts
On November 09 2011 06:30 overt wrote: I think if she had some initiation she'd be borderline (or even completely) OP. But without any CC she's basically a tanky DPS champion that can't initiate which is why I think a lot of people considered her a bit underwhelming. She's a lot more team reliant than other tanky DPS champions imo. Yup, she is @__@; I also find her w really easy to get out of sticky situations with, and I do still do decent damage with her which made her appeal to me a lot, so I've been playing her a lot. On November 09 2011 08:13 iCanada wrote:You can use Shyvana to initiate, just you need to it smartly. For example, you can ulti from behind the other team toward your team, pulling them towards you. Yeah, I know. Usually the other team is smart enough to not try anything cute when one member of the enemy team is missing (and alive..) though. Or atleast, that's been my experience .___.;; | ||
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