[Champion] Nasus - Page 27

On December 06 2013 19:06 Slayer91 wrote:
at garen
FIX HIS E BUG RITO PLS

On December 07 2013 08:41 Slayer91 wrote:
Q crits like (2*base q dmg) + Q stacks
so it includes the 110 or so free damage afaik.

On December 07 2013 10:33 WarSame wrote:
When I started playing him I went Trinity all of the time because of the great MS and huge Sheen damage. Over time I experimented and found that being able to pick up the Glacial Shroud early helped with Q stacks and laning a lot, vs. a TF component. Plus, while the damage is nice, the slowing and tankiness of IBG seems more attractive to me.

On December 07 2013 13:45 WarSame wrote:
In general you want to finish your items fully before moving on to the next one. Exceptions being something like HG.

In your build, at 15 minutes in or so, what do you have? Glacial Shroud, boots 1 and Phage. Really not much to go off of. Frozen Heart and Triforce are possible and not bad, don't get me wrong(and I often build FH/and some other tanky items), but Triforce in general seems to be too expensive, and too delayed for the stats that it gives to Nasus.

As with most things, it comes down to preference and situation I suppose. If you have an easy lane and can go straight for TF I say go for it. But if you are getting a Glacial Shroud often I find the TF comes too late to really make an impact, and by that point I'd rather be picking up the IBG for the CDR/Armor/Slow which seems nicer to me. But realistically I go for the FH first because that item is the bee's knees vs. an AD lane(SV is the counterpart for AP).

On January 14 2014 22:56 Slayer91 wrote:
dorans shield isn't that great against vlad anyway, you could have went like regen beads with lots of pots and had more regen and then get negatron or something. You could still build spirit visage. The extra regen is nice but basically everything you say is a massive exaggeration and nasus was fine against vlad and rumble before spectre's cowl and as long as he got jungler help around the area of lvls 5-9 he could win (you wouldn't have cowl around that time anyway)

People for the most part just played nasus more and realized how to play passive properly and not just let vlad keep stacks of his E up to full and spam spells on you

On January 16 2014 01:04 Lord Tolkien wrote:

Spirit Visage gained a great deal more cost-slot efficiency along with the addition of Spectre's Cowl (including the major amounts of hp/5 on the item(s) ). The 2200g cost for +200hp and +45MR was significantly weaker than the current version (+400hp/+55MR) for 2625g (now 2750g), just because of its slot efficiency and baseline stats. Going SV was, while certainly possible and desired in the matchup, suboptimal given Nasus's greatly preferred the build path of FH (more mana and alot more Armor), while the components of SV were weaker (no sustain on the items as opposed to Cowl).

On January 16 2014 01:04 Lord Tolkien wrote:
While Nasus survived the lane generally (shouldn't really die), Vlad could effectively deny Nasus and controlled the tempo of the lane pretty much the entirety of the lane phase (and force a weaker item build-path on him). Same with Rumble and Kennen. The play passive and not let Vlad spam his Q+E+AAs on CD requires that you basically self-zone yourself from the wave. Depending on the jungler during the mid/late lane phase wasn't reliable (warding was mandatory in all the matchups involving pushing Nasus to turret), and given Vlad's then usual summoners (double mobility into early distortion or ghost/ignite)+pool, was fairly difficult to gank if he saw the gank coming. Just as much possibility that Vlad's jungler comes top to dive to set Nasus back before he masses up stacks.

On January 16 2014 01:04 Lord Tolkien wrote:
This isn't the case anymore. Dorans Shield prevents the early autoharass from Vlad (which at the very early levels is probably where most of his damage on melee champs top actually come from due to insane CDs early), and Cowl/buffed SV significantly blunts Vlad's late-lane phase power (same with Kennen, and Rumble [pre-Rumble nerfs]).

On January 16 2014 01:04 Lord Tolkien wrote:
But perhaps you're right about people getting better at Nasus idk. At least no one criticizes your build when you go full CDR anymore. That was the #1 thing I heard throughout S2: why aren't you building triforce zomg why do you have FH/Shureylas repot.



Also: I still continue to facepalm everytime a Nasus gets a Trinity Force first item. Saw one that rushed it first when he was 0/4/1.

wat

On January 16 2014 04:27 Slayer91 wrote:


Everything you said here should technically apply now except nasus has 15 more hp5. Somehow that is the difference between getting crushed like you described and being unharassable? If you think that you are full of shit. I played a lot more nasus than probably everyone here and I had no problems vs rumble/kennen and everyone stopped playing vlad but I think I had about even rate of problems/ no problems but I was a lot worse at nasus in those days.
Self zoning yourself from the wave is standard nasus play even now against vlad you need to self zone yourself while he AoEs the wave then farm it.

Also because wither works through vlad pool its very hard for him to escape, and if he does take ghost/flash, its very hard to actually get a kill off because his burst damage is nearly the same as his harass damage (ult+ignite, I think ignite does 20% more damage also)

Vlad doesn't do a whole lot of auto harass and getting hp regen+more pots would actually do more to health yourself than dorans shield, you just get dshield now because its good enough that you can get away with 1 pot and you dont want tobuy any dead end items (you used to be able to build regen beads into locket/bulwark)

I mean saying that -15% auto damage completely prevents auto harass is so sensationalist wtf. To make the difference of 1 hp potion you have to auto 20 times, after 3-5 autos max the lane pushes and you get to lifesteal and regen it back at tower anyway. Pushing too fast early is pretty risky anyway because then you can get lvl 3 ganked when nasus hits lvl 2 and the only escape hope is countergank

On January 16 2014 05:42 Lord Tolkien wrote:

Wither works, but it's still difficult given it needs to be burnt early to initiate on Vlad, he'll be at range, and he can pool when you're in melee range (and apply a small slow), which, rough experience guestimation, is about the length of the wither. You'll end up roughly in melee range, but with no followup CC, and he's got a clear escape because ghost, or to retaliate if there's no gank. Vlad will probably opt for Mercs if he doesn't have double mobility, and he feels the wither gets too oppressive.

Perhaps it's a combination of S4 mastery changes in addition to the itemization, but the current matchup on both sides certainly feels different from S2/early S3.

When dealing with attrition lanes (like Nasus vs Vlad and Kennen), there is a threshold between enough harass to whittle you down, or enough regen to let you shrug it off for a long period of time. I feel it just currently leans towards the latter at this point..


D-shield with the Mastery. which means a total of 12 damage block on his early autoattacks. Additionally, the block applies after resistances.

At level 1: assuming 36 armor (18.5 base+12.5 from yellows, +5 from masteries (2 from hardness, 3 from the Legendary Guardian), Vlad's measly level 1 AAs do 48 damage, which is reduced to 35 damage per auto from armor. Dshield+mastery reduces it down to 23 damage (Dshield total reduction is thus actually ~23%). That's...pretty bleh against Nasus regen+sustain.

The result is that Vlad can't be as aggressive in early AA harass, because minion retaliation will basically outdamage his autos in a trade, and forces him to rely on his spells (which given CDs early does impact his early pressure. while spamming E early also drains his HP pool).