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On November 27 2011 04:27 arthur wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 04:21 freelander wrote:On November 27 2011 03:31 wei2coolman wrote:On November 27 2011 03:21 Woony wrote:
I think I've heard Regi say that Ryze got nerfed by the new masteries & is not that good anymore in comparison to others. What do you guys think? sounds about right. utility tree is complete shit. i wouldn't listen to anything reginald says theorycraft-wise Regarding the new masteries... Ryze got a tiny little baby nerf, whereas every other caster got a small buff. This doesn't mean ryze is bad now. Ryze is still awesome.
That, pretty much. No more going into defense (mres!) for Strength of Spirit (and nine offense helping him out more) and the increased AP at early levels on rival casters means I'm finding it increasingly difficult to justify mana blues over magic resistance, though.
Even though it's only 3%, the spellvamp from Utility combined with WotA and Desperate Power is fairly hilarious combined with his tanky itemisation.
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On November 27 2011 05:00 Haasts wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 04:27 arthur wrote:On November 27 2011 04:21 freelander wrote:On November 27 2011 03:31 wei2coolman wrote:On November 27 2011 03:21 Woony wrote:
I think I've heard Regi say that Ryze got nerfed by the new masteries & is not that good anymore in comparison to others. What do you guys think? sounds about right. utility tree is complete shit. i wouldn't listen to anything reginald says theorycraft-wise Regarding the new masteries... Ryze got a tiny little baby nerf, whereas every other caster got a small buff. This doesn't mean ryze is bad now. Ryze is still awesome. That, pretty much. No more going into defense (mres!) for Strength of Spirit (and nine offense helping him out more) and the increased AP at early levels on rival casters means I'm finding it increasingly difficult to justify mana blues over magic resistance, though. Even though it's only 3%, the spellvamp from Utility combined with WotA and Desperate Power is fairly hilarious combined with his tanky itemisation.
what about something like 9/15/3 on Ryze? Just go even more tanky, picking up the HP masteries, basic defense, and Enlightenment so you max CDR at level 13+frozen heart? (3 points left over... Havoc or w/e you want)
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United States47024 Posts
On November 27 2011 08:02 sylverfyre wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 05:00 Haasts wrote:On November 27 2011 04:27 arthur wrote:On November 27 2011 04:21 freelander wrote:On November 27 2011 03:31 wei2coolman wrote:On November 27 2011 03:21 Woony wrote:
I think I've heard Regi say that Ryze got nerfed by the new masteries & is not that good anymore in comparison to others. What do you guys think? sounds about right. utility tree is complete shit. i wouldn't listen to anything reginald says theorycraft-wise Regarding the new masteries... Ryze got a tiny little baby nerf, whereas every other caster got a small buff. This doesn't mean ryze is bad now. Ryze is still awesome. That, pretty much. No more going into defense (mres!) for Strength of Spirit (and nine offense helping him out more) and the increased AP at early levels on rival casters means I'm finding it increasingly difficult to justify mana blues over magic resistance, though. Even though it's only 3%, the spellvamp from Utility combined with WotA and Desperate Power is fairly hilarious combined with his tanky itemisation. what about something like 9/15/3 on Ryze? Just go even more tanky, picking up the HP masteries, basic defense, and Enlightenment so you max CDR at level 13+frozen heart? (3 points left over... Havoc or w/e you want)
If you're not taking defense all the way to 21, 9/0/21 is better than 9/x/y. Buff duration, mana regen, and summoner CDR are all way stronger masteries than a lot of the mid-tier defense stuff.
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On November 27 2011 08:53 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 08:02 sylverfyre wrote:On November 27 2011 05:00 Haasts wrote:On November 27 2011 04:27 arthur wrote:On November 27 2011 04:21 freelander wrote:On November 27 2011 03:31 wei2coolman wrote:On November 27 2011 03:21 Woony wrote:
I think I've heard Regi say that Ryze got nerfed by the new masteries & is not that good anymore in comparison to others. What do you guys think? sounds about right. utility tree is complete shit. i wouldn't listen to anything reginald says theorycraft-wise Regarding the new masteries... Ryze got a tiny little baby nerf, whereas every other caster got a small buff. This doesn't mean ryze is bad now. Ryze is still awesome. That, pretty much. No more going into defense (mres!) for Strength of Spirit (and nine offense helping him out more) and the increased AP at early levels on rival casters means I'm finding it increasingly difficult to justify mana blues over magic resistance, though. Even though it's only 3%, the spellvamp from Utility combined with WotA and Desperate Power is fairly hilarious combined with his tanky itemisation. what about something like 9/15/3 on Ryze? Just go even more tanky, picking up the HP masteries, basic defense, and Enlightenment so you max CDR at level 13+frozen heart? (3 points left over... Havoc or w/e you want) If you're not taking defense all the way to 21, 9/0/21 is better than 9/x/y. Buff duration, mana regen, and summoner CDR are all way stronger masteries than a lot of the mid-tier defense stuff.
On most champions, I would agree with you, but Ryze has such a terrible early game that having that extra bit of defense in the lower levels might be more valuable than 9/0/21. Also, if you were to go deep(ish) into the Def tree you'd have more room for Mana Yellows/Blues if you desired them.
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I just had to say: playing against Kat in mid makes me feel really sorry for him...
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On November 27 2011 08:53 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 08:02 sylverfyre wrote:On November 27 2011 05:00 Haasts wrote:On November 27 2011 04:27 arthur wrote:On November 27 2011 04:21 freelander wrote:On November 27 2011 03:31 wei2coolman wrote:On November 27 2011 03:21 Woony wrote:
I think I've heard Regi say that Ryze got nerfed by the new masteries & is not that good anymore in comparison to others. What do you guys think? sounds about right. utility tree is complete shit. i wouldn't listen to anything reginald says theorycraft-wise Regarding the new masteries... Ryze got a tiny little baby nerf, whereas every other caster got a small buff. This doesn't mean ryze is bad now. Ryze is still awesome. That, pretty much. No more going into defense (mres!) for Strength of Spirit (and nine offense helping him out more) and the increased AP at early levels on rival casters means I'm finding it increasingly difficult to justify mana blues over magic resistance, though. Even though it's only 3%, the spellvamp from Utility combined with WotA and Desperate Power is fairly hilarious combined with his tanky itemisation. what about something like 9/15/3 on Ryze? Just go even more tanky, picking up the HP masteries, basic defense, and Enlightenment so you max CDR at level 13+frozen heart? (3 points left over... Havoc or w/e you want) If you're not taking defense all the way to 21, 9/0/21 is better than 9/x/y. Buff duration, mana regen, and summoner CDR are all way stronger masteries than a lot of the mid-tier defense stuff.
I dunno I think the low-tier defense tree is way better than the utility tree. Enlight and Intel are basically the same (intel slightly better for its early game, ends up not mattering late game where either way you're maxed post-FH) so you're comparing
MR/Armor, health per level, veteran's scars, and havoc
with
15% summoner CDR, 3MP5, 3% spellvamp, and only 6 points to split between greed, wealth, awareness.
Havoc is better on casters than it is on physical - and it keeps ryze's damage competitive with other APs I feel. (5 damage to a 300 damage Q isnt that bad - that would be ~7 AP if he had annie's ratios.)
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United States47024 Posts
On November 27 2011 14:25 sylverfyre wrote:
MR/Armor, health per level, veteran's scars, and havoc
with
15% summoner CDR, 3MP5, 3% spellvamp, and only 6 points to split between greed, wealth, awareness.
Havoc is better on casters than it is on physical - and it keeps ryze's damage competitive with other APs I feel. (5 damage to a 300 damage Q isnt that bad - that would be ~7 AP if he had annie's ratios.)
I think Utility wins out in that comparison. Meditation has extremely good gold value per point compared to the low tier defense stat masteries. You're also underrating 15% summoner CDR a lot, IMO.
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On November 27 2011 14:36 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 14:25 sylverfyre wrote:
MR/Armor, health per level, veteran's scars, and havoc
with
15% summoner CDR, 3MP5, 3% spellvamp, and only 6 points to split between greed, wealth, awareness.
Havoc is better on casters than it is on physical - and it keeps ryze's damage competitive with other APs I feel. (5 damage to a 300 damage Q isnt that bad - that would be ~7 AP if he had annie's ratios.) I think Utility wins out in that comparison. Meditation has extremely good gold value per point compared to the low tier defense stat masteries. You're also underrating 15% summoner CDR a lot, IMO.
Actually i feel like the only things im putting value on in my mind are 15% summoner CDR and mana regen. Greed is mediocre, wealth is crap, and awareness is hard to value.
Vet scars is super-awesome gold/mastery though!
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I can't count the amount of times where I flash on the other guy, forcing him to flash, then you have yours back up before him and kill in that window.
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In what order to you guys get your items nowadays? I often find myself stuck with a bunch of early/midgame items that I built accordingly to the matchup. I often go top with Ryze these days and hence usually rush glacial. Depending on how the lane goes, catalyst->tear when I am behind or tear->catalyst when equal or ahead. I throw in Mercs most of the time, get my WotA and eventually (if the enemy teamcomp didn't require it beforehand) FH/BV.
I just started playing Ryze a lot and I wonder if that's the right way to build him.
If it's relevant: 9/0/21, MPen reds, HP/lvl yellows, Mana/lvl Glyphs, flat Mana quints.
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On November 28 2011 09:08 Shiv. wrote:
In what order to you guys get your items nowadays? I often find myself stuck with a bunch of early/midgame items that I built accordingly to the matchup. I often go top with Ryze these days and hence usually rush glacial. Depending on how the lane goes, catalyst->tear when I am behind or tear->catalyst when equal or ahead. I throw in Mercs most of the time, get my WotA and eventually (if the enemy teamcomp didn't require it beforehand) FH/BV.
I just started playing Ryze a lot and I wonder if that's the right way to build him.
If it's relevant: 9/0/21, MPen reds, HP/lvl yellows, Mana/lvl Glyphs, flat Mana quints.
yes that is correct
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I don't get the point of scaling runes on Ryze. Ryze is at his weakest in the early game and is an absolute monster when fully-geared. I feel as if you want every advantage you can get early game so that you can reach your tipping point as quickly and easily as possible.
Scaling Glyphs will give you 126 more mana at level 18, which is pretty meaningless. The extra mana from flat runes at lower levels seems much better to me.
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/vh3Bm.png)
what do you think? mmm?!
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On November 28 2011 10:41 evanthebouncy! wrote:what do you think? mmm?!
Thats basically what I was messing with, but I really want to get those points into meditation so I have enough mana to use plenty of skills in the early laning
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transfer the 3 points from havoc to meditation then. havoc isn't very point efficient, while meditation is.
the 3rd point in enlightenment will put ryze over cdr cap when he has level 5 Q and frozen heart
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i never understood why people want points in meditation for ryze. 3 points is a lot and 3 mregen on him feels like nothing tbh. i just go 0-21-9 and it feels great that or 0-9-21. mana per level yellow mpen red flat mana blue ms quint.
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On November 28 2011 19:37 wussleeQ wrote:
i never understood why people want points in meditation for ryze. 3 points is a lot and 3 mregen on him feels like nothing tbh. i just go 0-21-9 and it feels great that or 0-9-21. mana per level yellow mpen red flat mana blue ms quint.
Personally its very noticable early game, you often end up vs champs who push the lane far harder than you can and being able to use Q to last hit under the tower longer directly results in better CS. Sure later you don't care, but most masteries barely effect anything later game.
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On November 29 2011 01:26 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2011 19:37 wussleeQ wrote:
i never understood why people want points in meditation for ryze. 3 points is a lot and 3 mregen on him feels like nothing tbh. i just go 0-21-9 and it feels great that or 0-9-21. mana per level yellow mpen red flat mana blue ms quint.
Personally its very noticable early game, you often end up vs champs who push the lane far harder than you can and being able to use Q to last hit under the tower longer directly results in better CS. Sure later you don't care, but most masteries barely effect anything later game.
Pretty much this. Also: how do you justify 9 points in defense over 9 in offense?
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Does anybody else feel like he never does well on Ryze? I smartcast, I charge my tear like a mofo and farm all game but I still never feel like im doing really well.
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On November 29 2011 03:52 Woony wrote:
Does anybody else feel like he never does well on Ryze? I smartcast, I charge my tear like a mofo and farm all game but I still never feel like im doing really well.
Its probably just a question of positioning, I feel OP as hell playing ryze because I can instantly punish the slightest overextension and completely negate all the damage their melee does in teamfights. Just work on coming from a slightly odd angle in teamfights, not super aggressive but just enough to land your snare when they don't want to be snared, and also practice your kiting. With smartcast and decent kiting characters like riven and garen with huge damage and armor will come after you and you just laugh as they cant touch you and realize they cant disengage either.
The only aspect Ryze doesn't feel strong as is in 1v1 situations with AP, or AD carries in the earlier game, as his best skill has really no effect on them.
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EPT
