On December 08 2012 14:09 Alaric wrote: Iceball is strong as an AS debuff (flat from level 1), not as a damage tool, so in that sense Nunu's better than GP. He deals less damage but bloodboil is permanent compared to Raise Morale.
Bloodboil isn't permanent, but yes it lasts quite a bit longer than raise morale. Iceball is different than parrley, but I would still say that parrley is more effective in lane (not in a direct 100-0 engagement obviously, but great for other reasons). Bloodboil also doesn't give bonus ad to your adc like Raise Morale does.
I think that he means that bloodboil can be applied forever by just recasting it on yourself. Bloodboil and raise morale are both VERY good steroids for your carry, with bloodboil maybe being a bit stronger since it gives alot of movespeed and like 64% attackspeed compared to GP's 40 or someething AD and 15%~ movespeed(of course this is evened out by the fact that GP's entire team gets half the buff, not just the carry)
On December 08 2012 14:09 Alaric wrote: Iceball is strong as an AS debuff (flat from level 1), not as a damage tool, so in that sense Nunu's better than GP. He deals less damage but bloodboil is permanent compared to Raise Morale.
Bloodboil isn't permanent, but yes it lasts quite a bit longer than raise morale. Iceball is different than parrley, but I would still say that parrley is more effective in lane (not in a direct 100-0 engagement obviously, but great for other reasons). Bloodboil also doesn't give bonus ad to your adc like Raise Morale does.
I think that he means that bloodboil can be applied forever by just recasting it on yourself. Bloodboil and raise morale are both VERY good steroids for your carry, with bloodboil maybe being a bit stronger since it gives alot of movespeed and like 64% attackspeed compared to GP's 40 or someething AD and 15%~ movespeed(of course this is evened out by the fact that GP's entire team gets half the buff, not just the carry)
Yes, but with the modifications from s3, AS is suddenly worth so much more than AD (we're talking about a "balanced" build stat-wise), since the stat is more expensive and general and you can't get it from Zeke's anymore. You could argue than both teams can get zeke's so it cancels out, but even then having 70% bonus AS to 90 is relatively worse than having 90% to 110%.
The Raise Morale AoE effect is short-lived and has downtime, despite its teamwide utility, so in lane, especially when going for poke and harass rather than full-on engagements, your opponents can't abuse a downtime in your steroid unless you run oom. Though it is true that Nunu doesn't do much damage by himself when maxing W first, he also allows to dictate trades through superior mobility, and cripples AS-based carries (Ashe, Vayne notably) and those who need mobility (Draven won't be able to catch axes while slowed).
On December 09 2012 07:04 Alaric wrote: Yes, but with the modifications from s3, AS is suddenly worth so much more than AD (we're talking about a "balanced" build stat-wise), since the stat is more expensive and general and you can't get it from Zeke's anymore. You could argue than both teams can get zeke's so it cancels out, but even then having 70% bonus AS to 90 is relatively worse than having 90% to 110%.
The Raise Morale AoE effect is short-lived and has downtime, despite its teamwide utility, so in lane, especially when going for poke and harass rather than full-on engagements, your opponents can't abuse a downtime in your steroid unless you run oom. Though it is true that Nunu doesn't do much damage by himself when maxing W first, he also allows to dictate trades through superior mobility, and cripples AS-based carries (Ashe, Vayne notably) and those who need mobility (Draven won't be able to catch axes while slowed).
I don't think Vayne is AS-based unless she's maxing silver bolts.
I think whether an ADC wants more aspd or more AD depends on the champ. Trist and Graves for example get a lot of aspd from steroids so they would prefer more AD in general.
With relevancy to this thread, I don't think GP is a good support, but then again I don't think Nunu is a good one either but people have had great success with Cait Nunu in IPL5 and even before IPL5.
Been running gp in the jungle this patch, not extremely viable but a lot of fun. I run 9/21/0 with attack speed marks, armor yellows, and scaling mr blues, with movespeed quints.
Item path goes something along the lines of machete --> wriggles (get flask early as well) --> boots (upgraded into mercs/tabi) --> and then from there whatevers needed (aegis, hexdrinker, fh). If damage is needed I try to get trinity as well late game.
I find I clear pretty decently if I max E first. If I have red I see if I can do a quick gank early, but otherwise I try to get 6 as fast as possible. Your ult has a ton of utility and can easily turn around some midgame fights.
The best part is how awesome GP is late game, with a bunch of cdr and tankiness, you're a beast in teamfights.
I tried support gp on the theory support gets more stuff now and his individual scaling is better than nunu's, it was better than I expected but I wasn't a huge fan... I can see it working though. You do a lot of stuff but you're kinda meh at all of it, your laning is ok, your buff is mediocre, your initiation is ok, your peel is non-existent. I think at a certain point you need to recognize building utility is only going to get you so far. I ended with like bulwark crucible shurelya's locket when I should have cut the crucible out and just built an atmas. When you get down to it GP with a lot of items is still GP whatever the lane and a combination of AD, tankiness and CDR could make him pretty relevant late coming out of the support role.
Has anyone else tried an on hit cdr build with manamune on gp ? I had some fun with it, albeit in a low level game.
Basiaclly I went manamune/shiv into frozen heart , which gives you like 300 magic dmg extra on every Q and allows it to crit. Gauntlet is possible, but seems overkill since you need to get tanky at some point. Shiv maybe also not the greatest but manamune is really strong on gp now, as it also grants sustain if you max W second.
How about Statikk Shiv? Since it charges from you running around (~10% per teemo that you move), you could most likely get the proc for every Parley, and the proc can crit, too. It has the side effect of always push wave unless you stand still a lot, but I'd assume you're not gonna finish it THAT early. Would add significantly to his ability to splitpush later on - something he does enjoy doing with his high natural movespeed and global ult.
Seems like a good thing to build from Avarice, though.
I've come under the impression that Statikk Shiv, Iceborn Gauntlet, and Spirit Visage is the new TrinityForce on GP. Those 3 items replace everything that TF gives you (except 30 AD) but they grant more base stats and also give you CDR, Armor/MR and more passives!
If you spec 9-0-21 that caps you at 40% CDR! If you don't get 10% CDR from masteries then just build everyone's favorite new item, Black Cleaver, and you reach 40% CDR and get 50 AD and ArmorPen.
On December 12 2012 05:24 Ghost-z wrote: I've come under the impression that Statikk Shiv, Iceborn Gauntlet, and Spirit Visage is the new TrinityForce on GP. Those 3 items replace everything that TF gives you (except 30 AD) but they grant more base stats and also give you CDR, Armor/MR and more passives!
If you spec 9-0-21 that caps you at 40% CDR! If you don't get 10% CDR from masteries then just build everyone's favorite new item, Black Cleaver, and you reach 40% CDR and get 50 AD and ArmorPen.
I don't think Shiv fits in there at all unless you consider BC part of that "core". Getting AS and Crit without building any AD whatsoever seems kind of useless. And since you have no AD, you're just hoping to be tanky and letting IBG procced Qs do all your damage, since your autos won't do much on their own. And if you're playing Tankplank, that's fine, but then Shiv doesn't fit in at all. Luckily, plenty of AD items work with GP if you want to go Shiv.
As far as I'm concerned it works all the same with Philo and Avarice although you have to keep up actively farming the minions. You can also spec 21 Utility for extra gold/10 and with the pick pocket mastery you don't miss out on much gold by using your Q to harass the enemy laner. GP's parrley procs the full 5 gold from pick pocket and I like it when playing support GP in normals because you can easily "out farm" the other support.
On December 12 2012 05:24 Ghost-z wrote: I've come under the impression that Statikk Shiv, Iceborn Gauntlet, and Spirit Visage is the new TrinityForce on GP. Those 3 items replace everything that TF gives you (except 30 AD) but they grant more base stats and also give you CDR, Armor/MR and more passives!
If you spec 9-0-21 that caps you at 40% CDR! If you don't get 10% CDR from masteries then just build everyone's favorite new item, Black Cleaver, and you reach 40% CDR and get 50 AD and ArmorPen.
I don't think Shiv fits in there at all unless you consider BC part of that "core". Getting AS and Crit without building any AD whatsoever seems kind of useless. And since you have no AD, you're just hoping to be tanky and letting IBG procced Qs do all your damage, since your autos won't do much on their own. And if you're playing Tankplank, that's fine, but then Shiv doesn't fit in at all. Luckily, plenty of AD items work with GP if you want to go Shiv.
i feel like shiv would be good for pushing, but if i wanted to that then i'd rather go for tiamat -> hydra than shiv.
On December 12 2012 05:24 Ghost-z wrote: I've come under the impression that Statikk Shiv, Iceborn Gauntlet, and Spirit Visage is the new TrinityForce on GP. Those 3 items replace everything that TF gives you (except 30 AD) but they grant more base stats and also give you CDR, Armor/MR and more passives!
If you spec 9-0-21 that caps you at 40% CDR! If you don't get 10% CDR from masteries then just build everyone's favorite new item, Black Cleaver, and you reach 40% CDR and get 50 AD and ArmorPen.
I don't think Shiv fits in there at all unless you consider BC part of that "core". Getting AS and Crit without building any AD whatsoever seems kind of useless. And since you have no AD, you're just hoping to be tanky and letting IBG procced Qs do all your damage, since your autos won't do much on their own. And if you're playing Tankplank, that's fine, but then Shiv doesn't fit in at all. Luckily, plenty of AD items work with GP if you want to go Shiv.
i feel like shiv would be good for pushing, but if i wanted to that then i'd rather go for tiamat -> hydra than shiv.
Hydra pretty good on him, imo, better than Shiv for AoE picks.
On January 08 2013 04:41 Ghost-z wrote: As far as I'm concerned it works all the same with Philo and Avarice although you have to keep up actively farming the minions. You can also spec 21 Utility for extra gold/10 and with the pick pocket mastery you don't miss out on much gold by using your Q to harass the enemy laner. GP's parrley procs the full 5 gold from pick pocket and I like it when playing support GP in normals because you can easily "out farm" the other support.
If you're going Bankplank you want to be Q last hitting minions.
EPT
and I like it when playing support GP in normals because you can easily "out farm" the other support.
