I feel it should recieve the same deal as fast warpins: make it only castable on pylons that have a nexus or gate in their radius. That's how you kill the aggro pylon rushes imo.

Topdoller

United Kingdom3860 Posts

December 08 2015 11:33 GMT

#42

Is an 11 second duration long enough to deal against early attacks ?

Its too long

Do you think it’s logical that the mothership core can cast photon overcharge as soon as it’s finished?

No, tis bad enought that The MC is out so early and Zerg cant touch it untill Hydra tech
Is the range of photon overcharge good?

Range is fine

Do you think offensive photon overcharge is a viable strategy ?

Yes

Is photon overcharge too good at warding off drops?

Yes

How do you think this will change the way Protoss simcity their base?

They will expand faster as they dont need units to defend at all now

Will Protoss prioritize placing pylons around their minerals line, or infrastructure?

Yes

Is photon overcharge too good against smaller packs of units?

Yes

Do you think there is enough room to maneuver around photon overcharge in its current state?

No its spammable , you can cover a full base with full energy

Do you think photon overcharge is in a better state in LotV than in HotS?

Definatly not, this is the only change i disagree with in LoTV

weikor

Austria580 Posts

December 08 2015 14:25 GMT

#43

Is an 11 second duration long enough to deal against early attacks ?

In its current state i feel the balance is good for holding All ins or huge commited attacks.
Holding smaller agression and harrasment its slightly too strong.

Do you think it’s logical that the mothership core can cast photon overcharge as soon as it’s finished?
Well, its the main reason for making the mothership core.

Is the range of photon overcharge good?
Yeah, I like the tuning of it. Perhaps its slightly too strong vs air like banshees or oracles.

Do you think offensive photon overcharge is a viable strategy ?
Let me ask you, do you think proxy 10 gate is a viable strategy? I actually do think that its not too bad offensively though, perhaps to contain your opponent or something.

Is photon overcharge too good at warding off drops?
Yeah, i think so - but then again, drops are pretty strong so they need a strong answer
I also think that there definitely are some weaknesses in a pylon defense that players cant exploit yet. Perhaps there are some tank timings where pylons are just useless.

How do you think this will change the way Protoss simcity their base?,
Will Protoss prioritize placing pylons around their minerals line, or infrastructure?
First of all you end up dropping a lot more pylons than you would without it. Ideally, you might have 3 to 4 pylons in a wall at your front nexus, a circle around your base for vision, and something protecting your mineral lines

Is photon overcharge too good against smaller packs of units?
Probably

Do you think there is enough room to maneuver around photon overcharge in its current state?
Depends on what range units you have, lings - no, ravager - yes.

Do you think photon overcharge is in a better state in LotV than in HotS?
Definitely.

amanguszta

6 Posts

December 08 2015 17:03 GMT

#44

shield battery is a really good example of how u can solve balance problems what dont pass over decisionmakes. You always make plylons (yes , near your mineral lines too), and u always make mothership core, becouse of its price, and because you can use it for many things(harass, defend, and its an air unit in early game). And u solve defense, u dont have to make cannons, or make more units in early game like sentries which is lose their main role in early game. I think people would like this game if they could make more decisions (they want to focus defense more or not, they want to make cannons, battery shields or sentries depends on the scout) becoz diversity of strategies and styles what made brood war a really good game. I have some grandmaster friend from wol and thats why they stop play with this game: You build and build and produce units and then fight with enemy. The better composition wins and thats all. Starcraft would be a better game if stategies with lots of actions (harassment, pokes etc) could be viable and thats what overcharge kills from the game (both with recall ) . I would lower the cannon's price or build time against oracle in pvp, i dont think cannonrush could be a viable option in lotv coz of the 12 worker-start or make battery shield or something better option. And yes i wont buy this game until they dont remove this overcharge as the others said before

p68

100 Posts

December 08 2015 20:10 GMT

#45

I'm surprised at the amount of people in this thread that think it's fine or should even be buffed. It's almost 34 DPS for 25 energy with an 11 second duration! Even a single charge can deter early pressure, and if the opponent pulls back, you can just cast another when they return. If your enemy focuses on destroying the pylons, that just buys you time in situations where they wouldn't otherwise (e.g. a Terran bio drop having to focus down a pylon instead of workers).

It's crazy powerful vs early pushes and standard drops. It's basically another "oh shit" button, in addition to recall. Terran and Zerg don't have "oh shit" buttons to bail them out when they're out of position. If Protoss needs a buff somewhere to compensate for a PO nerf, so be it. Buff what you need to, but don't have an "oh shit" button be so powerful. It was a very prominent component of Protoss play at Dreamhack, and it really did make its mark in most matches.

JackONeill

861 Posts

December 09 2015 01:40 GMT

#46

1) Is an 11 second duration long enough to deal against early attacks ?
- the whole spell is gimmicky and band-aidy, so questionning its duration is pointless

2) Do you think it’s logical that the mothership core can cast photon overcharge as soon as it’s finished?
- nope since the spell makes no sense

3) Is the range of photon overcharge good?
- see previous answer

4) Do you think offensive photon overcharge is a viable strategy ?
- yes it is, and it's ridiculously stupid

5) Is photon overcharge too good at warding off drops?
- see previous answers

6) How do you think this will change the way Protoss simcity their base?
- it does

7) Will Protoss prioritize placing pylons around their minerals line, or infrastructure?
- they already do

8) Is photon overcharge too good against smaller packs of units?
- see previous answers

9) Do you think there is enough room to maneuver around photon overcharge in its current state?
- the whole spell is stupid. There shouldn't be room to maneuver around overcharged pylons, but PROTOSS UNITS

10) Do you think photon overcharge is in a better state in LotV than in HotS?
- tricky question... It's less binary, you can attack on overcharged pylons if you're really sure you're gonna snipe them. However the burst is ridiculous, you can cast it right when the MSC gets out and it can be used offensively.

This spell is a band aid and an admission of failure from Blizzard. Give MSC a shield battery, buff protoss defense if you want to, but this spell is a disgrace to the game.

Antares777

United States1971 Posts

December 09 2015 02:09 GMT

#47

Is an 11 second duration long enough to deal against early attacks ?
At it's cost, including Pylon positioning and MC energy, the duration feels reasonable, though it leans towards being more than long enough to defend.

Do you think it’s logical that the mothership core can cast photon overcharge as soon as it’s finished?
Yes, this I agree completely with.

Is the range of photon overcharge good?
I think the range is too long. With well-positioned Pylons, it becomes very hard to harass a Protoss player with a couple of units. This is unfair to the other races, which have to use their own units to defend against harassment.

Do you think offensive photon overcharge is a viable strategy ?
Eh, not really, but it's possible with its current range and damage.

Is photon overcharge too good at warding off drops?
Yes, I think this can be addressed by limiting its range more than it currently is.

How do you think this will change the way Protoss simcity their base?,
Will Protoss prioritize placing pylons around their minerals line, or infrastructure?
Both? They already have to place it around their infrastructure, now just instead of putting it behind Warp Gates and other buildings, you put them in front since they can be overcharged. There's really no reason to not build any in your mineral line since you need to build Pylons anyway. With Photon Overcharge, it's better to spread out your Pylons to maximize your defenses.

Is photon overcharge too good against smaller packs of units?
Yes, it makes harassment too difficult, you would have to commit more units than your should in order to do damage, and they'll most likely die and make the exchange not worth it in the first place.

Do you think there is enough room to maneuver around photon overcharge in its current state?
No, the only way to micro against it is by moving your units out of range, which sometimes means being unable to engage effectively until the timer runs out.

Do you think photon overcharge is in a better state in LotV than in HotS?
Yes, it's a step in the right direction but still needs work.

What I would do is have Photon Overcharge target Photon Cannons instead of Pylons, and it's effect would increase (double?) the rate of fire for a duration. This way the player has to invest in defense already to get the bonus of Photon Overcharge, but if they do, it's more powerful since a Photon Cannon with twice the rate of fire is double what Photon Overcharge does now, it just has less range and requires a more expensive initial investment. The ability would be more powerful, less flexible, and in a way more expensive. It would also probably make cannon rushes the source of nightmares.

And alternative suggestion would be to remove the ability and move the Stasis Ward ability from the Oracle to the Mothership Core, but I'm not sure if this will be strong enough to defend effectively early game, especially from Terran which has access to detection via scanning very early and plenty of ranged units to take down the Stasis Ward. Zerg also has the Ravager, which can kill it without detection. The ability itself is also less interactive and would depend much more on positioning that Photon Overcharge does now.

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