• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 03:38
CET 09:38
KST 17:38
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Tournament Preview3RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2
Community News
BSL Season 2025 - Full Overview and Conclusion2Weekly Cups (Jan 5-11): Clem wins big offline, Trigger upsets4$21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)15Weekly Cups (Dec 29-Jan 4): Protoss rolls, 2v2 returns7[BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 104
StarCraft 2
General
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Tournament Preview Stellar Fest "01" Jersey Charity Auction Weekly Cups (Jan 5-11): Clem wins big offline, Trigger upsets When will we find out if there are more tournament SC2 Spotted on the EWC 2026 list?
Tourneys
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-18 OSC Season 13 World Championship SC2 AI Tournament 2026 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 508 Violent Night Mutation # 507 Well Trained Mutation # 506 Warp Zone Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes
Brood War
General
[ASL21] Potential Map Candidates BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BSL Season 2025 - Full Overview and Conclusion BW General Discussion StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest
Tourneys
[BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10 Small VOD Thread 2.0 Azhi's Colosseum - Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Simple Questions, Simple Answers Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason Awesome Games Done Quick 2026! Nintendo Switch Thread Mechabellum
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Physical Exercise (HIIT) Bef…
TrAiDoS
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2506 users

Community Feedback Update - August 21

Forum Index > Legacy of the Void
419 CommentsPost a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 19 20 21 Next All
SetGuitarsToKill
Profile Blog Joined December 2013
Canada28396 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-08-21 18:22:34
August 21 2015 17:55 GMT
#1
[image loading]

Before we begin, we’d like to send a shout-out to the highest level pro-gamers out there in Korea who are always looking to find new strategies, counters to those strategies, and doing all they can to find solutions to obstacles within the game. It is both inspiring and admirable to see top end players who work through significant adversity to adapt and find new strategies and tactics. In many of the top-end pro-level HotS games this week, we saw lots of interesting counters to certain strategies that were seen as unbeatable, and it was awesome to be reminded that there are players out there who will explore things to find their own solutions rather than immediately jumping to extreme conclusions.

Heart of the Swarm Mech/Swarm Host Balance Test Map

We’ve seen your feedback regarding TvZ mech play, and we agree that certain mech games are dragging on too long. We’ve seen a lot of potential in this area as well, as some mech games have been packed with action. These have cultivated in unique max vs. max battles with heavy tech switches on the Zerg side.

With that said, we’re testing these Swarm Host changes:
  • Supply cost decreased from 4 to 3
  • Cost changed from 100/200 to 200/100
  • Locusts can fly without having the upgrade
  • Locust health down from 65 to 50


We believe this could be a good change that helps against Terran mech and against Protoss in a fun way. To reiterate, we don’t want to jump to conclusions and we don’t know if Zerg is underpowered against mech. With this test map, we can prepare a patch if that turns out to be the case. We’ll try to get the test map up next week.

Now, let’s talk about Legacy of the Void.

Protoss Feels “Gimmicky” Compared to Other Races
Thank you for discussions in this area this week. The main points that could contribute to the “gimmicky” feelings point toward offensive warp-ins, which should be addressed with this week’s patch. So overall, this is potentially a non-issue if testing goes smoothly with the new changes.

We didn’t quite agree with some of the other main arguments in this area. We feel that the consequences of not scouting if the opponent is going for Oracles or a Dark Shrine is just StarCraft II, not a case of Protoss being gimmicky. For example, if I’m going mech and I don’t scout that the opponent is going fast Spire, I could be at a huge disadvantage because my AA isn’t out yet. The same goes for things like proxy cloaked Banshee, Baneling bust, or any strategy any race can do that requires scouting and reacting. Scouting is a critical component of StarCraft II, and we want to increase its importance in Legacy of the Void.

Our goal is to give players plenty of strategically viable openers in Void in order to have more action throughout the course of the game. That’s why we’re adding tools to other races, including individual Overlord transport, Liberator harassment, Nydus changes, Siege Tank Siege Mode drops, and so on.

With that said, more options aren’t always better. If a race just has so many options that they can’t be effectively scouted, we would obviously look into ways to either increase scouting capabilities for the other races, or reduce some options on a race. We will definitely need to do a pass at this before the game launch, so please remember to not be too quick to judge. Previous experience has shown that learning to defend something takes more time than going on the offensive with new tools.

During beta tests, small groups of players often arrive at conclusions concerning a topic and, even though their assertion may no longer be the case, they just can’t let go. We encourage everyone to be more open minded in actually discussing and testing changes during this beta so that we can work towards having the best possible StarCraft II.

It’s one of the main reasons why we’re communicating with you more than ever before—it’s unproductive to focus on preconceived notions while not paying attention to the actual state of the game.

Mothership Core Photon Overcharge
We’ve been exploring a change to how this ability works based on your suggestions. Our current change is for the ability costs less, to only be cast on Pylons, and to no longer have siege range. We’re seeing a lot more interaction with this ability use due to this change, because now there are lots of decisions to be made on both sides. For example:

How many Pylons need to be overcharged?
How many and what type of Pylon building placement is optimal in case Overcharge needs to be used?
Do you avoid their firing radius, kill the Pylon, or run away?

We haven’t been too focused on this change recently, but we will continue testing and hopefully make a call before the next balance update.

Colossus
We heard your feedback that the Colossus nerf was too much, and regarding Colossi having a more general role like they do in Heart of the Swarm. We’ve been testing Colossus in combination with Disruptors and the results are cool so far. We started playtesting with their upgraded range back to 9, and the combination of the redesigned Disruptors supported by Colossi looks to be going well.

Adept
We agree that early game Adepts can be a bit too powerful, and we would like to see a greater variety in Protoss army compositions. We have been trying various suggestions internally, and are leaning towards changing their cost from 100/25 to 75/50. This will slow down how many Adepts can be massed early on, and in the later stages of the game, it’ll be more of a commitment when going heavy Adepts. Another benefit that we’re seeing in the late game is that the army composition becomes more diverse due to the minerals-to-gas ratio. We will continue reviewing this internally and hopefully get it out to the beta if testing continues to go well.

Carrier Interceptor Behavior
We’d like to thank you for your suggestions in this area. Based on your feedback, we’ve been exploring a change to issuing orders to the Interceptor. Even when Interceptors are starting to return to the Carrier, it is now possible to issue a new order to have them instantly attack another target without having to first return to the Carrier. We’ve put this change in this week’s balance patch.

Immortal
We agree with your feedback in that the new ability is quite difficult to use for a majority of players, and this ability might only impact the highest-level of players out there. Therefore, we’ve been trying out having the ability auto-cast by default. We’re noticing that this change is allowing Protoss to be able to focus on the more important parts of engagements, while Immortals continue to function at a high efficiency. At the same time, in order to use the ability for maximum efficiency, the highest-level players who have the extra micro to spare should turn this off. Thank you for this suggestion, and we will continue testing this change internally before making the call to have it go out to the beta.

Ravager Upgrade
We’re playing around with a new Ravager upgrade internally that increases the cast range of Corrosive Bile from 9 to 13. The idea here is to have a stronger counter to Siege Tank and entice Terran players to use different unit compositions depending on how the Zerg is playing. For example, if Zerg is going heavy Hydra/Lurkers, units like Liberators or Siege Tanks would be stronger, whereas if Zerg is going heavy Roach/Ravagers, Siege Tanks or Liberators might not be as strong as other units such as Cyclones or speed-upgraded Banshees.

Further Learnings From Internal Testing

Finally, we’d like to talk about a couple major changes suggested by our community that didn’t quite turn out to have as positive of an effect as we had hoped. We’ve been discussing and playtesting the following two areas internally, and have decided that both are not fit for beta testing.

  • Reducing the number of workers per base so that army sizes become bigger


When trying out this change, we determined that reducing the workers needed per base isn’t good for the game because many of the coolest moments in StarCraft II come from worker harassment. With fewer workers, it was just too easy to rebuild after taking economic damage, making these moments less meaningful.

We also looked into feedback suggesting we reduce the efficiency of workers when more than 1 is mining at a single mineral patch. This was aimed at making expanding result in a higher income more often than not, even when on an equal worker count. What we found is that expanding quickly and often already feels like a big advantage in Void, so this change does not feel all that different in terms of when you want to expand. Also, when you do expand faster and have your workers more spread out, it’s easier to replenish workers that you’ve lost to harassment. As we stated above, this is the opposite of what we’re looking to accomplish with the economy changes.


  • Introducing auto-build on units


This changed up the game to such a great degree that the game didn’t feel like StarCraft II anymore. It also wasn’t as simple as it sounds. New issues kept popping up, including difficulties expanding or saving up resources, since float was automatically being spent.


Even though we won’t be testing either of these changes in the beta, we wanted to get our results out to you for better communication. Thank you for your continued support during the beta, and please remember that while discussions are important, actually playtesting the beta is critical to the success of Legacy of the Void. Please check out the major changes that went into this week’s patch in actual games, and continue giving us your feedback. We appreciate all the effort you’re putting into making this the best version of StarCraft II yet.

Thank you. - David Kim

Source
Facebook Twitter Reddit
Community News"As long as you have a warp prism you can't be bad at harassment" - Maru | @SetGuitars2Kill
Ketch
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands7285 Posts
August 21 2015 17:57 GMT
#2
Ok, then i'll stop editing my post and not post it at all . Great update from my point of view!
Lunareste
Profile Joined July 2011
United States3596 Posts
August 21 2015 18:03 GMT
#3
Please just delete the fucking Colossus already.
KT FlaSh FOREVER
linuxguru1
Profile Joined February 2012
110 Posts
August 21 2015 18:06 GMT
#4
There are some good ideas in there, but please don't pursue auto-building units...
RFDaemoniac
Profile Joined September 2011
United States544 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-08-21 18:15:23
August 21 2015 18:13 GMT
#5
Not that I'm advocating for this, but a solution to auto build that would feel pretty good is to just not charge for the cost of a unit if it is queued, and only doing so once it starts being produced.

It's disappointing that they think having fewer workers at a base makes it less worthwhile to harass, and yet encourage having bases with only half as many workers on them. I would be willing to increase worker build time if it meant gaining a mining efficiency curve. Or even better reverting the 60% mineral patches that they currently use to full mineral patches.
mishimaBeef
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada2259 Posts
August 21 2015 18:19 GMT
#6
hyyyyyyyype!
Dare to live the life you have dreamed for yourself. Go forward and make your dreams come true. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
Dumbledore
Profile Joined April 2011
Sweden725 Posts
August 21 2015 18:19 GMT
#7
Immortals are broken for me after this patch. They're texture less balls :S
Have a nice day ;)
purakushi
Profile Joined August 2012
United States3301 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-08-21 18:30:30
August 21 2015 18:22 GMT
#8
Sigh, just remove photon overcharge and MSC and give shield battery, please. Very disappointing.
T P Z sagi
jpg06051992
Profile Joined July 2015
United States580 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-08-21 18:24:51
August 21 2015 18:22 GMT
#9
On August 22 2015 03:03 Lunareste wrote:
Please just delete the fucking Colossus already.


Yea pretty much my sentiments exactly, the Colossus is a no skill a move unit and the only people that want it back are Protoss players who miss A moving deathballs, because that's exactly what the Colossus is, an a move deathball unit that can't function outside of a deathball.

Remove the damn unit and buff Protoss accordingly.

I'm also very concerned about Overlord drops to make ZvZ less of a complete gimmick and change the starting number of workers down to 10 to allow some type of breathing room in the early game.

This update kind of feels like a step backwards to cater to baddies, the Colossus has zero place in the new Protoss army, it's too slow, too a move, too deathball.

Edit: Also, get Photon Overcharge out of here, replace with shield battery (or something else awesome that isn't PO pleeaase lol) Also WTF is with Immortals? Is it a bug or some shit? They look like little nubs in the ground rofl
"SO MANY BANELINGS!"
Pandemona *
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
August 21 2015 18:27 GMT
#10
Didn't mention any of the macro feedback. Im pretty sure everyone has questioned the decision on that one? Oh well at least they are talking and reaching out which makes everyone feel like they are apart of the process which is nice.
ModeratorTeam Liquid Football Thread Guru! - Chelsea FC ♥
SiegeFlank
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States410 Posts
August 21 2015 18:27 GMT
#11
On August 22 2015 03:06 linuxguru1 wrote:
There are some good ideas in there, but please don't pursue auto-building units...


It says in the post that they tried it and determined it made the game too different.

I really like their explanations for everything. I'm still not entirely sold on the concept of photon overcharge in general, but their proposed change for it definitely makes the ability more interesting and skillful to use, and seems like it could promote more dynamic gameplay.
Bird up
imre
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
France9263 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-08-21 18:31:01
August 21 2015 18:29 GMT
#12



Thank you for discussions in this area this week. The main points that could contribute to the “gimmicky” feelings point toward offensive warp-ins, which should be addressed with this week’s patch. So overall, this is potentially a non-issue if testing goes smoothly with the new changes.

Our current change is for the ability costs less, to only be cast on Pylons



haha, so hilarious to read this.

And their explanation for the less worker per base makes no sense to me. You will still kill a tons of worker with harass if there isn't any defense in place and if you wipe out a mineral line the impact will still be important, even if it takes less longer to replenish it.

And reading their explanation for auto-building units makes me wonder what they consider as their "community" and the line about not looking like starcraft considering the auto inject is pretty funny too.

Notice how they didn't even tried to make it look like they actually playtest DH or other economic model actually pushed by the community.
Zest fanboy.
DeadByDawn
Profile Joined October 2012
United Kingdom476 Posts
August 21 2015 18:32 GMT
#13
Time to ditch Terran and pick up P or (especially) Z. Does Kimbo not realise that T cannot proactively tech switch to counter Zerg compositions because it takes a fucking long time to do build a new composition and they will likely have no upgrades. Siege tanks have received nothing but nerf after nerf since the WoL Beta.
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
August 21 2015 18:32 GMT
#14
Mothership Core Photon Overcharge
We’ve been exploring a change to how this ability works based on your suggestions. Our current change is for the ability costs less, to only be cast on Pylons, and to no longer have siege range. We’re seeing a lot more interaction with this ability use due to this change, because now there are lots of decisions to be made on both sides. For example:

How many Pylons need to be overcharged?
How many and what type of Pylon building placement is optimal in case Overcharge needs to be used?
Do you avoid their firing radius, kill the Pylon, or run away?

We haven’t been too focused on this change recently, but we will continue testing and hopefully make a call before the next balance update.


Yeah no thank you, the problem of the photon overcharge is that it requires no execution, this changes NOTHING.


Colossus
We heard your feedback that the Colossus nerf was too much, and regarding Colossi having a more general role like they do in Heart of the Swarm. We’ve been testing Colossus in combination with Disruptors and the results are cool so far. We started playtesting with their upgraded range back to 9, and the combination of the redesigned Disruptors supported by Colossi looks to be going well.


Nobody likes how the colossus works, buffing it again is ridiculous. Just remove it from the game OR redesign it completely.

Immortal
We agree with your feedback in that the new ability is quite difficult to use for a majority of players, and this ability might only impact the highest-level of players out there. Therefore, we’ve been trying out having the ability auto-cast by default. We’re noticing that this change is allowing Protoss to be able to focus on the more important parts of engagements, while Immortals continue to function at a high efficiency. At the same time, in order to use the ability for maximum efficiency, the highest-level players who have the extra micro to spare should turn this off. Thank you for this suggestion, and we will continue testing this change internally before making the call to have it go out to the beta.


The problem is that this "micro" ability is just boring. Activating an ability isn't exciting, stimming marines is boring, what you can do with stimmed marines is the exciting gameplay part. Same should be true for every activated ability.



The economy part makes me just sad, well overal very disappointed with the update
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
Lexender
Profile Joined September 2013
Mexico2655 Posts
August 21 2015 18:34 GMT
#15
Wasn't the whole point of reducing the warp in time when in range of a nexus/Gateway to allow protoss to defend early game agression?

Then why the fuck they still want to keep photon overcharge?
jinjin5000
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1470 Posts
August 21 2015 18:36 GMT
#16
Ravagers already delt with siege tanks well when they flanked or waited until roaches tanked damage. I don't know why they are trying to nerf siege tanks even more-its not that great at state right now and needs lots of support like liberator hellbat and cyclone to make it work and they are looking to reduce it even further
DeadByDawn
Profile Joined October 2012
United Kingdom476 Posts
August 21 2015 18:37 GMT
#17
Why do they even need PO anymore? Just insta-warp in units and defend. I attack you early with marines, warp one or two adepts in and kill them all. It is a no-skill action.
Magnifico
Profile Joined March 2013
1958 Posts
August 21 2015 18:38 GMT
#18
I don't even know what the word “gimmicky” means.
Everlong
Profile Joined April 2010
Czech Republic1973 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-08-21 18:40:21
August 21 2015 18:38 GMT
#19
RIP mech, lol - Zerg go their own tanks.. Haha!

It is impressive they are able to come up with so much of bullshit.

This is the such a free for all clusterfuck of random ideas I don't even.. :_D

Out of like 500 problems and things they need to work on they come up with 13 range ground Zerg unit to counter Tanks, I'm done here.
[UoN]Sentinel
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States11320 Posts
August 21 2015 18:39 GMT
#20
Gateway expanding will be pretty cool with the new MSC.

Also approve of the Colossus change. It should still have a purpose, even if it's weaker than before.
Нас зовет дух отцов, память старых бойцов, дух Москвы и твердыня Полтавы
1 2 3 4 5 19 20 21 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
All-Star Invitational
03:00
Day 1
Classic vs ClemLIVE!
Reynor vs Maru
WardiTV1572
PiGStarcraft623
IndyStarCraft 287
BRAT_OK 239
3DClanTV 136
CranKy Ducklings111
EnkiAlexander 58
IntoTheiNu 21
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft623
IndyStarCraft 287
BRAT_OK 239
UpATreeSC 75
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 10773
Killer 240
Leta 173
ToSsGirL 87
Shuttle 81
Mong 73
Dewaltoss 73
Barracks 70
910 56
soO 53
[ Show more ]
JulyZerg 46
Mind 40
Noble 32
GoRush 31
NotJumperer 17
ivOry 8
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm109
League of Legends
JimRising 673
C9.Mang0560
Counter-Strike
Foxcn186
Other Games
summit1g9309
Fuzer 181
Livibee78
RuFF_SC270
minikerr26
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick2230
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 52
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH75
• LUISG 8
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1286
• Stunt511
Upcoming Events
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3h 22m
AI Arena Tournament
11h 22m
BSL 21
11h 22m
Mihu vs eOnzErG
Dewalt vs Sziky
Bonyth vs DuGu
XuanXuan vs eOnzErG
Dewalt vs eOnzErG
All-Star Invitational
17h 37m
MMA vs DongRaeGu
Rogue vs Oliveira
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 1h
OSC
1d 3h
BSL 21
1d 11h
Bonyth vs Sziky
Mihu vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs XuanXuan
eOnzErG vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs DuGu
Dewalt vs Bonyth
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Big Brain Bouts
6 days
Serral vs TBD
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S1: W4
Big Gabe Cup #3
NA Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
OSC Championship Season 13
SC2 All-Star Inv. 2025
Underdog Cup #3
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W5
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Rongyi Cup S3
Nations Cup 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.