|
I thought we already agreed that worlds placements are a terrible judge of skill outside of who wins since it's mostly bracket luck. Are we just pretending it's good now again?
League pro teams lack a lot in the terms of BMT and in series adjustments. They have for years and now after barely having a year of functional series they all crawling back to that bo1? Kind of hilarious. Now they claiming they get so much out of scrims even though in the past they claimed how the games in scrims are so different from the games on stage. Maybe they just claim whatever they want to justify their current position with the truth being somewhere in-between?
edit: The whole "working with players union to make scrims better". Such incredible marketing speak. The issue with scrims has never been tools outside of replays. It's always been player culture and efficient use of time instead of mindless grinding. How you going to change that overnight with a few words is pretty remarkable.
If Bo1 is the saviour for broadcasting then so be it but let's not try pretend playing barely a TIs worth of games a whole year is really going to make people better.
|
On October 01 2017 03:52 cLutZ wrote:
One other thing to consider is how riot can increase its sample size for balance purposes outside of LCS. If they go back to BO1, the data becomes almost entirely anecdotal, so they will need another tool.
If Riot balances for competitive play, they should only balance for Korea anyway. I'm not sure how much of a focus it is for them really, but I don't think the lack of LCS games will be an issue.
|
Nah, Koreans haven't been ahead of the meta for ages, it's everything else they're better at, like macro and team fighting. Other regions find and exploit the OP picks as well, maybe not as well but they are capable of executing it.
|
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On October 01 2017 05:26 Numy wrote:
I thought we already agreed that worlds placements are a terrible judge of skill outside of who wins since it's mostly bracket luck. Are we just pretending it's good now again?
League pro teams lack a lot in the terms of BMT and in series adjustments. They have for years and now after barely having a year of functional series they all crawling back to that bo1? Kind of hilarious. Now they claiming they get so much out of scrims even though in the past they claimed how the games in scrims are so different from the games on stage. Maybe they just claim whatever they want to justify their current position with the truth being somewhere in-between?
edit: The whole "working with players union to make scrims better". Such incredible marketing speak. The issue with scrims has never been tools outside of replays. It's always been player culture and efficient use of time instead of mindless grinding. How you going to change that overnight with a few words is pretty remarkable.
If Bo1 is the saviour for broadcasting then so be it but let's not try pretend playing barely a TIs worth of games a whole year is really going to make people better.
You're right, it is. But there isn't any other evidence suggesting that Bo3 actually improved NA/EU in any meaningful way.
At the end of the day the players said they preferred Bo1, and that any improvements over the past few years was not attributable to Bo3. That's really the end of the discussion, except for people who like seeing Bo3 and will put words in players' mouths and try to speak for them to disingenuously prove their own point.
|
On October 01 2017 04:42 Sent. wrote:Show nested quote +like what do you gain from bo3? this fabled "experience"? IMO players have said you get more from scrim blocks and adjustments that way - they play bo5 or more during blocks. Why would the viewers care about what happens during the scrims?
Because you never actually read my post. It seems you just want to cherry pick a sentence to suit some argument you have in your head.
Try reading my post again and find where I'm talking about viewers. I do believe the entire post was about if bo3 was competitive .
At the end of the day the players said they preferred Bo1, and that any improvements over the past few years was not attributable to Bo3. That's really the end of the discussion, except for people who like seeing Bo3 and will put words in players' mouths and try to speak for them to disingenuously prove their own point.
And xpecial just posted a video favoring bo1 over bo3 so even more evidence that the players think its better.
|
I really don't get the scrim thing. Is it only about bo3s allegedly not making the LCS teams as good as they should be in international matches?
I don't care about that aspect as a viewer and don't understand why this is even discussed in relation to the league's format. The league exists mainly as a source of entertainment for the viewers, so if they prefer bo3s over bo1s, bo3s should stay. Bolded the "if" because Riot can be right and the viewers can actually prefer the bo1s. In that case there would be nothing wrong with switching back to bo1s.
|
On October 01 2017 05:49 DarkCore wrote:
Nah, Koreans haven't been ahead of the meta for ages, it's everything else they're better at, like macro and team fighting. Other regions find and exploit the OP picks as well, maybe not as well but they are capable of executing it.
I've heard people say similar things about European Zergs too.
|
Why are we talking like the unanimity of players and teams agreed on going back to Bo1 format? Pobelter + Cody Sun have commented in favor of keeping Bo3: https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/73ik7v/pobeltors_thoughts_on_best_of_1_change/dnqjqci/
Speculation: might be that the lower ranked teams voted in favor of Bo1s and that was enough to outnumber those who wanted to keep Bo3s in the Player's Association.
Either way, as a viewer, I'm sort of ok with Bo1s since the double concurrent streams was a pain to watch live if you wanted to see 1 match on a stream and 1 match on the other. And they would always spoil the results of matches or send you to the other stream if games finished too quickly.
|
To me the problem always seemed like a 'multiple streams' issue and not a 'best of 3' issue. Like I would tune out of games as a viewer because I wanted to watch the other streams match way more often than any other reason I'd stop watching. I think that, especially now that we've moved to a franchise league, now is the time to mirror LCK and do games 4-5 days a week. Teams would know the schedule ahead of time so they can plan for scrims during days they aren't playing, and we wouldn't have any of this multiple stream nonsense.
|
On October 01 2017 10:38 chipmonklord17 wrote:
To me the problem always seemed like a 'multiple streams' issue and not a 'best of 3' issue. Like I would tune out of games as a viewer because I wanted to watch the other streams match way more often than any other reason I'd stop watching. I think that, especially now that we've moved to a franchise league, now is the time to mirror LCK and do games 4-5 days a week. Teams would know the schedule ahead of time so they can plan for scrims during days they aren't playing, and we wouldn't have any of this multiple stream nonsense.
Probably not the best time to risk a schedule change like that right after entering a structure change.
|
On October 01 2017 08:41 Ansibled wrote:Show nested quote +On October 01 2017 05:49 DarkCore wrote:
Nah, Koreans haven't been ahead of the meta for ages, it's everything else they're better at, like macro and team fighting. Other regions find and exploit the OP picks as well, maybe not as well but they are capable of executing it. I've heard people say similar things about European Zergs too.
Will a TL mod show up at your door if you whisper 'patchzerg' three times?
|
On October 01 2017 12:42 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 01 2017 10:38 chipmonklord17 wrote:
To me the problem always seemed like a 'multiple streams' issue and not a 'best of 3' issue. Like I would tune out of games as a viewer because I wanted to watch the other streams match way more often than any other reason I'd stop watching. I think that, especially now that we've moved to a franchise league, now is the time to mirror LCK and do games 4-5 days a week. Teams would know the schedule ahead of time so they can plan for scrims during days they aren't playing, and we wouldn't have any of this multiple stream nonsense. Probably not the best time to risk a schedule change like that right after entering a structure change.
While you're right about the timing, I'd be all for the change to a 4-5 day schedule. It would mirror many of the sports leagues that exist save for NFL.
|
Yeah, I wouldn't mind it personally either. I don't think they'll stick to this format long term - at the very least I don't expect it to last past the end of next year.
|
On October 01 2017 13:28 lilwisper wrote:Show nested quote +On October 01 2017 12:42 Gahlo wrote:On October 01 2017 10:38 chipmonklord17 wrote:
To me the problem always seemed like a 'multiple streams' issue and not a 'best of 3' issue. Like I would tune out of games as a viewer because I wanted to watch the other streams match way more often than any other reason I'd stop watching. I think that, especially now that we've moved to a franchise league, now is the time to mirror LCK and do games 4-5 days a week. Teams would know the schedule ahead of time so they can plan for scrims during days they aren't playing, and we wouldn't have any of this multiple stream nonsense. Probably not the best time to risk a schedule change like that right after entering a structure change. While you're right about the timing, I'd be all for the change to a 4-5 day schedule. It would mirror many of the sports leagues that exist save for NFL.
That's exactly why I think they should switch now. I think that a best of 3, 4-5 day schedule with a franchised league is shown to work in most sports and there's no reason to assume it wouldn't work here. Although I definitely see your point that changing too much might mask whatever problems come up and make it hard to make the league better overall
|
|
|
I do love how they threating to leave LCS while not being involved in anything else and not exactly having a massive fanbase. Worst leveraging ever. Did they learn how to negotiate from Trump University?!
|
On October 02 2017 05:22 Numy wrote:
I do love how they threating to leave LCS while not being involved in anything else and not exactly having a massive fanbase. Worst leveraging ever. Did they learn how to negotiate from Trump University?!
Well, they claim they're going bankrupt so it's a strong possibility.
|
Come on H2K, bring Prolly home.
|
On October 02 2017 06:17 Gahlo wrote:
Come on H2K, bring Prolly home.
If he gets dropped, I have a hard time imagining a team that doesn't want him as a coach.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](https://i.gyazo.com/fd452ac6ab501298d7675f27ec24839f.png)
