EPTYou obviously can't do that in League as you actually need to see your screen lol. I'd be fine if they just took that info from the bottom and spread it out a bit. Don't have to spread it completely around the screen but having so much info in such a small place is just a bit arg.
[Patch 5.14] Bilgewater General Discussion - Page 27
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
You obviously can't do that in League as you actually need to see your screen lol. I'd be fine if they just took that info from the bottom and spread it out a bit. Don't have to spread it completely around the screen but having so much info in such a small place is just a bit arg. | ||
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GiftPflanZe
Germany623 Posts
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TheHumanSensation
Canada1210 Posts
On July 29 2015 05:05 Caiada wrote: The right mirror (or left in right driving cars) is absurdly inefficient. But the mirror *has* to be there to minimize blindspot. Out of curiosity, what is the extent of your driving experience? | ||
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On July 29 2015 04:44 nafta wrote: It honestly baffles me that there are still people saying it is good/sux w/e instead of just everyone agreeing we need customization. The answer to all UI issues is not "let's make this an option for the user to decide": http://www.joelonsoftware.com/uibook/chapters/fog0000000059.html This is especially problematic here because users demanding customization are obviously more vocal than users who are happy with how it is now. The vast majority of the "PLS LET ME CUSTOMIZE" complaints right now are basically demands to restore legacy HUD functionality, and that's a waste of time. The real question is, for someone new to League, who has no bias towards the old HUD, what does that person want as far as customization? As an example, let's look at HUD scaling. Should there be limits on HUD scaling? People make fun of competitive integrity as a proffered excuse, but it's a little shitty if your lane opponent has an advantage over you because he has better than 20/20 vision and can read extremely small text and therefore has a super teeny squint-o-vision HUD that allows him to see more of the battlefield. Maybe some HUD scaling is a good idea, but where do you draw the lines? Does it really matter that you can't make the HUD 5x as big as it is now? | ||
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Caiada
United States3052 Posts
It's a customizable UI, raider doing the highest level stuff, not a healer. Healers skew things because player bars are arguably more important than seeing where the fuck you are and you can't really shrink them in that game. Where's all his important shit? Now, I'd still argue for being able to move and swap frames. But anyone arguing this UI is broadly terrible (again, lots of little problems they're working on) is ignoring a fuckton of evidence. The real question is, for someone new to League, who has no bias towards the old HUD, what does that person want as far as customization? Ex-motherfuckin-actly. | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On July 29 2015 05:23 GrandInquisitor wrote: The answer to all UI issues is not "let's make this an option for the user to decide": http://www.joelonsoftware.com/uibook/chapters/fog0000000059.html This is especially problematic here because users demanding customization are obviously more vocal than users who are happy with how it is now. The vast majority of the "PLS LET ME CUSTOMIZE" complaints right now are basically demands to restore legacy HUD functionality, and that's a waste of time. The real question is, for someone new to League, who has no bias towards the old HUD, what does that person want as far as customization? I genuinely don't understand your point.If this is the base and they let us customize how is it inferior to what we have now in any way? Oh yeah right I forgot fuck everyone who doesn't agree with me. Fun fact about that FF14 youtube video the person made his hud like that it isn't the base for all users  . | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On July 29 2015 05:25 Caiada wrote: + Show Spoiler + https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGmB5GqmUZU It's a customizable UI, raider doing the highest level stuff, not a healer. Healers skew things because player bars are arguably more important than seeing where the fuck you are and you can't really shrink them in that game. Where's all his important shit? Now, I'd still argue for being able to move and swap frames. But anyone arguing this UI is broadly terrible (again, lots of little problems they're working on) is ignoring a fuckton of evidence. Ex-motherfuckin-actly. In WoW, if you are not a healer, all that stuff is not "important shit". | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On July 29 2015 05:26 nafta wrote: I genuinely don't understand your point.If this is the base and they let us customize how is it inferior to what we have now in any way? Oh yeah right I forgot fuck everyone who doesn't agree with me. Fun fact about that FF14 youtube video the person made his hud like that it isn't the base for all users .You're operating from the premise that customization is by definition good: if there's a dispute over how the HUD should be, it should just be a menu option and there's no downside to doing that. This is a commonly-believed misconception by non-designers and bad designers, and for reasons why you shouldn't do that, you should read the article I linked, or this one, or this one. A successful UI is not one that bombards you with questions about how you want to customize every possible detail; it gives you a few limited customization options but otherwise "makes those decisions" for you. Think about how many people complained to Facebook that users should be able to customize their profile pages like on Myspace. | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On July 29 2015 06:01 GrandInquisitor wrote: You're operating from the premise that customization is by definition good: if there's a dispute over how the HUD should be, it should just be a menu option and there's no downside to doing that. This is a commonly-believed misconception by non-designers and bad designers, and for reasons why you shouldn't do that, you should read the article I linked, or this one, or this one. A successful UI is not one that bombards you with questions about how you want to customize every possible detail; it gives you a few limited customization options but otherwise "makes those decisions" for you. Think about how many people complained to Facebook that users should be able to customize their profile pages like on Myspace. Inevitably, you are going to think of a long list of intelligent, defensible reasons why each of these options is absolutely, positively essential. Don't bother. I know. Each additional choice makes complete sense until you find yourself explaining to your uncle that he has to choose between 15 different ways to turn off a laptop. This quote explains exactly what I hate about the way riot are going for this.This is aimed at only a part of playerbase and completely ignores another part.Just because a lot of people who don't give a shit about this stuff exist doesn't mean everyone who does should be screwed over too. I get the idea "make everything as simple as possible so our retarded userbase understands it" but hey maybe for once the other part of the playerbase gets some love too?Blizzard is doing the same "people can't handle more than 9 deck slots" which is about as stupid. I mean people think rivington is a good caster.That says pretty much everything you need to know about most of the playerbase. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On July 29 2015 06:01 GrandInquisitor wrote: You're operating from the premise that customization is by definition good: if there's a dispute over how the HUD should be, it should just be a menu option and there's no downside to doing that. This is a commonly-believed misconception by non-designers and bad designers, and for reasons why you shouldn't do that, you should read the article I linked, or this one, or this one. A successful UI is not one that bombards you with questions about how you want to customize every possible detail; it gives you a few limited customization options but otherwise "makes those decisions" for you. Think about how many people complained to Facebook that users should be able to customize their profile pages like on Myspace. That is totally fine. The problem is the current HUD is basically "slick" but not functional if you are trying to be "quick". I don't mind if there are limited options, given those options being good. The Observer interface is well balanced. Those graphics the krndamaandsan posted basically show what my problem with the new UI is. HOTS has less information to keep track of, but spreads it out much better. http://guidescroll.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/is4Pq.png | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On July 29 2015 06:15 cLutZ wrote: That is totally fine. The problem is the current HUD is basically "slick" but not functional if you are trying to be "quick". I don't mind if there are limited options, given those options being good. The Observer interface is well balanced. Those graphics the krndamaandsan posted basically show what my problem with the new UI is. HOTS has less information to keep track of, but spreads it out much better. http://guidescroll.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/is4Pq.png HotS also benefits from a lot of "missing" features. There's no items, so inventories don't need to be shown. Teams level together, so no xp. Don't farm creeps(afaik) so there's no cs tracker. I see 0 stats about a PC other than HP/MP/Doubloons. Is there ability ranks in this game other than unlocked/locked? Cause I can't tell. etc. Of course a hud is going to look nicer when it has less elements to display. Try to template this for League and you're going to run into issues. | ||
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Amui
Canada10567 Posts
I do think customization is important, because I would like to A. Increase minimap size by 20% B. Decrease size of everything else by about 50% C. Disable teammate minicons unless I play Shen, and show me ulti timers on Tab. I won't be checking ulti-timers when I'm in the middle of a fight, and otherwise I don't really care. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On July 29 2015 06:25 Gahlo wrote: In a couple months, nobody will care. It's not quick because you don't know where things are. Not because you should, but because it's new. A hud is like a new pair of boots, you gotta break 'em in a bit. HotS also benefits from a lot of "missing" features. There's no items, so inventories don't need to be shown. Teams level together, so no xp. Don't farm creeps(afaik) so there's no cs tracker. I see 0 stats about a PC other than HP/MP/Doubloons. Is there ability ranks in this game other than unlocked/locked? Cause I can't tell. etc. Of course a hud is going to look nicer when it has less elements to display. Try to template this for League and you're going to run into issues. That was actually kind of my point, less elements, but still more spread out. Its a lot easier for me than the new LOL UI even though I rarely play HOTS. Honestly, if they transplanted the allies back to the left, and didn't make you press TAB to show the timers at the top of the screen the layout would make sense. The towers and kills probably also could be there, then the tab screen is also simplified and I don't have so much "wasted" space at the top of the screen. | ||
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Ansibled
United Kingdom9872 Posts
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On July 29 2015 07:01 Ansibled wrote: Yeah, Allies on left and score in top right is really all I want from the HUD. Agreed. Do that and don't make me need to press tab to see allied summoner spell cooldowns. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On July 29 2015 07:32 cLutZ wrote: Also, as an aside, by shoving everything on the bottom they just exacerbated the traditional red-blue skillshot problem (particularly because you need to increase HUD size compared to the old HUD). That's why they shifted everything out of the bottom left, because that's where the biggest issue with the camera angle is center. | ||
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geript
10024 Posts
1. I want to be able to see the timers without constantly having to press a button. 2. I want to be able to individually size different things (spells/items, mini-map, score, timers, allies etc.) 3. I want to be able to individually more around things (spells/items, mini-mapt, score, timers, allies, etc.) 4. I want to have a set of colors that doesn't make me want to vomit every time I play. Just give players 2-3 color schemes and let them pick the one they like the best. I don't think that any of this is actually that hard to do. IIRC Smite pretty much does this. In regards to WoW Raiding UI, I actually used a variety of mods so I could have the key spells watermarked onto the screen and didn't really have any bars whatsoever. It was far easier to see who was fucking up to see who needed to improve or get booted or send a warning. Plus, when I was healing it was really important to have most high health targets ignored while lower health were completely opaque; that way I knew which rotation of heals I had available to cover the group or in addition to my specific targets. Since I was druid heals, it was really easy to keep things up and let the other worse geared/less mana efficient guys save their heals. Plus it was the best way to be notified of a variety of proc's which brought skills back up to be available. | ||
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Goumindong
United States3529 Posts
On July 29 2015 07:36 Gahlo wrote: That's why they shifted everything out of the bottom left, because that's where the biggest issue with the camera angle is center. Sure, which is fine and as far as i can see no one is really complaining about[though i really dislike the XP bar, its totally fine to have thinner HP/Mana to make way for Xp]. But in doing so they now they have the same problem in the river. By moving the character portraits/info they took away what was usable space and replaced it with dead space. Non-corner edges see the least use since the map is laid out as an X. Anything which can "lay flat" or horizontally should ideally be moved into those areas. And well, we leave three of those areas open in favor of sticking everything onto the map, making that area huge Additionally, information should not be "clumped" in the same space. Because stuff that is clumped in the same space is hard to make out. The map and character icons and cs/kills etc are not the same type of information (you want the map all the time, and consistent, you want character icons to be easy to differentiate for clicking, you want overall game info sparingly) and so putting them together makes all three harder to use. Why can we have game time and ping (also they reversed the ping visual cue so that its backwards! full bars is now good rather than bad) in the top right but not the kill information? edit: Basically they say they want to make it more usable. But you don't do that by putting all the information in the same space. Because then, when i am answering the x number of questions that i have before i can make an answer i have to spend time differentiating UI elements rather than processing the information. So while they did a lot of good (you can now reorganize the big team comparison screen so that you can have the same order each time for top/support/ad etc! Items are organized in order of cost so you see completed and big items first, everything reads consistent left/right rather than a symmetric organization which reverses the order in which you process info depending on which team is looking at it, we have a tower count without doing it manually) | ||
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