EPT[Patch 4.11] Maokai Rework General Discussion - Page 40
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
On July 08 2014 07:17 Ryuu314 wrote: I think Riot doesn't want to do that. Lucian's passive is very unique in the sense that it's the only damaging passive that doesn't have a cooldown. It also makes Lucian's playstyle flow better - thematically he's supposed to be the Matrix-Equilibrium gunslinger trope and the no cd passive is what really helps tie that theme together. That being said, they could nerf the damage on his passive. Maybe 50% to 30% or something. Or maybe lower the cast range on his Q and Q only. 550 autoattack range to 500 kills the black guy. RIP Lucian Lucian seems to me to be the spiritual successor to late S2 Corki/S3 worlds Corki, in that the botlane is generally unhealthy when he is strong because he is good in lane, while also being good in the key midgame fights. This meant for Corki (means for Lucian) that against most other ADs there is a huge period of time for him to amass a lead that will take till the 40 minute mark for you to outscale him. Graves seems like the healthier Caster-ADC model because he can get bullied be equally skilled players on long range champs, and falls off much harder due to his kit. | ||
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arb
Noobville17920 Posts
On July 08 2014 07:51 cLutZ wrote: Lucian seems to me to be the spiritual successor to late S2 Corki/S3 worlds Corki, in that the botlane is generally unhealthy when he is strong because he is good in lane, while also being good in the key midgame fights. This meant for Corki (means for Lucian) that against most other ADs there is a huge period of time for him to amass a lead that will take till the 40 minute mark for you to outscale him. Graves seems like the healthier Caster-ADC model because he can get bullied be equally skilled players on long range champs, and falls off much harder due to his kit. Almost like he still doesnt have respectable burst, free tank stats, a blind, and a dash that gives movespeed. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
The "blind" is mostly for jukes and stuff, in a direct confrontation it actually gives vision slightly larger than the standard range (~= 575) so you can most of the time know who's hitting you and retaliate if you're ranged. It's very strong to cover for roams/counterganks by negating stuff like ward vision during a trade before the enemy can walk off though, and can be helpful to disengage in crossroads like in the jungle. His dash is short range (heck, he can't jump thick walls and needs to be very close to the edge of others not to mess up) and is still limited by his own autoattack range, which doesn't help (the steroid actually isn't that bad; and it should be maxed faster now that you can't rush BT, stack it and take a second point in W at 8 to one-shot caster minions with WQ). | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
I think he's not the best at teamfighting though and a lot of people don't use his passive fully. | ||
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killerdog
Denmark6522 Posts
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canikizu
4860 Posts
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
On July 08 2014 06:04 wei2coolman wrote: The one thing I did like about Lucian was that it was an ADC that non ADC players could play, and not be useless. Caitlyn already exists though. | ||
onlywonderboy
United States23745 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
'cept with his kit and role it's really hard for Olaf to go an offensive item because he'll then need to farm a 2nd complete one (at least) before he starts contributing to teamfights. Remove the mobility from Shyvana's ult and ask yourself if she would still be able to start BotRK, to sum it up. And people won't let you farm 2 complete items before they start doing shit around the map. And Olaf peaks during the midgame, 'cept unlike Irelia he can't assassinate people. After the changes, full tank Olaf was weaker than pre-change full tank Olaf, and 1+ damage item Olaf stronger than pre-change 1+ damage item Olaf. The issue is that you can't really build damage on him and hit comfortable timings/windows anyway... | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
Caitlyn is godawful if you don't main ad wtf.This myth is retarded.If you dont get fed in lane as cait you are useless compared to enemy ad until 3+ items. | ||
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
Though tanky junglers are going to make her life hard, SotAG means every jungler is now a tank so pewpewpew is pretty useless. | ||
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MattBarry
United States4006 Posts
On July 08 2014 09:43 nafta wrote: If you compare her timing to the popular adc champs her damage potential is very weak.She is only better than some others if enemy has no tanks but otherwise she is really bad. Caitlyn is very safe and easy to play. Idk wtf you are talking about, she is the only AD I can play without feeding hilariously since I don't play AD. Many, many other players feel the same way | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
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Goumindong
United States3529 Posts
On July 08 2014 09:30 nafta wrote: Caitlyn is godawful if you don't main ad wtf.This myth is retarded.If you dont get fed in lane as cait you are useless compared to enemy ad until 3+ items. I agree. Cait also requires a good rhythm and knowledge of lane mecahnics in order to harass and zone well in lane, mechanics which are very ranged AD specialized. Trist is the AD for people who don't know how to AD. You can't do well in lane anyway, so don't try. You auto shove lanes by reading a guide, all you have to do is right click from 700 units away | ||
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
On July 08 2014 09:30 Alaric wrote: Because the changes aimed at rewarding Olaf for building offensive items instead of going full tank. 'cept with his kit and role it's really hard for Olaf to go an offensive item because he'll then need to farm a 2nd complete one (at least) before he starts contributing to teamfights. Remove the mobility from Shyvana's ult and ask yourself if she would still be able to start BotRK, to sum it up. And people won't let you farm 2 complete items before they start doing shit around the map. And Olaf peaks during the midgame, 'cept unlike Irelia he can't assassinate people. After the changes, full tank Olaf was weaker than pre-change full tank Olaf, and 1+ damage item Olaf stronger than pre-change 1+ damage item Olaf. The issue is that you can't really build damage on him and hit comfortable timings/windows anyway... Only if by pre-change you mean post-nerf, which its fairly hard to be weaker than... | ||
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
On July 08 2014 10:16 GolemMadness wrote: My experience with people who don't play ADC trying to play Tristana is that they miss a bunch of CS because of E passive and at the end of the game I've done more damage as support. I don't know what these specialised ADC mechanics are that you need with Caitlyn. You out range them. You auto them when they try to CS. It's not complicated. imo abusing range is a lot more difficult than using skills, and if you don't abuse your range Cait is p bad. | ||
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