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On June 02 2014 15:10 yamato77 wrote:
I disagree that Jax or Olaf were broken before their reworks, but meh. The game is better when you have hard scaling melee carries.
Jax still scales plenty hard. He's easily the hardest scaling melee champ in the game atm.
Also, Jax remake came with a set of huge stat growth buffs plus the change to his ult more or less gives him the same survivability his stat conversion passive did. The only real change was the huge nerf his aspd steroid took.
Olaf was pretty damn bonkers for competitive play. He had virtually 100% pick/ban rates at the time and virtually single handedly forced a ton of AD carry picks out of the meta. The only viable AD carries during his reign were the ones with insane mobility (ie. Ezreal).
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On June 02 2014 15:10 yamato77 wrote:
I disagree that Jax or Olaf were broken before their reworks, but meh. The game is better when you have hard scaling melee carries.
you must not have played when jax could 1v5 and dodge turret shots lolol.
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On June 02 2014 12:57 Ryuu314 wrote:
Yea...the Xerath rework was a complete and utter failure. It didn't help his pickrate. If anything it probably hurt it since the people who actually liked and played Xerath lost their champion. His winrate didn't really change either.
The xerath rework is honestly just baffling, what the fuck were they thinking with the ult? Its just awful.
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On June 02 2014 15:23 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2014 12:57 Ryuu314 wrote:
Yea...the Xerath rework was a complete and utter failure. It didn't help his pickrate. If anything it probably hurt it since the people who actually liked and played Xerath lost their champion. His winrate didn't really change either. The xerath rework is honestly just baffling, what the fuck were they thinking with the ult? Its just awful.
My biggest gripe with the Xerath rework is that all the visuals seem like it was half-assed. The ult looks so goddam shitty.
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On June 02 2014 15:18 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2014 15:10 yamato77 wrote:
I disagree that Jax or Olaf were broken before their reworks, but meh. The game is better when you have hard scaling melee carries. Jax without a doubt was. The only way you can say Olaf wasn't is if you're being technical about how he got nerfed hard before the rework.
Jax had to be reworked. Not because of Jax's kit, but because of the removal of dodge mechanics from the game. The rework turned out pretty good, but his late game will never be the same 
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I refunded Xerath and his skins (had them all). As a Xerath player, Riot fucked him right up. They utterly destroyed his identity by removing his w, aka siege mode. It was what made him unique amongst long range casters. Now he is clunky as fuck. That charge up q is utter crap. Completely wrecked a functional champion for bullshit reasons.
He isn't any more popular, which is one of the reasons they mentioned. Honestly, if they had improved his visuals, that would have probably sufficed. His new visuals are terrible, so I guess they just fucked up anyway. Plus he still kills from a long range, which for some innane reason was bad for Xerath but fine for other long range casters.
Still salty, never not salty.
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Honestly I think new xerath plays pretty much identically to old xerath except his burst is gone and replaced with a worthless peashooter only good for picking off people escaping with slivers of health.
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Played that new game mode with all Twitch. AP twitch is freaking broken in that mode. (since you can pop other people's deadly venom).
http://www.twitch.tv/team/clg
it's happening.
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I'm surprised I haven't seen/heard more stuff about the MLGtv stuff. It's much more functional than Azubu in my experience and if I understand correctly the ROI is pretty solid.
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United States47024 Posts
On June 02 2014 13:52 KissBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2014 13:18 TheYango wrote:On June 02 2014 13:11 InfSunday wrote:On June 02 2014 13:08 justiceknight wrote:On June 02 2014 13:04 yamato77 wrote:
A lot of reworks completely suck, to be honest. on the other hand am i safe to say LMQ is overrated by losing 2 games now? It depends. I thought the general consensus was that they're good but predictably snowbally and therefore not god-tier - which is what we've seen with the two losses. But I've seen some people say they're easily #1 team NA - so you'd be correct in that instance. Did people really expect a 2nd/3rd tier Chinese team to do better than they are? I mean, given the relative performance of NA and China in the past, I don't think it was ever realistic to expect outrageous things from them. Not sure if you agree but what do you think of their performance versus when they first came to the US? To be honest, I thought they got a lot better. When they first popped up, I wasn't too impressed by them. Vasili looked like Chinese ADC so they had that going for their team & Ackerman was Godlike. However, since then, I thought NoName, XWX, Mor really grew into their own. Oddly enough, I thought they really grew within the NA scene and I don't think they would've yielded the same results had they stayed in CN.
They got better while in NA, but you have to realize that their lineup was already way worse because Royal basically trashed last season's LMQ lineup in order to get replacements for the Royal main team.
They got better results here, but I don't believe they're a better team than they would be playing against Chinese teams.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
On June 02 2014 16:29 wei2coolman wrote:Played that new game mode with all Twitch. AP twitch is freaking broken in that mode. (since you can pop other people's deadly venom). http://www.twitch.tv/team/clgit's happening.
Wait, couldn't we set up TL off topic streaming group like that?
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On June 02 2014 15:00 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2014 13:04 yamato77 wrote:
A lot of reworks completely suck, to be honest.
EDIT: Olaf, Jax (people think new Jax scales hard, lololol), Corki, Phage/Triforce, Flat/%Pen, AD/Crit/ASp scaling/cost.
I could go on about the horrid changes they've made to this game. Olaf was just broken pre-rework. Post-rework he's nowhere near as strong as he is during his peak, but Olaf's peak was ridiculous. He's still better than post-nerf Olaf.
"Oh, when the meta is about going full tank, the guy who's got no mobility but good base damage and is good at brawling at low health and building exclusively tanky is strong.
Let's nerf Sunfire. Oh, and Randuin's. Smash FH to the ground too. And do even worse things to Warmog's. That guy was having success but surely there was no correlation between this and the meta, or every single freaking damn item he built that's been nerfed at the same time. Let's gut him."
Fucking Riot tunnel-vision. I can't blame Smash for trying, he did with what he had, and just nerfing his base damage (or full tank build damage output, in other words) was enough to make the post-rework Olaf worse off than a pre-rework reasonably adjusted Olaf (and it was one of the core goals of the rework). New Olaf's decent on paper, it's just he can't do what used to be his job, and faces very tough competition with the lack of "true" hard initiation in the game atm compared to all the shit picks like Ziggs provide to zone, stall and disengage.
Olaf is currently UP and would at least need his Q nerf reverted, though. You wouldn't think that needing to chain one more Q to get to your lane opponent would change much, but it's huge, especially if your lane's pushing (and if it isn't you're already giving up farm to chase so far so it's a loss too). You spend a lot more mana and lose out on damage.
On June 02 2014 11:04 Kinie wrote:
I've gotta say that even if you don't have a tier 1 meta champ, having an overall good champ for a particular role also helps.
Like Vi is not a current meta champ, but her ganks are so strong that in yolo Q you can tend to get away with it.
It's not hipster per-se, but it is about having a "pocket champ" that you can pull out to leverage your skill on that champ against the enemy team.
I just wish I could still call Riven my pocket champ for top lane. The hp/5 nerf to her was INSANELY overhanded, like you can't run her without a specific rune page, which I don't have the time/money to make.
As long as you shield harass, it's actually a buff because using E on cd is more "hp5" than she passively had previously. I don't see anything bad with Riven not getting to be a massive pusys if she feels like it, her all-ins and base damage are already pretty stupid (combo that with the mobility and cc and lack of animations/cast times and oh, she's got an assassin's damage scaling but all in AoE and a defensive steroid scaling off offensive stats), when she had one of the highest base hp5 in the game she could pussy out and stave off a lot of harass between that and her E.
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On June 02 2014 15:20 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2014 15:10 yamato77 wrote:
I disagree that Jax or Olaf were broken before their reworks, but meh. The game is better when you have hard scaling melee carries. Jax still scales plenty hard. He's easily the hardest scaling melee champ in the game atm. Also, Jax remake came with a set of huge stat growth buffs plus the change to his ult more or less gives him the same survivability his stat conversion passive did. The only real change was the huge nerf his aspd steroid took. Olaf was pretty damn bonkers for competitive play. He had virtually 100% pick/ban rates at the time and virtually single handedly forced a ton of AD carry picks out of the meta. The only viable AD carries during his reign were the ones with insane mobility (ie. Ezreal).
The problem isn't that they reworked Olaf but that they reworked Olaf and gutted every item that made him strong. He was only good in that absurd tank meta with the crazy Warmogs but they Olaf'ed him then nerfed those tank items so it basically rendered the olafing pointless.
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If Jax got two kills in a pro game he'd be left alone. That's expected. He's fed and against bad duelists. When Olaf does it, it doesn't look like there's counterplay because his ulti is cc immunity. So they poppied him so they wouldn't have to deal with pros crying about Olaf ever again.
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On June 02 2014 14:08 zulu_nation8 wrote:
I don't get why zyra keeps getting picked when she's so slow and squishy and they go pure AP on her. In b4 someone tries to explain by listing her strengths.
Also 2v0 for first 10 minutes meta with support roam makes her pretty strong on blue side for plants tanking early dragons at like level 4
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NiP getting banned lol. Maybe Alex Ich should come play for Curse 
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On June 02 2014 20:31 Sufficiency wrote:NiP getting banned lol. Maybe Alex Ich should come play for Curse
Do say more than that...
So appearently nukeduck and mithy banned for being abusive in chat. See Pro scene evolution.
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On June 02 2014 20:45 Duvon wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2014 20:31 Sufficiency wrote:NiP getting banned lol. Maybe Alex Ich should come play for Curse Do say more than that... So appearently nukeduck and mithy banned for being abusive in chat. See Pro scene evolution.
http://forums.euw.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1749326
Edit : Oh and now I can finally say that nukeduck is a f****** p**** of s***. Glad he's banned that guy was more toxic than a Weezing. Seems like being "pro" wasn't enough to teach him some respect.
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Yeah, 'cause cc is the only way to protect someone. Heals, dashes, shields, speed boosts etc. mean nothing, sure.
The difference is that if you have to run from someone else, if you slow them people don't go as far and move slower so you can get more autos in and get less isolated than if running from Olaf.
On the other hand Olaf's using his ult, when it's down he's a sitting duck. If you survive he can't even run way or, if you lead him away from the fight, regroup with his team. His Q is meh as a defensive cc. His W is useless if he's not in melee range to lifesteal.
Pros are the most armed to deal with Olaf's ult since they aren't Gold scrubs unable to even conceive that using Lulu's or Orianna's W on your carries instead of him will let them dodge the axe and keep their distance. That Olaf does jack shit against poke because he can't even manmode the way Jax can E-flash-QE or dumb-Riven can E-flash-W into the enemy team. That if you can drag a fight or force his ult early he becomes weak as fuck, even worse than lategame Twitch with his ult on cd when a fight starts.
'cause remember that Olaf falls off late because he can't itemise properly (squishy if not built full tank, no damage anymore if he skips damage items) but also because lategame 6s doesn't mean squat when you aren't an assassin and as such his ult can be stalled out (unless there's like Sivir+Karma or Lulu in your team but then you'd rather play against that than Ziggs/Nidalee/LB or Lucian/Twitch/Kog anyway).
There's a difference between "no counterplay" and "simple counterplay that people are too dumb to conceive" like non-cc based peeling.
(Now try to "counterplay" Rengar when you need Exhaust or instant point'n'click cc (which is becoming more and more scarce in the game) to prevent him from instantly killing a guy even with 100 armour. And then you still have the whole job of killing him before he escapes.)
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EPT
