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Is there a reason people only play Ice dragon Shyvana? is it the dragon form looking neat or is there something better about the skin, cause i literally never see another skin for her
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United States23745 Posts
On April 12 2014 08:33 arb wrote:
Is there a reason people only play Ice dragon Shyvana? is it the dragon form looking neat or is there something better about the skin, cause i literally never see another skin for her
It's by far the coolest.
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On April 12 2014 06:55 chalice wrote:
i still think sorcs and guise is almost legit on shyvana, she does have really strong base magic damage
anyone have any tips on using xin zhao's ultimate? it doesn't seem the easiest skill to use intuitively because of the passive interaction.
Treat yourself like an explosive cask that Insecs. E into your non target, preferably behind your target, and then ult.
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On April 12 2014 08:26 Sufficiency wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 08:20 arb wrote:On April 12 2014 07:22 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 07:06 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 07:03 Sufficiency wrote:
I do think hybrid pen runes are good on Shyvana. Not 100% sure on guise though. Screw guise, need liandries for maximum burn. And zhonyas for golden flying dragon swag points. Give this guy a PhD. I think guise/sorc boots has merit on shyvana if you get fed tbh. or as a last item. adds so much extra damage to her when shes sitting on top of you eating your face This is my issue with item analysis (like what that website I linked gives). Often, when you are ahead, your itemization choices do not matter - for example, I only build Liandry's on Amumu when I am ahead so I almost always win when I build this item. It gives very little indication that Liandry's is good on Amumu.
I dunno about that though. There are definitely cases where certain item builds are far superior when you're ahead than whem you're behind. The most common case is grabbing 3rd defensive item on adc after you completely smashed botlane and your damage stays relevant/high despite going 3rd defensive item.
Other cases include getting triforce/hydra on shen when he gets his defensive item timings super early on.
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On April 12 2014 08:48 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 08:33 arb wrote:
Is there a reason people only play Ice dragon Shyvana? is it the dragon form looking neat or is there something better about the skin, cause i literally never see another skin for her It's by far the coolest.
I'd like to buy it and play it more, but so scary to risk picking her till they've picked a toplane zzz.
picking her then them getting trundle is really dumb :<
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On April 12 2014 09:07 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 08:26 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 08:20 arb wrote:On April 12 2014 07:22 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 07:06 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 07:03 Sufficiency wrote:
I do think hybrid pen runes are good on Shyvana. Not 100% sure on guise though. Screw guise, need liandries for maximum burn. And zhonyas for golden flying dragon swag points. Give this guy a PhD. I think guise/sorc boots has merit on shyvana if you get fed tbh. or as a last item. adds so much extra damage to her when shes sitting on top of you eating your face This is my issue with item analysis (like what that website I linked gives). Often, when you are ahead, your itemization choices do not matter - for example, I only build Liandry's on Amumu when I am ahead so I almost always win when I build this item. It gives very little indication that Liandry's is good on Amumu. I dunno about that though. There are definitely cases where certain item builds are far superior when you're ahead than whem you're behind. The most common case is grabbing 3rd defensive item on adc after you completely smashed botlane and your damage stays relevant/high despite going 3rd defensive item. Other cases include getting triforce/hydra on shen when he gets his defensive item timings super early on.
There are so many confounding factors that it'll almost always be misleading.
I also believe that certain itemization choices, such as building a defensive item as a third item on ADC, is very strong. But this is very difficult to detect using the data we have available from Riot, because:
1. How do you tell it's the third item? While I can tell you what is likely to be the third item, you can't actually tell the order which a player bought the items when you only have the end-game itemization data. For example, if a Lucian has BT, TF, LW, and BV at the end of the game, you can't actually tell which item was bought third.
2. Darian's-DCAP-on-Shyvana issue, which I have previously described. When you are winning you will get more gold for more items - and your itemization choices does not really matter.
3. Issue 2 in reverse: when you are losing, you may not be able to get the item you want. Maybe you got smashed so hard in lane that you never got around to get the money for a BV, which never built first.
I personally believe any meaningful itemization analysis requires the data as the game progresses, not just end-game data. I am not sure if this will ever be possible, but perhaps with in-client replay features we will be able to mine the replays for these things.
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On April 12 2014 09:24 Sufficiency wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 09:07 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 08:26 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 08:20 arb wrote:On April 12 2014 07:22 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 07:06 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 07:03 Sufficiency wrote:
I do think hybrid pen runes are good on Shyvana. Not 100% sure on guise though. Screw guise, need liandries for maximum burn. And zhonyas for golden flying dragon swag points. Give this guy a PhD. I think guise/sorc boots has merit on shyvana if you get fed tbh. or as a last item. adds so much extra damage to her when shes sitting on top of you eating your face This is my issue with item analysis (like what that website I linked gives). Often, when you are ahead, your itemization choices do not matter - for example, I only build Liandry's on Amumu when I am ahead so I almost always win when I build this item. It gives very little indication that Liandry's is good on Amumu. I dunno about that though. There are definitely cases where certain item builds are far superior when you're ahead than whem you're behind. The most common case is grabbing 3rd defensive item on adc after you completely smashed botlane and your damage stays relevant/high despite going 3rd defensive item. Other cases include getting triforce/hydra on shen when he gets his defensive item timings super early on. There are so many confounding factors that it'll almost always be misleading. I also believe that certain itemization choices, such as building a defensive item as a third item on ADC, is very strong. But this is very difficult to detect using the data we have available from Riot, because: 1. How do you tell it's the third item? While I can tell you what is likely to be the third item, you can't actually tell the order which a player bought the items when you only have the end-game itemization data. For example, if a Lucian has BT, TF, LW, and BV at the end of the game, you can't actually tell which item was bought third. 2. Darian's-DCAP-on-Shyvana issue, which I have previously described. When you are winning you will get more gold for more items - and your itemization choices does not really matter. 3. Issue 2 in reverse: when you are losing, you may not be able to get the item you want. Maybe you got smashed so hard in lane that you never got around to get the money for a BV, which never built first. I personally believe any meaningful itemization analysis requires the data as the game progresses, not just end-game data. I am not sure if this will ever be possible, but perhaps with in-client replay features we will be able to mine the replays for these things.
I mean the most obvious one for me is triforce/hydra on shen.
It's actually an item you don't get at 6 items unless at some point you're ahead.
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On April 12 2014 08:48 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 08:33 arb wrote:
Is there a reason people only play Ice dragon Shyvana? is it the dragon form looking neat or is there something better about the skin, cause i literally never see another skin for her It's by far the coolest.
OWB almost got away with this, where are your standards guys?
Blue Eyes White Dragon is best all-around, her dragon is slightly worse than Blackfire Shyv, but regular form is better by enough to justify it being the best skin.
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On April 12 2014 08:48 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 08:33 arb wrote:
Is there a reason people only play Ice dragon Shyvana? is it the dragon form looking neat or is there something better about the skin, cause i literally never see another skin for her It's by far the coolest.
They should make popstar shyvana.
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On April 12 2014 09:34 Kyrie wrote:probuilds tracks purchase order example game
Yeah I suspect if you spectate the game as a bot, you can mine these information. But this requures a hack far more complicated than running the Riot API.
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On April 12 2014 09:38 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 09:24 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 09:07 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 08:26 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 08:20 arb wrote:On April 12 2014 07:22 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 07:06 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 07:03 Sufficiency wrote:
I do think hybrid pen runes are good on Shyvana. Not 100% sure on guise though. Screw guise, need liandries for maximum burn. And zhonyas for golden flying dragon swag points. Give this guy a PhD. I think guise/sorc boots has merit on shyvana if you get fed tbh. or as a last item. adds so much extra damage to her when shes sitting on top of you eating your face This is my issue with item analysis (like what that website I linked gives). Often, when you are ahead, your itemization choices do not matter - for example, I only build Liandry's on Amumu when I am ahead so I almost always win when I build this item. It gives very little indication that Liandry's is good on Amumu. I dunno about that though. There are definitely cases where certain item builds are far superior when you're ahead than whem you're behind. The most common case is grabbing 3rd defensive item on adc after you completely smashed botlane and your damage stays relevant/high despite going 3rd defensive item. Other cases include getting triforce/hydra on shen when he gets his defensive item timings super early on. There are so many confounding factors that it'll almost always be misleading. I also believe that certain itemization choices, such as building a defensive item as a third item on ADC, is very strong. But this is very difficult to detect using the data we have available from Riot, because: 1. How do you tell it's the third item? While I can tell you what is likely to be the third item, you can't actually tell the order which a player bought the items when you only have the end-game itemization data. For example, if a Lucian has BT, TF, LW, and BV at the end of the game, you can't actually tell which item was bought third. 2. Darian's-DCAP-on-Shyvana issue, which I have previously described. When you are winning you will get more gold for more items - and your itemization choices does not really matter. 3. Issue 2 in reverse: when you are losing, you may not be able to get the item you want. Maybe you got smashed so hard in lane that you never got around to get the money for a BV, which never built first. I personally believe any meaningful itemization analysis requires the data as the game progresses, not just end-game data. I am not sure if this will ever be possible, but perhaps with in-client replay features we will be able to mine the replays for these things. I mean the most obvious one for me is triforce/hydra on shen. It's actually an item you don't get at 6 items unless at some point you're ahead.
If you are kind of behind in lane, would you still build triforce/hydra?
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On April 12 2014 09:46 Sufficiency wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 09:38 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 09:24 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 09:07 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 08:26 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 08:20 arb wrote:On April 12 2014 07:22 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 07:06 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 07:03 Sufficiency wrote:
I do think hybrid pen runes are good on Shyvana. Not 100% sure on guise though. Screw guise, need liandries for maximum burn. And zhonyas for golden flying dragon swag points. Give this guy a PhD. I think guise/sorc boots has merit on shyvana if you get fed tbh. or as a last item. adds so much extra damage to her when shes sitting on top of you eating your face This is my issue with item analysis (like what that website I linked gives). Often, when you are ahead, your itemization choices do not matter - for example, I only build Liandry's on Amumu when I am ahead so I almost always win when I build this item. It gives very little indication that Liandry's is good on Amumu. I dunno about that though. There are definitely cases where certain item builds are far superior when you're ahead than whem you're behind. The most common case is grabbing 3rd defensive item on adc after you completely smashed botlane and your damage stays relevant/high despite going 3rd defensive item. Other cases include getting triforce/hydra on shen when he gets his defensive item timings super early on. There are so many confounding factors that it'll almost always be misleading. I also believe that certain itemization choices, such as building a defensive item as a third item on ADC, is very strong. But this is very difficult to detect using the data we have available from Riot, because: 1. How do you tell it's the third item? While I can tell you what is likely to be the third item, you can't actually tell the order which a player bought the items when you only have the end-game itemization data. For example, if a Lucian has BT, TF, LW, and BV at the end of the game, you can't actually tell which item was bought third. 2. Darian's-DCAP-on-Shyvana issue, which I have previously described. When you are winning you will get more gold for more items - and your itemization choices does not really matter. 3. Issue 2 in reverse: when you are losing, you may not be able to get the item you want. Maybe you got smashed so hard in lane that you never got around to get the money for a BV, which never built first. I personally believe any meaningful itemization analysis requires the data as the game progresses, not just end-game data. I am not sure if this will ever be possible, but perhaps with in-client replay features we will be able to mine the replays for these things. I mean the most obvious one for me is triforce/hydra on shen. It's actually an item you don't get at 6 items unless at some point you're ahead. If you are kind of behind in lane, would you still build triforce/hydra?
taht's your point though right? items that are good when ahead, but aren't good when behind.
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On April 12 2014 09:47 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 09:46 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 09:38 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 09:24 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 09:07 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 08:26 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 08:20 arb wrote:On April 12 2014 07:22 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 07:06 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 07:03 Sufficiency wrote:
I do think hybrid pen runes are good on Shyvana. Not 100% sure on guise though. Screw guise, need liandries for maximum burn. And zhonyas for golden flying dragon swag points. Give this guy a PhD. I think guise/sorc boots has merit on shyvana if you get fed tbh. or as a last item. adds so much extra damage to her when shes sitting on top of you eating your face This is my issue with item analysis (like what that website I linked gives). Often, when you are ahead, your itemization choices do not matter - for example, I only build Liandry's on Amumu when I am ahead so I almost always win when I build this item. It gives very little indication that Liandry's is good on Amumu. I dunno about that though. There are definitely cases where certain item builds are far superior when you're ahead than whem you're behind. The most common case is grabbing 3rd defensive item on adc after you completely smashed botlane and your damage stays relevant/high despite going 3rd defensive item. Other cases include getting triforce/hydra on shen when he gets his defensive item timings super early on. There are so many confounding factors that it'll almost always be misleading. I also believe that certain itemization choices, such as building a defensive item as a third item on ADC, is very strong. But this is very difficult to detect using the data we have available from Riot, because: 1. How do you tell it's the third item? While I can tell you what is likely to be the third item, you can't actually tell the order which a player bought the items when you only have the end-game itemization data. For example, if a Lucian has BT, TF, LW, and BV at the end of the game, you can't actually tell which item was bought third. 2. Darian's-DCAP-on-Shyvana issue, which I have previously described. When you are winning you will get more gold for more items - and your itemization choices does not really matter. 3. Issue 2 in reverse: when you are losing, you may not be able to get the item you want. Maybe you got smashed so hard in lane that you never got around to get the money for a BV, which never built first. I personally believe any meaningful itemization analysis requires the data as the game progresses, not just end-game data. I am not sure if this will ever be possible, but perhaps with in-client replay features we will be able to mine the replays for these things. I mean the most obvious one for me is triforce/hydra on shen. It's actually an item you don't get at 6 items unless at some point you're ahead. If you are kind of behind in lane, would you still build triforce/hydra? taht's your point though right? items that are good when ahead, but aren't good when behind.
This is just the Darian's DCAP problem.
If you are "ahead", you are already more likely to win. So, for argument's sake, when you think you are "ahead", you are going to win 75% of the time. Furthermore, suppose triforce is just an mediocre item in all situations and does not actually affects your win rate. Then, when you collect your data it will seem like you are winning 75% of the time with triforce, but in reality you just have a very biased sample.
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On April 12 2014 09:45 GhandiEAGLE wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 08:48 onlywonderboy wrote:On April 12 2014 08:33 arb wrote:
Is there a reason people only play Ice dragon Shyvana? is it the dragon form looking neat or is there something better about the skin, cause i literally never see another skin for her It's by far the coolest. OWB almost got away with this, where are your standards guys? Blue Eyes White Dragon is best all-around, her dragon is slightly worse than Blackfire Shyv, but regular form is better by enough to justify it being the best skin.
I dont like the dragon on Redeyes Shyvana at all tbh. Ice Shyvana has the best dragon hands down.
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On April 12 2014 09:55 Sufficiency wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2014 09:47 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 09:46 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 09:38 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 09:24 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 09:07 wei2coolman wrote:On April 12 2014 08:26 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 08:20 arb wrote:On April 12 2014 07:22 Sufficiency wrote:On April 12 2014 07:06 wei2coolman wrote:
[quote]
Screw guise, need liandries for maximum burn. And zhonyas for golden flying dragon swag points. Give this guy a PhD. I think guise/sorc boots has merit on shyvana if you get fed tbh. or as a last item. adds so much extra damage to her when shes sitting on top of you eating your face This is my issue with item analysis (like what that website I linked gives). Often, when you are ahead, your itemization choices do not matter - for example, I only build Liandry's on Amumu when I am ahead so I almost always win when I build this item. It gives very little indication that Liandry's is good on Amumu. I dunno about that though. There are definitely cases where certain item builds are far superior when you're ahead than whem you're behind. The most common case is grabbing 3rd defensive item on adc after you completely smashed botlane and your damage stays relevant/high despite going 3rd defensive item. Other cases include getting triforce/hydra on shen when he gets his defensive item timings super early on. There are so many confounding factors that it'll almost always be misleading. I also believe that certain itemization choices, such as building a defensive item as a third item on ADC, is very strong. But this is very difficult to detect using the data we have available from Riot, because: 1. How do you tell it's the third item? While I can tell you what is likely to be the third item, you can't actually tell the order which a player bought the items when you only have the end-game itemization data. For example, if a Lucian has BT, TF, LW, and BV at the end of the game, you can't actually tell which item was bought third. 2. Darian's-DCAP-on-Shyvana issue, which I have previously described. When you are winning you will get more gold for more items - and your itemization choices does not really matter. 3. Issue 2 in reverse: when you are losing, you may not be able to get the item you want. Maybe you got smashed so hard in lane that you never got around to get the money for a BV, which never built first. I personally believe any meaningful itemization analysis requires the data as the game progresses, not just end-game data. I am not sure if this will ever be possible, but perhaps with in-client replay features we will be able to mine the replays for these things. I mean the most obvious one for me is triforce/hydra on shen. It's actually an item you don't get at 6 items unless at some point you're ahead. If you are kind of behind in lane, would you still build triforce/hydra? taht's your point though right? items that are good when ahead, but aren't good when behind. This is just the Darian's DCAP problem. If you are "ahead", you are already more likely to win. So, for argument's sake, when you think you are "ahead", you are going to win 75% of the time. Furthermore, suppose triforce is just an mediocre item in all situations and does not actually affects your win rate. Then, when you collect your data it will seem like you are winning 75% of the time with triforce, but in reality you just have a very biased sample.
statistics or otherwise, the point of getting offensive item on shen was to splitpush faster. If you got to the point where you're unkillable due to a lead, there's no point in buying another defensive item. You don't need statistics to tell you stuff like this.
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I am not saying anything like item X is good on champion Y.
I am just saying detecting this purely using data is tricky.
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Shyvana has terrible skin selection. I get that boobwindow and cleavage have the whole yugioh duo going, but none of the skins really explore her half-dragon aspect at all until she goes full dragon, which is really disappointing. Human/armour shyv is neat because it's different but then the others went in the same direction, so it's not so much anymore. People like bonedragon? Normal shyv best shyv.
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she more naked in ice dragon its kinda o bvious
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EPT
