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[Patch 4.3] Vel'Koz General Discussion - Page 2

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EU LCS Week 8 Review
LaNague
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Germany9118 Posts
February 27 2014 00:53 GMT
#21
they can change support items all they want, people will always go for the runspeed active.




also, good first step into deleting yasuo, looking forward to more nerfs.
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
February 27 2014 00:55 GMT
#22
They should just change the Face of the Mountain active with Ohmwrecker, and remove Ohmwrecker as an item.
liftlift > tsm
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
February 27 2014 00:58 GMT
#23
Some serious math needs to be done, but some quick calculation shows that Relic Shield is nerfed.

You used to get 6HP/5sec, but now you don't have that anymore and instead you get healed for 40HP per charge spent. Since you get one charge per 60 seconds, that's 40/12 = 3.3HP/5sec. This, in combination that one of Relic Shield's strongest point is the early push to level 2 (when you are probably at full health), makes it a lot worse of a starting item than before.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
killerdog
Profile Joined February 2010
Denmark6522 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-27 01:00:02
February 27 2014 00:59 GMT
#24
What they should do is make fear cause you to run extra fast (like 150% ms speed or something) directly away from the thing which is fearing you. That both makes sense, and would give the chance for some epic plays. Fiddles ult into the team and cause the adc to run off into the distance/into your team. Heca ult causing the whole team to scatter like a slower gragas ult, noc able to ult someone, then flash fear then back into his team. Chances for highlight reel worthy fear plays.

As it is right now it's just kind of a shitty stun, except worse in most situations.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
February 27 2014 00:59 GMT
#25
On February 27 2014 09:55 wei2coolman wrote:
They should just change the Face of the Mountain active with Ohmwrecker, and remove Ohmwrecker as an item.


I think instead of FotM's active's damage component, make it slow surrounding unit until the shield breaks.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
killerdog
Profile Joined February 2010
Denmark6522 Posts
February 27 2014 01:00 GMT
#26
On February 27 2014 09:59 Sufficiency wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 09:55 wei2coolman wrote:
They should just change the Face of the Mountain active with Ohmwrecker, and remove Ohmwrecker as an item.


I think instead of FotM's active's damage component, make it slow surrounding unit until the shield breaks.

Or make the break a small knockback effect rather then damage. All enemies nearby get knocked back a few hundred units.
IMoperator
Profile Joined October 2011
4476 Posts
February 27 2014 01:11 GMT
#27
ok how do you carry as adc in solo queue? it seems like the game 100% depends on if your mid/top/jung wins or not, and you have no control over anything unless you get stupidly fed. how do people like wildturtle and them all rank up fast? do they just duo?
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
February 27 2014 01:17 GMT
#28
On February 27 2014 10:11 IMoperator wrote:
ok how do you carry as adc in solo queue? it seems like the game 100% depends on if your mid/top/jung wins or not, and you have no control over anything unless you get stupidly fed. how do people like wildturtle and them all rank up fast? do they just duo?

Go back 2 years when ADC's could actually carry. huehue.
Just gotta play smart, don't expect to kill everyone, just force the enemy divers to dive you so deep that even if they kill you, your team cleans up. ADC's pretty much exist to get towers now.
liftlift > tsm
GolemMadness
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada11044 Posts
February 27 2014 01:20 GMT
#29
I can see spellthief being beastly on Sona. That poke is gonna be crazy.
http://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=FLABREZU
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
February 27 2014 01:20 GMT
#30
Hey Neo.

Because I'm incredibly, incredibly lazy, it would facilitate that laziness if, when you closed a GD thread, you put a link in the post to the new one.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
IMoperator
Profile Joined October 2011
4476 Posts
February 27 2014 01:20 GMT
#31
On February 27 2014 10:17 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 10:11 IMoperator wrote:
ok how do you carry as adc in solo queue? it seems like the game 100% depends on if your mid/top/jung wins or not, and you have no control over anything unless you get stupidly fed. how do people like wildturtle and them all rank up fast? do they just duo?

Go back 2 years when ADC's could actually carry. huehue.
Just gotta play smart, don't expect to kill everyone, just force the enemy divers to dive you so deep that even if they kill you, your team cleans up. ADC's pretty much exist to get towers now.

it really sucks because it's my favorite role, because i like how mechanics focused it is. but it feels like i have no impact at all besides getting towers, like you said.
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
February 27 2014 01:26 GMT
#32
On February 27 2014 10:20 GolemMadness wrote:
I can see spellthief being beastly on Sona. That poke is gonna be crazy.

support AP Ez, the dream is real.
liftlift > tsm
VayneAuthority
Profile Joined October 2012
United States8983 Posts
February 27 2014 01:29 GMT
#33
stop playing lucian/caitlyn/etc and play vayne/twitch/draven/etc and you will see why ADs can carry. the ones that can rarely get pick in competitive games though.
I come in for the scraps
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
February 27 2014 01:36 GMT
#34
Caitlyn one of best ads to carry imo.You can win lane even with retard support and that matters more than anything else.
Eppa!
Profile Joined November 2010
Sweden4641 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-27 01:40:48
February 27 2014 01:36 GMT
#35
The problem with adc is sometimes the support picks something retarded so you can't win lane. You pick cait they pick blitz, you pick vayne they pick janna.

As i play most lanes I find that if your good at your champ or whatever power goes Mid>Support>Adc>Top. My win loss in those roles are Support=Top>Adc>Mid

92 win rate on Sivir. She is insanely strong right now.
"Can't wait till Monday" Cixah+Waveofshadow. "Needs to be monday. Weekend please go by quickly." Gahlo
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
February 27 2014 01:42 GMT
#36
You carry with AD by getting strong and winning team fights wtf, same as every other carry role.
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
February 27 2014 01:43 GMT
#37
On February 27 2014 09:58 Sufficiency wrote:
Some serious math needs to be done, but some quick calculation shows that Relic Shield is nerfed.

You used to get 6HP/5sec, but now you don't have that anymore and instead you get healed for 40HP per charge spent. Since you get one charge per 60 seconds, that's 40/12 = 3.3HP/5sec. This, in combination that one of Relic Shield's strongest point is the early push to level 2 (when you are probably at full health), makes it a lot worse of a starting item than before.


Basically this is correct. It's less regen now. It's a little bit more than 3.3HP/5, because you can assume that it's building up charges when you're backing and returning to lane when you would normally be "wasting" normal HP regen, but it's less than 6 surely.

It is however more healing for your lane partner, 25 more HP on the item, as well as more up front healing for yourself (assuming you take damage before using the charges). Long term it's less regen, but short term it's more regen. Personally I think it's a secret buff to double bruiser comps, although I doubt it's enough to make them anything other than a random cheese pick.

Targons and Face of the Mountain however both had their regen buffed, and Face's active is just worlds better than the old one. Way more useful now.



For the people talking about Spellthief vs. Coin on Sona, I'm still a little skeptic on the Spellthief line still. If used to 100% efficiency, Spellthief gives you 15 damage, 12 mana and 15 gold per 30 secs. Coin gives 31.5 HP, 15 mana and 12,6 gold per 30 secs. 5 AP is probably better than the added regen on some champs (skeptic about Sona), but even if Spellthief ends up being a little better for laning, Talisman's raw stats are probably still better for teamfights.

Where I can see Spellthief being good is on champions who can reliably cause damage without taking damage in lane, so damage caused will be more important than HP regenned. I'm looking more at like Zyra, Annie and Lux support than Sona for the item.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
Velocirapture
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States983 Posts
February 27 2014 01:51 GMT
#38
On February 27 2014 10:43 Ketara wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 09:58 Sufficiency wrote:
Some serious math needs to be done, but some quick calculation shows that Relic Shield is nerfed.

You used to get 6HP/5sec, but now you don't have that anymore and instead you get healed for 40HP per charge spent. Since you get one charge per 60 seconds, that's 40/12 = 3.3HP/5sec. This, in combination that one of Relic Shield's strongest point is the early push to level 2 (when you are probably at full health), makes it a lot worse of a starting item than before.


Basically this is correct. It's less regen now. It's a little bit more than 3.3HP/5, because you can assume that it's building up charges when you're backing and returning to lane when you would normally be "wasting" normal HP regen, but it's less than 6 surely.

It is however more healing for your lane partner, 25 more HP on the item, as well as more up front healing for yourself (assuming you take damage before using the charges). Long term it's less regen, but short term it's more regen. Personally I think it's a secret buff to double bruiser comps, although I doubt it's enough to make them anything other than a random cheese pick.

Targons and Face of the Mountain however both had their regen buffed, and Face's active is just worlds better than the old one. Way more useful now.



For the people talking about Spellthief vs. Coin on Sona, I'm still a little skeptic on the Spellthief line still. If used to 100% efficiency, Spellthief gives you 15 damage, 12 mana and 15 gold per 30 secs. Coin gives 31.5 HP, 15 mana and 12,6 gold per 30 secs. 5 AP is probably better than the added regen on some champs (skeptic about Sona), but even if Spellthief ends up being a little better for laning, Talisman's raw stats are probably still better for teamfights.

Where I can see Spellthief being good is on champions who can reliably cause damage without taking damage in lane, so damage caused will be more important than HP regenned. I'm looking more at like Zyra, Annie and Lux support than Sona for the item.


I am curious about how spellthief will play out mostly because of how it disables. My main support is Karma who you would think it is perfect for but empowered q randomly kills minions often enough that I dont want to have to worry about it. I foresee this same problem with sona power chord harass. Maybe the whole 3 charges thing will mitigate it, we will see.
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
February 27 2014 01:57 GMT
#39
On February 27 2014 10:51 Velocirapture wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 10:43 Ketara wrote:
On February 27 2014 09:58 Sufficiency wrote:
Some serious math needs to be done, but some quick calculation shows that Relic Shield is nerfed.

You used to get 6HP/5sec, but now you don't have that anymore and instead you get healed for 40HP per charge spent. Since you get one charge per 60 seconds, that's 40/12 = 3.3HP/5sec. This, in combination that one of Relic Shield's strongest point is the early push to level 2 (when you are probably at full health), makes it a lot worse of a starting item than before.


Basically this is correct. It's less regen now. It's a little bit more than 3.3HP/5, because you can assume that it's building up charges when you're backing and returning to lane when you would normally be "wasting" normal HP regen, but it's less than 6 surely.

It is however more healing for your lane partner, 25 more HP on the item, as well as more up front healing for yourself (assuming you take damage before using the charges). Long term it's less regen, but short term it's more regen. Personally I think it's a secret buff to double bruiser comps, although I doubt it's enough to make them anything other than a random cheese pick.

Targons and Face of the Mountain however both had their regen buffed, and Face's active is just worlds better than the old one. Way more useful now.



For the people talking about Spellthief vs. Coin on Sona, I'm still a little skeptic on the Spellthief line still. If used to 100% efficiency, Spellthief gives you 15 damage, 12 mana and 15 gold per 30 secs. Coin gives 31.5 HP, 15 mana and 12,6 gold per 30 secs. 5 AP is probably better than the added regen on some champs (skeptic about Sona), but even if Spellthief ends up being a little better for laning, Talisman's raw stats are probably still better for teamfights.

Where I can see Spellthief being good is on champions who can reliably cause damage without taking damage in lane, so damage caused will be more important than HP regenned. I'm looking more at like Zyra, Annie and Lux support than Sona for the item.


I am curious about how spellthief will play out mostly because of how it disables. My main support is Karma who you would think it is perfect for but empowered q randomly kills minions often enough that I dont want to have to worry about it. I foresee this same problem with sona power chord harass. Maybe the whole 3 charges thing will mitigate it, we will see.


power cord harass almost always trades, which is why Sona will probly still get more "harass" out of Dshield
Carrilord has arrived.
TeeTS
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany2762 Posts
February 27 2014 02:01 GMT
#40
My 2 cents:
Kassadin nerfs are a joke. Nerf his CD and range on ult and you have a chance to find the right place for him. With a 3second CD Doubleflash (since it has way bigger range) he will never be in the spot were he is viable but not OP.

Doran´s Shield: Good for the botlane, now you might be able to start with a support item and not lose every trade. I will try out frostfang for sure! BUT bad for top/mid. Because it simply creates new imbalances there now. Champs with build in sustain like Renekton or Nasus will take this hit way easier than champs without that like Riven or Shyvana. It´s a terrible mistake to let this through without any compensation. Also midlane melee assassins like Katarina and Akali are just fucked by this.

Gragas "nerf": lol what a joke. "Hey guys look, we nerfed Gragas, he is fine now! really! We promise!" So this low CD ult AoE burst with the strong relocation effect and silly AP ratio got toned down by 10%? (only AP ratio though) How do you justify, that an Orianna Ult, which is way harder to land, has a 0.7 AP ratio and this still goes with 0.9 even after the nerfs?
And the Shockwave even has a weaker relocation that the cask.

Ryze: this will definately help him. For Ryze fans, this might be enough to be able to play him again. I still see a lot of other midlane picks above him though - he won´t be FotM after this. For toplane I don´t see any chance for him.

Yasuo´s Shield got Rivened. Well it´s a start and allows more counterplay I guess.

Terrify: bad just simply a really bad change. You can`t balance a game only after the fluff. Yes it´s more realistic that you run away from the one that feared you. But jeez this makes the ability just absolutely shitty.
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