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On January 20 2014 05:16 Sponkz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2014 05:01 Alaric wrote:
But... then how do you play the lane against poke (I guess Sona and Lulu aren't seen much so don't run into it often, but there's still Cait, Jinx, Ezreal, etc.) or if they pressure for lane/bush control? You're going to tell me it's the same with Leona, and I'll tell you that's true at level 1-2, but after that Leona is more capable of all-ining if people go too far out of their way to harass you.
I'm at a loss as to how to play really passive lanes though, I'm always hitching to harass a bit, so Lulu against a threatening lane, Janna, etc. give me trouble. If I can't harass with autos or spells, I don't know how to have presence in the lane (especially bush control aside from wards) so I end up not contributing much.
Played a few games after my break. So far:
- Olaf's slow nerf is bigger than I thought. I mostly dismissed it when I saw it, but 6% at level 1 is still ~20 MS, and very often I was almost close enough to E when it finished fading. Needing 2 axes to close the gap if the enemy laner starts to run makes it way too manaphage. I guess it's more about using it to zone from last hits now.
- Had a silent guy who ended up with support going Kennen (and predictably failing and dying a bunch). Obviously it's because of Gambit, but is he a one-off or is Kennen support invading the queues?
- Premades and wonky matchmaking still annoying. Silver III s3 Annie rushing Grail versus Plat V s3 Talon kinda decided the game by itself (and he was premade with their Shyvana, moved top at level 3 and they killed Riven, then he moved back mid and killed Annie too).
- Getting camped for ~one and a half minute straight by the top+jungler premade is still annoying as all hell.
- I'm so fking rusty wtf, what a scrub. ;_; That's the thing. Sona/Lulu/Nami who are arguably the 3 strongest counters to Alistar doesn't get that much play at the moment, which is exactly why he's strong right now. You're completely true about your scenario explanation if Alistar is against a heavy poker. Right now all I've seen in my 6 ranked games (this sample size, hate me) is Leona, Thresh, Annie and Blitzcrank on the opposing team. Alistar is good against all of them except Annie.
Wait until the Mo'gana fotm kicks in.
The support meta is still evolving atm, so I wouldn't be surprised if Sona/Lulu/Nami regain playtime when the Leona/Thresh/Blitz/Annie counter supports gain traction.
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I mean if Leona's W get's nerfed extremely hard (maybe a small nerf to her base stats too) and Thresh gets some more nerfs, then yeah Sona/Lulu/Nami is probably getting back there. Right now, i just don't see the point, because you cannot beat tanks and gap-closers fuck you up.
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On January 20 2014 06:13 Sponkz wrote:
I mean if Leona's W get's nerfed extremely hard (maybe a small nerf to her base stats too) and Thresh gets some more nerfs, then yeah Sona/Lulu/Nami is probably getting back there. Right now, i just don't see the point, because you cannot beat tanks and gap-closers fuck you up.
When the anti Leona/Thresh supports get more play (Morgana for one, Ali as another), then the support meta will open up.
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How are you skilling Morgana? I think i tried a few games after the initial Season 4 changes, but i found her damage to be very lack-luster and the shield wasn't really cutting it. What match-ups would favor her and is that taken into account that you will most likely skill E?
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Q into E. I skip W unless I really need it for pushing, and just double up on Q and E (Q gets priority, because you get up to 3s of snare CC, and the CC shield has pretty strong base+level gain in strength that maxing it isnt necessary).
Her matchups are pretty damn good against melee supports (and Thresh), while they're lackluster at best against the range supports. Against Leona, you just need to space out enough to not get double-R'd, and just throw the shield on whoever is getting targeted by Leona (or get caught level 1 by random CC). If she puts out an E, just throw out your shield to prevent the stun, then retaliate with autos+Q. You're a range support (even if short). The E is there to prevent stuns and CC and nothing more, which is what most of the melee supports rely upon to have lane presence versus a range support.
Need to work on the ADC matchups/pairings, but she does tend to work well with longer-range ADCs who can take advantage of her long-range CC and threat, and the trades a good snare can create. So Cait would be good, or perhaps Varus (the CC chain and burst post-6).
I feel she's pretty strong against Jinx, since her E chaining becomes a non-issue, and she is short range (without mobility) enough that a hit snare post-6 will lead into a double proc Morgana ultimate.
There was a support Morg game in EU LCS, cant remember between which team, but it was a Morg/Cait vs Leona...Jinx? They played the lane pretty well (though the Morg's build afterwards and some mid/late game teamfight decisions were questionable).
EDIT: Oh right, Roccat vs Alliance. Does highlight Morg's potential despite some misplays/item choices mid-late game by VandeR. Completely shut down the Leona/Vi/Shyvana engages.
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On January 20 2014 06:28 Lord Tolkien wrote:
Q into E. I skip W unless I really need it for pushing, and just double up on Q and E (Q gets priority, because you get up to 3s of snare CC, and the CC shield has pretty strong base+level gain in strength that maxing it isnt necessary).
Her matchups are pretty damn good against melee supports (and Thresh), while they're lackluster at best against the range supports. Against Leona, you just need to space out enough to not get double-R'd, and just throw the shield on whoever is getting targeted by Leona (or get caught level 1 by random CC). If she puts out an E, just throw out your shield to prevent the stun, then retaliate with autos+Q. You're a range support (even if short). The E is there to prevent stuns and CC and nothing more, which is what most of the melee supports rely upon to have lane presence versus a range support.
Need to work on the ADC matchups/pairings, but she does tend to work well with longer-range ADCs who can take advantage of her long-range CC and threat, and the trades a good snare can create. So Cait would be good, or perhaps Varus (the CC chain and burst post-6).
I feel she's pretty strong against Jinx, since her E chaining becomes a non-issue, and she is short range (without mobility) enough that a hit snare post-6 will lead into a double proc Morgana ultimate.
I think it's worth putting the point in W early. It's nice followup to landing a Q when getting into your tiny AA range could expose you. Plus it's somewhat useful as a zoning tool. But yeah, definitely skill R-Q-E-W.
As for ADCs, I had a lot of fun supporting a Draven. Once you get some Q levels and they start to be rooted for a handy amount of time, land one, E on Draven and watch him go HAM all over the enemy adc while the enemy support can't stop him.
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On January 20 2014 06:41 JazzVortical wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2014 06:28 Lord Tolkien wrote:
Q into E. I skip W unless I really need it for pushing, and just double up on Q and E (Q gets priority, because you get up to 3s of snare CC, and the CC shield has pretty strong base+level gain in strength that maxing it isnt necessary).
Her matchups are pretty damn good against melee supports (and Thresh), while they're lackluster at best against the range supports. Against Leona, you just need to space out enough to not get double-R'd, and just throw the shield on whoever is getting targeted by Leona (or get caught level 1 by random CC). If she puts out an E, just throw out your shield to prevent the stun, then retaliate with autos+Q. You're a range support (even if short). The E is there to prevent stuns and CC and nothing more, which is what most of the melee supports rely upon to have lane presence versus a range support.
Need to work on the ADC matchups/pairings, but she does tend to work well with longer-range ADCs who can take advantage of her long-range CC and threat, and the trades a good snare can create. So Cait would be good, or perhaps Varus (the CC chain and burst post-6).
I feel she's pretty strong against Jinx, since her E chaining becomes a non-issue, and she is short range (without mobility) enough that a hit snare post-6 will lead into a double proc Morgana ultimate. I think it's worth putting the point in W early. It's nice followup to landing a Q when getting into your tiny AA range could expose you. Plus it's somewhat useful as a zoning tool. But yeah, definitely skill R-Q-E-W. As for ADCs, I had a lot of fun supporting a Draven. Once you get some Q levels and they start to be rooted for a handy amount of time, land one, E on Draven and watch him go HAM all over the enemy adc while the enemy support can't stop him.
Oh yeh, the Draven.
That reminds me of late S2 when Aphro still played ADC with muffinqt. Draven/Morgana was one of their terror staples. I remember him going like 7/1 against junglers and mid lane roams, and then getting a BT at 6 minutes in. Solomid tourneys pls. No mo' wombat voice :<
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Kobe should have brought him with him when he got hired. ;_; Even if NA doesn't want him, just have him replace Quickshot, Wombat knows not to try making analysis, and this voice!
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On January 20 2014 06:28 Lord Tolkien wrote:
Q into E. I skip W unless I really need it for pushing, and just double up on Q and E (Q gets priority, because you get up to 3s of snare CC, and the CC shield has pretty strong base+level gain in strength that maxing it isnt necessary).
Her matchups are pretty damn good against melee supports (and Thresh), while they're lackluster at best against the range supports. Against Leona, you just need to space out enough to not get double-R'd, and just throw the shield on whoever is getting targeted by Leona (or get caught level 1 by random CC). If she puts out an E, just throw out your shield to prevent the stun, then retaliate with autos+Q. You're a range support (even if short). The E is there to prevent stuns and CC and nothing more, which is what most of the melee supports rely upon to have lane presence versus a range support.
Need to work on the ADC matchups/pairings, but she does tend to work well with longer-range ADCs who can take advantage of her long-range CC and threat, and the trades a good snare can create. So Cait would be good, or perhaps Varus (the CC chain and burst post-6).
I feel she's pretty strong against Jinx, since her E chaining becomes a non-issue, and she is short range (without mobility) enough that a hit snare post-6 will lead into a double proc Morgana ultimate.
There was a support Morg game in EU LCS, cant remember between which team, but it was a Morg/Cait vs Leona...Jinx? They played the lane pretty well (though the Morg's build afterwards and some mid/late game teamfight decisions were questionable).
EDIT: Oh right, Roccat vs Alliance. Does highlight Morg's potential despite some misplays/item choices mid-late game by VandeR. Completely shut down the Leona/Vi/Shyvana engages.
Thanks for the insight! People like you, are the reason i love this forum <3
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Get paired vs D1 leblanc midlane as ori, my butthole.
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On January 20 2014 07:15 arb wrote:
Get paired vs D1 leblanc midlane as ori, my butthole.
This is why I don't play ranked at the beginning of the season. Too much variation.
Also my internet at school is currently on the fritz. Random as fk lag spikes.
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5-3 in placements, but playing vs mostly gold players, so my MMR I guess moved up slightly from preseason...
Hoping I can avoid 5-5 and place into mid/high silver at least...
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ARAMs aren't fun when the 4 people with you are so bad they make it unplayable. ._.
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On January 20 2014 08:13 Alaric wrote:
ARAMs aren't fun when the 4 people with you are so bad they make it unplayable. ._.
stop crying and carry them like the 1337 player you are.
Or roll a Sona. That'll work too.
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Na, enemy team had the Sona. But TF TPing 1v5 to try and finish off someone, Volibear and Udyr chasing behind the enemy team to try and get Malz while Karthus, Annie and Sona are free to walk right next to you, etc.
It's like they had no idea how to play their champions in general, nor in our comp. I'm fine with goofing around in ARAMs, I mean that's what it's for, but when 2 people seem to do nothing but right-click past an enemy champion and suicide, there's not much you can do vs burst+cc as a escape-less squishy and, well... you don't exactly play. And I'm not sure what's fun in suiciding either. Worst thing is we were a premade.
I'll grieve for the guy who rolled Rammus, though, he gets a pass. Rammus is awesome on SR but he's so gimped and useless on HA it's sad to see. 
Which makes me think, since I'm trying to un-rust myself and Vi's getting popular again, I'm going to need 1 or maybe 2 other junglers to roll with. I'm still not sure about how Nautilus fares, seeing how fast he becomes a damageless root-bot, and Mundo's going to get stolen from me, either by the bans or the top laners, so I can't rely on him either. Have people been playing Rammus somewhat lately? How's he faring?
On paper the new passive on the finished items should ease his mana problems but he's still slow anyway, and before this point the butcher passive is apparently going to be nerfed according to the PBE. Isn't it making his start pretty awkward?
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Oh, you had Voli and Udyr, that was a GG.
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On January 20 2014 08:26 Alaric wrote:Na, enemy team had the Sona. But TF TPing 1v5 to try and finish off someone, Volibear and Udyr chasing behind the enemy team to try and get Malz while Karthus, Annie and Sona are free to walk right next to you, etc. It's like they had no idea how to play their champions in general, nor in our comp. I'm fine with goofing around in ARAMs, I mean that's what it's for, but when 2 people seem to do nothing but right-click past an enemy champion and suicide, there's not much you can do vs burst+cc as a escape-less squishy and, well... you don't exactly play. And I'm not sure what's fun in suiciding either. Worst thing is we were a premade. I'll grieve for the guy who rolled Rammus, though, he gets a pass. Rammus is awesome on SR but he's so gimped and useless on HA it's sad to see. Which makes me think, since I'm trying to un-rust myself and Vi's getting popular again, I'm going to need 1 or maybe 2 other junglers to roll with. I'm still not sure about how Nautilus fares, seeing how fast he becomes a damageless root-bot, and Mundo's going to get stolen from me, either by the bans or the top laners, so I can't rely on him either. Have people been playing Rammus somewhat lately? How's he faring? On paper the new passive on the finished items should ease his mana problems but he's still slow anyway, and before this point the butcher passive is apparently going to be nerfed according to the PBE. Isn't it making his start pretty awkward?
Olaf. Olaf is fun, and still fairly good. His major weakness is if you have a terribad support that doesnt get a swift Talisman.
Also, someone said earlier that they were sad about seeing too much Athenes. I think its intentional from Riot. The tear nerfs were pretty heavy handed, and the tear users were nerfed alongside them.
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Heard in placement matches
Shyvana: so do i get zhonyas?
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Hmm, not anywhere near as harsh as I expected. Went 6-4 on my smurf, and resulted in my placement into gold I, much less of an mmr hit compared to what I expected.
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EPT
