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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:25 RagequitBM wrote: I believe his range was nerfed during that period? I thought he was 550 during the ADC trifecta No, his nerfs were to AS, his Quickdraw AS boost, and smokebombs. Graves' problem is as ADCarries get better mechanically, his kit is less appealing. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
And no, Graves' range was almost immediatly nerfed. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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Fusilero
United Kingdom50293 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:29 cLutZ wrote: No, his nerfs were to AS, his Quickdraw AS boost, and smokebombs. Graves' problem is as ADCarries get better mechanically, his kit is less appealing. I think barrier played a part in his season three drop off, became much harder to straight 100/0 burst an ADC with barrier. | ||
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:25 RagequitBM wrote: I believe his range was nerfed during that period? I thought he was 550 during the ADC trifecta yes he did his current state, however good you think that is, is without exaggeration the result of at least 11 other nerfs to his skills that took place at or after the time his range was reduced. the range nerf didn't kill him in the slighest | ||
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
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Shaella
United States14828 Posts
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:41 Roffles wrote: Pretty sure Graves has gotten like no buffs, all nerfs. The closest thing to a buff he's ever received happened in v140b: Buckshot:
Extra bullet damage increased (yay)! | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:45 Seuss wrote: The closest thing to a buff he's ever received happened in v140b: Buckshot:
Extra bullet damage increased (yay)! They also nerfed it like 3 different times prior to that lol | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
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Itsmedudeman
United States19229 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:43 zulu_nation8 wrote: vayne can trade but she has no push or waveclear ability so if you cant get to lv2 faster you'll have to farm under tower and take a lot of pressure. She really can't trade with most other adcs. It's typically bad to trade early on because usually the other adc will have better all in potential than you and if you're both at 50% it usually means the vayne has to be more defensive than the other way around. They also have better poke and more opportunities to get damage through the use of more burst/ranged poke. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:47 Itsmedudeman wrote: She really can't trade with most other adcs. It's typically bad to trade early on because usually the other adc will have better all in potential than you and if you're both at 50% it usually means the vayne has to be more defensive than the other way around. They also have better poke and more opportunities to get damage through the use of more burst/ranged poke. Tumble makes her tradse in lane not too terrible. When enemy walks up to cs. Vayne can instantly gap close with tumble and chase for another one or 2 more auto attacks. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:47 Sufficiency wrote: I feel Vayne's problem is her Condemn being too strong. I actually agree with this. Having a (admittedly situational) CC early on in lane is very strong. There's few ADCs who can CC chain alongside their support/jungler. Cait and Jinx have "skillshot" roots; Ashe, Trist, Urgot, and Varus need to wait until ults (well, slows sort of count I guess). Graves has Buckshot which is admittedly pretty strong, though. But Condemn is a pretty strong CC if you can land it and even if you can't it's a rather good disengage tool on a relatively short CD. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
There's a reason none of them have that. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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Kinie
United States3106 Posts
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Itsmedudeman
United States19229 Posts
On October 14 2013 06:52 Requizen wrote: I actually agree with this. Having a (admittedly situational) CC early on in lane is very strong. There's few ADCs who can CC chain alongside their support/jungler. Cait and Jinx have "skillshot" roots; Ashe, Trist, Urgot, and Varus need to wait until ults (well, slows sort of count I guess). Graves has Buckshot which is admittedly pretty strong, though. But Condemn is a pretty strong CC if you can land it and even if you can't it's a rather good disengage tool on a relatively short CD. Vayne's all in potential and burst is still significantly weaker than most other adcs like corki, ez, graves, etc. Even if you do land the condemn it doesn't necessarily mean you'll win the all in because vayne literally has no burst damage. It's also really difficult to follow up on a condemn pefectly while laning because you push them away from you meaning the CC might end up being useless. If you get so close to them that you can auto directly after then it means they severely misplayed and mispositioned. I think most people who play ADC in any skill bracket would say vayne is not that strong atm when you can get counterpicked by corki or caitlyn who should both have an easy time, regardless of support. Imo corki is a hard counter to vayne because even after vayne gets botrk she cannot win against a corki or duel him 1 on 1. | ||
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