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United States15536 Posts
On September 25 2013 03:27 JonGalt wrote:
As someone who has interacted with sheep for the past 11.5 months on a daily basis I can confirm they are super awesome, cuddly, AND tasty - YUM.
Baby sheep are also top 10 cutest animals ever.
Please create tier list in OT thread. Should be great MoonBear fodder.
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On September 25 2013 03:29 AsmodeusXI wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2013 03:27 JonGalt wrote:
As someone who has interacted with sheep for the past 11.5 months on a daily basis I can confirm they are super awesome, cuddly, AND tasty - YUM.
Baby sheep are also top 10 cutest animals ever. Please create tier list in OT thread. Should be great MoonBear fodder.
Humans are the cutest animals ever.
Super awesome and tasty too.
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That brings me to another point - I believe that support isn't the one who should be getting the oracles that you use for moving around as a pack of 5, especially around baron area. IMO that should be the jungler or even solo top. Support is too easily removed.
It would help alot if they made Oracle's Elixir a targetable item and the target received the buff. That way you could give it to your fulltank solo top without them having to hurt for items.
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On September 25 2013 03:30 Shikyo wrote:
That brings me to another point - I believe that support isn't the one who should be getting the oracles that you use for moving around as a pack of 5, especially around baron area. IMO that should be the jungler or even solo top. Support is too easily removed.
It would help alot if they made Oracle's Elixir a targetable item and the target received the buff. That way you could give it to your fulltank solo top without them having to hurt for items.
Idk, support doesn't need to buy the damage and penetration items so they aren't as gold starved. Also they almost never get like sunfire so they can clear baron way easier than a jungler/solo top who does have sunfire and will aggro baron.
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United States15536 Posts
On September 25 2013 03:30 Shikyo wrote:
That brings me to another point - I believe that support isn't the one who should be getting the oracles that you use for moving around as a pack of 5, especially around baron area. IMO that should be the jungler or even solo top. Support is too easily removed.
It would help alot if they made Oracle's Elixir a targetable item and the target received the buff. That way you could give it to your fulltank solo top without them having to hurt for items.
As someone who normally plays a tanky jungler, I love getting Oracle's, esp if I can finish my Golem/Mobos early.
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
On September 25 2013 03:32 AsmodeusXI wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2013 03:30 Shikyo wrote:
That brings me to another point - I believe that support isn't the one who should be getting the oracles that you use for moving around as a pack of 5, especially around baron area. IMO that should be the jungler or even solo top. Support is too easily removed.
It would help alot if they made Oracle's Elixir a targetable item and the target received the buff. That way you could give it to your fulltank solo top without them having to hurt for items. As someone who normally plays a tanky jungler, I love getting Oracle's, esp if I can finish my Golem/Mobos early.
I normally consider golem/mobos the only thing I need on a jungle, pretty much everything after oracle spam unless they're AP reliant so aegis is a bonus
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Gonna use TL to complain about the fact that I really really hate double elimination format and that there's a reason no legitimate sports actually use a double elimination bracket (because it's dumb and unexciting).
Seeing too many posts on reddit of people wishing next worlds or future LoL events will use them but I seriously think they're really really bad. The only exception I can think of was how China did their regionals since having a distinct winner wasn't too important since you really only wanted to place top 2 at Chinese regionals (and sure the #1 seed was nice but top 2 is what everyone was gunning for).
I prefer the current worlds format immensely over any double elimination possibilities. Ideally next year they'll just do like four groups to determine quarter finals instead of having two groups and giving team quarter final byes.
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United States15536 Posts
On September 25 2013 03:51 overt wrote:
Gonna use TL to complain about the fact that I really really hate double elimination format and that there's a reason no legitimate sports actually use a double elimination bracket (because it's dumb and unexciting).
Seeing too many posts on reddit of people wishing next worlds or future LoL events will use them but I seriously think they're really really bad. The only exception I can think of was how China did their regionals since having a distinct winner wasn't too important since you really only wanted to place top 2 at Chinese regionals (and sure the #1 seed was nice but top 2 is what everyone was gunning for).
I prefer the current worlds format immensely over any double elimination possibilities. Ideally next year they'll just do like four groups to determine quarter finals instead of having two groups and giving team quarter final byes.
I think double elimination is better than the current format, but only because it gives quarterfinal "seeds" far more play time. In the current format, the people "seeded" are in a worse position than others because they just don't get to play as many games to prove their quality. Which is stupid.
I think that the best solution (at least to me right now) is a second group stage in which the seeded teams take part. Spread out over enough time, it shouldn't wear TOO much on the teams who go through both groups (and even if it does, that's what happens when you don't win more)
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I'm not even trying to bitch about worlds format or anything. I just really hate double elimination. You end up with really lame grand finals where one team has an advantage or you cede that advantage and the team coming from winner's gets nothing even though they had a stronger tournament than a team that was already eliminated.
I don't know why the League community (or maybe it's just eSports in general) likes double elimination so much.
If the goal is to remove luck the best format is OGN's where matches are a week apart. If the goal is to ensure teams don't lose just because they choked or whatever then it's really dumb because choking (or even cheese-y strategies) are apart of competition and a team that falters to a "cheese" or to their own bad play doesn't deserve to continue in the tournament. This isn't even addressing the issues that the old school double elim tournaments had with fatigue where teams would be forced to play league for like 8 straight hours. That doesn't produce a good tournament at all imo.
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I think the Oracle's carrier really depends on the state of the game.
In my games I get it on jungler or support because the other guy usually won't have one.
Support usually has an easier time safely solo clearing wards because support will have a nice supply of wards and know when they are overextended or not. Support also usually won't be clearing waves so they have the time and space to do it.
I can see it being useful on a jungler in a long laning phase or when towers are being taken slowly, since they are usually the most safe characters with high mobility and general tankiness. They're also great for setting up skirmishes, in which it either helps a lot because you deny vision, or it doesn't help because you spend time clearing wards and less time positioning yourself for an ambush.
If you're 5-manning then it usually doesn't matter as long as one of you has one.
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On September 25 2013 03:57 overt wrote:
I'm not even trying to bitch about worlds format or anything. I just really hate double elimination. You end up with really lame grand finals where one team has an advantage or you cede that advantage and the team coming from winner's gets nothing even though they had a stronger tournament than a team that was already eliminated.
I don't know why the League community (or maybe it's just eSports in general) likes double elimination so much.
If the goal is to remove luck the best format is OGN's where matches are a week apart. If the goal is to ensure teams don't lose just because they choked or whatever then it's really dumb because choking (or even cheese-y strategies) are apart of competition and a team that falters to a "cheese" or to their own bad play doesn't deserve to continue in the tournament. This isn't even addressing the issues that the old school double elim tournaments had with fatigue where teams would be forced to play league for like 8 straight hours. That doesn't produce a good tournament at all imo.
You can get into all this statistical math about how likely a format is to ensure that the most skilled player/team wins the event. Double Elimination might not be as exciting, but it makes it much more likely to ensure this.
The most likely ways statistically are Round Robin and Swiss Pairing, but those are even less exciting, since they don't have "final" matches at all.
Edit: Personally, I'd prefer double elim to the current Worlds format. I am pretty upset with yesterdays games, as are I think a lot of people.
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How soon do you guys get boots on a support? That's another thing about oracles, clearing wards while moving like a sloth is not really the most efficient thing.
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United States47024 Posts
My conspiracy theory is that everyone who's ever complained that double elim grand finals should give an advantage to the WB finalist is just secretly butthurt that their favorite team lost a finals 3-2 when with a 1 game advantage they would have won.
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
On September 25 2013 04:04 Dark_Chill wrote:
How soon do you guys get boots on a support? That's another thing about oracles, clearing wards while moving like a sloth is not really the most efficient thing.
I normally try to get my basic boots after sighstone and try to squeeze in the mobos before spamming oracles.
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On September 25 2013 04:07 TheYango wrote:
My conspiracy theory is that everyone who's ever complained that double elim grand finals should give an advantage to the WB finalist is just secretly butthurt that their favorite team lost a finals 3-2 when with a 1 game advantage they would have won.
I think the biggest issue with double elim grand finals in league is how inconsistent it is. Sometimes it's a one set advantage. Sometimes it's just a one game advantage. In the super early days of league the winner's bracket team would get no advantage at all.
The actual format itself is just silly though especially when it's something scheduled to take place over a single weekend. Even if they did it for worlds next year they'd be forced to have games all week long and the tournament would either have to take an entire month instead of three weeks or else they'd only be able to give teams just a few hours of prep between games not to mention like a day or two of prep for the finals. I just don't think having teams marathon games is a better indicator of which team is the best than a single elim bracket. It's a better display of stamina but not necessarily skill or a team's strategical play.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
winner side of a double elim gets 5 games as blue. hue
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On September 25 2013 04:16 oneofthem wrote:
winner side of a double elim gets 5 games as blue. hue
blind pick finals plis
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On September 25 2013 04:07 TheYango wrote:
My conspiracy theory is that everyone who's ever complained that double elim grand finals should give an advantage to the WB finalist is just secretly butthurt that their favorite team lost a finals 3-2 when with a 1 game advantage they would have won.
I mean if it's really double elim, though, the Winner's bracket finalist should have to get eliminated twice, no? It really does make some sense to give the WB finalist SOME advantage.
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On September 25 2013 03:51 overt wrote:
Gonna use TL to complain about the fact that I really really hate double elimination format and that there's a reason no legitimate sports actually use a double elimination bracket (because it's dumb and unexciting).
Seeing too many posts on reddit of people wishing next worlds or future LoL events will use them but I seriously think they're really really bad. The only exception I can think of was how China did their regionals since having a distinct winner wasn't too important since you really only wanted to place top 2 at Chinese regionals (and sure the #1 seed was nice but top 2 is what everyone was gunning for).
I prefer the current worlds format immensely over any double elimination possibilities. Ideally next year they'll just do like four groups to determine quarter finals instead of having two groups and giving team quarter final byes.
I hate Double Elim, as well, especially if the winner bracket gets an advantage in the grand finals.
Imo should just use the same system as the footballer World cup next year.( well actually it's European Cup since WC has 32 teams)
16 teams, groups of 4s and then single elim like we have right now, probably with bo5 starting in the quarters already.
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There is for example in several martial arts, the normal brackets, but everyone who loses gets placed into the loser bracket, but can't compete for silver/gold anymore. Might be interesting.
Or otherwise, just put the top teams from each region in the groups but give them a 1 game win advantage from the start or something.
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EPT
