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On July 10 2013 20:58 Dusty wrote: To Zenon/Daniel:
Would it be too strong if by pressing R again you could change the direction of Lucian's ult? Even once/twice?
I was just thinking this when I pressed R and it cancelled instead 
If nothing else is changed please do this one. It'd make Lucian 50% more baller at a minimum!
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Dusty: we had the direction changing version in at one point. One version you could reactivate after 1.5s to pick a new direction, another version you could swing around immediately but he'd only alter direction slowly. Both of these, well, sucked ass.
Here's why: making a skill that is flawed and has tons of limitations and ways that it can fail enables you to make the best case of that skill SUPER impactful. Yes, you'll only get a perfect Culling once every 10 games, but boy is it going to feel AMAZING then. The more reliable you make a skill, the more you have to tone it down. I had a great conversation with Morello where he clued me into this, and as usual, he was 100% spot on. This is also why The Culling's cooldown is 50s at rank 3.
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I see a LOT of incorrect numbers floating around. Here's the real deal:
HP: 390 (at level 0) + 80/level Armor: 15 (+3) MP: 230 (+41) Attack range: 550. Q: Base damage 80-240. Bonus AD scaling: 0.6-1.2. Cooldown 9-5. Mana cost 50-70 (nerfing to 60-80 next patch) W: Base damage 60-220. Bonus AD scaling: 0.8 (nerfing to 0.6 next patch). Mana cost 60 flat. MS amount 40-60 (thinking about 40 flat). CD 14-10 E: CD 18-10. Mana cost 60-0. R: AP ratio 0.4 (nerfing to 0.3 next patch). AD ratio 0.33 (nerfing to 0.3 next patch). Base damage 35/50/65. Number of shots = (AS * (2.5/3.0/3.5) + 2.5) * 3. CD 100/75/50. Mana cost 100 flat
Yay numbers!
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Does Lucians W actually have a star shaped hitbox or is it just a circle with a star graphic just for da pretties?
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Ooh, I didn't notice the scaling ratio on his Q. Afaik only Garen, Trundle and formerly Pantheon have/had that. Is there a particular reason for using them (or why we don't see them more)? I have trouble getting the goal of a scaling total AD ratio instead of a bonus AD ratio when it comes to limiting earlygame power.
And still curious/obsessed over that star shape. 
^ iirc Zenon said it was a shape "never seen before" so I'm assuming the hitbox is a star.
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Pootie too good!4331 Posts
SotD actually looks really good on him. 100% crit on his passive proc will be really nice.
And his ult says it applies damage per shot, how does it interact with on-hit affects? I know you said it doesn't work with muramana, but is there anything it interacts with? Black Cleaver?
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Why hasn't Lucian been released yet?
A champion like Jayce allows you multiple ways to think about how to play him. What spells to use and what order to use them in: eg. If I want to escape while in hammer mode, I might Q to slow, E to knock back, transform and E for the speed. If I want a kill, I might QE in cannon form(slower response from the opponent than EQ), activate W, transform, Q, W, auto *(4-7), then E. Stopping as soon as my original QE misses.
Orianna has interactions in the delay on her ult, and the position of the opponent, the distance of her ball from a target and its speed, the shield ball dealing damage on return, the speed boost, and slow, and damage on her W, and the interaction of letting balls sit on an initiating ally.
What options do you have when playing Lucian?
I've obviously never played or seen a Lucian so I'll reserve myself on the theorycrafting.
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Under the hood, Q is a 200 radius (very small) circle in the middle and two overlapping thin rectangles. TO THE MS PAINT MOBILE!
http://imgur.com/a5jP0Rt
I AM BAD AT PAINT!
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Do you have the time to put together a scrolling shooter for the release? The way his ulti works reminds me of playing Ikaruga.
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Man, I so wanted to move with WASD and fire at mouse position during ult, but they told me I couldn't do that because that's a different game ;P
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I got a patch but can't buy the Udyr skin? did i miss something. D:
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Spirit Guard Udyr will be unlocked in a couple of days, once the patch is stable.
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On July 10 2013 21:23 obesechicken13 wrote: What options do you have when playing Lucian? Q isn't a skillshot: you target somebody (570 range), Lucian fires a piercing shot along the trajectory (1100), lets you snipe people from farther away, play on positioning, etc.
W is a skillshot marking enemies hit, popping a mark gives a flat MS buff. Depending on the animations you can use it on nearby minions to get a MS buff and run away/catch up to a running enemy, you can also mark him and another nearby, non-fleeing target, pop the mark on that one, use the MS buff to catch up to your initial target, pop his mark, and avoid being kited/compensate for escape abilities this way.
E is a dash similar to Graves' in range (and probably behaviour regarding walls) which cleanses slows from you. Keep it to escape? Use it to initiate a trade by getting in aa range and triggering your passive? Do I get to this Cait and take the free harass, or do I try to force her Net and use E to catch up and cleanse the slow so I can keep fighting since I beat her at short range?
R makes you point a direction (relative to your champ, picture it like a clock around him and he always fire to the same hour, it doesn't target a point on the ground like people believe) and rapid-fire shots (which stop at the first enemy, linear skillshot style) alongside it for 3 seconds. It's a channeled ability, but you can still move and use E without breaking the channel. If it kills an enemy champion, your E cooldown is refreshed. Do you try to use it at the start of a fight for the strong burst? Do you keep it until everyone is low and there aren't minions/pets around to block shots, using ER to get in a squishy's face and bust it before Eing from target to target as they try to run? Do you use it against strong divers so you can damage them while running, without the risks of stutter-stepping?
Just because Jayce is an asshole with a kit riddled with broken numbers and sporting almost everything in the game doesn't mean people with less versatility don't have choice and opportunity costs in their kits.
Lucian seems pretty reliant on positioning overall (stay in range to use Q and trigger your passive, don't get too close or your ult is easy to dodge by jumping behind your back, use W marks for jukes and kiting, etc.) which in itself creates a bunch of little choices.
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Neo keep getting trolled by Riot lolol
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Mana buffs for Brand? Meaningful mana bufffs?
ZOMG YESSSSSSSS.
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United States15536 Posts
On July 10 2013 21:39 DanielZKlein wrote: Spirit Guard Udyr will be unlocked in a couple of days, once the patch is stable.
Wow. For the first time ever I can directly respond with RIOTPLS. 
Really though, thanks for coming out and explaining all this! It's super helpful for all us immediately whiny and obsessively theorycrafting wackos.
More importantly, I think you've officially become a more frequent poster than Smash with just this. Congrats.
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BAM. Smashed the gizmo! :D
I <3 TL. It's a very special community, and while it can sometimes be short bus special, it's usually full of clueful people who ask good questions. I'm sure I fucked up in making Lucian, and I'm sure you guys will be the first to call me on it.
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On July 10 2013 21:43 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +On July 10 2013 21:23 obesechicken13 wrote: What options do you have when playing Lucian? Q isn't a skillshot: you target somebody (570 range), Lucian fires a piercing shot along the trajectory (1100), lets you snipe people from farther away, play on positioning, etc. W is a skillshot marking enemies hit, popping a mark gives a flat MS buff. Depending on the animations you can use it on nearby minions to get a MS buff and run away/catch up to a running enemy, you can also mark him and another nearby, non-fleeing target, pop the mark on that one, use the MS buff to catch up to your initial target, pop his mark, and avoid being kited/compensate for escape abilities this way. E is a dash similar to Graves' in range (and probably behaviour regarding walls) which cleanses slows from you. Keep it to escape? Use it to initiate a trade by getting in aa range and triggering your passive? Do I get to this Cait and take the free harass, or do I try to force her Net and use E to catch up and cleanse the slow so I can keep fighting since I beat her at short range? R makes you point a direction (relative to your champ, picture it like a clock around him and he always fire to the same hour, it doesn't target a point on the ground like people believe) and rapid-fire shots (which stop at the first enemy, linear skillshot style) alongside it for 3 seconds. It's a channeled ability, but you can still move and use E without breaking the channel. If it kills an enemy champion, your E cooldown is refreshed. Do you try to use it at the start of a fight for the strong burst? Do you keep it until everyone is low and there aren't minions/pets around to block shots, using ER to get in a squishy's face and bust it before Eing from target to target as they try to run? Do you use it against strong divers so you can damage them while running, without the risks of stutter-stepping? Just because Jayce is an asshole with a kit riddled with broken numbers and sporting almost everything in the game doesn't mean people with less versatility don't have choice and opportunity costs in their kits. Lucian seems pretty reliant on positioning overall (stay in range to use Q and trigger your passive, don't get too close or your ult is easy to dodge by jumping behind your back, use W marks for jukes and kiting, etc.) which in itself creates a bunch of little choices.
Lol, sorry to rain a bit on your information parade
1. Q is a line targeted skillshot, works similar to xerath Q 2. W marks are not consumed then you proc them, you can proc them for speed multiple times until they expire
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On July 10 2013 21:37 DanielZKlein wrote: Man, I so wanted to move with WASD and fire at mouse position during ult, but they told me I couldn't do that because that's a different game ;P You played Smite at all? 
On July 10 2013 22:15 DanielZKlein wrote: BAM. Smashed the gizmo! :D
I <3 TL. It's a very special community, and while it can sometimes be short bus special, it's usually full of clueful people who ask good questions. I'm sure I fucked up in making Lucian, and I'm sure you guys will be the first to call me on it. There's plenty of good theorycrafters around here, this community is pretty much the only thing that keeps me from quitting LoL altogether when I play.
That said, do you like Pokemon?
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Gute Arbeit Daniel, freu mich extrem auf den neuen Champion! :D
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