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On March 20 2013 07:16 Promises wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 04:48 clickrush wrote:
5 very overrated champions according to current statistics:
1. lee sin: everyone loves him, since he has such a fun kit and he was one of the most stable junglers for a long time. he didn't have any weaknesses until riot nerfed basicly everything that made him viable lategame. with mao, voli, xin there are junglers who gank just as well but have much stronger lategame potential as initiators and with vi and hecarim you have high dps carry junglers who don't lack in clearing time and gank decently. I agree that he is a lot, lot less scary then he used to be. But I think the manouverability he has and the crazy ganks and escapes that ensue from that stick in peoples mind as something they'd rather not face. Show nested quote +
2. caitlyn: I think ppl like her because she is easy to play during the laning phase. What alot of players don't realize is that she actually has to snowball her early advantage to be as useful as other ad carries. she is probably the worst scaling ad carry in the game with her only steroid literally being her range which other ad carries can also provide, while cait lacks that extra something. ppl take it too easy with her and don't play her aggressive enough to keep up or carry with her.
I love Caitlyn. I know she doesnt do quite as much damage as other AD's, I know she gets outtraded by a lot of champs in lane who also outdamage her late unless you manage to poke like a god, but I think she's worth it. Why? Because you can basically always go decent in lane, and you're basically always going to be able to hit a decent target in teamfights while being safe due to traps+net+flash. I've had plenty of games with hypercarry Vayne where I went 5-0 in lane but didnt manage to build on it lategame due to getting powerjumped by the enemy team, or being stuck on autoattacking their tank due to her short range. Show nested quote +
3. ezreal players have to figure out where he stands now. he was kind of the carry who did everything a bit too well for a long time. He doesn't seem to be overnerfed but rather picked too often and probably too often by players who don't play ad carry that well in general.
I completely agree that a lot of people who dont really seem to know ezreal play him because he's supposedly good. And they usually proceed ot be quite bad. Show nested quote +
4. the leona players i see aren't aware of the following two things: you need very good timing to abuse her skillset and you need to be a good teamfighter with her. she is not like taric who can litterally choose to stun a target reliably even though she has more CC than him. She also has to time her skills right to actually deal all that damage that makes her so scary. Her all-in is scary as hell but not if you don't know when to do it. patience is just as important as not hesitating at the right moment with her. All that finesse is asked from players who basicly don't want to support anyways. hf
I always dread playing Leona in case there might be a good one, but I certainly agree a lot of people whiff her completely, most noticably lategame. Show nested quote +
5. blitz is super mega annoying and his hook is a game winning move. his laneing is terribly overrated though. I've seen enough ad carries dodgeing and baiting the shit out of blitz hooks during the laneing phase. blitz is a fine champ but you need to be an expert to play him well, since ppl are used to him at this point. The fact that ppl are not scared anymore makes puts alot of pressure on the blitz player.
I personally rather like playing against Blitzes in lane. If you can somewhat dodge/avoid his hook he does nothing at all as a support. I've had some really good Blitz who really managed to keep the pressure on, but most of them just sit and wait for hooks from the brush, they'r no threat. Show nested quote +
What do all of those champions have in common? I'd say mostly the fact that they are all picked by players who don't actually enjoy and or play the champions role. The experts make those champions look good, and in the support section theres that "i don't want to support so I pick something that doesn't resemble one"-problem.
Agreed. People playing champs "because they'r OP" while not being familliar with the champ is a huge reason for them proceeding to blow it with said OP champ. I remember myself blowing royal chunks with Malphite once for exactly that reason ^^
Just going to comment on the blitz thing. It's about pressure, not about straight up hooks. Sure, you can get lucky, but if you're playing to land wild skillshots you're either crazy, lucky, or really skilled at skillshots. Either way, you're not smart. Same thing with Lee Sin and even Anivia. Make your skillshots undodgable. Blitz has speed - hit your w and come at a good attack pattern with lots of speed. If you wait for your shot you can get close enough to powerfist or they will use their escape. After they throw their escape, then hook them and power fist. Keep repeating this. This is the "pressure". Now you have a large distance where they cannot go because that engagement HURTS and does not rely on being good / lucky with skillshots.
Same thing with Lee Sin in ganks - don't just throw your q at a distance and hope it works, use your w to get close, be ready to e, and kick when it's guaranteed. Anivia: throw your wall in such a way that they are close and have to move one direction on it or eat more of your ult, and then when you hit them with your stun. Morg: get to the sideish of the lane, black shield, run towards them, there will be a moment when you are close - throw your snare then and ult. Amumu: having a hard time getting the carry to start a team fight? Just flash ult! Now that he can't move, you have a guaranteed q on him and that double stun is like 3-4 seconds. Leona: put pressure and get a little close before throwing your e. Maybe make them use an escape first. You don't have to do as much as blitz here because your e is easier to land than a hook, but it still makes it almost guaranteed.
I can keep going, but most players need to stop trying to be "good' with skill shots and just need to set them up better. That helped me a lot when I realized this, like a few hundred elo. My mechanical ability is terrible and I only win because of these kinds of tips (and knowing when to baron and teleport lol), but I can still hit skill shots if I set them up right.
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On March 20 2013 06:58 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:50 Slusher wrote:On March 20 2013 05:47 Chrispy wrote:
Lol 8% spell vamp. That shit would be a must buy on every mage. eh, the majority of max first spells on popular mids are now are AoE classification so it's really like 2.4% on shit(lvl1-5) damage, count me out. you have cause and effect completely backwards...
kinda, I mean in the sense that kennen and Vlad were fell off (before their nerfs) you are right, but I was mostly referring to Riot's stated goal of giving new champions (mostly) only skill shots(ziggs diana and zyra all have very weak kits for gaining life from spell vamp). I mean like now that it builds out of Kages wota isn't that expensive again and instead of blindly building it on everyone, people are (mostly) only making it when it makes sense.
and on the lee sin and Ezreal thing, don't get it twisted I don't mean to say they are bad at all, but top 5 overrated? who still considers these champions to be bannable champions? with the exception of Blitz his list is garbage and that was my point.
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On March 20 2013 08:05 Dark_Chill wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 08:03 Serelitz wrote:
So much discussion going on, I feel like I should slightly derail the thread again towards 'quinn strategies' into 'quinn is bad' into quinn buffs. It's a foolproof plan really.
Also wtf is going on with Riot switching mana and health pots like every other patch. I was confused by that too. I almost bought a mana pot by accident.
Yeah, think it's like the 4th time they changed it in S3 as well. Grrr
I'm predicting Zac release in 3.05 btw, not 3.04. In before this thread is renamed Fake Zac :0
With all this kennen/Vlad talk, does anyone know what made Vlad fall off so hard? He was starting to see some playtime in S3 in OGN winter, but then without changes he stopped getting picked. Is it just the rise of renekton/Zed or? Also for Kennen fans, I saw Maknoon play AP kennen vs MVP Ozone in SWL. Pretty cool stuff.
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On March 20 2013 08:07 samthesaluki wrote:
you know how i said i hat all the akali's i just had a game with no akali yet my death thing said akali killed me wtf
if Zed kills with ult she is listed as an assisting party, it's a lore thing.
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On March 20 2013 08:07 samthesaluki wrote:
you know how i said i hat all the akali's i just had a game with no akali yet my death thing said akali killed me wtf
Death recaps have been buggy since forever. It's also not really a high priority thing for Riot.
On March 20 2013 08:09 rackdude wrote:
I can keep going, but most players need to stop trying to be "good' with skill shots and just need to set them up better. That helped me a lot when I realized this, like a few hundred elo. My mechanical ability is terrible and I only win because of these kinds of tips (and knowing when to baron and teleport lol), but I can still hit skill shots if I set them up right.
This is spot on advice. Rather than hope your target can't dodge a skill shot, you can force them to be unable to dodge by opening with something else.
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I don't really like Blitz as supp anymore...
he's bad 2v1 and in 2v2 is just so easily outplayed. I especially dislike it if my supp picks blitz without knowing the enemy supp yet, well fuck if they pick taric, leona, thresh or ali, you're basically laning 1v2 for the longest time.
Proficient Blitz players are still scary certainly, the problem is there are not many.
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It also helps make you less predictable. The #1 mistake I see on any skill shot champion is always aiming for maximum range skill shots. It's really satisfying to land a maximum range spear/hook/whatever, but it's also way, way more predictable and gives your opponent more safe directions to run. When the enemy has to worry about both when and where you're going to throw a skillshot, it becomes much harder to dodge.
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So I now really dislike this system and am sorry I trashed people before.
I have now gone 5 advancement series in a row without advancing lol. Puts me back to 90 LP, I win 2 games then lose 2. Or Win 1 lose 1 win 1 lose 1.
This is one of the most infuriating designs ever. I would've won best of 5s in many of four out of 5 of them but I lost the best of 3 HUE. Almost plat...
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On March 20 2013 08:22 Seuss wrote:
It also helps make you less predictable. The #1 mistake I see on any skill shot champion is always aiming for maximum range skill shots. It's really satisfying to land a maximum range spear/hook/whatever, but it's also way, way more predictable and gives your opponent more safe directions to run. When the enemy has to worry about both when and where you're going to throw a skillshot, it becomes much harder to dodge.
This too. You're twice as fast as them, you have a lot of time to throw your hook, no reason to rush it.
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On March 20 2013 08:24 Bladeorade wrote:
So I now really dislike this system and am sorry I trashed people before.
I have now gone 5 advancement series in a row without advancing lol. Puts me back to 90 LP, I win 2 games then lose 2. Or Win 1 lose 1 win 1 lose 1.
This is one of the most infuriating designs ever. I would've won best of 5s in many of four out of 5 of them but I lost the best of 3 HUE. Almost plat...
This should be in the QQ thread.
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LoL was watching this interview with HuK and only 5minutes in, I noticed Link chilling in the background eating his lunch or whatever :D
+ Show Spoiler +
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On March 20 2013 08:43 AsnSensation wrote:LoL was watching this interview with HuK and only 5minutes in, I noticed Link chilling in the background eating his lunch or whatever :D + Show Spoiler +http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2noMWk5kVfQ&t=58s
whoah
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Thank god for Singed nerfs
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On March 20 2013 08:21 AsnSensation wrote:
I don't really like Blitz as supp anymore...
he's bad 2v1 and in 2v2 is just so easily outplayed. I especially dislike it if my supp picks blitz without knowing the enemy supp yet, well fuck if they pick taric, leona, thresh or ali, you're basically laning 1v2 for the longest time.
Proficient Blitz players are still scary certainly, the problem is there are not many.
I've been thinking about it, but is it actually better to straight up fight Blitz? When I think about it, his damage output isn't all that scary compared to some other supports, so if he dashes in to make you run away and try and get a grab, would staying and fighting be the better option? I don't mean this for every support, but even less tanky supports like Lulu.
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On March 20 2013 08:53 Dark_Chill wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 08:21 AsnSensation wrote:
I don't really like Blitz as supp anymore...
he's bad 2v1 and in 2v2 is just so easily outplayed. I especially dislike it if my supp picks blitz without knowing the enemy supp yet, well fuck if they pick taric, leona, thresh or ali, you're basically laning 1v2 for the longest time.
Proficient Blitz players are still scary certainly, the problem is there are not many. I've been thinking about it, but is it actually better to straight up fight Blitz? When I think about it, his damage output isn't all that scary compared to some other supports, so if he dashes in to make you run away and try and get a grab, would staying and fighting be the better option? I don't mean this for every support, but even less tanky supports like Lulu.
His damage output is quite high with the power fist plus attack speed w, and he's quite tanky because of his passive. You need like a leona or nunu to engage him. Plus, cc op.
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What the..... MRN Nientensoh #1 on challenger at 1000 points now hes in Diamond I? How does this make sense lol
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there's also the fact that if blitz grabs it's an instant signal to his ADC to attack for free.
meanwhile whoever is grabbed has to make a decision whether to run or fight and the support or adc has to go along with that idea.
the one or two seconds it takes to make that decision for blitz's enemies is like 4th-wall breaking cc, which is why it's hard to stay and fight.
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On March 20 2013 08:43 AsnSensation wrote:LoL was watching this interview with HuK and only 5minutes in, I noticed Link chilling in the background eating his lunch or whatever :D + Show Spoiler +http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2noMWk5kVfQ&t=58s
someone videobombing hotbid... whoa.
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In my opinion and from my personal experience, in lane the scary thing about Blitz isn't the hook at all, it's how he can go perma-100000x speed and run to you and knock you up and proceed to win the 2v2 because he deals a million billion damage for a support. That factor's been lessened with the mana passive nerfs and such but did someone ever even get hit by his hooks during laning? That was a very minor problem in comparison.
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I wonder if Riot will one day nerf TF...
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EPT
