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On March 18 2013 05:20 samthesaluki wrote:
well i learned that bans deteriorate with time and i been leveling an eu account so i just wont play for a month and finish leveling my eu account, so then ill come play a few so elo does not decay, also he feeds every ranked game and is bottom of bronze 3 im silver why put him on my team qq
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=220361
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Why is Kennen never seen in tournament play anymore? Imo is he has pretty good escape, a stun and pretty good damage.
Was it just his range nerf that hit him so hard that nobody plays him anymore?
Or did just nobody play him in the first place.
Still have pretty good succes on ladder with him though.
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On March 18 2013 06:25 Fildun wrote:
Why is Kennen never seen in tournament play anymore? Imo is he has pretty good escape, a stun and pretty good damage.
Was it just his range nerf that hit him so hard that nobody plays him anymore?
Or did just nobody play him in the first place.
Still have pretty good succes on ladder with him though.
Yeah, they nerf his AA range and people flee in packs.
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On March 18 2013 06:26 iCanada wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 06:25 Fildun wrote:
Why is Kennen never seen in tournament play anymore? Imo is he has pretty good escape, a stun and pretty good damage.
Was it just his range nerf that hit him so hard that nobody plays him anymore?
Or did just nobody play him in the first place.
Still have pretty good succes on ladder with him though. Yeah, they nerf his AA range and people flee in packs.
his lane phase was always impossible to kill but you can farm vs him, aa range made him killable. thats not to say he's a bad champion now, but it certainly hurt him considering he already had no ability to shut out the other person's farm. (thought I'm surprised he hasn't been used with MF at all.) Ironically he used to be considered a counter to singed and now singed is super popular and kennen is nowhere to be seen.
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On March 18 2013 06:29 Slusher wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 06:26 iCanada wrote:On March 18 2013 06:25 Fildun wrote:
Why is Kennen never seen in tournament play anymore? Imo is he has pretty good escape, a stun and pretty good damage.
Was it just his range nerf that hit him so hard that nobody plays him anymore?
Or did just nobody play him in the first place.
Still have pretty good succes on ladder with him though. Yeah, they nerf his AA range and people flee in packs. his lane phase was always impossible to kill but you can farm vs him, aa range made him killable. thats not to say he's a bad champion now, but it certainly hurt him considering he already had no ability to shut out the other person's farm. (thought I'm surprised he hasn't been used with MF at all.) Ironically he used to be considered a counter to singed and now singed is super popular and kennen is nowhere to be seen.
AA range made him way risker vs singed
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On March 18 2013 06:25 Fildun wrote:
Why is Kennen never seen in tournament play anymore? Imo is he has pretty good escape, a stun and pretty good damage.
Was it just his range nerf that hit him so hard that nobody plays him anymore?
Or did just nobody play him in the first place.
Still have pretty good succes on ladder with him though.
He is still seen. Pretty sure he was used yesterday and last week.
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On March 18 2013 06:39 Craton wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 06:25 Fildun wrote:
Why is Kennen never seen in tournament play anymore? Imo is he has pretty good escape, a stun and pretty good damage.
Was it just his range nerf that hit him so hard that nobody plays him anymore?
Or did just nobody play him in the first place.
Still have pretty good succes on ladder with him though. He is still seen. Pretty sure he was used yesterday and last week.
Was that as AD? Otherwise I must have missed it.
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Jimbonez on Giants(I think?) plays a pretty wicked ad kennen from what I've seen
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On March 18 2013 07:39 Fildun wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 06:39 Craton wrote:On March 18 2013 06:25 Fildun wrote:
Why is Kennen never seen in tournament play anymore? Imo is he has pretty good escape, a stun and pretty good damage.
Was it just his range nerf that hit him so hard that nobody plays him anymore?
Or did just nobody play him in the first place.
Still have pretty good succes on ladder with him though. He is still seen. Pretty sure he was used yesterday and last week. Was that as AD? Otherwise I must have missed it.
xPeke played him as AP whenever that was
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AA nerf was pretty huge because with 600 he was a lane bully but with 550 it's far more dangerous because if you harass, you are automatically in range of stuff like Darius hook etc.
Jimbonez has certainly "unleashed" another ad kennen craze, at least in EU soloQ but he's seen rarely top/mid
yep my bad, not 600 but 575 prenerf
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575, not 600. 600 would have been outright broken with the strength of his kit in terms of poke/harass/zoning.
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Eu still plays kennen quite a bit. I think he's a good support, but I'm wonky like that.
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United States23745 Posts
Nerf to spell vamp around the same time as the AA nerf were the main factors in his fall from popularity. I remember the first LoL tournament I watched Vlad and Kennen were like perma-bans against TSM. Changing his ult to cost zero energy was a pretty big recent change. Spam spell with reckless abandon and still ult and stun up 3/5 of the enemy team lol.
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On March 18 2013 04:33 upperbound wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 04:15 c.Deadly wrote:On March 18 2013 03:46 Parnage wrote:
Ezreal's still a often picked champion in pro play as well. Rengar is getting changes as I recall, Shaco is shaco..he's unlikely to ever see pro play but he's never really seen pro play at least in NA with a few exceptions.
Strong alternatives is just the polite way of saying the new stupidly strong. People wanting to play what they believe to be the best champions to win is nothing new. Of course I'd put my money on the vet Ezreal player over the bandwagon Tristana or Varus guy. Ezreal went from an ubiquitously picked ADC to one that's seen in maybe 10% of pro games, and mostly from aAa and Wolves, and he doesn't have much success. Same with Katarina, I only see her from fnatic and Curse. Obviously the rest of them that were competitive picks have dropped off the map, with the exception of Eve in Korea I just learned. Even if a champ is still being picked in a small number of games, going from a certain pick to a noteworthy one in just one or two patches is really indicative of an overnerf. And the new stupidly strong champions aren't ones that have been overbuffed recently, they were always lurking just behind the old stupidly strong champions that riot overnerfed. We get stuck in this cycle of nerfs where there's a constant changing of the guard, with a few pro players or teams staying one step ahead of the curve (Xin Zhao and now Voli from Gambit, or Kayle and recently Zed from Korean teams). I just don't like this nerfing philosophy from Riot, I think keeping things relatively more stable will add a lot more to the pro scene and give some more weight to the moments when teams bust out a completely new champion or strategy. What's a proper nerf then? Why should everyone be able to pick and play a champ as opposed to people that are actually good with the champ? To me, no champ should be "ubiquitous" in the sense that every team plays them -- only in the sense that the best players with that champ should be able to play them. No champ should be at a point where they're a 90% pick/ban like Ez was. If they go back to being a 10-15% pick/ban, that's not an overnerf, that's completely average and actually ideal.
Exactly. That is where Olaf should be: Somewhere where given the other team's comp (no anivia, probably no Jarvan) you want to pick him. Right now you wouldn't even want to play him vs. a team with like Kog + Kat, because he can't even kill Kog.
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Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
Fwiw, Maknoon played top lane Kennen in Starswar v LGD. Kennen I think can still work if you're aiming for a good lane match up and then aim for a big mid-game push/objective fight however you need to comp around his power curve. If you fall behind, it's also harder to just use him as an Ult-bot the same way Rumble can be.
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Fortunately they are gutting Rumbles ult so that solves one problem.
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I think the biggest reason Kennen isn't played is because a lot of the new champions can abuse him really hard in lane. For example Kha'Zix takes so many dumps on Kennen that you can't even really farm safe against him. What made Kennen so good was his ult (which is still good) and his ability to lane against anyone so that you could pick him early. You can't really pick him early anymore without getting lane countered.
He's still good though and still has mostly favorable lanes but the lanes that he loses he loses really hard.
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I've been playing a lot of Anivia lately, and well, I can't really bring myself to do it anymore. She just feels so clunky. I think the poor mobility, low range on her E and R, and her dependence on skillshots are what do it. She has like no offensive lane presence, because anyone with half a brain can dodge her Q, and her R's range is so pathetic.
I just don't see why anyone would bother playing Anivia when they can play a much easier midlaner.
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I think the issue with a lot of riots nerf is the renerf, the first time something's nerfed is often quite reasonable in terms of toning down power. The problem arises with the next balance patch 2 weeks later when riot goes "omg champ still being used better nerf again lol" when the self-adjustment cycles are often longer than that and a lot of persistent champ usage is due to momentum and habits as opposed to "imbalance"
So when the self adjusting player base catches up with the multi nerf cycle, it feels like certain champs drop off the face of the planet
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EPT
