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On March 13 2013 04:56 TheYango wrote:
The problem is that starting with only 2 runepages is so prohibitive that it's not a matter of convenience, but necessity at that point. Even if you're going with the most bare-minimum common-ground runepages, you still need 3+ additional runepages to have one for every role. This isn't even for having runepages for specific matchups/champions.
That's my point though. People buy champs because they're "good" all the time, not just because they're fun. They can choose to have more champion diversity as an advantage, or matchup specific rune pages. The two loaded rune pages would at least give them somewhere to start without putting them at a disadvantage should they choose to purchase another champion or two instead of more rune pages. Shoot, make it three starter pages if you'd like. The point is that people will still have a general basis to start with should they choose to spend their initial ip on champions instead of rune page diversity. If they want to have more rune pages for different matchups, they can either dish out $ for RP, sacrifice buying a couple of champs, or simply grind it out.
Edit: So Zac = April fools joke, that Ice Queen the actual next champ?
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Movespeed/AD/Armor/MR works with 99% of champions/roles. It's not optimal, but then neither are most team compositions, champion picks, or player decisions.
It's really, really nice to have 20 rune pages, but when I'm on my smurf the only time I really feel deprived is when I want to bust out a full Armor or MR page.
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Zac isn't an April Fool's joke. They already put in way too much work into the slow reveal.
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On March 13 2013 04:56 TheYango wrote:
The problem is that starting with only 2 runepages is so prohibitive that it's not a matter of convenience, but necessity at that point. Even if you're going with the most bare-minimum common-ground runepages, you still need 3+ additional runepages to have one for every role. This isn't even for having runepages for specific matchups/champions.
saying runes pages are a 'necessity' is overblowing it IMO. You could say that not missing any last hits is a necessity too but plenty of people go into ranked play without that skill and do fine, and last-hitting skill is more important than any number of runes you could stuff onto a page.
New players should make an AD/armor/MR/MS page and then focus on things that actually matter instead of worrying about small optimizations to their play that they can't unlock until they've played a lot more.
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Man last hitting with Cass early on much harder than it looks, especially if you want to harass at the same time. DoTs screw me much more than I'd have thought. :<
Plus I just noticed but her base AD is on the lower side, even for a mage. Gotta work up those mechanics.
Edit: guy digging up stuff. Pulling hair of course, but the fact that he said "24th letter" surprised me, I know some languages like Spanish have a different set of letters using the romanic alphabet, but considering it's on NA shouldn't it be 26 like with most languages using romanic?
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United States37500 Posts
Jungling is probably the only rune intensive role. Otherwise a standard AD/AP pair of rune pages will take you far. If you're not willing to invest $20-30 dollar into this "free" video game, then suck it up and play with "less" optimal runes.
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On March 13 2013 01:27 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2013 00:59 mordek wrote:I had an idea after hearing someone (Alaric?) talk about a friend collecting champs like pokemon. I think it would be cool if Riot designed a sidequest RPG-like element to the game. You could do quests with certain champs to either earn IP or that champ. Obviously huge design commitment but I think it would be really cool for people that want all the champs but would rather not grind a hundred games. Appeals to those former WoW or pokemon players etc  Doesn't help that he doesn't know many champ names so he just calls them with stuff like "Ms. Plant" for Zyra. 
I haven't referred to Hecarim as anything but Horsey for months now.
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United States37500 Posts
On March 13 2013 05:34 Amarok wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2013 01:27 Alaric wrote:On March 13 2013 00:59 mordek wrote:I had an idea after hearing someone (Alaric?) talk about a friend collecting champs like pokemon. I think it would be cool if Riot designed a sidequest RPG-like element to the game. You could do quests with certain champs to either earn IP or that champ. Obviously huge design commitment but I think it would be really cool for people that want all the champs but would rather not grind a hundred games. Appeals to those former WoW or pokemon players etc Doesn't help that he doesn't know many champ names so he just calls them with stuff like "Ms. Plant" for Zyra. I haven't referred to Hecarim as anything but Horsey for months now.
Forever "clippity cloppity"
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Seeing how he's a MLP fan I'm pretty sure I can make him remember Hecarim's name by convincing him he's like a character from the show.
Oh, he also remembers Cho's name. But that's because Cho is the cutest of all champs. And Orianna because spaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaace~.
Actually maybe LoL isn't like Pokemon to him but rather a directory of whatever media he plays/watches/reads. è_ê
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On March 13 2013 05:28 Alaric wrote:Man last hitting with Cass early on much harder than it looks, especially if you want to harass at the same time. DoTs screw me much more than I'd have thought. :< Plus I just noticed but her base AD is on the lower side, even for a mage. Gotta work up those mechanics. Edit: guy digging up stuff. Pulling hair of course, but the fact that he said "24th letter" surprised me, I know some languages like Spanish have a different set of letters using the romanic alphabet, but considering it's on NA shouldn't it be 26 like with most languages using romanic?
Dots are all about consistency much the same way tower damage is. Just got to get the timing down and then it's easy
ps: I think Mid is also rather rune intensive. While I was leveling up my account I noticed that when you go up against that guy going AD mid with full AD runes and you have no armour runes you pretty much lost the lane and just to go do something else.
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On March 13 2013 05:30 NeoIllusions wrote:
Jungling is probably the only rune intensive role. Otherwise a standard AD/AP pair of rune pages will take you far. If you're not willing to invest $20-30 dollar into this "free" video game, then suck it up and play with "less" optimal runes.
Even for jungling, where having an optimal setup arguably matters more than any other role, a typical AD page will work with the vast majority of junglers. You don't really need specialized runes except in some odd, inferquent cases (e.g. Akali, Karthus).
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On March 13 2013 05:42 Seuss wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2013 05:30 NeoIllusions wrote:
Jungling is probably the only rune intensive role. Otherwise a standard AD/AP pair of rune pages will take you far. If you're not willing to invest $20-30 dollar into this "free" video game, then suck it up and play with "less" optimal runes. Even for jungling, where having an optimal setup arguably matters more than any other role, a typical AD page will work with the vast majority of junglers. You don't really need specialized runes except in some odd, inferquent cases (e.g. Akali, Karthus).
Yeah, really so long as you have like armor yellows you should do well enough that runes not the reason you losing games.
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Nonetheless you'll need at least 3 rune pages to play every role and not be awful. Even assuming generic AD/AP pages, you'd still need another for support since playing most supports with a standard AP/AD page is fairly silly. A lot of Jungers can more or less work off normal pages.
Being convient is one thing, but it'd be more or less if you can configure your rune pages in champion select the way you can masteries, without 3 pages players will be at a significant disadvantage (probably around lv 25 vs lv 30 or so) in at least one role.
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United States47024 Posts
To be fair, if you could reconfigure runepages in champ select, nobody in their right mind would ever splurge for 20 of them.
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On March 13 2013 05:53 TheYango wrote:
To be fair, if you could reconfigure runepages in champ select, nobody in their right mind would ever splurge for 20 of them.
it probably takes enough APM that 90% of the playerbase would still have to buy them lol, it'd probably also randomly bug
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Not to belabor a point that's already been discussed extensively, but for me the problem isn't about money or convenience. I've spent a ton of money on LoL in the last 3 years and expect I'll spend plenty more. The problem is that the current system doesn't fully explore its own possibilities. I have 8 pages and most runes, but the amount of times I think things like "you know cdr quints would be useful here instead of AD" or "gee I wish I could try mpen blues instead of mr here." Riot give us near unlimited possibilities and then design a system than clamps down on it regardless of how much money you spend. Even when you've unlocked all the content the rune page system is at best unwieldy, and at worst stifling of strategic creativity. That's far worse than the nickel/diming/time investment/rune requirements arguments because it actually makes the playing experience less enjoyable. Personally I think that was more the point the fellow on lolgd was trying to make. The current system isn't fun, so Riot should look to improve it.
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United States47024 Posts
I mean, once you have like 5-7 "general" runepages, most of the specialized ones you'd use the other 15 for only vary on 1 rune type from one of the general pages (HP/lvl yellows instead of Armor, MS quints instead of AP, etc.).
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Pootie too good!4331 Posts
On March 13 2013 05:53 Kupon3ss wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2013 05:53 TheYango wrote:
To be fair, if you could reconfigure runepages in champ select, nobody in their right mind would ever splurge for 20 of them. it probably takes enough APM that 90% of the playerbase would still have to buy them lol, it'd probably also randomly bug
Brb, gonna go make rune page micro map.
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On March 13 2013 05:55 TheYango wrote:
I mean, once you have like 5-7 "general" runepages, most of the specialized ones you'd use the other 15 for only vary on 1 rune type from one of the general pages (HP/lvl yellows instead of Armor, MS quints instead of AP, etc.).
Right, but even playing one role I doubt that 15-20 rune pages is enough to optimally plan for all the possible match ups, especially for a crazy diverse role like top. More importantly wading through 20 rune pages for to find the very specific combination of stats you need isn't a very enjoyable method of customization. Understanding why it's there doesn't change that.
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On March 13 2013 05:28 Alaric wrote:Man last hitting with Cass early on much harder than it looks, especially if you want to harass at the same time. DoTs screw me much more than I'd have thought. :< Plus I just noticed but her base AD is on the lower side, even for a mage. Gotta work up those mechanics. Edit: guy digging up stuff. Pulling hair of course, but the fact that he said "24th letter" surprised me, I know some languages like Spanish have a different set of letters using the romanic alphabet, but considering it's on NA shouldn't it be 26 like with most languages using romanic?
I know exactly what you mean.
I have my games where I miss like 70% of the cs with her, purely because fucking snakes don't do enough damage to minions or dot OP. Then I have games where I get most of the cs. She really is a difficult champ to play in the end, though her wave clear is pretty decent still. Level 3 q will kill casters by the end of the tick, and if you use her passive well enough, w+e can clear melee minions pretty well.
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EPT
