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On November 23 2012 08:57 Alaric wrote:
Quick question, what's usually built on Teemo now?
Boots+3 -> [wriggles if AD laner] -> phage/wit's core -> zerkers/tabi/mercs/sorcs boots (is zerkers generally better than sorcs?), then what? PD for more AS? Nashor's even on bruiser Teemo? Atma's for armor since you have mallet? Randuin's for more kiting?
I have no idea how to build him since AP mid Teemo has been killed wih the DFG nerf.
straight ap teemo is still, without exaggeration, twice as good as on-hit. In any lane. It does more damage, more consistently and more safely and with better build paths. Sheen sorc shoes deathcap lichbane/void/zhonyas/dfg/etc. You don't need any attack speed, you don't have the luxury of using it optimally.
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That comeback was just epic
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On November 23 2012 13:02 GhandiEAGLE wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 12:53 Feartheguru wrote:On November 23 2012 12:45 OutlaW- wrote:
I don't think anyone would really just blindly go Trundle. Obviously only as a counterpick, and I truly believe that he has some match ups where he just dominates. Tell me with a straight face ONE matchup he dominates. Also versus Yorick he wins hard.
this is like patently not true
trundle has no tools with which to beat yorick
the regen from his passive is nothing for ghouls, yorick can kite him to kingdom come, and if yorick wants to play safe there's no way for trundle to harass him
this is one of those things that comes up all the time that baffles me
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On November 23 2012 13:02 GhandiEAGLE wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 12:53 Feartheguru wrote:On November 23 2012 12:45 OutlaW- wrote:
I don't think anyone would really just blindly go Trundle. Obviously only as a counterpick, and I truly believe that he has some match ups where he just dominates. Tell me with a straight face ONE matchup he dominates. Versus Nasus its pretty damn funny. Also versus Yorick he wins hard. But vs Yorick I prefer Cho anyways
Strongly disagree with the Trundle v Yorick comment. Any well played Yorick destroys him through harass despite the measly ~3-4 hp he gets every time a ghoul dies
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On November 23 2012 13:10 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 08:57 Alaric wrote:
Quick question, what's usually built on Teemo now?
Boots+3 -> [wriggles if AD laner] -> phage/wit's core -> zerkers/tabi/mercs/sorcs boots (is zerkers generally better than sorcs?), then what? PD for more AS? Nashor's even on bruiser Teemo? Atma's for armor since you have mallet? Randuin's for more kiting?
I have no idea how to build him since AP mid Teemo has been killed wih the DFG nerf. straight ap teemo is still, without exaggeration, twice as good as on-hit. In any lane. It does more damage, more consistently and more safely and with better build paths. Sheen sorc shoes deathcap lichbane/void/zhonyas/dfg/etc. You don't need any attack speed, you don't have the luxury of using it optimally.
I avoided answering this question because I don't play teemo enough but...
Teemo actually has more consistent damage from on hit than he does from AP.
A simple example. Nashor's tooth gives 65 AP and 50% atk speed. Malady gives 20 bonus on hit damage, 50% atkspd, and 25 AP. Even though malady is less expensive, the combined pure damage is 25*.4+20=30 damage, whereas nashors adds only .4*65=26 damage.
I'm ignoring the item passives and the .1 ratio on Teemo's poison, but on hit provides more damage especially with madreds br, and wits end.
I would still build teemo as an on hit champion with malady, sorc boots, sheen, guise, lichbane, finally into zhonyas/deathcap/voidstaff/mallet/nashors. I really like Teemo's mushrooms.
There's supposed to be an item in s3 that increases every autoattack damage by a percentage of AP.
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On November 23 2012 13:19 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 13:02 GhandiEAGLE wrote:On November 23 2012 12:53 Feartheguru wrote:On November 23 2012 12:45 OutlaW- wrote:
I don't think anyone would really just blindly go Trundle. Obviously only as a counterpick, and I truly believe that he has some match ups where he just dominates. Tell me with a straight face ONE matchup he dominates. Versus Nasus its pretty damn funny. Also versus Yorick he wins hard. But vs Yorick I prefer Cho anyways Strongly disagree with the Trundle v Yorick comment. Any well played Yorick destroys him through harass despite the measly ~3-4 hp he gets every time a ghoul dies
Aaand Hotshot tries playing Trundle, leaves game.
Well fuck, double post sorta.
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On November 23 2012 13:10 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 08:57 Alaric wrote:
Quick question, what's usually built on Teemo now?
Boots+3 -> [wriggles if AD laner] -> phage/wit's core -> zerkers/tabi/mercs/sorcs boots (is zerkers generally better than sorcs?), then what? PD for more AS? Nashor's even on bruiser Teemo? Atma's for armor since you have mallet? Randuin's for more kiting?
I have no idea how to build him since AP mid Teemo has been killed wih the DFG nerf. straight ap teemo is still, without exaggeration, twice as good as on-hit. In any lane. It does more damage, more consistently and more safely and with better build paths. Sheen sorc shoes deathcap lichbane/void/zhonyas/dfg/etc. You don't need any attack speed, you don't have the luxury of using it optimally.
Uh... doesn't Teemo rely on phage in a lot of his top lane match-up not to get smashed past some point?
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On November 23 2012 13:24 obesechicken13 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 13:10 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 23 2012 08:57 Alaric wrote:
Quick question, what's usually built on Teemo now?
Boots+3 -> [wriggles if AD laner] -> phage/wit's core -> zerkers/tabi/mercs/sorcs boots (is zerkers generally better than sorcs?), then what? PD for more AS? Nashor's even on bruiser Teemo? Atma's for armor since you have mallet? Randuin's for more kiting?
I have no idea how to build him since AP mid Teemo has been killed wih the DFG nerf. straight ap teemo is still, without exaggeration, twice as good as on-hit. In any lane. It does more damage, more consistently and more safely and with better build paths. Sheen sorc shoes deathcap lichbane/void/zhonyas/dfg/etc. You don't need any attack speed, you don't have the luxury of using it optimally. I avoided answering this question because I don't play teemo enough but... Teemo actually has more consistent damage from on hit than he does from AP. A simple example. Nashor's tooth gives 65 AP and 50% atk speed. Malady gives 20 bonus on hit damage, 50% atkspd, and 25 AP. Even though malady is less expensive, the combined pure damage is 25*.4+20=30 damage, whereas nashors adds only .4*65=26 damage. I'm ignoring the item passives and the .1 ratio on Teemo's poison, but on hit provides more damage especially with madreds br, and wits end. I would still build teemo as an on hit champion with malady, sorc boots, sheen, guise, lichbane, finally into zhonyas/deathcap/voidstaff/mallet/nashors. I really like Teemo's mushrooms. There's supposed to be an item in s3 that increases every autoattack damage by a percentage of AP.
you don't have the luxury of sitting there tapping people with autos. Those builds suck, you aren't going to do any damage in teamfights unless you wreck your lane. Ap teemo can get in and out of a fight and do so much, on hit teemo is garbage if he can't right click people at short range. His area control isn't good because the shroom damage falls off, his cc isn't good, and he does far less damage than an ad from much shorter range
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On November 23 2012 13:35 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 13:10 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 23 2012 08:57 Alaric wrote:
Quick question, what's usually built on Teemo now?
Boots+3 -> [wriggles if AD laner] -> phage/wit's core -> zerkers/tabi/mercs/sorcs boots (is zerkers generally better than sorcs?), then what? PD for more AS? Nashor's even on bruiser Teemo? Atma's for armor since you have mallet? Randuin's for more kiting?
I have no idea how to build him since AP mid Teemo has been killed wih the DFG nerf. straight ap teemo is still, without exaggeration, twice as good as on-hit. In any lane. It does more damage, more consistently and more safely and with better build paths. Sheen sorc shoes deathcap lichbane/void/zhonyas/dfg/etc. You don't need any attack speed, you don't have the luxury of using it optimally. Uh... doesn't Teemo rely on phage in a lot of his top lane match-up not to get smashed past some point?
no. Teemos matchups are extremely binary, jax or irelia will not shit on you any less hard with phage because if they close on you won't be able to auto to proc it anyway. It just helps vs champs with really limited gap closing and burst which are your dream matchups anyway.
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On November 23 2012 13:42 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 13:35 Alaric wrote:On November 23 2012 13:10 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 23 2012 08:57 Alaric wrote:
Quick question, what's usually built on Teemo now?
Boots+3 -> [wriggles if AD laner] -> phage/wit's core -> zerkers/tabi/mercs/sorcs boots (is zerkers generally better than sorcs?), then what? PD for more AS? Nashor's even on bruiser Teemo? Atma's for armor since you have mallet? Randuin's for more kiting?
I have no idea how to build him since AP mid Teemo has been killed wih the DFG nerf. straight ap teemo is still, without exaggeration, twice as good as on-hit. In any lane. It does more damage, more consistently and more safely and with better build paths. Sheen sorc shoes deathcap lichbane/void/zhonyas/dfg/etc. You don't need any attack speed, you don't have the luxury of using it optimally. Uh... doesn't Teemo rely on phage in a lot of his top lane match-up not to get smashed past some point? no. Teemos matchups are extremely binary, jax or irelia will not shit on you any less hard with phage because if they close on you won't be able to auto to proc it anyway. It just helps vs champs with really limited gap closing and burst which are your dream matchups anyway.
But phage is not to stop them gap closing it is to shit on them when they disengage. If jax jumps you you QW and run then auto them to hell once they disengage. It is like how rincent plays kayle.
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if they aren't engaging on you you're winning anyway. That's how heroes that auto beat teemo: by going hard and bursting him. If they're doing anything else they're losing. Think about why you buy phage in lane in the first place. There isn't a single losing matchup it turns around. What it does is potentially turn even or advantaged lanes into curbstomps, because if they start fighting you and get even a little behind they can't run. But teemo's opponents all-in him anyway, there's no point in them trying to trade autos and back off because that's what teemo is built to crush. So basically... No. Phage does not fix any of his matchups. The idea that you are going to buy it and kite these bursty top laners like a pimp is ridiculous. Nobody buys it to kite except ez who has the unique property of being able to auto at long range without an animation. Even corki buys it so that he can all-in incredibly hard.
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so how come no one ever told me how much fun ahri is? playing her for the first time today and having an absolute blast
i bet she crushes top lanes so hard, i wonder if anyone runs her there
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This was pretty much what happened before AP on his onhit got buffed.
Teemo was just a lane bully, and all he did was shove lanes all game, and provide ridic map awareness.
After AP buff on his onhit.
Teemo was lane bully, shoved lanes all game, provide map awareness and could 1v1 almost any AD-based champion if given similar amount of gold,
DFG nerf.
AP teemo still pretty ridic, but much harder for him to 1v1 majority of champs, which made him a lot weaker.
I think Frozen Mallet with typical AP items are still very strong on him, his natural base attack speed is good enough to constantly proc the slow on 2 targets at a time, all while still kiting them through shroom fields.
On November 23 2012 14:16 gtrsrs wrote:
so how come no one ever told me how much fun ahri is? playing her for the first time today and having an absolute blast
i bet she crushes top lanes so hard, i wonder if anyone runs her there
tbh, Ahri is like yorick to play against. It's hairpullingly annoying to play against her. She's so stupidly easy to play at a decent efficiency. PRESS R 3 times, get triple kill, and dash away. GAH! RAGE!
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On November 23 2012 14:16 gtrsrs wrote:
so how come no one ever told me how much fun ahri is? playing her for the first time today and having an absolute blast
i bet she crushes top lanes so hard, i wonder if anyone runs her there
ew. i hate ahri. probably one of my least favorite champs lol
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yeh ahri crushes top lane
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On November 23 2012 14:17 wussleeQ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 14:16 gtrsrs wrote:
so how come no one ever told me how much fun ahri is? playing her for the first time today and having an absolute blast
i bet she crushes top lanes so hard, i wonder if anyone runs her there ew. i hate ahri. probably one of my least favorite champs lol
when she was really popular i hated playing against her and i've never been a mid player (skillshots are too hard) so i never picked her up but god damn me i have enjoyed playing her so much today. that charm is so clutch, and all her skills do wayyyy too much damage. i see now why alex ich started that whole "i build only tank items and still do massive damage" phase a few months back. ahri's perfect for it
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On November 23 2012 14:16 gtrsrs wrote:
so how come no one ever told me how much fun ahri is? playing her for the first time today and having an absolute blast
i bet she crushes top lanes so hard, i wonder if anyone runs her there
From experience, Ahri has 0 place top lane. She doesn't have the sustained damage to kill anyone up there, lacks any kind of escape pre-6, has pretty low sustain, and just dies to anything with a gap closer.
If Olaf, Jax, Darius, Lee Sin get into melee range of her and she doesn't have ult up shes pretty screwed.
Also Jax can just jump on her and auto once and win the trade even if Ahri hits everything.
Edit: but she is amazing mid lane
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She was even more ridiculous with her original base damages, and abyssal sceptre use to have infinite range, and dfg use to do a bazillion damage.
Yeah, that champ is ridic.
But after abyssal range change + dfg nerf, she's gotten a lot weaker.
There's a reason how forellenlord got like 3k elo.... ahri....
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On November 23 2012 13:18 gtrsrs wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 13:02 GhandiEAGLE wrote:On November 23 2012 12:53 Feartheguru wrote:On November 23 2012 12:45 OutlaW- wrote:
I don't think anyone would really just blindly go Trundle. Obviously only as a counterpick, and I truly believe that he has some match ups where he just dominates. Tell me with a straight face ONE matchup he dominates. Also versus Yorick he wins hard. this is like patently not true trundle has no tools with which to beat yorick the regen from his passive is nothing for ghouls, yorick can kite him to kingdom come, and if yorick wants to play safe there's no way for trundle to harass him this is one of those things that comes up all the time that baffles me
It's probably the most severe case of something that that is "popular knowledge" yet completely false when it comes to this game. If you've played the matchup then it because painfully obvious that Trundle does not counter Yorick in any way. If anything, Yorick has the advantage. I've gotten a few free wins as Yorick because someone on the enemy team "counterpicked" with Trundle.
Nasus doesn't beat Yorick either.
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On November 23 2012 14:41 koreasilver wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2012 13:18 gtrsrs wrote:On November 23 2012 13:02 GhandiEAGLE wrote:On November 23 2012 12:53 Feartheguru wrote:On November 23 2012 12:45 OutlaW- wrote:
I don't think anyone would really just blindly go Trundle. Obviously only as a counterpick, and I truly believe that he has some match ups where he just dominates. Tell me with a straight face ONE matchup he dominates. Also versus Yorick he wins hard. this is like patently not true trundle has no tools with which to beat yorick the regen from his passive is nothing for ghouls, yorick can kite him to kingdom come, and if yorick wants to play safe there's no way for trundle to harass him this is one of those things that comes up all the time that baffles me It's probably the most severe case of something that that is "popular knowledge" yet completely false when it comes to this game. If you've played the matchup then it because painfully obvious that Trundle does not counter Yorick in any way. If anything, Yorick has the advantage. I've gotten a few free wins as Yorick because someone on the enemy team "counterpicked" with Trundle. Nasus doesn't beat Yorick either.
i played a game with nasus where i used lifesteal runes and masteries and started with vamp scepter. didn't beat yorick by any means, but eventually he went back to buy items and i took his tower. was kinda just sitting around running up and using syphon then running back withered whenever he tried to run at me.
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EPT
