EPTRofl.
If you dont get fed early he just friggen garbage. Its not even like you can just be content with outfarming the other jungler. Like literally he just can't teamfight at all.
[Patch 1.0.0.145: Rengar] General Discussion - Page 111
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
Rofl. If you dont get fed early he just friggen garbage. Its not even like you can just be content with outfarming the other jungler. Like literally he just can't teamfight at all. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On August 23 2012 05:51 Dusty wrote: I get that Riven's ult is really low cooldown lategame but I honestly dont see a practical situation where it's useful except for clearing large wave late game or something. +20% AD on a champ who makes a living stacking it is pretty strong. | ||
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Wolfstan
Canada605 Posts
I was more talking about how riot should encourage more interaction between laners than what champion gets chosen during picks/bans. I know there should be a certain level of excitement at character select screen as counters get chosen and comps take shape, but the majority of advantage should be gained in-game. http://solomid.net/guides.php?g=16914 This is a guide that riot should strive to have for at least a dozen top laners, approaching the lane with a day9 coined "mid-game plan". Depending on the opponent you will have goals, build adjustments, timings whether in items or levels, just general in-game counterplay that can be applied. Also to note is many Riven lanes have "defining moments" where you won or lost a lane just like a starcraft game, I have never had a lane loss where I felt like better play from myself wouldn't have made a difference. I cringe when an approach to a matchup is: "cry, you were counterpicked, hope you like farming under tower"(Yorick is worst for this) or "take a nap, avoid ganks and enjoy going into teamfights 6/0. I want: "you have advantage till lvl 9, where trades start to go into his favor" "shove and roam, they have terrible wave clearing" "you advantage diminishes as they get armor" "then lane is heavily influenced by <insert skillshot>" "trade down, shove the lane, and use your lvl 6 to finish as you ding your ultimate 3 mobs before him" | ||
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ninjakingcola
United States405 Posts
On August 23 2012 08:00 Wolfstan wrote: Barbsq: I was more talking about how riot should encourage more interaction between laners than what champion gets chosen during picks/bans. I know there should be a certain level of excitement at character select screen as counters get chosen and comps take shape, but the majority of advantage should be gained in-game. http://solomid.net/guides.php?g=16914 This is a guide that riot should strive to have for at least a dozen top laners, approaching the lane with a day9 coined "mid-game plan". Depending on the opponent you will have goals, build adjustments, timings whether in items or levels, just general in-game counterplay that can be applied. Also to note is many Riven lanes have "defining moments" where you won or lost a lane just like a starcraft game, I have never had a lane loss where I felt like better play from myself wouldn't have made a difference. I cringe when an approach to a matchup is: "cry, you were counterpicked, hope you like farming under tower"(Yorick is worst for this) or "take a nap, avoid ganks and enjoy going into teamfights 6/0. I want: "you have advantage till lvl 9, where trades start to go into his favor" "shove and roam, they have terrible wave clearing" "you advantage diminishes as they get armor" "then lane is heavily influenced by <insert skillshot>" "trade down, shove the lane, and use your lvl 6 to finish as you ding your ultimate 3 mobs before him" Aww man, you linked to the guide I use for Riven, now everyone's gonna know how to beat her  | ||
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arb
Noobville17922 Posts
On August 23 2012 08:11 ninjakingcola wrote: Aww man, you linked to the guide I use for Riven, now everyone's gonna know how to beat her I've always wondered why does rivens thing say this : Riven's abilities charge her blade, causing her basic attacks to deal 5/15/25/35/45/55/65/75/85/95/105/115/125/135/145/155/165/175 (+100% of bonus attack damage) bonus physical damage. Riven's blade may be charged up to 3 times and expends one charge per attack. when in game its clearly not anywhere near that high? | ||
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101toss
3232 Posts
On August 23 2012 08:24 arb wrote: I've always wondered why does rivens thing say this : Riven's abilities charge her blade, causing her basic attacks to deal 5/15/25/35/45/55/65/75/85/95/105/115/125/135/145/155/165/175 (+100% of bonus attack damage) bonus physical damage. Riven's blade may be charged up to 3 times and expends one charge per attack. when in game its clearly not anywhere near that high? Chainvests and dodge boots r pretty gud | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On August 23 2012 08:00 Wolfstan wrote: Barbsq: I was more talking about how riot should encourage more interaction between laners than what champion gets chosen during picks/bans. I know there should be a certain level of excitement at character select screen as counters get chosen and comps take shape, but the majority of advantage should be gained in-game. http://solomid.net/guides.php?g=16914 This is a guide that riot should strive to have for at least a dozen top laners, approaching the lane with a day9 coined "mid-game plan". Depending on the opponent you will have goals, build adjustments, timings whether in items or levels, just general in-game counterplay that can be applied. Also to note is many Riven lanes have "defining moments" where you won or lost a lane just like a starcraft game, I have never had a lane loss where I felt like better play from myself wouldn't have made a difference. I cringe when an approach to a matchup is: "cry, you were counterpicked, hope you like farming under tower"(Yorick is worst for this) or "take a nap, avoid ganks and enjoy going into teamfights 6/0. I want: "you have advantage till lvl 9, where trades start to go into his favor" "shove and roam, they have terrible wave clearing" "you advantage diminishes as they get armor" "then lane is heavily influenced by <insert skillshot>" "trade down, shove the lane, and use your lvl 6 to finish as you ding your ultimate 3 mobs before him" We already have plenty of the stuff you want. "you have advantage till lvl 9, where trades start to go into his favor" - Vlad "shove and roam, they have terrible wave clearing" - Shyvana, Udyr, Nidalee v. stuff like GP "you advantage diminishes as they get armor" - Renekton, Pantheon "then lane is heavily influenced by <insert skillshot>" - Q max Ezreal; most tops don't really rely on skillshots; in general skillshots are stuff mid laners worry about "trade down, shove the lane, and use your lvl 6 to finish as you ding your ultimate 3 mobs before him" - every ultimate-centric champ in the game. Riven and Jax are two notable top lane examples. I also don't see what's wrong with counterpicks and stuff like Yorick. Yes, it's unfun for the other guy, but it's part of the game. Part of the skill of playing the game is adapting; not only your own play, but the way a team approaches the situation. Against Yorick or counterpicks, lane swap. Sure, in solo q people don't necessarily do that, but should you balance for solo q at the expense of a more developed competitive scene? I don't think you should, but that's just me. It's like going up against Dark Swarm as a Terran in BW. It fucking sucks, but you just adapt and adjust your play. You don't be pigheaded and do the same thing. I won't say top lane is fine atm, 'cause it's not. But the issue, imo, isn't so much in champion design as it is with the way people approach top lane, especially in solo q. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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101toss
3232 Posts
On August 23 2012 08:56 Requizen wrote: FUCK. GUYS. THEY KNOW. THEY KNOW ABOUT THE SMASH. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cd_oJ9AnQuM If you're 16 and 0 in 15 minutes you deserve to solo baron. Also blue buff was given and glacial was skipped. Probably wouldn't happen in a real game. Also, the lack of gp/5s and buying wards :s Also, that baron attempt seemed very luck based (correct me if I'm wrong) | ||
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Vingle
Canada86 Posts
We all know it was going to come out sometime. | ||
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kainzero
United States5211 Posts
On August 23 2012 08:00 Wolfstan wrote: I want: "you have advantage till lvl 9, where trades start to go into his favor" "shove and roam, they have terrible wave clearing" "you advantage diminishes as they get armor" "then lane is heavily influenced by <insert skillshot>" "trade down, shove the lane, and use your lvl 6 to finish as you ding your ultimate 3 mobs before him" i think that you don't get those interactions because a lot of the time, one or two deaths can really snowball in one person's favor. it could be like "yeah, once irelia builds wits end then she goes from losing trades to winning trades against xxx champion." but if she gets one or two early kills, she's now up 1 or 2 levels, has wits end, and 20 more cs and it becomes impossible to fight zoning without jungle intervention. i don't know what a workable solution would be. itemization, maybe. | ||
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arb
Noobville17922 Posts
On August 23 2012 09:02 101toss wrote: If you're 16 and 0 in 15 minutes you deserve to solo baron. Also blue buff was given and glacial was skipped. Probably wouldn't happen in a real game. Also, the lack of gp/5s and buying wards :s Also, that baron attempt seemed very luck based (correct me if I'm wrong) I could see it happening, aslong as baron was clear and you had some way to ensure top/their jungle wouldnt come stop you | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On August 23 2012 09:05 kainzero wrote: i think that you don't get those interactions because a lot of the time, one or two deaths can really snowball in one person's favor. it could be like "yeah, once irelia builds wits end then she goes from losing trades to winning trades against xxx champion." but if she gets one or two early kills, she's now up 1 or 2 levels, has wits end, and 20 more cs and it becomes impossible to fight zoning without jungle intervention. i don't know what a workable solution would be. itemization, maybe. Or how about you dont die 1v1 to an Irelia. o.o | ||
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101toss
3232 Posts
On August 23 2012 09:26 arb wrote: I could see it happening, aslong as baron was clear and you had some way to ensure top/their jungle wouldnt come stop you It would be better in 99% of cases just to 2 man it with your jungler anyways | ||
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Vaporized
United States1471 Posts
On August 23 2012 07:43 iCanada wrote: So I changed my mind about Rengar. Rofl. If you dont get fed early he just friggen garbage. Its not even like you can just be content with outfarming the other jungler. Like literally he just can't teamfight at all. ive changed my mind about him too. his single target burst is insane early and mid game. | ||
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askTeivospy
1525 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
Turns out it's utter shit when you need 27 minutes to complete it because your dear premates don't stop taking your wraiths and golems even after you ask them and top lane kill Akali thrice then let her roam and never helps even for dragon. I'm trying to get a feeling for that build, but it seems like playing Trundle curses me to get a shitty game. :< | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
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101toss
3232 Posts
C'mon, give it at least a week | ||
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