EPT[Patch 1.0.0.144: Diana] General Discussion - Page 82
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AUGcodon
Canada536 Posts
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Vaporized
United States1471 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On August 08 2012 12:36 Ryuu314 wrote: What game are you playing that averages 400 gold per kill? The one where you can reasonably afford Deathcap on a jungler on majority of games. *sarcasm* | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On August 08 2012 12:36 Ryuu314 wrote: What game are you playing that averages 400 gold per kill? He taxes quite heavily with 31 minions so maybe his allies are underleveled and the enemy gets big bounties. The numbers are definitely slightly off but I think they're still fine. Just very hard. Also 3-0-2 is pretty fed. | ||
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Vaporized
United States1471 Posts
On August 08 2012 12:41 obesechicken13 wrote: He taxes quite heavily with 31 minions so maybe his allies are underleveled and the enemy gets big bounties. 31 minions is about 5 waves in 20 minutes. if someone goes back and i hold the lane i will last hit creeps. if creeps are going to die to one of our towers i try to get there to farm them if no one else will be there. mid lane i will push waves into the enemy tower if i gank and my laner has to go back to deny the other mid. after a turret goes down and the laner is farming my jungle i will go farm his lane. 31 is not that many. if i go gank a lane and smite is up i will smite a creep for the 10 bonus gold from defensive mastery. after i get my first red and blue i keep smite on cd because it is free gold. 31 is also from after the last team fight where i probably killed some on the way there and on the way back. the fight was at top turret. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
Rushing straight damage on a jungler is also generally a not very smart idea with the current meta. Even Triforce rushes have some measure of survivability to them with the extra hp and movespeed. Dcap offers nothing but damage. | ||
MoonBear
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
On August 08 2012 11:00 barbsq wrote: is it just me, or is draven seriously underrated? like, this is purely anecdotal evidence, but every time i've seen draven, either on streams or in my own games, they get 20+ kills and go legendary multiple times in a single game. The only time i've ever seen a draven do poorly was in the first 2 days he was released. idk, mybe it's just me Draven passive gives him a free BF sword by like lvl 6 or something stupid every time he hits Q. You can outfarm and outplay him really hard and get a whole BF up on him, but if you try to fight he still hits like a truck. It's honestly ridiculous. Actually, adding on the bonus damage native to Q he gets his free BF by lvl 4 I think. Wtf. And once he gets crit he doesn't even need his Q to truck you. I'm so glad no one plays him. | ||
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Vaporized
United States1471 Posts
On August 08 2012 12:48 Ryuu314 wrote: I have no doubt you can afford a dcap on a jungler going 3-0-2. The issue is you're not going to go 3-0-2 every game or at least in a game where you don't completely outclass your opponents. Rushing straight damage on a jungler is also generally a not very smart idea with the current meta. Even Triforce rushes have some measure of survivability to them with the extra hp and movespeed. Dcap offers nothing but damage. LOL i said right above the screenshots on the last page i went 3-0-2 in one game and 2-0-3 in the other... you said it was impossible to get a dcap at 23 minutes. it would help if people actually read what i wrote instead of immediately going 'no fucking way'. its just common sense that if i dont get a few kills or assists im going to be fairly useless to my team and be behind in items by 20-25 minutes. i specifically said in these games what my k/d/a was at 23 minutes. a jungler who has made no impact by 20 minutes is a bad jungler, there are some games where things dont go my way and i either die or i dont get any kills or assists and you know what, i lose those games and i dont get a 23 minute dcap. my whole point was that a 23 min dcap is possible on a jungler. as for building damage items on a jungler. i usually tell my team what i am going to play and ask if either top or support can be tanky, and 9 times out of 10 someone will do that. if i am one of the last 2 picks and we have no tank thats when i play sejuani or skarner. i dont want to play diana as a tank. i like the idea of an ap burst being designed to be a jungler. that is a concept that appeals to me, and through the first few games of playing her it works just fine. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On August 08 2012 13:06 Vaporized wrote: LOL i said right above the screenshots on the last page i went 3-0-2 in one game and 2-0-3 in the other... you said it was impossible to get a dcap at 23 minutes. it would help if people actually read what i wrote instead of immediately going 'no fucking way'. its just common sense that if i dont get a few kills or assists im going to be fairly useless to my team and be behind in items by 20-25 minutes. i specifically said in these games what my k/d/a was at 23 minutes. a jungler who has made no impact by 20 minutes is a bad jungler, there are some games where things dont go my way and i either die or i dont get any kills or assists and you know what, i lose those games and i dont get a 23 minute dcap. my whole point was that a 23 min dcap is possible on a jungler. as for building damage items on a jungler. i usually tell my team what i am going to play and ask if either top or support can be tanky, and 9 times out of 10 someone will do that. if i am one of the last 2 picks and we have no tank thats when i play sejuani or skarner. i dont want to play diana as a tank. i like the idea of an ap burst being designed to be a jungler. that is a concept that appeals to me, and through the first few games of playing her it works just fine. If you go into a game with the plan of getting a dcap at 23 minutes, you're gonna have a bad time. It's probably a sign that dcap rush is a bad build when you always lose games where you don't get fed and get that 23 minute dcap. If you're getting fed then sure, a dcap could be very nice to help you snowball the game. But it shouldn't by any means by core. If you were merely stating that it's possible, then fine, yes it's possible. But practically anything's possible.It's possible to get an IE from the jungle in 23 minutes. Doesn't mean it's viable/good. also, making an impact on the game =/= fed. sometimes making an impact merely means making sure the enemy team has less farm than your team. that's it. Building damage on a jungler is not bad. Rushing damage on a jungler tends to be bad. There's a difference. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On August 08 2012 13:06 Vaporized wrote: LOL i said right above the screenshots on the last page i went 3-0-2 in one game and 2-0-3 in the other... you said it was impossible to get a dcap at 23 minutes. it would help if people actually read what i wrote instead of immediately going 'no fucking way'. its just common sense that if i dont get a few kills or assists im going to be fairly useless to my team and be behind in items by 20-25 minutes. i specifically said in these games what my k/d/a was at 23 minutes. a jungler who has made no impact by 20 minutes is a bad jungler, there are some games where things dont go my way and i either die or i dont get any kills or assists and you know what, i lose those games and i dont get a 23 minute dcap. my whole point was that a 23 min dcap is possible on a jungler. as for building damage items on a jungler. i usually tell my team what i am going to play and ask if either top or support can be tanky, and 9 times out of 10 someone will do that. if i am one of the last 2 picks and we have no tank thats when i play sejuani or skarner. i dont want to play diana as a tank. i like the idea of an ap burst being designed to be a jungler. that is a concept that appeals to me, and through the first few games of playing her it works just fine. A jungler who can't get 5 successful ganks in 20 minutes isn't necessarily a bad jungler. Good players are good at avoiding ganks man. Unless they going balls deep to gank, in which case there is no way they going to have anywhere near optimal jungle farms. Junglers can make huge impact and win lanes without killing enemy laners, being zoned because you know the enemy jangler camping your brush is an awful feeling. No one is telling you not to build damage on a jungler. If you playing leesin and you like 5-0-0, sure, build that BT and kill things. But, there is a reason no one just flat out rushes BT on junglers. | ||
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De4ngus
United States6533 Posts
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upperbound
United States2300 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
Learn your lesson. A normal game (i.e. not a complete shit shoot) will only have ~2-3 kills TOTAL (for both sides, not each) early game unless someone fucks up hard or gets camped like a bitch. So no, you can not count on having a DC at 23 minutes in a normal game. When people stop playing like shit and actually watch out for Diana's semi-pathetic pre-6 ganks, you'll find you have less kills early on, and your lanes will not always let you have farm. | ||
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Chiharu Harukaze
12112 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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Lmui
Canada6215 Posts
On August 08 2012 13:34 Chiharu Harukaze wrote: Out of curiosity, is DCap by 23 min standard in midlane? I can't actually farm that normally because I'm too busy having to roam, duel the jungler, etc. I guess I should steal wraiths more often but does it help? I'm not a very good midplayer for what it's worth so maybe it's just my mechanics. Around 23 minutes you should have double dorans + sorcs + large rod + blasting rod. It's sorta 50/50 whether or not you have a dcap by then. | ||
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justiceknight
Singapore5741 Posts
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
Also I don't think kass farms well unless it's against another melee or he's zoning. | ||
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Cloud
Sexico5880 Posts
On August 08 2012 13:34 Chiharu Harukaze wrote: Out of curiosity, is DCap by 23 min standard in midlane? I can't actually farm that normally because I'm too busy having to roam, duel the jungler, etc. I guess I should steal wraiths more often but does it help? I'm not a very good midplayer for what it's worth so maybe it's just my mechanics. Around 20 minutes is standard for boots2 + 2 sorc rings + dcap. Also true for many other big items like triforce, ie, etc. | ||
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BlackPaladin
United States9316 Posts
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