EPTAnd her Ult is pretty decent in teamfights and escapes.
[Patch 1.0.0.143: MidJuly-Zyra] General Discussion - Page 18
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jacosajh
2919 Posts
And her Ult is pretty decent in teamfights and escapes. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
On July 20 2012 14:02 Bladeorade wrote: The all Orange build works well also. (Mobility boots, triforce, hexdrinker, rageblade, shurelyas,wriggles. Did it in a normal for the lulz and won) Eevee --> Flareon :O | ||
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Fus
Sweden1112 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On July 20 2012 22:56 Fus wrote: Hmm, a buff for Morgana, that was not expected. That's...not a buff | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
It's an endgame buff with the range, early game nerf. About balances out, imo. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On July 20 2012 22:59 Requizen wrote: It's an endgame buff with the range, early game nerf. About balances out, imo. The range is never something I ever noticed late game. As Morg, you're pretty much always in the fray in range of everything and everyone. I understand where the thinking comes from, but it's definitely a nerf. I haven't been able to play this patch yet, so Idk how much it actually affected Morg's lane. In theory, though, it should actually make her gankable. | ||
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
On July 20 2012 18:15 NeedsmoreCELLTECH wrote: Can someone explain to me why Hecarim went from a spectacularly underwhelming jungler to 'free elo huehuehue'? Has he gotten any nerfs recently? His pre-6 ganks are still meh, his post 6 ganks are still strong, right? he's exactly the same as he has been for months more people are starting to try him and get a little better with him, and the majority of the population still doesn't know how to play against him, so there might be the illusion that hecarim play is getting better i still think he's extremely mediocre and you have to choose between doing damage and surviving teamfights, he doesn't get to do both. ganks are on par with other good gankers, ultimate pretty underwhelming for an ult honestly he's better top lane because of his sustain and sustained damage. he's a legit counter to a lot of champs that destroy top lane like renekton | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On July 20 2012 23:01 jcarlsoniv wrote: The range is never something I ever noticed late game. As Morg, you're pretty much always in the fray in range of everything and everyone. I understand where the thinking comes from, but it's definitely a nerf. I haven't been able to play this patch yet, so Idk how much it actually affected Morg's lane. In theory, though, it should actually make her gankable. It does make her way more gankable, so like I said, early game nerf. Maybe it doesn't balance out in the long run, but the extra range does help when counter-initiating or whatever. Maybe not really noticeable, but it's there. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On July 20 2012 23:03 gtrsrs wrote: he's exactly the same as he has been for months more people are starting to try him and get a little better with him, and the majority of the population still doesn't know how to play against him, so there might be the illusion that hecarim play is getting better i still think he's extremely mediocre and you have to choose between doing damage and surviving teamfights, he doesn't get to do both. ganks are on par with other good gankers, ultimate pretty underwhelming for an ult honestly he's better top lane because of his sustain and sustained damage. he's a legit counter to a lot of champs that destroy top lane like renekton A semi-malphite ult that scatters instead of knocks up is underwhelming? I'd disagree. It's not as good as Malph or Amumu, but it's still bloody strong, especially if your team is good at sniping people who get split off, since you can R -> E someone way away from their team and isolate them. I'd also say he's one of the few junglers that doesn't need to differentiate between damage and survivability, since building CDR gives you both. Q spam is actually really good damage, especially with a bit of AD/MS(+passive), plus if you have Sheen/TF you get the proc more or less as often as humanly possible. And CDR + W in teamfights means you're more or less invincible as long as an enemy is in your W and your team is doing damage. So a build that has Kindle/Shureliya + FH is pretty beast mode. His ganks are pretty iffy before 6 because of how E works (fuck up knockback, save enemy), but post-6 they're pretty nightmarish. Perhaps not Malph/Amumu/Naut levels of absurdity, but much better than average. I'm pretty bad, but the Hec guide has a lot of good discussion on the matter. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On July 20 2012 18:15 NeedsmoreCELLTECH wrote: Can someone explain to me why Hecarim went from a spectacularly underwhelming jungler to 'free elo huehuehue'? Has he gotten any nerfs recently? His pre-6 ganks are still meh, his post 6 ganks are still strong, right? To be fair I've been calling Hecarim free Elo since shortly after he came out. Hecarim's seeing a lot more play now because teams want tanky CC junglers, but there aren't many good ones left after you finish banning Naut/Malphite/Ali. Also his pre-6 ganks are pretty good, arguably better than Malphite's unless you screw up on his E. Nothing really compares to Nautilus or Alistar, but just because he isn't on their level doesn't mean his ganks aren't good | ||
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arb
Noobville17922 Posts
On July 20 2012 16:17 bobbob wrote: Xin is pretty solidly strong, as I said I view him in a similar light as Darius as a largely immobile high damage bruiser, just wants to get on the ADC and slap him around. He is fine overall, probably going to become another strong toplaner. Eve got buffed (obviously), she now fits in as a stealthy jungler, I don't know how well pink ward counterplay will affect her, as I haven't been either scared of her, or supporting against a jungle eve. I think she may become viable as a top level jungler, or maybe she needs to be slightly stronger. In any case she is fine as is. Twitch is still trash as an ADC, haven't seen him in the jungle, but I imagine he is trash there as well. He doesn't have a good way to trade in lane, costing him a lot vs most AD carries. A good support can make sure they know when he stealths, making it apparent when he is trying to trade. Because he can't trade, he is merely on even footing when he finally is able to get a fight with his stealth. I think he's actually way stronger, he has longer range than graves and while he isnt as bursty i think his sustained damage is alot higher with poison+ expunge not removing it anymore. Late game since they removed that stupid ass cap on his ult he's alot stronger there | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23394 Posts
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On July 20 2012 23:49 Seuss wrote: To be fair I've been calling Hecarim free Elo since shortly after he came out. Hecarim's seeing a lot more play now because teams want tanky CC junglers, but there aren't many good ones left after you finish banning Naut/Malphite/Ali. Also his pre-6 ganks are pretty good, arguably better than Malphite's unless you screw up on his E. Nothing really compares to Nautilus or Alistar, but just because he isn't on their level doesn't mean his ganks aren't good And even without damage items, he brings significantly more damage to the table than Naut/Alistar. Nothing has ever been wrong with the pony, his niche is just seeing more usage now because the kings of jungle CC are banned so often. Hecarim brings less CC but more damage than them, but still one of the more CCful jungles so he's getting some love. I just wish his Q was a slow like Skarner's  It's so frustrating having someone get away AFTER you have closed the gap when ganking them. | ||
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Doctorbeat
Netherlands13241 Posts
On July 21 2012 00:16 Slayer91 wrote: Xin should be interesting, he's more of an initiator than darius with the new ult and if you hit 4-5 people with ult at level 16 with just triforce and GA you'll be absurdly tanky. I just played jungle xin and I know that he's probably way better top, but whilst jungling I felt that he just didn't have enough tankiness with less gold. He does have nice sustain for jungling with W, but you need to max Q for damage. Tried building him Wits/BC/Randuins, went ok-ish. I died pretty damn quickly, faster than a Malph or Shen would have. And I didn't feel like I did as much damage. Maybe I went to much damage with that build? Should I have gone for something like SFC after Wits? He doesn't have any mana problems btw, after 1 blue buff you're good. Wriggle's is not needed, but I do think it makes him quicker in the jungle. Delays your items a lot though, and the lifesteal isn't needed for jungling. I definitely need to learn how to play the challenge+ult thing. I already found out that it's pretty good for getting away if you haven't attacked anyone yet. It's really damn hard to be able to single out a carry though. 90% of the time the carry will be in the back of their team, so if you jump in, challenge the carry and then ult you'll knock their bruisers/tanks/support into your own team. Far from optimal  But he's a lot of fun, I hope I can play him in ranked sometime soon. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23394 Posts
Obviously you're going to die faster than a malph or shen with those items from the jungle, more gold more items and more levels in a top lane and it might be somewhat different though. | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On July 21 2012 00:36 Slayer91 wrote: BC is a pretty poor item and randuins mightn't be the best one pick up defensive item on xin because he mostly wants hp because of his ult. I imagine trinity is your best friend damage wise because the slow, speed, and burst on sheen are all pretty good with xins kit and only the sheen stats are wasted. Obviously you're going to die faster than a malph or shen with those items from the jungle, more gold more items and more levels in a top lane and it might be somewhat different though. Randuins is pretty damn nice for people who want HP - early HOG gets the hp bumped up a bit (not as much now though.. ugh) and later on you round off your high HP total (since you theoretically buy other items that work for you between HOG and Randuins) Also it works rather well for jumping on an enemy team. Jump with your slow, Press button when your slow is wearing off, seems like it works rather well with the way you want to play Xin in teamfights. However, 1 tank item does not a tanky character make, you're still going to get blown up if you're diving a team with only a Randuin worth of survivability. Something like Phage Wriggles Hexdrinker Randuin might be a more solid core. You don't need AS stacking the way old xin wanted it, so Tanky AD items to make your Q hit like a truck seem the best way to boost your damage output. Brutalizer also seems extremely good if you can find a way to squeeze it in without leaving yourself with a glass cannon build. If you say wriggles isn't needed (not sure, myself) then maybe an early HoG + Phage + Chain Vest -> TF + Randuin's? Add in an early Hexdrinker or something if you need it, early brutalizer if you are crushing and want to bring maximum damage to ganks. (% Armor reduction goes before armor pen, so the armor pen on bruta synergizes rather nicely with the new passive) | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On July 21 2012 01:12 TheYango wrote: New Xin seems to use CDR really well though. I would think a build that gets CDR more aggressively would have a lot of effectiveness. Bruta + Frozen Heart then? Or maybe Shurelia's? | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23394 Posts
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