EPT[Patch 1.0.0.141: Draven] General Discussion - Page 143
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On June 22 2012 21:37 Alaric wrote: Mao's got hard cc and a better ult imo, as a jungler. I agree with hard CC, but Nunu ult so strong. No AP if you get full one off it like 1k AoE damage. People have to respect that it wrecks whole teams so it like stupidly strong zone control. I mean, Mao ult strong zone control, but Nunu ult you either fight and get rolled by big deeps or run away (while horrifically slowed) and take free damage, assuming you use it after all hard CC blown. Not to mention, the fact that people blow their CC to stop your ult a huge boon in first place... call me crazy but I've never said ot myself "Damn, we need to stun that Mao..." in a teamfight. Ever. And I mean, 30% damage reduction pretty strong, but not gonna stop people from diving your carry. Not to mention, Snowball decrease enemy AD's damage output by literally the same amount. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
 I know when there's a Karthus or a Kennen I'm loved if I use my ult to cover their AoE.I find Mao more reliable because you don't have to pray that your AD will do well: you don't decrease the threats, you utterly keep them off him, so that he can dps all he wants. | ||
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samthesaluki
914 Posts
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Zdrastochye
Ivory Coast6262 Posts
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1ntrigue
Australia948 Posts
sowthern annihilighted tbh | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On June 22 2012 22:15 Zdrastochye wrote: I'd still rather jungle Naut or Mao in his place. I mean, there's a ton of really good junglers, and why you'd jungle a champion who's clearly worse than the others (maybe just so you can say you did it?) seems like needlessly neutering yourself. Unless you claim that Nunu deserves mention as being as good as the best junglers now. Thats my point... He's not clearly worse. Naut maybe, definitely not Mao though. Also both Maokai and Nautilus pretty weak duelers/counter junglers, whereas Nunu is actually rather strong in that reguard. Nunu a friggen brick wall in his own jungle, and counter jungles like a boss. Even if he loses fights against certain junglers (and actually, he beats a lot of them up) there isn't much you can do to stop a Nunu from running in kenyan mode wit Bloodboil, smiting/consuming your shit, then either killing you because he has massive steroids and debuffs, or just snowballing you and running away with a huge troll face. I suspect the nerfs to early game Consume damage the main reason people stopped playing him because this community fickle as all hell. Honestly, try him out. He is rather strong. Does everything well, much like say a Jarvan. | ||
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BlasiuS
United States2405 Posts
On June 22 2012 20:30 iCanada wrote: Why did people stop jungling Nunu? I've played like ten games in a row with him, and it feels really strong. He clears pretty quick (bloodboil+wriggles OP), ganks well, his teamfight is amazing... His level 2 ganks top are just as obnoxious as Lee Sin ganks, because Cripple goes from 30-0% over course of 4 seconds Snowball actually a stronger slow (20% over 4 seconds is better than 30% for 1 second, 22.5% for 1 second, 15% for 1 second, and 7.5% for 1 seconds) and you can use it twice during the gank if you have CDR masteries (ie 9/21/0 or 0/21/9). That, and both Nunu and teammate run/attack really fucking fast. Been building him typical bruiser. Wriggles->Wits->Tanky shit. Plus Consume gives you stupidly good Dragon/buff control. Unfortunately it only does half damage against Baron QQ. Also, I assume he'd shit on things top. Because he so fast he control engages, his Q give him stupidly good sustain even at level 1, and snowball is an AS debuff. I'd assume it be much like laning against Lee Sin. OddOne explained it pretty well yesterday: If you build him normal jungle, you max Q first. I've never built him any other way as a jungler, so I'm not sure how good he is when maxing W or E first, but my intuition tells me his jungle clear speed will suffer quite a bit. Q does NOTHING in teamfights. It's one of the only abilities in the game that's absolutely useless during a teamfight. So until level 18 jungle nunu is a completely gimped teamfighter. It's the worst when he's level 9, when he has 5 of points put into a skill that does nothing for your team during a fight. That's bad. Like, really bad. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
His early ganks are pretty strong with the permaslow and the movespeed buff to the laner, in teamfights he can support the AD really well and also shuts down the enemy AD completely with just a single snowball. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On June 22 2012 22:55 BlasiuS wrote: OddOne explained it pretty well yesterday: If you build him normal jungle, you max Q first. I've never built him any other way as a jungler, so I'm not sure how good he is when maxing W or E first, but my intuition tells me his jungle clear speed will suffer quite a bit. Q does NOTHING in teamfights. It's one of the only abilities in the game that's absolutely useless during a teamfight. So until level 18 jungle nunu is a completely gimped teamfighter. It's the worst when he's level 9, when he has 5 of points put into a skill that does nothing for your team during a fight. That's bad. Like, really bad. Not really. 400 True damage (ie level 1 Q) is enough to instagib wraiths/wolves pretty well all game. Why max Q? So useless, level 1 gives you sick sustain as it is. I been going RWEQ. His junglespeed assuming you build a wriggles is actually faster with W first. | ||
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BlasiuS
United States2405 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:01 iCanada wrote: Not really. 400 True damage (ie level 1 Q) is enough to instagib wraiths/wolves pretty well all game. Why max Q? So useless, level 1 gives you sick sustain as it is. I been going RWEQ. His junglespeed assuming you build a wriggles is actually faster with W first. True, in general he still seems gimped as a teamfighter though due to having an ability that doesn't do anything during teamfights. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:01 iCanada wrote: Not really. 400 True damage (ie level 1 Q) is enough to instagib wraiths/wolves pretty well all game. Why max Q? So useless, level 1 gives you sick sustain as it is. I been going RWEQ. His junglespeed assuming you build a wriggles is actually faster with W first. What? That's not true at all. Because of jungle camp HP scaling now, the Big Wraith/Big Wolf outscale rank 1 Q pretty much by your second clear. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:13 TheYango wrote: What? That's not true at all. Because of jungle camp HP scaling now, the Big Wraith/Big Wolf outscale rank 1 Q pretty much by your second clear. The big one yes, not small ones. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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Offhand
United States1869 Posts
On June 22 2012 22:54 iCanada wrote: I suspect the nerfs to early game Consume damage the main reason people stopped playing him because this community fickle as all hell. Honestly, try him out. He is rather strong. Does everything well, much like say a Jarvan. I would try this but I've been having too much fun playing the "UP" Udyr who dissappeared from the game after the completely inconsequential shield nerf. It's like people forgot what he did after not seeing him for a month. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:16 Offhand wrote: I would try this but I've been having too much fun playing the "UP" Udyr who dissappeared from the game after the completely inconsequential shield nerf. It's like people forgot what he did after not seeing him for a month. Case in point about fickle community. Shield nerf did dick all to his jungle, yet no one plays him anymore. On June 22 2012 23:16 TheYango wrote: Also, having to build Wriggle's on Nunu pretty much defeats the point of playing Nunu jungle in the first place. It totally misses his peak in power because at the point where you'd otherwise be strong, you're going to have like Boots+Cloth+Longsword or some shit. As apposed to like... HoG/Philo like in OddOnes guide? | ||
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Offhand
United States1869 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:19 iCanada wrote: As apposed to like... HoG/Philo like in OddOnes guide? That guide was written after the Nunu nerf when most people stopped playing him. I would have agreed with you before the jungle revamp, but the new jungle changes were just the nail in the coffin. Nunu was strong when you could just rush Boots2 + Oracles, and just dick around wherever you wanted on the map, while terrorizing all 3 lanes and the enemy jungle--they couldn't catch you, and you could steal 2 creeps from any camp with Q+Smite or a few autoattacks. Clearing camps entirely sucked nuts--and Nunu has always been bad at it, so you just screwed around in the enemy jungle, forcing the enemy jungler to clean up the scraps on the camps that you didn't finish. You can't do that anymore because of the way the new jungle works--the gains from playing like that are much smaller because of reduced camp XP and shorter respawn times. Even with the Q buffs, solely small camp counterjungling (which is what Nunu thrived on) is basically not a sustainable playstyle at the moment. This is compounded by the fact that there are also junglers in the current pool (the aforementioned Maokai and Naut being 2 of them) that can do what Nunu used to do--rush Oracles+Boots2 and apply enormous pressure to all the lanes--WITHOUT hurting their jungle speed because they don't need Wriggle's to maintain jungle speed. That's the difference between them that you're underrating enormously. While Nunu's raw ganking power may be comparable to Mao/Naut, the fact that he needs to build Wriggle's to keep up, and can't rush early Oracle's without putting his development hugely at risk means that its hard for him to keep that pressure up past the point when all the lanes are warded. | ||
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Sven Stryker
United States423 Posts
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
Just try it. -.- | ||
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