EPTaphromoo wants to duo with him after, should be some fun time ahead if they go duo.
http://www.own3d.tv/live/10955/Nhat_Nguyen
[Patch 1.0.0.135: Fiora] General Discussion - Page 240
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Same rules apply, per usual. Please use the appropriate threads (QQ, Brag, Champion, etc) whenever appropriate. Keep the resident Banling content. Thanks. Happy Gaming. | ||
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daemir
Finland8662 Posts
aphromoo wants to duo with him after, should be some fun time ahead if they go duo. http://www.own3d.tv/live/10955/Nhat_Nguyen | ||
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BlueSpace
Germany2182 Posts
On March 20 2012 07:42 Two_DoWn wrote: hmm, good point. They should remake SV to be a late game item instead of a midgame one, especially since wits is better. And I do NOT have a shotgun approach. Who have I called sleeper op besides Olaf, Shyvana, Kennen, and Morgana? And Annie technically as well I guess. But she is just underused. You forgot your favourite turret like champion, that shoots lightning. And I would like to have something along the lines of: An Introduction to T_D Hyperbole: Theory and Practice. | ||
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seRapH
United States9776 Posts
On March 20 2012 07:44 danana wrote: That reminds me that I've been wanting to ask about support items but really don't want to bring up the gp10 vs dorans debate again. So I guess I can frame it this way: how do you follow up on a standard gp10 opening as a support? I'm sure it varies depending on the situation but I'm curious how you go about deciding which items are most important next. From my experience, after getting philo, hog if i can get it early, and lvl 1 boots (obviously buying wards throughout and possibly getting oracles), I'm looking to get one or two out of... - lvl 2 boots - Shurelya's Reverie - Randuin's - Aegis - Zeke's Herald The rule of thumb I've been following (it feels good, but I have no clue if it's actually good) is to build either heart of gold or aegis before shurelya's, picking hog if i can get it before 15 minutes and avoiding aegis if someone else already got it. I don't mind doubling up on shurelya's or randuin's, but i'd only get randuin's when they have multiple bruisers diving my carry. But I find it really hard to look at a teamfight and know whether it would have gone better if I had bought a different item, because there are so many factors and each item contributes in a very different way. Reverie good for initiate, also good for counter-initiate to an extent. Aegis good vs aoe, as is locket. Zekes is super good especially if you have more than one auto-attacker, suprised that I don't see this item more often tbh. I sometimes build frozen heart on ali/leona/taric too if no one else is, because I have an inexplicable hardon for frozen heart. | ||
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Lancer723
United States486 Posts
On March 20 2012 07:44 danana wrote: That reminds me that I've been wanting to ask about support items but really don't want to bring up the gp10 vs dorans debate again. So I guess I can frame it this way: how do you follow up on a standard gp10 opening as a support? I'm sure it varies depending on the situation but I'm curious how you go about deciding which items are most important next. From my experience, after getting philo, hog if i can get it early, and lvl 1 boots (obviously buying wards throughout and possibly getting oracles), I'm looking to get one or two out of... - lvl 2 boots - Shurelya's Reverie - Randuin's - Aegis - Zeke's Herald The rule of thumb I've been following (it feels good, but I have no clue if it's actually good) is to build either heart of gold or aegis before shurelya's, picking hog if i can get it before 15 minutes and avoiding aegis if someone else already got it. I don't mind doubling up on shurelya's or randuin's, but i'd only get randuin's when they have multiple bruisers diving my carry. But I find it really hard to look at a teamfight and know whether it would have gone better if I had bought a different item, because there are so many factors and each item contributes in a very different way. very situational and depends alot on team compositions and the flow of the game. If the game is moving really fast out of the laning phase and into the midgame then Aegis gives you the best bang for your buck. However Aegis is expensive for a support and takes up a lot of slots getting the pieces together. Randuins and Zekes are super duper situation in my opinion and usually i don't get them till after I already have boots 2, shurelyas, and Aegis. The way I always look at is that I try to get the best item I can for the immediate future, knowing that I'm probably not going to be afford more than 2-3 items after my g/10s. This way I maximize my effectiveness with the gold I have. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On March 20 2012 07:36 Two_DoWn wrote: You should add a section for "Shit T_D says is OP" so i can refer to it in future GD's. BTW: Im takin credit for Olaf, even if it is mostly top lane atm. That's like regaling a psychic because she got something right. Make enough predictions, and one of them is bound to be right. | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
Shyvana is shitty: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=303850¤tpage=145#2881 List of Sleeper OP champions: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316556¤tpage=174#3464 Xerath Sleeper OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=281369¤tpage=29#561 Wukong Sleeper OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=276899¤tpage=5#93 Karma OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=281369¤tpage=44#879 Jungle Morde OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=285585¤tpage=133#2658 Jungle TF OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=298937¤tpage=69#1378 Sejuani will be OP if she can jungle (Monte's Comment: She can, and she isn't): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=303850¤tpage=13#245 I can't say my search was exhaustive, but I actually couldn't find where you called Morgana/Kennen being OP. I only went as far back as the Graves thread though, and only searched for "OP" and "sleeper". I also only spent about 5 minutes on this. Point being that you throw "OP" around like crazy and occasionally it turns out a champion you mentioned becomes relatively strong (=/= OP, and not always in the role/position/way you stated) and then you puff up like a peacock and claim victory, going so far as to claim you're 100% accurate in one post. This is also just your posts. You've thrown a number of crazy ideas around TL B chat/vent before and probably would have posted about them here if we hadn't talked sense into you (we couldn't save you from jungle TF sadly). | ||
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PartyBiscuit
Canada4525 Posts
On March 20 2012 07:44 danana wrote: That reminds me that I've been wanting to ask about support items but really don't want to bring up the gp10 vs dorans debate again. So I guess I can frame it this way: how do you follow up on a standard gp10 opening as a support? I'm sure it varies depending on the situation but I'm curious how you go about deciding which items are most important next. From my experience, after getting philo, hog if i can get it early, and lvl 1 boots (obviously buying wards throughout and possibly getting oracles), I'm looking to get one or two out of... - lvl 2 boots - Shurelya's Reverie - Randuin's - Aegis - Zeke's Herald The rule of thumb I've been following (it feels good, but I have no clue if it's actually good) is to build either heart of gold or aegis before shurelya's, picking hog if i can get it before 15 minutes and avoiding aegis if someone else already got it. I don't mind doubling up on shurelya's or randuin's, but i'd only get randuin's when they have multiple bruisers diving my carry. But I find it really hard to look at a teamfight and know whether it would have gone better if I had bought a different item, because there are so many factors and each item contributes in a very different way. There is almost no situation in which Randuins is a good idea since HoG builds into Locket nowadays and omen is stupidly expensive. An ok active that requires you, the support, to be directly in the middle of a fight to be most effective. This combined with a passive that won't be efficient on you since they aren't going to focus you, and if they do, you'll pop too fast anyway. Locket should be the final buy if you really want to convert your HoG though games shouldn't last that long. edit: For the rest, you basically answered most of your own questions correctly. If you want help in assessing a team fight, I would say it's dependent on which support you chose. There are certain situations where Aegis (i.e. someone like Janna or if team getting exploded) is a better first buy and some where you want the reverie (i.e. supports who lack escape or CC). | ||
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
On March 20 2012 07:44 danana wrote: That reminds me that I've been wanting to ask about support items but really don't want to bring up the gp10 vs dorans debate again. So I guess I can frame it this way: how do you follow up on a standard gp10 opening as a support? I'm sure it varies depending on the situation but I'm curious how you go about deciding which items are most important next. From my experience, after getting philo, hog if i can get it early, and lvl 1 boots (obviously buying wards throughout and possibly getting oracles), I'm looking to get one or two out of... - lvl 2 boots - Shurelya's Reverie - Randuin's - Aegis - Zeke's Herald The rule of thumb I've been following (it feels good, but I have no clue if it's actually good) is to build either heart of gold or aegis before shurelya's, picking hog if i can get it before 15 minutes and avoiding aegis if someone else already got it. I don't mind doubling up on shurelya's or randuin's, but i'd only get randuin's when they have multiple bruisers diving my carry. But I find it really hard to look at a teamfight and know whether it would have gone better if I had bought a different item, because there are so many factors and each item contributes in a very different way. reverie is a massive priority, imo. Boots 2 is low on the list (esp on janna, many games I don't even get boots 2, kus they're just not that valuable for supports). Due to several top laners and junglers getting aegis (esp junglers, mybe less so on the top laners) that priority becomes a bit lower as well. After revierie, herald or wota comes first imo. I've been getting wota a looot less since every AP mid gets one, and occasionally a top laner will get one as well. If you have double wota, don't bother getting a third, if you already have one on mid, unlikely you need a second on the support, i used to get it a lot tho, before every1 and their mother got it on mid. Herald is super good on supports, i get it a lot. I actually already got starks a lot, and herald has become even more support friendly. specifically on sona, i get a tear later on and just end up building it into AA sometime(yes, i know AA's not technically efficient without another mana item, but A) i like tear on sona, and B) I can't afford anything before AA anyways, and i'm not gonna get a roa or bveil within any reasonable time frame) I don't like omen on supports, but that might be more of a preference thing, i find that slowing bruisers doesn't typically help much more than the skills that already come with most support's kits. Mybe on soraka it might be better. | ||
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Doctorbeat
Netherlands13241 Posts
On March 20 2012 07:54 seRapH wrote: Reverie good for initiate, also good for counter-initiate to an extent. Aegis good vs aoe, as is locket. Zekes is super good especially if you have more than one auto-attacker, suprised that I don't see this item more often tbh. I sometimes build frozen heart on ali/leona/taric too if no one else is, because I have an inexplicable hardon for frozen heart. I totally dig going vamp/boots+3> HoG > zerker boots > Zeke's on Olaf. CDR, Life steal, HP and AS? Hell Yeah! Also note that after the Wriggle's nerf next patch the life steal on Zeke's and Wriggle's will be the same. | ||
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57 Corvette
Canada5941 Posts
On March 20 2012 07:44 danana wrote: That reminds me that I've been wanting to ask about support items but really don't want to bring up the gp10 vs dorans debate again. So I guess I can frame it this way: how do you follow up on a standard gp10 opening as a support? I'm sure it varies depending on the situation but I'm curious how you go about deciding which items are most important next. From my experience, after getting philo, hog if i can get it early, and lvl 1 boots (obviously buying wards throughout and possibly getting oracles), I'm looking to get one or two out of... - lvl 2 boots - Shurelya's Reverie - Randuin's - Aegis - Zeke's Herald The rule of thumb I've been following (it feels good, but I have no clue if it's actually good) is to build either heart of gold or aegis before shurelya's, picking hog if i can get it before 15 minutes and avoiding aegis if someone else already got it. I don't mind doubling up on shurelya's or randuin's, but i'd only get randuin's when they have multiple bruisers diving my carry. But I find it really hard to look at a teamfight and know whether it would have gone better if I had bought a different item, because there are so many factors and each item contributes in a very different way. I usually go for the Shurellias, but that is just me because i go balls deep as the support and initate fights with Taric/leona. Can't really comment on the other supports (Soraka, Sona, Etc) because I don't play them often enough. | ||
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nojitosunrise
United States6188 Posts
I totally forgot how mechanically sound his play is. | ||
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seRapH
United States9776 Posts
It's Zeke's, Gunblade, Exec and Doran's that aren't changed. And cutlass techinically but that's part of gunblade. | ||
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Doctorbeat
Netherlands13241 Posts
On March 20 2012 08:17 seRapH wrote: Wriggle's lifesteal is reduced x.x It's Zeke's, Gunblade, Exec and Doran's that aren't changed. And cutlass techinically but that's part of gunblade. I would love it if Cutlass would build into something different from Gunblade, for the champions that don't gain a lot with AP/Spell Vamp. Maybe an option of Cutlass + Brutalizer building into something with an active nuke that does physical damage or something. | ||
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
On March 20 2012 08:16 nojitosunrise wrote: Man I have been watching jiji on korea servers tearing it up. I totally forgot how mechanically sound his play is. watched him do his placement matches this morning, up to 1600 already | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On March 20 2012 08:05 Seuss wrote: Posts by TD: Shyvana is shitty: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=303850¤tpage=145#2881 List of Sleeper OP champions: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316556¤tpage=174#3464 Xerath Sleeper OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=281369¤tpage=29#561 Wukong Sleeper OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=276899¤tpage=5#93 Karma OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=281369¤tpage=44#879 Jungle Morde OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=285585¤tpage=133#2658 Jungle TF OP: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=298937¤tpage=69#1378 Sejuani will be OP if she can jungle (Monte's Comment: She can, and she isn't): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=303850¤tpage=13#245 I can't say my search was exhaustive, but I actually couldn't find where you called Morgana/Kennen being OP. I only went as far back as the Graves thread though, and only searched for "OP" and "sleeper". I also only spent about 5 minutes on this. Point being that you throw "OP" around like crazy and occasionally it turns out a champion you mentioned becomes relatively strong (=/= OP, and not always in the role/position/way you stated) and then you puff up like a peacock and claim victory, going so far as to claim you're 100% accurate in one post. This is also just your posts. You've thrown a number of crazy ideas around TL B chat/vent before and probably would have posted about them here if we hadn't talked sense into you (we couldn't save you from jungle TF sadly). Shyv, Wukong (I said sleeper decent here btw, which, ask smash, was pretty correct (not bad for 5 months ago either)), TF, and Morde are all sarcastic. Go back and check context. Sleeper op list was not who I felt was op, twas a list of champs who hadnt been played for ages so people thought they sucked. Sej, meh, I guess you can call me on that one, but that was before we knew A) how shitty her kit was in terms of scaling and B) how shitty her jungle was. Xerath IS the single most underplayed champion relative to how good he really is. Jiji been rapin koreans all day with him. As for guide to T_D hyperbole: If there is a op yo~ at the end of the sentence, chances are its being sarcastic. And so far Jungle TF has been in more competitive games than Soniv's lovechild Viktor, so there. | ||
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clickrush
Switzerland3257 Posts
swifties, mobility, soul shroud, all tenacity items except mercs, thornmail, ghostblade, nashors tooth, spirit visage. I think at least swifties, mobility and nashors are overpriced, the others too situational. | ||
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nojitosunrise
United States6188 Posts
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=22225436#post22225436 | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
On March 20 2012 08:39 Two_DoWn wrote: Ghostblade is a great item, what'chotalkinaboutwillis? ghostblade is a great item, but overshadowed by wits as the single offensive item for most bruisers. I think its better than wits on nocturne tho, and def a good buy on yi (not that any1 plays him). | ||
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