EPT[Patch 1.0.0.132: Sejuani] General Discussion - Page 68
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Public Service Announcement Use the Champion threads whenever appropriate. Don't use General Discussion simply out of ease. ===== If you want to whine about server lag, use the QQ thread. We all suffer alike when Riot servers kaput. No need to make a post about it in GD. | ||
infinitestory
United States4053 Posts
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Treadmill
Canada2833 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:02 infinitestory wrote: @57 Corvette: You underestimate Ashe support, I think. Ashe basically has a non-global CV on something like 20 second cooldown and solid ability to to initiate and slow the enemy team. She is also able to charge up her passive in lane due to not needing to CS. Hawkshot cooldown is 60 seconds. | ||
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infinitestory
United States4053 Posts
wtf it definitely feels shorter than that o_o possibly because supports spec a lot of CDR | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:05 infinitestory wrote: wtf it definitely feels shorter than that o_o possibly because supports spec a lot of CDR I always thought it went down with ranks lol, 60seconds is kinda short for something like hawkshot. | ||
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Craton
United States17274 Posts
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
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Niton
United States2395 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:25 Two_DoWn wrote: Why dont people run support nidalee more often? Nunu aspeed buff on a heal, great buff control, and she doesnt need items at 6 to turn into an actual legitimate damage dealer around dragon fights. I suspect it's for basically the same reason that nobody plays support Orianna - LoL players are very slow to change, and will only really change if someone proves their own beliefs wrong. The fact that Taric was a more common pick than Nunu during this event, despite Nunu being way stronger is a good example of why the support meta is so stagnant. Nidalee is also a fairly complex champion, and comparatively few players know how to play her well. Riot needs to decide on a number of champions they WANT to be played as a support role, and work on balancing them between each other - right now you have Sona > Soraka > Others as the general rule, simply because they're the only two 'support' champions to have a decent pass-over in the last 2 years. | ||
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mr_tolkien
France8631 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:25 Two_DoWn wrote: Why dont people run support nidalee more often? Nunu aspeed buff on a heal, great buff control, and she doesnt need items at 6 to turn into an actual legitimate damage dealer around dragon fights. She really is useless post 11 or so and doesn't have an awesome presence lvl6 like Nunu has. Nunu lvl6 ults made the games at IEM. I mean, the games where he wasn't banned. Orianna support is 300% legit though. It's my #1 support and I have like 80% win rate as support with her. | ||
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Flakes
United States3125 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:25 Two_DoWn wrote: Why dont people run support nidalee more often? Nunu aspeed buff on a heal, great buff control, and she doesnt need items at 6 to turn into an actual legitimate damage dealer around dragon fights. Her mana costs are pretty prohibitive, especially pre-6 where she doesn't really do much in lane. I'd only run it if she had a good chance of getting blue, e.g. purple team with a non-mana champ mid. | ||
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SnK-Arcbound
United States4423 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:25 Two_DoWn wrote: Why dont people run support nidalee more often? Nunu aspeed buff on a heal, great buff control, and she doesnt need items at 6 to turn into an actual legitimate damage dealer around dragon fights. Because nunu does isn't like that. attack speed and movement speed buff, 60% slow, including 25% attack speed, and 1000 damage cc bait ulti that slows movement speed 50% and attack speed 25%. Nunu is a dedicated anti ad carry/carry support buff/debuffer. Nidalee has a heal, and damage. Supports need to do atleast 2 of 4 things, sustain, cc, buff, debuff, in order to be a "viable" support. Taric, alistar, soraka, janna, sona, nunu, leona (because of her passive), all do atleast 2. Nidalee only does 1. Add in the fact she already has a good lane and there's no reason to play her as support. This is of course specific to ad/support bot. This is how I look at it anyways. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:46 SnK-Arcbound wrote: Supports need to do atleast 2 of 4 things, sustain, cc, buff, debuff, in order to be a "viable" support. Taric, alistar, soraka, janna, sona, nunu, leona (because of her passive), all do atleast 2. Nidalee only does 1. Add in the fact she already has a good lane and there's no reason to play her as support. This is of course specific to ad/support bot. This is how I look at it anyways. You're ignoring her 40% Armor/MR shred, which is arguably one of the strongest debuffs in the game? Though TBH, the majority of Nidalee players I've seen are pretty poor at using Bushwhack in combat, rather than just as a poor man's ward. | ||
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Ruken
United States858 Posts
![[image loading]](http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/1434/garenbuild.jpg) | ||
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Ruken
United States858 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:25 Two_DoWn wrote: Why dont people run support nidalee more often? Nunu aspeed buff on a heal, great buff control, and she doesnt need items at 6 to turn into an actual legitimate damage dealer around dragon fights. Because too many people are playing her AD on top lane. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:55 Ruken wrote: so I figured out that the best Garen build is to just buy all brush colored items. More camouflage and will be even more unsuspecting. You got me to chuckle a bit. I dig it. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:49 TheYango wrote: You're ignoring her 40% Armor/MR shred, which is arguably one of the strongest debuffs in the game? Though TBH, the majority of Nidalee players I've seen are pretty poor at using Bushwhack in combat, rather than just as a poor man's ward. She also has some of the best bush control outside of blitzcrank. I think people just ONLY see her as a top or mid and therefore are incapable of using ~imagination~. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
wtf? | ||
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SnK-Arcbound
United States4423 Posts
On January 22 2012 08:49 TheYango wrote: You're ignoring her 40% Armor/MR shred, which is arguably one of the strongest debuffs in the game? Though TBH, the majority of Nidalee players I've seen are pretty poor at using Bushwhack in combat, rather than just as a poor man's ward. It isn't an on demand shred. Which is why it doesn't count. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On January 22 2012 09:44 SnK-Arcbound wrote: It isn't an on demand shred. Which is why it doesn't count. Id argue tarics shred is harder to land than nids is, especially when you take risk into consideration. Your definition also leaves blitzcrank off the list as a viable support. And if you are counting leona's passive as a debuff (doing more damage) then you have to take into account the fact that nid does the most damage out of everyone you listed. | ||
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SnK-Arcbound
United States4423 Posts
On January 22 2012 09:48 Two_DoWn wrote: Id argue tarics shred is harder to land than nids is, especially when you take risk into consideration. Your definition also leaves blitzcrank off the list as a viable support. And if you are counting leona's passive as a debuff (doing more damage) then you have to take into account the fact that nid does the most damage out of everyone you listed. I might have to change it to they have to have atleast two skills that do atleast one of the 4 things supports do. Blitz has 3 different cc moves, leona also has 3, and a debuff that increases the damage of the next auto of a different champion (which is a debuff but people might ignore it). Nid heals, and nothing else. You need to remember artosis's words, rely on yourself being better, not your opponent being worse. In order to get shredded by nid, the player has to do something stupid, not you do something well. Same with teemo shrooms. You can't decide when the opponent takes the damage or the shred, so you're leaving it up to your opponent, something you never want to do. Also taric has a stun, a heal, and two buffs, so the fact that he can shred is irrelevant, he counts as a support even if he couldn't. | ||
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